Writes Tressie McMillan Cottom, in "This Could Be the Winning Issue for Democrats" (NYT).
The suggested winning issue is opposition to data centers: "Americans hate data centers. They really, really hate them.... Data centers evoke strong emotions because they are tangible. Voters can hear them, smell them and see them.... [W]hen political problems become local, people can be persuaded to look beyond their party affiliation or even their own social class to help one another...."
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203 comments:
1 – 200 of 203 Newer› Newest»…this could be ‘the’ winning issue? That sounds like your own team admitting you have no winning issues…
…and here’s the thing about that- you lost black people because your policies suck and blacks are tired if Democrats insulting their intelligence and pay lip service to their issues.
Did you ask these black people what they thought the winning issue for Democrats is? No. No you didn’t…
…and with the assumption redistricting unconstitutional districts ‘dilutes black power’ gives the game way while simultaneously insulting blacks with the assumption they’re Democrat voters.
There’s so much shit thinking in just these couple of paragraphs…
Tressie afraid the GOP might free blacks from the Democrat plantation, and she wants them stopped. In order to not seem overtly racist, she recommends a faint attack against data centers, because reasons.
The winning issue for Democrats: admitting to yourselves we are terrible people with terrible, unpopular policies…
The Democrat party has failed middle and lower income people and that includes Blacks. The Dems, to this day, take the Black vote for granted.
Opposition to data centers, IMO, is idiotic. I'm Nebraska's leading opponent to wind and solar energy, but I strongly favor data centers.
Doesn't Tressie Cottom know that the builders and owners of these data centers are leftist companies like Google and Meta? They have big data centers in NE and IA.
Opposing data centers is a total reach.
And I have to give our Governor, OPPD and NPPD some credit. Nebraska passed a bill allowing data centers to build their own power plants and OPPD and NPPD won't use eminent domain to take them over. The smart thing here is that ratepayers can't complain that the data centers aren't paying their fair share.
I haven't managed to get upset about data centers. Am I hopelessly out of touch?
And could we at least get the longstanding and idiotic nuclear power plant prohibition eliminated before we let the same ding dongs foment the same foolishness with data centers?
Data centers? I don't know many Republicans who are gaga over data centers either.
The left has built a crazed meth-like drug addiction.
Vote for them because if you don't the world will end.
A big - and fake - issue here in Omaha is that one of its biggest power plants burns coal and it is near the historically Black section of Omaha. The claim - which is unsupported by the evidence - is that this coal-fired power plant is killing Blacks. These people don't realize that if that was really true, PI lawyers would be nailing OPPD with wrongful death lawsuits on a regular basis.
OPPD has a bigger coal-fired power plant in Nebraska City, Otoe County; 95% white. According to tollfromcoal.org, this power station is "killing" more people than the North Omaha plant. The OPPD Board, however, doesn't care about the people in Otoe County.
The most shameful thing about this incident is that a Creighton *theology* professor interjected himself into it as an activist. Idiot.
Lol, their populist message is that they want revenge against society because they blame society for all their troubles. Maybe these political arsonists should tackle small things like refilling reservoirs before freaking about big data.
the left
s messaging is based around calling everyone fascist. calling everything and everyone a "existential threat"
Opposition to data centers appeals to morons, so it is a good issue for Democrats.
California is showing that the democrats don't need voters at all. Not real ones that need to be persuaded. They just need names on a voter roll.
The thing about data centers, to me, is that they expect to be powered by a grid that the lefties are destabilizing. They need to provide their own power, IMO.
In the real world, data centers are one of those things that everyone supposedly despises and yet every declining community desires. Weird.
Data centers, grocery stores, reliable energy, civil rights, human rights, etc.
"Black electoral power"
Don't they get one vote each like everyone else?
Deny thy data centers, deny thy servers, and AI will no longer be a blogger.
Looks like hate does have a home. A mid-century colonial.
The left is now at the end of long cultural cul de sac.
They have nowhere else to go. It's like the marching band scene at the end of "Animal House".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1v0jB3OswM
to disorganize and dilute Black electoral power
Voting blocs. Ugh. There should be no such thing as "Black electoral power" - nor "gay" nor "female" nor "name-your-identifying-characteristic." Voters should make independent decisions - ideally based on their judgments about policy, but not everyone is up to that level of interest or analysis, so even if it's just how a candidate comes across. Still a voter's own decision.
She fears and resents the possibility that some black voters may recognize that Democrat policies, for all the good intentions I'm still willing to impute to them out of the goodness of my heart, have done terrible damage to black families, black men, black women, black babies who were conceived but never born.
And the damage isn't simply the readily quantifiable forms; it's also the awful degradation of the spirit that we're seeing right now in response to the Anthony verdict. Time was - even during Jim Crow when one might be forgiven for expecting to see an awful degradation of the spirit among American black people - that black Americans married at higher rates than white Americans, for instance, and black teenagers had summer and after-school jobs at higher rates than white teenagers. But however many generations in from the War on Poverty and the Great Society, a culture of dependence and the resentment that goes with it are deeply rooted now.
"Black electoral power" of the elites vs deplorables is a fixture, fixation of Critical Diversity Theory.
That passage Althouse selected as headline is laughable. Why do democrats have to “organize” their voters? It’s a tell. They have to create division and strife to motivate their voters. Actual true issues don’t interest them so they need to gin up hatred and transfer some of that sweet Trumphate onto a new target and rally round the new fake outrage.
