३ ऑक्टोबर, २०१७

"Hugh Hefner was the original Pajama Boy."

Said Meade just now in a conversation we were having about Hugh Hefner.

I'd been going on about how Hugh Hefner wasn't very masculine: The image he created for himself — for viewers of the magazine to identify with — was as a man who spent all his time hanging around the house, listening to jazz, wearing pajamas. He didn't engage in traditional masculine activities like sports or working on the car. He hosted parties. Did he do anything outdoorsy? Was he ever outdoors in the daylight? I can only picture him outdoors after dark at his swimming pool, which was itself designed to have an indoors, a "grotto." That was some outré interior decoration — a grotto.

८५ टिप्पण्या:

Meade म्हणाले...

Time for me hop on my mt. bike. Back in a few.

mccullough म्हणाले...

Pajamas and a pipe. Beta male

Sprezzatura म्हणाले...

"...was as a man who spent all his time hanging around the house, listening to jazz, wearing pajamas. He didn't engage in traditional masculine activities like sports or working on the car."

Right, real men act like kids and poor people, they don't spread their seed.

Sheesh.

rehajm म्हणाले...

The image was an affectation of aristocracy or nobility. Hef's pretending could be viewed as Pajama Boy-ish but the affectation itself was not.

exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil म्हणाले...

"Right, real men act like kids and poor people, they don't spread their seed."

The inner city guys who have 8 kids by 8 different baby mommas agree with PB that "spreading their seed" is the sign of a real man.

That's the real toxic masculinity that ensures those kids will remain poor.

I Have Misplaced My Pants म्हणाले...

That grotto seems so...grotty.

I can't imagine the body fluids that have gone down in that water. Groooooooooss.

Sebastian म्हणाले...

"Beta male" The story of Hef's life: the beta male as PUA.

exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil म्हणाले...

Pants, someone here posted a link to a story about a guy who attended a party there within the last few years and took pictures. Toilet paper rolls stacked up on the vanities. 70's furniture. Stains on the carpeting.

I've been in Great Houses in the UK which were a bit worse for wear and yet were still beautiful after centuries. The Playboy Mansion looks sad and crappy and tacky after, what, 40 years?

buwaya म्हणाले...

Aristocracy is the right call. Or perhaps royalty.
People would come to him, looking for approval, favors, or simply to let it be known that they were worthy of being there. He kept an open house, a court.

The model is the Versailles of Louis XIV, or more accurately maybe the isle of Capri under Tiberius.

There is no need for some proletarian or even aristocratic physicality.

buwaya म्हणाले...

"Toilet paper rolls stacked up on the vanities. 70's furniture. Stains on the carpeting."

You need a proper staff for a palace.
Seems like his income suffered a decline.

exhelodrvr1 म्हणाले...

Meade,
"Time for me hop on my mt. bike. Back in a few."

Presumably you wore a "helmet" along with your silk pajamas?

William म्हणाले...

He had sex with lots of women. Many consider that a masculine activity.......,In Hefner's world everything was a consumer experience: sex, music, food, clothes. The point of the game was to demonstrate good taste, not high morals.......He certainly succeeded in having a pleasant, comfortable life. That's extremely rare, so congratulations are in order.......For another generation or two, there will be divided opinions about his importance and impact on society, and, then, he will be forgotten.

Roughcoat म्हणाले...

He was louche.

I love that word.

I Have Misplaced My Pants म्हणाले...

good taste

lol

TWW म्हणाले...

Entirely too much about Hefner. Althouse is just like Playboy; we go there for the photos. Enough said.

Michael K म्हणाले...

".He certainly succeeded in having a pleasant, comfortable life. "

He was a sybarite and that is not very masculine. Dorian Grey, for example.

Louis XIV was royal and, like Philip II, squandered a country that ended up poor.

Elizabeth I was a miser. Read the real history of the Armada.

Drake had to forage for food and gunpowder. Much came from captured Spanish ships.

England ended up rich.

Curious George म्हणाले...

I heard he laid a lot of pipe. Isn't construction masculine?

MayBee म्हणाले...

There is nothing more repulsive to me than that grotto. Would any of you actually dip your body in there?

