Meanwhile, 44% of voters have a favorable opinion of Paul Ryan, with only 40% unfavorable. This is a Pew survey of "1,511 adults, including 1,201 registered voters," taken conducted October 4-7, released today, the day before the VP debate.
The survey just before the 2008 VP debate had Biden at 53% favorable, 31% unfavorable. Sarah Palin had 51% favorable — much more than Paul Ryan, interestingly — and 40% unfavorable — exactly the same as Paul Ryan. That is, the "don't know" group is bigger for Ryan — 15%, compared to Palin's 9% — which means the VP debate is a big opportunity to reach open minds.
Oddly, 10% of respondents "don't know" what they think of Joe Biden. What's that about? How long must a guy hang around before people know what they think of him? (Maybe it's: everyone seems to think he's nice, but I don't know what he wants do.)
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What's public opinion on Neil Kinnock?
Probably 40% of voting age people in this country can't name the VP.
Well Sarah Palin didn't push Grandma over the cliff like Paul Ryan did.
Biden is seen as a pawn in Obama and Pelosi's game.
We feel sorry for him having to be the Court Jester in place to make Obama seem smart by comparison and the impeaching Obama seem a useless act.
The debate tonight need Hillary would be the usual candidate in waiting. Obama also would not let Mrs Clinton anywhere near Presidential power if Obama mysteriously ever woke up dead.
It will be interesting to see if the ACLU is able to influence the questions and get the topic of abortion and contraception as a big part of the debate. They may see this as a way to attack Ryan who has the Catholic position on abortion. It will make for a dull debate but maybe that's what the White House wants.
"Oddly, 10% of respondents "don't know"..."
It's only odd to me because I'd the expect the number to be higher.
Biden is seen as a pawn in Obama and Pelosi's game.
We feel sorry for him having to be the Court Jester in place to make Obama seem smart by comparison and the impeaching Obama seem a useless act.
The debate tonight need Hillary would be the usual candidate in waiting. Obama also would not let Mrs Clinton anywhere near Presidential power if Obama mysteriously ever woke up dead.
Rush -- shoutout to Althouse right out of the gate today!
Rush -- shoutout to Althouse right out of the gate today!
"Oddly, 10% of respondents "don't know" what they think of Joe Biden. What's that about? How long must a guy hang around before people know what they think of him? (Maybe it's: everyone seems to think he's nice, but I don't know what he wants do.)"
That's funny coming form someone that was undecided after 3 years and 9 months of the reign of Obama.
Ann Althouse: Rush Limbaugh talking about your debate post right now (at 9:13 PST)
Ann Althouse: At 12 minutes past the first hour of LImbaugh's show, Rush favorably mentioned your blog post about Obama's debate performance.
The medical community is well aware that Medicare patients are in a defacto death panel situation under the Obamacare that really starts the day after the election.
That $715 billion was taken from paying the medical community treating them.
Obama is a murderer.
Joe Biden doees not want to "do" anything. He is a soldier, not a capo.
Ryan should talk about the goodness of pie, racial harmony, sexual orientation harmony, and avoid any substantive topics. That way he can appeal to the middle, and improve his likeability rating.
To be honest, I don't know what I think of Joe Biden.
When he was a Senator, I thought he was quirky but astute, and had a solid grasp of foreign and domestic policy. It was only in the 2008 election cycle he started to look like a real bumbler, and as VP he has been a clown.
It's so odd. Is it that easy to hide your clown light under a barrel in the Senate?
Biden's favorables should improve (literally) after his 'opinionated/beloved goofy uncle' (G-d luv him) routine on Thursday. Who doesn't love comic relief?
Limbaugh just mentioned Althouse on his show. 12:11 am Eastern
While Romney/Ryan Derangement Syndrome has been nowhere near the levels of Bush DS or Palin DS it has seemed as bad, I think, because it's so self-evidently ridiculous. Disagree all you want with their policies and plans, but R/R strike me as such thoroughly honest, decent men that I find the efforts to brand them as evil, lying liars who are evil to be almost comical. It certainly says more about their accusers than about them.
"MayBee said...
To be honest, I don't know what I think of Joe Biden.
When he was a Senator, I thought he was quirky but astute, and had a solid grasp of foreign and domestic policy. "
He was on the wrong side of virtually every FP decision.
