Said Elon Musk, on the Joe Rogan podcast last week.
I was re-listening to that because the part about "mutilating animals" and "the worst thing you can possibly imagine from a horror show" got quoted in this new article at Yahoo News, "Trump said the US spent $8m on transgender mice – he was right."
The president was referring to an investigation by the White Coat Waste Project, a non-profit campaigning to stop animal testing, which investigates taxpayer-funded experiments on the effects of gender-affirming drugs in rodents. Justin Goodman, senior vice-president for the lobbying group, claimed it has documented “over $250 million spent on transgender animal experiments over the last couple of decades.”...
Details at the link. There are studies that use these mice to study the effects of hormone therapy. Does it lead to cancer, to osteoporosis?
As long as medical professionals are prescribed sex hormones to persons who seek treatment for gender dysphoria, the effects of that treatment ought to be studied, and the studies are done on mice. It's not a "demented" experiment on the mice. The mice, it seems, are produced in a form where they can be used to do experiments for the benefit of human beings. Maybe you think giving the human beings the hormones is bad science, that's a different matter.
Do you want more science about transgender medicine or don't you? At what point does your concern for mice kick in? Maybe it's all literally mutilating animals in demented studies.
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৬৩টি মন্তব্য:
Was Musk referring to the "transgender" experiments specifically, or more broadly such as experiments on beagles that came to light during Fauci's tenure?
"gender-affirming drugs", there's a dishonest honest turn of phrase. That said, they should be testing these drugs on animals to document and discover the side effects they will have on misguided children.
"Do you want more science about transgender medicine or don't you?"
No.
Let the Europeans spend their money on those studies, we don't have to be the world leader on everything.
So Al “Pimpstick” Green will be pleased he got the trans mice he was promised.
I guess there just isn't enough money to be made developing drugs that get mice to stop thinking they're really Napoleon.
Nope. I want no science on transgender medicine. I hear apricot pits work magic.
Does anyone believe that the mice experiments would have led to a decision to recommend against hormone therapy or transition surgery? When "science" has been so thoroughly corrupted that the outcomes of experiments are predetermined, then yes, these experiments become horrific.
Gender dysphoria isn't the only reason people are prescribed estrogen or testosterone. Menopause discomfort, as one example. The estrogen for the pharmaceutical is taken from female horse urine.
It's quite normal to think that we've gone too far in using animals to mitigate human problems.
Has Musk ever looked at his own companies (led by one of his "baby-mothers")? Or... that is a private money, so we are OK to run these difficult to describe, without feeling profound sorrow, experiments on our close animal cousins? Or... it is needed, because how else we learn... and so on.
I don't think even someone of his brilliance can always think these things through.
We wont be holding our breath awaiting Field Marshall Freder's apology for pushing the original legacy media fake "fact" check lies.
"Was Musk referring to the "transgender" experiments specifically, or more broadly such as experiments on beagles that came to light during Fauci's tenure?"
If you go to the link to the transcript and find the place, you can click there and play the audio and see who is talking. The material about the beagles is spoken by Rogan, not Musk.
The quote from Musk was used in that article about the botched fact-checking of Trump's speech.
Pitting the different factions of the Left against each other. Citizen minorities vs immigrant minorities. Labor vs globalists. Vax skeptics vs “science” followers. And now animal rights vs trans rights.
Political genius. Chipping away at Dem party discipline. Trump and Musk could do a better job of making it explicit, though.
JSM
It's a threat to "our democracy" meaning "their democracy." As a great philosopher once said "It's a big club, and you ain't in it." Any more than you are in "La Cosa Nostra" no matter how may times you say it, if you ain't "made," you ain't in it. Don't delude yourself, call it what it is, call both of them what they are "the Mafia."
"Does anyone believe that the mice experiments would have led to a decision to recommend against hormone therapy or transition surgery?"
I think it would lead to information about side effects that would need to be given in order to receive the kind of consent — informed consent — that is needed to avoid liability. So the person who wants female hormones will be warned that this could cause osteoporosis (or whatever the studies show). The patient could say, fine, I'll take that risk.
