Rand Paul’s motion was defeated 55 to 45, but a 2/3 vote is needed to convict, so it seems the outcome is preordained and the substantive merits of the case don’t matter. The 45 who believe it’s unconstitutional shouldn’t change their mind based on anything to be presented at trial.
ADDED: A TV commentator said that only 34 votes were expected on Paul’s motion. 45 is a much stronger showing. McConnell voted with Paul. Only 5 Republicans voted with the Democrats: Romney, Collins, Murkowski, Toomey, and Sasse. It will be difficult to generate any momentum for this dismal trial.
पोस्ट्स
२०९ टिप्पण्या:
209 पैकी 1 – 200 नवीन› नवीनतम»This tracks with my expectation that the Dems would get five GOP votes in the trial.
Without seeing the votes, I'm going to guess: Romney, Murkowski, Collins, Sasse, and Thune?
The Democrats will call for those 45 to be expelled from the Senate.
Great speech by Rand Paul. Everyone should listen to it.
Thank goodness for Rand Paul's leadership and courage!
...and the substantive merits of the case don’t matter.
The substantive merits were never going to matter.
55 political hacks.
Sasse is a hack. He knows the trial is unconstitutional, but wants to be the Anti Trump candidate in 2024. The Never Trump media is already talking him up though no one seems to care about him organically.
And so is Mcconnell for voting the way he was forced to.
But for the remainder,
It's no bill of attainder,
Attaint him we must!
Said Pelosi,"or bust!"
Or he'll get us next time,
That's what pains her.
When is Romney up for re-election?
2022 or 2024?
The substantive merits were never going to matter
What substantive merits?
"45 Senators just voted that the impeachment trial is unconstitutional..."
Not exactly. 45 voted to hold a vote on constitutionality while 55 voted to not have a vote (table the motion), so Paul's motion calling for a vote was not voted on.
Romney has said he's likely one and done.
At least we know which cocksuckers to primary.*
Of course, we've always known.
*McCain voted with the Dems in absentia from hell.
I think the handwriting is on the wall for any Republican who defects & jumps on the prosecute Trump train --- you will be primaried!
I so hope that Romney & Sasse get primaried, even at the cost of putting their Republican seats in jeopardy. They're both such self-righteous pricks.
"Thank goodness for Rand Paul's leadership and courage!"
I don't know why lots of Rs bag on Paul all of the time.
I haven't researched his record in-depth, but from what I've seen the past few years, other than his hair, he seems fine.
His dad was a nut, but sins of the fathers, etc.....
So Leahy can just change the conviction requirement to 50+1 senators. As long as we're not following the constitution what difference does it make?
That was clarifying. Now drag this shitshow out to make the "nays" and the vicious House impeachers look the nasty, petty, stupid and vicious creatures they are for a few weeks. When it gets boring, wrap it up and acquit. More clarification needed for more people about who pretends to be out leadership.
We don' need no stinkin' substantive merits.
A few years ago I dismissed Paul as a lightweight even though I like libertarianism, but he has been on a roll and I'm glad he's there. He proves the wisdom of the observation that nobody wins popularity contests or elections by calling themselves libertarian.
Narr
Narrite-libertarian
So now we get to have a trial, the only point of which is each side quoting the other and saying your regular political speech using regular political metaphors is awkshooally dangerous incitement!
I'm firmly convinced that the next president after Biden will truly be an authoritarian. The only question is, will it be Kamala, or whoever Trump anoints as his successor. Hell the way things are going to go the next four years, it might somehow BE Trump, an authoritarian for real the second time around.
"dismal trial"
"How the Democrats lost me." It's terrible! It's dismal! They should be better!
Rand Paul is the rare politician who generally votes on principle. As an added bonus, his principles are pretty good.
It's not about winning the case, (although the Democrats would love that) It's about grinding their boots in our faces and throwing red meat to their base.
What is the most important conclusion to take from this vote?
.
.
.
That every single Democrat in the Senate believes it is constitutional to impeach a private citizen. Or at least that they're willing to vote that way, regardless of what they believe.
That, my friends, is perhaps the most disgusting display from the Dems since the Kavanaugh hearings.
"Rand Paul is the rare politician who generally votes on principle. As an added bonus, his principles are pretty good."
I've always been a Paul fan.
Ha ha ha.
Maybe, just maybe, our rulers should take up some of Trump's issues that *garnered* our votes in the first place.
Good on Rand.
But I've been assured by my betters that this country can't heal unless we drag Trump's corpse through the streets of DC behind a Chuck & Nancy's charriot? How will we heal?
"It's not about winning the case, (although the Democrats would love that) It's about grinding their boots in our faces and throwing red meat to their base."
Can someone on the R side (like Paul) use the occasion to hammer the House prosecutors?
I'd love to see someone take apart the smug, low-IQ, Chinese spy-fucker Swalwell on the record and in front of a national audience.
"That, my friends, is perhaps the most disgusting display from the Dems since the Kavanaugh hearings."
Agree. It shows they are not serious in the least.
There is literally not a single free-thinker on the D side.
The Borg smiles.
The House's tantrum doesn't seem to have much support. And if anyone was wise, the matter would be dropped. So the circus will go on.
Obvious, isn't it? The solution, I mean. Simply restore Donald Trump's twitter account.
