"But I've spent hours and hours having civil discussions of politics and policy with him, not on social media but in person, one on one. For years, we worked closely together on a monthly student publication in high school. So I wasn't surprised in 2014 when I heard Howard Dean, the former head of the Democratic National Committee, say during a TV appearance with him: 'I happen to know Ben, and he's one of the smartest people under 35 in the entire country.' (He's now 38.) If you know Ben, you know he's an incredibly hard worker who's passionate about putting his progressive ideals into action. I'm confident that Ben Wikler is the right person to lead the Democrats in our home state."
Writes my son John, over at his blog, with information on how to help Ben Wikler as he runs for chair of the Democratic Party in Wisconsin. I myself am not a member of any party, and I don't contribute to any candidates or even endorse them. I often won't even tell you who got my vote, and when I do, my political caginess is such that people often misremember what I've admitted to. I wish I had a dollar for every time some commenter over at Instapundit has asserted that I voted for Obama twice. And only a handful of people know who got my vote for President in 2016. I'm about standing back and observing. But I like linking to John's blog, and he certainly does know Ben very well. I know Ben very well too. That "monthly student publication" they worked on got edited right here in the house where I still live. I've had long conversations with Ben, from when he was a teenager, and he's just an all-around fine person.
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८७ टिप्पण्या:
“he's just an all-around fine person.”
And the fact that he is a Dem is a tragedy. I know many Dems. I used to be a Democrat. But today’s Democrat party is radical and insane. GND. Pack SCOTUS. 16 year olds voting. Kavanaugh hearings. Open borders. Iran Deal. BDS. Medicare for all. Etc.
And one good person can’t change the party. The loons are in charge.
Being nice, or cordial, or even intelligent on top of all that does not assure that you are not simply wrong and provably so. Ideology is a hell of a drug. If you've had the same beliefs since childhood, it is your duty to seriously question it, not just once but anytime new evidence comes to you.
As has been said here recently, intelligence includes a increased ability to find novel ways to fool yourself, or talk yourself out of what you see right in front of you. The more intelligent you are the more elaborate your self-deception can get. Intelligent people need to be especially vigilant, and self-challenging.
I wonder what Ben thinks about those who are Trump apologists. I imagine he must be surprised as are most Democrats that people actually still think Trump is a fine person. I bet Ben doesn’t think that Democrats should now just pretend that Trump isn’t the biggest fraud in Presidential history. I bet Ben wants to see the House continue its investigations. I bet Ben didn’t vote for Trump and would never ever vote for someone like Trump or be an apologist for Trump.
From Move On website:
"Whether it’s supporting a candidate, passing legislation, or changing our culture, MoveOn members are committed to an inclusive and progressive future. We envision a world marked by equality, sustainability, justice, and love. And we mobilize together to achieve it."
Do you think Wikler could name one conservative he loves? How would he describe Scott Walker?
Your son is in Lala Land Althouse if he thinks a longtime Moveon operative is what Wisconsin Dem party or any state Dem party needs. Moveon is a hate group IMO.
“Description: Benjamin McDonald Wikler is an American political campaigner and Senior Advisor at MoveOn.org. On February 21, 2019, he announced his campaign to run for chair of the Democratic Party of Wisconsin. Wikipedia”
Senior advisor at Move On.org? Oh yes the very fine people here are going to take John and Althouse’s word that Ben is a very fine person. I believe Ben is a very fine person. Good luck Ben!
Not to pile on young Ben, who is no doubt a fine person, but he’s also well on his way to barking mad. It’s an interesting question. If an otherwise rational person internalizes patently bizarre beliefs, is he merely ignorant? Naive and gullible? That seems unlikely at 38. Or are they willfully mining that vein of insanity that lies in all of us. When I was a wee lad, it was a given that Birchers and CPUSAers alike could be dismissively laughed at. Strange to see the nuttiness celebrated and mainstreamed.
The Dems in WI are rabid. Here in CA, they are numerous and rabid. Heck! The Dems are rabid. It wasn’t always the case.
- Krumhorn
@David Begley Your comment seems insane to me. It's an argument for dropping out of all politics and letting the worst people have all the power. The implication that Republicans don't have corresponding problems isn't supported by anything. I'm keeping a high standard of moderation on this post. I'm really not interested in a general attack on the Democratic Party here. The party exists and is powerful in our 2-party system and it's going to be around and having an effect, so I am rooting for the best people to come into leadership positions. I feel the same way about Republicans.
I don't vote in Wisconsin so I'm not a registered Democrat there. But I would be curious to ask John's friend who aspires to leading the Dems in Wisconsin how he feels about the Democrat Party's embracing of Socialism and anti-semitism? Does he see this as a good thing? A progressive way of thinking? Does he see the folks who do embrace that way of thinking as his target audience?
Is that where he wants to take the Wisconsin Dems?
Or are they already there?
I agree with your comment, Ann. I long for the days of having at least 2, sometimes 3 parties to consider. It's been a long time since I even considered the Dems seriously. I sent in a previous response with that in mind. The questions I asked are real concerns about the direction of that party.
Isn’t going to happen.
The Progs won’t allow it.
