And when I say a nasty piece of work, I don't simply mean her opinions on Israel. She's been full-spectrum awful. I've known a few people who knew her 40 years ago, and she was slimy then too...
Also, let's just get the liberal bias thing out of the way. If there was a right-winger who'd spouted so much bile, hate, and ideological agenda-driven nonsense in the White House briefing room for half a century it would be . . . oh wait, no such person would have ever been allowed to become a Washington "institution" in the first place. ..
Suddenly, all of these people and groups are stunned to discover that Helen Thomas is . . . Helen Thomas. Feh.
৭ জুন, ২০১০
"Everyone knows she is a nasty piece of work and has been a nasty piece of work for decades."
Jonah Goldberg tells us how he really feels about Helen Thomas:
এতে সদস্যতা:
মন্তব্যগুলি পোস্ট করুন (Atom)
পোস্টগুলি
২৭৭টি মন্তব্য:
277 এর 1 – থেকে 200 আরও নতুন» সবচেয়ে নতুন»Our "loss" is the Notre Dame cathedral's gain. Replacement gargoyles can get pretty pricey.
I'd like to give Jonah Goldberg a smiley happy-face sticker for his excellent post. Good job, little boy!
Especially the first line:
I think a lot of people in Washington need to get a grip.
If more people were to compose their thoughts from this starting point, we would all be much better off.
You what I don't understand at the link? That someone was sad to have missed all the Sunday morning Talk Shows!
Over at Hot Air's Green Room, Karl invokes a vortex:
It is one thing to try to turn a blind eye to Helen Thomas; it is quite another to be sucked into her vortex.
I guess her vortex will be retiring with her.
mmm, i assume you know that thomas has "retired," right Ann?
and yeah, in some ways i didn't realize how big the story was because i was like, "wow, she's an anti-semite. well, color me surprised." yes in a sarcastic tone. but apprently this is news to people.
good to see her out on her a--.
I really like her when she played Aunt Bethany in Christmas Vacation.
Kent:
Haha "replacement gargoyles" excellent one LOL.
And jeez Helen Thomas is 89 years old! It's time to go home already you fossil and take Andy Rooney, Larry King and Morley Safer with you. And on the way, stop by the US Senate and colect everyone over 75 years old especially Robert Byrd.
Although her 'Go back to Poland' comment reflects, what I think is plain ignorance of history on the part of most anti-Israel kooks; that is, that the Jews have no claim to the region. From my experience it has come as a surprise when I inform some people that the Jews came from what we call Palestine.
Five bucks says the last words shouted out to her, on her way out the door, were: "THE POWER OF CHRIST COMPELS YOU! THE POWER OF CHRIST COMPELS YOU -- !!!" ;)
Since the last time I commented on an Althouse thread related to Helen Thomas the thought has been growing in my mind that she couldn't publicly state such views -- and to a rabbi, apparently! -- if these weren't acceptable comments in the circles where she moved.
Am I the only person who feels that way?
Big Mike
maybe not "acceptable" but tolerated. i rememmber in law school how professors would put forth the most out there theories and half the class would pretend it was a brilliant idea, and the rest would be silent. except for me, who drove those professors crazy. and to their credit, they gave me good grades. i can count for a few hearty recommendations from professors i positively drove nuts.
After class, alot of the silent ones would say, "i just wanted you to know alot of us agreed with you." i politely said thanks, but part of me was like, "then say it!"
I could easily picture a similar dynamic in the press rooms. no one wanted to contradict her because she was supposedly this respected elder of journalism.
Am I the only person who feels that way?
I don't think so. Then again, she didn't say anything that Arab nations have been saying for decades, and I can't find the quote off hand but she was pretty close to saying exactly what Achmedenijad said (something to the effect of why couldn't the Jews have been re-located in Europe).
Mr. Goldberg registers an opinion and the usual suspects are offended. After all, they think the Soviet definition of peace - give us everything we want and don't ever complain about it - should be applied to all forms of discourse.
What's interesting here is that this may be the first time (that I can recall, anyway) a member of the news media (or anything else, for that matter) had to resign because Conservatives were bent out of shape.
Maybe this Internet/talk radio/Tea Party thing is going to work after all.
Btw, we should really be nicer to Helen Thomas. She has been really depressed ever since Dorothy dropped a house on her sister.
edutcher
well, that is not entirely true. i mean it was mainly the rightosphere that mounted Dan Rather's head to the wall.
One other thing to consider about the Jews is that post-WW2 they were viewed as victims and vulnerable after what the Nazis did. The problem for them came when they actually started standing up for themselves. I think for many on the left, when you stop being a victim you lose your 'street cred' with them.
Hoosier
Well, its more like the vaunted underdog status. i mean liberals like isreal at full out war, because it was tanks and planes v. tanks and planes, with the isrealis outnumbered to a degree that recalls the old testament stories of jews kicking severe a--. so they were liked back then. But the palestinains managed to convince the left that now they are the underdogs.
People confuse fanatacism in a cause with the morality of a cause. people find and die "bravely" for evil, with evil in their hearts. when people get over that and recognize that reality, then a proper understanding of who is right and wrong in isreal is possible.
Great, when do we remove Pat Buchanan's cot in the green room at MSNBC?
Hoosier Daddy,
I believe "they", or at least Abraham and his household, came from what we today call Iraq.
(A merchant of Ur, which was a little NE of Nasaryiah where Jessica Lynch and her company got ambushed.)
Big Mike,
What Helen Thomas said is no longer "acceptable" anywhere; she is just an 89-year old woman who has been allowed to get away with acting outrageous for far too long.
As Jonah Goldberg advised, get a grip!
Great, when do we remove Pat Buchanan's cot in the green room at MSNBC?
Anytime...aaannytime.
Buchanan is a "Jack Booted Nazi" and can exit stage right...soon.
The sooner they dump Pat Buchanan the better. He is part and parcel of the elitist media. He is not a conservative. He just plays one on TV.
They just like his outrageous manner so the liberal muckty-mucks can feel good about the hate they spew. Off with his head!
garage... msnbc keeps pat buchanan around to discredit the republicans and conservatives by pretending he represents them.
And the same goes for Mark Shields on the other side. We need some new talking heads. Please.
Genetically, the Jews and Palistinians, Syrians and Lebanese (this means YOU too Helen Thomas) are closely related.
This makes sense. They all came from the same geographic area and have shared a common history for thousands and thousands of years.
So if Helen wants the Jews to go back to where they came from....guess what! They have.
"We need some new talking heads. Please."
Yes. David Byrne is an Israel-hating douchebag too.
I believe "they", or at least Abraham and his household, came from what we today call Iraq.
Want to know more from a non-religious source? Read Susan Wise Bauer's The History of the Ancient World. She's an excellent historical storyteller. It's written at a high level and the historical pace is fast, but it works well as a springboard for more detailed study of whatever specific things you might find interesting.
She has also written a kids' version, which is great for reading aloud or for sending to little boys like Jonah Goldberg as a potty-training graduation present.
I'm not shocked that the wheels seem to be coming off the left's naked wagon.
I'm shocked, almost daily, that it might actually happen in my lifetime.
I will also likely be shocked in years hence when the tally of pain and suffering is fully understood, amassed over the last few decades and, I'm sure, shortly ahead as the current inception of progressivism goes through its inevitable death spasms.
It'll fall apart if for no other reason than the radical Boomers are getting too old to remember to hold their tongues.
A.W. said...
edutcher
well, that is not entirely true. i mean it was mainly the rightosphere that mounted Dan Rather's head to the wall.
For expecting Black Rock News to be to tell the truth. How dare they.
Black Rock, as I recall, tried to shield him for a while, so it would appear it was more to save their credibility than public outrage that Dan Blather was let go. He had been going off the deep end for years.
WV "wookin" Making little Wookies.
garage... msnbc keeps pat buchanan around to discredit the republicans and conservatives by pretending he represents them.
You'd think conservative's would have been screaming for his head even more then. But, not a peep.
Great, when do we remove Pat Buchanan's cot in the green room at MSNBC?
Olbermann. Matthews. Maddow. Buchanan.
Hell, seems like ol Pat's finally found the one place where he really, truly fits in, after all this time.
and thank you Jonah Goldberg for pointing this out to us...many having felt that you were the nastiest piece of work out there for decades.
"Palladian said...
"We need some new talking heads. Please."
Yes. David Byrne is an Israel-hating douchebag too."
