"They had been drawn the day before when Dylan and Satchel were watching a movie. She insisted that I had closed them and left them that way. Her friend Casey had come over to visit and while they were in the kitchen, my mother insisted I had shut the curtains. At that point, I couldn’t take it anymore and I lost it, yelling, 'You’re lying!' She shot me a look and took me into the bathroom next to the TV room. She hit me uncontrollably all over my body. She slapped me, pushed me backwards and hit me on my chest, shouting, 'How dare you say I’m a liar in front of my friend. You’re the pathological liar.' I was defeated, deflated, beaten and beaten down. Mia had stripped me of my voice and my sense of self. It was clear that if I stepped even slightly outside her carefully crafted reality, she would not tolerate it. It was an upbringing that made me, paradoxically, both fiercely loyal and obedient to her, as well as deeply afraid...."
Moses Farrow tells his story in a blog post titled "A Son Speaks Out."
"Satchel" = Ronan Farrow.
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४९ टिप्पण्या:
Mommy dearest.
Mia Farrow (not Ronan) should just fess up about who Ronan’s father really is. It would solve almost every problem. Of course, it would create a liar and cuckold.
So how old was he?
Oh, he was 14. Look if your Mom hits you when you're 14, its usually because you deserve it.
So how old was he?
Moses is ten years older than Ronan Farrow. Generally speaking, siblings who differ that much in age have little interaction as children — ten-year-olds haven't much in common with suckling infants unless the ten-year-old is a very sick puppy indeed.
This whole thing smacks of press agent skullduggery intended to make a forthcoming memoir attractive to publishers.
Damn, that sounds credible. Mentally ill people really do act like that.
The fact that Ronan Farrow, who was only four at the time, is included in the narrative makes me suspicious of the account as given.
I am no Woody fan. I liked his early absurd comedies like Sleeper and Bananas, but haven't seen a thing he's done in the last thirty years.
That said, I have always thought Mia was the real monster in that relationship.
Shouldn’t this be done in the privacy of a therapists office? I am sure Jordan Peterson will be happy to offer his services.
Mentally ill people really do act like that.
Yes, they do. The problem is from the perspective of 26 years it's the mental health of Moses Farrow that's in question.
Memory is a very tricky thing. Our society has already gone through the agony already of false memories leading to false accusations in court time and time again. Families and reputations have been ruined uselessly. The only people who have profited from the priesthood of the therapist have been lawyers and book publishers.
Here's my thought about all this: the more I learn about it, from more sources, the more Mia Farrow looks paranoid and/or psychotic. It starts to look like the mistake Woody made was having anything to do with her. If Mia is nuts, then the other sources take on a lot more weight. I've been around people who are paranoid and psychotic, and Moses description is dead on. Of course, Moses is a therapist so he'd know that. Still...
Don't date actresses.
Mia has been bat-shit crazy for years. I believed Woody was a rat, but I never believed the Dylan story. Mia put her up to it.
Dredging every old, terrible thing that happened to a person into the present is a terrible idea. Not everything should be public.
I have no magical ability to tell what is the truth or not, but there was nothing in that account that struck me as being off or false. If anything it was an excessively consistent and emotionless account. But then if you can imagine being in such a situation, then he would have rewritten and rewritten this, to make it as perfect as he could and remove his emotions.
The problem our memory is are we remembering it accurately? He was certainly old enough at 14 to have remembered what he says he remembered. And if his relationship with his mother was as he stated, then I would guess he would have been an expert at interpreting and understanding his mother.
If fact this is where I know the account is not complete. He hasn't fully talked about his feelings and relationship towards his mother. Not that he has to or probably wants to.
Moses also points to a fair amount of supporting evidence for his memory: the implausible attic-train story; the supporting account from the nanny; the general implausibility of the situation; and the presence of so many other people who were suspicious of Woody Allen.
The part I find hardest to believe is his account of his mother's alleged abusive behavior. It could be true, but somehow I have the feeling that this is the sort of situation, where if something is partly true, then a partial truth can often be transformed into something uglier and more extreme. I have the suspicion that this is precisely the sort of situation where one needs to be most cautious about literally believing your own memory. If something just partly like this happened, he would have dreamed and re-dreamed it, and the memory would have transformed.
To paraphrase something Jordan Peterson said: the purpose of memory isn't really to remember accurately but rather to avoid bad situations in the future.
And I suspect it's a common thing for relationships with our parents to get very tangled and our memories perhaps less than accurate.
That’s a powerful statement.
What difference does it make, at this point, who closed the curtains?
I thought Ronan had sputtered after his MSNBC talk show tanked.
But he sure bounced back hard, and took down Harvey "potted plant" Weinstein.
