The NYT interviews, Lara Logan, the CBS reporter who was sexually assaulted in Egypt on February 11th:
She was ripped away from her producer and bodyguard by a group of men who tore at her clothes and groped and beat her body. “For an extended period of time, they raped me with their hands”.... She estimated that the attack lasted for about 40 minutes and involved 200 to 300 men....
As the cameraman, Richard Butler, was swapping out a battery, Egyptian colleagues who were accompanying the camera crew heard men nearby talking about wanting to take Ms. Logan’s pants off. She said: “Our local people with us said, ‘We’ve gotta get out of here.’ That was literally the moment the mob set on me.”
And from Jeff Fager, the chairman of CBS News:
Mr. Butler, Ms. Logan’s producer, Max McClellan, and two locally hired drivers were “helpless... because the mob was just so powerful.” A bodyguard who had been hired to accompany the team was able to stay with Ms. Logan for a brief period of time.
... Ms. Logan “described how her hand was sore for days after — and then she realized it was from holding on so tight” to the bodyguard’s hand.
From the CBS interview with Logan:
"There was no doubt in my mind that I was in the process of dying... I thought not only am I going to die, but it's going to be just a torturous death that's going to go on forever..."
She says that to try to survive, she thought about her children, and when she saw them again: "I felt like I had been given a second chance that I didn't deserve...because I did that to them. I came so close to leaving them, to abandoning them."
पोस्ट्स
१५१ टिप्पण्या:
It's not a bad culture, just different, ya know?
Shit. That's horrible.
Can't even think about it.
Sounds like rape to me.
Unwanted contact.
I'm proud of Lara for speaking out. that must have been difficult. I think it was smart of her to wait until she was ready. Sadly, this isn't really a latest breaking news issue. It's a long term humanitarian crisis.
The people protesting for freedom in Egypt were scum. They were absolutely scum. That hundreds of men can molest women indicts the entire protest. This wouldn't be possible at an American ANSWER rally or a Tea Party. People would stop the rapes and molestations.
I think this is key to why we should have left Mubarak in power.
Another person touched by the religion of peace.
As the cameraman, Richard Butler, was swapping out a battery, Egyptian colleagues who were accompanying the camera crew heard men nearby talking about wanting to take Ms. Logan’s pants off.
We're talking of Egyptians here. Egyptians. One of the most sophisticated, urbanised, multi-cultural Arabs in the world, whose contact with foreigners is well over 4,000 years old.
But inject Islam, with its deep-rooted misogyny and predilection for taking advantage of unclean nonbelievers, into the mix, and you produce a crowd composed of nothing but a pack of slobbering, fingering rapists.
If you doubt this, ask yourselves:
Would this have happened to a female reporter in Paris? In Washington DC? In Rio de Janeiro? In Moscow? In Beijing? In Tokyo?
Whatever else happens in those places, the Lara Logans of this world need not fear what happened to her in Tahriri Sq., happening there.
Cheers,
Victoria
Merciless.
That's the entire culture in a word.
By the way, I remember reading that 25 or so Egyptian women and policemen saved Lara Logan from an even worse fate.
How must it feel to see your compatriots engaged in such an act, on a helpless human being?
To their infinite credit, they put their lives on the line and did the right thing.
That, too, is part of Islam. It's just that the other part overwhelms it.
Sherif Ali: Does it surprise you, Mr Bentley? Surely, you know the Arabs are a barbarous people. Barbarous and cruel. Who but they! Who but they!
(Lawrence of Arabia, 1962)
So they had already raped her with their hands enough to leave Lara in a hospital bed for a while, but brave women intervened, saving Lara from the rest of their plan.
Other stories shed light on the rest of that plan. At the very least, she was going to be gang raped. Then, they probably would have killed her.
It's sad, but the fact is that women should stay away from radically islamic countries right now. This obviously isn't Logan's fault, yet sometimes we have to take responsibility for the things that aren't our fault.
It's hard to even believe the men who could help eachother do this to a defenseless woman are the same species as I am.
Thank God I was born in the United States, with a superior set of values and a wiser culture.
(For the record, Egyptians are considered a race apart from Arabs, but they are the leaders of the Arab League...)
One of the more fascinating things going on in Woodstock is that the left is completely in bed with Hamas.
Go figure.
But, here's the logic:
1. We hate the evil imperialist U.S.
2. We hate Israel
3. Hamas hates the U.S. and Israel
4. We're signing on with Hamas.
This extends now to gun running on behalf of Hamas.
Egyptians are a proud people. Add to that Muslim Religious Pride and place an attractive blonde western reporter gal into the middle of a lawless riot of those young men...well she is lucky to be here. The number of attackers may have worked in her favor, because the group wouldn't let one or two get away with her by themselves. If they had, she might be enslave into a forced "marriage" by now.
"To their infinite credit, they put their lives on the line and did the right thing.
That, too, is part of Islam. It's just that the other part overwhelms it."
I want to believe you. Sincerely. I guess you have shown some evidence. I'd prefer it if the rapists were brought to justice by women with guns. That seems unlikely in an Islamic nation.
She felt she didn't DESERVE a SECOND CHANCE ?
The above is evidence of the distorted thinking that can result after someone is victimized especially sexually. Their thinking gets bent, sometimes permanently.
I had a friend who went from basically fearless to afraid to go to the market.
"(For the record, Egyptians are considered a race apart from Arabs, but they are the leaders of the Arab League...)"
True. I'm not sure why it matters, or what an Arab really is, as a race, but there are Arabs in Iran and Egypt, technically.
Is this a one drop rule sort of thing? If so, I bet they are all Arabs, but again, it doesn't really matter.
"The above is evidence of the distorted thinking that can result after someone is victimized especially sexually. Their thinking gets bent, sometimes permanently."
Yeah, it's probably the saddest part of the story, right?
but then, there is a logic to it. She was putting her life on the line by being an attractive woman in Egypt. This wasn't an unknown problem.
I imagine soldiers who narrowly escape death also sometimes feel this way about what that would mean to their families.