Conservatives are making a mistake by under estimating Biden. I think he will do well in the debate. He is very likable and he connects with average people.
Of course, Biden could make a really stupid blunder but I think that is unlikely in this type of high profile event.
I will make the easy prediction that on Friday, the media will say that Biden won by not losing. Then the "comeback kid" stories will really start in earnest and culminate in an Obama win in the next debate. All Obana has to do is to appear more relaxed and engaged and he will "have turned the corner" on his campaign. Blah blah blah.
The irony is 80% of those with an unfavorable opinion of Joe are Democrats.
All Obana has to do is to appear more relaxed and engaged and he will "have turned the corner" on his campaign. Blah blah blah.
No, Bengahzi will bring him down. You can't cover up dead bodies like that.
Biden is a loveable dumbass--The gaffe prone village idiot. Three letters: J O B S.
Biden on taxes: “ we want to add trillions in tax increases!”
Ryan is smart and therefore he must be destroyed by the leftwing machine.
I'm all but certain the pro-dem moderator will do what she can to assist the dumbass.
OT: Just came in from drivin' and had Rush on. He was givin' a shout out to Ann for her theory about why Zero won't shut up about how bad he did un the debate. But if you wanna' do a gotcha' on Rushm he said the professor was from Michigan.
That is all.
"Of course, Biden could make a really stupid blunder but I think that is unlikely in this type of high profile event"
-- Maybe he can make some chronologically incorrect television references or talk about how Hezbollah has been kicked out of Lebanon thanks to joint U.S.-French actions.
I wouldn't know how to respond to this poll.
Does "affable idiot" constitute a favorable or unfavorable opinion?
The toxic narcissist in the White House needs Biden as a pawn in his game. Biden willingly plays his role is an inept old white guy.
What we learned in Debate #1 was that Obama has to have a narcisstic supply or he withers away like the wicked witch of the west in The Wizard of Oz.
The bandwagon to replace Obama is suddenly unstoppable.
Did Bill and Hillary arrange this?
I doubt Clarence Thomas would be on the USSC if not for Biden's work as Judiciary chairman.
Curious George said...
To be honest, I don't know what I think of Joe Biden.
When he was a Senator, I thought he was quirky but astute, and had a solid grasp of foreign and domestic policy.
He was on the wrong side of virtually every FP decision.
He was also in the pocket of the banks and the credit card companies.
I am frankly very concerned about the general attitude on the right that Paul Ryan is going to blow Biden out of the water. This is a dangerous meme to get out there for what I would think would be obvious reasons.
Biden is as dumb as a rock, that's true, but he has one overriding political asset that has proven to be his greatest strength. He is very good at parroting the words and opinions of others.
For Ryan to beat Biden he will have to knock Biden off his script so that Biden has to actually come up with his own concepts and put them into comprehensible words. If Ryan can do that, Biden will destroy himself. But if Ryan can't knock him off script, Biden could well come out on top. And right now, even a significant loss by Biden will be spun into a "win" since he is supposedly going to be reduced to primordial goo by Ryan's blistering intellect.
Dangerous meme here. Very dangerous.
"I will make the easy prediction that on Friday, the media will say that Biden won by not losing."
I second that call.
Some inane "just how many thousand casualties ARE acceptable in your waronwomen, Mr Ryan?" leading questions from the audience plants will help.
Yes Biden does connect with the average Joe. For contrast here is another take on Romney's latest use of his meeting with the fallen Seal, Doherty killed in Benghazi as told by Doherty's close friend:
"According to Ellefsen, Romney introduced himself to Doherty four separate times during the gathering.
"He said it was very comical," Ellefsen said, "Mitt Romney approached him ultimately four times, using this private gathering as a political venture to further his image. He kept introducing himself as Mitt Romney, a political figure. The same introduction, the same opening line. Glen believed it to be very insincere and stale."
Plagiarizing Joe is a bumbling, lying fool.
And you lefties protect him and protect him and protect him...
Nice job, Althouse!
Here's to hoping some student blatantlycheats in your law classroom, you get all pissy about it, and you live to see him made V.P.
Oddly, 10% of respondents "don't know" what they think of Joe Biden.
