That happened at yesterday's White House Press Briefing. Press Secretary Karoline Leavitt answered:
"I think the president was serious. I think president wants to get to heaven as I hope we all do in this room as well."
Trump's quote was the title of yesterday's post: "I want to get to heaven if possible. I'm hearing I'm not doing well. I hear I'm at the bottom of the totem pole. If I can get to heaven, this will be one of the reasons." Video of Trump saying all that at the link.
Was he serious? The question is how serious?
Was Mary Margaret Olohan serious — seriously hoping that he was serious?
I tend to think yes. She's at The Daily Wire. At Instagram, she calls herself Catholic. She stuck her neck out to ask the question, and she seemed to want to delve, at least a little, into the subject of God and peacemaking.Was Karoline Leavitt serious? She wears that cross around her neck. You can see the text of her answer, but if you watch the video, you'll see she's very crisp and perky, giving one of those you-can't-trick-me answers and moving right along. That was smart and professional.
But I really want to talk about the role of religious beliefs, expressed honestly, in a peacemaking conversation. In the comments on yesterday's post, I asked: "In the 3 hours when Trump and Putin spoke to each other, do you think they talked seriously about religious beliefs?"
Did they? Should they? There are 3 hours. How real does it get in 3 hours?
I noticed that when Putin first arrived in Alaska, he connected what he was doing to religion, to Russian religion. From the transcript of his remarks: "Alaska has to do with our common heritage, common history between Russia and the U.S., and many positive events have to do with that territory. Still, there is tremendous cultural heritage, back from the Russian America, for example, Orthodox churches...."
There are Russian Orthodox churches in Alaska — left from the Russian colonial days. "That territory" was once Russia's, and now the war is over territory that Putin believes — sincerely? — is still Russia's. Did the 2 men, in 3 hours, not talk about beliefs?
পোস্টগুলি
২৪৩টি মন্তব্য:
243 এর 1 – থেকে 200 আরও নতুন» সবচেয়ে নতুন»How dare he. Heaven is for ... the Adam Schitt tru-believers.
Impeach!
In Ye Olden Days, i.e. before America, pretty much no seperation of church and state. And if your leader was no good, it was a sign God wasn't real thrilled with your country.
On the plus side, God held the king responsible, not you. So it wasn't all bad: you could blame the King when you face God after you die. Now? You are on your own, and you are punished for your own sins and cannot weasel out by saying the King made you do it.
Trump may have given the afterlife considerable thought after avoiding it by an inch when the bullet nicked his ear instead of splattering his brains.
Hasn't Putin made a bit of hay by positioning Russia as the Christian alternative to the godless amoral LGBT loving west which is pretty much Sodom and Gomorrah?
And quite clearly, that said godless amoral LGBT loving west... hates Trump with a white hot anger. So, maybe Putin would be curious to know whether Trump really is that decadent playboy the left accuses him of being. Not that Putin would care, I think: Putin likes the ladies too, I believe. And isn't going to let a little thing like age or marital status interfere with that.
A 3 hour meeting is FOREVER in the business world.
He's simply setting out a position knowing that the Oppositional Defiance Disorder Democrats (ODDD) will take a contrary stand and declare wanting to go to heaven racist sexist and a sign of authoritarianism. Hell they are already pooh-poohing peace, PEACE! for Christ's sake.
Ha, Mike, that is a possibility. Democrats are so deranged it might be easy for Trump to just play them. He comes out in favor of going to heaven? Working towards it? Then the left will suddenly start shrieking about the virtues and desirability of going to hell and promising that if you vote for them, they will make sure you go to hell. Versus that icky Trump trying to get you to heaven.
And who wants that?
Was there a second possible answer?
Why not ask: "The President said he wants to end the killing. Was he serious about that or is the killing really just fine?"
Sheese! They really do not know what their job is.
The Daily Wire is a psyop. It is a dishonest organization with hidden goals.
Their actions and words do not match.
I'm sure that Trump PARTIALLY thinks its a good Christian thing to broker peace. And that doing good Christian things help you get into Heaven.
But I don't think Trump is particularly religious. If he was, he wouldn't be supporting Israel's genocide in Gaza and would've been outraged at Israel bombing churches and and sniping at people inside Churches. Not to mention killing aid workers, journalists, women and children.
I think trump is like that Luthern Pastor who urged everyone to vote for the very Unchristian Kamala Harris. His politics come 1st, and his religion comes after.
Give me a boost, a boost over heaven's gate
Trump is already rich, heaven's beloved angels like. (reich-gleich) Martin Luther
I do look forward to the Left declaring that the President wanting to do good things to get into heaven is a bad thing.
You know they want Trump to fail and they want people to die so they can wave the bloody shirt around. They will almost certainly fall into the trap that trying to do good things to get into heaven is bad.
You don’t really even need to try. They do everything they can to portray themselves as moral degenerates.
I'm picturing their 3 hour meeting taking place on Joe Rogan's set. The two of them leaning back in their chairs drinking whiskey and bullshitting about the nature of God and UFOs.
Trump's just trying to make heaven a place the Left avoids.
The reportette does something I really hate. Ask one Goddamn question. Don't ask two unrelated questions. Some of these press clowns will actually ask 3 questions! And get one answered. Usually the last one.
RCOCEAN II, 11:04AM
This is just barking-at-the moon, spittle-flecked, Hamas-hoax madness: [if Trump were religious] "he wouldn't be supporting Israel's genocide in Gaza and would've been outraged at Israel bombing churches and and sniping at people inside Churches. Not to mention killing aid workers, journalists, women and children."
If you wanna get to heaven...
You got to raise a little hell.
WaPo: Without evidence Trump asserts there is a heaven and that he may go there. Experts state that no explorers have returned from heaven and that scientists have been unable to locate it.
"This is just barking-at-the moon, spittle-flecked, Hamas-hoax madness"
Well that certainly is persuasive.
You can tell Father is an Episcopalian:
Father: I don't go to church to be preached at as though I were some lost sheep.
Vinnie: Clare, you don't seem to understand what the Church is for.
Father: Vinnie, if there's one place the Church should leave alone, it's a man's soul!
"On the plus side, God held the king responsible, not you. So it wasn't all bad: you could blame the King when you face God after you die. Now? You are on your own, and you are punished for your own sins and cannot weasel out by saying the King made you do it."
Henry V, Act 4, scene 1 (a fragment):
BATES
Ay, or more than we should seek after; for we know
enough, if we know we are the kings subjects: if
his cause be wrong, our obedience to the king wipes
the crime of it out of us.
WILLIAMS
But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath
a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and
arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join
together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at
such a place;' some swearing, some crying for a
surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind
them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their
children rawly left. I am afeard there are few die
well that die in a battle; for how can they
charitably dispose of any thing, when blood is their
argument? Now, if these men do not die well, it
will be a black matter for the king that led them to
it; whom to disobey were against all proportion of
subjection.
KING HENRY V
So, if a son that is by his father sent about
merchandise do sinfully miscarry upon the sea, the
imputation of his wickedness by your rule, should be
imposed upon his father that sent him: or if a
servant, under his master's command transporting a
sum of money, be assailed by robbers and die in
many irreconciled iniquities, you may call the
business of the master the author of the servant's
damnation: but this is not so: the king is not
bound to answer the particular endings of his
soldiers, the father of his son, nor the master of
his servant; for they purpose not their death, when
they purpose their services. Besides, there is no
king, be his cause never so spotless, if it come to
the arbitrement of swords, can try it out with all
unspotted soldiers: some peradventure have on them
the guilt of premeditated and contrived murder;
some, of beguiling virgins with the broken seals of
perjury; some, making the wars their bulwark, that
have before gored the gentle bosom of peace with
pillage and robbery. Now, if these men have
defeated the law and outrun native punishment,
though they can outstrip men, they have no wings to
fly from God: war is his beadle, war is vengeance;
so that here men are punished for before-breach of
the king's laws in now the king's quarrel: where
they feared the death, they have borne life away;
and where they would be safe, they perish: then if
they die unprovided, no more is the king guilty of
their damnation than he was before guilty of those
impieties for the which they are now visited. Every
subject's duty is the king's; but every subject's
soul is his own. Therefore should every soldier in
the wars do as every sick man in his bed, wash every
mote out of his conscience: and dying so, death
is to him advantage; or not dying, the time was
blessedly lost wherein such preparation was gained:
and in him that escapes, it were not sin to think
that, making God so free an offer, He let him
outlive that day to see His greatness and to teach
others how they should prepare.
Even in Shakespeare's day, I vas juost following orders is no excuse.
