1 of 2 cartoons about Eric Holder and Fast and Furious (with 2 different views of who's guilty of playing racial politics).
Both cartoons do great — and different — caricatures of Holder.
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९० टिप्पण्या:
Left out of both is the truckloads of Mexican corpses. They don't matter; they were just extras in this drama.
David Plouffe trying to defend DOJ's appointing two US attorneys instead of a special prosecutor being assigned on the security leaks debacle was pathetic. When given a direct quote from then-Senator Obama, in which POTUS about how the American people needed to be reassured by assigning a special prosecutor in the Valerie Plame case, he could not come off the obviously memorized talking points.
He was jittery and was talking way, way too fast. Something's amiss there.
The gloves are finally coming off.
Justice delayed may not be justice denied, after all.
There is nothing racist about pointing out incompetence.
There is nothing racist about pointing out incompetence.
I thought you lived in this country, Madman.
Well, both cartoons attempt to play the racism card against the Republicans, just more or less along the lines of 'when did you stop beating your wife.'
This is NPR, after all. Nuff said.
I think Eric Holder is so fixated on race that he may not even realize that "Fast & Furious" is a real case that we need to find out what went wrong here and get it fixed.
And no, I do not think he knows what happened or is even trying to find out. He thinks it is all about race, and those nasty Republicans are after him just because he is "black." And I think his department is playing him.
I think both cartoons miss the mark on Eric Holder, who looks mostly like a Black Rowan Atkinson with a moustache. In my opinion.
Both cartoons suck.
Also, re: Holder -- what I hear of him from people who have worked with him has always made him out to be conscientious and competent. I suspect he's coming off like this because the political appointees at DOJ have circled wagons to protect someone. We saw a brief hint of this in the news reports about Holder trying to push back on political influence in DOJ.
Randall Enos needs to stop watching MSNBC and listening to NPR.
He left out Brian Terry's family and the Mexican widows and children out of the "lynch mob."
Pretty disgusting, actually.
BTW, did you know Terry was shot in the back with a US DOJ /ATF approved AK-47?
what I hear of him from people who have worked with him has always made him out to be conscientious and competent.
Marc Rich undoubtedly thinks so.
Balfegor -- there is entirely too much info on the Holder DOJ out there to give your position much credence. What people say is fine, but when you look at his own quotes and acts of unwillingness to apply the law equitably, or apply the law at all, he is awful at being AG.
Not to mention his equivocating slimy Clinton pardon record.
Michael Steele said nice things about him too ...
what I hear of him from people who have worked with him has always made him out to be conscientious and competent
I hear the same things about his boss from people I don't trust.
I prefer the awesome, the incomparable, the the brilliant, the fantastic and the hysterical Michael Ramirez instead, thanks.
Is that Grand Wizard Robert Byrd in the hood?
Are we sure garage didn't draw those cartoons?
I see Michele Obama told OSU grads that the "fat (corporate) paycheck" may not be satisfying. But that did not stop her from accepting $300K salary in her hospitakl job nor her brother who is paid $950K to coach basketball at OSU.
I wonder if Mrs. Obama thinks everyone else is dumb.
I was glad to see that Enos put the hooded Democrat in the crowd. Such honesty is rare in a political cartoonist.
I see Michele Obama told OSU grads that the "fat (corporate) paycheck" may not be satisfying.
It's very satisfying if you are doing what you love, and if it comes with the benefit of knowing that perhaps you're giving someone out there something that they love or want, too.
Holder is prime scapegoat in the coming months. All the Dems need is some mint jelly and a spit to roast him on.
No, just that that is how things are done in Illinois.
Since the intent of Fast & Furious was to get a significant number of Mexicans killed and then blame American guns for the killings, and given that by that criteria F & F succeeded, at least the first part of it, the killing of Mexicans, doesn't that make Holder not only a murderer but a racist murderer? Murderer, no big deal. But RACIST murderer, big fucking deal!
Mint jelly w/ goat? I thought just w/ lamb. We can then call him the sacrificial lamb instead of the scapegoat. How about a nice vegetable/yougurt rice salad w/ the lamb and mint jelly?
Holder has packed the DoJ with every radical lawyer he could find. When Bush was elected in 2001, his appointees were filibustered and he left many of Clinton's people in place. They sabotaged his administration from inside and did in Senator Ted Stevens in a case that was later thrown out for prosecutorial misconduct.
Let's hope Romney has his list of appointments ready Jan20, 2013. From looking at his campaign so far, I'll guess he will. The "scandal" of Gonzales firing US Attorneys was about a delayed effort to get Clinton folks out. Big mistake. Bush wasn't all that competent. Bush v Gore made it worse.