Yeah but the professor played in the band when she went under the name of Tina Weymouth! If they go back on the road maybe we won't have to listen to her fight with the Crack Emcee anymore.
(That's a photo of the professor and Crack in happier times)
That's funny, Garage. I tried, but I can't think of a single conservative that I know that doesn't think Pat Buchanan is a blowhard and an idiot to boot. He's worse than marginal.
"You'd think conservative's would have been screaming for his head even more then. But, not a peep."
Perhaps they dont know he is on there, since they (and nearly everyone else) never watch MSNBC?
Good riddance to that piece of leftard offal. Now she just needs to die and that can't come to soon.
What Helen Thomas said is no longer "acceptable" anywhere; she is just an 89-year old woman who has been allowed to get away with acting outrageous for far too long.
This claim might be more convincing, Hagar, if so many left-wing sites out there weren't defending her and her comments and decrying her critics as crazed right-wing Zionists. (e.g. here, here, here, or the open comments section of any article/blog post that *does* criticize or condemn what she said).
Also, I'm in agreement with DBQ, TY, AW, et al. on Buchanan. (Though honestly, as long as he's only on MSNBC, that's close enough for me to him not being on the air at all.)
An apropos bit of dialogue from Clint Eastwood’s movie “White Hunter, Black Heart.” Clint, some dude and a pretty woman were having dinner together, when she said pretty much Hitler had the right idea about the jews. The dude reveals he is Jewish and she keeps going saying anti-semitic stuff anyway. And then Clint pipes up.
“Clint: I would like to tell you a little story, though.
“Woman: I love stories.
“Clint: You mustn't interrupt now, because you're too beautiful to interrupt people.
“When l was in London in the early [1940]’s, I was dining one evening at the Savoy with a rather select group of people and sitting next to me was a very beautiful lady, much like yourself.
“Woman: Now you're pulling my leg.
“Clint: Now, just listen, dear. We were dining and the bombs were falling, we were all talking about Hitler and comparing him with Napoleon, and we were all being really brilliant. And then, suddenly, this beautiful lady, she spoke up and said that was the thing she didn't mind about Hitler was the way he was treating the Jews.
“Well, we all started arguing with her, of course. Though, mind you, no one at the table was Jewish. But she persisted.
“Are you listening, honey? Mustn't interrupt Daddy. That's right. You're way too beautiful for that.
“Anyway, she went on to say that that's how she felt about it, that if she had her way, she would kill them all, burn them in ovens, like Hitler.
“Well, we all sat there in silence.
“Then finally, l leaned over to her and l said, ‘Madam, l have dined with some of the ugliest goddamn bitches in my time. And l have dined with some of the goddamndest ugly bitches in this world. But you, my dear, are the ugliest bitch of them all.’
“Anyway, she got up to leave and she tripped over a chair and fell on the floor. And we all just sat there. No one raised a hand to help her. And finally when she picked herself up, I said to her one more time: ‘You, my dear, are the ugliest goddamn bitch l have ever dined with.’
“Well, you know what happened? The very next day, she reported me to the American Embassy. And they brought me in for reprimand. And then when they investigated it they found out that she was a German agent. And they locked her up.
“Isn't that amazing?
“Woman: Why did you tell me that story?
“Clint: I don't know. It wasn't because l thought you were a German agent, honey. But I was tempted tonight to say the very same thing to you.
“I didn't want you to think I had never said it before.
“You, madam, are the...
“Well, you know the rest.”
To Helen Thomas. You, madam are the ugliest... ah, well you know the rest.
Now she just needs to die and that can't come to soon.
We might have to wait awhile on that score. My understanding is that Batman seldom, if ever, kills his foes.
garage
Why should conservatives be screaming for his head now? he has been like this for 20 years at least, and has been used by the liberal media for every bit as long. we prefer instead to watch a different network. we voted with our feet.
garage, what's your problem with Buchanan? doesn't he agree with you completely on Israel?
So there is a racist conservative poser on tv every night and not one call from conservatives for him to be fired? Good one!
Pat Buchanan is a walking straw man. He doesn't stand up at every WH press party and knock over the punch bowl.
SO there is a racist conservative poser on MSNBC every single night
Fixed to accurately reflect current ownership of toxic spill in question.
SO there is a racist conservative poser on TV every single night and not one call for him to be fired? Good one!
That is because, unlike you fascists on the left who want to silence everyone who doesn't march in goose step with der leader and your own ideology, we conservatives have the ability to turn off the television or change the chanel.
Free speech is for everyone, not just people you agree with. SO.....even if I think Buchanan is an ass and Helen Thomas is a senile urine smelling Jew hater...I think that both of them should not be 'forced' off of the air.
Their employers have the right to fire them or they can chose to resign on their very own, but to do as the fascist left does and try to silence by demanding someone be fired....is un-American. Of course...we already knew that about you guys.
SO there is a racist conservative poser on TV every single night and not one call for him to be fired? Good one!
"fire pat buchanan": About 26,700 results (0.20 seconds)
(This, despite MSNBC being a network that caters to hard-left liberals which has a viewership about the size of the local cable community access channel.)
Is there anything that liberals do that they don't somehow manage to blame on conservatives?
Pat Buchanan is paid to be hated and he is by both sides, so it's hard to fire him for it.
I think conservatives would like to see gone more than liberals do.
Dead Julius,
Or borrow a copy of Hammond's "Past Worlds" or "The Times Atlas of World History." No people are located "where they came from," which cannot be determined anyway with any precision beyond at best the last 2-3 thousand years.
AC245,
Some American Jews need to make up their minds as to what is "left wing" and "right wing."
Suspicions confirmed
and it would then seem that someone managed to hire some Turkish street thugs to ride along on the largest ship and give the boarding party a nasty surprise, without the Mossad finding out about it in time.
That is because, unlike you fascists on the left who want to silence everyone who doesn't march in goose step with der leader and your own ideology, we conservatives have the ability to turn off the television or change the chanel.
Hahahaha. Nothing says fascist quite like demanding a pledge of 100% absolute allegiance to a foreign country, or be called a racist traitor. Racism against an American President in this country? Doesn't exist!
I read in these threads all the time that there is really no racism in America anymore. When it comes to their tribe, that is. Thomas is a wingnut scalp, nothing more.
DBQ said:
"we conservatives have the ability to turn off the television or change the chanel."
I have this image of the cable company asking its customers "Are you conservative?" Yes.
"Well then you get a remote and a channel changer. " Heh heh
I read in these threads all the time that there is really no racism in America anymore
Please link to an example. I would love to see that coming from even the slightly excitable conservatives hereabouts. There may be (and I seem to remember quite a few) sarcastic comments in the vein of "I thought we were supposed to be post-racial now", usually written in response to some race-identity crap coming from the left.
Conservatives don't live in the world as we would like it to be. We don't share visions of an unattainable utopia. That's y'all's bailiwick.
It'll fall apart if for no other reason than the radical Boomers are getting too old to remember to hold their tongues.
This is the sort of thing that suggests to me that way too many of you dippy little wippersnappers slept through math class.
The first year of the Baby Boom was 1946. If you hadn't slept through your 2nd grad math class, you'd be able to subtract 1946 from 2010 to get 64 for the answer.
So the oldest Baby Boomer is 64, and at 89 Helen Thomas is twenty-five years too old to be a Boomer.
(Er, you were able to subtract 64 from 89 and get 25, right?)
If you want to see why the United States is screwed up, you can stop blaming the Boomers and go look in the mirror.
garage...
twist and turn all you want, but pat buchanan represents... pat buchanan. and maybe the KKK. He doesn't have a following in mainstream conservativism.
And no, we aren't 100% silent on the subject of buchanan, but its pretty clear msnbc doesn't give a rats' ass what conservatives think as evidenced by Keith Olbermann. They also don't care about the facts... as evidenced by Keith Olbermann. Besides, Olbermann's a pretty big racist, too.
That all being said, thank you to a news organization i never heard of for showing highers standards than msnbc. maybe they can hire her as a correspondant hunting down the "truth" contained in the protocols of the elders of zion. Its sort of like the davinci code, only stupider.
My apologies for making this, but I couldn't resist. I did my best to pretty her up a bit. Thanks for the idea, kent.
"Nothing says fascist quite like demanding a pledge of 100% absolute allegiance to a foreign country, or be called a racist traitor."