RCOCEAN II said...
But I don't think Trump is particularly religious. If he was, he wouldn't be supporting Israel's genocide in Gaza and would've been outraged at Israel bombing churches and and sniping at people inside Churches. Not to mention killing aid workers, journalists, women and children
Hatred of Jews is clouding your judgement.
Allowing the people of Gaza to maintain their current social contract just dooms future generations of children to the same fate as this generation of children. Children in Gaza are turned into weapons of war by corrupt leadership in Gaza. This will continue until Gaza is taken away from Hamas.
Unfortunately Hamas has actually done things that are uniquely evil in history. Never before has a group of leaders built hundreds of miles of tunnels underneath a civilian population and so blatantly tried to get as many of their own people killed on purpose. The NAZIs had more humanity than Hamas.
The entire world should unite to remove all civilians from Gaza and to sort out all Hamas members and supporters in the population.
Once these people who support Hamas are isolated they should be made an example of that history remembers for a 1000 years. I would get creative with it. Ant piles. Impalings. Tourniquets. Racks. It should be streamed on YouTube.
I think a worldwide suggestion box for ways to kill Hamas members in the worst way possible would increase involvement and more deeply seat the lesson.
When Peace reign on earth won't it be heavenly!!
I think Trump was clearly making a joke when he said that but he was also baiting the left at the same time. I expect to see a more than a few essays this week of the sort, "No, Donald Trump, You Are Not Getting Into Heaven."
Oh, you can't get to heaven on roller skates
'Cause you'd roll right by those pearly gates
Oh, you can't get to heaven in a rocking chair
'Cause the rocking chair won't get you there
Oh, you can't get to heaven in a limousine
'Cause the Lord don't sell no gasoline
If you get there before I do
Just tell my friend I'm coming too
Please, the answer, my friends, is no. Christians may lie, but not as often nor as obviously as this president does. For starters, Trump doesn't attend church services. And a Christian would not have ordered that hundreds of FBI agents to search through thousands of pages of Jeffrey Epstein documents in order to remove Don Trump's name. And what is this quid pro quo action to move Ghislaine Maxwell to Club Fed?
If they talked for 3 hours who/whom was Joe Roganing who/whom??!!
badfly - Does Nancy Pelosi attend church ? Hillary? Biden?
What is your point?
Whether religion was discussed, or not, the answer is either peace, or kill them all and let God sort them out. That's the only method history shows finally arrives at peace.
"For starters, Trump doesn't attend church services."
Religion is not faith and faith is not religion. There's an old joke that God gave man faith and then the devil showed up and said, "Hey! Lemme me help organize that for ya!" Tens of millions of people of faith in this country belong to no church or religious community and converse with their God every day.
No Christian needs to attend anything to be Christian.
You got to go through hell before you get to heaven. --- Paul Pena
No, in Christian theology, good deeds alone do not guarantee entrance into heaven. While good deeds are encouraged and considered a positive expression of faith, salvation is believed Bito be attained through grace and faith in Jesus Christ.
Salvation by Grace, not Works:
.The core belief is that salvation is a gift from God, received through faith in Jesus Christ, not earned through good works or adherence to a set of rules. Christian sources emphasize that Jesus' sacrifice on the cross atones for humanity's sins, making salvation possible.
Good Deeds as a Result of Faith:
.While good deeds are not the means to salvation, they are often seen as a natural consequence or evidence of a transformed heart and a relationship with God. Some sources suggest that those who have faith in Jesus will be motivated to live a life that reflects that faith through acts of love and service to others.
Many biblical passages support this idea, such as Ephesians 2:8-9, which states, "For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—not by works, so that no one can boast.". SO THT NO ONE CAN BOAST...sound like trump? Ya got to read the BOOK and adhere to the principles. MAGAS love the PROSPERITY GOSPEL.. All will come before the GREAT WHITE THRONE to see if their name is written in the Book ,the guy who said on live TV in 2015 "I think if I do something wrong. I just try and make it right. I don't bring God into that picture I don't" Asking God for forgiveness is a core tenet of Christian Faith,,,read the BOOK!
“He's simply setting out a position knowing that the Oppositional Defiance Disorder Democrats (ODDD) will take a contrary stand and declare wanting to go to heaven racist sexist and a sign of authoritarianism. Hell they are already pooh-poohing peace, PEACE! for Christ's sake.”
Not true. That you can’t envision any non Trumpists as Christians, not believing in an afterlife, and Pooh-poohing PEACE is sad. Who are you to judge a Democrat or Non Trumpist person as having less Christian faith than you?
I believe a line has been crossed elevating Trump as a near Deity. Trump is a flawed human, just like you and I and the rest of humankind. Trump posting images of himself as some Golden idol isn’t funny and if he wants to get to heaven he might rethink that. I’m thinking of that Gaza resort video.
That Trump is worried about getting to heaven is a good thing, I’m glad to hear it, but it’s not good works that will get him there, it’s belief in God and asking for forgiveness of sins, hopefully he’s done that. His health isn’t great and he’s almost 80
Achilles said...
Once these people who support Hamas are isolated they should be made an example of that history remembers for a 1000 years. I would get creative with it. Ant piles. Impalings. Tourniquets. Racks. It should be streamed on YouTube.
8/20/25, 11:23 AM
Mmhmm. Maybe we could try gassing them?
Seriously, Israel is facing levels of disapproval in America that were unthinkable even a generation ago. In the European Union, there is a very real chance multiple countries might break off diplomatic relations entirely. And the biggest part is that American Jews don't welcome your actions. The vast majority of them will be absolutely disgusted by you even as you handle their trash for them. When the majority of Jews have to choose between liberal internationalism or Zionism, Zionism is going out.
This is partly why moral structures are important to people like President Trump, and why the increasingly barbaric immorality of the Israel project will destroy its viability.
"Their actions and words do not match."
Which actions of the Daily Wire do not involve words?
Botfly - all of that matters - After you tell us WHY Bill Clinton flew to Epstein's Island 28 times.
a Christian would not have ordered that hundreds of FBI agents to search through thousands of pages of Jeffrey Epstein documents in order to remove Don Trump's name.
Well, that didn't happen, so...
Dinky…remember this?
"Why do I have to repent or ask for forgiveness, if I am not making mistakes?" asked Trump. "I work hard, I'm an honorable person."
https://www.christianpost.com/news/trump-why-do-i-have-to-repent-or-ask-for-forgiveness-if-i-am-not-making-mistakes-video.html
If Trump believes that, his pastor has some work to do. Good works are evidence of being among the Elect. But good works alone will not place you among the Elect. Being among the Elect is done through choice: Choose Jesus as your Way.
Paul writes, “I do not set aside the grace of God; for if righteousness comes through the law [good works], then Christ died in vain.” (Galatians 2:21, NKJV).
Paul further writes, “For by grace you have been saved through faith [in the salvation work of Christ], and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast.” (Ephesians 2:8–9, NKJV).
He’s just tryin to get to heaven before they close the door.
I love this quote by Trump. After the corrupt left tried to kill him, tried to jail him... libeled him... impeached him over Biden's actual Ukrainian corruption.
"Why do I have to repent or ask for forgiveness, if I am not making mistakes?" asked Trump. "I work hard, I'm an honorable person."
Fuck you, leftists.
Predestination - "the elect" - is a towering crock of bs that has - and should - gone the way of the Huguenots.
The position of the catholic Church and that of the Orthodox church is that heaven is earned by faith and good works. Because good works are an expression of faith. That's good enough for me. I don't need to listen to some nobody who's skimmed through the bible and come up with a unique personal "every man his own pope" interpetation.
Here is the video Trump shared on Truth Social
Trump Gaza
Also he’s reposted AI pictures of himself a Pope. Maybe he needs to get serious about asking for forgiveness.
"Who are you to judge a Democrat or Non Trumpist person as having less Christian faith than you?"
I dunno. Maybe because you are silent on Israel's genocide in gaza, and support a war in Ukraine. Mabye you support non-Christians. Maybe because you support Abortion and sorts of immorality condemned by Christians for 2000 years. Maybe because its impossible to tell by your actions and words that you are Christian in any way.
But maybe not.
So much expertise in the unknowable leaves me feeling like I missed too much school. Seriously, where did you people learn all this stuff with such certainty?
Faith is a trust domain.
Religion is a behavioral protocol or model.
Heaven or Martha's Vineyard. Does the motive matter?
As far as Christians go Trump's knowledge of Christian Theology is pretty average. The thing is, no where in the Bible does it say you need to understand the niceties of Christian Dogma to be a Christian. The essential things to be a Christian are to believe in the One God who created the universe and sent his only begotten Son to pay the price for our sins and to repent your sins.