At best, he's a Useful Idiot.
Ben Wikler is the kindest, bravest, warmest, most wonderful human being I’ve ever known in my life. He is the right person who identifies as a man to be the head of the Wisconsin Democratic Party.
"The implication that Republicans don't have corresponding problems isn't supported by anything. I'm keeping a high standard of moderation on this post."
That's just lazy and false equivalence
So stick to a high standard and make your case. Who are the Republican versions of AOC, Rashida Tlaib, Sanders, or Beto. That is, national figures who want to eliminate basic protections of the Constitution, change our very economic system to one which is historically failed, who openly express racist attitudes, want to allow non-citizens and whoever else they can to vote simply so they can win, people who support trying to overthrow a duly elected President for any reason they can find, and who are supported by their party and major media organizations.
Who are they?
There are very fine people on both sides 😂. Good luck to Ben. It would be nice if we could debate ideas again, not take each other out at the knees with every “discussion.”
I began my moderation on this post with a fair amount of vigor, mainly because (as my comment above shows) I didn't want the thread to get hijacked into just trashing the Democratic Party. Ben is a specific person and that's what the post was about, and it seems knee-jerk and vague to just say the party is extreme and crazy and so forth. The question is who can be effective at bringing the party to a more beneficial and useful place. I appreciate comments that are from the viewpoint of wanting what is good for America. I don't want the comments filling up with GOP hackery or whatever.
Anyway... in retrospect, I wanted to put back something that looks better to me on second view than it did at first when I moderated it out. Someone wrote, "I thought you said he was a Democrat." And then Meade (yes, I moderated out my own husband) responded: "You also had some very fine people on both sides. I’ve condemned Democrats. I’ve condemned many different groups. But not all of those people were Democrats, believe me. You had many people in that group other than Democrats and illiberal socialists. The press has treated them absolutely unfairly."
bagoh20 said...
As has been said here recently, intelligence includes a increased ability to find novel ways to fool yourself, or talk yourself out of what you see right in front of you. The more intelligent you are the more elaborate your self-deception can get. Intelligent people need to be especially vigilant, and self-challenging.
An undeniable truth.
One question for everyone is pretty simple -- am I applying this standard to myself, or using it as a stick against someone else?
The Democratic Party, originally The Democratic-Republican Party led by slave owners Madison and Jefferson, was distinctly pro-slavery — pro-slavery built on codified white racism and white supremacy. Andrew Jackson, also pro-slavery, dropped "Republican" for, simply, "Democratic." Ironically, the name "Republican" returned to partisan politics in 1854—right here in Ben's state of Wisconsin—when the anti-slavery GOP was founded.
Madison, Jefferson, Jackson, Lincoln... Obviously, for nearly 250 years, there have been some very fine people... on both sides.
I know Althouse doesn’t like “back and forth” and anti-Dem rhetoric, but here’s hoping a little follow-up will pass moderation, since it is specifically about prior posts:
Begley said: “today’s Democrat party is radical and insane. GND. Pack SCOTUS. 16 year olds voting. Kavanaugh hearings. Open borders. Iran Deal. BDS. Medicare for all. Etc.”
Althouse said: “@David Begley Your comment seems insane to me. It's an argument for dropping out of all politics and letting the worst people have all the power. The implication that Republicans don't have corresponding problems isn't supported by anything.”
What “corresponding problems” might those be? As far as I know, the GOP does not favor anything as “radical and insane” as “GND. Pack SCOTUS. 16 year olds voting. Kavanaugh hearings. Open borders. Iran Deal. BDS. Medicare for all.”
What’s “insane” about Begley’s comment? He lists what prominent Dems advocate. He calls the apparent support of an otherwise fine person for a party advocating those proposals a “tragedy.” He says one fine person cannot change a party in which loons are in charge. You can disagree, of course, but how is it “insane”?
Nor is Begley’s point an argument for dropping out of politics: it’s just a sketch of an argument for not supporting the “radical and insane” politics of today’s Dems. Nor is Begley in fact “dropping out of politics”—considering that he is one of the best reporters on politicians’ speeches in his region.
Two people advocating for the same policies, but one having a nice authenticity while the other seems to be a raving nut doesn't appear to be a real difference to me. It is like putting lipstick on a pig.
I’m quite sure that there are commenters here that think ALL Democrats are illiberal socialists or even “Stalinists”. Sorry, but I don’t see anything positive and beneficial to our country coming out of the Trump Republican Party at this point. Maybe one day they can take their Party back. I wish them luck and I mean that sincerely.
Who are the Republican versions of AOC, Rashida Tlaib, Sanders, or Beto. That is, national figures who want to eliminate basic protections of the Constitution, change our very economic system to one which is historically failed,
I agree with the whole comment.
"The question is who can be effective at bringing the party to a more beneficial and useful place. I appreciate comments that are from the viewpoint of wanting what is good for America."
As Inga notes, that Washington directorship of MoveOn.org is a huge hurdle to jump over. Good luck to him if he is a good person, but he has been working for some shady characters. He appears to be in Al Franken's and Elizabeth Warren's orbit. He is obviously an energetic person who identifies as a man.
It takes all kinds to make a world.