Moochelle is Marie Antoinette without the looks or polish.
I'm sure the health and well being of Mexicans is what keeps ricpic up at night.
I'm sure the health and well being of Mexicans is what keeps ricpic up at night.
Exactly, GM. ricpic isn't giving Holder any credit for competence whatsoever. If the goal of F&F was to get a bunch of Mexicans killed, I'd say he's pretty much been overly competent. Maybe too qualified.
If the goal of F&F was to get a bunch of Mexicans killed, I'd say he's pretty much been overly competent. Maybe too qualified.
Yea I'm sure that was the goal.
Were Democrats widely accused of racism for going after Attorney General Gonzales?
After all, what they went after him for was perfectly legal and generally acceptable. It was a completely made up scandal, used against our Hispanic AG.
That was racism, right?
I'm sure the health and well being of Mexicans is what keeps ricpic up at night.
It certainly doesn't give your Little Black Jesus any sleepless nights, that's for sure.
Yea I'm sure that was the goal.
Well, then, O Wise One, why don't you inform us Althouse Hillbilles what the real goal of F&F was?
Yea I'm sure that was the goal.
So what was the goal, garage? Please explain.
So what was the goal, garage? Please explain.
Don't know, and don't really care. I always figured F&F was dreamt up in the Breitbart/World Net Daily/Glenn Beck fever swamps to begin with. If you have a good read far away from them feel free to link it.
I noticed you didn't include Issa in the aforementioned swamps. Neither did you mention the lie that DOJ tried to give the committee before having to retract it after getting busted.
Thousands of guns, a dead border agent, hundreds of dead Mexicans. All fact. You believe it be "dreamed up". Holder does not dispute what happened. He disputes he knew anything about it.
Don't know and don't really care.
Somehow, the immortal words of Dean Vernon Wormer come to mind.
Holder may well be the worst AG in American history, but it's not because of "incompetence". He seems perfectly competent to me. It's because - as he has so kindly informed us - he sees his job as advancing the interests of "my people".
Don't know, and don't really care. I always figured F&F was dreamt up in the Breitbart/World Net Daily/Glenn Beck fever swamps to begin with. If you have a good read far away from them feel free to link it.
Paragon of conservative paranoia the Los Angeles Times.
Why do you not care, Garage? Because it is just "Mexicans"?
I always figured F&F was dreamt up in the Breitbart/World Net Daily/Glenn Beck fever swamps to begin with. If you have a good read far away from them feel free to link it.
Then it sure is convenient for you that the MSM has on the whole refused to pay the slightest attention to this story.
Here's a brief recap.
Neither did you mention the lie that DOJ tried to give the committee before having to retract it after getting busted.
If that was indeed a lie, so what? Are lies bad?
I always figured F&F was dreamt up in the Breitbart/World Net Daily/Glenn Beck fever swamps to begin with
That would be a story.
I kind of hope that Garage is doing a parody or satire or something. Because... that's the only rational explanation for the series of posts above.
That's a good feature comparing cartoons like that.
How do you take the most prominent feature and exaggerate that beyond proportion when there are no prominent features?
Saint Croix is right.
I typed St Croix. True fax. 'st' was the hardest abbreviation for me to 'get' when taking in someone else's signing. It got me every time because I'm taking it in phonetically and it always goes bolloxed. Even the word 'phonetically' is bolloxed when taken in phonetically. It starts out in your head like puh-honically. So Saint Bernard starts out stuhbernard. Okay great, I got the 'st' now. You cannot fake me out. Blah blah blah street bernard. What? Oh. Saint Bernard. It took a while. A long while. A depressingly good long while. I am incredibly slow on the uptake about some things and 'st' in sign language is one of them because of puhonics.
Garage,
Your Pontius Pilate schtick is cracking me up.
You know that Holder is going under the bus. Caesar needs to get off the golf course and just get on with it.
Saint Croix is right.
So is Howard Johnson.
"I always figured F&F was dreamt up in the Breitbart/World Net Daily/Glenn Beck fever swamps to begin with"
From GM's school of "Raise your IQ by limiting inbound information"
Makes him feel like he has a mind like a steel trap. Simplify simplify.
Like I always say "Liberalism is the opiate of the intellectually insecure."
It is a very effective opiate too, as they are probably now wondering what the above even means.
Too many fouls being called on Kevin Durant in the OKC-Miami NBA Final, while too many nocalls being given to "LeBrawn" James. I wish Holder would do something.
