Althouse: The Obama campaign exploits Romney's 47% remark.

२१ सप्टेंबर, २०१२

The Obama campaign exploits Romney's 47% remark.

This is a new ad from the official Obama campaign, using what is useful:

८२ टिप्पण्या:

ricpic म्हणाले...: Sensitive souls vote Democrat!; २१/९/१२, ९:२९ AM
Tim म्हणाले...: And in the real world, median income hits a 27-year low in Ohio, and the Congressional Budget Office confirms Obama-care raises taxes on middle-income families by almost $700 annually.; २१/९/१२, ९:३३ AM
deborah म्हणाले...: It is strange that after Obama got caught on tape talking about bitter clingers, Romney would do exactly the same thing. His only hope is that it will occur to the 53% to realize the burden they carry, and to vote in droves for Romney.; २१/९/१२, ९:३८ AM
Andy म्हणाले...: "I'll never convince them they should take personal responsibility and care for their lives."

Romney is a monster. The only upside of this display is that it's making clear that as much as Romney doesn't like or respect so many Americans, even fewer like or respect him.; २१/९/१२, ९:३९ AM
Wince म्हणाले...: ही टिप्पणी लेखकाना हलविली आहे.; २१/९/१२, ९:४५ AM
Andy म्हणाले...: His only hope is that it will occur to the 53% to realize the burden they carry, and to vote in droves for Romney.

You think 53% of the population thinks retired senior veterans are moocher victims who won't take personal responsibility and care for their lives?; २१/९/१२, ९:४६ AM
Wince म्हणाले...: I dunno. That ad kind of falls into a trap of it's own making.

It suggests that only white middle class people who are dependent on government for benefits that were promised and earned are not really dependent on government for handouts.

I can see how the ad might fail to move votes to Obama among this group, because it leaves open the belief that there is a percentage of people (under 47%) who are dependent on government that don't deserve income support because they didn't earn it and believe themselves to be victims.

If Romney did this ad, exonerating white seniors from their dependency while not talking about the poor and especially poor minorities, it'd be called divisive and racist for the reason it appealed only to whites of a certain type.; २१/९/१२, ९:४७ AM
edutcher म्हणाले...: It seems 47% really is the amount that will vote for Zero.

Cool.

We know how much is left for the Romster.

Andy R. said...

I'll never convince them they should take personal responsibility and care for their lives.

Romney is a monster. The only upside of this display is that it's making clear that as much as Romney doesn't like or respect so many Americans, even fewer like or respect him.

That's why he'll get 53+% of the vote.

(Zero, of course, is still falling); २१/९/१२, ९:४८ AM
edutcher म्हणाले...: Andy R. said...

His only hope is that it will occur to the 53% to realize the burden they carry, and to vote in droves for Romney.

You think 53% of the population thinks retired senior veterans are moocher victims who won't take personal responsibility and care for their lives?

God, he is a moron.

Ever hear the term, greedy geezer?; २१/९/१२, ९:४८ AM
cubanbob म्हणाले...: Every year the government sends me a statement on how much I have paid in to my retirement fund known as Social Security. Either I have a paid in contribution or the government is lying to me. Which is it?

Andy R, being that you are such a goodhearted fellow, why don't you pay my next quarterly tax installment?; २१/९/१२, ९:४९ AM
edutcher म्हणाले...: cubanbob said...

Every year the government sends me a statement on how much I have paid in to my retirement fund known as Social Security. Either I have a paid in contribution or the government is lying to me. Which is it?

You, sir, have paid your taxes into the general fund where it will be spent as soon as it's accounted for.

So, yes, the government is, surprise!!!!!, lying.; २१/९/१२, ९:५८ AM
alan markus म्हणाले...: Let's look at who the 47% might be that get more than they give. With paying sales tax, property tax, and payroll taxes if they are working (or had worked) a lot of them will not perceive that they are in the 47% that get more than they give. Just like people give themselves a higher grade or overrate their driving abilities, people tend to think they are paying much more and getting less for it than actual facts would support. I imagine a lot of people who are actually in the 47% will pat themselves on the back thinking they are in the 53% that pays the freight and will resent those "takers" & "moochers" in the 47%.