Dismal is the new boring!
you'll DO Realize, don't you?
It Only takes 50 votes to convict a regular citizen, that is NOT an Officer of the United States?
You'll Say: "gilbar! WHERE in the US Constitution are you getting THAT?"
and I'll Say: "Nowhere! i just Made It Up!"
and YOU'LL Say: "gilbar! you can't JUST MAKE UP THINGS! They HAVE TO BE IN the Constitution!"
and I'LL Say:"Since When? Explain WHY you can impeach a regular citizen that isn't an Officer of the US?"
If you hate Trump enough - you have the power to change the constitution.
Amazing how that works.
talk about a cult.
Democrats: Constitution? Things got a little out of hand. It’s just this impeachment and that lying son of a bitch Trump and…I would never hurt you. You know that.
They might try to play games to bring down the number of the quorum to make it easier to get 2/3 of the vote.
i see Dark Helmet beat me to it! Sorry Dark Helmet!
"They might try to play games to bring down the number of the quorum to make it easier to get 2/3 of the vote."
Well, they do have all those troops…
How stupid is President Biden? You might reply, how many angels can dance upon a pin? But, here it is, properly illustrated:
"BREAKING: Biden furious at Gavin Newsom for lifting stay-at-home order. Thinks he is only doing it out of re-election fears. "Steam coming out of his ears," per WH official."
The only, and I mean only, thing that will help the Harris/Dr. Jill presidency is improving unemployment numbers. Opening California will provide those numbers. Slow Joe, high on power as Hunter after a four day crack binge, would rather feel the power than actually do some good to win praise for that. He has no idea how anything works and it seems like not many in his administration do either. Dismal will be a high water mark for the Harris/Dr. Jill presidency.
Every election official takes an oath to preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution. It seems 55 members of the Senate have violated that oath. By all rights, they should be removed from office.
Narr said...A few years ago I dismissed Paul as a lightweight even though I like libertarianism, but he has been on a roll and I'm glad he's there.
--
Hospitalizations offer time to reflect.
Shouldn't Republicans welcome this total waste of the Senate's time? Thanks to the impeachment mess, Biden's coming in with no "honeymoon" and no momentum, so perhaps there's not much risk of his doing anything meaningful in his first few months, but still -- isn't it in Republicans' interest to prolong the farce as long as possible to block anything else Democrats might try to do?
With SCOTUS will not presided and 45 senators will not convict... what's the point? Oh, propaganda? Pelosi revenge? Just cause?
And us taxpayers are paying for this?
No biggie.. the Treasury will just print some more funny money to pay for it, right?
Get ready for Jimmy Carter II (also known as Joe Biden.) Stagflation is coming. Bye bye your IRA folks. You are screwed...
Shouldn't Republicans welcome this total waste of the Senate's time? Thanks to the impeachment mess, Biden's coming in with no "honeymoon" and no momentum, so perhaps there's not much risk of his doing anything meaningful in his first few months, but still -- isn't it in Republicans' interest to prolong the farce as long as possible to block anything else Democrats might try to do?
Yes, and it would be helpful as well, clarifying of the dismal state we are in. And it will further expose the mendacity, venality and in many cases outright stupidity of the impeach crowd.
"BREAKING: Biden furious at Gavin Newsom for lifting stay-at-home order. Thinks he is only doing it out of re-election fears. "Steam coming out of his ears," per WH official."
----
Secret source, secret sauce.
Now I wonder if McConnell receiving the impeachment notice from the House with all the solemnity it did not deserve wasn't actually a pretty effective head-fake. If he'd ridiculed the lack of process right away, showed his hand, he would be less empowered than he is now to rub the Dem's faces in their shit.
isn't it in Republicans' interest to prolong the farce as long as possible to block anything else Democrats might try to do?
It'd just be prolonging the inevitable. I mean, the Dems have at least 20 months or so and I doubt you could extend the farce that long.
Ok, now what? On to the next impeachment?
"45 Senators just voted that the impeachment trial is unconstitutional, so it seems that acquittal is inevitable."
Kudos to Roberts for refusing to sit in on this farce.
But for the remainder,
It's no bill of attainder,
Attaint him we must!
Said Pelosi,"or bust!"
Or he'll get us next time,
That's what pains her.
Dude, a legal lesson in poetry form. I am impressed!
Hell the way things are going to go the next four years, it might somehow BE Trump, an authoritarian for real the second time around.
A man scorned? Maybe. However, he wouldn't have the support for that mode of governance. Then again, the Democrats seem obsessed to forcefully convert a few conservatives: "Pro-Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of Happiness", and libertarians to adopt their authoritarian model.
What do you mean "5 Republicans"? Not any more they aren't.
"That, my friends, is perhaps the most disgusting display from the Dems since the Kavanaugh hearings."
This very minute, in the bowels of Imperial City, cries go out from impassioned Democrats... "Hold my beer!"
That every single Democrat in the Senate believes it is constitutional to impeach a private citizen. Or at least that they're willing to vote that way, regardless of what they believe.
Don't forget the five Republicans. Mitt Romney obviously believes that it's constitutional to put private citizens inside giant peaches.
I don't know why lots of Rs bag on Paul all of the time.
I haven't researched his record in-depth, but from what I've seen the past few years, other than his hair, he seems fine.