No doubt, any journalist honestly covering the middle east, from the ground, is very courageous. They also should consider what becomes of their family if something bad happens to them, even if it's the fault of monsters, not them.
"What really struck me was how merciless they were. They really enjoyed my pain and suffering."
Yeah. That's how most folks view the Obama administration, nowadays.
Majid: Aurens! Can you pass for an Arab in an Arab town?
T.E. Lawrence: If one of you will lend me some dirty clothes
(Lawrence of Arabia, 1962)
Dreadful.
How could any of those Rapists justify their actions.
It's sad, but the fact is that women should stay away from radically islamic countries right now.
I can think of a couple of problems with that advice:
1) Which countries are (not) considered “radically Islamic”? I don’t think anyone would have put Egypt in that category six months ago.
2) Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964 may prevent US-based employers who have employees stationed in those countries or who may be required as part of their jobs to travel to those countries from refusing to send female employees there even for their own protection.
"Radically Islamic” is redundant.
I have some familiarity with ethnic Egyptians. They remain markedly different in appearance and intelligence from the ethnic Arabian peninsula bedouins who conquered their country 1400 years ago (35 generations ago). Bedouins don't do planning and building. They use their Egyptian captives for that. That is why Copts are still alive today...they are the brain power needed to run things.
Do you suppose if she was in the museum she would have been protected?
Rare artifacts and all that.
Victoria said ... Would this have happened to a female reporter in Paris? In Washington DC? In Rio de Janeiro? In Moscow? In Beijing? In Tokyo?
In "certain sections" of Washington DC, I suspect it would have been worse.
TradGuy wrote:
The number of attackers may have worked in her favor, because the group wouldn't let one or two get away with her by themselves.
Right! Good point.
OT: Argh, I am logged into my Google vbspurs account, of course, so imagine my horror when I realised I had entered a search enquiry "gang bang Arabs" into Google, to get more info on this topic. The problem is that Google keeps the history of ALL your searches when logged into your account, for all time. So one day someone can wonder why vbspurs was Googling about gang bangs.
And "Poodle Vibrators".
"Egyptians are a proud people...."
With not much to be proud of.
--which is why it is so important for them to hate those over-achieving Jews.
So I guess it's not practical for Prof. Althouse to ban Titus?
I don't know what the rules are with blogger. This does seem to break the 'be interesting' stipulation.
Yeah, I know, I'm feeding a troll. My bad.
Peano wrote:
In "certain sections" of Washington DC, I suspect it would have been worse.
Let's not go there, Peano. In the West, a good-looking woman can go into a crowd of males, but if she has a camera behind her, most men of any skin tone will behave.
Even the threat of their attack being televised didn't deter these deviants from their physical attack.
What does that say about their culture, for God's sake.
"Bedouins don't do planning and building. They use their Egyptian captives for that."
Historian Bay Ye'or writes about how the state of agriculture and pretty much everything else declined markedly with the Muslim conquest of Egypt and North Africa. The conquering Arabs were not interested in any kind of real work, especially if it involved serious mental or physical effort; they only wanted to exploit their new population of slaves.
Do you guys ever dig in your butt and smell it?
Not being preoccupied with my asshole is just another benefit of being straight.
vbspurs said...
(For the record, Egyptians are considered a race apart from Arabs,
Egyptians, and for that matter Persians, consider Arabs to be goating herding, goat f'ing illiterate savages.
Shouting Thomas wrote:
But, here's the logic:
1. We hate the evil imperialist U.S.
2. We hate Israel
3. Hamas hates the U.S. and Israel
4. We're signing on with Hamas.
If only Glenn Beck would articulate the Far Left-Pro-Hamas ties in this way, he would sound like he had a point. But nooooo. He has to inject the Caliphate, Soros, and every other nutty conspiracy into the mix.
I thought journalists weren't supposed to become the story.
She should have been armed.
Moses: You know it is death to strike an Egyptian.
Joshua: I know it.
Moses: Yet you struck him. Why?
Joshua: To free the old woman.
Moses: What is she to you?
Joshua: An old woman.
(The Ten Commandments, 1956)
"He is the wittiest and most interesting commenter ever, according to the hostess."
Heh. Hopefully you're being sarcastic, but I never can tell with Althouse.
Oh well. It ain't my blog. I just note Titus is a boring pusher of the envelope.
Coprophilia!?!
So....the greeks did it first?
How'd they ever figure out this democracy thing?
Victoria, "Poodle Vibrators" is CSPAN-Speak for "Dennis Kucinich."
It seems like the NYT really enjoys Ms. Logan's pain and suffering... or at least they find it useful for advancing their agenda.
And it was groping. That ain't rape. Rape is "forcing another person to have sexual intercourse" according to my Mac's dictionary. "Sexual intercouse" is defined as sexual contact between individuals involving penetration. So no penetration, no rape.
"How'd they ever figure out this democracy thing?"
Heh.
That was done by the Greeks whose interests rose north of their groin at least once a day.
Even if there was no violation in the classic sense, the lady is very lucky.
Shame on Black Rock for trying to hush this up, whether for dhimmitude or PC.
vbspurs said...
...
Would this have happened to a female reporter in Paris? In Washington DC? In Rio de Janeiro? In Moscow? In Beijing? In Tokyo?
Worked with a guy originally from Bogota years ago. From what he said, I wouldn't lean too heavily on Rio.
By the way, I remember reading that 25 or so Egyptian women and policemen saved Lara Logan from an even worse fate.
I believe the number was fewer than that, but those people earned their place in Heaven.
Judaeo(sp?)-Christian Heaven.
(For the record, Egyptians are considered a race apart from Arabs, ...)
I've mentioned this before, but I met a delightful Egyptian lady once who insisted, "The Arabs are barbarians. I am not Arab. I am Egyptian".
Many Egyptians are African, with a strong dose of Greek (Cleopatra was a Ptolemy, after all).
Trooper York said...