Perhaps an example? One that actually exists out of your feverish imagination?
We should not forget that while Jews were dying in Europe, we Americans rejected nearly all their attempts to escape by coming here.
I know that conservatives generally believe that America can do no wrong. Were it politically expedient, I'm sure we would see today's Republicans telling the world that we ought to round up all the big-nosed gold-hoarding Marxist Jews and send them to a nice homeland in Madagascar.
For now, though, our past failure as a country requires us to support a Jewish homeland in their historical region to the greatest extent that we can.
demanding a pledge of 100% absolute allegiance to a foreign country
Which of the Elders' protocols was that one, again? I forget.
jeff
Look at any recent thread here on Israel. I'm an anti-semite, you know.
I did my best to pretty her up a bit. Thanks for the idea, kent.
You miracle worker, you! You've magically shaved decades off her appearance! She's practically a dewey, sparkle-eyed crone of ninety again! ;)
Nothing says fascist quite like demanding a pledge of 100% absolute allegiance to a foreign country, or be called a racist traitor.
What in the world are you talking about?
When I first exposed to Jonah Goldberg's writings, I was not impressed. The more he has written, the better he has become. His acerbic writing suits me to a T.
Regarding Buchanan...Most liberal shows/networks/newspapers always have buffoons as conservative representatives (think David Brooks). What better way to dismiss the conservative viewpoint that to have an idiot represent it, all in the name of balance.
Dead Julius
your morality is pretty good, but your facts are significantly wrong. i suggest reading dershowitz's book on isreal. its excellent.
I'm not saying you are wrong to support isreal. i am a supporter of isreal, but you are makign some factual mistakes along the way.
Looks like garage just keeps giving AlphaLib more yardwork, what with all the straw and all.
@Hagar, I do have a grip, thank you very much.
You know, most people, however they feel inside, know where the limits are because friends or a spouse or their kids tell them when they're getting over the top.
Or if they don't tell you outright, they at least look at you sort of funny and let you know through their body language that you've crossed a line.
Helen Thomas didn't just go over the top with her remarks, she got to the top and put up a 30' extension ladder.
And nobody stopped her until the rabbi got out his flip camera.
So the oldest Baby Boomer is 64, and at 89 Helen Thomas is twenty-five years too old to be a Boomer.
I don't recall naming Thomas as a boomer. What I do recall saying is that the boomers "are getting" (quotes added to remind exactly what I said). Still valid unless, of course, you contend the Boomers won't age or become infirm both mentally and physically.
As for looking in the mirror, I'm either a Lost Gen or X'r, depending on what journalist you decide to read. 1970. Basically, we've not had a chance to do anything except school and work. Very few of us hold the levers of power. It's highly unlikely we can screw it up any worse than the preceding generation.
That's assuming, of course, that we're not crushed by what they are handing off to us. Given that, if we do pull it off, it will be that much sweeter. The boomers took the greatest collection of positive circumstances and flushed most of 'em all swirly.
"Look at any recent thread here on Israel. I'm an anti-semite, you know."
I looked at this thread. I see nothing demanding 100% loyalty to a foreign country. What thread would you be referring to?
"I know that conservatives generally believe that America can do no wrong."
And the bullshit keeps on keepin' on!
Why do the lib trolls here suck so damn bad?
jeff
Look at any recent thread here on Israel. I'm an anti-semite, you know.
If the anti-semitic shoe doesn't fit, it's certainly not for your lack of effort to jam your foot into it on every thread.
Let no American imagine that Zionism is inconsistent with Patriotism. Multiple loyalties are objectionable only if they are inconsistent. A man is a better citizen of the United States for being also a loyal citizen of his state, and of his city; for being loyal to his family, and to his profession or trade; for being loyal to his college or his lodge. Every Irish American who contributed towards advancing home rule was a better man and a better American for the sacrifice he made. Every American Jew who aids in advancing the Jewish settlement in Palestine, though he feels that neither he nor his descendants will ever live there, will likewise be a better man and a better American for doing so.
- Louis D. Brandeis,
The Jewish Problem: How To Solve It
Dead Julius said ..For now, though, our past failure as a country requires us to support a Jewish homeland in their historical region to the greatest extent that we can.
No....We support Israel for several reasons. One of which is they are our only ally in the region.
If the anti-semitic shoe doesn't fit, it's certainly not for your lack of effort to jam your foot into it on every thread.
And nothing, absolutely nothing I've ever said here could remotely be labeled anti-semitic. You're proving my point.
Ah! Garage continues to run interference for Jew haters. What a surprise.
Garage, nobody gives a fuck about Pat Buchanan anymore. Conservatives cast him out of the movement and marginalized him a decade ago.
The only reason he has any relevance at all today is because MSNBC has given him a show on which he can spew his bile.
You can't really hang that around the Right's neck. (Unless you want to claim that MSNBC somehow represents the Right.)
Meanwhile, Helen Thomas has been lionized by the mainstream media, and embraced (in some cases, literally) by Liberals.
So, here's the score:
Conservatives: Marginalized Pat Buchanan for being a racist and a Jew hater, criticized Helen Thomas for being a Jew hater.
Liberals: Gave Buchanan his own show. Mostly defended Thomas's Jew hatred. Some, like yourself, continue to run interference for her and other Jew haters (like Hamas and the IHH).
I've been upgraded to running interference for Jew haters now, instead of being a Jew hater myself. Progress!
Dead Julius said..."I know that conservatives generally believe that America can do no wrong."
As a conservative, I don't buy that one either. America made a huge mistake in November 2009....one from which we may not recover.
@Scott, if you were born in 1970 then you should be 18 or 19 years out of college (maybe as few as 13 if you got an advanced degree).
If you were an engineer then long before now you should have been a team lead and then a project leader, if now a department manager.
As I look around, except for our largest programs the people in the positions I described above are about forty years old, some younger. If that's not where you're at in your career, then maybe it's time for a time out to figure out what's wrong with your work situation or what's wrong with you.
But at forty my grasp of the "levers of power" was limited to being a Republican precinct chairman in an incandescently blue state. That's where you start.
personally, speaking for myself, i support isreal because i don't want to see a repeat of the holocaust. I suspect that some terrorism might subside if we just threw that nation under the bus but I never really examined that because... its a morally unthinkable thing for me or my country to do.
Sometimes something can be so monsterously wrong, you must do anything to prevent it. Cost/benefit analysis just doesn't enter into it.
@Youngblood, right on!!!
"Great, when do we remove Pat Buchanan's cot in the green room at MSNBC?"
I would guess that comes from your clumsy attempt to equate Buchanan appearing on a "news" channel that no one watches with Thomas sitting in the front row of the white house briefing room. What other reason would you do so unless you were running interference for her, trying to make the point that if one anti-Semitic is on tv, all of them should be on tv. I guess. If not, please clarify your reasoning for bringing up Buchanan.
And nothing, absolutely nothing I've ever said here could remotely be labeled anti-semitic. You're proving my point.
"Nothing says fascist quite like demanding a pledge of 100% absolute allegiance to a foreign country, or be called a racist traitor. "
Well, garage, I'll concede that you're no more of an anti-semite than David Duke is:
"One of the forbidden issues in the Jewish-influenced American media is the question of whether or not many powerful Jews in media and government put the interests of Israel over that of the United States of America. Wheatcroft dismisses the dual loyalty issue in part by attacking me.
...
First off, to Mr. Wheatcroft and anyone else who cares to know, I am not anti-Semitic, disguised or otherwise, simply because I expose elements of Jewish extremism and supremacism. Am I supposed to be anti-Semitic because I dare to raise the question of the loyalty of many of the major Jewish organizations, lobbies, media bosses and Zionist government bureaucrats?"
But that's setting the bar pretty low.
@Big Mike
You missed the point completely, but that's partially my fault. I should have spelled out what I meant by the levers of power. Citing the demographic makeup of a private firm (if that's what you're doing) doesn't really have anything to do with the political levers of power that drive public policy in this country.
Your also coming at me from a very myopic meme...that I should have gone straight to college out of high school, got a degree (or advance degree) then entered the rat race. Sorry to disappoint, but I did six years in the military before going to school then did almost ten years of radio before finishing my final year. I know that doesn't conform to the seemingly ingrained 1950-60's model of what constitutes a "career", but I also see quite a few Gen X'rs doubting they will only have one career in their lifetime, let alone hitch up to a firm and be there until the gold watch.
