१८ सप्टेंबर, २००७
"I've never liked Barry Manilow's music, but I've seen him on talk shows and think he is a really nice person."
I said back here. But now here he is backing out of an appearance on "The View" because he thinks Elisabeth Hasselbeck is "dangerous and offensive." Now, that's incredibly lame. I don't care, because I don't like his music, and I think the music is lame too, so it all makes sense to me. If he hadn't said mean things about Hasselbeck, I would have understood his backing out as not wanting to undercut his extreme niceness image. He doesn't want to be the guy he would look like if he got into a political debate with her. But he insulted her publicly, so that undercut his extreme niceness image. Stupid. That was the only thing I liked about him.
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That was indeed a poor choice of words and a fight not worth picking. It amazes me that people beg out of an engagement or commitment with just the worst possible choices of exit lines.
As to the entertainer..he came to a Tulsa perhaps 30 years ago when I played with the orchestra there and he was the perfect good guy performer..prepared, on time, demanding not for himself for the music....just a good person to work with from the orchestra's point of view...not to digress but Steve Allen was on that season as well and it was a lot like him...knew what he wanted, efficient, no fake, just the real deal.
All the lawyers who commented on the $1000/hr choke point...try buying a ticket to one of his shows if you didn't get it the first 10 minutes it went on sale. I've been trying to buy two good seats for a year to treat my wife to a concert (a real fan) and $1000 an hour would be a bargain.
It's his choice.
I don't happen to like his music but I would think the venue of the view would be good for his record sales. I think (maybe wrongly) that those viewers would be the type that would buy his music.
Lame, indeed.
Elisabeth Hasselbeck is surely at the top of EVERYONE's list for "dangerous and offensive." After all, rumor has it she's a Republican.
God save us all. There is a dangerous and offensive threat loose on the set of "The View."
It's nice to see The View stand up for one of its hosts in the face of a bigger female celebrity, I mean a celebrity for bigger females, I mean a bigger celebrity for females.
Do you mean you don't like "Mandy"? I'll bet you didn't like Liberace, either.
I write the songs that Elisabeth Hasselbeck can't sing
I write the songs of the View and special things
I write the songs that made Rosie O'Donnell cry
I write the songs, I write the songs
Dang! Now I can't get that stupid song out of my repetitious head.
I agree with HDH, just cancel it. No he's got to make a statement about why and its just so lame. "I'm afraid of her"
A delicate flower like Barry needs to be protected from points of view that differ from his own. Poor thing.
Dangerous and offensive? Elizabeth Hasselbeck? That has to be the funniset thing I've read in a while.
Then again, typical response from the Left. Don't engage in a discussion or debate, just dismiss differing viewpoints as offensive and hang around your own echo chamber.
You read about a genuinely good man like Will Rogers who, although a lifelong Democrat, was welcomed by all of the Presidents from Wilson to FDR, and then you read petty crap like this. We're all Americans, damnit. No one's born Democrat or Republican no more than they are born Star-Bellied Sneetches.
John Podhoretz posted this comment on The Corner (National Review Online's Blog). It made me laugh out loud:
If I were Elisabeth Hasselbeck, I would refuse to sit next to Barry Manilow. After all, "I Write the Songs" has officially been categorized as a war crime by the Fourth Geneva Convention. Here at home, even Wayne LaPierre supports legislation to declare "Mandy" an assault weapon deserving of a complete ban. This is not to say that Manilow hasn't been of service to his country, albeit inadvertently. Unconfirmed reports claim that Abu Zubaydah would not break, even with a bullet in his groin, until they played 15 seconds of "I Can't Smile Without You," whereupon he cried like a little girl.
Wow, I didn't realize how tough Elizabeth was. Even with Babs, Joy, and Whoppi on his side, Barry was still afraid of her "right-wing extremist" views.
I wonder if Barry knows anyone who voted for George Bush?
P.S. - I hate his music.
This falls in the "Shut up and Sing" category.
I'd say Barry is a weenie, but that would really be unfair to weenies.
He's afraid of her?
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
I agree with the "shut up and sing" bit.
For *all* singers and actors.
I've thought for a while now that the seemingly compulsive need to use fame as a social/political platform reflects a genuine disdain for the craft itself, for singing or acting. As though it's necessary if one is a singer or actor to combat the worthlessness of the profession by doing some "good" in the world.
Entertainment for its own sake is valuable. I suppose if someone doesn't believe that they don't mind alienating fully half of their potential audience in their quest for relevance.
He appeared before on the View. What's changed since then? Is this his own little way of saying he's sympatico with Rosie?