Sprezzatura म्हणाले...

Exile,

If your friend w/ eight baby moms is rich and a dick slinger, then he is a winner. Resources and cum spreading = winning. Hef checked both boxes.

traditionalguy म्हणाले...

The Heff testing service drove many new models so he could find the very best one to rate Playmate each month. That sounds like work to me. You could consider Playboy Magazine a Consumer Reports for serially monogamous Puritans .

Gahrie म्हणाले...

Hefner had a lot of sex with willing partners for a non-masculine man. By biological standards he was a pretty successful man.

Gahrie म्हणाले...

The inner city guys who have 8 kids by 8 different baby mommas agree with PB that "spreading their seed" is the sign of a real man.

Given the basic biological imperatives they are correct. Maximizing your offspring and spreading your genetic inheritance as widely as possible is what it is all about from a animalistic biological standpoint.

Why should we be surprised that the uneducated, uncivilized and irresponsible act in an animalistic manner?

I'm not saying that this behavior is correct or desirable, but don't see it as any more deviant than killing your offspring before birth.

Achilles म्हणाले...

Quaaludes aren't masculine. They are more rapey. I am not sure if rapey is associated on the masculine/feminine scale.

Ann Althouse म्हणाले...

The affectation of the idea of the upper class is also something gay men were doing at the time, which was what started the conversation between me and Meade. We were talking about the documentary “Do I Sound Gay?” Which we watched last night.

As for hanging around with pretty women, that’s slumber party stuff.

Who knows what the actual sex was like? I’ve read some things, but I don’t think it was that macho. Lolling around in bed with women, come on that’s not very masculine in itself. Getting out and working hard, fight for survival, and being daring — that’s masculine. Having sexual intercourse is something that’s easily and lazily done by both men and women, often while very sleepy or drunk. Pajama boys do it just as easily as Marines and professional athletes.

walter म्हणाले...

Ha ha..wonder where Meade got that from..

Gahrie म्हणाले...

Who knows what the actual sex was like? I’ve read some things, but I don’t think it was that macho. Lolling around in bed with women, come on that’s not very masculine in itself. Getting out and working hard, fight for survival, and being daring — that’s masculine. Having sexual intercourse is something that’s easily and lazily done by both men and women, often while very sleepy or drunk. Pajama boys do it just as easily as Marines and professional athletes.

On behalf of all splooge stooges everywhere...thanks for the womansplaining.

Gahrie म्हणाले...

I suppose being lazy, allowing others to provide for you and cowardice are feminine?

robother म्हणाले...

Hef is a good counter to the reductionism of the whole Alpha-Beta Male thing. As his female counterpart, the adventuress. is to the simplistic model of female sex drive promulgated by Heartiste. Diana Krall does a great version of that adventuress theme song from the 50s, "Peel Me a Grape."

walter म्हणाले...

Norm McDonald has a bit about women being able to take phone calls during sex.
Talk about lolling..

Static Ping म्हणाले...

Hugh may have been the original pajama boy, but masculinity is really measured by three things:

1. Physical strength and prowess.
2. Being able to support a family.
3. Getting laid or at least choosing to be monogamous when there are plenty of willing partners.

Hugh, by all accounts, slept with a lot of women, many of them among the most beautiful women in the world. He also was rich which meant he could support a family and did so when it served his fancy. He's not Hercules, but he's certainly a lot more masculine than the current Pajama Boy who is a wimp, is probably living at home, and at ain't bagging any centerfolds any time soon.

Diamondhead म्हणाले...

Having sex doesn't make you special. People do it all the time! Hefner was just rich enough to get pretty young women to sleep with him when he was old and decrepit. His last wife even fucked him once, briefly. Some people would say a man's desire to get rich is tangled up in the desire to have access to youth when old. I can't imagine getting much pleasure out of an encounter where the woman is holding vomit back, but to each their own.

exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil म्हणाले...

.......For another generation or two, there will be divided opinions about his importance and impact on society, and, then, he will be forgotten.