Best political cartoon I have seen in a while:
Pollster asking a man sitting on the street in obviously destitute state:
1. Do you think Obama is doing well as President
2. Very well?
3. Very very well?, or
4. very very very well?
garage mahal said...
Neither did you mention the lie that DOJ tried to give the committee before having to retract it after getting busted.
If that was indeed a lie, so what? Are lies bad?
And there, ladies and gentlemen, is the moral high ground of the left.
Perhaps I have a better imagination than most people but I can *imagine* why someone thought funneling US weapons into the Mexican cartels might be a good idea. That doesn't mean that it *was* a good idea, but I can imagine a plot where this seemed to honest people as if it might be a good idea.
I can also imagine how other honest (but ideologically myopic) people found out that the drug cartels were using US guns and saw this as an opportunity to gain some domestic political gun-control moral suasion.
The two first things don't need to be coordinated; never mind that in response to the gun control threat 2nd Amendment advocates (as I understand the progression of events) quickly discovered that the guns in question had to have come from some other source than legal US gun sales and the whole thing busted open.
The basic facts of it all, that the United States *did* provide these guns, doesn't seem to be in dispute.
So why the cover-up? Why not "be a man" as they say, and own up to the decision making process for the program? Yes, it exposes individuals, but accountability doesn't necessarily mean bus-under-tossing either. If some one had a plan he or she put forward, they'd rightfully expect the approval process to provide checks and balances and counter arguments. The top person who approved ought to be *capable* of defending that decision, even if it turned out badly.
With the whole thing blown open there can't be any further information to be gained by secretly (my theory) of tracking the guns. The obfuscations simply look bad, no matter how one looks at it.
Seems to me that bus-under-tossing ought to be expressed in German. Does anyone know what that would be in German?
run over = "überfahren"
Holder run over = "Holder überfahren"
Holder run over by Obama = "schadenfreude"
And there, ladies and gentlemen, is the moral high ground of the left.
So lies are bad? Sometimes bad? Always bad? Bad when Democrats tell them? (If Holder did lie)
If that was indeed a lie, so what? Are lies bad?
And this, dear friends, is why Garage is a Democrat.
And this, dear friends, is why Garage is a Democrat.
Do you have answer? Nobody else seems to.
*an answer
Do you have answer? Nobody else seems to.
At a guess, it's because you're being obviously childish. You asked someone to provide a link that wasn't from your Four Horsemen and someone did. You clammed up. Still think it was dreamed up?
A second notion on why nobody's playing your game is that you were asked questions that you don't seem to want to answer.
As per normal.
So lies are bad? Sometimes bad? Always bad? Bad when Democrats tell them? (If Holder did lie)
I don't think anyone would have a problem if Holder lied to an Al Qaeda operative or a Chinese spy.
But what legal or policy justification is there to lie to the Congressional committee that is tasked with oversight?
Seriously, how can you excuse this? Do you want to make a case for excusing Nixon?
I don't think anyone would have a problem if Holder lied to an Al Qaeda operative or a Chinese spy
I see lies everywhere from politicians, I'm just trying to get a handle on when it's appropriate to lie and when it's not. In fact, our governor testified before congress and it's real easy to prove, with facts, that he lied several times. Is that bad?
I see lies everywhere from politicians, I'm just trying to get a handle on when it's appropriate to lie and when it's not. In fact, our governor testified before congress and it's real easy to prove, with facts, that he lied several times. Is that bad?
Unfortunately for that line of reasoning, this thread is not about Walker. It is about Eric Holder. Please do stay focused and answer the questions in the context of a discussion about Holder.
Ok, I'll go with lying is always bad, except to terrorists and spies. If Holder lied, that is bad. That wasn't that hard.
garage mahal said...
And there, ladies and gentlemen, is the moral high ground of the left.
So lies are bad? Sometimes bad? Always bad? Bad when Democrats tell them? (If Holder did lie)
There may be more issues here than just lying if I have to explain it to you.
In fact, our governor testified before congress and it's real easy to prove, with facts, that he lied several times. Is that bad?
Was he under oath? Perjury is a felony and that is bad.
But it's wrong to suggest that perjury is "real easy to prove." For instance, saying something incorrect under oath might be perjury. But it also might be a mistake or an error. You have to prove intent to deceive. In fact perjury prosecutions are often one of the most difficult prosecutions to do.
It's possible that Holder does not want to give up the documents because they might prove that he perjured himself. That's a big problem, since if he doesn't give up the documents he might be held in contempt of Congress.
The liberal media is ignoring this scandal, for the most part. They want you to be ignorant of what's going on. And you are!