Sherif Ali: Does it surprise you, Mr Bentley? Surely, you know the Arabs are a barbarous people. Barbarous and cruel. Who but they! Who but they!
(Lawrence of Arabia, 1962)
You missed one (and I think the best)
Jackson Bentley (Lowell Thomas):
Lawrence has a horror of killing, doesn't he?
Prince Faisal: Yes, with him, mercy is a passion. With me, it is merely good manners. I leave it to you to decide which is the more reliable motivation.
Gunnery Sergeant Hartman: How tall are you, private?
Private Cowboy: Sir, five-foot-nine, sir.
Gunnery Sergeant Hartman: Five-foot-nine, I didn't know they stacked shit that high!
(Full Metal Jacket, 1987)
She was putting her life on the line by being an attractive woman in Egypt.
...in hot pursuit of network news glory.
I think this forced her to confront her career vs. family dilemma, and she has made a decision.
Pogo - "Merciless. That's the entire culture in a word."
Trooper York - "Another person touched by the religion of peace."
Thank our Christian "religion of peace" God we live here, in such a civilized, "merciful" country.
*According to United States Department of Justice document Criminal Victimization in the United States, there were overall 191,670 victims of rape or sexual assault reported in 2005.
That's 525 a day.
That are actually reported.
Contrast the speed and dexterity with which the Tea Party and Sarah Palin were blamed for the shooting of Ms. Giffords with the ambiguity of this article. The several hundred men in Tahrir Square are not representative of anything at all. They are like a tornado that touched down.....What are the chances that a sensitive western or Israeli director will make a film dramatizing the plight of Coptics or women in Egypt? Can no one say that there is a clash of values and that our values are better?
I am so sorry she had to experience that. That is just horrible.
The proper response to this would have been directed and sustained automatic weapon fire to the left and right of Ms. Logan until they left her alone.
Carol - "...in hot pursuit of network news glory."
What exactly is your point?
That, after working for almost 20 years as a professional journalist throughout the entire world, she wasn't really hoping to provide realistic coverage of the situation, but just looking for some sort of "network news glory?"
C'mon...you don't really believe that.
Do you?
"Can no one say that there is a clash of values and that our values are better?"
William, I need to talk about your comments.
You don't seem to be getting the hang of 'celebrating diversity'.
Now, it's up to you whether or not you want to just do the bare minimum. Well, like Jeremy, for example, has 37 moral equivalencies.
And a terrific smile.
People can get moral criticism anywhere, ok?
They come to Althouse for the atmosphere and the attitude.
That's what diversity's about.
It's about fun.
William - "Can no one say that there is a clash of values and that our values are better?"
Well, that depends, William.
Do you consider 525 (reported) rapes a day to be some kind of "values" meter?
This was a mob who did a terrible thing, but to somehow use the situation as some kind of measuring stick of "our values" versus theirs is a tad simplistic.
Titus is beloved here. He is the wittiest and most interesting commenter ever, according to the hostess. He will never be banned.
No enemies from Sodom, I guess, and no trolls from Gomorrah.
See William?
That's how you excuse a barbarous culture.
Jeremy said...
Pogo - "Merciless. That's the entire culture in a word."
Trooper York - "Another person touched by the religion of peace."
Thank our Christian "religion of peace" God we live here, in such a civilized, "merciful" country.
*According to United States Department of Justice document Criminal Victimization in the United States, there were overall 191,670 victims of rape or sexual assault reported in 2005.
That's 525 a day.
That are actually reported.
And we punish people like that.
Your pals, the Moslems, don't.
shiloh said...
btw, our hostess "supposedly" likes it up the ...
Just like you?
Pogo - SO you think this is the land of "diversity?"
Now THAT is funny.
You could lump 90% of the daily comments into grab bag and never guess who wrote hat.
That's how "diverse" they are.
TGI, please look up the definition of "supposedly" and "claim" in the dictionary.
To help you out: supposedly = heresay.
>
And let the record show Titus w/the help of TGI, "hijacked" this thread, so both of them should apologize, like TGI did previously when he childishly hijacked another thread.
'nuf said!
Sixty Grit said...
Coprophilia is more common than normal people might imagine, apparently.
You have obviously never lived in Germany. aka, the poo shelf :)
http://www.banterist.com/archivefiles/000212.html
"
That, after working for almost 20 years as a professional journalist throughout the entire world, she wasn't really hoping to provide realistic coverage of the situation, but just looking for some sort of "network news glory?"
"
Obviously that's unfair. She knew the risks and wanted to tell the news.
And just because someone's ambition includes being renowned for their work doesn't mean they don't really want to do a good job. I think those go hand in hand. If Logan wanted to be a glorious reporter, well, there are lesser ambitions out there.
I don't really know how to deal with the aspect of risk. Should a producer send reporters into extremely dangerous environments? I wouldn't, but I guess Logan accepted the risks.
educher - "Your pals, the Moslems, don't."
Really?
There are no laws in Egypt? No punishment of any sort?
But here, we ferret out all 525 rapists (reported) and take care of business?
And, as for your teabagger "pals" comment, keep in mind that there are over a billion Muslims in the world and they aint's going away.
Pure bigotry.
And it was groping. That ain't rape. Rape is "forcing another person to have sexual intercourse" according to my Mac's dictionary
I would split the difference and call it "sexual molestation"
"And it was groping. That ain't rape."
What would the men here call it if it involved their mother, wife, sister or friend?
"Can no one say that there is a clash of values and that our values are better?"
Ask Jeremy and all the other appolgists for the religion of peace.
They never have a problem with what those barbarians are up to.
"
There are no laws in Egypt? No punishment of any sort?"
No, there wasn't any law in Egypt. There wasn't any punishment of any sort.
This was a mob! Don't you know that? That's why this is so disturbing. An entire huge group of people tolerated this. A few women and cops stopped it, not the protesting men.
This isn't possible in a good society. This is a valid piece of evidence about what's wrong with the people at that massive protest. There is no way something like this could happen at an American protest because we have a superior set of values.