What I see, as I get to the age where my more politically-minded peers are starting to gain foothold on the national level, is a steaming pile handed to us on a broken clay platter. Quite unlike that which the Boomers inherited from the WWII generation. I don't know if the "three generations from riches to poverty" theory holds for entire generations as it does for single families, but it's looking that way, isn't it?
"Cost/benefit analysis just doesn't enter into it."
For some reason, the only time liberals care about money being spent is when it goes to Israel.
Were it politically expedient, I'm sure we would see today's Republicans telling the world that we ought to round up all the big-nosed gold-hoarding Marxist Jews and send them to a nice homeland in Madagascar.
WTF!!
(Psst don't tell Goldberg, David Brooks, David Frum, Eric Cantor...They wouldn't be happy)
Garage wrote:
"I've been upgraded to running interference for Jew haters now, instead of being a Jew hater myself. Progress!"
Oh, no. I'm sorry if I wasn't clear there, Garage. Please allow me to correct the record!
You still come across as a Jew hater. You're just not stupid enough to come out and say that you don't like the Jews. Instead, you stick up for Jew haters like Hamas, IHH, and Helen Thomas whenever you can.
Now, you may do this because your real targets are Conservatives. A number of the Conservatives here have suggested as much, in your defense.
However, I don't have the ability to look into your heart and determine your true motivation when you side with Jew haters. In my eyes, if it walks like a Jew-hating scumbag and talks like a Jew-hating scumbag, it's probably a Jew-hating scumbag.
I see no reason to give you the benefit of the doubt there.
^ ouch
"The boomers took the greatest collection of positive circumstances and flushed most of 'em all swirly."
As a boomer, I have to agree.
I think progressive policy is like the hunger response. It serves you well when times are tough and life is bad. But, when you achieve a certain level of success as a species, as we have, it just leads to over-eating and obesity, yet the hunger continues.
A lot of demands for social justice today are just fat kids screaming for McDonalds.
Instead, you stick up for Jew haters like Hamas, IHH, and Helen Thomas whenever you can.
Again, not once have I ever made an anti-seminitic comment, or stuck up for Hamas, IHH, or Helen Thomas.
Need to put out an APB on A.L. How much yard work can one person do?
Her parents were Christians from Lebanon. She should be able to say what she thinks, for heaven sakes, even if we don't like it. Obama should have stood up for her. She's a nonagenarian cupcake.
This country is so awful thanks to the leftist censors that now it's like a frenzy of piranhas after everyone who says anything. We're becoming like icky French people.
She is an ugly person (on the inside). She is really quite foul.
edutcher said...
"What's interesting here is that this may be the first time (that I can recall, anyway) a member of the news media (or anything else, for that matter) had to resign because Conservatives were bent out of shape.
Maybe this Internet/talk radio/Tea Party thing is going to work after all."
You give you and your ilk far too much credit. First you rarely say anything that would cause anything but a bemused smile and second this was handled far away from any influence of the Faux Noise crowd of felons.
I haven't heard the full exchange and until I do I'll reserve judgment. As you don't have a wise head among you, it would be beneficial if you did the same but Sean and Glenn Beck would go into fits of outrage so you loonies go do what you gotta do.
"I know that conservatives generally believe that America can do no wrong. Were it politically expedient, I'm sure we would see today's Republicans telling the world that we ought to round up all the big-nosed gold-hoarding Marxist Jews and send them to a nice homeland in Madagascar."
Right. Which is why no one is remotely suggesting that. Projection thy name is Dead Julius.
Hoosier Daddy said...
Although her 'Go back to Poland' comment reflects, what I think is plain ignorance of history on the part of most anti-Israel kooks; that is, that the Jews have no claim to the region. From my experience it has come as a surprise when I inform some people that the Jews came from what we call Palestine.
Jews are no different than anyone else who invaded and temporarily occupied Palestine. They just held it longer than most the 1st time around, before they were booted in turn.
They actually came (in part) from the Arabian Peninnsula like all the Semites do, went to Iraq, got booted from there, went to Canaan and killed them, bred with the ones they didn't kill. Bred with others. The Ashkenazis came out of breeding Semites with Khazars and N Europeans. The Ashkenazis from geentic mixing are actually genetically less close to the original "ethnic Jews" than Syrians or Lebanese or native Palestinians or Separdic Jews are. Most of their ancestors came from outside Palestine, Arabian origin..
The Ethiopian Jews are as close genetically as Chinese are to the original Jews (Canaanites, Hittite, Philistine milkman admixtures, etc..making it stupid in as sense to think there was even such a thing as "an original Jew" different than others in the region.
Many of the so-called Jewish settlers from Russia occupying the West Bank show no semitic roots whatsoever. Basically, Slavs that call themselves the "heirs" to a land none of their lineage comes from.
Why are so many Palestinians, Lebs, and Syrians so much like their cousins the Separdic Jews? Because they all basically had the same ancestors Mommies and Daddies, and all stayed in the same region for millenia.
Many Palestinian Muslims and Christians are just Jews who converted to a dominant religion so they would have a less hassled life and be able to make more money.
That is why Arabs who are not of Semetic blood like Egyptians - like to piss off Lebs and Palestinians by calling them the "Israeli's cousins". And why Israeli security is premised on other ways to check people out, since Palestinians, Syrians are pretty much visually indistinguishable from a Sephardic from Syria, etc.
Great, when do we remove Pat Buchanan's cot in the green room at MSNBC?
Don't be too hasty, garage. If Buchanan wasn't on MSNBC we'd run the risk of him appearing on a show people actually watch. ;)
jeff said...
"Were it politically expedient, I'm sure we would see today's Republicans telling the world that we ought to round up all the big-nosed gold-hoarding Marxist Jews and send them to a nice homeland in Madagascar."
Perhaps Gilligan's Island, of which this ilk is familiar, but Madagascar is stretch (for them)..even with the cartoon movie
I guess it's just weird to me to see garage so comfortable supporting C4's line of thinking.
"She should be able to say what she thinks, for heaven sakes, even if we don't like it. Obama should have stood up for her. " I apparently missed the part where someone wanted her locked up for speaking.
"I haven't heard the full exchange and until I do I'll reserve judgment."
Right. No doubt this was all taken out of context and she really meant something completely different. Good call.
"Her parents were Christians from Lebanon. She should be able to say what she thinks, for heaven sakes, even if we don't like it."
Well, yeah. She can say what she wants, but that doesn't mean she's immune from the fallout.
And Goldberg is right: Everyone in Washington knows what a nasty piece of work is Helen Thomas. Just an unpleasant person who's gotten away with her crap for decades because no one has the balls to tell her to her face that's she's a nasty harpy and no one likes her.
"jeff said..."
Actually he didnt. He quoted Dead Julius.
From garage on earlier related threads:
Seeds are barred, because, well they might actually plant and grow something and thrive. Lumber and cement banned because they might actually build something. In short, anything that could be self sustaining and not dependent on Israel is not allowed.
Maybe Egypt didn't attack a ship and murder it's passengers like Israel did?
You can say until you're blue in the face but it doesn't make it true. I just stated I stand with this country, no other. Give it a try sometime. Then, you can condemn any country's actions and behavior that could potentially harm this country's interests.
I think the Right in this country would defend Israel's "right to defend itself" if they were parked off our coasts lobbing missiles at us.
Again, garage, I'll concede you're probably no more of an anti-semite than David Duke.
Or Pat Buchanan.
Or Cedarford.
Sure. We should let Helen Thomas spew her racist & anti-Jew hatred.
But Rand Paul - he's confused on the CRA of 1964 so OFF WITH HIS HEAD.
I understand.
And nice derail, garage. Instead of looking at the odious nature of Helen Thomas and discussing her foul vitriol, we're worried about a non-entity on a TV station only garage & his 3 closest friends seem to be watching.
@Jeff
I didn't say that. I just haven't heard the full exchange.You might not like her. I don't really care for her either but I don't toss people under the bus until I know...unlike some who are told what to think and do.
So there is a racist conservative poser on tv every night and not one call from conservatives for him to be fired? Good one!
No conservatives listen to Pat Buchanan. He's been persona non grata in the Republican party since the first Bush administration.
However, there are plenty of people of agree with what Helen Thomas said--heck, go to Huffington Post and watch the canonization of Saint Helen.
garage mahal said...
jeff
Look at any recent thread here on Israel. I'm an anti-semite, you know.
