१७ जून, २०२२

The most marital answer ever to the old question "You’re organizing a literary dinner party. Which three writers, dead or alive, do you invite?"

From the novelist Geraldine Brooks, interviewed by the NYT:
First, I would bring back [my late husband] Tony Horwitz, because he was more fun at a dinner party than anyone I know. Then, because I think it’s rather rude — and a little dull — to invite writers without their partners, I would have my fellow Australian Tim Winton and his wife, Denise, who is a marine scientist. I’d add Margaret Atwood and bring back her partner, Graeme Gibson, a passionate conservationist.

You could have anyone. You could have Shakespeare or Dickens. But you're going to have Margaret Atwood's husband, "a passionate conservationist." I wonder what's the conservationist position about bringing people back from the dead. But the only person she exercised her resurrection power on was her own husband.

That last link goes to Wikipedia, where I see that Brook's husband died suddenly of a heart attack 3 years ago, when he was only 60. 

I look up Atwood's husband and see that he too died 3 years ago, so the dinner-party resurrection power was exercised on 2 persons — both because of their status as husbands.

Gibson was 85 and had been diagnosed with dementia the year before:

Despite having written a book on birds, he could no longer identify those he liked to watch in his garden, but said "I no longer know their names, but then, they don't know my name either."

The resurrection power is a fantasy, but doesn't it seem to assume that the person is brought back in their prime?

ADDED: I had one more question, and I see a NYT column addressed it last year: "Why Is Jesus Still Wounded After His Resurrection?" 

A small excerpt:

Simon Steer, the school chaplain at Abingdon School in Abingdon, England, said to me, “The risen but scarred body of Christ is the ultimate signifier of divine empathy.” It is a reminder to Dr. Steer that in his own struggles with depression, “Christ is with me in the dark night of the soul.” Jesus himself experienced a “dark night of the soul” at the Garden of Gethsemane, where we’re told his soul was “deeply grieved,” and especially as he hung on the cross, naked, beaten and left to die, feeling forsaken by God. 

The artist Makoto Fujimura, author of the marvelous recent book “Art and Faith: A Theology of Making,” writes about the Japanese tradition of Kintsugi. Kintsugi is the art of repairing broken pottery pieces with lacquer dusted with gold. A Kintsugi master will take the broken work and create a restored piece that “makes the broken parts even more visually sophisticated,” according to Mr. Fujimura. “No two works, done with such mastery, will look the same or break the same way.” It is built on the idea that in embracing flaws and imperfections, you can create a more beautiful and more valuable piece of art. 

Applying that concept to theology, Mr. Fujimura makes this point: It’s through our brokenness that God’s grace can shine through, “as in the gold that fills fissures in Kintsugi.” Jesus came not to “fix” us, according to Mr. Fujimura, and not just to restore us, but to make us something new.

८१ टिप्पण्या:

David Begley म्हणाले...

I certainly wouldn’t invite Geraldine Brooks. Never heard of her.

David Begley म्हणाले...

Tom Wolfe, Mark Twain and Theodore Roosevelt.

gilbar म्हणाले...

do they have to speak english? Or is there magical translation?
If so, i'd want (saint) Paul, because while it'd spoil dinner.. I have Some Questions for that guy
And Robert Heinlein (which would probably ALSO spoil dinner)
and finally Traci Lords (who IS an Author).. 'cause she's cute

Readering म्हणाले...

Well, the interview produces a phrase new to me, "faffed about." And in answer to a question that illustrates her thinking about people in their prime. In that case, the current POTUS and the book she would have him read if she could.

gilbar म्हणाले...

I suspect both St Paul and Heinlein would have some questions for HER too

tim maguire म्हणाले...

It's nice that everyone she brought back can speak English. Most people don't think of that.

jaydub म्हणाले...

Can't make it. I've got a bath scheduled that night.

tim maguire म्हणाले...

"I no longer know their names, but then, they don't know my name either."

I like the way he thinks. I'm kind of the same way and people are often surprised at how little "book learning" I sometimes have about things that interest me. Growing up I had a big collection of Audubon books and star charts, but I can name only a handful of birds and only the most common constellations. I just liked to look at them or watch them, I never much cared what they were called.

Ann Althouse म्हणाले...

"Most people don't think of that."

Other things people tend not to think about when answering this question:

1. Would this person want to talk to me?
2. Does this person want to return from the dead?
3. Can I get info on the afterlife?
4. Does this person have good table manners?
5. Will I be serving food this person can enjoy?
6. Any food allergies?

Ann Althouse म्हणाले...

"I like the way he thinks."