Who wants to proudly proclaim, "yes, I am in the 47%!"? Most people will want to self-identify as being in the 53%, even if they actually aren't.; २१/९/१२, ९:५९ AM
Tim म्हणाले...: "Who wants to proudly proclaim, "yes, I am in the 47%!"? Most people will want to self-identify as being in the 53%, even if they actually aren't."

Romney's point about the "47%," too nuanced for the failed hat mannequin, is that it isn't about the actual composition of tax users v. tax payers, it is about the mindset of the "47%," i.e., if you believe yourself a victim, if you believe yourself entitled to government assistance, if you believe yourself "Julia" come to life, you will vote for Obama, no matter what Romney says or does.

So yes, some people who actually fall within the "47%" most decidedly do not see themselves this way; conversely, some who fall in the 53% do see themselves this way - and each will vote accordingly.; २१/९/१२, १०:१३ AM
TWM म्हणाले...: "You think 53% of the population thinks retired senior veterans are moocher victims who won't take personal responsibility and care for their lives."

I think that quite a few of thos retired senior veterans are going to vote for Romney. In fact, I'd say most of them will.; २१/९/१२, १०:२८ AM
chickelit म्हणाले...: Obama is still poor alternative for anyone upset that the SS Ponzi Scheme is unsustainable.

Andy S. bemoans You think 53% of the population thinks retired senior veterans are moocher victims who won't take personal responsibility and care for their lives?

No, I don't. But I'd wager that a hefty chunk of them think that hipsters like you contribute little to nothing towards future human capital.; २१/९/१२, १०:३७ AM
victoria म्हणाले...: You're darn right they are. You don't think the Romney campaign will and has exploited any Obama missteps?

I don't even like Obama.

Vicki from Pasadena; २१/९/१२, १०:४५ AM
Tyrone Slothrop म्हणाले...: If I was in a betting pool to pick the final election result, I would bet on Romney 53%, Obama 47%.; २१/९/१२, १०:५७ AM
Christopher in MA म्हणाले...: Angry Voter: "I'm one of the 47% and I won't vote for Mitt Romney!"

Romney: "You'll never vote for me. That's what I said."

Angry Voter: "RACIST!"; २१/९/१२, १०:५८ AM
chickelit म्हणाले...: victoria admits: I don't even like Obama.

Good for you. Liking his politics is one thing; falling for his sickening cult of personality is gross and un-American.; २१/९/१२, ११:०० AM
Christopher in MA म्हणाले...: Romney is a monster. The only upside of this display is that it's making clear that as much as Romney doesn't like or respect so many Americans, even fewer like or respect him.

Perhaps, Hat, you can explain why Romney - or anyone else - should respect a Peggy "I won't have to worry about putting gas in my car. I won't have to worry about paying my mortgage. You know, if I help him, he's gonna help me" Joseph, a Henrietta "Obama, give me a kitchen and a bathroom" Hughes or the "I'm getting money from his stash - I don't know where he got it from, but he's giving it to us" woman in Detroit.; २१/९/१२, ११:०६ AM
Colonel Angus म्हणाले...: Romney is a monster.

And Obama is a jackass who thinks I didn't work any harder than the next guy to start my business and that I didn't pay my fair share to build and maintain the infrastructure.

So as one of the 53% I can look forward to higher taxes to cover our $1 trillion budget shortfall while the 47% can wallow in their victimhood and say what a mean person Romney is.; २१/९/१२, ११:०७ AM
DADvocate म्हणाले...: It seems like an effective. Although, I guess I could be considered a senior citizen (61 years old) and it didn't convince me of a thing and I hated the background music. HATED IT!

I think Romney's wrong about 47% not changing their minds. I bet half of those could be convinced. It'd be interesting to see the whole video, but it must be flattering of Romney as the entire unedited video isn't available to the public.; २१/९/१२, ११:१३ AM
Colonel Angus म्हणाले...: if you believe yourself "Julia" come to life, you will vote for Obama, no matter what Romney says or does.