We don't need "fine" people or even good ones. We need people dedicated to doing the right things. That's what makes them fine, good people, not the other way around. Many fine people have done a lot of damage becuase they were just wrong on the issues, the focus, the facts. I know a lot of very nice people who can't keep their finances in check, control their impulses, or stay out of trouble in a variety of other ways.
When you want a particular job done, you want someone who knows how to do it and hopefully has done it already. If they don't like me or I don't like them personally, that's just fine with me. Do the job required, period. In the end, a politician is not the welcome mat on your front porch or a bumper sticker that tells everyone who you are as a person. In the end, they will either help improve the government or not, and that's all you get out of them.
To a large extent, competency and character trumps ideology when it comes to voting for a governor or POTUS (no pun intended with "trump", I've used that phrase long before he got into politics). I'm not a member or supporter of either political party, but I would use the same criteria if I had a say.
"The question is who can be effective at bringing the party to a more beneficial and useful place."
Professor, I'm honestly not sure that anyone can. What's the standard for 'useful'? Or 'beneficial'? My standard or moveon's standard? Though I'm sure he's a nice person, a Senior Advisor from moveon.org (if he actually was) is probably not going to be that person for me.
But I'm not of Wisconsin and have my own battles right here in Flahreeda.
You should have known using the term "fine person" would trigger some people. I don't think that was your intent, or was it?
The people of Venezuela loved Hugo Chavez. He said the right things, represented what they thought was good, but in the end, he, his wife, his friends and their successors robbed and ruined a nation, because he was simply wrong about what works and what doesn't, and neither he or anybody else ever proved their concept by making those ideas work. That, and he was a fraud who stole the wealth of his people, but that still would have been sustainable and OK for the people of Valenzuela if he was simply right about his ideas for the country, but he was exactly wrong. That is what matters: plan and ability, which is another way of saying ideology and experience.
Democrats believe in central planning of the economy and people’s lives.
They are antithetical to freedom.
They believe in forcing us to bake cakes. They believe in forcing us to pay for eugenics.
Conservatives like to force people to do what they want too. But they are pussies and you can tell them to shove off as the Democrats have demonstrated for several decades. Also the Republican Party now serves Republican voters and we just want to be left alone.
The point is that you cannot be a member of the Democrat Party and be a good person at this point. You are knowingly serving, and being, evil.
Economy is roaring. Job openings outnumber unemployed by millions. Wages are up for the first time in decades. Endless wars are being ended.
Democrats oppose this. They openly say they want the economy to be worse.
They are running a Stalinist attack on people who worked for trump. Lives are being ruined.
It is time people stopped enabling this shit.
The party is evil and so is anyone in it.
If we're not to view "young" (I guess 38 is young if your reference group is Bernie and Biden) Mr. Wikler as a MoveOn guy with progressive "ideals" (certainly not "ideology!"), then this is a curiously ad hominem post about some guy Althouse liked when he was in high school.
I guess that we're supposed to be impressed by this testimonial: I've spent hours and hours having civil discussions of politics and policy with him, not on social media but in person, one on one, but conspicuously absent is any recollection of a time when Young Mr. Wikler ever amended his political views in response to the arguments made by his independent-thinking friend. Without such evidence this post seems like an exercise in civility bullshit.
Did I just get blocked for asking if this candidate for statewide chair of a major politcal party ever had a real job outside politics?
The most dangerous thing to a democracy is for the people to expect too much from their government and too little from their politicians. The ideal politician works hard and diligently at assuring the government does as little harm as possible, becuase it's the most powerful force in our lives outside of nature, and just as dangerous. Look at history. What has destroyed the most, killed the most? 1) Nature, 2) Government. Good politicians know their job, and their limitations.
To a degree leadership as a personal case does not matter very much, with some exceptions at the extremes, a Napoleon say, or the right man at the right time at some turning point, pretty much where chance decides, and his presence being also an element of chance.
What matters are things of the mass, culture, incentives, economics. You do not get a system to work by being virtuous, but by the mass changing, and especially that caste that produces the leaders. One virtuous man in a horde of the incompetent is spitting into the wind. Indeed it is very likely that the virtuous man simply becomes a cog in the mechanism of corruption and incompetence. These things are greater than individuals.
The high road to personal corruption is when a man of virtue has to serve an evil system, where his duty obliges him to protect and justify his superiors and predecessors, and in leadership, that structure he has taken over, all those inadequate people he is now responsible for. Thats when ones powers to rationalize are required to operate at a high level.
The Democratic Party, originally The Democratic-Republican Party led by slave owners Madison and Jefferson, was distinctly pro-slavery — pro-slavery built on codified white racism and white supremacy. Andrew Jackson, also pro-slavery, dropped "Republican" for, simply, "Democratic."
I've seen that criticism made of Democrats here frequently. It's not entirely fair. The anti-civil rights Dixiecrats are now predominately GOP. That switch started with Nixon's southern strategy which began the shift of the then solidly Democratic deep south to a GOP bastion. I'm pretty sure that Andrew Jackson would feel more at home in the present GOP than the Democratic party. Not sure whether Lincoln or Teddy Roosevelt would now support the GOP.
