२१ सप्टेंबर, २०१९

"Now, this rising generation of autistic adults is joining others in the movement to change autism discussions that, they say, have historically been 'about us, without us.'"

"More and more, they are influencing policies, leading protests against misleading anti-vaccine messages and the marketing of quack treatments, pushing for fair representation in media coverage, movies and TV shows, such as 'Sesame Street,' and helping to reshape language and outdated opinions about what autism really means. (For example, many self-advocates ask to be called 'autistic people' rather than 'people with autism' because the latter implies a disability.) More and more autistic people, such as 16-year-old climate change activist Greta Thunberg, are taking pride in their identities. This month, she called autism her 'superpower.'... [Self-advocates object to teaching] autistic people to mimic neurotypical behaviors that are not natural to them. [Jillian Parramore, an autistic person in California] said providers would come into her preschool class to teach her how to 'walk and talk and breathe like a human — one that they understood to be human.' Parramore, who did not fully speak until she was 10, said trainers would also force her to practice facial expressions in the mirror to convey emotions, saying, 'show me happy, show me sad, show me angry.' 'To this day, I get really freaked out when I see a mirror in public because I immediately want to go through the facial expressions,' she said. 'I’ve even learned to put on lipstick without a mirror because it’s too much for me.'"

From "How a ‘Sesame Street’ Muppet became embroiled in a controversy over autism/Autistic self-advocates are changing discussions that, they say, have historically been 'about us, without us'" (WaPo). Despite the headline, the article is not mostly about "Sesame Street." The comments at the link are fantastic, with some very articulate autistic people dominating. Example:

It is wrong to put a child through conversion therapy which drives them to PTSD just so they can appear neurotypical in ways that do not disable them at all. Cosmetic behaviors like stimming are not corrected for a child's benefit, but rather for the benefit of an ignorant public.
And (from another comment by the same person):
I feel it is rational to assert that society as a whole could benefit if more people with autism could be understood and provided with a better opportunity to contribute. I feel fewer people with autism would end up in institutions, jails, and unemployment lines, and I feel that more savants would be able to step up and make the one-to-species contributions that we are known for.

It isn't a matter of entitlement. The question is: What choices are good for both a minority that needs to be protected and for our society as a whole? The answers come out the same. Encourage understanding, not cruelty, in the general population. Offer *reasonable* accommodations. Don't try to force us to be like everyone else.

४३ टिप्पण्या:

Amexpat म्हणाले...

Makes sense. We're all wired differently. We should all be free to be who we are, as long as we are not hurting someone else and are able to be a productive member of society.

tim maguire म्हणाले...

Cosmetic behaviors like stimming are not corrected for a child's benefit, but rather for the benefit of an ignorant public.

No, it’s done for the child’s benefit. Because that’s more realistic than expecting the entire world (or “ignorant public” as this person prefers) to change to accommodate the child.

This sounds like a variation on, “We want our children to speak English so they can be doctors and lawyers. You want them to speak Spanish so they can be maids and dishwashers.”

mockturtle म्हणाले...

"More and more autistic people, such as 16-year-old climate change activist Greta Thunberg, are taking pride in their identities. This month, she called autism her 'superpower.'..."

Why am I not surprised by this?

whitney म्हणाले...

Being led by children is just part of the confluence. It's really kind of boring but I guess some people find it novel

Fernandinande म्हणाले...

self-advocates

Is that a brave new word?

'autistic people' rather than 'people with autism'

Autistic-Americans
Autoids
Spectroids.

Being led by children is just part of the confluence.

That old French one had some mental issues, too.

Jean D'Arc(!)

Ingachuck'stoothlessARM म्हणाले...

"weaponized autism" makes 8chan more fun

Joanne Jacobs म्हणाले...

Years ago, when I was on the San Jose Mercury News editorial board, Microsoft CEO Bill Gates came to talk to us for reasons I can't remember. He rocked back and forth as he spoke.

Some think Gates is "on the spectrum." Or, as we can now say, autistic.

Here's a list of 30 "inspiring" people with autism, most of it very speculative. https://www.appliedbehavioranalysisprograms.com/historys-30-most-inspiring-people-on-the-autism-spectrum/ (It's sort of like those lists that says everyone famous was gay.)

Mary Beth म्हणाले...

It is wrong to put a child through conversion therapy which drives them to PTSD just so they can appear neurotypical

Is it actually conversion therapy? Or are they just using the same phrase in order to tie it to gay conversion therapy?

Think of it as acting classes. There are plenty of neurotypical people who, from time to time, have to display an emotion they aren't feeling. It's done out of politeness to people around you and is easier than trying to verbalize the same thing. Being different is fine but it's not an excuse for rudeness.