You may think there are more and better reasons not to undergo transgender therapy and maybe it should all be outlawed as unethical, but that's not where we are now and the scientists looking for side effects of treatment that is being given don't seem to be doing anything corrupt.
The government doesn't have to fund it, of course.
Did they discuss Neurolink's animal experiments and the torment of those animals for science?
Musk needs some radical transparency with his own animal experiments before he starts casting stones.
Great example of why it's good to remove "you know" and "uhm" and "like" from transcripts...
Thank you, Professor.
Doge and Musk are a threat to bureaucracy.
...and I'm just fine.
Adult mice? Children cannot offer informed consent to grooming and more corrupive methods of transgender conversion therapy. Planned Pethood? The Germans were progressive.
The sewer party does not care about women, girls, subjugated women in Islamic Theocracies, beagles, animals welfare in general - esp when it comes to their addiction to $$$$ and big pharma drugs.
"gender-affirming drugs" Male sex and masculine gender. Female sex and feminine gender. Homosexual, bisexual and transgender.
Democrats are now inspiring mass violence against Musk and Tesla.
The democrat party is a collective violent sewer - filled with insane violent antifa-Nazi mask wearing lunatics.
Whenever I see (thrice daily?) an attack on DOGE I think of these (connected?) facts:
We allocate billions for things like EV chargers but get somewhere between zero and damned few chargers (same pathetic results with so many other funding streams).
Congress critters make about $200k plus perks. Add in speaker fees and ... how the hell do they (and immediate family) become multi-millionaires?
DOGE found there were conspicuous absence of the ability to trace funds upon disbursement.
Untangling this web of enrichment on OUR dime is, IMO, the cornerstone of the rage Elon is facing.
Once again, the media "fact-checkers" make sure that everyone knows that the US government is, in fact, spending lots of taxpayer money to make mice transgender.
The man knows how to use that laser pointer.
Of course, hundreds of millions human beings participated in the field testing of the Covid-19 "vaccines". Remember those waiver of liability forms they had to sign to get the jab? A mouse doesn't have to give consent. How does a child give informed consent to puberty blockers or surgical interventions? Obviously, a parent or guardian will sign the consent form. How well informed are they? Does the consent form mention that some studies show that high percentages of childhood gender dysphoria cases resolve themselves without medical or surgical interventions?
Just asking.
Peachy said...
“Doge and Musk are a threat to bureaucracy.”
Excellent
Nothing to do with cancer and asthma research?
How does that even work? We rubes are told gender isn’t about biology, that it is all about how you feel. So how do they figure out how the mouse is feeling?
Dumb Lefty Mark: Did they discuss Neurolink's animal experiments and the torment of those animals for science?
Musk needs some radical transparency with his own animal experiments before he starts casting stones."
LOL
No Dumb Lefty Mark.
You utterly corrupt deep state establishment suckups need to sit back and stop throwing around your hoaxed up exposed BS lies for awhile and allow the the exposure of the tsunami of that corruption to be fully exposed.
But that's what you New Soviet Democraticals fear the most, isn't it?
Well, that and having pro-groomer policies and child sex trafficking reduced.
I would much rather see funds spent on finding out why "gender dysphoria" exists rather than "affirming" a person's mental confusion by drugging and dismembering him/her. It seems clear that transgenderism is much more a function of mass formation psychosis than anything else. Today's "tulip hysteria".
Soros Sludge(D) is pro-beagle torture.
"I think it would lead to information about side effects that would need to be given in order to receive [informed] consent".
Only if the study is designed to learn that specifically. Below is a study showing that transitioning female mice to males results in smaller ovaries, but the mice were euthanized without testing conclusively for fertility. The "suggestion" that the researchers chose to infer is that ovarian reserve - i.e. number of ova - is not compromised because the number of ova producing follicles doesn't change.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/36484619/
Soros Sludge(D) is pro-Beagle torture
@Alhouse, yes, we need to test drugs before we okay them to use on real humans. However I think we should use lawyers instead of rodents, because there are things even rats and mice won’t do.