Also, How Christians are Portrayed in Movies
Inga - Have you asked for forgiveness for all of the leftist lies and fraud you bought, believed, and advanced? +
Peachy, I’ve prayed it thousands of times in my life, how about you?
The Lord’s Prayer…
Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name. Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done, in earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread. And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil: For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen.
There's a potus who's sure all that glitters is gold
And he’s buying a stairway to Heaven.
I would guess, however, that Trump’s Heaven is a euphemism for the Nobel Peace Prize and that Trump and Putin did talk about that in their 3 hour meeting.
Used to be forgive our trespasses. I don't know when debt was thought to be more accurate. Paying back debt is part of the deal, if anything is going to work.
"The essential things to be a Christian are to believe in the One God who created the universe and sent his only begotten Son to pay the price for our sins and to repent your sins. "
Some Christians think that part is nonsense.
The essence of Christianity comes from Augustine: think the best of others instead of the worst.
The afterlife heaven is figurative for one on earth. Temporizing the essence : representing what is by how it winds up.
Thylias Moss, dealing with dogma
I don't believe in [God]. He's just a casual acquaintance,
a comfortable associate with whom I can be myself.
To believe in Him would place Him in the center of the universe,
when He's far more secure in the fringes,
so He doesn't have to look over His shoulder to nab the backstabbers who want promotions,
but are tired of waiting for Him to die and set in motion the natural evolution.
God doesn't want to evolve.
Has been against evolution from its creation.
He doesn't figure many possibilities are open to Him.
I think He's wise to bide His time, even though He pales in the moonlight to just a glow...
just the warmth of hot chocolate spreading through the body like a subcutaneous halo.
But to trust in Him implicitly would be a mistake,
for then He would not have to maintain His worthiness to be God.
Even the thinnest flyweight modicum of doubt gives God the necessity
to prove He's worthy of the implicit trust I can never give
because I protect Him from corruption,
from the complacency that rises within Him sometimes,
a shadowy ever-descending brother.
Trump calls for Fed governor's resignation as ally requests DOJ probe ~ Fox Business
This is hilarious.
Trump committed gross mortgage fraud by adding eight non-existent floors to an office building, tripling the square footage of commercial space and so forth.
How about Trump resign?
Didn't the AG of Texas Ken Paxton just get caught doing this exact same thing with 3 houses? When are Republicans going to call for his resignation?
A "call to action" must have gone out to the trolls. Trump ain't perfect, but he wants this war stopped, and he is facing an array of powerful politicians and members of his own government who want it to continue. It wasn't just Germany that allowed that they would be better off if the war continued another five years, a Danish politician said it as well.
Why are they saying this? I can only speculate, but there is a lot of loose talk among European leaders of fighting Russia directly in five years. Germany is starting to try to re-arm, for example and the EU is trying to issue bonds, which is the last step before the EU directly imposes taxes on Europeans, to build up an EU military. And what is the justification for this power grab? "Putin! Putin! Putin! Evil Putin is making us impose taxes on you and build up a military industrial complex, the provision of weapons to and by which will make us all rich! Putin!"
A question that might shed light on whether Trump was/is serious about going to heaven would be if he found out that he was indeed going to heaven would trade heaven for a third term.
If you are entirely sincere in your religious belief, you don't enter politics, the realm of compromises and misdirection.
What it means to have faith, how you know if you have faith, what you do if you have faith and how that differs from how you would behave if you don't have faith are all complicated questions, maybe too complicated for human minds to answer, so if we must judge and be judged, our acts and works are a good basis for judging.
IDF "Gaza therapy" is also a complicated matter. From backing Gaza to avoid negotiating with Fatah to ignoring warnings of the October 2023 attacks -- it's all murky. The idea that everything has to be destroyed for Gaza's own good is also highly questionable. Is the point really Gaza's own good, or even Israel's, or is it expansionism or just keeping Bibi in power?
You mean you "believe in the One God who created the universe and sent his only begotten Son to pay the price for our sins and to repent your sins" all by yourself!?! BURN THE WITCH!
"Who are you to judge a Democrat or Non Trumpist person as having less Christian faith than you?"
I dunno. Maybe because you are silent on Israel's genocide in gaza, and support a war in Ukraine.
Me… I support Israel’s right to defend itself, but that stops with what they have done in Gaza. Biblically Jews are God’s chosen people, but I doubt God is in favor of killing hundreds of thousands of innocent people.
“Mabye you support non-Christians.”
Me…
are you asserting that you support only Christians?
“Maybe because you support Abortion and sorts of immorality condemned by Christians for 2000 years.”
Me…
I’ve said on these threads numerous times over the years that I do not support abortion, but I do support allowing a woman to decide. I believe that if the woman decides to kill the baby in her womb, she will face God at her death and answer to him. Also God may understand her decision and forgive her if she asks Him to. As for homosexuality, who am I to judge them? The Old Testament also says it’s a sin to eat shellfish. How about having two wives or a concubine? There are things in the Old Testament that are unclear.
“Maybe because its impossible to tell by your actions and words that you are Christian in any way.”
Me…
maybe you have pre conceived ideas about people on the left. Are you a good arbiter of who is a Christian? I was raised in a Christian faith, I still believe in God and Jesus, his son. I still practice many of the teachings I learned. I also grew up and learned that Biblical teachings can be twisted, misunderstood and abused.
Europe is afraid that the US will leave, and the knife fight for the "mastery of Europe" will resume. I think that this is the next book I should read:
The Struggle for Mastery in Europe, 1848–1918
Inga - I didn't ask you about how often you pray - I asked if you seek forgiveness when it comes to the deliberate calculated lies you buy wholesale.
You might want also want to seek help about your Trump obsession.
Better not, I bet that book is full of Putin's propaganda that I might be in danger of internalizing.
If you are entirely sincere in your religious belief, you don't enter politics, the realm of compromises and misdirection.
Bullshit. Compromises are necessary to many positions not just politics, and it's not wrong to negotiate and compromise. I wonder where you get such twisted theology.
Mary Margaret Olohan? Was that the Catholic school girl on SNL or the nurse on MASH?
gadfly said...
Please, the answer, my friends, is no. Christians may lie, but not as often nor as obviously as this president does. For starters, Trump doesn't attend church services. And a Christian would not have ordered that hundreds of FBI agents to search through thousands of pages of Jeffrey Epstein documents in order to remove Don Trump's name. And what is this quid pro quo action to move Ghislaine Maxwell to Club Fed?
Gadfly gives us the opportunity to discuss the differences between someone who is completely morally deranged and dishonest vs someone who is just very stupid.
Further what combination of these two attributes leads someone to be diagnosed as insane.
We could discuss how much compassion you are willing to show someone with gadfly’s deficiencies but at some point they are antithetical to a free society.
"Compromise" not in the sense of working out agreements, but "compromise" in the sense of being compromised, that is to say lowering standards and becoming corrupted.
Jaq said...
Europe is afraid that the US will leave, and the knife fight for the "mastery of Europe" will resume.
Europe has been free loading for a long time off US security guarantees and the rulers have become very wealthy.
The US has a lot of bases in Northern Africa and a lot of “anti-terrorism” operations there.
But I think we all know it is a lot less about terrorism and much more about the globalists using the US military to make the globalists rich through their European Sahel empire.
The purpose of the war in Ukraine and expansion of NATO is just expansion of this empire. If they can launder a bunch of taxpayer money through a war that is just bonus.
Inga said...
"Who are you to judge a Democrat or Non Trumpist person as having less Christian faith than you?"
"By their works you shall know them."
”By their works you shall know them”
Achilles.
Ryan McBeth traveled to Haza to get an idea of what is going on there on the ground. He asked an IDF general why they aren't trying to arm Gazan men who aren't involved with Hamas to keep order and help deliver food. As they did with the "sons of Iraq"? The IDF general took him to a grade school. Every Gazan from an early age is taught to hate Jews and Americans. That hatred is ingrained in their society.
ROCEAN
You demand peace from me every day of the week except the sabbath when you preach hatred and death to me. Now you wonder why I shun you.
RCOCEAN II said...
The position of the catholic Church and that of the Orthodox church is that heaven is earned by faith and good works. Because good works are an expression of faith. That's good enough for me. I don't need to listen to some nobody who's skimmed through the bible and come up with a unique personal "every man his own pope" interpetation.
8/20/25, 12:15 PM
—————————————-
According to the Church salvation can only be achieved through Christ.