10/3/17, 12:35 PM

Yeah. That's about it. I never found him to be a terribly interesting character, and he seemed pathetic and shoddy in his old age. I remember a poem in "Spoon River Analogy" about the town roué who ends up a diseased, toothless, shabby old man still trying to play at being the village Don Juan. Hef had much more fame and money than the character in Edgar Lee Masters' poem but his end was just as pitiful in its' own way.

Bill R म्हणाले...

That grotto was featured in a Sex and the City. The girls walk by to see it filled with large breasted topless women.

"Look at that", says Miranda, "tit soup."

MaxedOutMama म्हणाले...

Gotta have a private place to play, right?

Depends on your definition of masculinity, doesn't it? I would think for most men, "getting plenty" pretty much suffices.

Bay Area Guy म्हणाले...

Hef was a Beta Male, who made it big.

Myself, I prefer the common man, the guy who works hard, honestly, honorably, to support his family, to save money, to build something in his community. The rest is commentary.

tcrosse म्हणाले...

Bob Guccione: compare and contrast.

rcocean म्हणाले...

Real men fight wars and defend the country. Real men invent things, raise families, build and run businesses, write music and literature. They run the world.

Pajama boys only want 3 things: A warm bed, A warm pair of shoes, and a warm pussy.

Gabriel म्हणाले...

@buwaya:The model is the Versailles of Louis XIV

Might explain some of the stains and wear-and-tear. Versaille did not have toilets, and it was dangerous to get too far away from wherever the King was, as you might lose influence or be gossiped about or something, so there was a lot of peeing behind columns and in corners.

@Michael K:Louis XIV was royal and, like Philip II, squandered a country that ended up poor.

I've read some of his correspondence with his generals, and what comes through there is that he was incredibly perceptive, tactful, and competent. Now his absolute government did not reward initiative and consequently his generals frequently demanded very specific orders before doing anything. Wars are not run well by remote control, but Louis XIV probably did the best that any human could have done in his situation.

I would imagine the initiative problem extended to economics as well, and if so Louis XIV is therefore to blame--but that is the inherent problem with top-down economics, and I don't imagine anyone could have done better. It simply should not have been done at all. And I don't know how to assign to Louis XIV for the nation and style of governing he was literally born into. I think he made the very most of what he had.

rcocean म्हणाले...

I do envy Hef for his "Grotto". I'd love to have clean, indoor swimming pool with waterfalls and caves.

Hearst had a great indoor and outdoor swimming pool at San Simeon. Much better than Hef's.

BTW, I've read that Kirk Douglas had tunnel built to the Hef Mansion so that he could go there undetected. No sure its true though.

Gabriel म्हणाले...

Louis XIV's letter to his son could not make the contrast between himself and Hugh Hefner more clear. It is grossly unfair to the Sun King to put those two men in the same sentence, I think:

There is something more, my son, and I hope that your own experience will never teach it to you: nothing could be more laborious to you than a great amount of idleness if you were to have the misfortune to fall into it through beginning by being disgusted with public affairs, then with pleasure, then with idleness itself, seeking everywhere fruitlessly for what can never be found, that is to say, the sweetness of repose and leisure without having the preceding fatigue and occupation.

I laid a rule on myself to work regularly twice every day, and for two or three hours each time with different persons, without counting the hours which I passed privately and alone, nor the time which I was able to give on particular occasions to any special affairs that might arise. There was no moment when I did not permit people to talk to me about them, provided that they were urgent; with the exception of foreign ministers who sometimes find too favourable moments in the familiarity allowed to them, either to obtain or to discover something, and whom one should not hear without being previously prepared.

