Kerry was clear. He said it all in one word: "Opprobrium."
That word was (of course) surrounded by typical, tedious Kerryesque blah-blah-blah, which I've printed out below the fold. But the answer is "opprobrium." The dreaded opprobrium. A big international frowny face.
Well, we're now discussing all of the options. This is an act of aggression that is completely trumped up in terms of its pretext. It's really 19th-century behavior in the 21st century, and there's no way to start with that if Russia persists in this, that the G8 countries are going to reassemble in Sochi. That's a starter. But there's much more than that.If you want to invade another country you need a genuine pretext.
Russia has major investment in trade needs and desires. I think there's a unified view by all of the foreign ministers I talked with yesterday, all of the G8 and more, that they're simply going to isolate Russia. That they're not going to engage with Russia in a normal, business-as-usual manner.
Because Russia is inviting opprobrium on the international stage. There could even be ultimately asset freezes, visa bans. There could be certainly a disruption of any of the normal trade routine, and there could be business drawback on investment in the country. The ruble is already going down and feeling the impact of this.
And the reason for this, David, is because you just don't invade another country on phony pretext in order to assert your interests.
There are ways to deal with this. And President Putin knows that. President Obama yesterday offered mediation. There are plenty of ways to protect Russian-speaking people in Crimea or other parts of Ukraine. But they are really sort of a hidden pretext here, possibly trying to annex Crimea.By the way, on "Fox News Sunday" this morning, Chris Wallace expressed his displeasure at Kerry going on all the other Sunday shows but turning down the Fox News invitation. I take that to mean Kerry is weak and he knows it. And if Kerry can't stand up to a few questions from Chris Wallace, what are the chances that he's projecting any strength at all to Putin.
ADDED: Here's the "Fox News Sunday" transcript:
For the record, we invited Secretary of State Kerry to join us today. But although the White House put him out on all the other broadcast Sunday shows, they declined to make him available to us or you.
पोस्ट्स
१५० टिप्पण्या:
Kerry said: There are plenty of ways to protect Russian-speaking people in Crimea or other parts of Ukraine. But they are really sort of a hidden pretext here, possibly trying to annex Crimea.
At least that makes clear what the Obama administration will offer them in exchange for a draw down.
Wasn't it a youtube video that caused the invasion??
"Unexpectedly!"
Unless you were Palin or Romney. Lololol
"I take that to mean Kerry is weak and he know it."
Illustrated by this exchange:
DAVID GREGORY:
Before I get to my final question on Israel, with a big meeting with Benjamin Netanyahu, the prime minister coming to meet with President Obama. Marco Rubio is on this program in just a few minutes in saying it's time for the administration to publicly acknowledge that the reset with Russia is dead. Do you acknowledge that?
SECRETARY JOHN KERRY:
Well, I don't know what you mean by the reset.
Note to Japan - you are on your own with China!
Fuck it, if I were a resident of Hawaii I might even feel some concern. If Mexico invades Texas, well perhaps we Anglos just don't understand the higher modalities of the situation. On the other hand, the Anglos of Texas are well-armed and warlike.
The EU will do nothing, because Russia can shut off their natural gas supply. The US and the rest of the world will do nothing, since Russia has nuclear weapons.
Putin is trying to reconstitute the USSR as the "Eurasian Union" forging a counterbalance to the EU and the rest of the West (and China in the East).
Iowahawk: Nice hat
Now Putin will find out what happens when you fail the global test. Yeah, that'll show him.
Iowahawk: Here's an idea: throw some medals at Putin. LOL! Think fast, invader boy!
I think if we don't stop Russia now, then the next you know they'll invade Kazakhstan, and then where would the USA be?
I see the dominoes falling already.
Zingers rule.
He's already in Ohio. Putin Bay.
"Well, I don't know what you mean by the reset."
AKA I've never heard of my predecessor.
Nothing Hillary did or said as SOS is allowed to be remembered.
" If Mexico invades Texas, well perhaps we Anglos just don't understand the higher modalities of the situation. On the other hand, the Anglos of Texas are well-armed and warlike. "
How about if Mexico invaded southern California ? It might include better government.
Can anyone imagine Kerry as President if he had won in 2004?
Today the lefty Congressman from Maryland referred to "two wars we are winning" in his blather about the defense cuts.
No self awareness.