Bob Smith म्हणाले...

And the societal downslope gets even steeper.

gilbar म्हणाले...

self-advocates ask to be called 'autistic people' rather than 'people with autism' because the latter implies a disability.

RIGHT! it is NOT a disability!! It's just something that makes it hard for Autistic People to hold down jobs, or form relationships, or cope with society.

If neurotypical people can just be taught to understand, that it is THEIR RESPONSIBILITY to accommodate Autistic People, and provide for them; then everything will be fine. Neurotypical people should be taught to be HAPPY to provide for Autistic People, and to view Autistic People as those with 'superpowers'; the superpowers of having a hard time holding down jobs, forming relationships, and coping with society

I have that right? Don't I?

Ingachuck'stoothlessARM म्हणाले...

some sort of "Fake it Till You Make it" doesnt apply here?

gilbar म्हणाले...

ps. I'm an antisocial Asshole. I have to constantly watch what i say and do, to keep from upsetting people; is that bad? Or is That MY superpower? Is it society's responsibility to accommodate ME?

rhhardin म्हणाले...

The moron spectrum will be the next victim class.

gilbar म्हणाले...

rhhardin said... The moron spectrum will be the next victim class.

That's All i'm asking For! Well, THAT'S WHAT I AM DEMANDING!!!!

sean म्हणाले...

That's so funny, because a few years back, "people with autism" would have been the politically correct term, and "autistic people" totally offensive. See the linked discussion. http://crookedtimber.org/2006/04/23/my-sweet-tunibamba/

mockturtle म्हणाले...

I can easily picture cadres of militant youth enforcing 'green' behavior by their elders. Instead of the Red Guard, I guess they would be the Green Guard. And autistic youth would be leading the movement.

Ingachuck'stoothlessARM म्हणाले...

an autiste!

give them some "autistic license" ?

Renee म्हणाले...

You know there is no medical test for it. They kept trying to put my kid on the spectrum, fought hard to keep him off.

Bites tounge.

Ingachuck'stoothlessARM म्हणाले...

People with dwarfism and cleft palate may have been revered in ancient times

https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2019/03/people-dwarfism-and-cleft-palate-may-have-been-revered-ancient-times

Birkel म्हणाले...

And still Greta Thunburg will have "I keel you" eyes.

Robert Marshall म्हणाले...

I know a bit about this, as the parent of an adult with Asperger's Syndrome, and I can see some merit in both points of view. Sure, the general public should learn to be as tolerant as possible of the quirks of the AS crowd, especially since the Aspies didn't get a say in that aspect of their make-up. Live and let live.

At the same time, complaining about "conversion therapy" ignores the fact that you have to live in the world as it is. Sure, it would be great if everyone would tolerate the weirdness without objection, but that's not really the way things are or will ever be. To get along, you have to avoid freaking out the majority, and learning how to do that (as much as it is possible) is a useful exercise, whether you like it or not.

Birkel म्हणाले...

Just when we need Smear Merchant Chuck to explain something...

n.n म्हणाले...

tie it to gay conversion therapy?

Transgender conversion therapy has progressed to indoctrinating (e.g. transgender/homosexual couplets) the general population (e.g. public school, private corporation axis movements, popular culture), narrow focus of the individual targeted for transition, and medical corruption to force transgender/neo-sexual states.

NorthOfTheOneOhOne म्हणाले...

Robert Marshall said...

I know a bit about this, as the parent of an adult with Asperger's Syndrome, and I can see some merit in both points of view.

I'm a step-parent of an adult Aspie as well and I wholeheartedly agree.

Ralph L म्हणाले...

Jordan Peterson says one of the most important things parents should do is make their child likable when he starts school. It must be difficult for parents to restrain themselves from over-training.

h म्हणाले...

Related: An article in the Wash Post about a single sperm donor who had 12 offspring through the donation process and all 12 were autistic. (or the appropriate appellation). The implication of the article (and explicitly in the comments section) was that the sperm from this man should be removed from the bank. I think this implication can only be based on a presumption that autism is a "disability" or (if you don't want to use that word) a condition that potential mothers would avoid if they could. (I can't write this without thinking, " in many cultures "daughterness" is a regarded as a disability, or a condition that potential mothers would avoid if they could.)

mockturtle म्हणाले...

h reports: An article in the Wash Post about a single sperm donor who had 12 offspring through the donation process and all 12 were autistic.

Do you remember how old the donor was?

mockturtle म्हणाले...

