From "Older Adults Are No Longer Staying in ‘Empty Shell’ Marriages/Rates of gray divorce have risen sharply over the past few decades — and experts have a few theories as to why" (NYT). That's a gift link because there are so many interesting comments over there.
1. When her husband forgot her birthday, the wife remembered that she had forgotten that she was a person.
2. Do you get much anonymity by limiting the NYT to using only your first name when your first name is as unusual as Ruchi? (I did look it up, and I can see that in India, it is a very common name.)
3. From the anecdotes in the article, I get the impression that when these long-term marriages dissolve, the man finds another woman (to take care of him?) and the woman embraces independence.
4. From the comments over there: "This article contains the second reference I’ve seen recently to menopause as the cause of women becoming intolerant. I feel like that’s a slippery slope. I offer for consideration the fact that many, many women in our society are expected to carry loads that are unreasonable. I think that might contribute to 'intolerance' more than any hormonal shifts. And I believe such intolerance is valid."
పోస్ట్లు
60 కామెంట్లు:
“I am woman hear me roar
As I go about settling scores…”
“better than nothing is a high standard”
Expert, texpert fucking jokers
Don’t you think yer flippin’
Out of gas?
For stories like this, the comment sections should require the commenter to include their sex, M or F.
"I offer for consideration the fact that many, many women in our society are expected to carry loads that are unreasonable."
What's reasonable is a matter of opinion. I offer for consideration the fact that many, many men in our society are expected to carry loads that women think are reasonable.
Related to Aggie; I suspect most of the commenters are also divorcees seeking confirmation they made the right choice.
What Mason G said. For every woman "expected to carry loads that are unreasonable" there is a man doing the same. The difference is that the man will briefly complain about it to one of his drinking buddies and then get back to the game whereas the woman will complain about it in the NYT
“And now the heart is filled with gold
As if it was a purse
But oh, what kind of love is this
Which goes from bad to worse”
The Irish say that contention is better than loneliness I suppose it depends on the type of contention, but this sounds more negligent than abusive. There are worse fates than being married to a negligent husband as she will perhaps discover.
Those of you who follow James Lileks have an inkling how devastating a late-life divorce after a long marriage can be. Granted that we have only his side of the story, it seems like a real betrayal, the worst kind of hurt. (Aggie, I'm a man, early 70s. Often enjoy your comments here and and AVI, Grim's.)
Late life crisis.
Maybe he didn’t forget.
I was married 25 years when my wife left for another woman and filed for divorce. I contacted spell caster Dr. Kachi, a professor of sociology at the online University of Middle Outer Illinois. He cast a love spell. In 3 days my ex returned, apologized, and begged to reconcile. And then I thought about it and realized I was better off without her.
Shorter NYT: Institution of marriage collapses; women hardest hit.
Hey, boys and girls, love together, work together, age together. Life is neither so short nor narrow.
It's time for a remake of the Rogers/Astaire flick "The Gay Divorcée." Two remakes: Gray and Gay [but in a different sense of the word].
".. menopause as the cause of women becoming intolerant..."
hmmm?
is that why So Many ICE protesters are 60+ year old women?
also, what does it say about the Large number of trans mass murderers?
does messing with your hormones make you crazy?
which is the cart? and which is the horse?
"I am more than my kids and my husband. I think I kind of forgot that."
Beware the woman who concludes "I don't love myself enough."
Maybe "Ruchi" was in an arranged marriage, or something close to it? She's been Westernized.
A little while ago I read some comment, can't remember where, that observed that marriage is not a 50-50% even-handed split of effort, it's a commitment of 100% from both sides. That has stuck with me as a very apt characterization. You have to give, and be willing to continue, to be worthy. And if your partner in life betrays that commitment, as much as it hurts, you're better off if you've honored your commitment. I suspect this story about grey divorce trends is not so trendy as they say.
"I offer for consideration the fact that many, many women in our society are expected to carry loads that are unreasonable."
How much of that load is created by the expectations of the woman herself? A load no man, including her husband, expects of her.
Shorter woman: I do so many things around here that you don't care about and therefore don't acknowledge and reciprocate.
And how much of that load goes away after the divorce? Or is the load somehow more reasonable when there is no one else in her life to place her frustrations?
".. menopause as the cause of women becoming intolerant..."
Scientifically, since the intolerance is new this would infer that the menopause was also recently discovered.
Perhaps the Boomers got SUPERmenopause? Maybe they're just less able to tolerate it than their predecessors?
Or is it the childless women who are most affected -- as they suffered all of this hormonal manipulation without the benefit of creating children? Pain and suffering for nothing?