It's not odd. Many people don't know who our VP is, or even what they had for dinner last night.
oooh r/v - that was very damning! I hope Obama runs an ad on that!
Team Romney is saying poor little Paulie hasn't really ever debated anyone before, and that Biden is a force.
Awww!
You don't think the Wunderkid will actually have to explain their un-explainable tax plan, do you? He couldn't even explain it to the friendlies at Fox News. You know the Crazy Uncle is going to bringing the lumber. And there will be no staffer on stage to cut the debate short. Gulp.
Maybe he can make some chronologically incorrect television references or talk about how Hezbollah has been kicked out of Lebanon thanks to joint U.S.-French actions.
Maybe he can make some chronologically incorrect television references or talk about how Hezbollah has been kicked out of Lebanon thanks to joint U.S.-French actions.
Yeah and the media ignored it last time, and piled on Palin.
I'm not sure what will happen, but Joe may fumble, after all he's the best hope Obama has now, that has to be some pressure, especially considering that Biden thinks he should be the top of the ticket. I'm hoping ego gets the best of him. Ryan, however has little debate experience, and could have a bit of trouble with the format.
I'm sure Althouse is undecided about Joe Biden.
I formed my opinion of Biden during SCOTUS confirmation hearings. An insufferable dumbass then, and his VP speeches (aka gaffes) have only reinforced that view.
Joe Biden is very good at one thing:
Getting elected.
Either that or the people of Delaware are completely dumbasses.
garage mahal said...
Team Romney is saying poor little Paulie hasn't really ever debated anyone before, and that Biden is a force.
Awww!
Where's that vaunted Sconnie loyalty you once lectured me about for not coming to the aid of Allie?
Why do you hate the man from Janesville so?
I wouldn't underestimate Biden in a debate format. He's one of those people who have the ability to talk ........ and talk, and talk, and talk, and what he says is usually an oddball mix of actual facts, made up facts, and total non-sequitors, all balled up in a massive clusterf*** of hundreds of words that could be difficult to parse, unpack and rebut in an on-your-feet debate.
Even though, at bottom, Biden is a boob, and Ryan [whether you agree with him or not - and I'm largely unimpressed with many of his actual votes in Congress] is not, I would not count on a clear cut win.
" It was only in the 2008 election cycle he started to look like a real bumbler, and as VP he has been a clown."
Biden has had two craniotomies for cerebral aneurysm. He is probably showing evidence of that and it is an amazing comment on Obama's judgement that he picked a brain damaged VP.
"You're never the same, once the air hits your brain."
"Only 39% have a favorable opinion of Joe Biden"
Oh no! Slow Joe is not liked? Is that why they call him 'Buffoon' Biden?
And HE is gonna save Obama's chances of re-election?
Hahahahahaha.
"2012 can't come to soon" spoken by Sarah Palin.
So maybe we will finally get some real Hope and Change.
"Team Romney is saying poor little Paulie hasn't really ever debated anyone before, and that Biden is a force."
-- Remember the healthcare discussion Paul v Obama? I do. Someone will link you to the sweet, sweet YouTube clip. This is just managing expectations.
I don't know what I think of Joe Biden. If you've ever seen the ending of the old "Man With No Name" Clint Eastwood movie, the first one, I feel like the old gravedigger surveying the damage:
"Joe... Joe Joe Joe Joe." (shakes head and ambles away.)
"You don't think the Wunderkid will actually have to explain their un-explainable tax plan, do you?"
Why don't you look up the tax plan recommended by Obama's commission? Here, I'll do it for you.
President Obama’s National Commission on Fiscal Responsibility and Reform and the Bipartisan Policy Center’s Debt Reduction Task Force (on which I served) both endorsed this strategy [of lower marginal tax rates on a broader base] in their recent deficit reduction proposals. The fiscal commission’s “Illustrative Tax Plan” would scale back and redesign many of the largest tax preferences (e.g., mortgage interest, employer health insurance, and retirement saving), eliminate many others (e.g., state and local interest), and use the resulting revenue to
• Cut individual tax rates, bringing today’s six brackets (10, 15, 25, 28, 33, and 35 percent) down to three (12, 22, and 28 percent);
• Repeal the alternative minimum tax (AMT), the personal exemption phase-out (PEP), and the phase-out of itemized deductions (Pease);
• Cut the corporate income tax rate from 35 to 28 percent.