Does that mean every Muslim is a rapist? No, of course not. But, there are clearly massive numbers of Muslims who are absolutely horrible people.
hearsay, not heresay
Let's not go there, Peano. In the West, a good-looking woman can go into a crowd of males, but if she has a camera behind her, most men of any skin tone will behave.
I could ask you what the antecedent of "there" is, but let that go.
Tell you what: Get one of your girlfriends to carry the camera and walk behind you. I'll show you where to walk.
By the way, I neither said nor implied anything about "skin tone." It's all about culture. There are sub-cultures in Washington DC that are as primitive as anything you'll find in Cairo.
I suspect that Titus is bipolar.
There are times (on his meds) when he states reasonable, cogent opinions. Then there are times (manic episodes?)when he sounds like a 15 year old trying to shock his elders.
I have to admit that I often find him pretty funny.
Society does not approve of coprophilia, and a fair number of things have to go wrong for an individual to develop an erotic interest in shit. Just the reverse with rape. The inhibitions against it come not from the individual libido but from the taboos of society at large......I think someone like Jeremy would say that the Tailhook scandal reflected poorly not just on the officers involved but on the macho society that they represented. Likewise with the recent rape case involving civilian contractors in Iraq.....Jeremy's failure to draw the arrows in Tahrir Square shows not a tolerance for Moslems but a tolerance for rapists. Shame on him.
Titus: No, I'll join this conversation on the proviso that we stop bitching about people, talking about wigs, dresses, bust sizes, penises, drugs, night clubs, and bloody Abba!
Tick: Doesn't give us much to talk about then, does
(The Adventure of Priscilla Queen of the Desert,1994)
vbspurs,
Would this have happened to a female reporter in Paris? In Washington DC? In Rio de Janeiro? In Moscow? In Beijing? In Tokyo?
It could easily have happened in Paris and, as another pointed out, in Washington DC.
I can't help but notice you left out London -- I have no doubt this could happen there as well.
Long live the Arab Spring!
Animals.
Yes, terrible. I wonder if she'll be going back to war zones. Logan has been brave.
TWM:
It's not a bad culture, just different, ya know?
"Collective guilt!"
"All those Arabs are the same!"
She was rescued by Egyptian women.
AND... women are raped every day in the USA. Does that make all of us bad people?
Not that you're a bigot or anything.
Wow, it's "bigots R us" around here!
The curious want to know: Does your faith teach you to hate Arabs? What faith is that?
Theodore Roosevelt: What do I want? I want respect! Respect for human life and respect for American property! And I'm going to send the Atlantic Squadron to Morocco to get that respect.
John Hay: That's illegal.
Theodore Roosevelt: Why spoil the beauty of the thing with legality
(The Wind and the Lion, 1975)
Alpha wishes everyone to ignore the fact, as he does, the standards in Islamic countries are different. The raped woman is guilty there, and presumed so.
He wants to do the value-neutral, non-judgmental, multi-culti dance.
We don't.
Dhimmitude, it's not just for eunuchs anymore.
That was done by the Greeks whose interests rose north of their groin at least once a day.
Boobies!! I knew it!! Democracy is all about the boobies.
w/v: tyrdstic - yecch....Coprophilia wins!
Trooper York - "Ask Jeremy and all the other appolgists for the religion of peace."
You're just another right wing bigot with little understanding of the real world.
There are over a billion Muslims in the world so what gives YOU or any of the other teabagging fools here the right to denigrate so many because of their religious beliefs?
They were here before us, and based on the way we're taking care of our own country and affairs, will probably be here after we're all gone.
*And by the way, numbnut...all of those pithy lines you throw out from films, as if they have damn near anything to do with real facts?
They don't.
The Grand Inquisitor said..."No, there wasn't any law in Egypt. There wasn't any punishment of any sort."
I wasn't referring to that specific day in time, fool. I know what a mob is.
But are you saying that there are indeed no laws in Egypt??
Feech La Manna: It's a good thing that what you think don't mean uh-gotz.
(The Soprano's, 2005)
AlphaLiberal said...
"AND... women are raped every day in the USA."
Have you ever heard of a rape of this magnitude occurring in the USA?
"Does your faith teach you to hate Arabs?"
No. Does your common sense not cause you to hate what these particular Egyptian men did at least as much as you hate bigotry?
Henry Drummond: "The Bible is a book. It's a good book, but it is not the only book."
Not according to Trooper and the rest of the bigots who hang here.
"I wasn't referring to that specific day in time, fool. I know what a mob is."
Then you agree this was a lawless pack of monsters who escaped justice, and are clamoring for control of a government.
but earlier you said this was not lawlessness at all, because Egypt has laws. The problem with that is that those laws, that system, that government... that's what these monsters are protesting in the first place. They want to rule. This lawless, unpunished, den of bastards should be called out specifically for the lawlessness.
You missed the forest for the trees. This lawlessness is exactly the issue.
Doesn't give us much to talk bout then, does it?
Sure it does. If we all dig around in our anuses and carefully examine what we fish out, we'll be able to spend the rest of the day describing the size, shape, texture and smell of each and every fascinating particle. The possibilities are endless. Another 600+ thread in the making.
When we tire of that, we can talk in general about the 525 daily rapes that happen in the US as if we really, really care, or start calling each other bigots as if we weren't impugning ourselves.
This way NO ONE will have to feel uncomfortable questioning, facing up to, weighing, or considering the realities and implications of the violence Laura encountered or the abuse she experienced.
Have you ever heard of a rape of this magnitude occurring in the USA?
Re: your faux equivalency question, one would have to go back to the Revolutionary War when America was fighting for it's freedom.
But once upon a time, witches were burned at the stake, and horse thieves were hanged and speaking of magnitude, the KKK (fill in the blank).
Also, there have been cases where women have been raped and victims severely beaten and witnesses stood by doing nothing.
>
ie if you want to do a history of serial killers, America is a very good place to start, eh.
Am I still on topic ...
Iceberg, Goldbeg what's the differance.