Again it bears repeating, the Obama campaign puts out an ad that for all intents and purposes illustrates how great it is to be one of the '47%' and suddenly Obama supporters take umbrage because Romney validated their own campaign ad.

The fact Obama is even close is a statement as to how low this country has fallen.; २१/९/१२, ११:१९ AM
machine म्हणाले...: I think they should make a commercial about Mitt's self tanning in order to make himself more appealing to Univision viewers...

that would be a good one...; २१/९/१२, ११:२४ AM
alan markus म्हणाले...: "I'm getting money from his stash - I don't know where he got it from, but he's giving it to us" woman in Detroit.

Awhile ago, a blogger printed part of an Obama email:

Huge news:

We finally closed the gap. We outraised Mitt Romney and the Republicans $114 million to $111 million in August.

He didn't show the email itself, so there is no link to foreward it out to those who want some of Obama's "stash" - looks like he has an extra $3 Million to give. Someone should get the links & spread the word that all you have to do is ask Obama for it and you will get it. Obama cares for those who don't gots!; २१/९/१२, ११:२७ AM
Peter Ryan म्हणाले...: I am amazed at how deft Mr. Obama's campaign is at fighting straw men. Clearly, it is their strongest skill set.

Mr. Romney's remarks referred to Federal income tax payers. 47% pay no federal income tax. This is undisputed.

Mr. Obama's campaign video then addresses three entitlement programs, two of which are separately funded from the federal income taxes: Social Security benefits (separately taxed), Medicare (separately taxed) and veterans benefits (which are funded by general federal tax revenues).

And does that video almost knock those straw men down! Then, they inadvertently blow up the meme:

1) At 1:15, the middle-aged white feels it's "offensive" - He's a victim!
2) At 1:50, the older white guy (OWG) insists he's not a victim, but then OWG says "he would be a tragic president" (the "he" to which OWG is referring is unclear - I assume Mr. Obama, but we don't know how the editing worked, so it could be referring to Mr. Romney). So OWG is going to be - wait for it - a "victim" of tragedy.
3) The music throughout is sad and ominous, almost like whining victimization is about to happen.

These folks sound whiny even when they insist they are not whining.

Do you think their arms get that itch from pushing around all those bales of straw?; २१/९/१२, ११:४० AM
Tyrone Slothrop म्हणाले...: alan markus said...

Huge news:

We finally closed the gap. We outraised Mitt Romney and the Republicans $114 million to $111 million in August.

However, Fox News just reported that at the end of August, Obama's war chest was $125 million and Romney's was $166 million.; २१/९/१२, ११:४० AM
TWM म्हणाले...: "I bet half of those could be convinced. It'd be interesting to see the whole video, but it must be flattering of Romney as the entire unedited video isn't available to the public."

I argree, especially since the Obama campaign - and the Hat - keep harping on senior veterans. Yes, the receive benefits, but I would bet that most of them are conservative-leaning and will vote for Romney. They don't think of themselves as the 47% and they aren't really, so yeah Romney can get more than a few percentage points from that group.; २१/९/१२, ११:४२ AM
Colonel Angus म्हणाले...: I argree, especially since the Obama campaign - and the Hat -keep harping on senior veterans.

I don't equate a veteran receiving benefits with a high school droput, with a couple out of wedlock kids with no marketable skills on the dole because he/she can't get a 'livable wage'.; २१/९/१२, ११:४६ AM
Alex म्हणाले...: Romney is a monster.

It's monstrous to point out the moochers in today's society. It's monstrous to say "he look at the elephant in the room!".

Monstrous.; २१/९/१२, ११:४८ AM
Andy म्हणाले...: I don't equate a veteran receiving benefits with a high school droput, with a couple out of wedlock kids with no marketable skills on the dole because he/she can't get a 'livable wage'.

Romney did.; २१/९/१२, ११:५० AM
alan markus म्हणाले...: Obama's war chest was $125 million

Hey, that's better yet! The election's in the bag (according to the MSM), Obama doesn't need it anymore, so just go ahead and ask for it at www.barackobama.com. Those folks would be happy to assist you in getting your share of the Obama stash. Spread the word!; २१/९/१२, ११:५० AM
Colonel Angus म्हणाले...: Romney did.