Back in the late 1970s as an undergrad Chem student in college, I befriended a grad student studying the effects of acetominophen overdoses. She force fed rats vast amounts of Tylenol and then, 24 hours later, took their livers for analysis. She was a bit squeamish, so I helped her decapitate her victims - err - her research subjects, using a lab-standard rat guillotine in a lab sink. She came up with a lot of good, novel data that was published. I think her study cost about $500 total, other than her time and effort, for a few bottles of Tylenol and lab rats, raised in the Biology Dept for ongoing studies, which she got at in-house rates.
If $250,000,000 was spent for studies of hormone effects on mice and rats, there was a huge amount spent for overhead (researcher salaries, administration salaries, etc.) and they should have a pretty complete picture of the effects by now.
I'd bet the same could have been accomplished for a lot less. I also bet a lot of the studies were for the researchers' pet projects funded under the guise of grants for transgender studies, as that was a hot topic and $$$ were available if you put that term in the grant abstract.
In another significant body blow to Dumb Lefty Mark and LLR-democratical Rich, which will definitely leave a "mark" so to speak, we have this,:
BREAKING: DOGE announces the cancelation of a $600,000 grant to study "menstrual cycles in transgender men"
Thoughts and prayers for Dumb Lefty Mark and Rich at this difficult moment.
More waste found:
"12 billion dollars was allocated to the Navy for submarines and not one submarine was built.
42.5 billion dollars was allocated to hook people up to high-speed Internet, and not one single person was hooked up to high-speed Internet.
7.5 billion dollars was allocated to build EV charging stations. Only 37 stations were built. Thats 200 million per charging station.
Where is the rest of the money?"
X - Insurrection Barbie
I saw where they spliced some wooly mammoth DNA onto mice. The result was fluffy mice that looked kind of cute. Maybe they can integrate this into their studies of transgendered mice. I think really cute transgendered mice will help mice overcome their transphobia when around transgendered mice.
Nihimon said...
Great example of why it's good to remove "you know" and "uhm" and "like" from transcripts...
3/8/25, 8:27 AM
JD Vance makes up for that. It is very unusual for JD to have any ‘fillers’.
Musk is one of a kind. His daily problem set must be a kaleidoscopic mess. A dozen kids, four businesses, reforming the structure of the largest organization in world history, managing media, all while trying to have fun. Something is going to give.
These experiments sound awful, but this kind of emotional cherry-picking of the worst examples is just the flip side of "these cuts are causing babies to die of AIDS in Lesotho." Both sides are going to extremes either to justify or undermine the entire project.
While government does fund a lot of - potentially - useful studies (where else might the money come from?) there is so much dross hidden from the public eye that it is, indeed at this point, necessary to ‘throw the baby out with the bath water’.
Build back greater transparency about where every research dollar is going.
Calling a mouse "transgender" is oxymoronic. Think about it.
that was a fauci/collins project, why the latter is singing in the wrong key,
"(where else might the money come from?)"
stlcdr inadvertently highlights another big problematic aspect of this.
The testing of the effects of "Gender-Affirming" drugs and "Care" on mice (if that's all we're talking about here) seems perfectly reasonable and necessary as the "science" certainly isn't "settled" in regard to these practices, despite claims to the contrary, especially by those doctors profiting from this "Care".. Studies of people who have undergone this "Care" also need to be done. I seem to recall studies out of Europe and the UK reporting that the results are not good. Of course, these are not widely publicized. Which brings up another problem. If the studies are completed during a democrat presidency they won't be released and certainly won't be acted upon.
Good gravy!!! I had no idea. And three sizes to boot!!!
DOGE is doing good work. While a more methodical approach can be argued, the effects of the "Shock and Awe" way things are being done are quite heartening, especially the response by Democrats, exposing how dependent they are on bureaucracy and the courts to advance their policies, especially those not favored by most people.
Unfortunately, I don't see that any law could be put in place to prevent the next democrat president from completely restoring the "Deep State".