When I heard about this, the first thing I thought was, "Gawd, he's still alive?" I knew Botox got rid of wrinkles; I just didn't realize it was a preservative.
Petty sentiments? Yeah, well, I never liked his music in the first place--far, far too sappy for me, the same reason I don't particularly care for Barbra or Celia.
Also, years ago when he had a concert in Boise (probably the same tour hdhouse speaks of), he was quite upset because the mayor hadn't come to meet him at the airport. He was "Barry Manilow," after all, and the mayor should have been thrilled to have him grace that little Podunk.
Barry Manilow.
Downtownlad.
These folks are the living, breathing embodiment of relentless bigotry and narrow mindedness.
Manilow's choice of words was very foolish, particularly because, as you said, he normally seems like such a nice man, and, more than that, a genuinely good sport (think of his appearance on the Colbert Report.)
Having said that, Elizabeth Hasselbeck is probably the most annoying person on television. I've only watched a couple of episodes of The View, but she injects her religious beliefs into otherwise apolitical discussions and flies off the handle when anybody disagrees with her. Plus, she's a 100-pound blonde who's 17 years of Catholic education and art history degree trained her well for her intellectually taxing career accomplishments in life include marrying a rich football player and intellectually taxing career of marrying rich football players, appearing on reality shows and waxing political to an audience of bored housewives. She's a winner in my book!
Once again, HD House hits the nail on the head. Aside: I see that you (and the lawyers) are serious about that $1000 - Wow! Had no idea - thought he had sort of disappeared from sight (and thus large fees) myself, so was VERY surprised when I saw this story on Yahoo.
Note to Wade: great first paragraph but the second puts you into la-la land in my book (not that you care about that). Just an observation about the tendency of left and right fringes to go completely over-the-top in their personal demonization of otherwise relatively insignificant dissenters. Unfortunately, folks like you, on the right and left, are driving the political debate in this conuntry. Pity.
At The View show
liberal nirvana
The hottest spot north of Havana
At The View show
fem urbana
Bitchin’ and passion
Were always the fashion
At the The View
They fell in loathe...
I see now that I made a typo in my second paragraph. Oops!
I wouldn't have a problem with Elizabeth Hasselbeck if she was just a talk-show host. When she's given discretion to interject her politics (which are divisive, even if you agree with them) into her otherwise apolitical tv shows, then she's sort of asking for certain types of criticism, isn't she?
My second paragraph was supposed to read:
"Having said that, Elizabeth Hasselbeck is probably the most annoying person on television. I've only watched a couple of episodes of The View, but she injects her religious beliefs into otherwise apolitical discussions and flies off the handle when anybody disagrees with her. She's a 100-pound blonde who's 17 years of Catholic education and art history degree trained her well for her intellectually taxing career, whose accomplishments include marrying a rich football player, appearing on reality shows, and waxing political to an audience of bored housewives. She's a winner in my book!"
When she's given discretion to interject her politics (which are divisive, even if you agree with them) into her otherwise apolitical tv shows, then she's sort of asking for certain types of criticism, isn't she?
I suppose but I also remember that happening to people like Tim Robbins, Sean Penn, Danny Glover, the Dixie Chicks et al, and we were told such criticism was bad for America as it had a 'chilling effect' of dissent.
Considering I never cared for Barry Manilow (always thought his groupies were the 50-60 something ladies) his views are as relevant to me as his music.
Apolitical TV shows such as... The View?
Uhhhhhh... yeah.
Wade, your comment is quite sexist.
Nope, its not. Your comment, however, is a blatant attempt to suck me into your so-called vortex.
There are plenty of equally worthless guys on tv, and plenty of equally worthless guys who sit at home watching them. However, Hasselbeck is a woman and her audience is almost entirely women, all of whom have to be home in the middle of the day. You don't watch The View if there is anything else intereting on tv, you don't watch it if you're a man, and you don't watch it if you are at work or otherwise occupied between 11am and noon on weekdays. Hence, my 'bored housewives' comment is accurate. Oh wait - I forgot to include bored retired people.
Jane, you are a gem. A perfectly witty, acerbic commentary on the banality of both the show and Manilow.
Best laugh of the week so far.
I've been laughing at myself for the past few days so thanks for that, Lee David :)
Of course, it's only Tuesday.
Wade, I'm not sure it's "bored housewives" so much as the forty words in the sentence prior to that. I could be wrong.
Wade, I won't speak for Prof. Althouse, but I found your comment to be sexist too, and the part that you defend is not the part that bothered me.
