१७ ऑक्टोबर, २००५
"It's going to be tough, because I'm used to keeping it at 78."
Suffering with the thermostat at 65. Staying warm in the winter is imperative, and facing increased heating bills is hard, but why are people drastically overheating their houses in the first place? Would the prices be going up the way they are if we weren't overconsuming? I'll bet when the temperature outside is 78, this woman turns on the air conditioning! Now, she's piling on sweaters and extra blankets to deal with an indoor temperature of 65. You should have turned the thermostat down to 65 long before the prices went up. You would be healthier and sturdier now if you hadn't been slow-roasting yourself all these years. You'd be even better off at 62 degrees, especially while sleeping. Putting the thermostat above 70 is like driving a big gas guzzler car, except that other people don't see your overconsumption -- unless you take up whining to the press about how much you miss creating T-shirt weather indoors year round.
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No offense, but I've never seen the wisdom living where lack of heating could kill for months at a time. But people really might want to have some perspective and realize wearing sweaters indoors shouldn't be considered too big of a problem.
I recall at UCR they had specific guidelines as to how cool and how hot each occupied classroom could be (no lower than 65 no hotter than 78, IIRC) and given the desert location both extremes were tested frequently, I assume similar rules apply at UW at Madison (will the increase in energy costs lead to the bending of the rules to say a brisk 60 degree minimum?)
Plus la change, apparently. Here in Texas, walking into a movie theater during the summertime can cause injury or death as you move from 105 blazing degrees in the parking lot to 62 bone-chilling degrees in the theater lobby. During winter, indoor temps in Texas' public buildings are normally pretty comfortable although if the outdoor temperature rises above 60 you can bet money that air conditioners across the state are going to be turned on.
Did you notice, Ann, that most of the people quoted in that story are elderly?
It's kind of their job to keep the temp hot and stuffy, drive big cars and then complain about the cost of everything.
I can't wait to grow old.
While I am fond of a/c, I dislike heat unless it is truly cold outside--like in the low 30s. I'd rather put on sweats and get a hot cup of coffee than turn the blinkin' heat on.
Now, I do like a nice fire in the fireplace.
I always tell people that my wife keeps the thermostat solidly set on 600 bucks a month. Hot in the winter, cold in the summer. It's a year-round spendfest.
It's amazing to me that people keep the a/c in the summertime on temperatures that they wouldn't accept in the wintertime. In the summer they keep the a/c on at 60-65 and in the winter the heat must be at 70-75. For myself and I my family, we have the a/c on at 76 and the heat is at 67 (65 overnight).
I've always felt it was kind of dumb to wear a sweater indoors in the summer. My favorite is when I can turn off both the heat and the a/c and just open the windows...
Kimsch: It seems people are just out of touch with nature. They don't even keep track of what the temperature is outside. They'll leave the AC on because it WAS hot before, but don't notice when it's cooled off. I'm always checking and ready to turn it off an open the windows. I dislike the noise and the artificiality. I prefer real air, especially when I'm sleeping. I feel the same way about the heat. I turn it very low at night because I don't want to hear the blowing and feel the processed air. Actually, I'm as cranky and fussy about this as the lady in the article is about her 78 degrees. But at least I'm saving energy with my crankiness.
Michael: Try gradually lowering the temperature. I keep my thermostat at 62 or even 60 in midwinter, but early in the season I might put it as high as 68, at least during waking hours. The key is to acclimate yourself. It's good for you!
GS: You mean it's sad that an old person has to wear a sweater in the winter? And maybe the rise in gas prices will mean that old people will need to replace their SUVs with fuel efficient cars. Horrors!
78?! I would feel nauseous indoors at 78.
Michael: I think it makes you hardier and that it is also good for your respiratory tract. The latter point I base on personal experience: I've had one cold in the last 10 years. Not a scientific study, but try it yourself. Put the thermostat very low, especially at night, and see if you don't feel a lot better .
Michael: I think it makes you hardier and that it is also good for your respiratory tract. The latter point I base on personal experience: I've had one cold in the last 10 years. Not a scientific study, but try it yourself. Put the thermostat very low, especially at night, and see if you don't feel a lot better .
GS: I don't see why overconsumption by older people should be considered special. I would expect older people to have attained some wisdom and perspective about waste and limits. They are not children.
