Cruz thought fast and said: "Well, I am blessed to receive a word from God every day in receiving the scriptures and reading the scriptures. And God speaks through the Bible." Perfect. But he had a whole minute to talk, so he proceeded to talk about his rough childhood and his consistent conservatism, tying both to religion. The drunken dad "gave his heart to Jesus." And "the scripture tells us, 'you shall know them by their fruit,'" so don't just listen to who says he's conservative. Ted Cruz has the conservative fruit to show you.
Kelly threw it to Governor Kasich. What do you think? Has God told Kasich what to do? Kasich begins his answer: "Well, Megyn, my father was a mailman." Isn't that just the ultimate nonanswer? He goes on to do his rough childhood talking points, then — in a strained effort to get to religion — proclaims "I do believe in miracles." That seems to refer both to his ability to get elected and the potential to fix America. A little more blabber and then back to God: "He wants America to be strong. He wants America to succeed. And he wants America to lead." Then, in a nutty non sequitur: "And nothing is more important to me than my family, my faith, and my friends." What about your country? Your friends come before your country? If you are serious, you're disqualified. But he's not serious. He's blabbering the time away and keeping as far away from the question as he can get. Why not just say I have not received a word from God about my campaign?! Would it kill you to dignify the anointed Facebooker with a straight answer.
And now Kelly, who clearly can't ask all 10 guys this word-from-God question, gives it to Scott Walker, and damned if he doesn't get to a straight answer (with a very concise and very religious preface):
Well, thanks, Megyn. I'm certainly an imperfect man. And it's only by the blood of Jesus Christ that I've been redeemed from my sins. So I know that God doesn't call me to do a specific thing, God hasn't given me a list, a Ten Commandments, if you will, of things to act on the first day. What God calls us to do is follow his will. And ultimately that's what I'm going to try to do.Then he shifts to more general material from his usual speech but still sticking to the theme of following God:
And I hope people see it in my state, even in the big challenges I took on when I had over 100,000 protesters in and around our capital, trying to do what I thought was the right thing. It wasn't just how I took on those political battles. It was ultimately how I acted. Not responding in kind. Not lashing out. But just being decent going forward and living my life in a way that would be a testimony to him and our faith.Nicely done, I think. Sincerely religious, complete with "the blood of Jesus Christ," but manifested in public life in ways that are not noticeably different from being a kind, decent person in a way that works for people of any religion or no religion.
Only 2 more candidates are going to get the religion question, Marco Rubio and Ben Carson. Rubio not only avoids the specific question. He goes for a joke:
I think God has blessed us. He has blessed the Republican Party with some very good candidates. The Democrats can't even find one.He continues with the "blessings" approach:
And I believe God has blessed our country. This country has been extraordinarily blessed. And we have honored that blessing. And that's why God has continued to bless us.Kelly had woven a question about veterans into the question for Rubio, and with Ben Carson, she changes the question entirely. It's no longer whether God has given you a specific message. It's "a question to you about God and his role, but also... what, if anything, you can do -- you would do as the next president to help heal [the racial] divide?" Carson doesn't talk about religion at all. He goes for science. He says that he doesn't talk about race much "because I'm a neurosurgeon."
[W]hen I take someone to the operating room, I'm actually operating on the thing that makes them who they are. The skin doesn't make them who they are. The hair doesn't make them who they are. And it's time for us to move beyond that...Perhaps someone else on the stage last night would have said that he'd received word from God. Jeb Bush? Chris Christie? Rand Paul? Mike Huckabee? Donald Trump? Who do you think seems most likely to believe God's given him the go ahead? Trump? It's funny to say Trump, but you know, Trump is a Presbyterian:
People are so shocked when they find out I am Protestant. I am Presbyterian. And I go to church and I love God and I love my church"...He takes Communion:
"I am not sure I have [ever asked God for forgiveness]. I just go on and try to do a better job from there. I don't think so.... I think if I do something wrong, I think, I just try and make it right. I don't bring God into that picture. I don't."
"When I drink my little wine—which is about the only wine I drink—and have my little cracker, I guess that is a form of asking for forgiveness, and I do that as often as possible because I feel cleansed.... I think in terms of 'let's go on and let's make it right.'"Have my little cracker!