Thinks with dementia.

Maybe we should aspire to thinking well with the capacities we have, now and in the future, including a future with dementia, if that is to be our fate.

I think I remember reading — years ago — of a blogger who kept blogging with dementia, all the way to the end. That's what I'd do.

Ann Althouse म्हणाले...

Here's a list of blogs written by persons with dementia.

What's emanating from your penumbra म्हणाले...

"You could have Shakespeare or Dickens. But you're going to have Margaret Atwood's husband"

No apoplexy about the first tag along spouse to be mentioned, Denise, wife-of-Tim? Only lamentations about husbands.

This post is a caricature of Althouse. It must be a burden to carry around baggage like this.

Maynard म्हणाले...

Ayn Rand, Isaac Asimov and Gabriel Garcia Marquez.

whiskey म्हणाले...

From the Third Part of Aquinas's Summa

It was fitting for Christ's soul at His Resurrection to resume the body with its scars. In the first place, for Christ's own glory. For Bede says on Luke 24:40 that He kept His scars not from inability to heal them, "but to wear them as an everlasting trophy of His victory." Hence Augustine says (De Civ. Dei xxii): "Perhaps in that kingdom we shall see on the bodies of the Martyrs the traces of the wounds which they bore for Christ's name: because it will not be a deformity, but a dignity in them; and a certain kind of beauty will shine in them, in the body, though not of the body." Secondly, to confirm the hearts of the disciples as to "the faith in His Resurrection" (Bede, on Luke 24:40). Thirdly, "that when He pleads for us with the Father, He may always show the manner of death He endured for us" (Bede, on Luke 24:40). Fourthly, "that He may convince those redeemed in His blood, how mercifully they have been helped, as He exposes before them the traces of the same death" (Bede, on Luke 24:40). Lastly, "that in the Judgment-day He may upbraid them with their just condemnation" (Bede, on Luke 24:40). Hence, as Augustine says (De Symb. ii): "Christ knew why He kept the scars in His body. For, as He showed them to Thomas who would not believe except he handled and saw them, so will He show His wounds to His enemies, so that He who is the Truth may convict them, saying: 'Behold the man whom you crucified; see the wounds you inflicted; recognize the side you pierced, since it was opened by you and for you, yet you would not enter.'"

https://www.newadvent.org/summa/4054.htm#article4

Kay म्हणाले...

1. Would this person want to talk to me?

I think about this one a lot in. In fact it’s held me back from meeting some actually alive heroes of mine when I had the chance. That, and not knowing what to say to someone when the power dynamic between the two of you is so skewed.

Rory म्हणाले...

Thomas Sackville, with a guy named Norton, wrote the first English play in blank verse. Some cousin to Elizabeth I, he eventually became Lord High Treasurer and was a troubleshooter for her. He was also something of a high liver, liked his music and drink, was jailed in Italy as a young man for outspending his allowance. I'd like to share a few bottles with him.

Lurker21 म्हणाले...

Tony Horwitz? The Civil War Confederates in the Attic guy? I didn't realize that he had died, or that he was married to Brooks, who has written a novel about the Alcott family during the Civil War. So there you go. If he comes back, they could talk about the Civil War. The Canadian Atwoods would be very bored.

tim maguire म्हणाले...

Ann Althouse said...
"I like the way he thinks."

Thinks with dementia.


Copes with dementia, not thinks with dementia. The aspect I was focusing on was an attitude towards his declining mental capacity, not the declining mental capacity itself.

Sally327 म्हणाले...

I would ask the Tony who is still alive, Anthony Horowitz, as well as, probably, Paul Theroux, and maybe an historian, Max Hastings or Rick Atkinson. And if one of them couldn't make it, Donna Tartt.

Ernest म्हणाले...

C. S. Lewis, Martin Luther, and the virgin Mary (making the assumption she is the source for the Magnificat, Luke 1:46-55).

Temujin म्हणाले...

"I think I remember reading — years ago — of a blogger who kept blogging with dementia, all the way to the end. That's what I'd do."

And I look forward to reading it to the end. My end. Though I probably won't remember even reading it or who you are.

2yellowdogs म्हणाले...

Oscar Wilde, Tom Wolfe, Christopher Hitchens

Jefferson's Revenge म्हणाले...

George MacDonald Fraser, Shakespeare, Dorothy Parker.

Honor is the hardest thing to do and they can all be quite funny.

Rollo म्हणाले...

I would invite Steve Allen and Jayne Meadows so they could bore me with stories of all of the fake dinner parties with history's greats that they had filmed.