My point is not dis the GOP or prop up the Dems. Just that both parties' positions have migrated over time and it's close to meaningless to blame or boast about what either party did over 100 years ago.
My point is not dis the GOP or prop up the Dems. Just that both parties' positions have migrated over time and it's close to meaningless to blame or boast about what either party did over 100 years ago.
Well said.
The Democratic party system and its policies are the result of the interest groups that depend on it and back it. These are in fact a combination of that ancient Marxist bugbear "finance capital", of the bureaucracies of all the various levels of government, the US leadership caste almost in total, and the corporatist elements that depend on their relationship with government. These lead, but depend on a mass of poor people dependent to a great degree on givernment benefits to provide a voting mass.
These combine between them, as a resultant product, to produce not Stalinist or communist or even socialist ideologies, but a generalized corporatism operated by what amounts to an aristocracy. Imagine a hereditary oligarchic fascism.
Sorry, but I don’t see anything positive and beneficial to our country coming out of the Trump Republican Party at this point.
Ending the ISIS caliphate is not positive? Unemployment for blacks and Hispanics at historically low levels is not beneficial to our country? Real wage growth at the lower end of the economic ladder is — what? Somehow bad?
EDH said... "Did I just get blocked for asking if this candidate for statewide chair of a major politcal party ever had a real job outside politics?"
I rejected your comment for publication because of the way you asked it. I don't have it to refer to but you didn't say "this candidate." You used an abusive term.
I am rejecting nearly all comments that address the moderation, though they do work as private messages to me (that I can't respond to). I am publishing and responding to this because you are a good commenter and you asked a decent question, but I found the reference to the candidate with an abusive term (something like "idiot" or whatever) unacceptable.
An even better comment would be to look up his record and simply provide us with the fact.
The phrase "real job" is also rough. We know what you mean but it makes it feel like you dropped in to take a shot in the easiest way. Don't do that.
Sorry, but I don’t see anything positive and beneficial to our country coming out of the Trump Republican Party at this point.
Ending the ISIS caliphate is not positive? Unemployment for blacks and Hispanics at historically low levels is not beneficial to our country? Real wage growth at the lower end of the economic ladder is — what? Somehow bad?
Political parties have positions, ideology, platforms and legislative and governing goals. Being a nice person is nice but irrelevant. FDR and LBJ were not nice guys but they were very effective in promoting their party's goals. Begley summed up it well, it's not his problem he exposed a raw nerve. Perhaps the Democrat Party as it is currently constituted has left you and you aren't ready to reconsider that fact yet.
Sorry, but I don’t see anything positive and beneficial to our country coming out of the Trump Republican Party at this point.
Hilarious that someone who objects to Democrats being called "Socialists" when their presidential candidates mostly called them selves this. OK, maybe Stalinists" is a bit extreme.
But that commenter says what is quoted above. Lack of insight is a prominent feature of mental illness.
"The question is who can be effective at bringing the party to a more beneficial and useful place."
Then the question is how the hell would such a person win in today's party. I accept that the Democrats are the party opposed to what I believe works best, but they could use a lot more people like Joe Lieberman in my opinion. I think that would make them a more successful party, even though I don't want them to win, but I do want the alternative to my preference not be a dangerous alternative. I'm not going to vote for a Democrat just becuase they're more reasonable than others, but I wish the Democrats would do that. I don't know what someone like me can do to make the other party more sane. The one thing that would work is for the Republicans to trounce the unreasonable Democrats in elections. How about you concerned Dems cross over and fix your party that way. It will actually make your party better. It may be the only way to get there.
In 1990, 26 years after the 64 Civil Rights Act, 25 years after the Voting Rights Act, 22 years after the “southern strategy” after 8 years of Reagan and two years of Bush 41, how many southern legislatures did the GOP control? Answer:0. They took the Florida Senate in 1992. The avalanche started in 1994 after the Hillarycare debacle. The Clintons turned the South GOP.
Sorry. But this Ben Wikler fellow seems like a hateful person and perfectly horrible race-baiter who literally hides behind the statements of others, all in order to advance his status within progressive politics.
Kushner’s fellow Jewish Harvard alumni attack him ahead of their reunion
Member of liberal social action group shares some of the traditional notes sent by graduates ahead of event
Ben Wikler, the Washington director of MoveOn.Org, the liberal social action group (and like Kushner a Harvard class of 2003 grad), recently shared some of the entries from Harvard’s “Red Book” — it’s a Harvard tradition for alumni to submit notes about themselves ahead of reunions, Wikler noted on his Twitter feed.
The upcoming reunion starts this Thursday, and some of the Red Book notes weren’t kind to the president’s son-in-law and adviser.
Said Ben Wikler ✔ @benwikler...
"Jared Kushner didn’t send in a note for Harvard’s 15th Anniversary Report. But flip to the page where his entry would go and you’ll find this, the end of a note from an alphabetically adjacent classmate. May 19, 2018."