@Joe Smith, well I'm a Republican who has researched Rand Paul's positions. I like his domestic policies very, very much, but I have always felt that his foreign policy is too isolationist for the 21st century. Perhaps he has learned something from Trump about how to engage (and how to disengage).
Interesting that Lisa Murkowski voted the way she did despite being up for reelection in 2022. I have previously noted that Murkowski survived losing her primary to a Tea Party candidate in 2010 by winning a three-way race as a write-in candidate, so perhaps she feels invulnerable. Against that, she has never -- as in not once -- even achieved 49% of the vote in any election. Ben Sasse seems to have wet his pants over the January 6th Capitol incursion that got out of hand, and he has never gotten over it. Toomey, of course, is retiring and doesn't have to worry about reelection.
What a fucking colossal waste of time.
The only possibly redeeming thing about this “impeachment trial” is that the Dems will have less time to screw us over worse with BS legislation.
Of course these days that doesn’t matter. We don’t legislate anymore. We just let the president sign executive orders.
Isn't Murkowski up in 2022?
Anyone voting for this should immediately be censured and impeached themselves. You can NOT impeach a private citizen. That these "politicians" either don't know this or don't care should be enough to get them thrown out. Ass-hats...
No one has done more to destroy the Senate institutional body than the incorrigible and swarmy Chuck Schumer. If anyone should be impeached and expelled, its him.
We shouldn't ever take any sasse.
"Romney has said he's likely one and done."
"Severely conservative" Mitt Romney has lied about everything, and so he's lying about not running again. If he sees a chance, he will run for POTUS in 2024. If he sees an easy re-election he will run for Senate again. I could also see him running for governor in UTah and becoming King of the Mormons.
But if Mitt Romney said the sun will rise in the east tomorrow, I wouldn't believe it without proof.
Another Trial will give Mittens a chance to talk to God again. Last time, God told him to vote for removing/impeaching Trump and then justify his vote in a letter to the Senate. I expect Jesus will will tell Mittens the same thing this time.
BTW, I wonder if the Senators who voted not guilty last time, appreciated Mittens implying they hadn't taken their oath seriously, unlike Mitt Romney.
Ben Sasse is absolutely finished in Nebraska politics. He'll go back east and be president of an Ivy League school.
I'm actually glad Mittens will vote guilty, because his vendetta against Trump, makes all his pompous self-righteousness even more phony and absurd. History will look back and not say "wow, Mittens was the only R senators to vote to remove Trump in 2020. What courage!" Instead History will say "Mittens was a jealous little girl, who voted to impeach/remove Trump twice, no matter what the evidence".
Regardless of the subject or merits, it's good to see Senators make the constitutionality of their actions a primary concern once again.
we dodged a bullet when Mittens lost in 2012. He would've destroyed the Republican party. One can imagine him paling around with Harry Reid and Pelosi, making "deals", and doing everything possible to lose in 2016 and help Hillary become President.
Joe Biden calls Trump's 1776 history Commission 'ignorance and lies'
Again we see Biden will continue the left's plan of governance by fantasy. The left's 1619 Project is based on lies especially that the American Revolution was fought to protect slavery and the entire American economy was based on slave labor. Neither Biden nor anyone else has identified any "lies" in the 1776 Commission but even if they did Biden has already shown he doesn't oppose lies. In fact he and the rest of the left oppose the truth.
BidenFamilyTaxPayerFundedCrackPipe said...
Isn't Murkowski up in 2022?
Why Yes! Yes she Will be. Here's an interesting tidbit:
Murkowski has never won a majority of the vote in any of her three U.S. Senate races, only pluralities.
back in 2010, she didn't even win the primary; but famously said:
"That doesn't matter! The Unions will just create write in votes for me, and i'll be in Easy!"
and she was!
You KNOW a person is a TRUE CONSERVATIVE;
if the ONLY WAY they can get elected is to have unions commit fraud for her!
Sasse didn't vote for Trump in 2016 or 2020. He tried to run in the primary against Trump, but no one was interested. He's been attacking Trump 24/7 for over 5 years, and only went silent in 2020 so he didn't get primaried.
when the polls showed Trump losing in Oct 2020, Sasse was crying that Trump needed to be "cut loose" and all the R effort put into "saving the Senate".
his vote is completely and utterly expected.
Watch Rand - he's right. Not that the hate-filled lunatic hypocrite left will listen.
Romney needs to get primaried.
@Saint Croix
Can you imagine how much more interesting the legal profession would be if argument, concept, and the endless reams of dead-tree documents had to be poetically transmitted?
Drive-by defendants defended with a dope rap.
Divorces discharged in iambic pentameter.
Lawsuit voir dire in the style of King Lear.
A depressing and dismal duty becomes a delight!
This is why it will never happen. Lawyers have a higher percentage of alcoholics than dentists and pilots combined.
The point of the trial is not to convict. It is to sway voters. I think it will backfire on the Democrats, but only if the republicans take it seriously and mount a defense.
Sounds as though zero Democratic Senators agreed. Must be a no-brainer. Or else they are?
I think the Senate should indeed look into the incitement that Senator's Durbin and Sanders delivered to Hodgkinson.
Dave Begley said...