So of course every complaint about data centers is actually created out of ordinary issues that apply to any development but are framed as unique to data centers: water use and pollution, power usage and supply, who “benefits” from the operation and how do we extract Danegeld from them. There is nothing uniquely threatening by data centers.
Once again democrats plot in plain sight how to create strife and conflict out of advances that benefit all of us in the long run.
The writer, John Robb, had some powerful insight into the data center backlash:
The backlash against data centers isn't about servers, AI, or technological progress in the abstract.
It's a backlash against;
>a vision of the future, where the good outcomes involve hazy hand waving and the bad ones are clear as day.
>a future that we are being coerced to accept, at every level, without complaint or discussion, let alone taking action to ensure a positive outcome (similar to COVID, the financial crisis, etc.).
>a technological, financial, and political leadership that almost nobody would trust with watching their dog while on vacation (a distrust built on decades of hard won experience).
With each failed promise over the last few decades, anger has grown. However, up until now, there hasn't been a way to oppose this future. It's been too amorphous.
Now, there is. Data centers are a tangible embodiment of a future nobody appears to want or trust. A focal point for opposition and disruption.
Did this poorly reasoned article mention the concrete steps that the Trump admin has imposed on new data centers? How is the new requirement to build dedicated power plants being received by the anti-advancement luddites of the DSA?
Are data centers the new Nazis?
Anti-data center propaganda is all over social media. Wonder why? Read on:
Sen. Tom Cotton urges DOJ to probe Chinese bid to 'kneecap' American AI (Yahoo! News)
"Sen. Tom Cotton urged the Justice Department to investigate a covert campaign linked to China designed to "kneecap" America's rapidly expanding artificial intelligence infrastructure in a letter obtained exclusively by Fox News Digital.
...
Cotton's request follows the release of a report last week from the Bitcoin Policy Institute, a think tank based in Washington, D.C., alleging that Chinese state media, foreign-funded advocacy groups and a network of organizations funded by American tech tycoon Neville Roy Singham have spent years building opposition to U.S. data center construction and AI infrastructure projects.
Singham, an avowed Marxist and the founder of a Chicago-based company, Thoughtworks, that he sold in 2017, now lives in Shanghai, and has become a growing focus of congressional scrutiny and federal investigations. In March, as members of the Singham network were journeying to Havana to support the Communist Party of Cuba, Earlier this year, Fox News Digital published a five-part series documenting how Singham has funneled $278 million into a series of nonprofits, including groups at the heart of the protests against AI, data centers and technology firms in the U.S."
More at the link.
Lots of anti-SpaceX agitprop as regards Elon Musk's proposal to use satellites for data centers. Most of it repeats the mantra that you can't cool the machinery in space because there's no air. I'm no expert on such things, but all the satellites up there are able to radiate heat, on the side not facing the sun, just fine.
You know who else wanted to put data centers everywhere? Hitler!!
Great points Michael. But the dangers hinted at are entirely the result of WHO IS RUNNING the AI companies and have nothing to do with data centers per se. There will be no demonstrations or riots or damage to Elon’s data centers because they will orbiting the planet free from nimbyism. The lack of trust in tech companies is direct reflection of the Star Wars Bar scene that our current tech oligarchs resemble: Bill “windows” Gates, the “do no evil oops nevermind “ Google bros, lying shitstain Zuckerberg, Sam “what me worry?” Altman, Jack Dorsey?
Today's Coffee & Covid--Good stuff on how Democrats "organize" their "voters," and the Republican program to make sure that voters' and only voters' mail-in votes are properly recorded.
Key line: Well, the silver lining is that LA’s homeless population apparently has a strong sense of civic participation. Unlike nearly anywhere else on earth, LA’s underpass dwellers vote in surprisingly large numbers.
Coffee & Covid
Data centers in the Cloud.
"Most of it repeats the mantra that you can't cool the machinery in space because there's no air. I'm no expert on such things, but all the satellites up there are able to radiate heat, on the side not facing the sun, just fine.
Data centers use so much power that the cooling requirement is orders of magnitude higher than current satellites. And the fact that there is no air makes cooling inefficient.
It's only one of many engineering challenges that have to be addressed by space-based data centers. I don't think we'll be seeing them in the near future.
Mike (MJB Wolf) said..."Did this poorly reasoned article mention the concrete steps that the Trump admin has imposed on new data centers? How is the new requirement to build dedicated power plants being received by the anti-advancement luddites of the DSA?"
Do you have a link on this?
Thanking you in advance.
I don't get this manufactured hate for data centers. They are all over the state I live in, and there is intense debate at the state level over cancelling tax breaks promised to their owners by the legislature. It is causing a fiscal crisis because the two competing democrat factions cannot agree.
I've been to two centers, and, while they are huge buildings, nothing seems to be unduly horrible about them, as opposed to other industrial operations.
Paraphrasing Michael Jordan: "Democrats use AI too."
How is this a Republican vs. Democrat issue? Apparently the assumption is that Democrats are ignorant Luddites. Not necessarily wrong...
Absentee voter fraud is an effective tool for Democrats to "organize voters." It's been working since 2020.
I love data centers. Just put common sense restrictions on them.
the dems lie and cheat - and build hate structures, and cheat structures to do it.
And the fact that there is no air makes cooling inefficient.
You might be surprised. They are radiating to a background at near absolute zero. If you take the silvery reflective layer off a thermos bottle, it doesn't work that well due to radiative transfer. I expect SpaceX engineers can do the computations.
"..Democrats need organized voters..."
by 'organized voters', i assume they mean:
fraudulent
imaginary
fictitious
non citizen
non existant
voters
?