Yeah you are.
The boomers took the greatest collection of positive circumstances and flushed most of 'em all swirly.
Did they, though? Control of Congress and the Supreme Court have yet to pass to the Baby Boom generation; both institutions are still controlled by members of the preceding generation. Most of the governmental stupidity inflicted on us over the past decades is traceable to people born prior to the end of WW2.
Hey there's Cedarford coming out of nowhere on a thread about those dirty Jooooooo invaders!!
Couldn't see THAT one coming, no sir!
What I find amusing is that no other Arab or Persian country is willing to take in the "Palestinians".
For two reasons:
1) It would defuse the Gaza/ West Bank mess, which the other countries clearly don't want.
2) The most important...they don't these terrorists either. Yasser "that's my baby" Arafat was booted from several Arab countries.
"Her parents were Christians from Lebanon. She should be able to say what she thinks, for heaven sakes, even if we don't like it. Obama should have stood up for her. She's a nonagenarian cupcake."
Well shit, I guess I better check my family tree before I chime in on something I may lack the qualifications for!
Since the last time I commented on an Althouse thread related to Helen Thomas the thought has been growing in my mind that she couldn't publicly state such views -- and to a rabbi, apparently! -- if these weren't acceptable comments in the circles where she moved.
Antisemitism is fashionable again after a long hiatus. Of course these comments are acceptable in her circle as long as you preface them with something like "I don't hate Jews, but..." It's the modern version of "Some of my best friends are black."
"We should not forget that while Jews were dying in Europe, we Americans rejected nearly all their attempts to escape by coming here."
I wonder who was President when that happened?
**cough** FDR **cough**
Garage wrote:
"Again, not once have I ever made an anti-seminitic comment, or stuck up for Hamas, IHH, or Helen Thomas."
Yes, you have.
Your antisemitism lurks in your double standards. Anyone who cares to do so can go back and read recent threads in which you employed such double standards consistently.
And, in this thread, you're continuing to run interference for the Helen Thomas's of the world.
I don't have psychic powers. I can only know you from what you write. If you consistently apply an objectively antisemitic standard to Israel, try to take the heat off of Jew haters, and dust off Cedarford's "dual loyalty" bullshit when you're called on it, I see no reason to give you the benefit of the doubt.
miller said...
".... we're worried about a non-entity on a TV station only garage & his 3 closest friends seem to be watching".
Hey stupid? Yo! You! Look at the numbers and look at the demographic. The same braindeads tune in and stay there on Faux..its 65+ male just like talk radio...that is their most efficient demographic. MSNBC kills them on younger audiences and when it comes to education..it is all over.
When Faux Noise pulls out that whore ridding nitwit Morris and puts on Anthrax Annie and Newt (Mr. Cancer) all within the 1st half hour..well folks...you gotta love 'em.
"I didn't say that. I just haven't heard the full exchange.You might not like her. I don't really care for her either but I don't toss people under the bus until I know...unlike some who are told what to think and do."
Random stranger says exact same thing, I still dont like it. Who do you think are being told what to think or do? You are willing to make that leap of logic and throw those people under the bus (whoever your talking about) but you refuse to acknowledge her own words as objectionable because you havent heard the full exchange? Do you think it started with "i will blow your head off unless you say something really offensive"? As an interesting experiment, suppose Palin had said the exact same thing. Still waiting for the full exchange before deciding?
@Scott, my apologies.
FWIW I was drafted during final exam week and lost effectively 2 1/2 years to the military -- a Democrat was fighting a war in SE Asia and needed cannon fodder. (The two years was how long I served, and the extra six months was to catch up to all that had happened in my field while I was off wearing O.D.)
So I'm sympathetic.
What I'm not sympathetic about is this notion that the "Greatest Generation" handed us a world that was simply wonderful. What we had to deal with included (1) the Cold War, with its implicit suggestion that the United States would end up destroyed in a nuclear holocaust; (2) a stupid war in SE Asia that was begun by two Democrat members of the "Greatest Generation," JFK and LBJ, and continued by another WWII veteran for four more years (despite his "secret plan to end the war"); (3) a Black population that had finally had more than enough of Jim Crow (and rightly so) except that they were expressing their sentiments in flaming riots; (4) pollution so bad that Lake Erie literally caught on fire -- regularly! -- and the air in many places could not be breathed nor the water drunk; and (5) inflation that reached its apogee under yet another member of the "Greatest Generation." Can you imagine buying a house with a 16% mortgage? I bought a fixer-upper with GI Bill benefits at 8.5% and other Baby Boomers expressed raw envy at me for years afterwards.
Did I remember to mention that learned "futurists" were telling us that global cooling was coming upon us, and we were going to run out of oil, and there would be massive famines, and we'd all freeze to death in the dark? In fact, if I recall correctly, we were going to starve to death from the famines because of runaway population growth even if we didn't freeze to death -- not that there was any question but that we were going to freeze to death because the earth was cooling down, as any fool could plainly see.
If you'll pardon a military phrase from my era wearing a specialists's patch on my sleeve, kindly take your ration of sh*t elsewhere. Or, to use the 21st century phrase, how about you go man up?
We Boomers didn't have it as tough as the generation that lived through the Great Depression and fought WWII, but you don't really have it as tough as we did, my friend. There's no draft, the US now fights its wars to win (with the caveat that the present occupant of the White House may yet screw up the end game in Iraq), Civil Rights is a fact, pollution has been so well cleaned up that liberals have to invent things to worry about as far as the ecology is concerned.
And today's futurists assure us that we aren't going to freeze to death.
Sure you have problems. Now fix 'em.
HDH, apparently suffering a major headwound, says: "Hey stupid? Yo! You! Look at the numbers and look at the demographic. The same braindeads tune in and stay there on Faux..its 65+ male just like talk radio...that is their most efficient demographic. MSNBC kills them on younger audiences and when it comes to education..it is all over."
Yo, you with the drool on your keyboard. Care to back your statement up with some, oh, I dunno, facts? Or are you just going to sit there in your urine-filled depends and gnaw on your computer desk?
Hey Garage, I think Hoosier Daddy has your allegience all figured out over on the other channel: Link.
I'm starting to worry about you Garage. Helen Thomas has a great view of the Place de la Concorde from her new perch, so do us all a favor and try and wink after it happens, you betcha! Link.
Your antisemitism lurks in your double standards. Anyone who cares to do so can go back and read recent threads in which you employed such double standards consistently.
Since you are the one making the claim, how bout you provide it for us.
DBQ - "Genetically, the Jews and Palistinians, Syrians and Lebanese (this means YOU too Helen Thomas) are closely related.
This makes sense. They all came from the same geographic area and have shared a common history for thousands and thousands of years."
I'd just say, DBQ, that certain Jewish groups are closely related to their cousins the Palestinians, Lebs, Syrians. Others, like Ashkenazis, not so much. Still other Jewish groups like Ethiopian and new Settlers from Russia - not really at all.
Based on the Y-Haploid studies done, which debunk much past ideas of lineage, not just in the ME, but other areas even more interesting, like Japan, India.
======================
"Dead Julius said...
We should not forget that while Jews were dying in Europe, we Americans rejected nearly all their attempts to escape by coming here."
With 1 in 3 Americans jobless at the time, we also rejected other victims of Fascism, Communism, the Japanese militarists to come here at the same time.
What is your point? That Jews are somehow "more special than" Russians trying to flee before the Gulags got them? The Armenians and Greeks trying to flee the Turk?
How about since the "special people" were turned back we also turned away from the idea of bringing in 10s of millions of starving Chinese and Indians in the 50s? That was OK? Reasonable...but rules should be different for Jews...more deluxe consideration, perhaps?
The 10s of millions butchered in African jungle savagery?
How about 3 million more "Oppressed noble Haitians" on top of half of Mexico demanding to be let in because of economic persecution and political oppression by Mexican elites?
It was the same political call made by every country that also rejected Jews facing job discrimination or 10 million starving Chinese or Africans demanding in - in hard times, huge numbers of it's own people jobless hungry and homeless - each country knew it's citizens wanted their own looked out for 1st.
The same braindeads tune in and stay there on Faux..its 65+ male just like talk radio...that is their most efficient demographic. MSNBC kills them on younger audiences and when it comes to education..it is all over.
