Said the lawyer for Q’orianka Kilcher, quoted in "James Cameron stole my face, actress claims/Q’orianka Kilcher, who is of indigenous Peruvian descent, is suing the director, alleging that he and Disney violated her rights for the blockbuster franchise" (London Times).
Kilcher claimed that Cameron had told her at an event in 2010, one year after Avatar’s release: “I’ve admired your activism work in the Amazon.” She said he later gifted her a signed one-off sketch of the Avatar character with a handwritten note that read: “Your beauty was my early inspiration for Neytiri. Too bad you were shooting another movie. Next time.”
"Avatar" is the highest-grossing movie of all time, so you can see how Kilcher must feel that she's owed something or that Cameron will be persuaded to give her more than that sketch and the compliment. That "Too bad/Next time" must hurt her! And it must hurt him now to be accused of making a movie "that presented itself as sympathetic to indigenous struggles, all while silently exploiting a real indigenous youth behind the scenes."
The law in question is California’s right of publicity law. Here's the text.
I'm giving this my "lawsuits I hope will fail" tag, but I could be talked out of it.
পোস্টগুলি
৬৬টি মন্তব্য:
Now, that's interesting. I never knew that inspiration was exploitation. Put Christianity in a whole different light, doesn't it?
Well if Cameron is a decent person he will just settle out of court. Just give her 500K. He can afford it. But y'know how billionaires or multi-zillionaires are. They'll stiff a waitress out of a $2 dollar tip if they could.
So, I hope it succeeds although that's not based on the law, just the power relationship.
The Avatar looks a lot more like Cameron Diaz than this sue-happy grifter.
Yah, me too. Not a fan of showing up with your hand out after the winners and losers have been sorted. Egregious exploitation. Maybe second only to the offensive term 'stakeholders'...
Consider this an update to the naked baby on Nivana's "Nevermind" album. He later replicated the cover as an adult, used it for self-promotion, and then eventually sued for "exploitation and child pr0ngraphy." He lost.
The attempts to gold mine the wealthy never end.
https://www.npr.org/2022/01/04/1070159593/nirvana-nevermind-album-cover-lawsuit-dismissed
Not sure I care. If what she says is true - then go for it.
I detest that movie. It's another leftwing climate religion cult movie.
"Well if Cameron is a decent person he will just settle out of court. Just give her 500K. He can afford it...."
Yeah, the question is what's the right amount. 500K?
I think the statute is about stealing the "publicity" value of the person, like if you were to put a drawing of Elvis on some product. Read the statute and the cases and tell me whether an unknown person is considered to have publicity value within the meaning of that statute.
She's Jewel's cousin, and the granddaughter of Yul Kilcher, a Swiss emigre who homesteaded near Homer, Alaska. I met Yul when an organized backpacking/kayaking trip I went on used his homestead as a base camp.
None of which has anything to do with the case. Regarding that: Cameron said her lower face was the inspiration for the character's (because the upper face has two huge eyes and a massive forehead, and doesn't look like any human's). That's rather thin gruel.
Ms Kilcher herself was prosecuted, in California of all places, for workers-comp fraud, because she hurt herself on one movie but collected disability while working on the next one. The charges were ultimately dropped - probably when someone realized "hey, we don't lock people up for program fraud! Our jobs depend on program fraud!"
So you would think she understands that people can come pretty close to violating the law without actually doing so, or technically violate it in a de-minimis way. CC, JSM
No good deed goes unpunished.
California, like virtually all states, has a broad carve out for the use of name or likeness in entertainment or expressive works.
3344d, 3341.1a2
Silly
From the statute: "In addition, in any action brought under this section, the person who violated the section shall be liable to the injured party or parties in an amount equal to the greater of seven hundred fifty dollars ($750) or the actual damages suffered by them as a result of the unauthorized use."
Also, ref the publicity value: all the armies of nerds with photo-recognition software didn't notice, over all these years? Where's the publicity? She would be hard-pressed to find a single person who bought a ticket, PPV fee, DVD, or T-shirt based on "the blue girl's lower face," let alone "omfg, that's Qiana Kilcher's chin!!!!! Squeee!!! I am literally dying rn!" CC, JSM
There is a finite degree of facial variability in the diversity of humanity. Lawsuits that are illogical on the face of the evidence.
Pop music had the "seven notes" rule, whereby one could be sued if the melody was identical for a long sequence. Plenty of bands/songs went close to the edge and duplicated 3, 4, or 5 notes without getting into trouble (John Fogerty won in court). Some did get into trouble and lost in court (e.g., "I Want a New Drug" and "Ghostbusters").
Duplicating half of a face? First, human females all have mouths and chins. Billions have long straight dark hair too. Second, if one is going to address "native tribes" a la Avatar, Earth examples include many in the Americas, South Asia, and Africa. This face resembles the Americas and Asia -- still millions of human females. Third, the cheekbones of the CGI blue "mask face" are very different.
This is just about the mouth and chin? But, Kilcher is slack-jawed in the linked photo. Probably not the best example to use. I'd never mistake one for the other.