Really, who better to be America's frowny face than John Kerry?
The route is Ukraine to Belorussia to the Baltics.
Here's a thought, maybe Kerry IS Hillary in a latex mask.
SECRETARY JOHN KERRY:
Well, I don't know what you mean by the reset.
Hey John, that was when Hillary Clinton and Obama told the American public everything wrong with Russia was George Bush's fault. Maybe if they didn't see conservatives as the enemy they wouldn't have F'ed up so bad.
Of course this presumes you care, which I doubt.
"If Mexico invades Texas, well perhaps we Anglos just don't understand the higher modalities of the situation. On the other hand, the Anglos of Texas are well-armed and warlike."
Isn't it more like if Texans rose up and had a revolution, got to be a new separate country, had an election in which the ethnic Americans won the presidency, then 10 years later, there was another revolution in which the ethnic Mexicans took over, and the United States intervened to protect the ethnic Americans?
Obama is huddled with his advisors, and should be ready when the time comes to fill out his NCAA Bracket. There will be a hard-hitting interview in the meantime with Andrea Mitchell.
Sometimes the bored schoolboy slouching in the back is just sizing you up for a fight.
"But the answer is 'opprobrium.' The dreaded opprobrium. A big international frowny face."
With brash talk like that, you must have a better idea? Would love to hear it.
We should start a rumor that Putin is a Climate Change sceptic.
Billie Jean King and Brian Boitano are being brief at this very moment!
"... there was another revolution in which the ethnic Mexicans took over, and the United States intervened to protect the ethnic Americans."
That would be so if the Americans had deported the Mexican population and replaced it with ethnic Americans.
Crimea's Russian population traces to Stalin's deportation of the ethnic Tatars and resettlement of ethnic Russians.
For real opprobrium you need an elephant.
Maybe it's just me (well it's ALWAYS just me around here) but when one has written off the whole of US foreign policy, it's so gosh darn hard to get worked up about the nuances of John Kerry's blather. Bovine coprophilia is not my thing.
Putin May be, since there are Russian scientists who are vocal.
@Seeing Red, I used "ethnic American" as a phrase to make the analogy.
"American" works fine.
Vlad will be DESOLATED !
I had to look it up - opprobrium. He's such a pompous ass.
Another point - why do people insist on saying to critics "Do you have a better idea?" It is NOT my responsibility to be knowledgeable enough to come up with ideas on how to handle international global relations. But IT IS THEIRS!
That was a great opportunity for me to use the "define" function on my iPhone. Thanks for scaring the Russian Bear with a big scary word. That's probably how Reagan would have handled it too...
"Our chief weapon is surprise...surprise and opprobrium...."
The costs are other nations abandoning Pax Americana and nuking up.
America's reaction probably wasn't a serious consideration in Putin's decision to invade. That's the remarkable thing. He's long past thinking Obama is anything other than a punk.
How many divisions does opprobrium have?
It's really 19th-century behavior in the 21st century, and there's no way to start with that if Russia persists in this, that the G8 countries are going to reassemble in Sochi. That's a starter. But there's much more than that.
Let's just pause be glad that the G8 conference isn't going to happen in Sarajevo this summer on so historic a centennial.
On CNN this morning, Zbigniew Brzesinski said the NATO should provide the Ukraine with military assistance (unspecified) and that NATO should reposition some of its forces (where unspecified).
I hope this is merely the droolings of an elderly Cold Warrior, but our ruling class (Obama, Kerry, Hagel, Clapper et al) is certainly stupid enough and arrogant enough to do something like it.
And that would be an overt military threat, and it would be an empty threat because we do not have the military power to intervene anywhere in Central and Eastern Europe. And Putin knowing this would probably do something even more threatening than merely occupying the Crimea.
If Putin ran a Tea Party 501(c)4 the IRS would be all over him like white on rice.
Obama: ...any violation of Ukraine’s sovereignty and territorial integrity would be deeply destabilizing, which is not in the interests of Ukraine, Russia or Europe. It would represent a profound interference in matters that must be determined by the Ukrainian people. It would be a clear violation of Russia’s commitment to respect the independence and sovereignty and borders of Ukraine, and of international laws.
Putin: "Bitch, please....”
Meanwhile, China has a base in Zimbabwe.