No he didn't.; २१/९/१२, ११:५६ AM
Nathan Alexander म्हणाले...: I'm a veteran, and I'm clear that Makers pay my salary.

I'm not stupid enough to think that raising my salary would help the economy, because I realize that pretty much ALL govt employees are a drag on the economy.

I do believe firmly that the drag on the economy that the military represents is worth it, and we contribute to the US' wealth by ensuring stability for global trade that the US benefits from.

But I also am 100% clear (and I wish democrats and paulbots were equally cognizant of) that I defend the nation, its values, and its prosperity at the risk of my life at a salary so low that 99% of the nation is unwilling to join at the same salary/benefits.

So I am part of the dependent 47%, but not of the 47% stupid enough to vote for Obama.

And I wish the democrats would stop breaking promises to the military.; २१/९/१२, ११:५७ AM
machine म्हणाले...: Stop it. This is hard. You want to try it? Get in the ring.; २१/९/१२, १२:०० PM
Howard म्हणाले...: Of course the add is deceptive. We all know that Romney was talking about blacks, gays, Latinos, jews, women, etc. He was certainly not talking about white retirees, veterans, and working poor whites. That is what he meant by *inelegant* because his attempt at using a racist, homophobic, antisemitic and sexist dog-whistle painted with too broad of a brush.

The funny thing is Ozero's team recognizes that *people* only care about the white retired, white working poor and veterans among the 47%, so that was the demographic they focused on in their clever advert.; २१/९/१२, १२:०१ PM
Colonel Angus म्हणाले...: I and pretty much everyone who has two brain cells rubbing together knew what Romney meant. It won't have any bigger impact than Obama listening to goddamn America sermons for 20 years, wanting to redistribute wealth or calling a chunk of the electorate bitter clingers.

This election will boil down to who can repair the economy. If the majority think the current occupant can do it after four years of making a had situation worse then we will all have to live with the consequences.

Obama is very much about fairness and equality. Perhaps its his goal to make everyone poor.; २१/९/१२, १२:०२ PM
traditionalguy म्हणाले...: Ryan needs to communicate again that he is saving Social Security for those over 55.

The economy cannot pay the current benefits without borrowing and simultaneously inflating the dollar. That IS the Dems' plan.

The Dems' plan that once payid out a hypothetical $1800 a month will soon pay out an $1800 a month that will buy what $1200 a month once bought.

This Dems plan cuts the benefits for everyone including the over 55s used in their deceptive ad.; २१/९/१२, १२:०३ PM
traditionalguy म्हणाले...: Seriously, Romney needs to display some fight and risk his assumed victory by using some free speech about the way the economy really works...that is his specialty after all.

So why won't he show some leadership on the subject? So far Romney is running out the clock and playing a prevent defense.; २१/९/१२, १२:०९ PM
अनामित म्हणाले...: No he didn't.

Then exactly who are the 47% he was referring to? He explicitly referred to the 47% who don't pay income tax, which includes the groups you claim aren't in that group.; २१/९/१२, १२:०९ PM
Andy म्हणाले...: Then exactly who are the 47% he was referring to? He explicitly referred to the 47% who don't pay income tax, which includes the groups you claim aren't in that group.

I've heard conservatives alluding to this idea that Romney somehow didn't say the absolutely disgusting thing that his words actually mean, but no one has ever given the super-secret meaning behind his comments.; २१/९/१२, १२:११ PM
अनामित म्हणाले...: The economy cannot pay the current benefits without borrowing and simultaneously inflating the dollar. That IS the Dems' plan.

Of course it can, simply by eliminating the salary cap on SS contributions.

Inflation is not currently a problem and is not in the foreseeable future.

Anyway, I thought the problem was a weak dollar, not a strong one.; २१/९/१२, १२:१२ PM
chickelit म्हणाले...: machine said...
Stop it. This is hard. You want to try it? Get in the ring.