“Ben Sasse is absolutely finished in Nebraska politics. He'll go back east and be president of an Ivy League school.“
So you’re saying Sasse’s ass is grass?
"So you’re saying Sasse’s ass is grass?"
More like ivy.
This will allow the Trump team to call Nancy Pelosi and grill her about her prior knowledge of the riot and whether she impeded the defense of the Capitol. What did she know and when did she know it? That was the key question in Watergate. This could become Pelosi-gate.
Look for Democrat cries of injustice as the Republican grill her. It will also be entertaining to grill the former Chief of the Capitol Police.
"That was clarifying. Now drag this shitshow out to make the "nays" and the vicious House impeachers look the nasty, petty, stupid and vicious creatures they are for a few weeks."
I hope not. Dragging this out keeps us focused on the show while Biden's handlers grind out more EO's, and the House passes fraud enshrining HR1 in the background. We'll lose what's left of our Republic, and most won't even realize it happened.
Romney, Sasse, and Toomey are anarchists who want to destroy the rule of law and the Constitution.
democrats are the party of lock-step.
That's why I don't hold out much hope for Sinema and Manchin.
He's so sassy and brassy
Our Ben Sasse.
I think the dems are functioning from the place of mortal fear which has not left them since the 6th. This is one reason we don’t let the victims of a crime also be the prosecution, jury and judge in the trials against their perpetrators. That scenario does not lead to justice. It leads to revenge and vindictiveness that is not on balance with the alleged crime. The republicans seem to be functioning with cooler heads with Rand Paul leading the way very effectively.
He's so glassy and assy
our ben sasse.
Ben puts the Ass in Sasse.
The dems ought to vote in lockstep. That's their deal. Nothing is too stupid to vote for.
I have previously noted that Murkowski survived losing her primary to a Tea Party candidate in 2010 by winning a three-way race as a write-in candidate..
Alaska had the big three Congressmen for a long time. Stevens, Young, and Murkowski (Lisa's father). They were pretty much untouchable for 20 years because of the amount of bacon they brought home. Daddy M was Governor for 4 years after leaving DC. During his term he treated the state coffers like his personal piggybank, and lost to Palin because of it. The day before the election he came out with a statement that was probably the most pathetic thing I have ever seen in politics. He begged the Alaskan electorate the keep him in power, and he would mend his privileged ways. He was literally crying while he said it. That was the reason she lost her primary to an outsider who could be best described by thinking of the horned nut job we saw in the Capitol building on Jan 6. I went to a fundraiser for her (in part to mollify a business deal, and partly because the TP guy was not someone we wanted in DC). What an entitled bitch! That apple fell about 2 inches from the tree. I held my nose and wrote the check. And now I want to apologize to the citizenry for that. Sorry.
Blogger Gem Quincyite said...
I think the Senate should indeed look into the incitement that Senator's Durbin and Sanders delivered to Hodgkinson.
--
For reference, play a compilation of Mad Maxine's unhinged rants.
Older than dirt senate democrat Lahey -- who wants Trump tried and convicted and REMOVED FROM OFFICE-- is appointed judge. What a joke.
Banana republic + kangaroo court.
The five finks:
Sasse - Up in 2026. wanted Trump's endorsement 2020
Toomy - Will Retire 2022
Collins - Up in 2026. wanted Trump's endorsement 2020
Romney - Up in 2024. wanted Trump's endorsement in 2018
Murky - Up in 2022 - has honestly and forthrightly hated Trump.
Lisa Murkey voted AGAINST Kavanaugh when it counted. She voted FOR ACB when it didn't count. That's her MO. Vote liberal on the important stuff, but always cover your tracks by voting conservative when it doesn't.
Sasse will be the Kasich of 2024.
The press will quote him approvingly while wondering if he can win his home state.
Sasse will be the Kasich of 2024.
Maybe Ben's dad was the mailman too.
Romney does not bring his own meat to DC.
"democrats are the party of lock-step.
That's why I don't hold out much hope for Sinema and Manchin."
If the Dems think they will lose then they will let those two vote against it for appearance sake.
That's how the game is played...
There is precedent for this: the brits dug up Oliver Cromwell, had a trial, and beheaded his corpse. So there.
Sasse just won re-election? how freaking sad.
For decades I've been informed that prosecuting your predecessor would make us a 'Banana Republic'.
Clintons giving China secret missile technology in exchange for bags of cash?
Let's look forward and not be a 'Banana Republic'.
Obama releasing a $billion and half to Iran to fund their Middle East terror.
Let's look forward and not be a 'Banana Republic'.
Trump using common sense economic principles to lift America to the heights of prosperity?
Kill the witch! Impeach him...again! Prosecute him!
Face it. We're a Banana Republic now.
The quisling quintette.
There used to be a norm; we're still wringing hands about norms Trump violated, right?
Well, anyway: there used to be a norm that the losing politician wasn't subject to a political prosecution after being vanquished. That's the reason Hillary wasn't prosecuted for the blatant email thing, amongst others. It's why GWB and Dick Cheney weren't prosecuted for "war crimes" (although the left very very badly wanted to do it). That form of vindictive retribution is something that happens in failed - and failing - states like Venezuela.
So, now, it appears that all Democrats, and a few Republicans, are onboard with drumming up an incitement charge to justify political persecution of not just one man, but the people who voted for him. Yet they complain about abandoning norms. They eagerly reject them and justify it with a sense of self-righteousness.