Dictators get to be dictators by going too far. Hubris is an occupational failing......Ths is Putin's fault. He went too far. That said, there is nothing about Obama's policy or demeanor that would give Putin cause to reconsider......Both Imperial Russia and the Soviet Union visited great crimes on the Ukraine. For the most part they are unknown the west but I'm sure that they're a living memory for most Ukrainains.....I'm not in favor of Putin's homophobia but it's worth noting that this homophobia caused more distress on the left than Stalin's wilfull murder of millions of Ukrainians.
Chickenhawks pine for sabre rattling, offended by big words from the thrice wounded vet.
Oh look, it's tee time!
If only the Ukes had bundled campaign donations like the Kaiser family behind Solyndra, Obama'd be b*tch-slapping Putin like GM and Chrysler bondholders
I think Ukraine may split into two or three new states, and each will get a government a little more to its liking, but not all that much will change from the way it was.
And that will be that.
Putin already has done something a lot more threatening if there is anything to these stories about warships visiting around the globe and opening discussions about establishing naval bases.
Not to mention that the Chinese seem the be haedng in the same direction and then some.
Chickenhawks pine for sabre rattling
Obama's the one drawing "redlines" and then stepping away from them. BWAWWWK...bwakbwakbwakbwak
19th century behavior in the 21st century.
Sniff sniff we are so above that type of thing.
This is human nature.
This is why I loathe the feminization of this country.
I know what we should do, Harrow!
Let the wimmin folk handle it. After all, we're the more co-operative sex!
William
Well put. It's just like republicans getting hysterical that affirmative action might help black kids and have little concern for 400-years of slavery.
Oh, right. No one living today was responsible for slavery, so it's a non-issue. I guess their might be a few lynchers still around, but that is just moving the goal posts.
Don't forget William, as we learned from the vile Progs in the Terry Schiavo case, dying by starvation isn't really painful.
I can't imagine what the North Koreans would dig up freshly dead bodies or eat tree bark, can you?
Furious_a Thanks for making my point that sabre-rattling is a dipshit tactic. Ozero has stepped on his crank several times, at least he hasn't launched endless wars costing trillions of dollars and over a hundred thousand killed.
Howard: It's just like republicans getting hysterical that affirmative action might...
...barf up a President as manifestly unready-for-the-3AM-call as Barry the First.
There, fixed it for you.
Lolol Howard. 2 AA presidents!
"at least he hasn't launched endless wars costing trillions of dollars and over a hundred thousand killed."
New game for Libtards: lets pretend Bush did all that so we can excuse Obama's incompetence.
BTW, Obama's actions will lead to far worse than any of that. America's enemies see us as short-stacked and are going all in. How many millions died because of Neville Chamberlain's fecklessness? Obama will be responsible for much more.
That's funny about Hillary and the reset. I enjoyed that :-)
As far as Crimea. War is out. Bellicosity is out. Trying to out-bully the bully is out. Stooping to those levels is out.
Looks like Putin outfoxed Obama.
Isn't it more like if Texans rose up and had a revolution, got to be a new separate country, had an election in which the ethnic Americans won the presidency, then 10 years later, there was another revolution in which the ethnic Mexicans took over, and the United States intervened to protect the ethnic Americans?
No.
Among other problems with your analogy, Ukraine didn't become a country via revolution, it happened because of the dissolution of the USSR.
If the US collapses and a large portion of it becomes the country of "America" and signs treaties recognizing the independence of Texas as a separate sovereign nation, then that America has no right to intervene in the affairs of that Texas no matter how much the different ethnic groups are mucking things up internally.
Russia probably could have found allies to stand up to the emergent Ukranian opposition government on the grounds that it what took place was an illegal coup of a democratically elected government. Putin didn't go that route though, and the ruse that this is about protecting Russians in Crimea is utter bullshit.
Not to worry. They probably have Putin on double-secret probation.
Blogger harrogate said...
"But the answer is 'opprobrium.' The dreaded opprobrium. A big international frowny face."
With brash talk like that, you must have a better idea? Would love to hear it.
3/2/14, 12:16 PM
_____________________________
You go first. Tell us what all the bien pensants are saying we should do.
Blogger Howard said...
Chickenhawks pine for sabre rattling, offended by big words from the thrice wounded vet.
3/2/14, 12:59 PM
What's on your DD214, Troop? Or, are you currently deployed?