Fox vs MSBNC ratings among viewers aged 25-54:
5/31: Fox 243, MSNBC 178
6/1: Fox 384, MSNBC 159
6/2: Fox 406, MSNBC 130
6/3: Fox 446, MSNBC 139
6/4: Fox 333, MSNBC 153
Alternately, you could address the examples I already provided, garage.
Not to speak for him, but I would bet that Youngblood is willing to stipulate, as I do, that you are probably no more of an anti-semite than David Duke.
Or Pat Buchanan.
Or Cedarford.
I have to say there are some unsual line-ups on this issue. I urge everyone to take a step back and think about it. Just sayn
But it is no surprise to see hdhouse loving Helen Thomas. They went to school together you know.
I simply don't understand why Jew-haters seem to act so defensive and ashamed when we point out their position.
I'd think they'd be proud of being bold about their beliefs. Isn't it weird how they run from that label? Like they know it should be shameful, but secretly they're glad that they are anti-Jew?
C4 is right out there. Why not just admit you're part of his world, garage? You'd fit right in, except that you have this quaint behavior where you pretend you haven't said what you've said.
Troop, but I thought Helen Thomas was hdhouse's nurse.
It seems pointless to try to use history as a basis for determining who owns what, seeing that nearly every plot on earth could conceivably be claimed by at least two different groups of people.
Were the Jews there first or last? Meh, what's the difference? They're there now. Heck, just look at Turkey--there were no Turks in Turkey a thousand years ago. Nearly all of modern day Turkey was taken from the original Greeks and Bithynians and Lycians and Syriacs and Kurds. Is anyone calling for the Turks to go home? No.
This idea of a moral right to property based on some historical antecedent is asinine. Otherwise you and I and all other non-natives all need to evacuate the United States. Canadians too.
What matters is the political reality now. Israel exists and isn't going anywhere. Whether the Jews "belong" there is a pointless inquiry.
Why not just admit you're part of his world, garage? You'd fit right in, except that you have this quaint behavior where you pretend you haven't said what you've said.
All these terrible things I've said just a few days ago that nobody seems to be able to find! Amazing. I criticized Israel's raid on the flotilla and that makes me anti-Semitic. Oh well.
The right loves Buchanan because he says what they want to say, but are afraid to say in public. He will survive with all of his twisted, rightie ideas intact.
Hateful man
Vicki
@dumbasses who can't do math
Against the prime deom 25-54 Faux generally draws about 30% in that range...MEANING 2/3rds fall outside that range and that is almost exlusively over 55 with the majority over 65...JUST WHAT I WROTE AND SAID.
It is highly inefficient agsint the prime demo and you can dress that sarah palin ya'betcha pig up anyway you want but it is.
Do the math. If I want to pay a $20 cpm on MSNBC I get very little waste. If I guy on Faux Noise on that demo...particularly the 25-34 segment of it, I get creamed.
The problem is you guys can't think past the end of your weewee....which obviously is pretty darn small time.
To go on, if you look back at history, the Israelis are in this mess because they weren't brutal enough. If they had done what other nations have done throughout history--exterminate or expel the losers--they wouldn't be in this mess. You don't hear of Germans calling for the return of Danzig. There are no Greeks contesting the possession of Istanbul. Heck, there are no Jews demanding to return to Baghdad or Damascus. Those people got booted out, brutally and totally, and as a result those conquests were ratified by default.
Doesn't genuine freedom of speech demand that Helen Thomas or Pat Buchanan not be shut up (or shut down) for saying the unsayable, since in genuine freedom of speech there is no unsayable other than crying fire in a theater or inciting violence? Isn't that what Voltaire's famous "I do not agree with what you say but I will defend to the death your right to say it" is all about?
Here's a wonderful shot of Helen Thomas and hdhouse on the way to the junior prom.
Even back then, Helen was an exhibitionist. That's why hd dropped her. He prefers to do his evil in secret
The best part of the Helen Thomas fiasco is that this will be how she will be remembered. "Schadenfreude"
Brings back fond memories Dan Rather's departure. "Courage"
"Isn't that what Voltaire's famous "I do not agree with what you say but I will defend to the death your right to say it" is all about?"
Voltaire never said that...
Jesus Christ, this Tu quoque routine is frightfully boring. "You have extremists!" "No, you have extremists!" "Well, you have worse extremists!" "No, you have worse extremists!"
Why don't all of you just shut the fuck up!
Uh oh, I'm suppressing free speech!
Wait, no I'm not! I'm using speech to counter speech I deem bad. Just like people have done against Helen Thomas. Unless the government censors her, everything is working as it should.
Does anyone else think that Vicki and HDHouse would make an adorable couple?
The right loves Buchanan because he says what they want to say, but are afraid to say in public. He will survive with all of his twisted, rightie ideas intact."
Er, no. The right ignores Buchanan because he's a throwback to 30's era Republicanism: anti-semitic, xenophobic, isolationist, flirting with fascism. When's the last time Buchanan was invited to address any Republican gathering or meeting of significance? Exactly.
I looked at this thread. I see nothing demanding 100% loyalty to a foreign country. What thread would you be referring to?
Garage beleives that supporting Israel's right to self defense=100% loyalty to them.
Then again he just blithers the party line. Not sure why he's all worked up over Pat B. though. They both seem to hold the same view regarding Israel.
Doesn't genuine freedom of speech demand that Helen Thomas or Pat Buchanan not be shut up (or shut down) for saying the unsayable, since in genuine freedom of speech there is no unsayable other than crying fire in a theater or inciting violence? Isn't that what Voltaire's famous "I do not agree with what you say but I will defend to the death your right to say it" is all about?
I hear there's a part II to be released and I think people want to hear it.
Freedom of speech and "tenured front row position" in WH corps are not mutually exclusive.
Doesn't genuine freedom of speech demand that Helen Thomas or Pat Buchanan not be shut up (or shut down) for saying the unsayable, since in genuine freedom of speech there is no unsayable other than crying fire in a theater or inciting violence?
Free speech is not a shield against criticism or condemnation or even ostracism. It's only a shield against gov't censorship.
The poor little Lefties. They see one of their best and brightest bought down by the words out of her mouth. Uncle Saul never told them it could happen this way.
HDHouse said...
edutcher said...
"What's interesting here is that this may be the first time (that I can recall, anyway) a member of the news media (or anything else, for that matter) had to resign because Conservatives were bent out of shape.
Maybe this Internet/talk radio/Tea Party thing is going to work after all."
You give you and your ilk far too much credit. First you rarely say anything that would cause anything but a bemused smile and second this was handled far away from any influence of the Faux Noise crowd of felons.
It certainly wasn't the Lefties that forced her out.
Besides, whatever ilk I have was made into ice cream for the DLTDHY party.
This thread proves my point better than I ever could. Talk about fascists.
All these terrible things I've said just a few days ago that nobody seems to be able to find!
Anyone having trouble finding examples of what garage has said is welcome to jumpstart their search by looking at my 6/7/10 4:31 PM and 6/7/10 4:57 PM comments.
Just keep in mind the caveat that what garage said is probably no more anti-semitic than something David Duke would say.
Or Pat Buchanan.
Or Cedarford.
The right loves Buchanan because he says what they want to say, but are afraid to say in public. He will survive with all of his twisted, rightie ideas intact.
I don't know anybody, right or left, who thinks much of Buchanan. I'm sure they must be out there, but there can't be very many of them.
It certainly wasn't the Lefties that forced her out.
Actually, there was no shortage of criticism of Thomas from the left. And unless her employer has suddenly been turned from being part of the dreaded liberal media conspiracy into a conservative media outlet because they accepted her "retirement", it sure looks like she got pushed out because of criticism from all sides. And rightfully so.
Just keep in mind the caveat that what garage said is probably no more anti-semitic than something David Duke would say.
David Duke, Pat Buchanan are Republicans. And Cedarford I'm sure. That would put you in Sarah Palin category of stupidness to point out.
"GMay said...
Hey there's Cedarford coming out of nowhere on a thread about those dirty Jooooooo invaders!!
Couldn't see THAT one coming, no sir!"
The Jewish tactic for making friends and influencing people is to call all who criticize any aspect of Jewish dominated institutions, scandals, Israeli state polict as "Anti-Semites!" Supposedly, the WWII memory and the claim of Jews to be the world's Greatest Victims with the World's highest moral authority is supposed to cow any objectors.
Anytime people object to Jews running the US Communist Party or Israel destroys another 10 Palestinian farms to make room for new Russian migrants...just scream Joooo! Jooooo-hater! and people will be intimidated and ashamed as support whatever Jews or Israel want!