"I never imagined a resurgence of Nazism as I grew up, the secure granddaughter of Holocaust-fleeing German immigrants," one said. 'Mostly, I feel a low-grade, constant horror as I watch attacks on refugees, minorities, my most at-risk patients, women’s rights and the environment, and new threats of nuclear war. Our classmate Jared Kushner surely knows that climate change is real and yet he watches as regulations are dismantled daily. Shame on you, Jared Kushner.”
Wikler posted another five with pretty much the same message and only slight variations in tone, ranging from the outraged to the sarcastic.
“I, for one, am actually relieved that our class of ’03 has a real, live fascist among us,” said Jon Sherman, also the descendant of Holocaust survivors. “Who says Harvard isn’t diverse!”
The Jewish Kushner, who used to be a Democrat, was vice president of the campus Friends of Chabad and played Junior Varsity Squash. He is now best known for fathering the grandchildren of the man liberal America loves to hate.
The Boston Globe obtained a copy of the Red Book and found some more Jared jibes, although it noted that out of 1,600 members, the number of such protests was relatively small.
Still, among those who did register protests, many appeared to be Jewish. Chanda Prescod-Weinstein, who also wrote “Shame on you” in her entry, was prompted in part by Kushner’s appearance last week at the opening of the new US embassy in Jerusalem while Israeli troops killed some 60 Palestinians attempting to breach the fence between Israel and the Gaza Strip.
“He was in Jerusalem with his wife while people were being massacred,” she told the Globe. “I feel so emotional about that. People were being massacred. He’s a person who is doing horrible things. As a black woman and a Jewish woman, I think it’s disgusting.”
Israel said the protests were orchestrated by the Hamas terror group and used as cover for attempted terror attacks and breaches of the border fence.Hamas has subsequently admitted that 50 of the dead were members of the terror group. Three others were Islamic Jihad members.
Don’t look out for the Kushner entry — the first son-in-law did not submit one.
Unfortunately, the article didn't say whether Winkler had anything to say for himself.
Let's hear from Ben Wikler here and let us judge for ourselves.
You used an abusive term. I found the reference to the candidate with an abusive term (something like "idiot" or whatever) unacceptable.
I thought I said "this guy"?
Repeating my post from another thread...
***But plumbers can do their jobs without bothering with philosophy***
The job To keep a Republic. H/T Ben Franklin
My question ...
Can citizens?
Can party President? Etc
it is very likely that the virtuous man simply becomes a cog in the mechanism of corruption and incompetence.
Brings to mind the Victorian expression, "One cannot touch pitch without being defiled," which applies to virtually every political organization in history. But then there's TR's Man in the Arena, which we can extend to the event organizers and fundraisers.
IIRC, Jefferson ran his harshly-partisan house organ out of the White House. When will Dorsey cut off Trump's?
Amexpat, The Republican party remains anti-slavery, pro-freedom, party that wants all people treated as equals regardless of race. The Democratic party remains dedicated to taking as much of the product of people's work as possible, and doling out government benefits based on race, and treating people differently under the law based on race. Are you saying they have reversed or are now equal, because I don't see how you can say either.
“The phrase "real job" is also rough. We know what you mean but it makes it feel like you dropped in to take a shot in the easiest way. Don't do that.”
What if the easy shot is also relevant and on target? We’re talking about politicians here, not the Little Sisters of the Freakin’ Poor.
I have paternal feeling for my children’s friends, too (well, the ones that I liked). It doesn’t mean I don’t try to see them clearly.
I can only Dream that my Oregon representatives are the Best for America.
don't look at evil, so i ignore the senator who is a kookette and will not name his name.
@RonWyden is my only Senator then, and of course he wants to be Best, but his is such a tough and potent spot, and sadly, he has barked the corrupt Dems'gospel.
@repschrader is my rep, & he gets press as a voice of moderation, and no doubt aims for that, but whoa! he went with every flow of obamaton-ness.
#SerenePoliceState? What #SerenePoliceState?
the democratic power blob has a pull and current that is deep and swift.
it would be Great if democrats joined everybody else and foamed-killed their beast.
but, wait! haha, i actually came on to announce <> i am taking 4 hours off my #AmericanParade and holding four 40-minute HighWatches, in honor of this historic lovely weekend and our duly elected President and all his stubborn supporters of every color and nation, May I be still and know most high Good is streaming on every enemy and every friend, in all the world, cada una, cada uno, every One. y, por supuesto, a ustedes tambien. salud!
"I thought I said "this guy"?"
I thought a lot before refusing to publish what you wrote, and it struck me as an undesirable tone for speaking about an individual I know on my blog. Feel free to write about him somewhere else.
Althouse has met Ben and finds him to be a fine person and that is good enough for me.
What I wonder about is sort of meta to this and it is the note that Howard Dean likes Ben. Not being a Democrat, I've no idea what sort of ideas he brings up in Democrats--conservative? Progressive? Has-been, deranged? I do know he just gave credit (on Twitter) to President Obama and his team for the recent final defeat of Isis. So I think mainstream (non-Democrats) are likely placing Dean on the "deranged" spectrum of attributes.
I feel like the new generation in each party builds upon older statesmen who lend gravitas and respectability to the party. This gives an opening, a kind of good-will that makes a skeptic listen to the new guy rather than just dismiss him as a kook. So, if Ben is a reasonable and good guy, how does he get anywhere when the base of his party is filled with nut-jobs like Dean?