White privilege is being able to vote for whoever you want.
There's a saying that you can only be argued out of a position that you were argued into in the first place......I have an open mind on data centers, but if Bernie Sanders and Eilizabeth Warren are against them, there must be something to be said for them.......I saw Elon Musk talking about the need to put data centers on the moon. Apparently on the moon, you won't need any coolants or whatever to keep them working......I'm an old man. You can't expect me to stay conversant about data center coolants, but I have a vague sense that Elon Musk knows more about these things than Elizabeth Warren.
"We want to scare stupid people with Chinese propaganda to get their votes."
Isn't it already pretty damn cold in space? At least on the dark side of Earth?
Power requirements? The first small, modular reactor achieved criticality a few days ago:
"I expect SpaceX engineers can do the computations."
The computations have already been done. Cooling requires large structures, comparable in size to the solar panels powering them.
Without air, you are limited to thermal radiation alone for cooling. With air, you also have convective cooling.
I don't understand why AI needs so much power. I don't know much about the technology, but something about all these data centers feels like a dead end, or even a scam of some type. I expect some development in tech to come along and make them all obsolete as soon as all the money is gone.
I think the article misses the mark badly. The Progressives have built a machine that creates voters out of thin air, highjacking public policy to stoke the voter rolls for harvest. We've just seen it happen in California.
But that machine is totally dependent on the cash flow coming in, to operate. And as we've just seen in the House testimony, the cash machine has been severely cropped. Act Blue no longer has the protective cover of a Progressive administration. US A.I.D. has seen its Progressive cash crop gutted, and the NGO empire is folding. Fraud via infiltrated state agencies is also under attack, crimping the welfare and Medicaid fraud cash flows.
I'm sure these efforts will continue to bear fruit over the next 2½ years, as this administration's efforts are refined. Good ! Long overdue. The Progressives have shown little interest in their voting base and its issues. They've developed the means to simply make votes as a reliable topper to get them over the line. It's going to be hard to turn the ship. Good !
The Dolly Moment: Why We Stan A Post-Racism Queen
by Tressie McMillan Cottom
Okay, let's delve into Cottom's particular brand of crazy by examining the "Stan" in the title of her essay. According to an AI data center...
Stan is slang that means to be an extremely devoted and obsessive fan of someone or something. It is a portmanteau of the words "stalker" and "fan," popularized by Eminem’s 2000 hit song "Stan" about a dangerously obsessed fan. In her renowned essay... Cottom uses the term as a critique rather than pure praise. In the title Why We Stan a Post-Racism Queen, "stan" is used ironically to highlight society's obsession with Dolly Parton. Cottom argues that we "stan" Dolly because it helps white Americans feel good about living in a "post-racist" society. By adoring her, we project the idea that our culture is unified and past its racial flaws, even when deep contradictions remain.
Here's the first paragraph:
Dolly Parton is having a moment. After 60 years in public life, the sassy songbird in indelible drag is a reigning queen among pop culture’s most elite celebrity tier: the “unproblematic fave.” Those are celebrities who have transcended whatever domain first made them famous, have not disappointed their core fanbase, and manage to avoid a casual audience’s wrath. Rare in its own right, Dolly’s ascension is even more noteworthy because of what she is selling. Mediatized to our collective eyeteeth and insolent in our aesthetic preferences, we usually denigrate Dolly’s type of earnest sentimentality in the discourse. Yet over the past five years, it has become verboten to dislike her, much less to critique her. By tacit consensus, Dolly Parton is the one good thing in our empire’s twilight.
I will say that recently Trump spoke about the US Government possibly getting an ownership interest in AI companies and that in turn, "the public will become very rich." I suspect the reason he put this out there is that Trump senses that there is widespread worry, or at least skepticism, about Data Centers specifically and AI broadly.
"A [Democrat] is someone who stands athwart history, yelling Stop."
The G.O.P. is racing to disorganize and dilute Black electoral power
How dare we not fully leverage white guilt to maximize Democratic power!?
Let's talk ActBlue and money laundering.
Everything about the democrat party has turned into a scam. I don't think 2-1/2 years is sufficient to uproot it. But as much as possible must be done. As fast as possible.
Democrats need boxes of ballots. w/ no chain of custody.
"Did this poorly reasoned article mention the concrete steps that the Trump admin has imposed on new data centers? "
Concrete steps are much more durable than, say, wooden steps. The concrete steps leading to my back door have survived many harsh winters and lots of traffic.
The issue is never the issue.
“ Americans hate data centers. They really, really hate them”
Tell me you live in an impenetrable leftist bubble w/o telling me you live in an impenetrable leftist bubble.
It's not what's in a data center, it's what's on them. Countries like China are already a panopticon, so it is wholly and simultaneously an internal and external national security project. A force multiplier. One cannot 'opt out' of it by refusing to utilize it. In China, it's commercial utility will always subordinate to its security utility.
America's panopticon is approaching obligatory, but still subconsciously voluntary. Being monitored is essentially the price you pay for using the technology, but it won't be that way for much longer with intuitive modeling. Being Amish won't save you.
Still very much a national security project, but we're not yet that far along no matter how many in DC want China's social credit system in this country...and there are many.
" The G.O.P. is racing to disorganize and dilute Black electoral power across the South..."
You mean the way Democrats have already diluted conservative electoral power across the states they control?
If you don't like having it done to you, you shouldn't do it to others. Or maybe...
Rule 4: "Make the enemy live up to its own book of rules."
OM
At two bucks a pop, for a few grand you can buy a lot of votes.