Will be running for office no doubt soon.
Mia had stripped me of my voice and my sense of self.
Hey, kid! I've got your 'sense of self' right here!
That's an incredibly strong letter and more credible than anything said about this sad, stupid affair. I believe every word. Farrow truly is a very sick and demonic, demented human being. The way she treated those disabled kids is unforgivable. Perhaps some of the depressed ones would have committed suicide anyway, but it seems she contributed to more than a fair share to that suspiciously high number of events.
What a disgusting human being. Does anyone doubt female entitlement now?
The alleged victim has a Twitter feed that is a one-track paean to issues of sexual assault.
Clearly someone has constructed her identity in a very intense and narrow way - for her. No other interests in life? None at all?
Come on.
Even if she believes it her inability to have a public identity that relates a single other interest in life, even a fleeting distraction of some sort - of any sort... that speaks volumes.
She is not a normal person and to either some extent or to every extent that Farrow bitch made her that way.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJH1k0jP6tw
"That said, I have always thought Mia was the real monster in that relationship."
What makes everyone assume that if one is a monster, the other one isn't?
Normal healthy sane people do not tend to be attracted to monstrous people, but tend to leave the moment the monstrousness starts showing itself. People who stay in such relationships tend to be people who are used to the rules monsters live by.
"Dredging every old, terrible thing that happened to a person into the present is a terrible idea. Not everything should be public."
People air their family's dirt in public because it's part of the drama. They're asking you to take their word for it that their family member is no good. Side with them & help punish that family member.
It's like asking the community for justice, only without the due process part.
We rightly disapprove when someone attacks a family member physically or verbally or emotionally, yet we don't see anything weird about attacking a family member's reputation and social resources - so that they are (one hopes) shamed, shunned, ostracized, and treated as disgusting. Someday we might call such tactics "social abuse".
What makes everyone assume that if one is a monster, the other one isn't?
Because none of this story would exist were it not for one person's struggle against the other.
Even though in other cases, that's a legitimate point. Commenters here all the time say that Trump is a saint because Hillary and Bill Clinton are corrupt. So go figure.
Moses’ story is affecting, and is supported by certainly more externally verifiable facts than either Dylan’s story or Ronan’s support of that story.
Three suicides of three genetically unrelated adult “adopted” children should already tell you that there was something manifestly wrong with the Farrow household. That two official investigations of Dylan’s claims both exonerated Woody also suggest that the latter was not the director on this movie set nor the bringer of insanity onto it. The impossible elements that Dylan has in her story, like the toy train, probably didn’t help add to the story’s credibility.
(I put “adopted” into quotations, because it really doesn’t seem like Mia was much of a parent to these children, rather using them as instruments of her own fulfillment, to be abandoned when no longer useful.)
"Normal healthy sane people do not tend to be attracted to monstrous people," @8:48
Yep. This right here.
Mia is fucking nuts; borderline personality disorder I'd reckon. Daddy issues up the wazoo; the 21-year-old seductress destroying Dory's life, the first (known) casualty of her derangement.
The brief description of John Farrow gives a great deal of credence to all that follows: addiction, unconstrained rage, molestation, child abuse, violence, suicides. Alcoholism can ravage lives across generations and old John most certainly must have been the driving force of his children's monstrous behavior. Then again, God knows what exactly his childhood looked like!
And oh, the irony the wonderful irony of the 21-year-old Soon YI's betrayal!
Still, it's all very very cery sad.
He should emancipate himself and pay her back for the money she put out for his care since he was a child.
Then, and only then, does he get to complain that mommy spanked him -- hard! -- when he had a tantrum and called her a liar in front of her friend. (Wait til the friend goes home next time before starting your family drama, boy. Otherwise, parents tend to feel disrespected and yep, sometimes you get corporal punishment. Poor kid. He thinks the world owes him something...)
Whoever wrote this sounds as messed up as Farrow - whose money, BTW, basically came from what Frank or Woody did for her anyway.
His mom is a liar.
Just for the sake of context, Dershowitz's clients included:
O.J. Simpson
Mia Farrow
and a tenuous publicly argued case on behalf of Donald Trump
He seems to have a long track record of loving and believing liars.
PPPT: Dersh takes on some objectionable clients. Sometimes mixing with bad people is a strong indicator of bad character. If you're an attorney who believes in the law, really believes in it--not just in theory, but in its application--it may indicate something else. A sort of idealism, a strong sort. That even the very worst sort of person deserves the strongest possible defense under this system. You may still believe this to be true even if the outcome of your vigorous defense--say, of OJ--leads to an unpleasant outcome. Because your belief in the system is greater than your feeling about any particular outcome. I suspect, for better or worse, Dersh is that kind of guy. They are good to have around, even if difficult to understand or appreciate.