(Gilbert Gottfried, Fuck the Aflac
Duck, HBO 2011)
"Also, there have been cases where women have been raped and victims severely beaten and witnesses stood by doing nothing."
It's probably happened at some point, but I'd love to see a link.
Has there ever been, in recent American history, a case where hundreds of men raped a woman, in a protest with thousands of people there?
Nope. Shiloh calls this point a faux equivalency, but I don't think that means what she thinks it does. I think her response is drawing a false equivalency, actually.
Or maybe the reason she accuses people of what she just did, or subsequently immediately does, is because that's her shtick. That's just so boring and dumb I find it less plausible than her being an idiot.
shiloh is a woman?
I do apologize for my #1 AA pet being totally obsessed w/me.
So disturbed and immature that although he knows I'm not female, he makes a point of referring to me as a female several times in his convoluted post trying to childishly bait me.
Truly embarrassing that TGI goes out of his way to look foolish as he can't help himself ...
>
Again, as long as he's payin' attention to every word I post.
Is jeremy referring to all the rapes in Superdome during Katrina that did not happen. Poor little jeremy. The problem for the media is that the sexual assualt was in contradiction of the proproganda of a peaceful revolution they were spreading.
Jeremy said...
Trooper York - "Ask Jeremy and all the other appolgists for the religion of peace."
You're just another right wing bigot with little understanding of the real world.
Jeremy, of course, is a world traveler who's lived in Europe, the Middle East, and Asia; not some left-wing twit whose views are determined by fear of what the Moslems might do to him if he doesn't make a lot of noise to show he's on their side.
There are over a billion Muslims in the world so what gives YOU or any of the other teabagging fools here the right to denigrate so many because of their religious beliefs?
When their conduct is so out of touch with the rest of the world's standards of decency, people have the right.
Don't doubt one of Jeremy's forebears made the same speech when people heard about Kristallnacht.
They were here before us, and based on the way we're taking care of our own country and affairs, will probably be here after we're all gone
He's been reading from the Barry Obama history of the world again. Last I looked, Christianity predates Islam by 700 years and Judaism by a good 2500.
Alex said...
shiloh is a woman?
What they used to call a male-miss. As someone once said, were it not an unmerited reproach on the sex, I should say he had the timidity of a woman.When he can't say anything cogent, he insults the proprietress in a way that would get his lights punched out if he ever tried it in person.
Oh, and he's the only person who can get kicked in the balls rhetorically and call it admiration. I believe the condition is called masochism; it can be treated.
After Shiloh, the South never smiled!
At this point, I have no problem committing genocide on an entire religion and it's adherents, namely islam. I would willingly go to that special genocidal hell if I knew that getting rid of islam and muslims everywhere would make this world a better place and still keep a religious semblence intact free from this sub-human, barbaric death cult. Judge me as you will, but deep down, many of you know I'm right. Their religion, is intolerable, their ideology is intolerable, their culture is intolerable, their way of life is intolerable and incompatible with the rest of the world, literally. Enough is enough, they have to go one way or the other. It's us or them. Which do you choose. I've already made my choice.
What offends me about this, in addition to the disgusting barbarity of the Egyptians, is that Logan seems to believes that she deserves some kind of special protection from the barbarian masses because she is a journalist.
Do the genitals of plumbers not deserve special protection from barbarian masses?
Oh, how cute. A couple of internet tough guys get to bond over their shared Walter Mitty fantasies of violence towards Muslims in general. Let it never be said that the internet doesn't bring people together.
For myself, I'll just say that I hope Lara Logan recovers and that the people who attacked her are punished in this life and the next one.
Get out there and mix it up with some muslims then and fight. What are you typing away on a keyboard for? Get those knees up Shitty!
$1000 says Jeremy has never been to a predominantly Muslim country.
somefeller said...
Oh, how cute. A couple of internet tough guys get to bond over their shared Walter Mitty fantasies of violence towards Muslims in general. Let it never be said that the internet doesn't bring people together.
shiloh's relief, or another of his personalities, is here.
Anyone outraged over something like this is indulging their Walter Mitty fantasies.
Another old line that goes back to the Vietnam War.
Yes, we're soooo sophisticated that we just get a real bang out of looking down our Lefty noses at such people.
"What they used to call a male-miss. As someone once said, were it not an unmerited reproach on the sex, I should say he had the timidity of a woman.When he can't say anything cogent, he insults the proprietress in a way that would get his lights punched out if he ever tried it in person. "
Oh damn. That's right. someone said Shiloh was a man at some point.
I didn't mean to imply sexism. Shiloh is a girl's name, and Shiloh has not corrected my in calling her a she (Which I suspect she is, just based on her Deb Frisch loser old maid persona... which I realize is quite an assumption on my part).
If Shiloh is a man, my apologies, though I do not think men or women have different worths, and it wasn't meant as an insult.
I mean... you can all see what Shiloh is. Penis or vagina, the problem is in Shiloh's mind.
"For myself, I'll just say that I hope Lara Logan recovers and that the people who attacked her are punished in this life and the next one."
It's doubtful either will happen. Especially in the Islamic afterlife since Islam specifically says kill all infidels. Raping them is just a bonus I guess. Maybe it gets them one extra virgin or something.
Islam is dangerous and barbaric and I simply cannot understand how anyone does not see this, being that it is just so fricken' obvious.
Edutcher mumbles: Anyone outraged over something like this is indulging their Walter Mitty fantasies. Another old line that goes back to the Vietnam War. Yes, we're soooo sophisticated that we just get a real bang out of looking down our Lefty noses at such people.
It's pretty clear that I think what happened to Logan was an outrage. Punishment by eternal damnation is a pretty serious punishment (that's the punishment "in this life and the next one" I was referring to), and is the sort of punishment one doesn't suggest unless outraged. I guess reading comprehension isn't your strong suit. Maybe if it was, you'd be gainfully employed. But yes, I am looking down my nose at "such people". It's hard to avoid doing so when they put themselves in that position, and that position has nothing to do with one's political stripe.