I love one of the comments at American Interest.
Obama should "unfriend" Putin on FB.
With brash talk like that, you must have a better idea? Would love to hear it.
Not flailing on Iraq, Syria, Egypt, AfPak, Iran would have been a good start.
You guys act like Crimea happened in a vacuum. Is the left really so stupid that they can't comprehend how projecting weakness leads to getting your ass kicked?
Lefties love living in grit. It makes the feel alive.
Get your maps out & start marking them up, the pieces are on the move and it's going to get grittier. Our close descendants will live in a very interesting world.
Shall it be armed camps, the ChiComs or islamofascism?
It takes a big foot to keep the peace. It's not US anymore, so things might be getting a bit rocky for the next few years.
I hope u like the terms given, you didn't like ours.
Perhaps the opprobrium would be meted out in a manner reminiscent of Jenjis Khan.
Suppose the Hispanic population of Southern California, spurred on by La Raza ("The Race") and its rhetoric that California was stolen from Mexico by the United States, rose up, took over the state capitol, and deposed the democratically elected governor of California. What do you think Obama would do?
Is it beyond the pale to think that he would do nothing?
Irend: "The route is Ukraine to Belorussia to the Baltics."
This is precisely the plan if the Russians are even partially serious (and why wouldn't they be) about the realization of their Eurasian Union as a counterweight to the EU and NATO.
Obama hasn't realized this yet cuz it hasn't been in the papers much.
Irend: "The route is Ukraine to Belorussia to the Baltics."
This is precisely the plan if the Russians are even partially serious (and why wouldn't they be) about the realization of their Eurasian Union as a counterweight to the EU and NATO.
Obama hasn't realized this yet cuz it hasn't been in the papers much.
Pax Americana lasted 60+ years. The will to play Hegemon role was part of every American President and Congress. Until we got taken over by a Fifth Columnist President that wants the USA's role redistributed.
Putin has taken over our role now. Welcome to Hegemony Russian style. The Russian Navy is already seeking the Naval bases which Adm. Mahan pointed out are necessary.
Japan being next door to Russia and can accept its new role. Alaska's resources will be next up for fair a redistribution.
Howard: "Chickenhawks pine for sabre rattling, offended by big words from the thrice wounded vet."
LOL
Yes, "thrice "wounded""
one of those wounds was a teeny tiny piece of "shrapnel" Kerry claimed he received from an engagement.
The Dr he saw looked at it and simply reached out and took the teeny tiny piece of metal (that was barely piercing the skin) out with his fingers and no effort.
Kerry did not even receive a bandaid for this "wound".
In fact, for a "thrice wounded vet", isn't it amazing that there are no scars?
And I bet Howard is not inquisitive as to why Kerry has never released the medical records associated with those "wounds".
Kerry is a "thrice wounded vet" in the same way that Lyndon Johnson "earned" his Silver Star. (spoiler alert: he didn't)
The dems.
Hilarious.
I think if we don't stop Russia now, then the next you know they'll invade Kazakhstan, and then where would the USA be?
Yeah! Fuck those Kazaks and the Ukrainians too! Who gives a shit about them..let Putin kill them and oppress them!
sunsong: "Looks like Putin outfoxed Obama"
Easy there sunsong.
That would make Putin a "racist eleventy!" and it would make you a racist for simply noticing it.
Crack will explain it all shortly.
harrogate: "With brash talk like that, you must have a better idea? Would love to hear it."
LOL
Harrogate and his pals are desperate to be able to change the conversation to ANYTHING except obama's manifest incompetence which the left here can claim is all due to racism.
However,since the ENTIRE world sees it, I wonder how that will be explained away and spun by the left.
BTW, obama and his admin let in a muslim cleric who has advocated for the death penalty for homosexuals.
So, heads up Titus.
When push comes to shove, your interest group will have to be placed just a smidge below the muslims.
And last I checked, the muslims appear to be immune to your political correctness.
So, if history is our guide, the only rational response to this gay-hating muslims rhetoric at this point is for the lefties to call for more action against Christians.
That would be consistent.
I thought it was interesting that Kerry referred to Putin's invasion as "19th century behavior". It reminds me more of 20th century behavior, such as Czechoslovakia/1968 or Hungary/1956, to name two. George Steph, for his part seemed to press Kerry. Do you think GS will have an epiphany about how dangerously inept these democrat politicians (he has aided and enabled over the years) actually are? I doubt it, in his case.