I hope every singe of these 55 senators, and the Representatives who voted to impeach, are replaced at the earliest opportunity, as they have no sense of anything but their own power.
I can't see how these impeachments are just about playing to the Democrats base since most of that base is either lying in a cemetery, simultaneously living in two or more states, or existing only as bits and bytes.
But then again I'm not a Democrat.
Breezy said...
….
This is one reason we don’t let the victims of a crime also be the prosecution, jury and judge in the trials against their perpetrators.
-------------===========
- are you saying Trump is not victim and D are not perpetrators?
I’ve always been patient with Collins knowing that she needs to grab a few stupid liberal votes to win in Maine, but there can be no forgiveness for this betrayal. Democrats have as much as admitted the trial is unconstitutional by not having Roberts preside. There has to be limits to what one will tolerate and these five senators crossed the line.
I expect no better from Democrats, but any Republican...no. It cannot stand.
@ Unknown
"There is precedent for this: the brits dug up Oliver Cromwell, had a trial, and beheaded his corpse. So there."
Finally, the head has been buried at Sidney Sussex College, Cambridge--his alma mater. Sidney Sussex at least was allowed to keep the college plate (silver service) that was otherwise confiscated from Cambridge and Oxford under the Protectorate.
Romney does not bring his own meat to DC.
Romney both doesn't have meat -- and he is meat.
Well. At least 45 people in Washington aren't total dimwits.
Romney's toast.
Murky's toast.
We'll see how the other two do, but most likely this will be their last rodeo.
we dodged a bullet when Mittens lost in 2012. He would've destroyed the Republican party. One can imagine him paling around with Harry Reid and Pelosi, making deals..."
The funny thing is, if they played their cards right, the Dems could have made a lot of deals with Trump. He likes making deals. But instead they had to take the bedwetting route.
Joe Smith said...
I'd love to see someone take apart the smug, low-IQ, Chinese spy-fucker Swalwell on the record and in front of a national audience.
**********************
Mark Steyn has started calling him "Shagwell."
heh
Jersey Fled said...
I can't see how these impeachments are just about playing to the Democrats base since most of that base is either lying in a cemetery, simultaneously living in two or more states, or existing only as bits and bytes
oh! oh! i know! i Know! pick me!!
Democrat VOTERS are lying in cemeteries, two states, ethernet, etc...
Democrat BASE (their money bags), lives in Peking
This is a clarifying moment in American political history. The entire Democrat Party and a handful of Republicans have chosen to pursue the destruction of a citizen, Donald Trump, on the thinnest of evidence and logic and in defiance of the Constitution of the US. I believe they feel emboldened by their success at stealing an election in plain sight. Having stolen an election, why not destroy the man they cheated, thus removing him as a threat to them forever?
I'd love to see someone take apart the smug, low-IQ, Chinese spy-fucker Swalwell on the record and in front of a national audience.
It is a pointless show trial. So why not?
The funny thing is, if they played their cards right, the Dems could have made a lot of deals with Trump. He likes making deals. But instead they had to take the bedwetting route.
This
Democrats sabotaged their own agenda in an attempt to make President Trump look bad.
Amnesty was there for the taking. Path to citizenship. Infrastructure. But nope, waste four years attempting to tank President Trumps approval. All of that and Trump was essentially the same approval as Obama.
But I've been assured by my betters that this country can't heal unless we drag Trump's corpse through the streets of DC behind a Chuck & Nancy's charriot? How will we heal?
You misheard that, they said 'heel'.
I am not a lawyer and I never studied Law, but I wonder:
In what way shape of form is this a trial?
In what way shape of form is this a trial?
Trump will be made to suffer a punishment to atone.
People saying these 5 will be primaried are so adorably naive.
They will easily be "reelected" by fraud again, just like they were originally "elected".
If you think Republican primaries are any less fraudulent than 2020 was, you haven't been paying attention. The fraud is likely even worse in those. How do you think we got the utterly feckless and traitorous Republican Party we have? It's not because that's what their voters really wanted.
As for Rand Paul, he voted to certify the electors. He talks a good game, but when a spine was required, his folded like a cheap lawn chair. That won't be forgotten.
"DC will stay under military control while the opposition leader is put on trial”
https://twitter.com/JackPosobiec/status/1353698351208923139
The only thing missing to make this a headline about an authoritarian regime somewhere in the word would be the silencing of opposition voices in the media and allegations of vote rigging.
Don’t worry, it can’t happen here.
Sotto voice Obama: “Yes it can!"
Francisco D: Stop thinking of it as a trial and start thinking of it as a purge. Or at least the start of one.
Oh yeah, and the suspension of freedom of assembly due to the utter heinousness of the opposition to our maximum leader.
I am starting to like Rand Paul's hair.
"You misheard that, they said ‘heel’"
Ha ha ha!
The Constitution is not that long a document folks. It wouldn't hurt to *read it.*
Sarah Palin has to run for that Senate seat in Alaska.
Does this set the stage that I could also be pre-emptively impeached?
@tim in vermont, so have you contacted her with a pledge of support? Otherwise it's "how about let's you and her fight."
the Dems could have made a lot of deals with Trump. He likes making deals. But instead they had to take the bedwetting route.