People like that are often "wrong." But it's worth trying to understand the higher calling they are serving before judging them. Also after judging them. Understanding them eventually brings wisdom, even if your final judgment on them, should you arrive at one, is negative. Dersh is one of the helpful ones: in his mistakes as much as in his successes, as we perceive them.
The account as given is sufficient to damn Mia, but I don't think it exonerates Woody.
It was Woody's courtship of Soon Yi that set all these primal forces in motion. On the evidence given I would never convict Woody of child molestation, but neither would my suspicions be totally dissipated. There was definitely some crossed wires in Woody's libido....... I don't think Mia's mothering skills were so great. Three children who died self destructive deaths is quite a lot. Disabled children who grow up in third world orphanages don't have such an easy passage through life, so maybe not all her efforts were to no avail. But Moses' account is damning. No one comes out looking good.
Woody wouldn’t be the first man to run afoul of the hot/crazy matrix.
None of this “damns” anybody who hasn’t committed a crime, but it calls out for therapy all around.
Mia puts the Me in MeToo. Adopting a bunch of kids, including some with special needs, somehow puts her beyond criticism. But it could be pure narcissism if she can hire help, and train the kids to sing "Hallelujah" every time she walks in to a room.
That's a harrowing narrative.
Oh brother. Your mom was crazy and your dad was nice to you so you decided he couldn't be a monster too. I really liked the part where he completely absolved the Woody Soon Yi relationship. No. It's not normal. Sorry. Do not pass go. Do not collect $200.
Another line in the article that bothers me. Why would Mia speak out about her brother's victims? They received justice. He's in prison. That line shows me Moses axe is ready to grind. He's not playing it straight.
It was Woody's courtship of Soon Yi that set all these primal forces in motion.
I don't think this is true. Farrow's betrayal of her friend predates this as do many of Moses' stories of her manipulation of him and the other children.
Our instinct is to contextualize the crazy by assuming normal is the default and something triggered the crazy. We do this because we presume people are mostly just like us but in the case of crazy it just isn't true. The crazy will out, it cannot be contained. The question is not whether a trigger will occur but rather what the trigger will be. It will always be something.
Stay away from crazy.
"Commenters here all the time say that Trump is a saint because Hillary and Bill Clinton are corrupt."
No. What we say and have been saying is that those who go out of their way to ignore and excuse the Clintons and Obama have no credibility when they complain about Trump doing the exact same things.
"PPPT: Dersh takes on some objectionable clients. Sometimes mixing with bad people is a strong indicator of bad character. If you're an attorney who believes in the law, really believes in it--not just in theory, but in its application--it may indicate something else. A sort of idealism, a strong sort. That even the very worst sort of person deserves the strongest possible defense under this system. You may still believe this to be true even if the outcome of your vigorous defense--say, of OJ--leads to an unpleasant outcome. Because your belief in the system is greater than your feeling about any particular outcome. I suspect, for better or worse, Dersh is that kind of guy. They are good to have around, even if difficult to understand or appreciate."
He also defended Claus Von Bulow.
Of course, defense lawyers are not naive enough to believe all their clients are innocent. However, this is immaterial, as their job is to represent their clients to their very best ability, which is as it should be.
My ex-wife was the same sort of abusive, loyalty demander that Mia Farrow is.
People need to quit excusing Mia Farrow's abuse of her children in an effort to hate on Woody Allen. Trained investigators confirmed that Dylan was coached by Mia. The parental alienation that Mia engaged in is more abuse.
"Another line in the article that bothers me. Why would Mia speak out about her brother's victims? They received justice. He's in prison. That line shows me Moses axe is ready to grind. He's not playing it straight."
Not at all: Moses is just contrasting his mother's passionate anger and statements toward Woody with her statements or feelings displayed toward her own child-molesting brother. If Woody is a "monster," why not her brother? Moses makes the point that Mia's fury and calumnies are inspired by her (certainly valid) feelings of jealous betrayal rather than by any concern for the victims, real or alleged, of either person.
If Moses' story is a fabrication, it is masterful: it reads to me as completely sincere. That doesn't necessarily prove it's entirely accurate, but, I believe it is.
Maybe they were both jerks? I mean, they are show business "liberals," right?
To lose one adopted child may be regarded as a misfortune; to lose two looks like carelessness; but three? WTF?
-- Not Quite Oscar Wilde
He was being disrespectful so she punished him. Big deal.
And as a mom with adopted boys, I wonder how much of his hatred against his adopted mom is displaced anger against desertion by his birth parents (and maybe this is a way to get the approval of WoodyAllen, the only father figure in his life, who also deserted him).
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