Fuck you, machine. Denounce the cult of personality. Then I'll listen.; २१/९/१२, १२:१३ PM
TWM म्हणाले...: "I've heard conservatives alluding to this idea that Romney somehow didn't say the absolutely disgusting thing that his words actually mean, but no one has ever given the super-secret meaning behind his comments."

Maybe they can be found in the 1 to 2 minutes of tape that was disappeared.; २१/९/१२, १२:१३ PM
Bryan C म्हणाले...: "Romney did."

No, he didn't.

Why do you feel the need to lie, Andy? And why in defense of corrupt and incompetent politicians who take your vote for granted, and give you nothing but failure and lies in return? You don't have to support them. You don't have to let them define you. You are allowed to vote for someone who you personally despise, but who can do the job required. You have a choice.; २१/९/१२, १२:१३ PM
TWM म्हणाले...: "Then exactly who are the 47% he was referring to? He explicitly referred to the 47% who don't pay income tax, which includes the groups you claim aren't in that group."

Senior veterans don't pay income tax? Really? Since when? I'm a veteran and also close to retirement and I am going to pay income tax on a part of my retirement benefits. And since many retirees end up with second jobs they pay income taxes on that as well.; २१/९/१२, १२:१६ PM
Colonel Angus म्हणाले...: I've heard conservatives alluding to this idea that Romney somehow didn't say the absolutely disgusting thing that his words actually mean, but no one has ever given the super-secret meaning behind his comments.

47% of wage earners don't pay Federal income tax. This is undisputed. Within that 47% are a sizeable percentage that are net takers of the system, which means they rely on the 53% to not only fund the fed income tax but also provide their benefits as well.

Was it inartfully said? Probably but I find Obama's you didn't build that, or you are no smarter or harder working than anyone else despite building my own business infinitely more offensive.

Yes I do work harder and yes, I am a bit smarter because it takes more than just showing up to keep a businesss running. And yes I did build those roads, sewers, schools and police stations with taxes from my business and my personal income.; २१/९/१२, १२:२० PM
Colonel Angus म्हणाले...: Of course it can, simply by eliminating the salary cap on SS contributions.

In other words, take even more of my earnings.; २१/९/१२, १२:२२ PM
jp म्हणाले...: As a SS recipient, I am collecting from my children.

The money I paid in has been spent on other things.

Another 4 years of Obama will make things worse for my children; २१/९/१२, १२:२३ PM
jp म्हणाले...: As a SS recipient, I am collecting from my children.

The money I paid in has been spent on other things.

Another 4 years of Obama will make things worse for my children; २१/९/१२, १२:२४ PM
alan markus म्हणाले...: The funny thing is Ozero's team recognizes that *people* only care about the white retired, white working poor and veterans among the 47%, so that was the demographic they focused on in their clever advert.

Yeah - I don't think it would out too well using these people in that ad:

People Line Up For Money From Obama's Stash - People line up for pre-paid debit cards that don’t work; २१/९/१२, १२:२६ PM
अनामित म्हणाले...: Senior veterans don't pay income tax?

You might have to, but of the 47% that don't almost half (44%) are seniors whose retirement income including military retirement) is eligible for special tax treatment.

Granted, because military retirement benefits are so generous, I would imagine most retirees receiving military retirement benefits probably do pay some income taxes. But not every veteran is entitled to military retirement benefits, in fact most veterans do not receive military retirement benefits.; २१/९/१२, १२:२६ PM
अनामित म्हणाले...: As a SS recipient, I am collecting from my children.

If you feel so bad about it, return your checks to the treasury--or even sign your checks over to your children--apparently you think it is their money.; २१/९/१२, १२:२८ PM
Andy म्हणाले...: 47% of wage earners don't pay Federal income tax.

I've only seen the 47% refer to households, not wage earners. The percent of wage earners that don't pay federal income tax is a different percentage, I believe.

What are you talking about?; २१/९/१२, १२:२९ PM
अनामित म्हणाले...: In other words, take even more of my earnings.

Damn straight, Skippy! If you are making more than $110,100 a year, you can afford it.; २१/९/१२, १२:३० PM
अनामित म्हणाले...: 47% of wage earners don't pay Federal income tax.