Bagoh
I suspect your right.
Democrat cultists hate who and what they are told to hate.
Dutifully. Religiously.
For a supposedly impartial journalistic institution, the NYT sure spends an inordinate amount of time and energy fretting over the Democrat party’s electoral prospects.
But seriously, instead of coming up with some gimmick, all Democrat’s really need to do is back a policy or two that the majority of Americans support. I suspect they’ll eventually have to go this route if for no other reason than to keep their money laundering schemes functioning.
“ Singham, an avowed Marxist and the founder of a Chicago-based company, Thoughtworks, that he sold in 2017”
As a Marxist, shouldn’t he have just turned the business over to the workers? CC, JSM
It's not like data centers are new, but AI data centers are energy hungry and have driven up the cost of computer hardware. I don't think AI is all that useful for those costs. However, Gov. Abbott in Texas has remedied the one problem that I think is right for the state to fix. If you want to build an AI data center, then you can fund your own infrastructure to support it, which solves the power problem.
Democrats need organized voters.
Listen up, sheeple!
Musk is putting at least a GW of data centers in orbit in 2026,10gw or more in 27 and terawatts by 29.
1 gw=1typical nuke plant.
Solar powered "it's always sunny in space"
I've been saying for years that musk's eventual goal was power to earth from space. I thought it was concentrated utility scale power. It looks like even more than I expected but diffuse electronic power
John Henry
No data centers on Earth? This can only drive SpaceX stock up on its first trading day.
Makes you wonder whether Elon's PR team paid her to write it.
Yes it is not a winning issue for them as it promotes the promotion of the issue if gerrymandering and which party has had the upper hand in it for two three generations…
Black = Democratic has been a feature of politics for so long that the 2 are inseparable. Gerrymandering to insure black representation = Gerrymandering to insure Democratic representation. As to data centers, I think it's a roll of the dice as to which party benefits the most from an "anti" stance. I'm not sure how the "trust the science" party can reject technology which is purely a result of scientific advances.
I am not an engineer. I get (sort of), in theory, that you can power AI processing in space, and transmit the product. But how do you power electricity for earthbound things like heating/AC, transportation, agriculture, construction, etc., from space?
I've been trying to figure out why there is so much negative press regarding data centers in the US while Asia seems to embrace them. I can't get past the idea that it's being done to purposely put us behind other countries, especially China.
I expect some development in tech to come along and make them all obsolete
I wouldn't call data centers a scam. But tech is rapidly advancing, chips will get better, training more efficient, algorithms improved. Planning a couple of years out is inherently dangerous. I think anything that takes more than a couple of years to build is on shaky ground. Note that Musk is making money on his data center, but he got it built in months, not years. Firstest with the mostest is still a winning tactic.
"Americans hate data centers."
Americans hate oligarchian AI that imposes itself into everything, built by companies run by sociopaths who clearly do not have American interests in mind.
Not all data centers are thus, but the ones getting the most publicity are. And not liking Google, Meta, or Microsoft is a rare affinity across political lines. Most people don't know OpenAI, but Sam Altman is as close to a superman villain as we get in the real world and anything known about him leads to instant dislike across political categories.
Elon Musk gets favorable likes from the Right now, but is despised by the Left.
So why support their projects if the people and the companies involves are so disliked? That's a hard sell in addition to the environmental concerns.
"Musk is putting at least a GW of data centers in orbit in 2026,10gw or more in 27 and terawatts by 29."
Really? Let's stick with 2026. Can you link to what he's doing in this regard this year? Thanks.
Total us capacity is currently 1.4TW or 1400 nuke plants. Elon plans to double that in less than 4 years.
He is earning that $trillion. Let the man work.
John Henry
Every time Copilot makes my office docs worse or intrudes on my flow I get more against data centers. Every time I use google to search and get their AI responses, I want them to have less AI not more (sadly I have tried other search engines and they are all worse than the non-AI google still). In real work life, AI is intrusive, unhelpful and makes everything more expensive as it's being sold as a bonus.
There are good uses to AI, but most of the stuff that intrudes into regular lives makes things worse and much more irritating.
Democrats count on the veil of ignorance of these voters as their policies ravage the working class and the black community. This veil is expected to keep certain segments of society loyal even as Democrats destroy them: the working class, blacks, more recently Jews and yes, even women.
Democrats see data centers as a threat to their hold on power; promising to fulfill every need from the cradle to the grave.
They intuit their constituents will go with the highest bidder.
Why do so many people dislike AI? I ask Grok.
Grok replies: Because it feels like an existential threat wrapped in convenience. It’s automating jobs, flooding the world with soulless content, and making human skill feel obsolete. Deepfakes erode trust, biased algorithms amplify division, and the rapid pace leaves society breathless. Most of all, people sense a loss of control — handing our creativity, decisions, and future to machines we don’t fully understand or trust. AI promises progress, but it arrives with the quiet fear that one day we might not be needed anymore. That unease is hard to ignore.
Cooling requires large structures, comparable in size to the solar panels powering them.
Yes, what's your point?