That proposal, which Obama is ignoring, is almost identical to Romney's plan. Stephanie Cutter has already admitted on TV that the "$5 trillion tax cut" is not true.
Dope.
G-d luv ya, Joe...
...I sleep better at night knowing that the former 'Dumb Blonde of the Senate' is literally only a heartbeat away from sitting on the Big Red Button by accident.
I think more people don't know about Biden because what's there to know?
The man's a fool*, but mostly a low-profile fool, especially if you don't get your news from blogland.
Joe "Let's Just Give Iran 200 Million Dollars To Show Them We Like Muslims" Biden.
Seriously.
(* I was tempted to say idiot, but fool is much more apt; as the above TNR link suggests, the man is deeply unwise. But that's unrelated to his "intelligence", which seems to be perfectly adequate.
But an intelligent fool is still a fool. And a worse executive by far than a reasonably wise man of merely average intelligence.)
" to his "intelligence", which seems to be perfectly adequate."
He has a higher IQ than you, and he'll prove it.
I too am somewhat concerned about the widely held assertion that Ryan will easily blow Biden out of the water. Biden could easily pull off a Dr. McCoy to Ryan's Mr. Spock. In other words, he could come off as a charming, avuncular, emotional guy while Ryan comes off as cold, wonkish, figuring spouting Vulcan. Biden could lose the debate on facts but win it on personality. Don't discount emotion. A lot of voters a susceptible to the pulling of the heartstrings and all that nonsense.
Tomorrow you will see Joe Biden, turned into a human mop, just like his boss.
Ryan needs to be prepared for the gotcha question about his support for the “so-called Personhood bill” aka H.R. 212: Sanctity of Human Life Act.
They'll slip that in after a question about economics.
Be PREPARED!
There are going to be very few questions about the economy - the moderator will ask many questions about abortion and follow up questions about abortion and follow-up-up questions about abortion. That's what Ryan should be prepared for. I hope his handlers know this.
Nonapod said...
I too am somewhat concerned about the widely held assertion that Ryan will easily blow Biden out of the water. Biden could easily pull off a Dr. McCoy to Ryan's Mr. Spock. In other words, he could come off as a charming, avuncular, emotional guy while Ryan comes off as cold, wonkish, figuring spouting Vulcan. Biden could lose the debate on facts but win it on personality. Don't discount emotion. A lot of voters a susceptible to the pulling of the heartstrings and all that nonsense.
Biden will try to come off as affable, but he will be destroyed and his feathers will get ruffled in due course and you'll see the attack dog denture wearer come out. Ryan isn't being prepared in a bubble for this debate. I'm fairly certain Ryan will be ready for the gotcha questions that pop up.
Maybe Biden can explain to Ryan that he has a much higher IQ than Ryan.
garage mahal said...
Team Romney is saying poor little Paulie hasn't really ever debated anyone before, and that Biden is a force.
Awww!
You don't think the Wunderkid will actually have to explain their un-explainable tax plan, do you? He couldn't even explain it to the friendlies at Fox News. You know the Crazy Uncle is going to bringing the lumber. And there will be no staffer on stage to cut the debate short. Gulp.
10/10/12 12:01 PM
What is inexplicable about cutting rates and eliminating deductions? Even you can understand that.
Franklin said...
Ryan needs to be prepared for the gotcha question about his support for the “so-called Personhood bill” aka H.R. 212: Sanctity of Human Life Act.
They'll slip that in after a question about economics.
Be PREPARED!
10/10/12 1:00 PM
His rejoinder would be to describe what a partial birth abortion is and remind the viewers the democrats are in favor of that and in favor of using your tax dollars to pay for them and Obama's voting against the born alive act in IL, which allows doctors to kill infants that somehow mange to survive an abortion procedure after they are born. The dems better be very careful with the gotcha questions, it could easily blow up in their face.
Matthew Sablan said...
Maybe Biden can explain to Ryan that he has a much higher IQ than Ryan.
10/10/12 1:22 PM
Indeed he will since he right now as we speak he is undergoing an emergency brain transplant.
A few days off the booze and Biden shines right up. He's a formidable debater. That's what the quarantine is about.