ADDED: Interestingly, even as Carson avoided religion when asked about religion, he dragged in religion when the subject was taxes:
"What I agree with is that we need a significantly changed taxation system. And the one that I've advocated is based on tithing, because I think God is a pretty fair guy. And he said, you know, if you give me a tithe, it doesn't matter how much you make. If you've had a bumper crop, you don't owe me triple tithes. And if you've had no crops at all, you don't owe me no tithes. So there must be something inherently fair about that...."Basing tax policy on the Bible?! Is everything in the Bible presumptively fair? If your answer isn't no, then you'll have a hell of a time getting elected. And spare me the ludicrous folksiness of "God is a pretty fair guy." The man is a neurosurgeon and an elite academic. But he worked with sick children and maybe that's how we're being talked to, like children.
पोस्ट्स
९० टिप्पण्या:
Frack Kelly- I hope she is disbarred from future debates.
Man; I would love to see those questions asked when the Democrats get around to their primary debates - if they ever do this time around.
I haven't watched Fox News in a couple of years, though I used to watch them pretty regularly. I have never seen Kelly's show, so I have no idea what she is thinking, but it looks like she wants to get invited to those Manhattan cocktail parties she keeps hearing about.
I had lunch in a little deli in Manhattan one time and Greg Gutfeld sat down at the next table for lunch, alone, reading his own column in some paper. Maybe it gets too lonely in Manhattan and Fox News should move to Dallas. I am sure that a lot of the production staff would get along fine in Plano.
It's a dumb question in a night filled with snarky, dumb questions.
But Republicans are used to being treated like that by the media. So they did well.
" about your country? Your friends come before your country?"
"If I had to choose between betraying my friend and betraying my country, I hope I would have the courage to betray my country." -- Emerson
I don't want to have any candidates who boast--and any such declaration is boasting--they "hear God" and "follow his will." They're either liars or fanatics.
""If I had to choose between betraying my friend and betraying my country, I hope I would have the courage to betray my country." -- Emerson"
Fine, but don't ask to be President.
If you want public office, you'd better put the public good ahead of your friends. Most of us are not personal friends with any of these characters, and we deserve a President who serves us because we are citizens and gives us equal regard.
Maybe a Fox correspondent who actually knew something about religion would have asked Trump WHICH Presbyterian Church he took his little cracker from...
http://rapidcityjournal.com/lifestyles/faith-and-values/presbyterian-church-schism-over-gay-ordination-splits-congregations/article_14a55cc0-6062-5adc-a4b2-90eee7a1b562.html
By the way, "little cracker" is a fairly impious way to describe the rite of Communion, so I have to wonder how devout Mr. Trump actually is.
"Fine, but don't ask to be President"
That position might have helped more in 2008, Ann...
I don't want to have any candidates who boast--and any such declaration is boasting--they "hear God" and "follow his will." They're either liars or fanatics.
You wanted to see that so badly in there that you did! Congratulations!
And I am thinking that the Democrats are paying fifty cents every time a commenter gets in the word "clown."
By the way, "little cracker" is a fairly impious way to describe the rite of Communion, so I have to wonder how devout Mr. Trump actually is.
Here is a clue, Trump is nowhere near as pious as your average Gaia worshiper driving their "Prius."
A better question would have been:
"How are you going to rebuild the middle-class when there are no more factories in America, and the Africans in Baltimore are leading the way to the next Holocaust?"
Have my little cracker??? My, God!
"If I had to choose between betraying my friend and betraying my country, I hope I would have the courage to betray my country." -- Emerson
This sentiment strikes me as insane. Say that back during the Cold War you found out that your friend was a Soviet spy. Say that back during WWII you found out that your friend was a Nazi spy. Say today you found out that your friend was an al Qaeda spy. Betray your country first? Insanity.
(Tangential: Why do so many papers write it "Al-Qaeda?" "Al" means "the." "The-Base?" "The-Foundation?" Why would "the" have a hyphen to connect it to something else? Is it because "al" is connected to the next word in Arabic? It's still a definite article. We don't write "Al-Qaeda" in Arabic; we write it with English letters. So why would we try to connect it?)
When Ben Carson said the tax system should be based on tithing I thought he was going to announce his 10-10-10 plan.
In the Presbyterian Church, the bread is just bread. Those heathens don't have a real Priest to perform the transubstantiation.
Thus they just eat Crackers, and Catholics instead eat a miracle feast.