Please explain how it is remotely relevant that Elizabeth Hasselbeck is a) 100 lbs, or b) a blonde. You list those statistics in a way that implies that they lower her credibility in your eyes (along with the art degree and Catholic education). And that insinuation, in my book, is sexist.
If what Wade says about Hasselbeck is true, then she seems to have had a pretty charmed life so far. Its easy to spout off moral platitudes when you've been told your whole life that it is what a nice Catholic girl is supposed to do, but, as a listener, its hard to take moral guidance from somebody who has no moral authority. Who is she to tell anybody else how to live their life? Did her faith see her through the entirely fictional hardships which befall the cast members of Survivor?
Seattle Steve, do you realize what a raging bigot you sound like? I'm guessing you have to, but just like Archie Bunker or your average Klansman, it's not bad bigotry if you're aiming it at those subhumans, right?
Do you think through these statements before making them, or do you simply default into dehumanizing the "other"?
I would be curious if Wade would consider his own political views divisive? If not, how would he handle things if his job put him in a group of 3-4 other people who constantly brought up their politics and who politics were 180- degrees opposed from his own?
Seattle Steve: If what Wade says about Hasselbeck is true, then she seems to have had a pretty charmed life so far. Its easy to spout off moral platitudes when you've been told your whole life that it is what a nice Catholic girl is supposed to do, but, as a listener, its hard to take moral guidance from somebody who has no moral authority. Who is she to tell anybody else how to live their life? Did her faith see her through the entirely fictional hardships which befall the cast members of Survivor?
Here's an idea: what if adhering to a set of moral and ethical precepts that's stood the test of many millenia (taking the sum of Judeo-Christian moral and ethical education as an example) helps avoid hardship in the first place? A whacky idea, eh? Yet there are Christian insurance companies such as Thrivent Financial for Lutherans whose actuarial statistics demonstrate that their Lutheran members are a better insurance risk than average, and their premiums reflect that fact. Perhaps Ms. Hasselbeck is just a Catholic example instead of a Lutheran one.
That's one way of looking at it. Here's the other way: she is 30 years old. She was a kid or in college for 22 of those years and has been rich and famous through no avchievement of her own for the past seven years. She's had a charmed life and seems to be unable to understand how people who have not fail to live up to her arbitrary standards.
Plus, she's a 100-pound blonde who's 17 years of Catholic education and art history degree trained her well for her intellectually taxing career accomplishments in life include marrying a rich football player and intellectually taxing career of marrying rich football players, appearing on reality shows and waxing political to an audience of bored housewives
IIRC (from back when she was on Survivor), Elizabeth had a job w/ Reebok prior to her reality show appearance (where she probably did put some of that artistic education to work). Also, she married Tim Hasslebeck, the journeyman QB and not the rich quarterback (Tim's brother Matt).
Could care less about the View, since I'm not about to tape it while I'm at work, but I like that it has someone willing to present a religious, conservative POV.
If just her being there provokes actual dialogue on political issues, I'm all for it.
Wade, you don't like her and her views, fine. But save us the rationale. I don't like Joy Behar and her views, but I don't need a Wikipedia explanation for it.
"people who have not fail to live up to her arbitrary standards."
I'm not sure you can describe them as arbitrary.
Maybe some might seem then as unrealistic, but I don't think arbitrary is the right word. What would be an example of what you view as a arbitrary standard she believes in?
I know who he is - Matt Hasselbeck plays for Seattle! Tim Hasselbeck has still, in six seasons, managed to earn several million dollars in salary. That's pretty rich by my standards. Furthermore, a significant reason she was chosen to be in a reality show was because of her last name - that really matters when it comes to getting men to watch those shows; why do you think they always cast a football or basketball player on Dancing With the Stars?
How did she get where she is today? Well, she's on The View because she was on Survivor. She got onto Survivor because she is pretty and blonde and married to a member of one of the most famous football-playing families in America.
"She got onto Survivor because she is pretty and blonde and married to a member of one of the most famous football-playing families in America."
Wasn't she on one of the early one's, back when they had real people? Also, she wasn't married when she did survivor.
Elisabeth Filarski did not marry Tim until a year after her Survivor experience. So please revise your statement.
most famous football-playing families in America
?? Don, Matt and Tim. Right up there with Bob and Brian, Marion Jr and Marion III, Ron and Shawn, Rhonde and Tiki. That had to impress those "Viewers"
Please, please stop arguing
Ms. Hasselbeck's case. There is simply no way that she can possibly hope to come close to the staggering intellect and impeccable credentials of Joy Behar.