"One question for everyone is pretty simple -- am I applying this standard to myself, or using it as a stick against someone else?"
Just knowing the double edged nature of intelligence is some inoculation. Personally, I try to avoid overly sophisticated explanations or understandings of things. I try to keep language simple, and respect the track record of Occam's razor. I have changed my mind on a lot of issues, and continue to, but high intelligence is not something I suffer from.
interrupt here, i meant to say, this post of such a brave democrat raised my hopes, rested my heart and started a natural prayer mind, and that is why I posted my previous post here. Praise most high good for people of every party and belief, i do believe if we truly raise our minds and hearts to that Most High Good calling us individually, physics or poetry, however that expresses, the world is truly saved. most high good guide this young ben. salud.
“I've seen that criticism made of Democrats here frequently. It's not entirely fair. The anti-civil rights Dixiecrats are now predominately GOP.”
What has not changed is the Democrat’s cynical, deliberate, and vicious exploitation of African-Americans. The plantation is no longer a farm, the crop is no longer cotton, but it’s still all about keeping Black folks down so the Democrats can harvest votes and graft. 100, or even 200, years is not very long and it’s easy enough to track the progression and consistency of the Democrat’s use of Black folks.
"... but I found the reference to the candidate with an abusive term (something like "idiot" or whatever) unacceptable."
"The phrase "real job" is also rough. We know what you mean but it makes it feel like you dropped in to take a shot in the easiest way. Don't do that.
Althouse posts a piece about a man running for political office. His experience is:
• "He worked on political campaigns starting in high school, helping Democrats including [now-Senator] Tammy Baldwin [and then-Senator] Russ Feingold. . ."
• He is a "MoveOn senior adviser".
His goal? "It's time to supercharge our party in every corner of the state to fight for our progressive agenda..."
One of the common complaints about a supercharged 'Progressive agenda' is how little it seems to take into account how the 'real world' works.
One of the ways of possessing such knowledge of that is experience in a "real job". You know: quantifiable success. Repercussions for failure. Basic book-keeping. The need to adapt quickly.
From High School Political Volunteer to Political Action Group Senior Adviser to Elected Political Position is an arc from which one can draw conclusions.
If doing so is a shot in "the easiest way' then perhaps non-idiot politicians could prepare for their career by getting a wider breadth of experience; one could infer that - by not doing so - they see no importance in obtaining such a better understanding of these things their constituents experience in their lives.
Hell, even Althouse herself can point to a 'real job' stint between Law School student and Law School Professor.
And the idea of EDH getting blocked confirms my reticence in embracing the New Moderation Era.
I am Laslo.
He's no doubt a nice person, but the qualifying question is: does he believe Trump colluded with Russia?
How about you concerned Dems cross over and fix your party that way
And they think the same about Trump supporters, in spades. The scary part is that 90% of the electorate seems to be stuck to its side, regardless of the candidates.
I am sure that the time that Mr. Wikler has spent with the Althouse clan has been enjoyable for everyone.
But what are we to make of the agitprop smear that Mr. Wikler conducted against his classmate Jared Kushner. His little story about the Harvard 15th Reunion Red Book made Newsweek, Times of Israel, Boston Magazine, Boston.com, People, Boston Globe, the Jewish Telegraphic Agency, the Daily Wire, the Hill, Forward, the Daily Mail, Boingboing.net, Washingtonpress.com, and others.
Well, not so good, is it. It was a class reunion, not a political event.
In the Sermon on the Mount it says, "By their fruits ye shall know them." Mr. Wikler has a way to go to make my hit parade.
My view is that it is going to take an epic defeat of the Dems in 2020 for the sane Dems to take back the party. Maybe Ben will be part of that.
If the Dems win with Bernie, Harris or Beto, the GOP will go wild in opposition. Unity? Ha!
His twitter feed is revealing, he seems a standard issue progressive right down to the buzz words. I'd never support the guy, but then, I'm not a Democrat for a reason.
The Jewish Kushner, who used to be a Democrat, was vice president of the campus Friends of Chabad and played Junior Varsity Squash. He is now best known for fathering the grandchildren of the man liberal America loves to hate."
This is from the "nice" guy? Someone should clue him in to the fact Liberal America is a distinct minority of America. This is starting to look like 1972 but in 1972 the Democrats weren't openly anti-Semitic. Trump isn't Nixon, he won't walk away and this time the Republicans aren't going to join in overthrowing Trump. The Democrat and Republican parties used to have a significant amount of overlap which is why the Civil Rights Act of 1964 was passed and why Medicare was passed. Not anymore. Funny thing is that not so long ago Trump's positions were mainstream Democrat positions. Trump drives Democrats crazy because he fights like a Democrat and reminds them ( and a lot of their less progressive voters) that he is an older version Democrat who has and will draw those voters away from the current progressive version.
AA said: "...he's just an all-around fine person."
Then all the best to him. Our Nation, and especially the Democrat Party, need more of that kind of person.
Here's hoping he doesn't go native, if he decides to make a career out of it.
And I also agree with AA's 11:16 AM comment.