I’d like to know a little more about what it means that he “took the unique biometric features and …. ran them through an industrial production process.” If he literally started with a picture of her specifically and fed it into a computer program that allowed him to make changes directly to that photo until he had what he wanted (something easy today, but I’m not sure about then), I have at least a little sympathy for the suit. If it’s something more like he looked at a photo and made concept drawings that may have some connection to what he saw in the photo, that’s BS. Even more BS if he did this with multiple photos including but not limited to hers.
I can’t help but suspect that such unclear wording was chosen on purpose.
Hey wait a minute, doesn't she have one of those sculpted Hollywood faces that was covered a few days ago, thinner nose, plumped up lips? How did Cameron exploit something she deliberately altered herself as a matter of preference? Sorry, ma'am but there is no resemblance whatsoever. Trying to pay for more 'work'?
I just googled her image. Nope, she does not look Neytiri.
“I think the statute is about stealing the "publicity" value of the person, like if you were to put a drawing of Elvis on some product.”
The New England Patriots have a drawing of Elvis on their helmets.
So, $750 is the amount or damages if greater. I'm not sure what amount in Damages she's asking for.
Alex Jones was ordered to pay $1,500 million dollars for "defamation and emotional distress" to the families of Sandy Hook. And the avatar movies have made $5,000 million.
So, 500K seems like a reasonable amount in light of that.
If cameron was smart, he'd get some good publicity by saying "Sorry I overlooked you. Here's 500K. I always support indigious peoples, that's why i made the movies"
I predict they will settle and she will get $50m, which now won't go to deep-sea research.
Neytiri doesn't resemble Kilcher in any identifiable way. As an aspiring actress, she benefits more from the association with Cameron, then he does from her.
Go to court to see if there is enough resemblance. If she loses, make her return the a signed and unique Avatar sketch and note that Cameron graciously gave her.
Off topic: In the photo of Cameron - he’s pictured with Oona Chaplain - Charlie Chaplain’s granddaughter.
That is why in my book of bios I am planning to use AI generated cartoons instead of pics of actual people. Cartoons can't sue.
Can they?
(Just completed 2 more this morning, on Ole Evinrude and the Johnson brothers of outboard fame. Only 34 to go!)
John Henry
How does this interface with NIL [name, image, likeness in college sport, especially when used without cotract or compensation ??
It's an expanded feminine modesty thing, covering anything that women use to make themselves "attractive." You have to pay for it if you use it.
The second thread in a row with unnecessary apostrophes...Obviously a distraction from the world coming to an end because the Strait of Hormuz isn't open.
"The New England Patriots have a drawing of Elvis on their helmets."
So do the Florida State Seminoles
Kahn!!! Cameron!!! Uh, AI!!!
Could be bullshit. From Grok:
The character was designed with performance capture in mind, so the team started with a life cast (a physical mold) of Zoe Saldaña’s face.
Concept artist Joseph C. Pepe (and others) went through many iterations to create the Na’vi look (larger eyes, different proportions, blue skin, stripes, etc.).
They specifically retained the lower part of her face (from just under the nose to the chin, including the lips and mandible) to help anchor and scale the facial performance capture markers. This preserved recognizable human expressions and proportions from Zoe’s performance.
Smilin' Jack--they had to change to Flying Elvis because this guy threatened to sue:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pat_Patriot
@Gusty Winds ---
Per your comment I searched for "Zoe Saldana Avatar" -- the photos include many side-by-side comparisons. Blue face is much more like Zoe than Kilcher. The resemblance goes far beyond the mouth and chin, and you can see Zoe through the makeup.
Throw out this lawsuit.
Enigma--not only that, Zoe Saldana was the voice of the character. What a bullshit lawsuit.
The Avatar character has an incredibly broad nose, QK does not. It's one of the most striking features of that Avatar face; unlike actual human noses, it does not taper from broad at the base to narrow where it meets the forehead. Also, huge forehead, enormous eyes, and fully-deployed bat ears; again, QK does not. I guess if you just count features (lips, nose, eyes, ears, forehead, cheeks, etc.), they each have the same numbers of features and general layout, but rather differently expressed.
So, I'd call BS on this claim. "Inspired by" ≠ "used." Or else Hollywood is in a lot of trouble!
“"Avatar" is the highest-grossing movie of all time, so you can see how Kilcher must feel that she's owed something….”
I don’t see it. Cameron shouldn’t give her a nickel, and should countersue for defamation or something. Bullshit like this should be discouraged.
Alita battle angel is probably a closer match
"...A movie "that presented itself as sympathetic to indigenous struggles."
More like infantilizes them and makes them too perfect to be believable.
QK should take her lawsuit to Canada, where the "First Nations" seem destined to win whatever preposterous BS lawsuit they file.
Yeah, I'm talking about you, Cowichans! "My ancestors used to travel from home on Vancouver Island, to Richmond, BC, about a hundred miles, every summer, to fish on its waters and camp on its shore. So we own that land now!" Of course you do!