Trump is for the American dream: Pro-Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of Happiness. He opposed the Obama/Biden legacy of wars without borders and transnational terrorism. He was for emigration reform to mitigate progress and diverse first-order forcings of [catastrophic] [anthropogenic] immigration reform (e.g. illegal immigration, excessive immigration, refugee crises, social justice adventurism, trail of tears). He was for medical and pharmaceutical market reform to control progressive prices and availability under Obamacares etc. He stood up to diversity dogmatists, not limited to racists, including reeducation camps, affirmative discrimination, etc. He recognized the transgender spectrum (e.g. homosexual, neogender) on principle, not as a politically congruent construct ("="). He pursued a policy of revitalization, rehabilitation, and reconciliation in urban spaces with stakeholders, not community activists. He supported energy development, and opposed the Green blight and its effort to secure viability with the prophecy of [catastrophic] [anthropogenic] global cooling... warming... change, undeniable, unfalsifiable. He backed audit the vote (in several Democrat jurisdictions with irregularities, perhaps fraud) for civil rights. He supported education choice and accountability in contrast to Democrat's fatal Atlanta, Georgia policy of "every child left behind" etc. He called out Democrat collusion with Kiev, Russia, Iran, and China. He worked to reform international agreements based on labor and environmental arbitrage, and called out human rights abuses (e.g. selective-child and concentration/reeducation camps) in China.
Senators take an oath to uphold the Constitution. Of course, they have a role in interpreting the Constitution! If the Senate says this impeachment is constitutional, then it's constitutional. The Chief Justice needs to get his fat ass over there and preside over the second impeachment.
I wish Congress was more forceful on some of these big legal issues. Why should the Supreme Court have the final say? Giving the Supreme Court the last word on constitutional questions “was never intended, and can never be proper.” Those are James Madison's words...
Looking forward to the trial.
In what way shape of form is this a trial?
You can beat the rap but you can't beat the ride.
Tommy Duncan- "This is a clarifying moment in American political history."
Indeed.
Democrats always tried to be discrete with their vote fraud. The 2020 election was their Waterloo. The votes for Trump were massive. Discretion could not be maintained. The Democrat vote fraud was brazen.
On January 6, we assembled, half a million strong, at our Nation's Capitol, to petition for a redress of our grievance at the blatant fraud.
Ashli Babbitt was murdered for the offense of being in 'the People's House'. That girl was raised on the idea that our thing is that we were self-governing. Heh. How naive. A young woman murdered for petitioning her Government for redress.
Americans are terrorists now. It's a clarifying moment.
"The Chief Justice needs to get his fat ass over there and preside over the second impeachment. “
Despite what the Constitution clearly says in black and white?
"When the President of the United States is tried, the Chief Justice shall preside”
This is a debate regarding a bill of attainder against a private citizen. There is no possible way to interpret the clear and plain words of the constitution to suggest that Roberts *must* attend this farce. And since he doesn’t want to, well too bad.
Dark Helmet and gilbar: make the insightful point that once "we" agree that the Constitution doesn't matter, we can convict with 51 votes. (or 34, or whatever). Let's hold the trial in a special room called a "star chamber". No matter how much you hate Trump, this episode is going to be regarded as shameful in a historical context. (Better historians than I will fill in the blanks about the historical reputation of appointing Senators in the South after the civil war. That at least had the excuse of trying to figure out a way to get federal representation in states that had declared war on the US, with a universal political leadership made up of supporters of that declared war.)
" so have you contacted her with a pledge of support?”
If she makes noise about running, I will send her money.
Not to be morbid but supposedly Leahey (and the democrat majority in the Senate) just went to the hospital.
T
Ashli Babbitt was murdered for the offense of being in 'the People's House'.
She clearly represented a clear and progressive threat to property and Congress, an exercise of novel self-defense, which justified her summary execution. This is in contrast to where actual insurrections backed by JournoListic braying and Democrat activism over 17 trimesters, threatened and prosecuted attacks on property and people... persons.
Well--No turning back for the Sasseholes. How could any Republican vote for any of them?
More about Babbitt, shot while committing a violent crime? Sad she died but it was a justifiable shooting.
Romney, Collins, Murkowski, Toomey, and Sasse.
The usual suspects. I'd like each to write an essay on how this impeachment meets the demands of the Constitution. And if they can't do it, they should be tossed out like the garbage they are.
Leahy hospitalized? With GOP governor of Vermont? Hmmm.
Ken B., yes, we've read your lame opinion on the Babbitt shooting enough already. Go back under your bridge now.
Ken B is the new Chuck.
Fuck off foreigner.
Leahy's in the hospital? It gets tougher and tougher to remain an atheist.
readering: "Leahy hospitalized? With GOP governor of Vermont?
Can murder charges be far off?....
"Leahy hospitalized? With GOP governor of Vermont? Hmmm."
If it's the 'vids, the man is doomed.
He already has 1.99 feet in the grave.
Ken B: "Sad she died but it was a justifiable shooting."
So you fully intend to continue pretending we don't have video of that incident, aren't you?
"With GOP governor of Vermont?”
Don’t get your hopes up, Dems there hold the Senate 22 - 6 and the House 94 - 43. In Mass they just changed the law when it suited them.