Primary Reasons for Data Center Opposition
Recent polls (e.g., Gallup, May 2026) show ~70% of Americans oppose AI data centers in their area. Top concerns:Resource strain (50% of opponents) — Massive electricity use (driving up bills and straining grids) and water consumption for cooling (millions of gallons daily in some facilities).
news.gallup.com
Environmental & quality-of-life issues (noise pollution from fans/generators, air pollution from backups, land loss, traffic).
foodandwaterwatch.org
Economic drawbacks — Few local jobs (mostly construction; AI replaces more than it creates locally), tax breaks for Big Tech, and higher utility costs for residents.
news.harvard.edu
NIMBY + symbolism — They’re giant, noisy warehouses seen as Big Tech imposing costs on communities while benefits go elsewhere. Some tie it to broader AI skepticism (job loss, distrust), but that’s a minority factor.
theatlantic.com
Your AI post captured cultural/philosophical unease well. Data center fights are more "not in my backyard" over real-world impacts like power bills, water shortages, and diesel fumes. The two connect because data centers enable the AI people fear—but the opposition is grounded in tangible local pain, not just abstract worries. This has already delayed or blocked billions in projects across the U.S.
People don't like and don't trust Big Tech. That's the barrier to overcome.
I worked a substantial portion of my life for the very rich… white shoe NYC corp law firms, then deep pocket publishing companies and start-ups. Sure beat working for employers operating on a shoestring. (I got plenty of that crap in the popular music biz.) The pay, perks and working conditions offered by the very rich are great.
@Paddy O, so much of what AI is doing now is what search engines used to do just as efficiently 20 years ago, and which commercialization, ads, and SEO destroyed. Enshittification isn't an if with AI, it's a when.
When I have negative thoughts about all this I remember that AI data centers may be killing the climate change hoax and I am mollified.
water consumption for cooling
Phony issue, the cooling water is recirculated, and has additives you don't want in the ground water in any case.
For background: I have worked with data centers since the 1980s.
There are speculative data center "projectors" crawling all over my area of Pennsylvania. They are looking for any good deal on land and trying to lock things in before the laws can catch up with them.
The result is many big fights between locals who are worried about their wells (as an example) and surplus lawyers seemingly hired to tell them that they can't do a goddamn thing about it.
This absolute will lead many to question their loyalty to a political party that has told big tech that anything goes. And, perhaps, shift people back to a party that claims to stand up for them.
I have the distinct impression that these projects are promoted by independent hucksters who dream of a revenue stream from AWS, Oracle, AT&T, Microsoft, etc.
It is interesting how much climate change, carbon-free, and green energy have diminished in so many conversations surrounding data centers at the corporate level. Yeah. People noticed.
"Yes, what's your point?"
That it's expensive.
re: the "cold of space". The Stefan-Boltzmann law, which describes radiative heat transfer, does not have a term for the temperature of the sink. Only the source. Temperature of a vacuum is a poorly defined concept, but in any case it doesn't matter.
Actually, Republicans need "organized voters." Democrats can just harvest the ballots sent to dead people, fake addresses, and skid row.
Data centers, the moral panic for 2026. Seems to be driven by people most likely affected by widespread use of LLMs.
Data centers are this year's global warming or fracking or keystone pipeling or Three Mile island. I'm not too crazy about them but my old idea that abandoned malls could become solar farms didn't work out, so maybe they could become data centers.
Musk is going to put data centers in space. No need to cool them.
Fracking is a good similar example.
Here's why the data center problem is not a "winning issue" for either political party. It's a NIMBY issue. Data centers are an import part of our infrastructure and people utilize them daily for everything that they do in the internet. People just don't want them near to their houses. (And I can relate to that.) But when election time comes, voters in Maine aren't going to care about a data center in Utah. Add to that, the fact that politicians belonging to both major political parties have approved these data centers, and you'll see that both parties are deeply involved with having them built. So it's hypocritical to condemn the other side for something your side has also done. And there's also the fact that there has been a recent pullback in the number of planned data centers because AI isn't working out the way that the AI companies hoped for.
The Democrats are not losing elections because of what they've been fighting against. (Because mostly, it's just Trump, Trump, Trump and people just tune that out.) The Democrats are losing elections because of the unpopular issues that they insist on fighting for.
AI data centers are a human right!
"No need to cool them."
That's wrong. They generate a lot of heat which must be removed.
Chinese communists met with Bernie Sanders the communist - and whispered in his ear that data centers in the US must be stopped.
Obey your pay masters, Bernie.
"Enshittification isn't an if with AI, it's a when."
This. People put up a lot when they get a sense there's a real benefit. Which is why wealthy folks oppose wind farms off ther beachside villas. They know there's little benefit besides politics and its for the poor people to put up with the political useless rent-seeking gestures.
There's hardly a category of our lives that is now considered "better" than 20 years ago. A lot is better, yes. But a lot isn't. Art is worse than 150 years ago. Movies are terrible. Online search, using Adobe, Microsoft, etc. is terrible. Meta is the yahoo of our era, buying up the little that is good and making it always worse. AI is everywhere but I think people really would have less popups in their software, links to actual websites, and trustworthy content not written by AI (or artificial non-intelligent but physical people the media now exclusively hires)
Dave Begley said...
"Musk is going to put data centers in space. No need to cool them."
One of the reasons why they can't put data centers in space is that there is no way to cool them. Empty space isn't cold or hot; it's just empty space. A data center generates heat, but there is very little in space to transfer that heat to. So the heat will just build up in the data center. Granted, there is a little leakage of heat into space, because it's not a total vacuum, but it's not enough to get rid of all the heat that a data center will produce.
Neville singham and dustin moslowitz no joke
"Data centers evoke strong emotions because they are tangible. Voters can hear them, smell them and see them.... "
They must have hated newspapers, magazines and Ford Motor automobiles. And then there are the airplanes and motorcycles.
"More power for sociopaths and more enshittification in more places" makes for a really hard sell.