Except that Jewish way of making friends hasn't panned out too well. About 63 nations supported Israel 40 years ago. That number has dwindled, even as new nations are added, to 3 allies of "their Special Friend". The USA and two Pacific Islands we pay to support the Special Friend.
Within the USA, on the Right, questioning Israel is like a Chinese Party apparachnik questioning the burden and trouble of backing N Korea as China's "Special Friend no matter what.
It just isn't done in the Party ranks in China. They stand by N Korea, no matter what N Korea does.
The world sees the Chinese and American's "Special Friend" relationships - as quite similar.
N Korea could blow up another ship and the Chinese won't say squat except "they are concerned". Israel could cluster bomb Lebanon again and the US would say that they "are concerned and hope the situation will be resolved".
When's the last time Buchanan was invited to address any Republican gathering or meeting of significance?
Around 1999-2000, or in other words, until he committed partisan political suicide by walking out on the GOP and running as a third party candidate. Pat Buchanan was quite welcome among Republicans (or at least a good portion of them - a lot of people had him figured out long ago, including many Republicans) until then. Such is the nature of hubris - he didn't realize that once he crossed the Party, a lot of people who looked the other way at his cranky and foul views on many topics because they thought they were on the same partisan page would suddenly notice them. Same thing happened to Ralph Nader about the same time.
The idea that Pat Buchanan was marginalized by the Right is false. He marginalized himself, and suddenly a lot of conservatives started citing press clippings once ignored. And don't kid yourself, he still has a following.
David Duke, Pat Buchanan are Republicans. And Cedarford I'm sure. That would put you in Sarah Palin category of stupidness to point out.
David Duke and Pat Buchanan were kicked out of the Republicans, actually, garage.
I'll happily take the designation of being in the "Sarah Palin category of stupidness" for my comments.
Meanwhile, your comments are putting you into the Helen Thomas category of anti-semitism.
Trooper,
Do you know how many evenings you've ruined with that link? In no specific order--
My God that's an awful beaver--flash forward to Helen Thomas--vomit.
Brings new meaning to "burning rubber"--flah forward to Helen Thomas--vomit.
Ride that hot rod--flash forward to Helen Thomas--vomit.
Wouldn't the rumble seat be more comfy dear?--flash forwar to Helen Thomas--vomit.
Are you sure that's not PIAPS?--flash forward to PIAPS--vomit.
wv: "incesse"--flash forward to Helen Thomas--vomit.
HDHouse wrote:
"...with the majority over 65..."
Hey, numbskull, The median age of Fox News viewers is 65. The majority can't be over 65. Otherwise, it wouldn't be a fucking median.
Well garage when you slam Israel for enforcing a blockade on a territory run by a group of Islamofacists who have been raining rockets on Israel since Israel pulled out of there I do have to wonder where your thought process is. I mean if your belief is that supporting Israel's right to self defense is bad for America then why? Is it because our support for them brings irrational Muslim hatred on us? If so then lets not just cut off Israel but cancel every alliance we have. I mean what happens is South Korea decides to go to war over their sunk cruiser? You cool with dat cause we're gonna go too.
And don't kid yourself, he still has a following.
Yes: on MSNBC, where he shares his audience with Maddow, Olberman, Schultz, and Matthews.
Sorry Old Dad.....but at least she was wearing her Spanx.
Hey, numbskull, The median age of Fox News viewers is 65. The majority can't be over 65. Otherwise, it wouldn't be a fucking median.
Which is really funny since shitforbrains(that's hdhouse) called everyone dumbasses who can't do math.
Christ talking about showing your ass.
"Since you are the one making the claim, how bout you provide it for us."
You've already provided it, Garage. I don't need to lift a finger.
Most of the regular readers are familiar with what you've said in previous threads and, interestingly, they seem to be in general agreement with me.
Anyone who wants to see what you said before can go back and read the various recent Israel-oriented threads.
Garage said:
"This thread proves my point better than I ever could. Talk about fascists."
My goodness, Garage is right; this thread proves nothing which has always been his point.
garage's point is that somehow his case of Jew-hatred is justified because at least they deserve it.
Imagine the nerve of those Jews trying to stay alive by fighting back against those that shoot rockets into their nation near daily! I mean, really!
They should put their heads in the oven. garage has all the matches they need.
I'll happily take the designation of being in the "Sarah Palin category of stupidness" for my comments.
Sarah Palin supported and held fundraisers for Pat Buchanan for President in 1996 and 2000, and served as Buchanan's Alaska State Director. Doh!
I would say you're no more stupid than Sarah Palin.
The fact that Israel should have launched against Iran over a year ago for its very survival but didn't because of "How will America react?" gives the lie to the notion that AIPAC "controls" U.S. policy. The other way around more likely.
Trooper,
Spanx? Oy! Was that nice?
Ok now, Sophia Loren in her Maidenform.
That's better, bad thoughts almost gone--arrghh, there's HT in a teddy--my eyes.
Once again you've derailed the thread nicely, garage, from Helen Thomas' despicable Jew-hatred to the ravings of a man who is watched by the fellow travelers of C4.
I don't know why we let this happen.
I mean, it's not like garage doesn't have an agenda to point the finger at the nasty Republicans and their fixation with Israel, the Worst Nation in the World.
I would say you're no more stupid than Sarah Palin.
I'm not going to rehash your litany of anti-Palin calumnies, garage.
But in the spirit of comity, I will say you're no more anti-semitic than Helen Thomas.
(Or David Duke.
Or Pat Buchanan.
Or Cedarford.)
Garage Mahal said: I would say you're no more stupid than Sarah Palin.
Careful Garage, smear tactics aren't your strong suit.
Since this thread began by Helen Thomas telling people to go back where they came, would it be too much to ask the Bamster to please return to Chicago....or Hawaii....or better yet, Kenya.
"But in the spirit of comity, I will say you're no more anti-Semitic than Helen Thomas."
I'd just use the oldfashioned Judenhass for garage. He's too quick to point out that technically the term "Semite" covers a wider population than just Israelis.
What surprises me is that he hasn't simply joined forces directly with C4.
Yes: on MSNBC, where he shares his audience with Maddow, Olberman, Schultz, and Matthews.
I don't think MSNBC-viewing liberals are the ones buying his books or subscribing to his magazine, The American Conservative. And his views on these topics (Israel, race, etc.) didn't suddenly appear in 2000. But, like I said, he may not be as big a GOP player now as he used to be, but that's as much (if not more) because of his walking out on the GOP than it is because he was somehow voted off the island.
Well, at least we agree that Jew-hatred has no place in the Republican party.
I'd like to say the same of the Democrat party, but ...
garage mahal said...
Palin's church can't be any weirder than Obama's, and if she is a Pat Buchanan Republican I feel safer. He is about the only sane Republican I've heard these past 8 years. An truthfully I thought Buchanan's joke about Washington D.C. being "Israeli occupied territory" years ago friggin hilarious, with some truth behind it. But, I'm in the minority of liberals who like Buchanan.
9/3/08 7:20 PM
AC245 --
GAME, SET, and MATCH.
"Palladian said...
Does anyone else think that Vicki and HDHouse would make an adorable couple?"
Oh they have already been there and
done that!
(And by that I mean the nasty)
Note that the comment is on the first page of comments. I don't know about you, but the link from Blogger took me the last page of 700+ comments.
"But, I'm in the minority of liberals who like Buchanan." - garage mahal
Delicious.
I'd like to say the same of the Democrat party, but ...
You can say the same of the Democratic Party. Unless you think that the majority of Jewish voters in the United States (who still vote overwhelmingly Democratic, and interestingly enough, when they vote Republican tend not to side with the Palin/social conservative wing of the Party) are somehow stupid or supportive of anti-Semitism. And if you do say that, well...
somefeller, you miss my point. Are you a liberal?
My point is that the Republican party was quick to disavow Helen Thomas AND HER VIEWS.
Where were the Democrats on this? Hemming and hawing.
Nice try to change the point.
Remember, it is one of yours who said "I'm in the minority of liberals who like Buchanan."
You're right, miller. I pasted the timestamp link directly from garage's comment, but it doesn't seem to link back correctly to the multi-page comment thread.
As you point out, his 9/3/08 7:20 PM comment is about midway down the first page.
garage must be ruing the day his mom connected the Internet down in the basement for him.