Walker is the most un-Christlike person imaginable.
"If you want public office, you'd better put the public good ahead of your friends. Most of us are not personal friends with any of these characters, and we deserve a President who serves us because we are citizens and gives us equal regard."
Yet, the presidents of recent vintage don't serve us or the public good; they serve their "friends" on Wall Street, in the banks, and in the corporate boardrooms.
Scott Walker is a good man and a Marquette Warrior to boot.
"In the Presbyterian Church, the bread is just bread."
It's just bread in the other churches, too, (including the church I grew up in, the Episcopal Church). It's only anything more than bread in people's heads.
garage mahal said...
"Walker is the most un-Christlike person imaginable"
I know Garage has a hard on for Walker, but good Lord... That's too hyperbolic even for Garage.
Do we really need to start listing all the people who are more "un-Christlike" than Scott Walker? Ok I'll go first: POTUS
garage mahal said...
"Walker is the most un-Christlike person imaginable."
Says the guy who supports his political enemies being arrested, sued, and intimidated by the government because they disagree with him politically.
Re: Robert Cook at 2:30 "I don't want to have any candidates who boast--and any such declaration is boasting--they "hear God" and "follow his will." They're either liars or fanatics."
I think this comment shows how far we've come from the Judeo-Christian consensus. Once, not that long ago, just about everyone understood that someone pledging to pray on tough decisions and to try and follow God's will, was not boasting or being fanatical -- it was a public expression of humility. It was saying "I recognize that I don't have all the answers and that I will need to seek guidance of a higher power." The praying spoken of can be understood in today's secular terms as Christian guided meditation. All contrasted to someone saying he is a better speech writer that his speech writers and smarter than any of his policy advisers.
"A better question would have been:
"'How are you going to rebuild the middle-class when there are no more factories in America,'"
A good question. The question.
"'...and the Africans in Baltimore are leading the way to the next Holocaust?'"
A moronic question.
The next holocaust will be brought about--as they all are--by powerful and rich people in governments and corporate offices around the world, scheming, as ever, to steal as much money and power and natural resources for themselves as possible, by whatever means necessary, heedless of any consequences further into the future than five minutes.
So hearing from God makes one a fanatic. Then faith in scripture is simply fanaticism in the first degree.
No wonder our founders thought we needed First an Amendment to keep authority mad governments from persecuting all those damn fanatics. Too bad the 1960s era SCOTUS pilled off an early Obama language reversal trick on the troublsome First Amendment and Louis XIVth like declared our Edict of Toleration Revoked by saying that not forbidding religious expression IS establisment of religion.
"Blogger garage mahal said...
Walker is the most un-Christlike person imaginable."
Says the expert on Christ-like.
Jeeez garage, you are making dopes like Cookie look smart.
"the Africans in Baltimore are leading the way to the next Holocaust?'"
A moronic question. "
Well, garage , you have competition. I will give you that.
Baltimore is a preview of a coming race war if that Obama stuff gets out of hand. This country is not Zimbabwe, no matter how much he wishes it were.
Habitual Lying. Kicking the poor. Being a paid prostitute for billionaires. Insatiable and Neverending list for more power. Name one thing about Walker that embodies Christ? This guy is in for a mighty rude awakening if the God he says he worships is real.
After Kasich tried to best Cruz's "my daddy was a drinker" with his "my daddy was a mailman," I was waiting for the next guy, who happened to be Walker, say "I was born a poor black child."
I still cringe thinking of John Edwards' "My daddy was a mill worker" and all that fake humility crap.
But that stupidity must work on soft-minded people who dont know they are being conned, or dont care. Like Kerry/Edwards or Obama/Biden voters.
"Kasich begins his answer: "Well, Megyn, my father was a mailman.""
Sincerity, if you can fake that . . .
"Cracker"
Must be Trump "telling it like it is" again.
Good to see you go back to fisking, by the way. Play to your strength. Avoid stubborn hairsplitting defenses of untenable positions, tempting as it may be to a lawyer proud of her own analytic prowess.
Kooky said:
A moronic question.
The next holocaust will be brought about--as they all are--by powerful and rich people in governments and corporate offices around the world, scheming, as ever, to steal as much money and power and natural resources for themselves as possible, by whatever means necessary, heedless of any consequences further into the future than five minutes.