Wow. An article about that in the WSJ reveals that:
"Of course, as these stories go, that was not the donor’s true background. At the time Rizzo viewed H898’s profile he did not, in fact, have a Master’s in Medical Photography. The donor didn’t even have a college degree, for that matter. Additionally, if the sperm bank had done even a little investigatory work, they would have found that H898 had gone to a school for children with learning and emotional disabilities; didn’t speak until he was three years old, and had been diagnosed with ADHD, as well as Pervasive Developmental Disorder (a form of autism spectrum disorder)."

mockturtle म्हणाले...

IMO, the sperm-donor thing is problematic on many levels, one of which is the type of guy who would donate his sperm. I'd sooner pick someone up off the street. And how many half-siblings will there likely be? And their offspring would be at even higher risk for inbreeding. Bad idea.

Ingachuck'stoothlessARM म्हणाले...

is there a 'supply/demand' dynamic similar with drugs?

Sebastian म्हणाले...

From reasonable tolerance to coerced recognition is a short step in progworld.

Freeman Hunt म्हणाले...

Learning to get along in an NT world is an important skill. Learning to value and accommodate Aspies, especially since they're likely responsible for a hugely outsized number of the advancements enjoyed in modern life, is an important skill too.

Le Stain du Poop म्हणाले...

Is that about the mental retard child-abuse victim?

NotWhoIUsedtoBe म्हणाले...

1. Expecting the world to accommodate you is childish.

2. Working to change how the world works is an adult endeavor.

To accomplish 2, you have to jettison 1. Autistic people with many strange behaviors which they can't control aren't going to convince anyone.

rehajm म्हणाले...

Climate change activist is not a thing anyone should post along with their name. For one it sounds like you are pro climate change and two, in a second pass, it means you are some sort of professional worry wort.

Not an oldster. म्हणाले...

Had an aspie type kid in the pool back in the lifeguarding days. Wouldn't get out when the lifeguards took their break and we cleared the pool. Mom explained he's autistic not just misbehaving. But rules are rules in a shared society. If you're kid isn't mature enough to follow safety rules and you have no control over him, he can't come to the pool and carry on like that.

You can't accommodate them in public like the mothers are willing to do at home. Not fair to others who have mastered the rules and it puts others at risk to have someone going against the grain because they are are allegedly medically... special.

Inclusion can be overrated.

Not an oldster. म्हणाले...

Greta girls' work is overrated. PR stunt.
Call me when you're ready to overhaul your lifestyles, kids, and then I know you understand the science and really love Gaia.

Kids are pawns, so easily owned.
"Save our Planet! ... Guns are Bad! ... Go Patriots!"

The future is in their hands? Lol.

Amadeus 48 म्हणाले...

To resolve a long term dental issue, I needed an extraction and an implant. In referring me to a surgeon, my longtime dentist said that the man is brilliant but he probably will say some strange things.

Yup. Brilliant oral surgeon who had calibrated social dialogue differently from most people. Nothing too off-kilter, but definitely playing by different rules.

He makes the world a better place, but I didn’t look to him for guidance on the planet’s future.

MayBee म्हणाले...

I like the second commenter Ann quoted.

It's tough, because to just learn to accept outside-the-norm behaviors works against our brains which are well developed through time to notice odd behavior and be uncomfortable with it. That's part of human survival built into us. So you can't just say "accept it" and be done, even if that's what we *want* to do.

But I get them. As a woman who is more conservative than the "women's issues!" political media landscape allows for, I understand how it feels to have all the writing about your "group" be *about* you by people who don't get you.

stlcdr म्हणाले...

“...benefit of an ignorant public”

Talk about broad brush.

It’s not about the minorities. Blacks, Jews, gays the homeless, autism, ptsd. They (as a group) are simply tools used by the political elite to their own ends. The overwhelmingly vast majority of the public understand minorities, of whatever type. The ‘ignorant public’ that they see are what the media and the elites want you to see. They don’t want to help you.

daskol म्हणाले...

We should apply the same understanding to other flavors of neuroatypical. People who are unusually empathetic, for example, probably have a difficult time in a world of neurotypicals—maybe just as much of challenge as those who don’t feel or convey empathy in typical ways. That would be nice. But neuroatypical people, whether they exist in the long tail of intelligence, empathy, psychoneurosis, creativity, will do themselves and society a favor by developing a working model of neurotypical behaviors nonetheless. It’s not conversion, it’s survival—really, thrival— skills in a world or normies. I suspect I enjoy the Althouse commentariat as much as I do, and it’s as unusual as it is, because of its high concentration of neuroatypicals, including the host’s tolerance for unusualness and her own displays of it.

daskol म्हणाले...

Thrival skills. I think I just made that up but don’t wanna google and be disappointed.

Skippy Tisdale म्हणाले...

"self-advocates ask to be called 'autistic people' rather than 'people with autism' "

self-advocates ask to be called 'colored people' rather than 'people with color'