Ann, you're a woman after my own heart!
It does save both energy and money to keep the temperatures of the a/c higher and the heat lower. I'm a couple hour's drive southeast of you so we're in the same climate zone. I have a blanket on the couch for tv watching and wear a sweater. We recently had an offer from an affiliate of the gas company to spread all our payments out over a year and "save money". Turns out they were going to charge us 132% more than we paid all of last year. My costs were lower last year because I held the temperatures down in the winter. Even though the gas prices are supposed to rise this year, I don't think they'll be rising 132%! I can lower the temp another degree or two and still save.
Now that I'm older I've become totally skeptical of people who tell me situations that they would like to see prevail are "good for me" without anything but anecdotal proof. What if it turned out that it was healthier to keep one's tootsies from freezing in the winter? Would the same people be in favor of keeping the thermostat at 55 in order to get rid of all the inconveniently healthy oldsters?
Robert: You've heard of socks? Slippers? Comfortors and blankets? You don't need to burn fuel and warm all the air in the house to warm your toes. That's incredibly wasteful. And I bet you get more colds than I do.
Watching my parents grow increasingly frail the past couple of years I have learned that older people often do not have a strong enough circulatory system to keep warm and feel the cold more. So they turn up the thermostat. I would be miserably hot when visiting while they added a blanket.
Our daughter's cross country coach told us one season that the body can acclimate to heat but not to cold.
A favorite exercise physiology instructor of mine was fond of exhorting, "We are each an experiment of one - discover your own optimum." What works for me may not work for you and vice versa. Not every body has the same capacity for homeostasis.
Anecdotally, I agree with AA to a large... degree. My family and I feel more rested after sleeping in cooler more humid air. Taken to an extreme, that would mean sleeping in a cold rain. No.
There are many peer-reviewed studies that suggest improved health results come from challenging physiological systems and allowing them to adapt - respiratory and circulatory, digestive, musculoskeletal, nervous, and even immune systems - all lose vitality and balance if not put to work and then allowed to rest.
As with most things, moderation is key.
Diane: I'm willing to believe there are some very elderly people who need extra heat. But the people quoted in the NYT were not in this category. And 78 is way hotter than anyone needs (unless something is terribly wrong with them, like that old guy in the greenhouse in "The Big Sleep").
Diane: Healthy human bodies adapt to both heat and cold but there are limits at either end.
I certainly agree with the basic philosophy you're espousing, Ann. And living in an large, old (by midwestern, if not eastern, standards) house, circa 1855, replete with many, many large, non-standard size windows and heated by a 1915 boiler, we implement it, too. Our heat doesn't go on until Halloween week, at a minimum, and every year (except for the one in which my son was an infant) we run a "contest" to see how long we can wait to flip the switch. The thermostat is set all winter so that the heat only kicks on if the temperature drops below 58 degrees; we have throws everywhere; and we dress in layers. Out East, we conserved based on philosphy and stewardship; now we do it based on economics (who would want an energy bill the size of which otherwise would be exceeded only by the mortgage, after all?).
All that said, I feel that the criticism of old people is perhaps a little unfair, given that I'm thinking there are some factors not being considered.
First, I think there's a bigger difference in the older body's ability to regulate temperature, among other things, than is being given credence here. This is also exacerbated by a different level of activity, which is perhaps not being enough taken into account.
But the major thing I want to point out is that it's not just about feeling warm--it's also about joints , mobility, and other related issues. It is one thing for me to bundle up and still be able to move around effectively (if not as freely). It's another for someone who is elderly. If you suffer from significant issues of arthritis etc., your mobility is very much affected by temperature. If you "bundle up," you may address that issue (although not for hands, a not-insignificant point), but you may also be significantly restricting mobility and comfort in other ways.
Ever been skiing? Or outside when you've worn layers plus a snowsuit? For the average person, free movement is significantly less under those circumstances. It might be fine for recreation, but not for working around the house. (Personally, even in just a North Face parka, I hate driving because I don't like the feel of restricted motion.)
I have an elderly friend, who used to ski a lot 20 years ago, tell me that multiple layers of clothing in winter gave her the same feeling--except that far from being voluntary and time-limited, she felt like that all winter, especially when trying to do basic things, like cooking, cleaning, climbing stairs and so on.