He is about the only sane Republican I've heard these past 8 years.
This isn't much of a surprise. Buchanan was hardly a supporter of the Iraq war and by extension, Dubya. Therefore he was perfectly acceptable to garage. Like garage, Pat feels our relationship to Israel is a liability and not in our interests. Debatable but therein lies the nature of alliances. If we want to have alliances that won't actually require any kind of exposure on our part, I say stick with Luxembourg and maybe Micronesia.
And he seems to have suddenly...disappeared.
I didn't think it was possible for him to get embarrassed.
Holy shit, AC245! Nice find.
Garage has been begging me for evidence of his antisemitism, so I will quote it again!
"Palin's church can't be any weirder than Obama's, and if she is a Pat Buchanan Republican I feel safer. He is about the only sane Republican I've heard these past 8 years. An truthfully I thought Buchanan's joke about Washington D.C. being 'Israeli occupied territory' years ago friggin hilarious, with some truth behind it. But, I'm in the minority of liberals who like Buchanan."
Garage thinks neo-Nazi ZOG smears are hilarious and truthful?
Shit.
Like garage, Pat feels our relationship to Israel is a liability and not in our interests. Debatable but therein lies the nature of alliances.
Debatable? Anywhere but this country. There is more debate inside Israel.
It's a shame about those flea's man. I tried to tell you but you wouldn't listen.
Where were the Democrats on this? Hemming and hawing.
There was no shortage of Democratic media people critical of Thomas. And not many politicians on either side weighed in, given that the story moved pretty quickly to resolution and was mostly a story for media people and media junkies. And as I said, her employer certainly didn't waste any time accepting (forcing?) her retirement. But if you want to keep riding this hobbyhorse, go right ahead.
Debatable? Anywhere but this country.
Garage, the only argument I ever heard on the issue is that our support of Israel brings the jihad wrath of Muslims down on us. Ok fine then that argument lends itself to the policy that we should only ally ourselves with countries that don't have enemies.
Outside of Israel, there isn't a country in the region that is remotely democratic and shares Western political and social values.
Now if that isn't your position then please, share with the rest of the class why we should not back Israel.
Garage and Cedarford, taking down the Zog Machine two by two by two...
And the white man marches on!
@idiots
I said the most efficient demographic was 65+. It also might be the majority of viewers as the numbers are generally taken off HH and the demographic break outs are derived from that...that is if you had any idea what in the world you are talking about...which obviously you don't.
I'll hold media 101 for you kids when you want but it will cost you and with your incoming level of stupidity it will take any number of sessions before you can count, add, and reason.
Calumny and comity sat down to a cup of tea --
Comity settled for the watercress sandwich
Cause calumny hogged all the brie.
And yes, my wv is HATERS!...but without the !
Holy, er Moses (so to speak). Garage is going full-metal jacket on us.
This ain't going to end well.
Mazel tov.
@idiots
Why don't you ring the nurse to change your diaper already? You're sounding more shrill as the night goes on and you're keeping up poor Mrs. McGillicuddy in room 12 whose been trying to get to sleep.
Now if that isn't your position then please, share with the rest of the class why we should not back Israel.
*facepalm*
Never said we shouldn't support Israel. The American government politely asked Israel to freeze building any more settlements. What did Israel do? tell us to fuck off. In turn they told you to fuck off, and for that they get your full 100% support no matter what they decide to do. I want Israel to get their shit together and play ball with our interests and stop doing the stupid and counterproductive things they have been doing.
Cedarford (Provided you haven't ducked out of yet another thread prematurely),
I didn't call you an anti-semite, I'm just making fun of you. I don't think you're an anti-semite, I think you're anti-fact and that you belong back over at CODOH with the rest of your ilk.
A few marginally kind words about Helen Thomas. She's 89 years old. Her statement was stunning in its stupdity Has anyone considered the possibility that she's lost a few marbles?....I can explain the mystery of Pat Buchanan on MSNBC. He was militantly and, some would say, rancidly against the Iraq war. Anyone against that war is not all bad in the MSNBC playbook.
I don't think MSNBC-viewing liberals are the ones buying his books or subscribing to his magazine, The American Conservative.
Pat Buchanan's last book is ranked #40,025 on Amazon, and "The American Conservative" has a circulation of 15,000. At this point there are college newspaper editorialists with more readers than Buchanan has. Buchanan's remaining fanbase consists of the lingering pre-WW2 paleoconservatives, various Holocaust deniers, and leftists looking for a "principled conservative" who agrees with them on the war and Israel.
In any case, the simple fact that none of the conservatives here are willing to claim Buchanan as one of their own serves to refute any claim that we're unwilling to criticize or condemn him. :)
The American government politely asked Israel to freeze building any more settlements. What did Israel do? tell us to fuck off. In turn they told you to fuck off, and for that they get your full 100% support no matter what they decide to do.
You know I thought I had hemmerhoids and its turns out it was you up my ass. Had to be since you know so much of what I believe.
Not sure where I ever stated 100% support of Israel. All I ever stated was that I support thier right of self defense. Now if you want to talk settlements then lets do that. But this conversation stems from the enforcement of a blockade, which you don't support. You obviously don't support settlements either. I won't even ask what you thought of the wall, you know the one that reduced Israeli suicide bomb victims to nil.
Speaking of getting thier shit together, how about your beloved Palestinians garage? I mean your boy Bill and Peres bent over backward in the 1990s getting the peace process going, gave the Palestinians 95% of their territory back at which Arafat told them both to how did you say...oh yeah, fuck off and spent the next 2 years blowing up Israelis.
I want Israel to get their shit together and play ball with our interests and stop doing the stupid and counterproductive things they have been doing.
And that right fucking there says it all. Hey, how about the Palestinians stop raining rockets down on Israel or kidnapping Israeli soldiers? Or doesn't that count as unproductive?
yeah garage, fucking-A facepalm.
HDHouse,
Actually, to be completely fair, going back and rereading what you wrote, you did in fact say that the majority of viewers outside of the 25-54 demographic were older than 65.
And you're almost certainly correct there.
Nonetheless, FOX News Channel smacks MSNBC around like a redheaded stepchild within the 25-54 demographic.
So all that you're really saying is that, in addition to dominating MSNBC in this key demographic, FNC also attracts a lot of older viewers.
Obama is controlled by two big Jews!
Disavow him, liberals!
His lily-white ass is Israeli-occupied territory!
"The American government politely asked Israel to freeze building any more settlements. What did Israel do? tell us to fuck off."
You support Arrogant American Imperialism!!!
And you love when other countries tell America to "fuck off". That is, unless those other countries are shitty little countries run by Jews!
verification word: sweedum
But this conversation stems from the enforcement of a blockade, which you don't support. You obviously don't support settlements either. I won't even ask what you thought of the wall, you know the one that reduced Israeli suicide bomb victims to nil.
First of all if the wall has reduced bombing victims to nil why the need for the blockade? How does the blockade help American interests in any way? I don't know any credible analysts that think the blockade was effective, or deterred Hamas in any way. On the contrary. That's the stupid counterproductive shit I was talking about. Second the blockading an entire country is illegal under international law. For it it to be legal Israel must be at war. With who? Gaza? if their claim is they are at war with Gaza then Gaza has every right to fire rockets into Israel. Sorry, but those are facts. I hold Israel to a little higher standard than fucking Hamas, aren't they supposed to be the shining beacon in the ME for the world to follow?
Hey, where'd everybody go?! C'mon, keep having your pointless tu quoque argument about whose "side" has the crazier fuck-wad! That was so fun and productive!
And it was nice to see garage, sent out on a mission to get a new box of Depends for HDHouse, wandered so far into the craggy midnight forest of the darkest reaches of the left that he discovered Cedarford and Pat Buchanan there, mining coal to stoke their ovens.
Political philosophy! It's a circle, not a line, people!
What do you want to bet that Olbermann and Buchanan give each other handjobs in the MSNBC private lavatory?
Talk about reaching across the aisle!
And in summary, The Helengoyle has been safely cemented onto her perch for eternity, circumnavigate the political sphincter and you're going to encounter different sorts of hemorrhoids along the way, and speaking of hemorrhoids, Cedarford still hates the Jews, garage mahal is Nazi-curious and HDHouse needs his diaper changed.
Goodnight and may YHWH bless!
Oh, and Allah too. Can't forget about him.
Now shut the fuck up already!
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