Good works are an outward manifestation of devotion to Christ but are not a path to salvation without Christ.
The levels of metaphysical certainty expressed about Trump's (and lots of other people's) qualifications for heaven are astounding. If anyone has a direct pipeline to God, please advise.
Check that. Please don't.
Perhaps Trump, like David, is a special case. There is a lot of that in the Bible.
We know you, Inga.
If Trump is seriously considering the fate of his soul that can only be good thing.
In my experience, a three hour meeting working through interpreters is a one hour meeting at best.
RCOCEAN II is like having our very own Cato the Elder!
"RCOCEAN II said...
I'm sure that Trump PARTIALLY thinks its a good Christian thing to broker peace. And that doing good Christian things help you get into Heaven.
But I don't think Trump is particularly religious. If he was, he wouldn't be supporting Israel's genocide in Gaza and would've been outraged at Israel bombing churches and and sniping at people inside Churches. Not to mention killing aid workers, journalists, women and children.”
Carthago delenda est! Cato the Elder is said to have used the phrase as the conclusion to all of his speeches to push for war against Carthage, even when the speech was otherwise unrelated to Carthage or foreign affairs.
Israel delenda est! RCOCEAN uses this phrase as the conclusion to all of his blog posts to push for the destruction of Israel, even when the blog post is otherwise unrelated to Israel or foreign affairs.
I am sure all atheist think Trump was joking.. and all believers think his is serious. And I to think he is serious.
He is an old man and he knows his time is short. God bless him!
"Knock, Knock, Knockin' on Heaven's door"?
docrev said…
This is partly why moral structures are important to people like President Trump, and why the increasingly barbaric immorality of the Israel project will destroy its viability.
Israel has 2 choices:
1. Live with Hamas next door attacking them until Hamas at some point succeeds and kills all of the Jews in Israel.
2. Destroy Hamas.
At this point the leaders of Israel have one path that is viable. They have no other choice unless they want to accept their people being massacred.
Moral retards will be upset with Israel doing what they have to do with what they have.
Israel does not have a large enough army to do what I would like to do. I would occupy the place completely and move all of the “civilians” out to temporary refuges and then I would cleanse everything remaining. Then you would help them resettle under Saudi/Egyptian management and rebuild the strip along the same lines as Qatar.
Israel doesn’t have an army large enough to do that so they have to root the little fuckheads out block by block and seal up the tunnels one at a time.
Meanwhile they have degenerates baying at them demanding that Israel accepts its eventual destruction.
The people who are whining about the killing in Gaza by Israelis need to be honest about what they want to happen. Just admit you want Hamas to eventually succeed. Stop with the dishonest nonsense and just fess up.
I am not defending how Israel is doing this by the way. I think they should know what would happen if they pursued this “nice war” fiction. Israel has been going to extreme lengths to limit the number of Gazans killed knowing that Hamas set this up in order to maximize civilian casualties.
But Israel overestimates the intelligence and underestimates the honesty of most people. They should know that no matter how hard they try it will never be enough.
This should have been very short and very bloody. They gain nothing by being kind.
"If anyone has a direct pipeline to God, please advise."
I've heard that in order to find their equal the Irish are forced to talk to God. Alright Father I told him!
On faith and works: Think of it as we are all in a deep pit. We cannot climb out. Jesus is up there, throwing us a rope. We grab a hold of the rope and climb out.
Who saved us? Jesus: without His rope, none of us gets out of the pit. And also us: without us grabbing and climbing the rope, we are not getting out of the pit. Can we, therefore, say we saved ourselves? No, because we didn't have the rope. But Jesus requires us to grab the rope and climb, and for the weaker, He will even reach out and grasp our hands and pull us... but we still have to reach out and grab onto Him.
Thus, works are required: we have to grab and climb. But it's impossible to get out without the rope Jesus offers us.
Oh, and as for a "direct pipeline to God" I would be very remiss in my religious duty to not mention that yes, Russell M. Nelson, the president of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, is in fact the prophet of God for today. He has a direct pipeline to God.
As do the rest of us, via prayer. But President Nelson is the one called of God to be His spokesperson right now.
Most people don't believe that, of course, but I'm just letting you know that there is someone out there.
As Trump self-inflicted economic policies worsen and his authoritarian initiatives tighten, it will be interesting what he upholsters next. I can almost hear; “Nobody knows God better than I do”.
Inga said...
"Who are you to judge a Democrat or Non Trumpist person as having less Christian faith than you?"
I dunno. Maybe because you are silent on Israel's genocide in gaza, and support a war in Ukraine.
One of these wars is about lines on a map and which set of oligarchs control the Russian ethics who live in Donbas.
The other war is about elimination of all Jews in Israel.
What the war is about has bearing on which wars you support.
Ronald J. Ward said...
As Trump self-inflicted economic policies worsen and his authoritarian initiatives tighten, it will be interesting what he upholsters next. I can almost hear; “Nobody knows God better than I do”.
What authoritarian initiatives? Be specific.
What economic policies? Be specific.
I look forward to making you look stupid again as we delve into this topic.
It would be fascinating to hear Trump and Putin discuss religion. Remember Bush II talking about Putin and religion?
How he looked into Putin's eyes and was able to get a sense of his soul? I imagine most other world leaders presume that speaking about religion is a thing you do with American presidents, even though it's not the norm elsewhere, especially not in Europe.
Pope Francis altered the translation of the Lord's Prayer in 2017, Narr.
I am amazed that I agree with Dinky.
So many people misunderstand Christian doctrine as evidenced by the comments of many in this thread. (Some few do seem to get it though.)
You cannot get to heaven on your own efforts. Period. Full stop. You can be Mother Theresa reincarnated and you won't get to Heaven. You could be Josef Stalin reincarnated and make it in. So anyone judging Trump by his actions to determine if he is going or not going (and trump seems to misunderstand this as well) does not understand the Gospel. Now, if you are using some other religious text for your determination, then maybe works will work for you.
All you can say is that someone is not being a strong adherent to Christ's teaching, but even that judgement can be debated. Choosing Israel or Gaza won't save or damn one's soul no matter how much spittle proceeds from your mouth as you condemn a person.
Achilles, I’m not here to spoon-feed what’s already common knowledge, nor do I have the expertise to program a little red dot to bounce over each syllable for your understanding.
Sorry: rhhardin.
I'm pretty sure of one thing: Trump spent a lot less time on this than everybody else did. He probably didn't spend more than a couple seconds thinking about it before he said it, and has only thought about what others have said about it since.
The US policy clearly established by the Biden administration was unconditional support for Israel regardless of the incidence of war crimes and human rights abuse involved. Greater Israel now encompasses all of Palestine plus military hegemony over apparently all adjacent Arab lands.
This validated decades of tacit support for Israel by the US government.
Jake Sullivan continues to speak about a "two-state solution" which is just continuing a smoke-blowing exercise by leading Democrats extending over several decades, apparently to deflect criticism for being complicit in the enabling of large-scale war crimes. I don't think these people fully grasp just how discredited they actually are. The thousands of maimed and disfigured children in Gaza are difficult for anyone with any sensitivity to human dignity to take let alone stomach.
Wa St Blogger wrote: "So anyone judging Trump by his actions to determine if he is going or not going (and trump seems to misunderstand this as well) does not understand the Gospel."
I guess Jesus was confused when he told the parable of the sheep and the goats. The decision on whether his followers were judged to be among the sheep or the goats seems very much to depend on the actions of the person. Indeed any other criteria seem to be rejected. And in the Letter of St. Jude, Jude also questions what faith means in the absence of works: "But someone will say, 'You have faith; I have deeds.' Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by my deeds."
Rushing to accuse Trump of the heresy of Pelagianism seems unwarranted by Scripture.
Preach it Brothers and sisters!
Can I get an amen?
Achilles, I’m not here to spoon-feed what’s already common knowledge, nor do I have the expertise to program a little red dot to bounce over each syllable for your understanding.
So in other words, you ain't got shit.
Shocking.
Support for Israel - not matter what - when they are blowing up Christian Churches, massacring women and kids and trying to starve the whole population into surrender, is UnChristian and UnAmerican. Our tax dollars are paying for the weapons and bombs used by the IDF.
Frankly, its disgusting to hear "Christian" leaders support it, and go wailing at the wailing wall when this genocide is going on.
But I need to get back to work.
Trump is motivated like any other good person who has and can accomplish big things. He wants to be known and remembered for doing great deeds for mankind. If you need to make that negative, then he's motivated by ego, but the result is the same: a man of considerable ability facilitates great things that benefit many and except for the notoriety are either a sacrifice or a net wash otherwise, while carrying great danger in the meantime. Assuming you are not an evil or very small person yourself, you would do the same. It's not all that mysterious. It's reasonable to assume God would approve of such a thing or else why worship and why do them?