Interjecting her political views into an apolitical show? How is what Elizabeth is doing any different from Rosie, Joy, or Whoopi pontificating? How does being a has-been or never been comedienne grant them higher insight into foreign or domestic issues?
So you're saying she rode her husband's coattails. Does this mean you won't vote Hillary!
Also Barbara Walters first came to prominence due to her first marriage to Bronko Nagurski
Trooper, that is a horrible slur towards a beloved icon. You need to apologize to the memory of the late Bronko Nagurski.
Look, I'm sane and work for a living, so I don't watch The View. But let me know as soon as Whoopi Goldberg, Barbara Walters, Sandra Bernhardt, Jill Clayburgh, Dorothy Hamill, or any of the other washed-up celebrities they roll out onto that set starts to cry on the set because an unpleasant topic (for instance, partial-birth abortion) is raised.
I'm sure she took her studies at Boston College seriously, though, because she did after all say that the morning-after pill is akin to leaving a child out in the wilderness to die. That's pretty scientific, I bet she must have taken some reproductive biology electives in addition to her art history courses.
Wade, your religious and moral viewpoints are different than hers. We get it. We got it the first time you pointed it out. However, when you are ridiculing her opinion's on something, you are also ridiculing the millions of people who agree with her. Which is why she is on the show. The question is, why is one person vs everyone else on the show, such a threat to you. Plus you say you don't watch it. So who cares she is on there?
She was a kid or in college for 22 of those years and has been rich and famous through no avchievement of her own for the past seven years.
Please. You can say that for most of the entertainment industry including overpaid athletes who make millions to throw or hit a ball.
Has no one added the crucial issue here: that a judge is making people convicted of noise violations sit trapped for an hour in a room and listen to Barry Manilow emanating loudly from little boom box?
That's justice, man.
...When she's given discretion to interject her politics (which are divisive, even if you agree with them) into her otherwise apolitical tv shows...
I'm literally rolling on the floor laughing.
Of course, I figured by the end of this sentence, the commenter was speaking of Rosie, right? I mean, how could one say anything like this about anyone other than Rosie, right?
I mean, come on.
Another case of the 15 Minute Mutt Blog Comment (15MMBC), right?
People on the right shouldn't interject their views. It's divisive.
Diversity is the greatest good. Divisiveness is the greatest evil.
It's a fine line, people. A fine line.
Ah yes, diversity. The condition where everyone is valued for holding the identical liberal viewpoint.
Diversity = reflexive bumper-sticker sloganeering whereby all manner of ethnic and sexual status and social deviancy and personal perversions are celebrated, for as long as they are loyally associated with the Left or Democrat Party. Otherwise, No Diversity For You!
"At The View show
liberal nirvana
The hottest spot north of Havana
At The View show
fem urbana
Bitchin’ and passion
Were always the fashion
At the The View
They fell in loathe..."
Damn that was good! I vote for Jane to replace that vapid airhead Hassel-pain-in-the-neck. I'm only sorry that Rosie didn't wallop her one (or wrestle her to the ground and sit on her) when she had the chance. I also wish that she'd dye her hair black; she helps perpetuate negative stereotypes about blonds.
You think YOU dislike Barry Manilow?
I made constant fun of him and his music throughout the 70's and 80's.
Imagine my surprise when I saw my secretary of 4 years standing next to Barry Manilow on a segment of the TV show "20/20"! She was the President of his largest fan club! A secret she kept from me for all those years! While I mocked him when he was on the radio!
The next day, I demanded pennance for the secret: Tickets for my wife and her best friend to his next LA area concert and a meet and greet with Barry afterwards. My secretary was only too glad to comply. I was a hero to my wife, and sadly, embarrassed to know that I was the only person in my 320 employee business who didn't know about my secretary's passion for La Manilow.
I did cut out the snide remarks about him around the office, though.
He was pretty good on the Cobert Report last night.
How can you not like Elisabeth Hasselbeck? It's not like she's overbearing. She gives her opinion freely like anyone else, but she respects others. Sorry if the little Republican doesn't let herself be trampled with loud talk and a bullying agenda. And she speaks out on the war only when a discussion ensues.
She and Manilow are both nice people. So what's this pre-emptive verbal strike on her? Hasselbeck has been on there before, singing onstage with him with the girls, when he's visited before. And she's always been up front about her views on the war and being conservative. So the Rosie mess is all that could have changed his opinion of her. So it's obviously a show of loyalty for Rosie, about which he should be up front.