How horrifying. While mobs in any culture are capable of unspeakable cruelty, I wonder what it will take for American journalists to someday wake up and realize that Arabic muslim culture is not civilized.
The behavior of the men toward the woman is a direct consequence of the infantilization of man-woman behavior promoted by Islamic culture. No dating, no talking with the opposite sex (other than your close relatives) makes any woman become an immediate sex object in the eyes of these men. A Western woman is automatically considered "loose" since she has no "Islamic morals" to constrain her. Worse, since in Muslim men's eyes it is always the fault of the "temptress" that they behave badly, there is rarely even remorse - after all, "they made me do it".
In Saudi Arabia it was not uncommon to read about Egyptian women being literally locked in her house by her husband during the day when he was away at work in order to "preserve her virtue" (read as - no ones getting any but me). That behavior was pretty normal.
I wonder too if the only reason that they did not actually rape her was that with so many there, there would actually be the possibly of having the 4 male witnesses necessary to achieve a conviction in an Islamic court (you have to have 4 independent male witnesses, courtesy of Alisha's little fling in the desert with a hunky soldier, to prove rape - an inconvenient detail that makes rape almost impossible to prove in this area - physical evidence without the witnesses is actually considered proof the woman merely committed adultery.
Move on folks - nothing to see here but the cultural norms on display.
What happened to the women that helped Lara out? Where they the ones dragged away and given tests for virginity?
somefeller said...
Edutcher mumbles: Anyone outraged over something like this is indulging their Walter Mitty fantasies. Another old line that goes back to the Vietnam War. Yes, we're soooo sophisticated that we just get a real bang out of looking down our Lefty noses at such people.
It's pretty clear that I think what happened to Logan was an outrage. Punishment by eternal damnation is a pretty serious punishment (that's the punishment "in this life and the next one" I was referring to), and is the sort of punishment one doesn't suggest unless outraged.
I guess reading comprehension isn't your strong suit. Maybe if it was, you'd be gainfully employed. But yes, I am looking down my nose at "such people". It's hard to avoid doing so when they put themselves in that position, and that position has nothing to do with one's political stripe.
Nothing of the kind. Talk's cheap, especially when it's just the preamble to snide remarks aimed at people who would actually like to see something done - that's how these animals would get punished, by enough people being outraged to demand something done. But some phony folksy isn't interested in that. A few vague generalities and it's off to the real purpose of the exercise.
Feeling superior is sooo much more important, we have to talk down anyone who wants the creeps actually punished in this world.
And, as usual, some phony folksy is feeling so inadequate, he has to snark everyone. My reading comprehension is good enough to see through his faux outrage, and I guess subbing for shiloh constitutes his idea of a job, so those of us that work - and I work, moron, at a couple of home businesses after I got tired of your hero, Little Zero, trying to destroy this country and figured I was going to have to do it myself - can only take pity on him.
Tell me if I missed it, but the story sounded like she was sexually assaulted by hand and not by penis. The middle east has a several thousand years old tradition of raping their beaten enemy's women as a legitimate booty of war. I suspect that the Egyptian women who came to her rescue challenged the crowd's assumption that she was one of the enemy's woman. Meade and the Professor had to face a similar crowd that believed in psychologically raping their enemies by yelling shame curses, chanting in their faces and displays of power by drumming.
Edutcher sputters: And, as usual, some phony folksy is feeling so inadequate, he has to snark everyone.
Nope, not everyone. Just those who openly talk about (their words) committing genocide. Once again - reading comprehension! Plus, as you say, talk is cheap, especially from internet tough guys.
And good luck with those "home businesses". Is that the cool phrase among the unemployable these days? At one time, the cool term was "independent investment consultant", but I guess that doesn't seem as cool after the market tanked. (Though it's doing pretty good now, thanks Barack!) Anyway, off to bed. Need to get to the office tomorrow. Or was it rude for me to use the term "office" in front of you?
"Anyway, off to bed. Need to get to the office tomorrow. Or was it rude for me to use the term "office" in front of you?"
Not taking sides in your little spat, but an "office" could be McDonalds. Not that there's anything wrong with that in our current economy.
40 minutes? 200-300 guys?
You're on your own, Egypt. Get your house in order.
Some phony folksy doesn't like the idea of home businesses. We're all supposed to be little thralls of the government, so he has another snark attack. He doesn't want to hear of resume services or medical-legal consulting.
And, if he thinks the market is up because of Little Zero, clearly he doesn't know enough about work to know the market is powered by all those Capitalists he hates.
You're on your own, Egypt. Get your house in order.
As Ironclad mentioned, Saudi Arabia still lacks human rights for women, etc. and yet they "supposedly" are our ally as is Iraq now.
hmm, "we" went into Iraq to get a bad guy, why not Egypt, Iran, Libya, Somalia, Sudan etc.
Selective outrage by the right is always somewhat amusing.
btw, wonder if the Bush family and Saudi Crown Prince Abdullah's/Saudi Foreign Minister Prince Saud Al- Faisal's families are still buddy/buddy lol
The enemy of my enemy is my friend or some such nonsense, especially when talking about Middle East foriegn policy er oil, which America is dependent on, eh.
Speaking of enemies, America is it's own worst enemy ie it's dependency on foreign oil.
A Muslim just got picked by the Jets
[*BOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!*]
Gabe Carimi went to the Saints. Congratulations Beth.
Pack up next!
It will take a few more terrorist strikes here to get to the levelof opinion needed, but we actually need to expel all non-citizen Muslims, stop admitting any Muslim students/tourists, and offer incentives to citizen Muslims to renounce US citizenship and leave.
Islam is incompatible with civilized life.
J,
AlphaLiberal (...like there is such a thing),
Jeremy,
Shiloh
Exactly what causes these fucktards to gather?
GarageMahal is frequently here....but the others. They seem to show up on queue.
I'm thinking this is CAIR, or Nitwits of Islam trolls.
Pack taking a loooooong time to pick.
Blech. Sorry. Carimi went to the Bears. WTF. I'll stop live blogging for the moment. LOL
Islam delenda est.