Maybe Leahy got Lyme disease from a nasty, blood-sucking tick hiding in that fur cape.
Balfegor muses: Shouldn't Republicans welcome this total waste of the Senate's time? Thanks to the impeachment mess, Biden's coming in with no "honeymoon" and no momentum, so perhaps there's not much risk of his doing anything meaningful in his first few months
Not unless one considers 39 executive orders signed in four days as 'doing anything'.
I can imagine Maxine Waters and Kamala Harris thinking, "No I really meant what I said" when Rand Paul claimed that their riot-inciting comments were only rhetoric.
"Maybe Leahy got Lyme disease from a nasty, blood-sucking tick hiding in that fur cape."
Maybe the tick got Lyme disease from the nasty, blood-sucking senator...
Apparently, after the tick bit Leahy, it's head swelled up instead of it's abdomen. Weird.
Ken B said...
More about Babbitt, shot while committing a violent crime? Sad she died but it was a justifiable shooting.
Sad, are you?
What you are is, a piece of shit.
Democrats are a disgrace.
I maintain- there should not be another Democrat elected for two generations. It'll take at least that long to clean it out.
Leahy's in the hospital? It gets tougher and tougher to remain an atheist.
I've long ago accepted that a) there is a God and b) he has a very bizarre sense of humor.
If interpreted too broadly, the ban on bills of attainder will also prevent legitimate exercises of everything from eminent domain to impeachment. What then?
Look, a bill of attainder imposes punishment without a judicial trial. But Trump, who is very obnoxious, is going to get his trial!!!
So you’re saying Sasse’s ass is grass?
Once more in Daffy Duck voice.
Ken B, why don’t you go read up on how the Nazis used the Reichstag Fire, and then ask yourself the question “Are we the baddies?”
JKLOL, you couldn’t possibly examine your own political biases in a dispassionate manner.
Process as punishment.
Same as it ever was.
"But Trump, who is very obnoxious, is going to get his trial!!!”
He wasn’t allowed to present a defense last time, it was a classic show trial. What makes you think that he would be allowed to present a defense this time? This is a kangaroo court.
"f interpreted too broadly, the ban on bills of attainder will also prevent legitimate exercises of everything from eminent domain to impeachment. What then?”
That’s cute. That’s just a rationalization dressed in legerdemain though. Impeachment and removal is clearly defined in the Constitution, it’s not in danger. What’s in danger by taking into account the language on bills of attainder is this ridiculous farce dressed up like an impeachment. This is no kind of legal trial, and this is not a real impeachment, since the rules are to vote to remove first, then vote to sanction. He’s already out of office. It’s up to the voters now whether he should ever get back in office.
If all you needed to do to pass a bill of attainder was to hold a hearing and call it a trial, then you may as well cross the language out of the constitution. The Democrats are fine with treating the constitution like so much toilet paper, I guess.
Basically the message from the Democrats is that the voters can’t be trusted.
Re: mockturtle:
Not unless one considers 39 executive orders signed in four days as 'doing anything'.
Fair enough. But you can't pack the court or create new states by executive order.
the voters can’t be trusted
That is the central tenet of Progressive-ism
Something I had forgotten about Rand Paul. He is a strong supporter of the Read The Bill Act, which if it ever passed, would require members of Congress to actually read the bills before being allowed to vote on them. The man’s heart is absolutely in the right place.
"Basically the message from the Democrats is that the voters can’t be trusted."
Clearly, which is why they [the Dems] vote for them [the voters]. Just to be sure they get it right.
45 cowards.
As we are still paying Trump and providing him perks, we can impeach him. Rand Paul has gone off his own reservation.
"More about Babbitt, shot while committing a violent crime? Sad she died but it was a justifiable shooting."
Ken B. Bullshit! So climbing through a broken doorway sidelight is "violent?" I notice you characterized it as justifiable, not justified. I read the Daily Mail's account of the still unnamed shooter's CYA justification. Frightened jerkface at best who shot without warning before anyone actually cleared the sidelight.
tim in vermont said...
He wasn’t allowed to present a defense last time, it was a classic show trial. What makes you think that he would be allowed to present a defense this time? This is a kangaroo court.
****************
It was the Republican-controlled Senate that blocked the subpoena of any witnesses or evidence in Trump's first impeachment trial.
Slippery slope arguments are always criticized yet are true in hindsight. The trial of a private citizen in the Senate should be universally condemned as a violation of the rights of citizenship access to justice but the Democrats are a self incited violent mob out for TDS blood. Who will be next in the Senate’s dock.
Left Bank(6:32pm):
I've corrected you on this before: Trump didn't accept any salary, so we aren't "still paying him" even if he accepts a pension, which I'm quite certain he won't. Stop saying he is or was a paid employee of the federal government! It is entirely false.
Newsweek: "Vermont Democratic Senator Patrick Leahy has reportedly been hospitalized just hours after he was sworn in to preside over the second Senate impeachment hearing for former President Donald Trump.
The 80-year-old senator was reportedly feeling unwell in his Capitol office before being examined by the Capitol physician.
"Out of an abundance of caution, the Attending Physician recommended that he be taken to a local hospital for observation, where he is now, and where he is being evaluated," Leahy's spokesperson David Carle said."