I would also invite essayist Philip Lopate so we could bitch about how much we hate dinner parties and hate the very idea of dinner parties.

Mike of Snoqualmie म्हणाले...

Shakespeare, Mark Twain and Heinlein.

Big Mike म्हणाले...

Robert Heinlein, of course. His 1973 commencement address to the US Naval Academy should be required reading for every teenaged male — or young female who thinks she wants to transition.

Do people who write, but whose main source of income is from something else count? Then I’d take Richard Feynman. Whether I’m sharp enough to pose questions he’d find interesting is a point I’ll quietly elide past.

That would also open the door to having Abe Lincoln at my party, but perhaps my #3 would be the unique insights of Sarah Hoyt.

Eleanor म्हणाले...

My husband and I used to play "Fantasy Dinner Party", and over the years our guest list changed, but one thing didn't. One of the questions he always asked me was if I was planning a dinner or a debate? His choices were always people he had questions for, and mine were always people I wanted to hear talk to each other. He admitted when we planned parties in real life, my guest lists always led to a livelier evening. While putting together some authors would take me more time than I have right now, I'd start with what authors might like to meet each other?

khematite म्हणाले...

Based on an old kabbalistic tradition, Leonard Cohen preceded Fujimura by writing:

Ring the bells that still can ring
Forget your perfect offering
There is a crack, a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in

Sebastian म्हणाले...

"It was fitting for Christ's soul at His Resurrection to resume the body with its scars."

Slightly OT, but Aquinas was just the best in making up reasons for stuff. Even better than Althouse.

Rollo म्हणाले...

While Britons faff about, Americans just fart around.

I tell you, we are here on earth to fart around, and don't let anybody tell you different." Kurt Vonnegut

Another old lawyer म्हणाले...

Does JFK qualify as an author? His name was on the book jacket.

Temujin म्हणाले...

OK, if I must.

Leif Enger, Amor Towles, William Saroyan. I just want to talk with them about their approach to writing. Not looking for answers to life questions.

khematite म्हणाले...

George Ade, Robert W. Service, Sax Rohmer

Clyde म्हणाले...

The conservationist position about bringing people back from the dead is summed up in a T-shirt: NECROMANCY: Reuse, Reduce, Reanimate.

Nancy म्हणाले...

Maybe she meant passionate conversationalist.

chuck म्हणाले...

My imaginary conversationalists would include Benjamin Franklin, James Clerk Maxwell, and Michael Faraday. Occasionally Charles Darwin slips in there. Faraday was reputed to be good company when he was a young man, but he declined into dementia in his last ten years and was well aware of his failing powers. I don't find writers that interesting, but admit to speaking with Mark Twain and Heinlein on occasion. Henry Adams might want to discuss geology, not sure who I would pair him with. I suspect Gauss or Newton would not be good conversationalists, and maybe altogether too brilliant for a dull fellow like myself, but their reactions to modern developments would be interesting.

rcocean म्हणाले...

I find atwood boring, but then I'm not really into short stories. I can only echo others and say: who is G. Brooks?

Since I only speak English I'd invite:

1) Mark Twain
2) Ezra Pound
3) william Shakespeare

That should cover 300 years.

rcocean म्हणाले...

Years ago Cspan had a conversation between:

shelby Foote
Peggy noonan

And some other turkey, who was a bore. But Noonan and Foote were quite interesting. i kept wanting Tom Wolfe or Charles Murray to show up.

Kate म्हणाले...

Why do people make it a dinner party on earth? Why not say, "Who will I seek out in heaven, assuming all of us make it there"? You can ask Jesus yourself about the stigmata.

Jaq म्हणाले...

Chaucer, Goete, and ... can't we make it five or six?

Ann Althouse म्हणाले...

Thanks, Temujin.

Jaq म्हणाले...

Cervantes.

Ann Althouse म्हणाले...

Lots of Aquinas in the linked NYT piece too.

Michael म्हणाले...

Charles Dickens
Anthony Powell
Tom Wolfe

Michael म्हणाले...
ही टिप्पणी लेखकाना हलविली आहे.
D.D. Driver म्हणाले...

Orwell, Hunter S. Thompson, and Mark Twain. I want Hunter to bring the party favors and I want the dinner to take place in Elon Musk' secret compound on Mars.

dbp म्हणाले...

V S Naipaul, H P Lovecraft and C S Lewis. All great in their own ways and utterly different from each other. Could be amazing or really boring, but hey, no risk - no reward.

And they all speak English.

MAJMike म्हणाले...

Robert Heinlein, Issac Asimov, Arthur C. Clarke

BG म्हणाले...