Not surprisingly, little attention will go to the humility of placing himself at bottom of the totem pole.
Funny thing Jim, every time you guys ask for examples, the real issue isn’t that they don’t exist, it’s that you don’t accept them.
little attention will go to the humility of placing himself at bottom of the totem pole
Worth emphasizing and noting that he has been fair and charitable away from the public scene. There is clearly more to the man than is published. Perhaps he is sincerely striving to improve his moral character, while balancing his secular oath under our Constitution (i.e. social contract).
Trump says that he is hearing that he is not doing well and is near the bottom of the totem pole in terms of getting to heaven. Are those forecasts (presumably coming from third parties) with or without evidence?
God's grace is given as He sees fit.
PS. Trump doesn't care about getting the Nobel Peace Prize. He cares about having earned it (unlike some other unworthy recipients).
Again - Inag - you really should pray for your Trump obsession.
It's eating your brain.
Paragliders scare a Jewish camp for kids - in the US.
The left's pro-Hamas propaganda buyers are the real Nazis.
Even When Trump shows humility - the D-loyal hive-mind cultists have a mentally ill meltdown.
from above link:
"Danielle Gordon of Denver is a white, middle-class, college-educated employee of Fidelity."
No longer with Fidelity. Do not hire the Hamas-adoring Jew hater names Danielle Gordon(D). Thank you.
I know three things:
I can only achieve salvation through Christ.
I am a sinner.
I do not know the condition of anyone else's soul.
The left are known for lying, wasting massive amounts of OUR money on their lies, and on their self-serving power-projects.
The Democratic left are known for destroying our nation with high crime and an anti-police sentiment.
from my link. Please read if you ahve time.
"First, to show just how mainstream this kind of hate has become. Danielle isn’t some fringe extremist hiding behind an anonymous account. She’s a professional at one of the most respected financial institutions in the country. She’s a typical progressive parroting TikTok talking points about Jews, Zionism and Israel. At one point, she even lectured me that “Zionism goes against your religion” — a laughable claim for anyone who has read a page of Jewish history.
Her hatred isn’t rare; it’s disturbingly ordinary. And that’s what makes it so dangerous. This strain of progressive antisemitism thrives side by side with self-aggrandizing claims of moral superiority.
Second, accountability matters. If Danielle Gordon is representing Fidelity and a client mentions assets or travel plans tied to Israel, should that client trust their money in her hands?"
Trump is being accused of being a believer in scripture. That man has guts.
I had this thought on my commute today: Gaza/Hamas failed the Civilization Test on November 7th. No civilized country uses mass rape and infanticide as a weapon of war, let alone mass hostage-taking. And I'm saying Gaza/Hamas because it wasn't just card-carrying Hamas members invading Israel: they used their whole military-aged male population. As other commenters have pointed out, in the defense, the Hamas tunnels violate multiple laws of land warfare (misuse of protected facilities, use of civilians as shields, etc).
When you've shown categorical disregard of the rules of civilization, you don't get to be treated like one anymore. In fact, it is dangerous to treat you like one, because you will just do the same things again if given any sort of mercy.
We applied this principle to the Krauts and the Japanese. We were prepared for 40 years to apply it to the USSR on a moment's notice. We didn't have to because the Russians turned out to have kept some remnants of their civilization.
Hamas/Gaza have not.
RR
JSM
Full Moon said: Trump may have given the afterlife considerable thought after avoiding it by an inch when the bullet nicked his ear instead of splattering his brains
Most likely...who wouldn't begin to think about such things after such a close call with death. The hand of God just giving Trump a little nudge to avoid death???
A person might wonder why they were spared and if there might not be a higher purpose they are supposed to try to fulfill while on this Earth.
That he might be a bit sarcastic or wryly put out his statements....but that just seems to be his habitual way of speaking. Doesn't mean he isn't sincere.
Chuck J. Ward once again starts an argument with unfounded ad hominem and then runs away when confronted. Shocking.
"Some Christians think that part is nonsense."
Then by definition they aren't Christians.
"all by yourself!?! BURN THE WITCH!"
I have no idea what you are trying to say here. Is this some kind of dig at organized religion?
Nothing shocking here Boatman. It’s telling that every time I cite tariffs, deportations, or military posturing against U.S. cities, the response isn’t to refute them but to pretend they don’t exist. That’s not me running away—that’s you running from reality. Running away is easy. What I’ve done is harder: refuse to waste time repeating common knowledge to those who’ve already decided to deny it.
"Nothing shocking here Boatman. It’s telling that every time I cite tariffs, deportations, or military posturing against U.S. cities"
Well, since Trump supporters voted for the tariffs, deportations, and law and order, I fail to see how you have demonstrated corruption and as for the tariffs causing economic disruption, inflation is coming under control and the US is getting trillions of dollars of investment in domestic manufacturing.
The Simpsons - Protestant Heaven vs. Catholic Heaven (an old YouTube).
Catholic heaven appeals to me.
Mariachi bands in the Latino sector, colorful dress, booze-orama withal. The Italian sector of heaven, a huge party table, everyone with hoisted glasses of wine, big-busted women sitting at the table, making out on the laps of handsome, dark-haired protectors of Italian virginity.
It's the Irish sector. I say the Irish section would be Trump’s all-time favorite - look for Trump in the Irish sector of Heaven. Crammed full of Irish fist-fights, brawling, tumbling on the ground, Irish hoisting pints and rooting on the fight, John Wayne from the Quiet Man in never ending sloppy brawl all over the countryside rolling around, taking hard shots with real heavyweight Victor McLaglen, fair-maiden Maureen O'Hara, amply endowed and more amply disgusted with both toxic fools, but cooking dinner anyway (how could Trump go wrong in Irish heaven?). Trump would fight to get in.
Decide for yourself whether the piñata in the Piñata scene is stuffed with Epstein files, the shredded Steele dossier, or personal notes on Adam Schiff about his “schiffy” toilet secrets, fact-checked by the NYT toilet-cam.
Yet, whoa! The grand finalé. Group Jesus blanket-tossing, Jesus laughing, and, at the new ball room at the White House, barked command, “DANCE YOU GOBS!” Not sure what that dance was at the end. I prefer the Michael Douglas and Annette Bening private dance, Bening only in a shirt, in the upstairs bedroom, with all the politics exorcized. Poor Marge Simpson, stuck in boring Protestant heaven.
I’m sold. Catholic heaven. How to sign up?
Exemptions for lapsed like me?
Stephen wrote:
I guess Jesus was confused when he told the parable of the sheep and the goats. The decision on whether his followers were judged to be among the sheep or the goats seems very much to depend on the actions of the person. Indeed any other criteria seem to be rejected. And in the Letter of St. Jude, Jude also questions what faith means in the absence of works: "But someone will say, 'You have faith; I have deeds.' Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by my deeds."
I don't think Jesus was confused. You might be though. There are several ways the sheep and goats parable can be interpreted, but in context of everything Jesus talks about, it is most likely a caution against acting holy rather than being holy. It fits right along with his rebuke of the Jewish leaders. It clearly should not be considered a message on works getting you in, and you seem to support that with the quote of James 2:18. And I agree that our works should tell on us, just like it says in John, they shall know you by your love.
But, we are not the ones separating the sheep from the goats, and we don't know a man's heart, we can only guess through his actions as an individual. But since we all fall short, one could easily point to the myriad failures of mine and predict a goat pen for me at the end.
Finally, the requirements of a world leaders are different than an individual. Trump is not acting on his own behalf. I have an obligation to forgive the person who harms my family, the state does not, and to do so would be an injustice to the next family that person harms. The forgiveness of my oppressor is mine to give, not anyone else's. As far as I know Jesus never condemned the government for it's actions in delivering justice. (though we disagree with whether it is justice being delivered, but that is not a salvation issue.)
Mr. D says:
I know three things:
I can only achieve salvation through Christ.
I am a sinner.
I do not know the condition of anyone else's soul.
Spot on
Ronald J. Ward said...
Achilles, I’m not here to spoon-feed what’s already common knowledge, nor do I have the expertise to program a little red dot to bounce over each syllable for your understanding.
So you are going with appeal to authority.
You are just too stupid to engage. You also know what has happened every time you engage with me.
You are boring and stupid. Thank you for your attention to this matter.
"I have no idea what you are trying to say here. Is this some kind of dig at organized religion?"