Hey, you forgot one thing the holocaust all are: Socialists.
Just. Like. You. Are.
Trump accepts the Puritan Work ethic and enjoys his work immensely as a part of his inheritance of an adopted son of God. It is a Calvinistic idea. And it makes believers squarely the enemy of all European style Tyrants/Kings/Emperors/Popes, foreign and domestic. They were predestined to travel to a wilderness here at Cape Cod and to survive, start Thanksgiving and then join the Massachusetts Bay Puritan migration to escape those fierce European Tyrants and their language police.
Megyn had a bad night. "Giggling schoolgirl" about covers it.
The "moderators" were the worst part of it.
By the way, the debate format and the tenor of the questions show that the GOP still doesn't function like a coherent party.
Journalists don't know anything. They are in show business and want to be part of the show. They care about the horse race and ratings.
Instead, the GOP should get articulate experts with policy experience and have them ask questions, with follow-ups. To start, I nominate Bill Galston and Walter Russell Mead. Of course, Fox may then decline . . .
Weird to me is that Trump's church would actually serve crackers and wine. The Presbyterian church I was raised in serves grape juice and bread. You have these trays with individual little cups of grape juice. Pass the tray down the row, and everyone takes their individual cup. Then the minister leads the congregation (sipping out of a regular chalice), and we all drink together. Ditto for the small piece of bread. Presbyterians I know are horrified by the idea of everyone drinking out of the same cup. As for grape juice - some protestants were pretty extreme teatollers. I think many of my mother's ancestresses on her father's side during the mid-1800s, and probably earlier would fit in there. Think Puritans. And, if Communion is symbolic anyway, then why should it matter if you drink unfermented grape juice, instead of the fermented type?
The thing that wasn't mentioned here is that Kelly was raised, and I think still practices, Roman Catholicism. My experience has been that this sort of praying is more a Protestant thing. Not completely, of course, but enough so that a lot of Catholics look a bit askance at it. Esp maybe when you go overboard like Gov Huckleberry has been known to do. This may have affected how she asked these questions.
If Megyn Kelly wants to be taken seriously, she should be serious. Instead, she's playing the brat. Her questions are the same as Trump calling Rosie O'Donnell a pig, just dressed up a little.
Say that back during WWII you found out that your friend was a Nazi spy.
Say that today your Sec'y of State found out that her chief aide was a mole for the Muslim Brotherhood...
That quote about not betraying your friend: it's by E. M. Forster not Emerson.
People, you should know that. It's basic to a good education, to being educated. Attributing the quote to the wrong person in an effort to make a point or bolster an argument is kind of pathetic.
Garage takes time out from salivating over the sale of baby parts and praising Hamas to lecture others on "Christ-like" behavior.
"The drunken dad "gave his heart to Jesus.""
Drunken dad. Now that is some real progressive compassion for you.
Also, anyone who knows anything about Emerson would know that Emerson would never, ever feel much less express such a sentiment. Attributing that quote to Emerson is a terrible insult to one of America's greatest men of letters.
Baltimore is like a "Roach Motel." You can check-in, but you can't check-out.
Nine people got rubbed out this week.
Walker is NOT doing God's work in Wisconsin.
He is not serving Him. Christians can see that.
I didn't know it was every Christian's duty to launder taxpayer funds into contributions to Democratic campaigns through mandatory payroll deductions.
Or to submit fraudulent time-cards by using phony doctor notes to get paid for marching on Madison on taxpayer time?
'Splain me where that is in Scripture, you sanctimonious tool.
Beach Brutus said...
Re: Robert Cook at 2:30 "I don't want to have any candidates who boast--and any such declaration is boasting--they "hear God" and "follow his will." They're either liars or fanatics."
I think this comment shows how far we've come from the Judeo-Christian consensus. Once, not that long ago, just about everyone understood that someone pledging to pray on tough decisions and to try and follow God's will, was not boasting or being fanatical -- it was a public expression of humility. It was saying "I recognize that I don't have all the answers and that I will need to seek guidance of a higher power." The praying spoken of can be understood in today's secular terms as Christian guided meditation. All contrasted to someone saying he is a better speech writer that his speech writers and smarter than any of his policy advisers.
8/7/15, 3:42 PM
I agree completely.
Emerson's most famous quote:
"War educates the senses, calls into action the will, perfects the physical constitution, brings men into such swift and close collision in critical moments that man measures man.”