Irene - Crimea's Russian population traces to Stalin's deportation of the ethnic Tatars and resettlement of ethnic Russians.
==============
Incorrect. Russians have been in Crimea longer than America has been America. Ever since they defeated the Turks and the vassal Tatars, who were essentially slave raiders that kidnapped and sold an estimated 2 million Ukrainians and Russians and Balkan nation people before Russia stopped them.
Stating that the ethnic Russian population is recent and all Stalins fault and the Noble Tatars would still have the place if Stalin hadn't deported them is ignorant stuff.
Read some history about the place sometime.
And while Stalin did cause a lot of Tatar minority deaths when he relocated them (40% vs almost 0% of enemy alien Japs the US relocated) - it was not without some reason. Once the Nazis came in, the Tatars were willing collaborators. When the Russians retook the place, the Tatars got the boot. It took over a decade before the Russians let some of the pals to the Nazis back in.
Another point - why do people insist on saying to critics "Do you have a better idea?"
Because they are dishonest and without morals.
"We make men without chests and expect from them virtue and enterprise. We laugh at Honor and are then shocked to find traitors in our midst" - Lewis
Kerry is the epitome of this. I think America is finally learning the price for abandoning morality. Kerry speaks about global stability and no one listens or cares, because we all know its only about covering his own ass.
Patton was right.
When we don't finish things, the come back to bite us in our ass.
North Korea 1954 and 1979 Iran.
Still dealing with the fallout.
Maybe even Nam.
Steffi won't bite hildebeasts hand.
For the young'uns, Patton didn't want to stop, he wanted to push thru to Moscow.
Hillary was either prescient or damn lucky to be out of that job before this happened.
To one and all..don't forget our supply line to Afghanistan runs through Russia.
Drago:
You might be right, I wasn't there taking fire with John F Kerry in Viet Nam. It's unseemly to disparage a decorated combat vet based on Koch Brothers funded hearsay. However, the windsurfing putz didn't get my vote because of his fake medal tossing and his congressional testimony of US war crimes based on hearsay.
Kerry also said publicly that Russia "risks" being expelled from the G-8.
Note he did not say the US will seek to have Russia grown out of G-8.
But it's a risk.
Anyone think it will happen?
Next perhaps Kerry will announce that we would have boycotted the Sochi olympics if only we had known about this then.
Irene said:
Crimea's Russian population traces to Stalin's deportation of the ethnic Tatars and resettlement of ethnic Russians.
Ditto much of the Russian population of Eastern Ukraine. Although there the natives were not so much deported as just murdered in the millions by Stalin and his gang of thugs.
In the name of socialism, of course. Lest we forget, 100 million or so were murdered to promote socialism in the last century.
Including 12 million in the German National Socialist murder camps.
Never forget, never forgive.
John Henry
rcocean said...
I think if we don't stop Russia now, then the next you know they'll invade Kazakhstan, and then where would the USA be?
I see the dominoes falling already.
We'll see. The US is not the only country whose military resources are limited. It's even worse for Russia. They gain nothing by overextending themselves.
Fritz said...
Hillary was either prescient or damn lucky to be out of that job before this happened.
Yeah. Because we all know what she did while she was in office had no effect on the future.
Obamas really earning that Nobel now, isn't he?
I wasn't there taking fire with John F Kerry in Viet Nam
Neither was John Kerry. His "wounds" were self-inflicted.
http://johnkerry-08.com/war/unfit_for_command_03.php
They won't learn, Fen. Morality is flexible, it's also someone else's fault.
I lmao at a comment on another blog. The guy was getting is usual coffee and the woman behind the counter was going on about Obamacare. I didn't vote for this! Who did u vote for?
harrogate: "With brash talk like that, you must have a better idea? Would love to hear it."
The enduring affliction of the Obamadupes: shameless forgetfulness. Nothing that came before has to do with now.
A more brazen example: "Well, I don't know what you mean by the reset."
Another: "I never said 'red line.'"
Seeing Red:
Right on Bro. I'm getting tired of all the whingers blaming black AA, Mexican illegals, libruls, democrats and Ozero.