I cannot tell you what fruit I gathered immediately I had taken this resolution. I felt myself, as it were, uplifted in thought and courage; I found myself quite another man, and with joy reproached myself for having been too long unaware of it. This first timidity, which a little self-judgment always produces and which at the beginning gave me pain, especially on occasions when I had to speak in public, disappeared in less than no time. The only thing I felt then was that I was King, and born to be one. I experienced next a delicious feeling, hard to express, and which you will not know yourself except by tasting it as I have done. For you must not imagine, my son, that the affairs of State are like some obscure and thorny path of learning which may possibly have already wearied you, wherein the mind strives to raise itself with effort above its purview, more often to arrive at no conclusion, and whose utility or apparent utility is repugnant to us as much as its difficulty. The function of Kings consists principally in allowing good sense to act, which always acts naturally and without effort. What we apply ourselves to is sometimes less difficult than what we do only for our amusement. Its usefulness always follows. A King, however skilful and enlightened be his ministers, cannot put his own hand to the work without its effect being seen. Success, which is agreeable in everything, even in the smallest matters, gratifies us in these as well as in the greatest, and there is no satisfaction to equal that of noting every day some progress in glorious and lofty enterprises, and in the happiness of the people which has been planned and thought out by oneself. All that is most necessary to this work is at the same time agreeable; for, in a word, my son, it is to have one's eyes open to the whole earth; to learn each hour the news concerning every province and every nation, the secrets of every court, the mood and the weaknesses of each Prince and of every foreign minister; to be well-informed on an infinite number of matters about which we are supposed to know nothing; to elicit from our subjects what they hide from us with the greatest care; to discover the most remote opinions of our own courtiers and the most hidden interests of those who come to us with quite contrary professions. I do not know of any other pleasure we would not renounce for that, even if curiosity alone gave us the opportunity.

rcocean म्हणाले...
ही टिप्पणी लेखकाना हलविली आहे.
RBE म्हणाले...

When I first scrolled past the photo of the grotto I thought it was a picture of a religious grotto...scrolled back up to see the story attached thinking it might be about something gentle and lovely and saw it was the Playboy Grotto...Nope!

rcocean म्हणाले...

Here's a question. If Hef had inherited his $$$ millions and could have gotten plenty of "Playmates" without his magazine, would he have founded Playboy? Or would've he have just lounged around his entire life having sex with his bunnies?

pdug म्हणाले...

Hefner made straight sex "gay"

(and FWIW, some bunny has claimed Hef watches gay porn while having sex with bunnies)

https://calvinistinternational.com/2017/10/02/hugh-hefner-porn-and-the-homosexualization-of-sex/

ccscientist म्हणाले...

Manly: cajun navy.
I think the word I would use for Hef is successful but effete. Successful is necessary for men but is not equivalent to manliness.

Bad Lieutenant म्हणाले...

I remember a poem in "Spoon River Analogy" about the town roué who ends up a diseased, toothless, shabby old man still trying to play at being the village Don Juan.


Pls remind me which name/grave

Ann Althouse म्हणाले...

“but masculinity is really measured by three things:

1. Physical strength and prowess.
2. Being able to support a family.
3. Getting laid or at least choosing to be monogamous when there are plenty of willing partners.”

Well, if #3 refers to the ability to do it, women are way more masculine than men. Women are so macho by the #3 standard that we have to take strong measures — like a professional boxer re street fights — to avoid nearly all of the opportunities.

Ann Althouse म्हणाले...

“I suppose being lazy, allowing others to provide for you and cowardice are feminine?”

Your logic is terrible.

Some think logic is masculine.

buwaya म्हणाले...

I thought Hef worked pretty hard himself most of the time.

A magazine does not publish itself, nor did the rest of his many other businesses (at the time) run themselves either.

He retired, in effect, several decades ago, but before then I think he put in his time doing actual work.

My analogy was Hefners establishment vs Versailles, not necessarily Louis XIV himself vs Hefner. Louis XIV seems to have been a one-woman-at-a-time man, at least, staying with a particular mistress for a considerable period. Versailles as a place to see and be seen, and to obtain opportunity and favors was more like the Hefner mansion in function. People came to kowtow to Hefner.

Louis XV however was more Hefner-like. The parc aux cerfs and all that.

The other analogy was Tiberius on Capri - and in that case Hefner comes of as much less perverted.

William म्हणाले...

Who among us would not readily swap the life of Hugh Hefner for that of Mother Theresa. While it's true that she didn't get lucky very often, she did manage to achieve a moral grandeur. In the long run, what gives your life savor and significance is not how many Playboy models, you sleep with but rather how many lepers whose feet you have washed.

rcocean म्हणाले...

"Women are so macho by the #3 standard that we have to take strong measures — like a professional boxer re street fights — to avoid nearly all of the opportunities."