It is by faith alone I put my mind in motion
Through faith in Christ my salvation is achieved
My sins will be forgiven
Proof becomes irrelevant
It is by faith alone I put my mind in motion
All. By. Myself.
Bless your hearts, you just gotta love the pivot-and-justify move:
Instead of denying tariffs, deportations, and military threats happened, Ron Winkleheimer reframes them as good things and claims they don’t show corruption or failure. Nice shift from “that didn’t happen” to “well, it happened, but it was good.”
That actually validates my point: the cracks are real enough that they must now be rationalized.
So Ron, thanks for confirming the tariffs, deportations, and military posturing weren’t figments of my imagination. Whether you cheer them or not, they remain the cracks I was pointing out. That you see them as a badge of honor doesn’t erase their consequences. Denial has turned into justification—that alone tells the story.
"I’m sold. Catholic heaven. How to sign up? Exemptions for lapsed like me?"
I'm not but my wife is Catholic, and unfortunately, you're going to have to get with the pontiff on that one. Him and his predecessors and pretty much the whole shabang are lapsed too...have been for a while. They just don't know it.
How soul got into the language, before religion put the word on holiday
``It may be that the sense of falsification comes from the way I understand the phrase ``have a body.'' It is really a mythological way of saying that I am flesh. But I am not satisfied with this myth, for it implies that I also have something other than a body, call it a soul. Now I have three things to put together: a body, a soul, and me. (So there are four things to be placed: I plus those three.) But I no more have a soul than I have a body. That is what I say here and now. People who say they have a soul sometimes militantly take its possession as a point of pride, for instance William Ernest Henley and G.B.Shaw. Take the phrase ``have a soul'' as a mythological way of saying that I am spirit. If the body individuates flesh and spirit, singles me out, what does the soul do? It binds me to others.''
Cavell _The Claim of Reason_
Ronald J. Ward said...
Nothing shocking here Boatman. It’s telling that every time I cite tariffs, deportations, or military posturing against U.S. cities, the response isn’t to refute them but to pretend they don’t exist.
We support every one of these policies.
We support the results we have seen.
If Trump announces tomorrow that he is arresting every mayor that is complicit in insurrection and aiding and abetting illegal invaders who invade our country his poll numbers will go up 5 points.
If Trump raises taxes on Oligarchs who make things in other countries and ship them here under the name of tariffs his poll numbers will go up. We support taxing the wealthy.
Right now you have people in Chicago all over social media begging Trump to send in the National Guard.
I hope you people are stupid enough to keep this up.
Will Trump get to heaven? Or the Althouse commentariat? At the gate, we'll meet the Lord and who is he?
"Tyger Tyger, burning bright,
In the forests of the night;
What immortal hand or eye,
Could frame thy fearful symmetry?
In what distant deeps or skies.
Burnt the fire of thine eyes?
On what wings dare he aspire?
What the hand, dare seize the fire?
And what shoulder, & what art,
Could twist the sinews of thy heart?
And when thy heart began to beat.
What dread hand? & what dread feet?
What the hammer? what the chain,
In what furnace was thy brain?
What the anvil? what dread grasp.
Dare its deadly terrors clasp?
When the stars threw down their spears
And water'd heaven with their tears:
Did he smile his work to see?
Did he who made the Lamb make thee?"
Ad hominem noted Achilles. Facts don’t need your approval to exist.
You are boring and stupid.
You're leaving out arrogant.
Judaic Messianism says that every man is the Messiah. Who else can take on the suffering of others if not the being that says "me"? That's strikes me as more Christian than Christian dogma. (Sanhedrin 98b-99a)
Christianity would move the action to a shadowy God. But the properties of God are commandments already, so it's a doubly removed allegory. God is merciful means be merciful like Him. Why not leave it with the one who is being reminded in the first place, man.
It's a lesson in how human kind can arrange their lives for best results. Ostriches have different rules.
14 Which leaveth her eggs in the earth, and warmeth them in dust,
15 And forgetteth that the foot may crush them, or that the wild beast may break them.
16 She is hardened against her young ones, as though they were not her's: her labour is in vain without fear;
17 Because God hath deprived her of wisdom, neither hath he imparted to her understanding.
Missed an above comment but thanks for confirming, Achilles. Observing the consequences of tariffs, deportations, and military deployments isn’t opposition—it’s reality. That you celebrate them doesn’t change the cracks they reveal, nor the voter impact once they hit hard.
Trump has been hunted, and slandered, shot, and generally been the object of pure hate- much of which comes from the so called christians on this blog.
He is almost 80, and has spent the last 10 years fighting for America- the alternative to Trumps America is Biden, or Clintons, or Harris, and all of you hypocrites on the left cheered every time Trump 'gotcha' moment happened. only you never got him. but you cheered for his failure, you cheered for Americas failure.
and you supported every lie, every slander, every bullshit moment of the last 10 years.
Not one of you can produce any facts, only hate. Not one of you can show any good things about Biden, or Harris, except MSM propaganda.
so fuck you and your so called christianity.
and as always, the Jew hater chimes in. NO facts, nothing but pure Jew hate. Guess what skippy, the Jews have been hated, hunted and murdered while scum like you cheered. and yet they are still here, stronger than ever.
They will prosper and survive, in spite of your hate. My Israeli friends always laugh at people like you- living to hate others destroys the hater.
Ad hominem means cognitive dissonance, forgetting for the moment that ad hominem is today used in a sense opposite to its original. Its original meant an argument designed to appeal to the opponent's interests and values. Today it means can't think of an argument but I'm sure you're wrong.
Ronald Ward said: It’s telling that every time I cite tariffs, deportations, or military posturing against U.S. cities, the response isn’t to refute them but to pretend they don’t exist
I think Ron is confused. They aren't pretending that tariffs, deportations or military use in criminal zones don't exist. They know they do and voted for those things to exist.
They are pretending that YOU don't exist. They know that you aren't worth their time to try and argue with you and your delusion......every time you bring the topic up. You are just too tedious.
'Nice shift from “that didn’t happen” to “well, it happened, but it was good.”'
I never denied them. I always thought they were good. I voted for them, so I must have thought they were good. You stomping your feet and insisting they aren't good doesn't move the needle on convincing anyone. Your just virtue signaling.
Tariffs - I'm old enough to remember when "Fair Trade" was a Democrat talking point. Bernie Sanders is a long time critic of outsourcing and unfair trace practices. Of course now that Trump is acting on that then Trump is "doing it wrong."
Deportations - people on the left who opposed illegal immigration and were for deporting them.
Cesar Chavez
Bill Clinton
Obama
Tough on crime:
Most Democrat politicians when running for office except the ones that want to release violent criminals to terrorize citizens because "compassion."
Donald Trump wants to go to heaven and thinks creating peace between people killing thousands of each other is a way to get there.
Muslims want to go to heaven and think that killing and beheading anyone who is not Muslim is the way to get there.
US reporters don't even think of heaven. Or morals. Or character. But they do believe that Trump is more evil than a Hamas terrorist.
Take their reporting with this in mind.
Wm. Dunbar (?1460-1520) had the classic fear of death poem
I that in heill wes and gladnes
Am trublit now with gret seiknes
And feblis with infirmite:
Timor mortis conturbat me.
Our pleasance here is all vane glory,
this fals warld is bot transitory,
The fleshe is brukle, the Fend is sle:
Timor mortis conturbat me. ...
Today people live to be so old that death is viewed with indifference. No tasks left to complete. Heaven suffers a bit too.
Think of heaven as a nursing home.
Dems 2025:
Hell, yes!
rhahrdin said, "God is merciful means be merciful like Him. Why not leave it with the one who is being reminded in the first place, man."
Reminds me of Hillel the Elder, “Where there are no men, strive to be a man!” Also, "If I am not for myself, who will be for me? And being for myself, what am I? And if not now, when?"
The Redeemer came and went. YOU are v2.0.exe. Execute.
Israelis will trade a thousand imprisoned terrorists for two Jewish captives, dead or alive.
And yet, the claim is they are murdering and starving innocent men, women, and children.
POTUS has no path to ending the war, which the invader demonstrated once again he still wants to finish with military victory--short of pulling a Stalin and invading Ukraine from behind. So why not talk on tv about religion as part of his just say stuff modus operandus?
Did someone seriously mention ad hominem?
It’s so classic I can almost lip-sync your response before reloading the page. Dust Bunny Queen and Ron Winkleheimer are doing the one-trick pony dance: doubling down on delegitimizing me personally rather than engaging the substance.