The other thing that happens around menopause is that the kids leave home. Once the children are gone, the cracks in the marriage that were hidden or ignored so easily by the distractions of raising kids are very visible. My husband and I went through this about 6 years ago, but we decided to work on our marriage instead of separating or continuing to live miserably with each other. I'm glad we did. It has been very hard, and required a lot of self examination and change on both our parts, but our marriage is stronger now than it was at the beginning.
Maybe these women have read too many "second chance at love" books which are a very common plot device for books written for women.
Half-way through the Covid lockdown, I and the people I worked with remotely, were going stir-crazy and a little nuts. In a mutual support conversation, we all decided that now was a bad time to make life-changing decisions like getting divorced, changing careers or deciding to relocate. Ride it out, and decide later.
I don't know what menopause is like, but that advice might apply.
We don't know Ruchi's situation, but having less money and a complicated family dynamic with teenage children, sounds much more irritating.
Parents often live for their kids, and forget who they are as a person. People married for many decades, forget how to be whole person. Figuring out that without blowing up the family seems like a more prudent move.
I have to assume that forgetting her birthday was a last straw, or at least a catalyst that highlighted a history of other problems, other ways she was being overlooked.
What a drag it is, getting old.
I will never believe a post from Meade again.
"The Grass is Always Greener Over the Septic Tank." - Erma Bombeck
Over 2000 comments at the NYT.
My favorite:
“We were going to divorce years ago but neither of us wanted custody of the kids.”
This one was sweet:
“I think there's probably a bit of self-reassuring posturing in these comments. Divorce is not fun, regardless of who initiates it. Dating after 50 is no picnic. Men are not villains. Women are not grumpy menopausal beasts. We're all just humans trying to navigate the time we have left as best we can. Everyone could probably use a hug.”
"I offer for consideration the fact that many, many women in our society are expected to carry loads that are unreasonable. I think that might contribute to 'intolerance' more than any hormonal shifts. And I believe such intolerance is valid."
The problem is not unreasonable loads. That's life. Institutional misandry validates the commenter's intolerance.
Professor's theme this morning seems to be "angry women of the NYT"...
The woman in this article sounds like a real peach. Woe is me, life is hard.
I'm sure she goes out of her way to make her husband feel calm and safe and loved when he comes home... NOT
Marriages take commitments on both sides, and giving more when the other side is giving less, and not keeping score, and communication and forgiveness and empathy and a host of other things I don't hear from the subject of this article.
Jersey Fled said...
I will never believe a post from Meade again.
😂 Always trust Jersey Fled.
NYT continues the left’s most important conquest, not education, news media, Hollywood, etc., but the institution of marriage. It is the glue that hold a society together.
"My family is very, very, very important to me." I think she meant
"My family is very, very, very, VERY important to me."
One "very" is enough, and two are often a bit excessive. The only people I have heard use three "very's" have been Cluster B personality disorders.
My ex and I divorced after a 30 year relationship. I was in my mid-50’s and learning how to date again.
17 years later, I am happier than I have ever been. I married a woman who divorced after a 25 year marriage.
Sometimes you need to cut your losses and start over again.
Sad how tough NYT's reading women have it. Every phase of their lives is a struggle. They're either lonely or being controlled by some man. Men, what are they good for? Heartaches by the number, troubles by the score.
I'm glad that large numbers have found happiness in being by themselves. Without men. Happiness is other chicks.
"menopause as the cause of women becoming intolerant." I will tell you that menopause came along and made my wife turn hard left, politically. She used to be a reliable center right voter. Now, there's a picture of her when you look up TDS.
James Lileks' divorce has me depressed. If a great writer like him can get cashiered after 38 years and kicked out of his house, then what chance do us poor slobs have...?
"4. From the comments over there: "This article contains the second reference I’ve seen recently to menopause as the cause of women becoming intolerant. I feel like that’s a slippery slope. I offer for consideration the fact that many, many women in our society are expected to carry loads that are unreasonable. I think that might contribute to 'intolerance' more than any hormonal shifts. And I believe such intolerance is valid."
Yeah. Imagine how unreasonable a man would have to be to forget this woman's birthday.
If you read enough of the comments, you saw quite a few people commenting multiple times. That gave the reader a chance to notice the frequent presence, or eruption, in their vocabulary of words including: patriarchy; MAGA; more-sensible and -sensitive blue states; capitalism (bad); and others of the same ilk.
There was an amazing anecdote told by one unhappy woman of asking her husband if he wanted just a good, OR better yet, a GREAT marriage. She was astounded when he did not take the bait, and answered, "Good."