LOL. Going by how many men you've laid, a street Hooker is the most macho person in the world. Or perhaps Andrew Sullivan is the most macho man alive, I'm sure he's gone "bare back" riding with more partners, then 99% of straight men.

It must be a cultural thing, but where I grew up, Grown up Men - not HS and College students - weren't measured by how many bimbo's they could talk into bed. In fact, a man who spends his whole life bedding women was called a "Gigolo". It seems some people think that's a compliment.

exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil म्हणाले...

Bad Lieutenant:

Lucius Atherton


WHEN my moustache curled,
And my hair was black,
And I wore tight trousers
And a diamond stud,
I was an excellent knave of hearts and took many a trick.
But when the gray hairs began to appear--
Lo! a new generation of girls
Laughed at me, not fearing me,
And I had no more exciting adventures
Wherein I was all but shot for a heartless devil,
But only drabby affairs, warmed-over affairs
Of other days and other men.
And time went on until I lived at
Mayer's restaurant,
Partaking of short-orders, a gray, untidy,
Toothless, discarded, rural Don Juan. . . .
There is a mighty shade here who sings
Of one named Beatrice;
And I see now that the force that made him great
Drove me to the dregs of life.

Gabriel म्हणाले...

@rcocean:In fact, a man who spends his whole life bedding women was called a "Gigolo"

I thought gigolos were kept men.

M Jordan म्हणाले...

Hef is a beta male ... I had never seen it before. Maybe that’s why he repulsed me. I’m a bit beta myself by nature but I’ve overcome it. I put down the guitar and grab a chainsaw. Does it every time.

exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil म्हणाले...

A young black man named Jonathan Smith worked to save people in Las Vegas until he was shot himself.

A retired Marine stole a truck and drove it to the concert grounds and took wounded and dying people to the hospital

Another Marine saved the life of a girl he had just met an hour earlier.

Those are manly men.

buwaya म्हणाले...

You CAN do it all - conquering both nations and their women -

http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2010/08/1-in-200-men-direct-descendants-of-genghis-khan/

M Jordan म्हणाले...

@Ann: “Some think logic is masculine.“

It is masculine. Just ask James Damore. Or walk through the programmers section of the company.

rcocean म्हणाले...

"I thought gigolos were kept men."

You're right. If they're not kept, they're usually called Pimps.

Achilles म्हणाले...

Ann Althouse said...

Some think logic is masculine.

That's funny.

walter म्हणाले...

Blogger buwaya said...I thought Hef worked pretty hard himself most of the time. A magazine does not publish itself, nor did the rest of his many other businesses (at the time) run themselves either.
--
Yeah..but no chainsaw, carburetors or boxin'..so say the academics.

dustbunny म्हणाले...

M. Jordan, perhaps that is why Dylan puts down his guitar and picks up the arc welder

Left Bank of the Charles म्हणाले...

Connecting the dots on the Hugh Hefner posts, is Althouse intimating that Donald Trump modeled his life in the image of the original pajama boy?

Jupiter म्हणाले...

Blogger rcocean said...

"Pajama boys only want 3 things: A warm bed, A warm pair of shoes, and a warm pussy."

Is that anything like "loose shoes, tight pussy and a warm place to shit"?

Gabriel म्हणाले...

@exiledonmainstreet:

Once, when midnight smote the air,
Eunuchs ran through Hell and met
From thoroughfare to thoroughfare,
While that great Juan galloped by;
And like these to rail and sweat 5
Staring upon his sinewy thigh.

Freeman Hunt म्हणाले...

I wonder if there are any eccentric rich guys who live in grottoes.

Bad Lieutenant म्हणाले...


Ann Althouse said...
“I suppose being lazy, allowing others to provide for you and cowardice are feminine?”

Your logic is terrible.

Some think logic is masculine.
10/3/17, 3:58 PM


Is that why you don't favor logic, because it doesn't become you?

Logic is men in shorts. Who's with me boys?

Meade म्हणाले...

Some say Anthony Bourdain, at 61, no pajamas, is quite masculine.

exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil म्हणाले...

Ah, but Gabriel, "that great Juan" ended up in hell.

exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil म्हणाले...