"Pack taking a loooooong time to pick."
Just so we don't miss our chance like the Ravens did!!
What happened to the Ravens?
Some phony folksy thanks Obama for 1.75% growth, 6% inflation, and 10.2% unemployment, 19.2% underemployed, and 6 million not counted because they can't find employment.
The market is headed for a fall, due to 13% of all homes unoccupied.
As some phony folksy put it, "Thanks, Barack".
I remember this happening at a bar in new Bedford, Mass a few years ago. It was full of Portugese fishermen and this woman came in to use the phone. They took turns with her on the pool table. Luckily she got away and reported it and the patrons of the bar really got hit hard.
Logan was stupid. Anyone not driven by PC and multi-culti claptrap knows that Muslims world-wide will whenever they have a chance, rape (and kill) any non-Muslim women not wrapped up in a burqa/chadoor.
That is how Muslims are. This is how they behave. They act this way in Stockholm, in Jakarta, in Kuala Lumpur, in Riyadh, and they act this way in Cairo.
Logan is typical of attractive, professional, PC-Multiculti bound women who wield considerable power in the West (her looks got her the career she has, basically, not much else). And who cannot conceive that among Muslims she is simply chattel to be violated with impunity. Among suburban professional Western men she rules, among Muslim men she is not even a human being.
PC makes you stupid. And among the stupidest are professional and attractive women in the West.
Logan's assault and ordeal were entirely predictable. That she needed a bodyguard in and of itself speaks to the inherent nature of Muslim men.
Logan's ordeal was akin to a surfer jumping into shark-infested waters after an attack, a skier transversing avalanche-prone slopes, or anything stupid and dangerous.
But her inherent Liberalism ("Muslims are good and kind and not icky White Beta Males who are the REAL bad guys") and PC-Multi-culti brainwashing made her ...
UNABLE TO COMPREHEND THE SIMPLEST DANGER.
And as more and more Muslims wash into the West, in Europe and America, more and more incidents like this will take place. Attractive White professional women who are powerful in the office and among Western men (based on their looks and female status) brought up short, tragically, by being fundamentally stupid about non-Western, non-White men.
PC makes you so stupid you suffer. So does Multi-culti idiocy. Real life is not a showing of AVATAR. Where all the bad guys are "evil White guys."
shiloh,
You really need to check you history more. The friend of the Saudi's was Averell Harriman who handled the Bush financials at his company Brown Brothers, Harriman on Wall St. It was a blind trust because Bush Sr was in government service. They miaght have been friends but the links were through Averell Harriman. Harriman ran for president as a Democrat and his widow (and the widow of a bunch of other very rich men) was Pamela Harriman who was the financial backer of Bubba. That is you link to the Saudi family and the Bush family.
a similar crowd that believed in psychologically raping their enemies by yelling shame curses, chanting in their faces and displays of power by drumming.
Similar to what took place here. Rest assured something significant is being revealed or discussed when Titus, Jeremy, AlphaLiberal and Shiloh show up and start spinning like Drudge's rotating red and blue gum-ball alert. With Garage finishing off the display by mistaking this for The Pain and Suffering Cafe and confusing the power of drumming with droning.
The words I most appreciated here today were Pogo's. Simple, direct, honest and sincere...
Shit. That's horrible. Can't even think about it
Am I the only one that remembers the mobs in Central Park? It might have been about 10 years ago. Something like 25 women doused in water, stripped of clothing, groped, etc...? Even that doesn't quite compare to the violence of this attack. But, this episode speaks as much to the mentality of mobs as it does to the culture of the host country.
"hmm, "we" went into Iraq to get a bad guy, why not Egypt, Iran, Libya, Somalia, Sudan etc.
Selective outrage by the right is always somewhat amusing."
But didn't Obama invade Libya, but not Syria or Iran?
I think one reason for this is that he doesn't have unlimited troops and resources, and has to plan out a long term strategy.
for example, Iraq is a special tactical place for a war on terror. It sucked in terrorists to a battle they eventually lose. It has a population somewhat capable of modernization into a prosperous nation. It's at least somewhat less radical, though clearly a Muslim nation. It's also part of a containment of Iran, theoretically. If you plot Bush's foreign policy on a map, there's a reason it all tends to surround Iran.
So is this hypocrisy? Nope. Not unless you're really unreasonable.
dick
There are many links re: The longgg Bush family history w/Saudi financiers/tycoons ie Bush43's (3) failed businesses were funded by Saudi oil $$$.
The Failed Corporate Record of
George W. Bush
Bush's Former Oil Company
Linked To bin Laden Family
The Bush-Saudi Connection
take care, blessings
One for the road ...
The Barreling Bushes
Four generations of the dynasty have chased profits through cozy ties with Mideast leaders, spinning webs of conflicts of interest
The sad truth is that this scene would play out in any Muslim-majority country as they all consider Western women nothing more than infidel whores. Furthermore, there is little difference between the views of the illiterate and the views of the educated elites in the Muslim world on this matter. Understand this or you understand nothing. By the way, I've traveled many times, often for weeks at a time, to Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, UAE, Bahrain, Qatar, Turkey, Indonesia, Bangladesh and the former Soviet Stans--all majority Islamic countries. The leftist media has kept you in the dark as to the true nature of these people and their diseased culture. Oh, and all you Muslim apologists: please spare me you simple-minded, myopic, anecdotal stories of the "Muslims you've met aren't like this at all, they’re just like us with families, and blah, blah, blah." You know not of what you speak. The sooner you "get it" the sooner the West can shore up our defenses against this barbaric hoard called Islam that is spreading like a deadly virus around the globe, unchecked, in fact, rooted on by liberals/leftists/socialists in the West.
Dick,
I think you mean New Bedford, MA, not Bedford. Two completely different places.
Horrible things happen in this country all the time. And sometimes the community rallies around the people that did horrible things.
Why is anyone talking about football in this post? Disgusting.