As far as her credentials are concerned: Hasselbeck graduated Boston College, was a softball captain, was a professional footwear designer, went on Survivor and was in the top 4, became a TV fashion show host, happily married a pro football player, now co-hosts the View, and is a mother of one with another on the way. For fun, she does charity work for the Breast Cancer Foundation.
I think she's quite accomplished and intelligent, and an excellent role model for any young woman. How can people dislike her for expressing a conservative viewpoint as staunchly as liberals do? So, basically, people hate her for having a not-so-bad/hard upbringing it all and playing up her assets to achieve her full potential.
If that's so, then why is no one ragging on Kelly Ripa? She's just as outspoken and opinionated and privileged (and I like her just as well). And she ALSO took on Rosie once...and won.
It could only be because Elisabeth won't participate in bashing Bush and the Republican party on a liberal-dominated show.
Participating on a show like Survivor is one of the lowest and most degrading things a person can do. If conservatives consider a former star of a reality show like that to be a role model for "any young woman," then I don't know what to say, other than that I was no part of that culture.
When have being picked based on your looks to host a tv show come to be considered an accomplishment? When did starring in a reality show come to be considered an accomplishment? Any by whom - excluding the bizarre sub-set of women who judge each other based on the fame and/or success of their husband - is marrying a professional football player considered an accomplishment?
Why, that's right, WG. TVdom is a meritocracy based on the sound logic and academic, intellectual, feminist accomplishments of its stars and programming. Hasselbeck is an objectionable exception to the small screen Virtue rule.
Wade Garrett said...
Participating on a show like Survivor is one of the lowest and most degrading things a person can do.
Mr. Garrett, are you kidding? To include Survivor with the other reality shows is a mistake. I'll agree that reality TV is a joke, but Survivor, especially the first ones, is a show requiring fitness, skill, intelligence, emotional balance, athleticism, endurance, and discipline. Elisabeth came out of it with her character intact, having never compromised her integrity and having the respect of her fellow players. Who wouldn't say she's a role model? I'd say she's a model feminist in the most ladylike way.
Now, trash like The Real World, The Bachelor, and reality TV where people can't even get along in even the best conditions -- with trash-talking, emotional outbursts, and immature behavior -- I'll wholeheartedly agree. But as for Survivor, it's an exception.
And to say that just because a woman gets a job because of her looks after already proving herself sounds chauvinistic on your part. And while marrying a pro player is not in itself an accomplishment, managing to stay happily married under the pressure of publicity and the spotlights of both professional careers IS indeed a major accomplishment. Marriage is a challenge even for folks who don't face constant scrutiny. So, please, spare the condescension and give the woman at least some credit.
And, Wade, with all due respect, does this post from your blog -- http://commonsensedancing.blogspot.com/2007/09/by-demand-more-victoria-marshman.html -- more reflect what you value in a real woman? I mean, how could Elisabeth compare to those "accomplished" women?
Galvanized - I have no idea what you are even accusing me of. Stop rambling.
I'm, uh, glad to hear that Elizabeth Hasselbeck came out of an entirely fictional, made-up, and stage-managed reality show with her character intact. She must be so proud of herself!
Sorry if I offended, Wade, as I meant "with all due respect." And you did open the dialogue on me. I was not accusing but just noting a seeming contradiction. I just thought that if a beautiful Yalee deserved complimentary recognition in a post on your own blog, and for a show based purely on her looks, that your comments about Elisabeth rolling into a job on her looks and lacking accomplishment seemed somewhat hypocritical. But if you obviously believe that women deserve credit based only on beauty rather than their minds -- seen not heard -- then I guess that's your choice. No hard feelings.
Once again, you've missed the entire point. First of all, I'm not turning to any of the candidates on America's Top Model for inspiration or for moral guidance or leadership anytime soon. They are on an entertainment show, and this show might be entertaining, because I have a rooting interest in one of the contestants because she went to my college and is studying what I studied. If the contestants interrupt their modeling to start spouting superstitious religion and conservative politics at me, then I will change the channel immediately.
Secondly, modeling - though not intellectually challenging - is a skill set and an actual profession, unlike Survivor, which is nothing more than a documentary about an entirely staged set of events.
Thirdly, it is not a contradiction to love and value intelligent, insightful women and dislike Elizabeth Hasselbeck at the same time, because I consider her to be neither intelligent nor insightful.
Fourthly, seen but not heard? Please.
Wow, I never realized that Barry Manilow was such an IDIOT! Too afraid to go up against Elisabeth Hasselbeck and defend his beliefs? Obviously because he can't. I almost went and threw away all my Barry Manilow cd's, but then I realized I'd be stooping to his level of maturity.
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