Ernest said...
C. S. Lewis, Martin Luther, and the virgin Mary (making the assumption she is the source for the Magnificat, Luke 1:46-55).


Martin Luther would be fun, especially after you get a few beers in him.

Martin Luther, Agatha Christie, Erma Bombeck.

Caroline म्हणाले...

Walker Percy, Leo Tolstoy and Fyodor Dostoyevsky.

Jaq म्हणाले...

Twain was just a smartass who pillaged Cervantes, but he was a first rate stylist. Ok, “pillaged” might be a little strong, but Tom Sawyer is Don Quixote and Huck is Sancho. Great artists steal.

Tim म्हणाले...

Well, I think I would go with JRR Tolkien and CS Lewis. Not that I would have much to add to the conversation, but now that both have experienced the afterlife, I would love to hear their thoughts on it. And for my third, I would add Jerry Pournelle instead of Heinlein. He may be the blogger Ann is thinking of, I read his blog as he developed a brain tumor and recovered from it, and to watch the deterioration and then recovery of his very sharp thinking was amazing. And he could add to the conversation with Tolkien and Lewis. Me, I expect I would just sit there and listen. Not sure it would be great to add Paul, once he got a glimpse of how the world has wound up, he would be preaching a hellfire and brimstone revival that might bring on WWIII.

Anthony म्हणाले...

Hemingway and Oscar Wilde for the entertainment factor, and James P. Hogan who is my favorite sci fi author just for me to talk to. We emailed a few times, but I was never able to meet him in person even though he was in my town for conferences a couple of times. Note: Don't put things off for tomorrow because there may not be one.

Not Sure म्हणाले...

Mark Twain, Tom Wolfe, and then somebody who'd STFU while those two are talking.

Maybe F. Scott Fitzgerald, with enough booze in him to plop face-first into the mashed potatoes.

Or Roger Angell, for a couple of palate-cleansing baseball anecdotes between courses. ¡Yo la tengo!

PM म्हणाले...

Meriwether Lewis
Robert Rogers
John Wesley Powell

PigHelmet म्हणाले...

The king [Saul] said to her, "Don't be afraid. What do you see?"
The woman said, "I see a spirit coming up out of the ground."
"What does he look like?" he asked.
"An old man wearing a robe is coming up," she said. Then Saul knew it was Samuel, and he bowed down and prostrated himself with his face to the ground.
Samuel said to Saul, "Why have you disturbed me by bringing me up?"

Michael K म्हणाले...

I keep remembering the personal ads in the back of the New York Review of Books. Under "women seeking men" several included "No Republicans." That was in the days I subscribed to it.

Narr म्हणाले...

Horwitz, his works and death, have been discussed here several times, including after his sudden death. An interesting window into who apparently doesn't read whom. I commend his Confederates In The Attic, and A Voyage Long and Strange was interesting too. (I did not know he was married to Geraldine Brooks, myself.)

A. von Humboldt, Twain, and Mencken.

I knew Shelby Foote. He was an interesting figure and fascinating talker, if not a very good historian. (3 . . . 2 . . . 1 . . )


Kevin म्हणाले...

Here's a list of blogs written by persons with dementia.

Now do newspapers.

Kevin म्हणाले...

Most people would rather talk with their dead relatives than any writers.

Especially if there's a winning lottery ticket they can't find.

mikee म्हणाले...

"I also choose this guy's dead wife."

The best, or the worst reddit comment of all time.

William म्हणाले...

I would go with Heidi Lemarr, Louise Brooks, and Dolly Parton. They all had titles published under their name.

William म्हणाले...

Question for those with knowledge of theology: Christ, when resurrected, apparently chose to come back with gaping wounds. I was raised as a Catholic and was led to believe that on the day of resurrection, your body comes back on its peak day during lifetime. I don't think that belief is grounded in anything in Gospel. Wouldn't the example of Christ lead one to believe that you come back on the day of the body's greatest agony. When you suffer, you're at your most emphatic and Christlike. My body reached its peak at, say, eighteen years, but at that time I was cursed with excessive acne. I wouldn't want to go through all eternity with severe acne, but, on the plus side, I had lots of energy. Given a choice, I would opt for some point in my mid thirties.

Rollo म्हणाले...

I'm torn between ...

a) Three egotistical geniuses who wouldn't let anybody get a word in edgewise,

b) Three moody geniuses who wouldn't say anything,

and c) Three fiendishly clever wits who would just insult each other.

Unfortunately, anybody famous who we think would be good at a dinner party would probably have better things to do and not deign to eat with our boring selves.

gilbar म्हणाले...