(I'm feeling perfectly well at the moment, but I may get the house checked for radon next week, just to be safe.)
But what are we to make of the agitprop smear that Mr. Wikler conducted against his classmate Jared Kushner.
Or did he intend to make his other classmates look nasty/deranged? OK, probably not. No Blaska he.
"I thought I said "this guy"?"
Hardly a pejorative.
This Guy... Reminds me that my first album was Herb Alpert's "The Beat of the Brass" (just like Kira Knightly in Seeking a Friend for the End of the World).
As a child I liked crazy dancing to the peppy Tijuana Brass instrumental horns.
But now I'm having a flashback to how much one video from the 1968 TV special shaped my early conception of cis-gendered, hetero-normal courtship ritual.
This Guy's in Love with You
"You see, this guy"... I wanted to be... "This Guy"!
But just watch the video. No wonder my sex life has been so limited!
"Chanda Prescod-Weinstein, who also wrote “Shame on you”"
Prescod-Weinstein... why does
that name sound familiar...
The Democratic party remains dedicated to taking as much of the product of people's work as possible, and doling out government benefits based on race, and treating people differently under the law based on race.
Two issues here, big government and racial politics. Regarding big government, the Jefferson and Jackson Democrats were generally against big government and a strong federal government. The first federal income tax was introduced by Lincoln and the first federal corporate tax was proposed by Taft. Yes, there are historic counter examples, but being a Democrat didn't automatically mean being for a bigger more progressive government until FDR. I believe that the first use of Progressive was done by Teddy Roosevelt, although as a third party candidate when he didn't get the GOP nomination.
I don't see racial politics as clearly black and white as you and many of the other commenters here. Most of the hard core racists were Democrats until Wallace ran his third party campaign. I'd include the highly educated Woodrow Wilson in that category and offer TR as an enlightened counter example. After Wallace's defeat there was a migration of those
who supported segregation to the GOP. It didn't happen all at once, and the nominating of southerners Carter and Clinton slowed that trend. There also were other factors in the southern shift to the GOP. The Dems lost the evangelical vote over abortion and other social issues. But, someone like a David Duke would now run in the GOP primary whereas from at least 1968 and before he would have run in the Democratic primary.
It get your point about the "racist" aspect of affirmative action. Technically it is racism and on the whole I'm against admission to universities or getting jobs based on skin color or self reported ethnic background. I do see the value in diversity and helping the underprivileged, but that should be based on the communities you come from and the real adversities you faced. But I think you go over the top in the link between taxation and doling out benefits based on race - what percentage of the budget would that be? Also, the wrongs I see with affirmative action pales to the wrongs of segregation.
"I happen to know Ben, and he's one of the smartest people under 35 in the entire country." I thought he was talking about Ben Shaprio.
After reading everyone’s comments, it seems 2 different things are being discussed.
One is a fine person and one is politics.
One can be a fine person, nice, thoughtful, helpful, considerate, rational, etc., and he may be all those things as a person, but he worked for MoveOn.
He hasn’t changed.
Some of us learned our lessons in 2006, which Nancy tried again in 2018. For some of us, that 2006 lesson was reinforced 2009-2016.
And that’s why we got Not Tired of Winning Yet.
From what I’ve read and listened to, it seems this generation is as arrogant as the 60s boomers. Cause it’s going to work this time.
And it seems Ann, you keep looking for something or someone to put the genie back in the bottle or trying to close the barn door.
China or Iran might be somewhat unifying. I just hope and pray it’s not because they’re picking the bones of our carcass.
A solid Democrat cannot reform the party any more than solid Republicans could reform the GOP.
It took Trump to reform the GOP, as reform means pushing LLR's out and bringing new people in. It will take a party outsider to do the same to the donks.
As Howard Schultz is proving, that won't be allowed to happen until at least 2024.
It will take a party outsider to do the same to the donks.
I should add that like Trump, it won't be "a nice guy" who makes it happen.
People who are nice lack the necessary ability to throw overboard what must be jettisoned.
David Burge @iowahawkblog
1. Identify a respected institution.
2. kill it.
3. gut it.
4. wear its carcass as a skin suit, while demanding respect
On these terms we have D = a zombies party.
***People who are nice lack the necessary ability to throw overboard what must be jettisoned***
Is there enough viable cells for regeneration?
I'm surprised the governor doesn't get to handpick his state party chairman, but maybe his hand is hidden and he's happy with any henchman.
If Wikler was in Washington, what's he doing in Wisconsin? When was he wired in to the state party workers and wacktivists?
The problem always is when do you say, no, I am not going to do that.
If your job is agitation (persistent urging of a political or social cause or theory before the public) and propaganda (information, especially of a biased or misleading nature, used to promote or publicize a particular political cause or point of view), it is very hard to adapt whatever fine feelings you may have (for example, a commitment to truth, to honesty, to a "Golden Rule" approach to life) to doing that work. I suspect that the more involved you become in political agitation and propaganda, the harder it is to say "no".
If Jared Kushner were going to give a policy speech at Harvard, he is firmly in the public arena and it is open season.