The Same Prophets Who Sold You Climate Doom Are Now Selling You AI Doom https://share.google/fv5D8XqfstWUK9jNg
Empty space isn't cold or hot; it's just empty space.
Not so. "Empty" space is filled with fields. Current temperature of the EM field is about 2.7 K.
Some of the challenges of space-based data centers
"If you run the numbers honestly, the physics doesn’t immediately kill it, but the economics are savage.”
""Empty" space is filled with fields. Current temperature of the EM field is about 2.7 K."
That "temperature" doesn't mean what you think it means.
darn
Italics off.
Original Mike,
The gw&tw numbers came from a quick query of Gemini which says they are estimates and speculative
John Henry
Elon Musk has proposed putting up a gigantic chip forge in an area NW of Houston. It utilizes one of the decommissioned lignite power plants sites which is now empty - except for the electrical utility infrastructure that was left over (high-tension distribution).
There has been a groundswell of opposition in the area, concerned-citizen advocacy. Recently Musk's proposal has secured substantial tax breaks. But the opposition is remarkable well-organized. Very slick presences on social media, very good public interfaces with all the latest in news, recent polls, etc etc. In other words, the 'concerned citizens' that are decrying the spoiling of their quiet, traditional, rural lifestyle, living the wholesome simple life, are belying a very well-organized astro-turf support group that is setting the tone and supplying the content. Nobody has confronted this NGO too disclose their funding yet. I'm foreseeing fireworks when it happens.
Thanks, John.
I don't think Musk is putting any data centers in space this year. Would be interested to learn otherwise.
Original Mike,
The economics of space Ai is largely an issue of cost to orbit. Musk has done more to drive that down in the past few years than all space programs in the previous 75.
Current cost is @1500-3000 per kg.
In 1990 it was $70-100,000 in current dollars
Per Gemini
John Henry
That "temperature" doesn't mean what you think it means.
It means exactly what I think it means. What do you think it means?
"If you take the silvery reflective layer off a thermos bottle, it doesn't work that well due to radiative transfer. "
Vacuum bottles work primarily because of the vacuum between the interior container and the environment.
Now do space.
Maybe making data centers much more costly by both restricting their supply and taxing them heavily would be a way to reduce the amount of AI slop being produced. The more expensive tokens get, the less incentive there is for companies to use them.
We should always try to recognize the externalities produced by different kinds of industry and commerce so that we can minimize their negative impacts on the general public and make sure that the cost of mitigation is borne by the firms that benefit from producing them.
Given the business model of many tech firms---lose money on products until the market is captured and then jack up subscription feeds--it might be very much for our own good if the cost of AI were to rise to match what it costs to create and run the systems. Firms could then make accurate cost/benefit calculations instead of trading short term savings for massive and inescapable long-term costs.
The cosmic background radiation has a near-perfect blackbody spectrum of 2.7-degrees Kelvin. That tells you nothing about coupling between it and an object immersed in it.
Current Starlink satellites use about 35kw, so I expect Musk has a pretty fair idea of what is required to shed heat in space, and how much it will cost. These orbital "datacenters" won't be datacenters as such. They will be more like 1mw racks in space with network connectivity provided by laser links, much like the existing Starlink constellation.
Copilot AI gives us some reasons why local people and governments should be working to attract data centers. Here are two ...
A hyperscale data center is a $500M–$2B construction project. That means:
o 1,000–2,500 construction jobs for 18–36 months for
electricians, steelworkers, concrete crews
o union contracts
o local subcontractors
o Even if long‑term staffing is small (30–100 employees), the construction phase is a major economic event.
does not have a term for the temperature of the sink.
So what? You might want to look into the concept of detailed balance from thermodynamics. The black body not only radiates, it absorbs. Two black bodies at the same temperature facing each other will absorb as much as they radiate, with no net loss of energy.
The easy way to motivate voters is to say what you want to do and do it. The old 'build it and they will come'. the argument that the 'opposition is surpressing the minorities!' is an old tired argument.
In its second hour of trading, SpaceX is priced at $175. The IPO pricing was $135. Most of the shares were allocated last night to mutual funds and sovereign wealth funds, I am told. Brokerages didn't fare as well as they had hoped, so most private bidders would have been disappointed.
John Henry,
"In a recent paper, researchers at Google said that if launch costs fell to about $200 a kilogram or less, AI orbital data centers would be comparable to traditional data center costs. A mission on SpaceX’s workhorse rocket can cost around $3,400 a kilogram." (from my link @ 11:36am)
Is that right? IDK
Can Musk get it that low? IDK
Boatbuilder,
The only difference between transmitting data, in microwatts and transmitting utility scale power in megawatts or gigawatts is scale. It is the same technology.
Nicola Tesla built a demonstration plant on Long Island around 1905 and was transmitting kilowatts wirelessly over about 5 miles. Robert Heinlein was writing about nuclear power plants in orbit beaming power to earth in 1940. ("Blowups Happen")
The physics has been known for 125 years or more. The engineering is fairly well known and mostly solved. The main problem is the economics, the cost of launching the plant into space. Data sells for hundreds or thousands of dollars per KWH. Electricity sells for pennies.
It is not simple, cheap or easy but we do know how to do it.
As I mentioned, Musk has dramatically dropped the cost of getting to orbit. In probably less than 5 years it will drop by another factor of 10, I am guessing. That, plus the economies of scale from space power for data and driving down the learning curve will make power from space economical.
John Henry
why local people and governments should be working to attract data centers.