If Leahy is unable to preside, does everyone agree that Sen Chuck Grassley should preside over the trial??
The worst offender was Schumer in front of the Supreme Court, threatening individual justices by name.
The justices are not even politicians to whom you could ascribe electoral allegory to Schumer’s threatening words.
How about this for entertainment?
Trump demands to speak at the 'trial.'
Say for just 20 minutes.
He could give a stem-winder for the ages and set the election agenda for the next 10 years.
By the way, if Trump really wants to troll the Dems and Never-Trumpers, he should change the name of The Office of the Former President to "The Office of the Once and Future President". If anyone objects, hey, it's just a literary allusion to a T. H. White book.
The FBI or the DNC (same thing) put out a memo on social media calling 'Patriots, come armed to all 50 State Capitols!!! It was an insulting trap that left Americans wondering what dystopian nightmare Democrats inhabit. Do they get their ideas from the deviants in Hollywood? Alyssa Milano? Rob Reiner?
Americans now know if they protest, they will be murdered or hunted down. It's good to know the rules.
The Progressives who orchestrated the 2020 coup are scared. They've stolen the Capitol, and now must try to keep it.
Democrat governed States called out their National Guard and the razor wire was strung against the peasants with care.
Republican governed States simply said, 'Citizens are welcome at their Capitol.' No National Guard. No razor wire.
Who will prevail? Who should prevail?
I suppose they believe that if they have another trial they will, well not convict Trump they need 2/3rds of the Senate for that. A trial will then discredit him? Gain the Democrats catharsis? Let them ride the tiger of their base for that much longer?
There really is no rational reason to continue this, so it must be something emotional that the Democrats gain. I suppose I should be grateful they are wasting so much time and energy on this.
Divorce or Civil War.
Romney and Toomey (what a disappointment he has been) are done. Collins won her election and is immune. Murkowski and Sasse are vulnerable.
I live in that part of Maine where most of the resident people are, Collins is representing her constituents with these votes.
The MSM is still bloviating about DJT. He's living rent free in their heads. They're afraid their election scam will be revealed to the entire country and their power going poof!
Mock- Progressives will never allow a divorce. I've talked to my State Legislature about pumping up the 9th and 10th Amendments. They mewl, 'We can't. We'd lose the Federal Money'
We have to teach Grammer School kids about anal-sex. We get $43 million from the US Dept of Education. We have to teach what they tell us.'
We have been blessed to be in a defining moment. Let us all acquit ourselves well.
The MSM need Trump to maintain the high level engagement of viewers, and advertising revenue, they have come to expect. Trump will wisely use that need to his advantage. The Democrats will wittingly, or unwittingly, abide the dude.
Sasse had a primary opponent but I couldn’t even tell you his name.
The Dem was a gay guy who owns a cupcake shop. He sexually harassed a female staffer (via text message) after he won the primary. The Dems pressured him to quit, but he persisted. So, the Dems ran a write-in campaign with a black guy who’s last name is Love. Love’s dad was a great sax player. All of this is true.
Coming to a school system near you: Compulsory Ideology for Teachers K-12 in Illinois.
Expected by whom?
We really need to focus on what the Democrats are doing here: They want to use their temporary control of both houses of Congress to bar a particular opposition candidate from ever running for public office again. Is that what our law allows?
"I've corrected you on this before: Trump didn't accept any salary, so we aren't "still paying him" even if he accepts a pension, which I'm quite certain he won't. Stop saying he is or was a paid employee of the federal government! It is entirely false."
The President is required to take the salary, he can't refuse it, it is required by the Constitution. See Article II, 1.7: "The President shall, at stated Times, receive for his Services, a Compensation, which shall neither be increased nor diminished during the Period for which he shall have been elected, and he shall not receive within that Period any other Emolument from the United States, or any of them."
Trump took the salary but each quarter donated the three months salary in full to some worthy cause of his choosing.
Fauci is the highest paid federal employee, though...
Romney, Collins, Murkowski, Toomey, and Sasse apparently are sacrificing their careers to be anti-Trump.
Look, a bill of attainder imposes punishment without a judicial trial. But Trump, who is very obnoxious, is going to get his trial!!!
It is "like" a trial, but not. There is a verdict, but not.
In a real constitutional impeachment,(this is not) removal from office, and maybe prohibition, on holding future positions in the govt. No fines, prison, parole.
This clown show however is undefinable. No words can define exactly what is going on.
Please find any document, that delegates to congress, the power to impeach a citizen, not working for the federal govt.
mockturtle said...
Ken B., yes, we've read your lame opinion on the Babbitt shooting enough already. Go back under your bridge now.
If blogspot had upvoting, this would be upvoted.
@Goepace, Toomey has announced his retirement. Campaigning from Maine, Collins probably feels that her vote improves, rather than diminishes re-election chances — and she has 5 years and 10 months to mend any fences she needs to mend. Ben Sasse probably also figures that 5 years and 10 months from now people will have forgotten his backstabbing. He’s probably right. Romney has always been a dick, but as long as he can hold the Mormon vote —in Utah! — he probably feels safe. And I believe that stabbing Trump in the back won’t cost him the Mormon vote in the 2024 Utah primary.
That just leaves Lisa Murkowski. Two years from now will you think to send money to her primary opponent?
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