Emerson was a strong proponent of abolition and the Union cause of defeating the Confederacy to preserve the nation intact and end slavery. He would NEVER have betrayed his country for the sake of a friend or friendship.
Blogger garage mahal said...
Walker is the most un-Christlike person imaginable.
They said the same thing about Jesus. Then they killed him.
Looming race wars. Moles for Muslim Brotherhood. Holicaust. When, exactly, did conservatives become so fucking weird?
garage mahal said...
Walker is the most un-Christlike person imaginable.
Give her a break. Althouse is doing her best to find something positive to say about Walker's debate performance. That's not easy work.
It has become clear already, my friend, that you aren't getting rid of Walker the easy way, by foisting him onto the rest of the country.
Paglia: Kasich won the debate
"Buoyed by the crowd's enthusiastic support of his tenure as governor of Ohio, Kasich came on strong in the debate. His brusque, animated gestures are awkward but manlike in a solid, old-fashioned way. Kasich is a genuine populist with working-class family ties. He made the Princeton-educated Cruz look effete tonight. Kasich was full of specifics about his congressional experience on the armed services and budget committees. I think he won the debate. Kasich is a mensch in a party of parakeets."
Name one thing about Walker that embodies Christ?
You don't remember when Jesus got pissed off at all those public sector workers at the temple? He personally chased them out of the building with a whip of cords he made himself.
That's the example Scott Walker is following.
Oh please--Kasich obviously made an oversight. Let's not take the omission of "country" as anything more than it is.
It was a weak question, and wasted time on a night when time was in short supply.
Cookie said:
"I don't want to have any candidates who boast--and any such declaration is boasting--they "hear God" and "follow his will."
Because the Kenyan Messiah is a jealous God -- thou shalt have no others before him.
Madisonfella said:
You don't remember when Jesus got pissed off at all those public sector workers at the temple?
"And if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector. " -- Ouch and Matthew 18:15-17.
Alas, this is not the moment to deploy the That Escalated Quickly meme.
The moment will come. Wait. Wait, I will. Not post so early. My powder dry I will keep. Dew. There is no dry.
my little cracker.
Must be a Ritz cracker. A ritzy Ritz cracker.
"When, exactly, did conservatives become so fucking weird?"
So Hillary, Biden and Sanders are in Madisonfella's "non-weird" category?
TradGuy wrote:
"They were predestined to travel to a wilderness here at Cape Cod and to survive, start Thanksgiving and then join the Massachusetts Bay Puritan migration to escape those fierce European Tyrants and their language police."
What better way to celebrate their escape from tyranny than by flogging Quakers?
" the GOP should get articulate experts with policy experience and have them ask questions, with follow-ups."
Yes and I hope that's coming when the GOP guys figure out that last night was not the standard for debates with serious people.
It used to be that some media people actually knew a few things. Anybody remember Meet the Press when it was run by Lawrence Spivak ? They had a serious panel who knew something. Unfortunately, since TV took over, nobody in the media knows anything and most are DNC types with bylines.
Goddamn typos. Gah.
garage mahal said...
Habitual Lying. Kicking the poor. Being a paid prostitute for billionaires( Soros,Steyer & Co). Insatiable and Neverending list for more power. Name one thing about Obama-Hillary!-Biden-Sander-O'Malley that embodies Christ? This (these) guy(s) is (are) in for a mighty rude awakening if the God he says he worships is real.
8/7/15, 4:05 PM
It so refreshing when garage gets it right.
"Isn't that just the ultimate nonanswer?"
Being the son of a mailman isn't as cool as the situation for Cruz and Walker.
Has anyone else commented on this telling part of the "debate" (sic)?
The next holocaust will be brought about--as they all are--by powerful and rich people in governments and corporate offices around the world, scheming, as ever, to steal as much money and power and natural resources for themselves as possible, by whatever means necessary, heedless of any consequences further into the future than five minutes.
Can you believe that Comrade Cookie claims that he has never read Das Kapital?
I'm starting to suspect that our little Squealor may be lying to me.....
Re: Robert Cook at 2:30 "I don't want to have any candidates who boast--and any such declaration is boasting--they "hear God" and "follow his will." They're either liars or fanatics."
I think this comment shows how far we've come from the Judeo-Christian consensus.