Dust Bunny Queen reframes my critique as irrelevant because “I don’t exist” in their discourse—she isn’t debating policies, she’s dismissing my presence and effort, calling me “tedious.” Pure ad hominem, meant to silence.
Ron Winkleheimer fully pivots to policy cheerleading—tariffs, deportations, and tough-on-crime measures are presented as virtuous, historical, or bipartisan, while painting my points as virtue signaling. He’s collapsing all my examples into moral approval rather than examining consequences or cracks.
What you likely don’t get is that you’re now defending Trump-era policies instead of debating real-world impacts, which leaves me as the rational observer pointing out actual consequences.
Policies celebrated or not, the consequences of tariffs, deportations, and military deployments remain. Voting for them doesn’t erase their impact.
Reminds me of Hillel the Elder, “Where there are no men, strive to be a man!”
DIfferent R. Hillel "There shall be no Messiah for Israel, because they have already enjoyed him in the days of Hezekiah." The idea being teased out that Israel awaits a higher aspiration than being saved by a Messiah.
See Emmanuel Levinas _Difficult Freedom_ Essays on Judaism p80-90
Ronald J. Ward said...
Policies celebrated or not, the consequences of tariffs, deportations, and military deployments remain. Voting for them doesn’t erase their impact.
So lets get into what the consequences are:
Consequences of tariffs: Oligarchs and Multinational Corporations pay their fair share of the tax burden.
Consequences of Deportations: Rule of law upheld, less crime, and working class wages go up.
Consequences of National Guard deployments: Police are supported in their efforts to bring peace and stability to Washington DC.
That all sounds great to us. Thanks for playing.
Ronald J. Ward said...
Ad hominem noted Achilles. Facts don’t need your approval to exist.
There is a difference between ad-hominem and observation.
I am observing that you cannot actually engage in an honest way and that makes you stupid and boring.
“Policies celebrated or not, the consequences of tariffs, deportations, and military deployments remain. Voting for them doesn’t erase their impact.”
No substance provided. That is simply a statement backed on your own faith that it means anything.
Let’s cover deportation. This has been the law in the United States and other developed countries for decades. It is based on the sovereignty of the people to set their borders and demand entry from outsiders happen on the terms set by the people. It is a gracious policy, in that failing to adhere to the laws of entry, those that broke the law are simply sent home rather than imprisoned for years as happens in countries like China, Russia, Cuba, and other socialist paradises. I’ll admit voting for deportations was done for the exact intention of not erasing them, so not sure why you think that is negative.
What about this policy do you not like, because you didn’t say? Your comment lacked substance to explain anything other than a negative expression. In fact, I’m gleamed negativity because your entire comment was to bash everything you mentioned as negative without explanation or substance. You simply rephrased what other’s wrote and said you didn’t like it. Got it, but for such a hollow sentiment, could you get to your point in maybe a sentence and post once?
Or is this how you rodeo?
Ronald J. Ward said...
What you likely don’t get is that you’re now defending Trump-era policies instead of debating real-world impacts, which leaves me as the rational observer pointing out actual consequences.
I just directly addressed the real world consequences.
I look forward to you defending Multinational Corporations and Oligarchs not having to pay any taxes and illegal immigration.
I know you are an intellectual coward though. Again that is an observation in reaction to your past intellectual cowardice, not an ad-hominem attack.
wow stupider then chuck, that shouldnt be aspirational for you, in the 80s, the left was terrified of nuclear war, because Reagan, well they figured they had pulled a similar trick on Goldwater, so maybe it would work, Frankly Nixon and Ford entered into some ill advised agreements like SALT 1 and 2
but thats neither hear nor there, Reagan ended the cold war, and Bush sr, proceeded to botch it with the post soviet transition that seeded the oligarch and the return of someone like Putin,
meanwhile around the same time, he exported our industrial base, piece by piece to Mexico then China, we imported a quarter of Mexico's population after the 82 and 93 crackups of their markets, the former instance is what occasioned the 86 amnesty,
“There is a difference between ad-hominem and observation.”
Not everyone’s “observations” are based in reality. For a commenter who has different opinions from the majority here, it’s helpful to realize this up front.
that goes to some degree to showing how California became a hellhole, the Courts voted down the people in prop 187 and 209, also prop 8, because sodomy was the flavor of the day,
“POTUS has no path to ending the war, which the invader demonstrated once again he still wants to finish with military victory”
As all right thinking people hope. But too late for Democrats, peace is already becoming crystallized.
The Russo-Ukrainian War began in February 2014, following Ukraine’s “Revolution of Dignity”, with Russia’s annexation of Crimea and support for separatists in the Donbas region.
11.5 years is at the limit of endurance for war.
its all about love, turned into 'bake the cake' pretty soon, of course Dread Pirate Roberts was no hel[p
Original sense of ad hominem, found on a forgotten site long before blogs
Some time since I had a pleasant discussion with a university professor who held that faith and knowledge are in inverse ratio. As the area of knowledge enlarges, he claimed that of faith diminishes correspondingly. Once people accepted by faith what has since become known, and science has thus made faith superfluous in all such things. The professor admitted, however, it was not likely that knowledge would ever entirely banish faith; there would still remain some unexplored regions where faith could find room, and so preachers could still find a field for their activities. I came back at this professor with an argumentum ad hominem, "Is it true," said I, "that the more knowledge your wife has of you, the less faith she has in you? And is it true that the more you know of her, the less faith you have in her? In your home are faith and knowledge in inverse ratio? If so, I pity you both." It is not true that knowledge excludes faith. The more you know of your family physician, the more faith you have in him. The more soldiers know of their general, the greater their faith in him; else the army is in a bad way. The more we know of our friends the more faith we have in them. The greater a man's knowledge of nature, the greater his faith in nature. Intelligent faith is not weaker than ignorant faith.
For a commenter who has different opinions from the majority here, it’s helpful to realize this up front.
But he's presenting his opinions as facts and not providing any substance to back them up.
It's boring. It's tedious. It's arrogant.
It's not worth the time.
the Courts voted down the people in prop 187 and 209
Prop 209 is California law to this day.
“Consequences of tariffs: Oligarchs and Multinational Corporations pay their fair share of the tax burden.”
And then pass the cost on to consumers who are already having great difficulty with high prices, especially food prices.
“Consequences of Deportations: Rule of law upheld, less crime, and working class wages go up.”
Innocent people being rounded up on streets that resemble Jews being rounded up in the 1930’s. American citizens being arrested by ICE even though they’ve shown a their Real ID, yelling “Why am I being arrested, I’m an American citizen!”
“Consequences of National Guard deployments: Police are supported in their efforts to bring peace and stability to Washington DC.”
Using the military against America citizens is a slippery slope that goes far beyond simply making the streets of any given city safer when they have their own Police Department. It’s a show of authoritarian might. Not a good look.
I’m in awe of Karoline Leavitt’s intelligence, preparedness and demeanor. What a refreshing change from her immediate predecessor!
yeah I remember when a 6 year old boy faced mp 5 machine guns, even though his mothers dying wish was for him to come to this country, we've seen this movie before,
she is very sharp and when the press is unbelievably dim and unaware how ignorant they are,
More on the consequences of deploying military against its own citizens.
https://www.npr.org/2025/08/20/nx-s1-5507032/more-national-guard-deployed-to-washington-dc
"Military vehicles in front of public buildings and the idea of them constantly there with weapons, that is absolutely called intimidation," Manner, who served as acting vice chief of the National Guard Bureau, told Morning Edition. "I'm very concerned about the impact on both our recruiting, as well as, the perception of many of the people of color as they see the National Guardsmen from other states coming in to occupy Washington, D.C.
Manner, who served the guard for 15 years, says deploying troops into D.C. is a bad idea for several reasons. He notes that the guard is not trained in "policing actions," like the Metropolitan Police and other officers, and their deployment to U.S. streets negatively impacts their readiness to respond to emergencies, like war and natural disasters.
"The sad thing is this is a political prop. Our young soldiers and airmen are political props," Manner said.
Manner spoke with NPR's Michel Martin about what the National Guard is trained to do and why he says deploying troops to D.C. is a law enforcement issue and doesn't meet the criteria for active duty or military operations.“
Ron: OK. here goes. Long. Put on your pay attention cap.
Tariffs: Trump has strategically made some great deals for the US. It takes some time to see the results of economic strategies at this level. Instant gratification is for toddlers. The revenue from the various tariffs has already been coming in. There are also companies that have decided that it is in their best interest to move to or move back the the US for manufacturing and distribution. This is also good as it creates jobs, more internal tax revenue from expanded businesses. And in some industries, goods will actually cost less. Yes you TEMU crappola and imported items from China, India etc may cost more. Buy American.