It must have been painful for Yahoo News, a relentless TDS leftmedia aggregator, to publish that.
And that they were using the studies to conduct gender mutilation on children...
A transgender mouse? Howzabout a gay gopher, or a lesbian lizard? Let's get something for our taxpayer money!
"Do you want more science about transgender medicine or don't you?"
"Politics is the use of authority to allocate scarce resources."
We could concentrate federal science spending on Alzheimer's, cancer, viral contagions, etc. or we could waste it on highly speculative research that is miles and years away from bringing any improvement in anyone's life if it ever does and is pursued primarily because it is trendy and supported by favored groups.
Our moneypot is not bottomless.
Gender dysphoria exists and has become an epidemic in the USA for exactly one reason. Before Obamacare, it was generally not covered by insurance. After Obamacare, every health insurance policy is required by law to cover "gender affirming medical care."
As someone pointed out, if you build it, they will come.
Both sides are going to extremes either to justify or undermine the entire project.
How is highlighting these examples going to extremes? It's right there in plain sight.
“ "12 billion dollars was allocated to the Navy for submarines and not one submarine was built.
42.5 billion dollars was allocated to hook people up to high-speed Internet, and not one single person was hooked up to high-speed Internet.
7.5 billion dollars was allocated to build EV charging stations. Only 37 stations were built. Thats 200 million per charging station.”
And somehow no employee unions or ngo’s sued Beiden to force him to release these congressional mandated dollars! Democrats were asleep at the switch.
Mark said...
Did they discuss Neurolink's animal experiments and the torment of those animals for science?
Musk needs some radical transparency with his own animal experiments before he starts casting stones.
There is a very bright line regarding what is acceptable vs unacceptable animal testing. As the man said, however, "I shall not today attempt further to define [it]; and perhaps I could never succeed in intelligibly doing so. But I [will] know it when I see it[.]"
Who that man is, i don't recall so I will just attribute it to the baseball great Yogi Berra.
"12 billion dollars was allocated to the Navy for submarines and not one submarine was built.
That one is not quite so straight forward. We have been commissioning ~1 virginia class boat a year for going on a decade now, maybe longer. We tried to accelerate to 2, but it had come back down some since then last i checked. Then we are also working on building the Columbia class to replace the Ohio class SSBNs. The first hull is in production right now. Several expensive long lead time items are also being competed (the reactor plant, for example). It takes a very significant investment upfront to get started on each hull, and it is not a quick build for good reason. It probably needs to be doubled or trippled to help grow the industry, but or maintenance infrastructure would struggle to keep up without lots of additional zeros in investment dollars as well, above and beyond the NSS-S and the other shipyard infrastructure investment initiative that i can't recall the name of right now.
So, yes, NAVSEA could use some improvement in acquisitions (looking at you, Constellation frigate and LCS programs!), but that $12B has not gone to waste.
Andy McCarthy over at NRO is arguing that the President cannot impound funds Congress has legislated for more than 45 days. That means that to make these cuts real, this Congress is going to have to excise all of these programs in a reconciliation bill. Unlikely to occur as some Republicans have their hands in these pots as well.
People who think they are transgender are mentally ill. They need to be cared for in an asylum.
"So like, you probably saw like, you know, let's say, like, Trump as a threat to our democracy, which is ironic since he was elected with the majority of the, you know, popular vote."
Every time I read a transcription of Musk's conversation, I'm struck by his poor ability to speak articulately, which indicates to me a poor, or at least sloppy, mind. But to the point: what kind of idiot thinks a person who gains office by the popular vote* cannot become a threat to that society's freedom? (There's also nothing "ironic" about it.) Many tyrants have won office by popular votes.
Also, it is NOT "transgender mice," for fuck's sake, it's transgenic mice.
*(Just a reminder: the popular vote was split almost evenly for and against Trump. The percentage difference between the Trump popular votes and the Harris popular votes was only 1.5%. Even a meager majority is a majority, yes, but it is false to suggest Trump won office by a landslide or that he has a majority mandate by the American people to make the changes he is making.)
You say transgender, I say transgenic...
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