Unhappy, probably often loveless people. Sad group.
Yet, to go on the other hand -- long lives of relative healthfulness together can surely wear out a lot of one's patience. I'm sure my wife and I are probably both sick of certain attributes the other one carries. Should we jettison everything because of occasional exasperation? We are all blind to many, if not most, of our faults.
Women who think that they are more important than their children would do well to figure this out sooner rather than later. My wife did.
"There was an amazing anecdote told by one unhappy woman of asking her husband if he wanted just a good, OR better yet, a GREAT marriage. She was astounded when he did not take the bait, and answered, "Good.""
The Husband Store & The Wife Store
The Husband Store
A store that sells new husbands has opened in New York City, where a woman may go to choose a husband. Among the instructions at the entrance is a description of how the store operates:
You may visit this store ONLY ONCE! There are six floors and the value of the products increase as the shopper ascends the flights. The shopper may choose any item from a particular floor, or may choose to go up to the next floor, but cannot go back down except to exit the building!
So, a woman goes to the Husband Store to find a husband. On the first floor the sign on the door reads:
Floor 1 - These men Have Jobs.
She is intrigued, but continues to the second floor, where the sign reads:
Floor 2 - These men Have Jobs and Love Kids.
"That's nice," she thinks, "but I want more."
So she continues upward. The third floor sign reads:
Floor 3 - These men Have Jobs, Love Kids, and are Extremely Good Looking.
"Wow," she thinks, but feels compelled to keep going.
She goes to the fourth floor and the sign reads:
Floor 4 - These men Have Jobs, Love Kids, are Drop-dead Good Looking and Help With Housework.
"Oh, mercy me!" she exclaims, "I can hardly stand it!"
Still, she goes to the fifth floor and the sign reads:
Floor 5 - These men Have Jobs, Love Kids, are Drop- dead Gorgeous, Help with Housework, and Have a Strong Romantic Streak.
She is so tempted to stay, but she goes to the sixth floor, where the sign reads:
Floor 6 - You are visitor 31,456,012 to this floor. There are no men on this floor. This floor exists solely as proof that women are impossible to please. Thank you for shopping at the Husband Store.
PLEASE NOTE:
To avoid gender bias charges, the store's owner opened a New Wives store just across the street.
The first floor has wives that love sex.
The second floor has wives that love sex and have money and like beer.
The third, fourth, fifth and sixth floors have never been visited.
Kevin nailed it. So much of the “burden” women carry comes from their own expectations.
Ehh, my husband's grandmother walked out when she went through menopause too. She went on estrogen and became normal again. She's still on estrogen in her 90's. I think estrogen is preferable to divorce but I'm not a NYT reader.
"How much of that load is created by the expectations of the woman herself?"
Summary of a tv interview of a husband & wife regarding housework:
Her: "He doesn't help with chores around the house."
Him: "I used to but she was unhappy because I did them wrong and she re-did them. I don't see the point of doing something she's just going to do all over again."
"I used to but she was unhappy because I did them wrong and she re-did them."
My wife knows I'm going to do them wrong and doesn't want me to try. I'm ok with that. (I do plenty; we just stick to our own spheres of influence. I wouldn't want her pruning the trees.)
"My wife knows I'm going to do them wrong and doesn't want me to try. I'm ok with that."
I have friends who have divided up the chores based on the person who's most concerned about how they're done being the one to do them. Seems to work for them.
Those of you who follow James Lileks have an inkling how devastating a late-life divorce after a long marriage can be. Granted that we have only his side of the story, it seems like a real betrayal, the worst kind of hurt.
When she sent him a f*cking letter - while he was in England, no less - she lost all benefit of the doubt.
Don’t pray for an easy life. Pray for the strength to endure a hard life.
Hell's bells. Shit. I absolutely do not want to read the details of Lileks' situation. Anyone know how Gnat is taking it?
Sydney @11:05am is spot on. Well said.
My wife and I’ve been married for 50 years as of last January. I can’t imagine life without her, and I don’t want to.
Anyone know how Gnat is taking it?
She's barely been mentioned throughout the whole ordeal (the last eight months). It's really been a shitshow. Especially when prepping the house for sale.
Sara dropped the bomb on him and they spent the next six months living together in prep for sale and divorce.
Me? I would've changed the locks on the house, and thrown her ass on a bus for Arizona the day I got back from England.
Mason, LOL. You sound a little too much like an expert!
If so, it's not from personal experience- just listening to others talk about theirs.
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