Was he under oath? Perjury is a felony and that is bad.
Yes he lied and yes he was under oath.
Maybe one shouldn't feed the trolls, but in answer to Garbage, maybe the answer is that the reason that it is so egregious that Holder lied to Congress is that he appears to have done so under oath, as the chief attorney for the country, when Congress is acting in their oversight capacity.
He seems to be asserting that lying is ok, as long as it is done by Democratic politicians. Or, something like that.
But, I would ask, if lying about the conduct of their offices is just fine for politicians, and something to be rewarded, and not condemned, then what are the limits that we, as a people, put on those to whom we give power us?
President Clinton was not impeached for having sexual relations with that woman, but rather, for lying about it to a court of law. President Nixon would likely have been similarly impeached, if he had been as brazen about his lying as was Clinton. Scooter Libby was convicted as a felon as a result of not remembering something of no real import, when the jury believed that he should have remembered. All three were lawyers, and all three had their law licenses jeopardized as a result.
This may surprise some, esp. because of all the jokes and stereotypes, but lawyers have an extremely high ethical duty to be honest. I would suggest significantly higher than for any other profession. If you want to lose your law license, the best ways are to get caught either stealing client funds or lying, and esp. lying while under oath.
So, we apparently/supposedly have the chief law enforcement officer of the country (if you ignore his boss) repeated lying to Congress, and intentionally actively obstructing their investigation of illegal activities by his department (ignoring for a moment that Fast and Furious was also immoral).
AG Holder controls the law enforcement activities of the federal government. If we cannot trust him to honestly execute his duties there, then who can we trust to protect us from the government?
I think that one of the things that has been esp. worrisome about Fast and Furious is the level to which the MSM is willing to hide the scandal from view of the American public in order to protect the President. NBC apparently finally mentioned the scandal for the first time last week, as a side issue, for maybe 10 seconds. This was almost a year and a half since probably the biggest scandal of our lifetimes had broken. A year and a half of hiding the scandal from the American people, and probably only in passing because it is likely to result in the first finding of Contempt of Congress by a sitting AG in decades. (And, maybe because it now seems likely that some Dems will vote with the Republicans, destroying the claim that it was purely politics).
Another part of this is that the DoJ cover up is so egregious. We aren't talking about covering up the actions of a couple of rogue agents of Nixon's reelection campaign, but a systematic attempt by top DoJ officials to protect themselves from scrutiny and accountability.
I do go back and forth with AG Holder between believing that he is grossly incompetent and extremely dishonest. I don't think that he should be trusted with the Department of Justice in either case.
The reason that I tend towards the dishonesty explanation is that he seems to have been successful in some of his endeavors - in particular, in protecting Blacks from scrutiny and racializing the operation of his department. I also think that if it were merely a question of incompetence, he wouldn't be fighting the appointment of a special prosecutor or stonewalling Congress so strenuously.
He seems to be asserting that lying is ok, as long as it is done by Democratic politicians. Or, something like that.
I asked if lying was bad. And got a lot of "I can't believe you're asking that!", without actually answering the question. I suspect with serial liars like Romney and Scott Walker representing them, that might be tough to admit.
Yeah, illegally shipping weapons to Mexican drug cartels, resulting in numerous Mexican civilan deaths, and the death of a US Border Patrol agent, then lying about what you did to Congress in kind of bad. Glad we were able to help you work through that, garage.
I asked if lying was bad. And got a lot of "I can't believe you're asking that!", without actually answering the question.
This seems to presuppose that lying is worse for Republicans than for Democrats, since apparently it is hypocritical for the former, but expected of the latter. Something like that.
I think though that even if you accept that politicians lie as a matter of course, that there have to be limits on their lying if this country is going to survive. And, those limits, I think, have to include not lying under oath or before Congress.
Yeah, illegally shipping weapons to Mexican drug cartels, resulting in numerous Mexican civilan deaths, and the death of a US Border Patrol agent, then lying about what you did to Congress in kind of bad. Glad we were able to help you work through that, garage.
I highly doubt it was "illegal", as anything the U.S. does is inherently not illegal. If Holder lied, so fucking what? They all lie.
Anyways we are the largest weapons dealer in the world. 62 countries - from Afghanistan to Yemen. I'm sure lots of shit has blown up in our face arming people.
Yeah, that's it garage, they all do it! They all ship machine guns to Mexican drug gangs, then cover it up. It's no big deal, truly it's not. Now that that's out of the way, you'll have more time to obssess over Scott Walker and his secret routers, lol.