That is the selling point of the proposed Stratos data center in my neighborhood. The problem is that it is a real estate play, not a tech play. The idea seems to be that if you build it they will come. So far no one is planning to come, there is no money, and no engineering team that might build the place in quick time. Getting a loan for a project with no certain tenants is a long shot, I expect it to die on the vine unless they can sucker government into funding it.
The difference from Musk, is that Musk built his data centers to support training for Grok (Memphis) and Tesla (Giga Texas). He had a need and built to satisfy that need. It was a classic case of vertical integration, not a real estate play.
"...the Voting Rights Act is all but dead..."
What does that mean? Did anyone lose the right to vote? No.
Does this make it harder for a properly registered citizen of the US to vote? No.
Is anyone held out from being allowed to vote because of the color of their skin, gender, religion, or personal hygiene? No.
Is there anyone who, if properly registered in their state, is being disallowed from voting? No.
What the hell are Democrats selling to their constituents...yet again? A lie. An evil, underhanded lie. A lie to keep them enslaved to the Democratic Party. A lie they've been using ever since they had to give up being the public face of Jim Crow.
The Voting Rights Act stands intact. If you want to vote, register and vote. But you might have to get up off your ass to do so.
I had the opportunity to dive into self-generation in the early 1980s when I was manager facility operations at Alcon Humacao. The resulting federal case is what makes solar and wind farms possible. (I apologize). More recently, I dove into for an article in Packaging Digest https://www.packagingdigest.com/packaging-business/should-your-packaging-facility-make-its-own-electricity-
It is something I've been interested in professionally and personally since the late 60s.
One of the problems with electricity pricing in the US is the way rates are set. Greatly simplified, the utility goes to a govt regulator (who they more or less own) and says "This is what it costs me to generate a KWH". The utility generally accepts that cost and then allows them to charge the cost plus a percentage.
This gives the utility a disincentive to reduce costs. It gives them a positive incentive to increase costs. Their profit is twice as much on a 20c KWH as on a 10c one.
Ditto cost of building a nuclear plant. 10% on a $2bn plant is twice as much as on a $1bn plant.
When the data centers start building their own power plants, nuke or fossil (Note that virtually none are building wind/solar)
They have every incentive to keep the building cost (capex) and operating costs (opex) as low as possible.
Cost of downtime in a data center is enormous. Potentially thousands, even tens of thousands of dollars per second. Per Claude:
In 2024 the average minute of downtime cost $14,056 for all organizations, and large enterprises averaged $23,750 per minute. For some Fortune 500 companies, the cost exceeded five million dollars per hour.
So they are going to build a lot of redundant capacity and they will not do it on the cheap. Except possibly compared to a utility.
I suspect that at some point, they will decide to sell some power to the utility. Then we will see what the true cost of electrical power is. I suspect a lot less than we are paying now.
John Henry
Price of generation in Puerto Rico, by each generating plant, in real time is online at https://genera-pr.com/data-generacion
Currently, Eco-Electrica, a combined cycle gas turbine plant is supplying 324MW at 7.31c/kwh AES Coal a coal fired steam plant is providing 489MW at 6.48.
The govt owned utility is providing power at prices from 10c to 30c.
Solar is selling for 18-20c, wind for 16.39
Eco-electrica and AES are private and operate at a profit. The others are govt and operate on politics.
Solar/wind are bullshit prices having nothing to do with cost or value.
John Henry
We hear about data centers and energy usage. In 2026 there are about $45bn if data centers going up. (building cost only).
But there are over $200bn of manufacturing buildings going up as well. (Plus equipment & Machy)
I would not be surprised if manufacturing buildings use the same or more juice, heat and cooling than data centers proportionally. So about 4 times what is being complained about with DCs.
Why do we not hear about manufacturing plants the same way as data centers? (Rhetorical question)
John Henry
For those saying you can't cool data centers in space:
What is a Starlink if not a small data center? With identical, albeit smaller, issues as a DC?
If Musk can power and cool the Starlink sats, why would we not expect they know how to scale up to DC size satellites?
Someone mentioned the moon, different issue. Assuming that by the time there are DCs there, there will be a moon colony. They will certainly be able to use the heat for keeping living spaces comfy, cooking and a million other things. It will be a valuable resource to be used, not a waste product to be discarded.
John Henry
Tressie don't know nuthin' 'bout buildin' no data centers, but she ain't no ways tarred.
So the Democrat party will join with the Chinese communists to make sure that data centers are build in China and not the US. Checks out.
"For those saying you can't cool data centers in space:"
If that's directed at me, I didn't say you can't.
"If Musk can power and cool the Starlink sats, why would we not expect they know how to scale up to DC size satellites?"
People have already done the design work. Of course it can be done. And it's expensive. It's all going to come down to economics.
Serious question, what does a Data Center smell like?
I've worked with computers of all sizes for 45 years and I've never noticed them smelling like anything in particular.
Bull Connor would disagree, Triscuit.
I do have some sympathy for some data center opponents. I live about an hour from Port Washington Wisconsin which is the site of the Oracle Open AI Lighthouse project. Few residents had any idea of the proposed scope of the project until it was approved by the town. This is a 672 acre facility costing $15 billion that was started last year and will not be completed until sometime in 2028. There have been all kinds of environmental concerns as well as 24/7 construction activity with long lines of trucks and equipment constantly entering and exiting the site. I’ve driven by it and it’s beyond description. I can understand perfectly well why many oppose this project.
They smell how this looks.