What really happened was that Kerry volunteered for a Swift Boat post b/c he thought it would be far from the action (which is understandable). At the time Swift Boats were far away from the action and Kerry dreamed up spending his tour skiing behind the boat and making selfie-movies that would compare his service to Kennedy's.
Unfortunately for Kerry, the Swift Boats were retasked with littoral duty, which meant they would be close to shore and in rivers. So he took advantage of the 3 Purple Heart policy - get 3 and you get sent back home.
His behavior is easily recognizable to anyone who has served in a Victor unit and seen all the shenanigans the shitbirds try to get re-assigned to the rear.
Who's that cross-dresser on MASH always scheming to get sent back to the states? That was John Kerry.
Expect more 19th century behavior soon. Bullets and bombs may break my bones but opprobrium will never hurt me.
"And while Stalin did cause a lot of Tatar minority deaths when he relocated them (40% vs almost 0% of enemy alien Japs the US relocated) - it was not without some reason."
Okay, I bite. Tell me, what was the reason that Stalin exterminated close to 40% of Crimean Tatar civilians, women and children. Go ahead...
I noticed that same liberals who cry rivers of tears for arabs who left Israel, always find reasons and excuses for communist thugs killing millions of people.
BTW, Tatars who fought in WW2 for Stalin were also deported.
hombre wrote this:
"The enduring affliction of the Obamadupes: shameless forgetfulness. Nothing that came before has to do with now."
The lack of self-awareness is excellent with this comment. Away with the "fecklesness," for verily, the neocon approach--an approach that NEVER has been put into practice--will most assuredly work! Guaranteed!
She voted for Obama and dems. Lolol
I want people to have health care, I didn't know I was going to pay for it! Lololol
Cedarford....
"Read some history about the place sometime."
"Russians have been in Crimea longer than America has been America."
Crimea became part of Russian empire in 1783, a few years after the Declaration of Independence.
According to Russian sources: "По данным исследователей конца XIX века Ф. Лашкова и К Германа население полуостровной части Крымского ханства к 1770-м годам составляло примерно 500 тыс. человек, 92 % из которых были крымские татары. Первая российская перепись 1793 года зафиксировала в Крыму 127,8 тыс. человек населения, в том числе 87,8 % крымских татар."
In 1793, Crimean Tatars were 87.8% of the population.
Howard said...
Drago:
You might be right, I wasn't there taking fire with John F Kerry in Viet Nam.
...that's all right you were probably next to him during his 'Christmas in Cambodia'.
"Russians have been in Crimea longer than America has been America."
But America should still get to say what happens there because is there anything more American than America?
the political appointees in this administration need to be reminded that actually running a functioning government and foreign policy is different than an episode of "The West Wing".
Russia invades Ukraine and Samantha Power tweets our...outrage(?) Come on.
tell Obama that Russia is a conservative 501(c)(4). Maybe he will get worked up then
How do you think the Germans are feeling? They are essentially disarmed, depending on the US for any defense they might need with a reawakened Russia. Take it one step further: how are the Poles feeling? I find it hard to believe that either of these countries is going to remain passive about threats to their east.
As far as Kerry is concerned, he has always been a useless prig. The absolute worst example of what a private school/Ivy League education can do to a weak man.
No Lars, I was fucking your girlfriend while you were spit-shining your shoes.
Tell Obama that putin supports fracking
Harrow lololol didn't Powell have to step in over Malta? I think it was Malta.
"How do you think the Germans are feeling? They are essentially disarmed, depending on the US for any defense they might need with a reawakened Russia"
Wait you mean the social welfare state paradise has only been able to provide such generous benefits because the US gauranteed their safety? Do Tell.
A. They would look to us anyway.
B. There are these printed pieces of paper with signatures which give guidance. Fortunately the US Vonstitutional lawyer detests those old world thingies and ignores them cos they could hVe negative rights in them and he only wants to help people.
Because he cares.
The Ukraine, the Syria and Iran debacles are yet another set of demonstration that you don't want appeasement wing Democrats as POTUS, ever, because the rest of the still existing, very anti-US hostile nations knows they are candy-asses and pushovers.
"The Ukraine, the Syria and Iran debacles are yet another set of demonstration that you don't want appeasement wing Democrats as POTUS, ever, because the rest of the still existing, very anti-US hostile nations knows they are candy-asses and pushovers."