I went to school with a boy named S.T. The initials did not stand for anything. His name was Ess Tee. He said he was always getting phone calls from people wanting to talk to Mr. Saint. I had a teacher named J.C. (jay cee) and a cousin named F. J. (eff jay). Why is this idea so hard to understand.
Yeah, that's it garage, they all do it! They all ship machine guns to Mexican drug gangs, then cover it up. I
I bet it happens all the time. F&F is probably a remarkably tiny fuckup in the big scheme of things. We sell fighter jets to countries that don't even know how to fly them.
Yeah, that's it garage, they all do it! They all ship machine guns to Mexican drug gangs, then cover it up.
The one thing that the DoT didn't do was to ship machine guns. Those, the Mexican cartels get from the Middle East, Central and South America, and their own police and military. The world is awash in military grade weapons, while it is close to illegal to sell them here.
What was sold were higher grade semi-automatic AR variants (that look like M-16s), .50 caliber rifles (aka "sniper rifles"), and high grade semi-automatic pistols. Mostly, the semi-automatic ARs, which after 40+ years of our soldiers being trained on that platform, are the preferred type of rifles in this country.
Keep in mind though that American military doctrine has moved away from "spray and pray" fully automatic weapons since Vietnam. The semi-automatic versions are quite deadly, as evidenced by their death toll in the Fast and Furious operation.
So guns DO kill people. Nobody could have predicted.
I highly doubt it was "illegal", as anything the U.S. does is inherently not illegal. If Holder lied, so fucking what? They all lie.
The illegality is that supplying arms to foreign terrorists requires Presidential authorization, and typically is done through the DoD or State Department. This requirement is apparently not waiverable by the Attorney General.
Most of those examples of arming the rest of the world are private American companies selling arms to sovereign foreign countries, presumably after getting the requisite export licenses. Not the U.S. government shipping arms to terrorists in a friendly neighboring country, while hiding such shipments from the government of that country (and, note that the Bush era "Wide Receiver" operation was with the full knowledge and cooperation of the Mexican government). Yes, the U.S. has shipped arms to foreign terrorists (most famously, to the Afghans to fight the Russians during the Cold War). But, that requires Presidential authorization, and is not something that the Attorney General can authorize on his own (or, worse, his subordinates).
I highly doubt it was "illegal", as anything the U.S. does is inherently not illegal.
I . . . what the hell? How can you possibly believe this? Acts aren't "inherently not illegal" just because it's a bunch of government officers doing them. Theoretically, our government is bound by laws, after all.
In any case, the plan by the gun control people to push back 2nd Amendment rights by fanning the flames of outrage over US guns in the hands of Mexican cartels is toast.
So there's that.
"I . . . what the hell? How can you possibly believe this? Acts aren't "inherently not illegal" just because it's a bunch of government officers doing them. Theoretically, our government is bound by laws, after all."
It's jurisdictional.
Garage is confusing the actions of our government in the jurisdictional interstices between nations and the actions of a portion of the US government subject to US law.
Garage is confusing the actions of our government in the jurisdictional interstices between nations and the actions of a portion of the US government subject to US law.
Oh please. We illegally arm groups of people all over the world. We barely care if guns are sold illegally in the U.S.
I bet it happens all the time. F&F is probably a remarkably tiny fuckup in the big scheme of things
Yeah, it is certainly small potatoes compared to Scott Walker's secret router, I'll give you that. Good to know that you've got things in perspective.
"Oh please. We illegally arm groups of people all over the world."
Bruce explained rather clearly.
Also, "illegal" doesn't mean "morally wrong" or "I don't like it" or "is illegal in some circumstances so must be illegal in all circumstances because anything else isn't fair."
Re Craig Robinson's well compensated coaching: It's very satisfying if you are doing what you love, and if it comes with the benefit of knowing that perhaps you're giving someone out there something that they love or want, too.
Michelle Obama specifically said she went to law school, he (Craig) went to business school and both left the [filthy lucre of the]corporate world for [implied] occupations of less remuneration, and was encouraging her audience thusly.
She, who made 6 figures at the hospital turfing poor patients (mostly black). Followed by a raise to over $300,000 in a position which evaporated after her senator husband was elected POTUS with scant skills or experience.
Hypocrisy is thy name.
Garage, man, you're too predictable. Everything with you follows the same three steps:
1. Deny lefties did anything wrong.
2. Admit they did something wrong but tu quoque your lil' heart out.
3. Storm off in a huff.
We illegally arm groups of people all over the world.
Who is we? The Obama administration?
Wow. I thought Garage beclowned himself over the Wis Recall. But this thread is priceless.
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