This is an incorrect statement.; २१/९/१२, १२:३२ PM
Andy म्हणाले...: 47% of wage earners don't pay Federal income tax.

Colonel Angus, here are the charts that contradict you. Can you explain what you were talking about?; २१/९/१२, १२:३३ PM
hombre म्हणाले...: Fund raising hyperbole elevated to legitimacy by the Obamamedia.

Just something else to distract from Obama's diminishment of the nation.; २१/९/१२, १२:३४ PM
hombre म्हणाले...: ही टिप्पणी लेखकाना हलविली आहे.; २१/९/१२, १२:४६ PM
machine म्हणाले...: Cult of Reagan...ok

anyone else? not ok

IOKIYAR; २१/९/१२, १२:४९ PM
hombre म्हणाले...: "Colonel Angus, here are the charts that contradict you. Can you explain what you were talking about?"

The charts confirm that 47% don't pay income taxes. Payroll taxes are not income taxes. The 47% are probably people who file returns, not necessarily wage earners.; २१/९/१२, १२:५० PM
Andy म्हणाले...: The charts confirm that 47% don't pay income taxes.

Yeah, but the charts are for households, and Angus said "wage earners."

Angus, can you explain your comment?; २१/९/१२, १२:५० PM
Andy म्हणाले...: The whole point of this is whether Romney was referring to retired veterans collecting social security. If Romney is only talked about the working poor, who make some money, but not enough to pay federal income tax, then retired veterans aren't included.

If Romney was talking about the 47% of households, then that includes the retired veterans. The data says households. Angus's comment about wage earners was wrong.

Do we all agree that Romney was criticizing retired veterans on social security?; २१/९/१२, १२:५२ PM
hombre म्हणाले...: FF wrote: "Damn straight, Skippy! If you are making more than $110,100 a year, you can afford it."

How can you possibly know that, Class Warrior?; २१/९/१२, १२:५२ PM
chickelit म्हणाले...: machine wrote: cult of Reagan

As it happened, I didn't vote for Reagan. I do admire him in retrospect. But we're talking now about a man who encourages the defacement of the flag and the usurpation of the pledge.

============
Andy S. doesn't understand the difference between FICA and Federal Income taxes.

No wonder.; २१/९/१२, १२:५५ PM
Howard म्हणाले...: No Andy. Romney was talking about minority welfare queens and their spawn, workers comp scammers, and homeless druggies getting SSI.

Unfortunately, he is so effing stupid, the plain-english reading of his statement included 60% of his base.; २१/९/१२, १२:५८ PM
Howard म्हणाले...: Chickenlit

Reagan was so great, giving in to terrorists, selling arms for hostages, and turning tail from Beirut after 250 Marines get blowed up; २१/९/१२, १:०० PM
chickelit म्हणाले...: Howard reminds: Reagan was so great, giving in to terrorists, selling arms for hostages, and turning tail from Beirut after 250 Marines get blowed up.

And yet Reagan was a vast improvement on Carter. Don't double down on stupid like I did in 1980.; २१/९/१२, १:०९ PM
Howard म्हणाले...: Chickenlit says: "Don't double down on stupid like I did in 1980. "

Exactly. No more Henry Kissinger-loving neocon world police nation building.; २१/९/१२, १:१७ PM
TosaGuy म्हणाले...: As a veteran, I thank you Andy for your concern for us and our issues. I am sure you sudden concern for veterans has nothing to do with election season politics. I look forward to your continued support of veterans, especially in times where it won't be a convenient talking point for you.; २१/९/१२, १:२४ PM
Andy म्हणाले...: As a veteran, I thank you Andy for your concern for us and our issues. I am sure you sudden concern for veterans has nothing to do with election season politics.

What sudden concern? My dad is a Vietnam veteran.; २१/९/१२, १:२७ PM
chickelit म्हणाले...: Howard said...
Exactly. No more Henry Kissinger-loving neocon world police nation building.

No, I meant no more Carteresque Obama diplomacy and foreign policy. No more turn the other butt-cheek.; २१/९/१२, १:३५ PM
chickelit म्हणाले...: @Howard: I still don't get why you're OK with Obama's cult of personality if you were bothered by Reagan's. Are you that partisan?; २१/९/१२, १:३७ PM
chickelit म्हणाले...: @Howard: Do you need a link to show what I mean by Obama's cult of personality?