Not really. you can't generalize from Comrade Cookie...he's a Commie, so all other religions are the enemy.
I'm not suggesting another poll.
But, I would have thought that a law prof would also realize that there's another group of folks who wouldn't be allowed on the jury, unless they lie. Presumably there are only a small number of folks who think that the death penalty always the appropriate punishment for capital murder. But, it's probably not exactly zero percent for the entire country.
Anywho, it's too small of a group of people to justify an option on the poll. At least I'd hope so. OTOH, it would have been an interesting test of the hardcore, eye for an eye law-and-order-ness of the Althouse faithful.
richard mcenroe wrote: "If I had to choose between betraying my friend and betraying my country, I hope I would have the courage to betray my country." -- Emerson
I believe the quote is attributed to E. M. Forster, not Emerson. Either way, it is a selfish and elitist sentiment which assumes one's duties to a single person outweigh one's obligations to society. The quote became something of an official motto among the Cambridge spies, who did in fact betray they country and ours at least partly in the name of friendship.
A quote of questionable ethical provenance, best avoided.
The angry right base is now angry at Fox. Gradually those who are righteous, approved and "tell it like it is" gets smaller and smaller
There all bastards!!!!
(PS GET OFF MY LAWN!!!)
I'm not suggesting another poll...
PB&J commenting in the wrong thread. Nevertheless it makes more sense here than in its intended context.
The Quakers should have dared to fight back. No one was stopping them but their imagination.
Robert Cook said...
Has anyone else commented on this telling part of the "debate" (sic)?
It was good of The Donald™ to make this explicit, but it wasn't really news. No wonder Murdoch wants to kill his candidacy. Murdoch, with the power of his press behind him, has benefitted more than most from these arrangements.
The origin of a moral philosophy, economic theory, etc. is irrelevant. People prefer to worship mortal gods because they promise a material return (e.g. redistribution, retribution) and indulgence for their violations of human (e.g. selective-child), civil (e.g. class diversity), and moral (e.g. selective exclusion) rights.
---Say that today your Sec'y of State found out that her chief aide was a mole for the Muslim Brotherhood...
Gosh that’s far fetched.
-----Being the son of a mailman isn't as cool as the situation for Cruz and Walker.
What a dumbass comment. Not a spark of intelligence contained therein. So Cruz had a rather moving story about a father inspired by God to turn from alcoholism, and Walker mentioned his father....??? And Walker’s minister father was an alcoholic....?
Being liberal means being able to just spout mindless BS.
unknown,
"How well I remember
The look that was in his eyes
Stealin' kisses from me on the sly
Takin' time to make time
Tellin' me that he's all mine
Learnin' from each other's knowin'
Lookin' to see how much we've grown..."
Lighten up! Sheesh.
Why the FUCK anyone would call what went on last night a DEBATE, I take to be just more Orwellian fucking with the language.
Althouse: is what went on last night a "debate"? It's not even close to a law student reciting a case in a torts class, with the perfesser interrogating you until your deodorant fails.
Here: No question based on agreed-upon statement of the facts. (Law cases are from printed sources. They ARE the facts.))
So, naked assertions are offered as "fact": No time to agree on the facts in the question, let alone flesh out an argument
Unfair time for rebuttal by the candidate.
No counter by the questioner
No ESTABLISHED time for other candidates to actually "debate" anyone on a particular question. (Christie and Paul the only example of "debate" for the entire night)
YOU CALL THAT A DEBATE? IS THAT HOW YOU RUN YOUR CLASSES, ALTHOUSE???
Robert Cook said...
"'Has anyone else commented on this telling part of the 'debate' (sic)?'
"It was good of The Donald™ to make this explicit, but it wasn't really news."
Given how many Americans still seem to think the candidates are running to serve us, rather than the wealthy, and that our political system is anything other than a farce, I'd say it is news to those Americans.
I do want to hear Megyn Kelly ask Hillary! if she has had any messages from God lately.
Or Chris Wallace asking her about Don Tyson's pilot and those manila envelopes stuffed full with $100 bills.
That is probably too long ago for today's audience, and anyway, for my point, it would be better to hear Wallace ask Hillary! about her age.
Or weight.
"So hearing from God makes one a fanatic. Then faith in scripture is simply fanaticism in the first degree.