Meade, since Bourdain has said he'd like to poison the President, I find him much less appealing.

And poisoning strikes me as a distinctly sneaky, unmanly method of murdering someone, although I can see why a chef would favor it. I think of Lucrezia Borgia. Be a man, Anthony, and challenge Trump to a duel at 20 paces!

rcocean म्हणाले...

"Is that anything like "loose shoes, tight pussy and a warm place to shit"?"

To you maybe. Not to me. Different strokes, etc.

rcocean म्हणाले...

"Some say Anthony Bourdain, at 61, no pajamas, is quite masculine."

No doubt. But others say that he- like most men over 55 - should keep their shirts on. Otherwise they look like skeletons with six pack abs.

Gahrie म्हणाले...

Your logic is terrible.

At least I use it.

You stated that: "Getting out and working hard, fight for survival, and being daring — that’s masculine."

If those attributes represent masculinity to you, why is it illogical to ask "“I suppose being lazy, allowing others to provide for you and cowardice are feminine?”


Some think logic is masculine.

I don't. I'm just disappointed women don't use it more often.

At least I know that it has nothing to do with emotion.

Gahrie म्हणाले...

Personally I think many women work hard, fight for survival and are daring..which is why I don't label those traits as masculine.


Many men are lazy, allow others to support them and are cowardly. which is why I don't consider those traits feminine.

Since you were being sexist, I asked you if you did.

Browndog म्हणाले...

All of this debate over 'what is masculinity' leads me to believe that someday we'll be debating over which bathroom to use.

SukieTawdry म्हणाले...

I appreciated the guy's savvy "empire" building and actually did read the articles, but I always thought him a little pathetic in his pajamas with a bevy of beauties on his arm, more and more so as he got older. The pajama parties at the mansion cracked me up. But they were a coveted invitation among the Hollywood crowd and turned men's designer PJs into a cottage industry.

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together म्हणाले...

Lawnboy is making love to the grass.

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together म्हणाले...

I can't imagine the body fluids that have gone down in that water. Groooooooooss.

Everything that you swim in touches your body fluids. Groooooossss.

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together म्हणाले...

Lolling around in bed with women, come on that’s not very masculine in itself.

For a man it is.

Gabriel म्हणाले...

@exiledonmainstreet:Ah, but Gabriel, "that great Juan" ended up in hell.

So did the eunuchs. May as well hang for a sheep...

There are great sinners and little sinners. Though I don't think Hef was the great type. There was little risk to him in what he did.

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together म्हणाले...

Getting out and working hard, fight for survival, and being daring — that’s masculine.

And very life-shortening.

Having sexual intercourse is something that’s easily and lazily done by both men and women, often while very sleepy or drunk.

Sounds like you're doing it wrong. Men have to work for it, BTW.

They're not doing it to work. They're doing it to have sex. Sorry if you thought they must have something more "noble" in mind when directing their attention at you.

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together म्हणाले...

Meade, since Bourdain has said he'd like to poison the President, I find him much less appealing.

So go have sex with the president, then, FFS. Who cares! The two of you can eat well-done steaks and greasy fast food fries and hamburgers and two scoops of ice cream together until your taste buds rot and your adipose cells burst open!

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together म्हणाले...

That grotto was featured in a Sex and the City. The girls walk by to see it filled with large breasted topless women.

"Look at that", says Miranda, "tit soup."


Which we now know, she was more than happy to imbibe.

Freeman Hunt म्हणाले...

You won't find Trump hanging out in a grotto.

I Have Misplaced My Pants म्हणाले...

Everything that you swim in touches your body fluids. Groooooossss.

I won't presume to speak to your social or recreational choices, but no one fucks strangers for money in the bodies of water I swim in.

exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil म्हणाले...

The Toothless Revolutionary said...
Meade, since Bourdain has said he'd like to poison the President, I find him much less appealing.

So go have sex with the president, then, FFS"

So according to Ritmo logic, if you don't like that Bourdain said he wants to murder the president that means you want to have sex with Trump. That doesn't make sense, even as a joke.

You're getting shriller and more ridiculous every day, Ritmo.