When I was a kid I thought I looked like the ‘P’ in PBS. Can I sue public television?
I'm with the boss and most commenters: no case here. Of course, IANAL, much less a professional one, so what do I know about it?
“Your beauty was my early inspiration for Neytiri."
Seems like a pretty solid admission-against-interests.
The Avatar character looks nothing like the “inspired” real world woman. The “inspiration” is an opinion that can be checked and challenged.
Dictionary: “Inspiration is the feeling of enthusiasm or the mental stimulation that triggers creative ideas, actions, or emotions. It is often described as a force that motivates someone to create, achieve, or improve. Key facets include "breathing life into" someone (from its Latin origin) and the sudden, insightful spark of a new idea.”
An inspiration is an inanimate element in the mind of the inspired person.
Guarantee this is one of those cases where the lawyer contacts the person and offers to sue, no charge unless we win.
Free link with pics.
Yeah thats pretty lame
She contributed nothing to the success of Avatar. She is a gold digger who deserves nothing from Avatar or James Cameron.
Yes, lawsuits I hope would fail. It's success would be a disaster; a gold mine for gold diggers.
I've never seen Avatar, but the blue woman looks like Zoe Saldana, right? She played her in the movie.
Let’s say for the sake of argument that victim survivors could sue the dog that told David Berkowitz (Son of Sam) to kill. Can you see where things could devolve into, once that kind of reasoning allowed to be presented as a tort claim?
“She said he later gifted her a signed one-off sketch of the Avatar character with a handwritten note that read: “Your beauty was my early inspiration for Neytiri. Too bad you were shooting another movie. Next time.”
Note to self: Never put a pickup line in writing.
Is an indefinite aesthetic inspiration actionable?
It's an Iran-Iraq war, you want both sides to lose
If female appearance as "inspiration" was legally actionable, every male who had a twinkle in his eye, who asked out a woman, or who wrote a sappy love song would be in court.
Quoting Chicago circa 1984:
You know our love was meant to be
The kind of love that lasts forever
And I want you here with me
From tonight until the end of time
You should know, everywhere I go
Always on my mind, in my heart
In my soul, baby
You're the meaning in my life
You're the inspiration
You bring feeling to my life
You're the inspiration
...
14-year-old indigenous girl...
He can't pound the facts, he can't pound the law, so he's pounding the table.
And then there is the question of "injury". How is not getting picked for a movie role an "injury"?
I could see the reverse being more of a substantive claim. Think of all the great actors who were chosen for terrible movies.
I put ai on the case :
Al Pacino in Jack and Jill (2011)
Michael Caine in Jaws: The Revenge (1987)
Jeremy Irons in Dungeons & Dragons (2000)
Halle Berry in Catwoman (2004)
Robert De Niro in The Adventures of Rocky and Bullwinkle (2000)
Then again, it could be argued, some of these movies were terrible because the actors were terrible.
I guess with Blake Lively settling for nothing; Hollywood needs another lawsuit to discuss. I imagine the diminished audience for Avatar will be most alarmed by the news that capitalists are exploiting indigenous people, as that is the premise of the movies. The damage from the lawsuit announcement will be in the millions.
That last required blackmail perhaps the hailey berry one
"Quoting Chicago circa 1984:"
The WORST of CTA's hits.
Michael Caine in Jaws: The Revenge (1987)
"I've never seen the movie, but I have seen the house it built."
- Michael Caine
tim maguire: "a gold mine for gold diggers."
I aint sayin she a gold digger/But she look nuthin like that blue character....CC, JSM
While I hope the lawsuit fails, I still think James Cameron should be drawn and quartered for creating Avatar in the first place- it is literally the worst 3 hour movie I have seen and will ever see.
If I had been alone at the theater that day, I would have left after the first hour. By the middle of the 3rd hour I was scratching into the seat in front of me, "NO FUN, NOT WORTH IT!!”
Were they Q’orianka's features or the generic features of a 14 year old indigenous girl? I wonder about "biometrics" since Q’orianka looks a little different in different photos. In some pictures the "indigenous" features are very noticeable. In others -- not so much. And how does the avatar compare to Zoe Saldana or other actresses who read for the role?
Lesson: never put in writing that someone was you inspiration.
@Yancey Ward --
Avatar was advanced CGI technology in search of a plot. Also see Star Wars: The Phantom Menace. Cameron rehashed the most obvious green natives-vs.-colonials content ever made. He literally used the cliched tech joke "unobtainium" as the mined mineral.
Pour a bunch of eye-popping video game environments and screen saver art into a big pot and call it a movie.
I rented avatar for a 1.50 from blockbuster i overpaid
This makes me think of the computer generated composite images of women from different countries based on thousands of samples. The blending averages them and makes them all hot, because they are more symmetrical. But I found that the UK girls were hottest, it’s probably in my dna.
I consider the person the equivalent of an artists model. Was Mona Lisa paid by the hour or as a percent of sales? I guess the judge needs to decide that. But the law will rule as our Hostess says.
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