If Jared Kushner is coming to your friend's child's bar mitzvah, a good person lays off--it's personal.
If Jared Kushner is coming to his college class reunion, and he is unpopular with some (perhaps small) group of classmates, what do you do? I would say that a good person would lay off Kushner.
A person who doesn't lay off and instead creates and promotes a story to the media about it has a bigger commitment to political agitation than to being a good person--and indeed, is probably confused about what a good person does. It is not a public forum; it is a personal and private event insofar as Kushner and his classmates are concerned.
Would Wikler have gotten anywhere if he had put out a press story saying that Ben Wikler, Washington director of MoveOn.org, disapproves of his classmate Jared Kushner and thinks he is a Nazi? I think not.
Politics makes louts of us all.
Fine people don't belong to organizations that kill newborn babies, conspire to frame political opponents for crimes that they themselves committed, traffic in racism and sexism for profit and power, advocate for the supremacy of foreigners and criminals and a justice system based on racial and gendered spoils system, work to cheat our electoral college and election system, whip citizens up in a frenzy of hatred based on lies and deceits, and work to subvert the independence and lustre of the American experience.
He's a democrat party member. He's a Nazi.
Can you tell us which of these Ben supports? States right, mandatory registering of firearms, School choice, abortion on demand up til birth, strict interpretation of the constitution, reparations, wealth taxes, social justice income re-distribution, the Foxconn deal, transgenders using the bathroom of their choice, border security and a tight border wall, amnesty for illegal immigrants, same day voter registration, ending the use of fossil fuels, Occasional Cortex's Green New Deal, $15 minimum wage, expansion of the number of SCOTUS justices, voting by non-citizens?
You can't at once claim to be politically independent and endorse a clear partisan. That makes you a partisan, an idiot or a hypocrite.
Ann Althouse said...
"I began my moderation on this post with a fair amount of vigor, mainly because (as my comment above shows) I didn't want the thread to get hijacked into just trashing the Democratic Party."
You said that "If you know Ben, you know he's an incredibly hard worker who's passionate about putting his progressive ideals into action". So was Stalin. Seriously. How can an "all-around fine person" want to rob his neighbors at gunpoint in order to purchase votes from people who don't pay taxes? He can't. A person who wants that is not an all-around fine person. He's a thug.
Seeing Red said...
After reading everyone’s comments, it seems 2 different things are being discussed.
One is a fine person and one is politics.
This is a most interesting point. What I noticed was that many in the commentariat who wanted to bash Democrats picked up Althouse's last point "he's just an all-around fine person" as an easy pivot. Pivot on "he's a fine person" and you can ignore the meat of the post, which is John's comment framed around the Howard Dean quote.
Althouse made a personal remark and all the conservatives here want to make the personal political!
You said that "If you know Ben, you know he's an incredibly hard worker who's passionate about putting his progressive ideals into action". So was Stalin. Seriously.
So was Lincoln. Seriously.
And Howard Dean is who is being quoted.
bagoh2O said...
Just knowing the double edged nature of intelligence is some inoculation. Personally, I try to avoid overly sophisticated explanations or understandings of things. I try to keep language simple, and respect the track record of Occam's razor. I have changed my mind on a lot of issues, and continue to, but high intelligence is not something I suffer from.
Thumbs up.
The respect of Howard "ARRGH" Dean and being hardworking in the pursuit of socialism and totalitarianism are not exactly recommendations to those who are NOT Democrats.
Is your son aware that there is a full half of the population who disagrees with him and are not actual Nazis? Sadly, I have to ask this question.
If my college alumni newsletter was allowing people to call me names, I would submit my favorite stories about said people molesting Cub Scouts back in the day.
Well he's competing in a democratic primary, which is four standard deviations stranger than the one in 2004.
"I’m quite sure that there are commenters here that think ALL Democrats are illiberal socialists or even “Stalinists”. "
Is there even one Democrat who didn't support the overthrow of the democratically elected Republican governor of Wisconsin in 2011?
Is there even one Democrat who didn't support the overthrow of the democratically elected Republican POTUS in 2016, 2017, 2018, 2019...?
You were part of the protests at the capitol in Feb.-March 2011. The so-called "Uprising." Did you take part in the chant, "THIS IS WHAT DEMOCRACY LOOKS LIKE!"? Do you remember the chant, "SHAME SHAME SHAME SHAME!"?
"Whose house, OUR house" originated where? I'm quite sure it originated with the Bolsheviks, no?
The least any Wisconsin Democrat should feel is embarrassment.
“It was a conspiracy and, worse yet, a conspiracy ignited and carried out from within the FBI and the Department of Justice. Nothing could be more dangerous to a democratic society than that. How high this conspiracy went is still somewhat unclear. I say ‘somewhat’ because the likelihood of it having reached into the White House of the previous administration is great. It's hard to imagine how it could have happened otherwise.” -Roger Simon
As Glenn Reynolds asks: "Will we see any accountability for the many ethical — and probably legal — breaches involving Trump’s bureaucratic opposition? " https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2019/03/24/mueller-report-findings-collusion-news-media-donald-trump-column/3263167002/
A truly democratic American would demand that accountability. Partisan Democrats not so much.
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