Oh the irony it is just too rich!!! We still have not nearly begun to recover from the broad ranging clusterfuck that was the US military adventurism people like Sgt Ted argued for and got. And Sgt. Ted and 101st keyboard warriors here and across Teh Internets are all drawn up with cartoon-tinged dignity droning on (see what I did there?) about the "lessons" of Obama's RELATIVE nonadventurism.
At least there's some comedic value in it, anyway. Dark though it be.
Iran 1979 oh the irony.
Ohh maybe if mom jeans projected some sense of assertiveness these past 5 years we wouldn't be talking about this today.
The basic problem is this. The Russian navy has to have a port that is ice-free the year around. Sevastopol is the only one they have, and it is located in the Crimea. They want it, and, clearly, no one is capable of stopping them. Our conventional forces aren't nearly enough, and we're not going to go nuclear over the Crimea.
Putin bribed or blackmailed or coerced or somehow got Yanukovych to do an about face on his support for integration with the EU (or perhaps Yanukovych decided that the price the EU was demanding was too high). The people rose up against Yanukovych and Putin and in favor of the European Union, and the result jeopardizes Putin's control of Sevastopol.
How could the administration's experts -- self-proclaimed experts, it appears -- not have connected the dots?
Obama couldn't even be bothered to put on a show of attending the meeting of the National Security Council. He's already given up.
If Kerry and Obama don't believe it is in the US's interests to get involved in this Russia/Ukraine mess, then they should just say so.
The problem is they can't pick a side, so they vacillate between vaunted (and dishonest) rhetoric and "I really mean it guys, next time, I might slap you on the wrist." The schizophrenia of their positions is what makes us look weak. If Rand Paul were President, he might not get involved either, but he wouldn't be so dishonest about it. And that makes a lot of difference.
Wow. Obama's actually making a move in Ukraine's direction:
Secretary of State John Kerry will travel to Ukraine on Tuesday to meet with both legislators and civilians, the Obama administration announced Sunday afternoon as European leaders called for calm in the midst of international outrage over Russia’s hostile takeover of Crimea.
"The basic problem is this. The Russian navy has to have a port that is ice-free the year around. Sevastopol is the only one they have, and it is located in the Crimea. They want it, and, clearly, no one is capable of stopping them. Our conventional forces aren't nearly enough, and we're not going to go nuclear over the Crimea."
This is not true. Russia has several ports of their own on the Black Sea.
http://www.worldportsource.com/ports/RUS.php
Novorussiysk is their major southern export port and has a naval base.
Its not like Russia does not have a huge Black Sea coastline of its own.
Where are people getting this misinformation that Russia "needs" an outlet to the sea in the Crimea.
Howard: "...based on Koch brothers funded hearsay."
Well, then its a really good thing i wasnt basing my comments on koch brothers funded hearsay!
Whew!
Of course, when you depend heavily on your "greater by factors of 10" soros and left wing funded propaganda, its understandable why you might be confused.
We still have not nearly begun to recover from the broad ranging clusterfuck that was the US military adventurism
Wasn't a clusterfuck until the Dems and Obama undermined it.
Ironic, but not the way you meant.
[this is really all about tribalism for you, right?]
Obama is like the Black Knight in Monty Python to Putin's King Arthur.
Reagan was never willing to trigger WW3 over anything the USSR did from 1981-1989. However he never issued empty threats either. He did call them an "Evil Empire" and called on Gorby to "tear down that wall". However he never issued EMPTY THREATS that were never backed up by real actions.
Reagan was a man of action. Grenada, supporting the Contras come to mind...
"Alaska's resources will be next up for fair a redistribution."
I always knew it was folly to buy the place. You can practically see Russia from the governor's house.
Obama is like the Black Knight in Monty Python to Putin's King Arthur.
I've always seen him more as Brave Sir Robin.
Put the SS 20s in Germany.
Obama is like the Black Knight in Monty Python to Putin's King Arthur.
I've always seen him more as Brave Sir Robin.
Alex: Tell what a man of action Reagan was to the Marines in Beirut. You forgot to mention the arms for hostages deal with Iran and the abandonment of Afghanistan to the ISI sponsored Taliban that led to 911.
OOOh, SNAP.
harrogate said...
"But the answer is 'opprobrium.' The dreaded opprobrium. A big international frowny face."