Deportations: About TIME. Deporting ILLEGAL ALIENS, invaders of the US, will lower costs in many ways....and increase employment of American Citizens. Lowered costs in Medicaid, Medicare, Social Security, Schools, Welfare Benefits, Hospitals, the cost of housing ILLEGALS for free on the tax payer dime. Money that LEGAL citizens earned, payed for and deserve. Reduced law enforcement costs as the criminal ALIENS are being deported. Less ILLEGAL and ILLITERATE people driving commercial and private vehicles causing accidents and death. Are there going to be some sad cases? Yes...too bad...too sad. They have broken the laws by just being here.
Military/National Guard intervening in lawless, crime ridden cities AND on Federal Lands. Current police staffing is either too low, or they have been inhibited by Democrat Mayors. Over 90% of the people who are actually living in these deporable cities are in favor of intervention. With just a few days/weeks in, the crime rates have dropped dramatically, and the rats are scurrying for cover. Low crime=more prosperous safe cities. More businesses opening instead of closing.
I know it is hard to think economically, logically and without tear jerk, knee jerk emotion. But ...please try.
Biden's illegals must ALL go. Might be sad - but your anger should be directed at Crook Joe.
Funny how dedicated leftists don't care at all about the human trafficking and the child abuse and child sex trafficking that came along with Joe Biden's open border - and the left's transport of illegals to all corners of our nation.
Pray for forgiveness - leftists.
NPR is a joke.
Hopefully Trump, the National Guard and The local DC Police can finally get crime under control in our nation's Capitol
Crime under Crook Joe was allowed to soar. Most of that crime hurts poorer black businesses and black neighborhoods.
Bernie Sanders and AOC are political props.
“NPR is a joke.”
National Guard Major Gen. Randy E. Manner, Does not work for NPR. What does he say that you take umbrage with? It’s lazy and dumb to just bash the publication that quotes someone.
with no punchline, initially I liked keillors guy noir parody, but national proletarian radio has worn out its welcome
Ronald J. Ward, Winkleheimer and Dust Bunny Queen nailed you perfectly- I can't think of a single commenter at Althouse who denied those three items have occurred. What we don't agree with your characterization of them to the extent that you have even offerred a single substantive critique of any of them. You go on and on about them being corrupt or indicators of failure but then you never actually explain why you believe this in any detailed fashion. It is almost as if you think your characterization of them is too obvious to argue about.
Let me clue you in since you are new around here- you aren't the first lefty commenter who we have encountered here or anywhere else who behaves this way- when we see a new one it is just the same old game and so we treat you with derision pretty damned quickly because of that fact. Either up your game or expect to be increasingly ignored and/or mocked.
like that guy, Tim Walz, he was in the Guard to, until it came to the clinch, luckily a better officer replaced him, in Iraq,
After slamming Trump’s DC move, Dem governor of New Mexico declares emergency in crime-ridden county
After 4 long years of Crook Joe - the Soros puppet - crime is off the charts all over the nation.
Inga- NPR is a joke. A leftist joke.
So, Washington D.C. has gone a week now without a single homicide. Interesting......
DBQ - To your excellent point on illegals...
Proof: Colorado Democrats have budgeted 50 million for free health care for illegals. All while Colorado faces a massive budget crisis.
“Inga- NPR is a joke. A leftist joke.”
Kill the messenger syndrome. As I said…
National Guard Major Gen. Randy E. Manner does not work for NPR. What does he say that you take umbrage with? It’s lazy and dumb to just bash the publication that quotes someone.
hes a hack who abandoned iraq to islamic state, among his other accomplishments, along with darth Austin, meanwhile they fail to secure the homeland against invasion,
if he was British, he'd be a Colonel Blimp type, i'm sure he loved the kabuki around inauguration in 2020
2021, when 20 million swarmed into this country, a sheer dereliction of duty,
Inga said...
“Consequences of tariffs: Oligarchs and Multinational Corporations pay their fair share of the tax burden.”
And then pass the cost on to consumers who are already having great difficulty with high prices, especially food prices.
So do you support Trump's tax cuts for Americans then?
"So do you support Trump's tax cuts for Americans then?"
While you're at it, you might as well ask if she objected to "high prices, especially food prices" (and post a link to the comment) while Brandon was busy showering with his daughter for all the good it'd do.
Inga said...
More on the consequences of deploying military against its own citizens.
Tim Walz actually deployed the National Guard.
They were authorized to shoot, and shot at American citizens who were merely on their porches.
Inga supported Tim Walz for Vice President.
Inga does not believe a single word she says. She is a completely amoral hypocritical creep who will support literally the opposite position if it will gain her power over other people.
Inga - what the hell is your problem? NPR interviewed someone. and? No one cares.
btw- anytime the word Oligarch shows up - we all start laughing at you.
Kash Patel: "Work Will Continue in D.C. Until 'Every Community Is Safe"
"Things are looking up in Washington, D.C., and we have the Trump administration to thank for it. Homeless enclaves have been cleared away, and the streets and neighborhoods are cleaner, quieter, and safer. The work, however, isn't done yet. On Wednesday, FBI Director Kash Patel lauded his and other law enforcement agencies for actions in the District of Columbia. He also vowed that the FBI will not stop its operations in the national capital until "every neighborhood is safe.""
Bad news for White Democrats.
If the DC government had policed their own city, Inga, we wouldn't be where we are.
And stop with the dramatics. The military isn't "deployed against its own citizens", except to the extent that, yes, some of the criminals are citizens.
“Tim Walz actually deployed the National Guard.”
There was rioting in the city. Trump actually praised Walz for sending in the National Guard.
Stephen Miller says:
"The voices that you hear out there, those crazy communists, they have no roots, no connection to this city, no families they’re raising here. They have no jobs in this city. But they’re the ones advocating for the 1% — the criminals, the killers, the rapists, the drug dealers…We're gonna ignore these stupid white hippies. They all need to go home and take a nap, because they're all over 90 years old. And we're gonna get back in the business of protecting the American people and the citizens of Washington, D.C."
If you watch the footage of the protestors - they are all old white ninnies - who bussed themselves in.
"Homeless enclaves have been cleared away, and the streets and neighborhoods are cleaner, quieter, and safer."
Gavin Newsom did this in San Francisco and the left didn't go insane over it. Of course, he cleaned things up for China's leader and not for the people of San Francisco, but still...
Trump brings a lot of this criticism on himself. He gladly releases staged photos of fundamentalist pastors "laying hands" on him in the Oval Office. Trump's MAGA followers never complained then about the separation of Church and State. At least they weren't speaking in tongues or handling snakes, so I guess that makes it OK.
“Yes, in 2020, then-President Donald Trump praised Minnesota Governor Tim Walz for his handling of the situation following the murder of George Floyd, specifically for sending in the National Guard to quell unrest.
During a phone call with governors on June 1, 2020, Trump said, "I fully agree with the way he handled it the last couple of days," and called Walz "an excellent guy". He further complimented Walz, stating, "You called up big numbers and the big numbers knocked them out so fast it was like bowling pins". This praise is documented in a recording of the call obtained by CBS News and reported by various news outlets including CNN and ABC News.
However, Walz had already deployed the Minnesota National Guard before this conversation with Trump. Walz deployed the Guard hours before Trump publicly threatened to do so.
Although Trump later claimed to have sent in the National Guard, this is false. The Minnesota National Guard is under the command of the governor, and Trump never federalized the troops during that period.
Despite Trump's 2020 praise, Republicans have since criticized Walz's handling of the 2020 events, especially after he was announced as the Democratic vice-presidential nominee in 2024.”
Google AI
“Inga- NPR is a joke. A leftist joke.”
C’mon, Peachy… a joke of a leftist never understands a leftist joke.
Ronald J. Ward said...
"Ad hominem noted Achilles. Facts don’t need your approval to exist."
Yeah. Got any?
" God loves your good words. he loves your good works more."
Some fuckin' saint or somebody.
Chuck--I'm in FAVOR of tariffs, deportation and military use in criminal zones. I'm not pretending that they don't exist. Nobody is. I think they are working, quite spectacularly, and most people seem to agree with me. You have abysmally failed to convince anyone that they are not. Up your game. Or shut up. But don't give me that "I don't have to prove anything to you morons" BS. You started it. Prove what you claim.
Inga said...
“Tim Walz actually deployed the National Guard.”
There was rioting in the city. Trump actually praised Walz for sending in the National Guard.
LOL.
I am talking about COVID when they were used to enforce curfews.
You are so dishonest.
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