Speaking of shining up, recall the way the mounted camera moved behind and above the candidates to show what they see from behind them, showing us where Biden's plug work ceases. Apparently there wasn't enough to fill the whole patch or maybe he ran out of money. Or maybe he was always previously vexed with a Dennis the Menace thing that stuck up in the back and decided to do without that again.
I kept waiting for the bird's eye shot with the June Taylor dancers doing a kaleidoscope thing with their legs.
Does your mind drift from politics? Kaleidoscope in sign.
Biden used to flash those pearly whites in Senate hearings and he was sort of charming.
Now it just seems creepy.
I love when people who voted for the "hope and change" candidate now demand specifics from Ryan and Romney on the tax plan. The governor has said many times that the details are subject to negotiation with Congress, that he can't tell the House and Senate that "it's my way or the highway."
What a concept! Working with Congress to write suitable legislation instead of ramming through unpopular programs on party-line votes. To paraphrase the great Chile Palmer, "We only need to say as few words as possible, if that" to draw a distinction in the upcoming election.
I have a favorable view of Joe Biden.
It's just that my view does not encompass his political actions.
Otherwise, a Prince of a man.
Not a Peggy Noonan fan but loved this on Joe Biden:
"...he is incapable of staying on the river of a thought, and is constantly lured down tributaries from which he can never quite work his way back--you can see him batting the little paddles of his mind against the weeds, trying desperately to return to the river but not remembering where it is, or where it was going."
Biden will be a baby harp seal and Ryan the club.
I don't think it will matter that much. A huge Ryan win will solidify Romney's, but generally the Veep debate isn't such a big deal. It was last time only because the media was running Palin against Obama.
IBM = Irish Big Mouth = Joe Biden [n.b. "Empty heads make the most noise" per Sister Bernard Patrick circa 1958]
sleepless nights said...
I don't think it will matter that much. A huge Ryan win will solidify Romney's, but generally the Veep debate isn't such a big deal. It was last time only because the media was running Palin against Obama.
It will be an exercise in the obvious. Remember how the politics of low expectations worked out for Urkel in the debates. It was self-fulfilling prophecy.
Oddly, 10% of respondents "don't know" what they think of Joe Biden.
I don't find that odd. Sure, he's been in politics a long time, but he hasn't actually done much of anything.
Team Romney is saying poor little Paulie hasn't really ever debated anyone before, and that Biden is a force.
"It will be a tough fight" is standard campaign boilerplate, silly. It lets the campaign exaggerate their victory or downplay their defeat.
Obviously nobody with common sense expects Biden to come out ahead. Heck, he had a tough time with Sarah Palin, and that was *before* he had four years of Obamanomics to defend. :)
Chip Ahoy said...
A few days off the booze and Biden shines right up. He's a formidable debater. That's what the quarantine is about.
Reminds me of the character Lee Marvin played in Cat Ballou.
CURD YOUR LOINS!!!
Biden will be a baby harp seal...
Don't get cocky, kid -- Mr. Biden won his first elected office in the same year Paul Ryan was born. And "swam in the Senate shark tank", as someone noted in an earlier thread, from 1972 until 2008. He has a skill self-preservation and -promotion (actual or otherwise) honed over a long period of time.
THE LONG-WINDED PLAGARIST VS. THE LONG- DISTANCE FABULIST!
Biden strikes me as one of those guys that is so odious and dumb at the same time that he almost comes off endearing. Like a Ted Baxter.
jr565 - OMG!!! That's him, Ted Baxter, it has always been in the back of my mind but I couldn't figure out who he reminded me of...
Biden only pawn in game of life?
I don't think that anyone should underestimate Slo Joe here. As has been pointed out above, he is an extremely well seasoned politician, serving in high office as long as Ryan has been alive.
Remember the debate with Palin? Many claimed that he had made her look foolish and inexperienced, effectively winning the debate. And, then, the next day, much of what she had said that had been panned by the pundits turned out to be mostly correct, while Biden turns out to have told one whopper after another. But, he does it so convincingly that he looks highly intelligent and knowledgeable.
I fully expect the same this time. The experienced pol making the young turk look like a naive novice, effectively "winning" the debate, until his "facts" are debunked a day or two later, after many in the country have lost interest.
We shall see.
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