With brash talk like that, you must have a better idea? Would love to hear it.
The better idea: shut the F up. You can't bluff someone who has the nuts. Trying it costs you your bet, or in this case, shows you far weaker than your other opponents fear.
Drago admits he willingly slanders a combat vet based on hearsay. Fine.
You have no evidence that I rely on the Soros shitbag spinners. I wouldn't even know where to find such information.
"Chickenhawks pine for sabre rattling, offended by big words from the thrice wounded vet."
So, what about the UN? How about a cessation of military cooperation? Why is it Russia (and China) gets a pass on anything near its borders and no one else does?
Thrice wounded? The only American officer still possessing all his limbs to take advantage of the three wound rule to leave his tour early.
What pisses me off is that it's the racist, homophobic, superstitious, greedy idiots represented by the denizens of Althouse that are working non-stop to destroy reasonable opposition to democrats. Fucking children.
"Tell what a man of action Reagan was to the Marines in Beirut."
One might as well as about who ordered the USS Maine to Havana. I think that was a Republican Administration as well.
"Fucking children."
Being the only adult present must be such a burden.
If Dobbie's evil master would give him a shirt, we would not have to be confronted with his pecks, or his evil machinations.
----Well put. It's just like republicans getting hysterical that affirmative action might help black kids and have little concern for 400-years of slavery.
Oh, right. No one living today was responsible for slavery, so it's a non-issue. I guess their might be a few lynchers still around, but that is just moving the goal posts.------
Someone's pretty disturbed by this topic and has retreated to their rhetorical blankie… There there it will be all right, let the grown ups handle it.
----However, the windsurfing putz didn't get my vote because of his fake medal tossing and his congressional testimony of US war crimes based on hearsay.----
Not to mention his free-lance negotiating with the North Viet Namese communists while still in the uniform of his country.
----abandonment of Afghanistan to the ISI sponsored Taliban that led to 911.
Wowser, its create an alternate reality night. When did we have power over Afghanistan so as to be in a position to abandon it?
You are lying or ignorantly confusing Reagan with Gorbachev because the Soviets continued to support the government they left behind until 1992. Well after Reagan left office.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afghanistan
Putin must be spending hundreds of dollars on new underwear and dry cleaning costs these days. Because he must be pissing himself laughing every time he hears Obama or Kerry make a speech.
" It's just like republicans getting hysterical that affirmative action might help black kids and have little concern for 400-years of slavery."
Help at whose expense? I am all for blacks getting affirmative action at the expense of children of liberal and left-wing parents. It's a win-win situation. After all, they are members of the party which fought for slavery, they need to pay for it. Agreed?
Well, Kerry does have the hat to this day; that ought to count for something.
Trashhauler said...
"I always knew it was folly to buy the place. You can practically see Russia from the governor's house."
Apparently trash is one of those folks incapable of distinguishing a Tina Fey Saturday Night Live skit from a Sarah Palin interview.
Howard said...
What pisses me off is that it's the racist, homophobic, superstitious, greedy idiots represented by the denizens of Althouse that are working non-stop to destroy reasonable opposition to democrats. Fucking children.
Said the hyperbolic child.
Seeing Red said...
Put the SS 20s in Germany.
Missle defense shield in Poland.
Deny them access to Cuba and Venesuela. Air bases in Iraq.
Weakness invites confrontation.
So what are the costs?""
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-03-03/russian-stocks-crash-central-bank-scrambles-hikes-rates-most-1998-default
Apparently quite expensive. The private investment centers might solve the problem for us.
@Big Mike
"How could the administration's experts -- self-proclaimed experts, it appears -- not have connected the dots?"
I think that the lowliest second lieutenant could have figured this out - by himself!
@Aaron
See the following: http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/1f749b24-9f8c-11e3-b6c7-00144feab7de.html#axzz2uurp2Hf6
Perhaps it will help you with your strategy development.
Later howard: "You have no evidence that I rely on the Soros shitbag spinners."
LOL
Howard takes a "principled" stand against lack of evidence for assertions.
Uh, except for this..
Earlier howard: " It's unseemly to disparage a decorated combat vet based on Koch Brothers funded hearsay."
Hmmmm, Howard apparently reserves the right to violate the protocols he breathlessly and powerfully advocates for.
LOL
Duly noted.
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