If you wrote about a topic that doesn't belong here, you need to get in here and delete your post now. Look for the trash can and hit it. This shouldn't be my job. Delete now and apologize.
Indeed Sixty Grit as yourself and Titus are special being the first (2) to childishly hijack this thread ...
and I have already apologized for my #1 AA obsessed juvenile pet TGI as he continues to embarrass himself!
Didn't something like this happen in central park a few years back? Its not just the religion I think
Here is the scariest fact of all:
Egypt is considered the most advanced and enlightened of all the Arab countries.
@Jennifer and Mark: The Puerto Rican gangs that went “wilding” through Central Park on the day of the Puerto Rican Day Parade 11 years ago were young gang members out doing what these lawless gangs always do—terrorize law-abiding citizens. The criminal behavior of gangs is widely known and understood in America. The behavior of those Puerto Ricans youth gangs was not supported, condoned, encouraged, tolerated or accepted in any way by the greater Puerto Rican community—in fact, quite the opposite—it was a great source of shame and anger among Puerto Ricans. By contrast, Muslims holy men and political leaders at all levels regularly denounce the decadence of the West, pointing to the “whorish” behavior of our “infidel” women as exhibit A in this, “the west is evil and must be destroyed” meme that permeates a vast swath if their cultural, religious and social lives. You would be appalled by the opinion and religious pages of any Arabic language newspaper. The primary importance of Islam and its “no exceptions” doctrinal teachings about the role of women cannot be understated. Here in America we simply can’t grasp the overwhelming influence of Islam on the everyday lives, philosophy, thinking and personal behavior of its adherents in the Muslim world. You could look at the most secluded, cultish, religious sect in America and probably find less actual religion doctrine displayed in their daily lives than with any run-of-the-mill, garden variety Muslim. Remember, in ALL Muslim majority countries if Sharia law is not the law, then Sharia still has a tremendous influence on the legal, cultural and social system. The treating of women as “property” is what Islam teaches and what Muslims do. Those 300 men who accosted Lara Logan were not part of a criminal gang out “wilding” or succumbing to “mob mentality” because they were caught up in the moment. They were acting out their true beliefs about decadent Western women and demonstrating the effects of what the “religion” of Islam has taught them all their lives.
The problem with saying it could happen in London or France is neglecting the fact that similar things do happen—in Muslim areas.
Do we get barbarity like that in the West? We do: But only when Western culture is rejected. I'm unaware of any time in Western history when gang-rape was A-OK.
Meade:
"Have you ever heard of a rape of this magnitude occurring in the USA?"
Yes. A number of times. The one that stands out is a Central Park assault.
Edutcher:
Alpha wishes everyone to ignore the fact, as he does, the standards in Islamic countries are different. The raped woman is guilty there, and presumed so.
I wish nothing of the sort and I said nothing of the sort.
I know a lot of these countries are backward (though I don't accept your premise and suspect it's wrong).
Edutcher:
He wants to do the value-neutral, non-judgmental, multi-culti dance.
I wish nothing of the sort and I said nothing of the sort.
Why don't you just go masturbate your strawman and leave me out of it, EWanker?
Do conservatives really believe that gang rape does not occur in the US?
It happens way, way too often right here. And, my point is that it reflects only on the perp's not all of the American people.
Yet Arab-hating conservatives blame all Arabs/muslims for the actions of these individuals (in a mob).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Central_Park_Jogger_case
Police: As many as 20 present at gang rape outside school dance http://articles.cnn.com/2009-10-27/justice/california.gang.rape.investigation_1_suspects-arrest-police?_s=PM:CRIME
Remember the Halliburton (KBR subsidiary) worker who was raped, then kept locked up in a container and then the GOP Senators REFUSED to hold Halliburton accountable? In Iraq?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jamie_Leigh_Jones
According to Jones, on July 28, 2005, several of her fellow KBR employees offered her a drink containing a date rape drug, of which she took two sips. While she was unconscious, the men then allegedly engaged in unprotected anal and vaginal gang-rape upon her. She was able to name one of her attackers based on his confession to her, but was unable to identify the others due to her unconsciousness. Further, the lawsuit filed by Jones' attorneys cites the following: "When she awoke the next morning still affected by the drug, she found her body naked and severely bruised, with lacerations to her vagina and anus, blood running down her leg, her breast implants ruptured, and her pectoral muscles torn – which would later require reconstructive surgery. Upon walking to the rest room, she passed out again."[5] Jones' account was confirmed by U.S. Army physician Jodi Schultz.[6] Schultz gave the rape kit she used to gather evidence from Jones to KBR/Halliburton security forces, after which the rape kit disappeared. It was recovered two years later, but missing crucial photographs and notes.
30 Republican Senators voted against an amendment holding contractors to account if they refuse to allow rape victims their day in court.
If you are, or have known, a woman who has served in uniform in the US Armed Forces, you know this is the tip of the iceberg:
The U.S. military's 'rape epidemic'
Current and former soldiers are suing the Pentagon, accusing it of failing to prevent rape within the military. Will this public protest make women in uniform safer?
Here come the usual gang of shitheads, trying to draw false, useless parallels between us and them.
No, assholes. We're better than them. Our culture is better then theirs in every way.
Pretty sad for you that you pathetic, slobbering, morally-blinkered excuses for Americans are blind to that.
There is no crime that these barbarians might commit that AlphaLiberal and others of his ilk will not make excuses for and condone by creating a moral equivalency that only exists in their perverted minds.
AlphaLiberal, Jeremy and the rest of the fellow travelers will send you to the camps and the ovens just as quickly as their Puppet Master George Soros did to his fellow Jews.
They are the grinning, leering, posturing face of the evil that is liberalism.
Find an evil in this world committed by the enemies of our nation and they will rush to defend it.
All love and good thoughts to Ms Logan. She is physically recovered, may her psychic recovery be swift and whole as well.
Perhaps the mob was simply engaging in an exercise of multidimentional storytelling, collaborating in a political narrative of their criticism of feminism?
I find it very empowering. Don't you?
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