All this talk about Christ coming back with wounds, when he didn't have to*
The IMPORTANT POINT IS: What was The First Thing Christ Did, On His Return?
you KNOW what he did. You KNOW IT!!!!
John 21:3
Simon Peter saith unto them, I go a fishing. They say unto him, We also go with thee. They went forth, and entered into a ship immediately; and that night they caught nothing...
Jesus stood on the shore: but the disciples knew not that it was Jesus...
Then Jesus saith unto them, Catching Anything? They answered him, No...
And he said unto them, Cast the net on the right side of the ship, and ye shall find.
They cast therefore, and now they were not able to draw it for the multitude of fishes...

And the Disciples KNEW Him!!!! Jesus Christ! OUR LORD!! Our Fishing GUIDE!!

Valentine Smith म्हणाले...

I've never been to a dinner party sounds stuffy and proper.
I would invite C.G. Jung, Thomas Merton and Eric Hoffer to the old Palm Pines on Union Street. I would be behind the stick again and they would be sitting at the bend of the bar by the front door, one leaning against the wall and two splitting the bend. I'd ask Jung to clarify as much as possible what the hell the collective unconscious is. Merton maybe could draw out any parallels to spirituality. Of course, Hoffer is there to bring it all back to concrete reality.

Joe Smith म्हणाले...

Charles Schultz...he understood the human condition.

U.S. Grant...he did some things.

One of the apostles of the New Testament...

Joe Smith म्हणाले...

@AA

Is there a reason (for the last week or so) my posts get posted (I see them with a little trash can beside them) but then disappear 10 or 15 minutes later?

It's very weird...

Josephbleau म्हणाले...

"And he said unto them, Cast the net on the right side of the ship, and ye shall find.
They cast therefore, and now they were not able to draw it for the multitude of fishes...
And the Disciples KNEW Him!!!! Jesus Christ! OUR LORD!! Our Fishing GUIDE!! "

Great story, I bet he put some of the special Jesus bait on the net when they were not looking.

Josephbleau म्हणाले...

How about if I invite the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost? Would that count as one or three? Nicaean or Arian? with my other two choices I could invite Satan and Mohamed.

Josephbleau म्हणाले...

I always wondered about the administration of Christianity, God was creative in his early career, but now seems on high level oversight. Jesus had a high visibility project early on, but now you never hear about him. The Holy Ghost, "Don't call me GOD private, I work for a living!"

Josephbleau म्हणाले...

If it were for entertainment I would invite Shelby Foote, US Grant, and Longstreet. I don't know that Lee wrote a book.

Mary Beth म्हणाले...

The list of people I would want to chat with are not necessarily the same as the ones that would be on a list if I were trying to organize a dinner party. If I were picking people for one-on-one dinners, I think Robert Heinlein would be on my list. I'd also enjoy having dinner with Terry Pratchett. Maybe Lewis Carroll. I don't know. There are a lot of authors that would tie for third, it would depend on my mood at the moment.

I'm not sure who would be on a dinner party list. It would have to be people that I thought would be interested in each other. Inviting a whole party of people who would only entertain me would be dreadful.

Joe Bar म्हणाले...

Karl Marx, Adolf Hitler, and Mao Tse Tung. I'd bring a Claymors.

Smilin' Jack म्हणाले...

Churchill, Hitler, and Stalin, because that’s the kind of guy I am. (Yeah, it might be a stretch to include Stalin, but I’m pretty sure he must have written something prior to all those death lists.)

tolkein म्हणाले...

JRR Tolkien, Homer and, as an author, St Paul. I had originally had Shakespeare, then thought of Chaucer, but then thought, in this imaginary world, I could be more universal, imagining I could understand ancient Greek and Hebrew/and Aramaic.

Robert Cook म्हणाले...

"I keep remembering the personal ads in the back of the New York Review of Books. Under "women seeking men" several included "No Republicans." That was in the days I subscribed to it."

Probably unnecessary...I mean, how many Republican men read the New York Review of Books?

Tina Trent म्हणाले...

Three John Updikes.

Rusty म्हणाले...

I'm sticking to writers who's first language was English, Edgar Allan Poe, and I was going to add Thomas Pynchon, but he's a tedious lefty. Larry McMurtry and Paige Smith.

mikee म्हणाले...

Calvin Coolidge, Marcel Marceau, Helen Keller. Shut up and eat.

Tina Trent म्हणाले...

Ugh. I had to peel Vonnegut out of the grass once when he fell off the stage. How about Bukowski? He was notoriously polite.