"No wonder our founders thought we needed First an Amendment to keep authority mad governments from persecuting all those damn fanatics."
The first amendment is also meant to protect we, the people, from government imposing religious doctrine on the nation, or from operating according to theocratic principles.
"Once, not that long ago, just about everyone understood that someone pledging to pray on tough decisions and to try and follow God's will, was not boasting or being fanatical -- it was a public expression of humility. It was saying 'I recognize that I don't have all the answers and that I will need to seek guidance of a higher power.'"
I don't want those making decisions that affect all our lives to "seek guidance of a higher power." I want them to make decisions based on the best data available, and after discussion with others as to the best and worst options, the possible or likely consequences of any action taken, (positive and negative), etc., etc.
Moreover, the Christian Right has gained such influence over politics today that, whereas 50 years ago one would never have heard our elected representatives speaking about making policy decisions on the basis of their faith in Jesus, and one would never have heard journalists--or "journalists," such as we have today--asking such questions of our elected representatives, today it seems to have become a litmus test that must be passed.
It's pandering, pure and simple. Therefore, I repeat: any elected representative who makes a point of speaking about his "faith in Jesus" and how he will "follow God's will" in making decisions is either a liar--saying shit to curry favor with the religious right--or a fanatic--someone who really means what he says and who, therefore, cannot be trusted to make rational decisions based on the facts of the material world.
Robert Cook said...
Given how many Americans still seem to think the candidates are running to serve us, rather than the wealthy, and that our political system is anything other than a farce, I'd say it is news to those Americans.
I don't think people are as naive as you believe. The people living in middle east dictatorships or communist China aren't operating under the illusion that their leaders are working for their benefit. They are stuck with their system and can't do much about it so they get on with their lives. Why do you think Americans are any different?
Gahrie said...
The next holocaust will be brought about--as they all are--by powerful and rich people in governments and corporate offices around the world, scheming, as ever, to steal as much money and power and natural resources for themselves as possible, by whatever means necessary, heedless of any consequences further into the future than five minutes.
Can you believe that Comrade Cookie claims that he has never read Das Kapital?
I'm starting to suspect that our little Squealor may be lying to me.....
No.
He reads like he's read Howard Zinn over and over and memorized the parts that get him excited.IYKWIMAITYD. Very two dimensional.
"I don't think people are as naive as you believe. The people living in middle east dictatorships or communist China aren't operating under the illusion that their leaders are working for their benefit. They are stuck with their system and can't do much about it so they get on with their lives. Why do you think Americans are any different?"
Because Americans--while griping about their government in various ways--still believe we live in a representative republic, and that what goes wrong is the result of this "bad" or "incompetent" President or another, or due to the "bad" party holding the majority...and they believe that voting in another member of the dual-headed single party to the White House or the other wing of the dual-headed single party to the majority may actually bring about change. Americans, for the most part, don't recognize that our political system is terminally compromised and that decisions are not made with any consideration for what the people want. Witness here the focus on Trump, or Walker, or Clinton, and so on. Whoever the next president will be, America's policies will continue as they have. Our presidential "debates" are a joke--starting with calling them debates. There is no serious discussion of serious issues, but merely the recitation of talking points and soundbites, quips, appeals to the base, pandering to sentiment and religion, and so on.
Citizens of overt dictatorships can see who holds the power; Americans are distracted by our own mythology of being the "exceptional nation," the "greatest nation that ever existed," and so on. Americans are thoroughly indoctrinated by our own propaganda.
I guess she wants to distinguish someone getting their values from conventional religion from "liberal" State-f*ckers who get their values from the Cult of the State, Talking Points Memo, Jon Stewart, etc.--you know, really rational sources like that.
So none of the GOPers talked any trash about God? Stop the presses.
Did Megyn also encourage the candidates to rhapsodize about motherhood or apple pie?
I'm glad 24 million Americans tuned in to watch the Trump Show. The parts I saw were great entertainment.
I see that today, Erick Erickson is mobilizing the GOP P.C. police against the Donald.
I'm afraid it's too late though. Trump de-clothed the nine GOP would-be emperors in public, and too many people saw them in all their ingloriousness.
bbkingfish wrote:
"Trump de-clothed the nine GOP would-be emperors . . ."
If you want to see an emperor look east. Trump is not Caesar. Walker is not Caesar. Obama is Caesar.
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