I'm just suggesting that THIS issue may help account for the difference between needing, say, 70-72 degrees and 78 degrees--or, "T-shirt weather." It's easier to move around in a t-shirt--or fewer layers--after all.
I, and I think my family, am a warm weather weanie. 60 or so in the winter is fine, but 80 in the summer is hard to sleep in.
My father in his eighties does just fine in the mountains in the winter. But, then again, he just got a new pair of skiis, and thus is committed to ski at least one more season.
Sorry to hear about how this will be inconvenient for you. Real shame that after 9/11, when everything changed, Oilmen Cheney and Bush and Rice didn't set the country off in a new direction.
What does it take to get through the head of a conservative blogging law prof?
Quxxo: Did you READ the post? Do you understand quotation marks?
Kathy: I almost never put on the air conditioner. Usually, it has to get into the high 80s before I even consider it. And only half of my house even has air conditioning! I live in a house assessed at over half a million dollars but it does not have central air.
It's pretty clear quxxo is at least borderline mentally disturbed. Ann writes "tomato", quoxxo responds "BUSHITLER!"...
I've got the problem in my office that the AC will come on if I try to set it low so the heat won't come on. Setting it at 68 today to keep out the heat caused the damned AC to come on. I stood on a chair to reach the switch to turn off the AC, even though I know from experience that if I leave the AC off too long, eventually it will drip rusty water on everything. Ideally, you should be able to set a middle range where you reject the unnatural effects and you can measure your virtue by the number of degrees separating your heat on and air on numbers. For example, a 30 degree range would be impressive. A 10 degree range should be considered the minimum acceptable. I have about a 20 degree range. How about you?
I'm with you Ann. Turning the heat on is a last resort during the winters (which aren't too bad where I am...40s at the very coldest).
We don't have AC in the house, but I don't even like it on in the car. I've been driving again after many years of not driving and I've noticed on warm/hot days, I'm frequently the only person on the road w/ the windows rolled down.
Seems like one of life's basic pleasures to me! I'm nonplused that others don't enjoy it too. It seems like people either have the top down, or they're all closed up w/ the AC on. Yuck!
I like the windows down so much that sometimes on cold days, I'll roll 'em down and turn the heat on low.
I have a wide range...I'm happy in normal clothes into the low 60s... colder than that and I put on socks and a sweater. If that doesn't work, the heat goes on.
I like the windows open whenever possible. So they're usually open at 70 on up. That's like April to late October here (San Francisco).
It never gets much over 100 where and only over 90 a few weeks total. I don't mind those temps at all. I just drink more.
I went to grad school in Atlanta where I lived in a slum apartment. I left the AC on (a swamp cooler) at home 24/7 and never went more than a few feet away from it for any longer than absolutely necessary.
I don't think my furnace has a pilot light. I know it does have a motherboard tho... a contractor crossed a wire and surged the house and blew the furnace's motherboard. $400.
I wondered, "Maybe it has a webpage too. Does it blog?"
Chuck and Lindsey: LOL. But ... ya know ... ya gotta wonder ... maybe someday ...
Oregano: I've had that exact same experience with friends experienced in other climes--and not always just from other countries.
Range:
Heat (central): 58 degrees.
Cooling: Harder about which to be specific and concise, since there is no central air in this old, approx. 3,000+-sq-foot home (or more, depending on how you count hallways, nooks, etc. etc. etc.--you in old homes know of what I speak, since mostly they "don't count" in terms of realtors, but do in terms of maintenance, heat, and taxes).
After five years of no air, we started to put in window units. Six years later, we have two downstairs and three upstairs.
Downstairs: One is at 68--because it's the largest and does the most work; if the room in which it is in is not "too cool," the rest of its area is way too hot. The other is at 74 (would be set higher, but its area includes the kitchen, already warmer because of the amount of "scratch" cooking and baking that goes on year 'round).
Upstairs: One is on during the summer only on a very part-time basis (meaning, not daily) and is set at 78 degrees. A second is on continuously during the hot months and is set on 75 during the hottest few hours of the middle of the day and 85 degrees the rest of the time. The third is also on continuously during the hotter months, and it is set at a steady 72 degrees.
Since you asked, Ann ...
annsfusebox - won't work if your hot water and cooking are also gas...
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