Would that help?; २१/९/१२, १:३८ PM
Known Unknown म्हणाले...: What sudden concern? My dad is a Vietnam veteran.

Thank him for his service on my behalf. Seriously.; २१/९/१२, २:०३ PM
Howard म्हणाले...: ChickenLit:

I'm a values voter: Reagan, Reagan, Bush, Perot (=Clinton), Perot (=Clinton), Bush, Bush, Obama, Obama

Of course, the way I add up the values of the candidates are based on a complex of personal preferences. Ending the middle east wars is a huge one for me. I supported both, then was very disappointed in how they were handled. I even doubled down on Bush because there was no way I could ever vote foe Kerry.

I am very aware of the cult of Obama, just like the Mormon cult, the Tea Party cult, the OWS cult, etc, etc, etc. All that stuff is great for pushing buttons, but is really just a whole lot of noise. The current Obama socialist hysteria is exactly the same as Bush derangement syndrome. In fact, my main disappointment with Obama is he is very much like Bush.

Also, I strongly believe that this country has way (like totally way!) mondo checks and balances, politically, economically and socially for one president to be able to depart significantly from the mainstream.; २१/९/१२, २:०४ PM
ken in tx म्हणाले...: I have paid federal income tax since I was 16 years old. The last year I did not pay taxes was the year I was 15 and worked part-time at a service station. I made $13 a week because it was the maximum amount you could make without having taxes withheld. My boss did not want to do the paperwork. I did not mind because sometimes he paid me in moonshine whiskey. Didn't pay taxes on that either.

I am retired now and still paying federal and state income taxes.; २१/९/१२, २:१३ PM
ken in tx म्हणाले...: I prefer Scotch now and have to pay taxes on my whisky. I have not figured out how to get untaxed Scotch.; २१/९/१२, २:२५ PM
a psychiatrist who learned from veterans म्हणाले...: "Ubi non gensimus sumus?" is one of the lines you study Latin to hear. It was spoken by Cicero in his oration against the revolutionary Catiline. Looking at it again I see 'Where are we not a proper people?' In school it was more loosely translated, 'What kind of people are we?' The 'sumus,' 'we are' refers to a permanent state of being I assume. Apologies to those who hablar espanol, but our discussion here perhaps suffers from the Obama campaign manipulating the difference between ser and estar in Romney's statement. I might say Soy Miguel as that is who I am but Estamos in ciudad Acuna as we are, but not permanently, in the city of Acuna. I think Romney was probably referring to people who are those who have perhaps never paid income taxes; it wouldn't be, in a sense, part of their nature.; २१/९/१२, ४:४८ PM
jp म्हणाले...: Freder;

I demand the politicians who stole my SS contributions return them to the treasury.; २१/९/१२, ९:०३ PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together म्हणाले...: Denounce the cult of personality. Then I'll listen.

Ok. I denounce Ronald Reagan's "cult of personality." There you go. Happy?; २२/९/१२, १०:१० AM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together म्हणाले...: "As a SS recipient, I am collecting from my children."

If you feel so bad about it, return your checks to the treasury--or even sign your checks over to your children--apparently you think it is their money.

Amen.

I'm a values voter: Reagan, Reagan, Bush, Perot (=Clinton), Perot (=Clinton), Bush, Bush, Obama, Obama

Of course, the way I add up the values of the candidates are based on a complex of personal preferences. Ending the middle east wars is a huge one for me. I supported both, then was very disappointed in how they were handled. I even doubled down on Bush because there was no way I could ever vote foe Kerry.

I am very aware of the cult of Obama, just like the Mormon cult, the Tea Party cult, the OWS cult, etc, etc, etc. All that stuff is great for pushing buttons, but is really just a whole lot of noise. The current Obama socialist hysteria is exactly the same as Bush derangement syndrome. In fact, my main disappointment with Obama is he is very much like Bush.

Amen again.; २२/९/१२, १०:१७ AM