"In its second hour of trading, SpaceX is priced at $175. The IPO pricing was $135. Most of the shares were allocated last night to mutual funds and sovereign wealth funds, I am told. Brokerages didn't fare as well as they had hoped, so most private bidders would have been disappointed."
SPCX valuation: $1.8 trillion
WMT valuation: $920 billion
SPCX revenue: $18 billion
WMT revenue: $713 billion
Yeah...I'll take another look in 6 months - after hyperventilation ceases - and consider it once it stabilizes.
Crazy pills. Oof.
Original Mike said...
If that's directed at me, I didn't say you can't.
Not at you but at several who have said it can't be done.
And it's expensive. It's all going to come down to economics.
Yup. It is expensive, now but it is gettng cheaper daily.
EVERYTHING comes down to economics. Very high end data, like portable internet connectivity can be sold at a high enough price to justify the expensive cost. Less high end data like an Amazon data center is still expensive and can justify a high, though not as high, cost.
Costs will have to get ridiculously low to make selling utility scale power possible. But they are well on the way there already.
John Henry
The Republicans can't get many more black votes, so they should go after the dead voters that Democrats have a lock on. They need to go grave to grave, knock on tombstones and make their case. There are millions of votes out there just waiting to be dug up.
Oh they are organized. Into goose-stepping Maine Kampf nazi ranks.
They are organized into categories: rapists, child molesters, nazis, thieves, terrorists, murderers, grifters, and gangsters.
KKKak/Richsockpuppet/paidActbluetrollaccount-: thes are your people...is there any democrat out there that isn't one of these groups???
(Btw your ActBlue paymaster had to plead the 5th a dozen times. Why would she need to plead the 5th so many times....???
She even pled the 5th when asked her name.
@RideSpaceMountain, I don't disagree, I think there is a lot of tulip energy in the markets right now. But on the other hand..... A person wouldn't be 100% wrong to risk a speculative position, understanding the nature of the beast.....
Relative to historical IPOs: .."If future Spacex growth = AMZN 1997 or NVDA 1999, you'll still kill it. But if it's "just" META 2012 or AAPL 1980, pricing in too much....."
Don't disagree at all. After retail stops huffing glue and there's a semblance of equilibrium I intend to hold it my portfolio long term.
"She even pled the 5th when asked her name."
Is that the ActBlue exec who was testifying to Congress?
These people think they're untouchable. And they are, until the DOJ proves otherwise.
Me so horny! Share $100 each? Me hold SPCX long time!
Thank you, John Henry, for your response at 12:17.
I trust you, but as a physical matter I find it hard to accept, or perhaps more correctly to wrap my head around. The only transfer of energy through air that I can imagine is something like lightning.
For example, as a consumer today, in order to use wireless data transfer, you still need a powered transmitter/receiver arrangement. Why aren't Earthbound utilities which provide wi-fi not also offering wireless energy? Wouldn't that be "cheaper" and easier than current energy delivery systems? Are there any "real life" examples of the type of system you describe (as opposed to "experimental")? It seems hard to believe that Tesla did it in 1905 and there haven't been any advances since then.
Voters can smell data centers? Hmmm, is it anything like Texas BBQ?
In other news, the Scottish lass with the knife and axe defending herself and her sister from the wanna be rapist Immigrant... was totally vindicated as the immigrant and his sister were convicted of various sexual assault and threats against the girls. Every Democrat, including the ones here at Althouse, who condemned her for defending herself and her sister.... are completely silent and still mad she wasn't raped and killed by a "tolerant loving migrant!"
I have a hard time accepting the idea that having "organized" voters is somehow a positive sign. I guess it is in terms of putting a particular party in power, but if you don't care about the actual positions of that party, then it's just either mindless sports-team rooting or expectation of getting a payoff.
It seems to me that seeking to develop a semi-coherent set of positions that appeal to large numbers of unorganized middle-class voters would be a better approach--if that is possible given the coalition of interests in a given party. And if so, the decision to instead seek or create highly organized voters indicates an inferior set of positions.
I didn't know organized as synonym for self-deluded
Yes, of course cooling electronics in space is a major design point of scope. A rough estimate I saw at an optimization conference is that at present allowable chip temperatures and certain cooling design assumptions you would need about 1.1 sq ft of radiator panel area per sq ft of solar panel. So you just need to see if you can afford to do that. The value proposition is that in space you escape the evils of local politics and much of regulation. You are not going to be used as a cash source for the state government. You won’t have Karens screaming at you.
And it also helps the Chinese dominate us economically and militarily which is another plus.
for everybody blathering about cooling things in space...If you want to know how it actually works, go to
https://projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/index.php
and study the sections on (yup) cooling things in space.
Warning: some (lots of) math, but pretty simple math.
Josephblau: In space, you can't hear the Karens scream.
How do you suppose the heat from the sun gets through the vacuum of space to the Earth?
"How do you suppose the heat from the sun gets through the vacuum of space to the Earth?"
sigh
Data centers pay a ton in taxes but put relatively little strain on communities in that, once built, they use few workers. No roads to be built for worker commutes, no schools for the families. They pay a a lot of money in taxes and use few services. There are two problems. They must develop a power source. And they must not build too close to houses because there's a hum. These problems have been recognized and are being met. They pay a a lot of money in taxes and use few services. In few years there will be lawsuits because AI centers were not built in the black communities. Why? They pay a a lot of money in taxes and use few services.
Most folks don't understand why data centers are needed. Do you like streaming movies and TV series in 4K? Do you think it's magic how that happens? No idiots, it's data centers. Those centers contain the entire internet content. This also includes "the cloud", which is widely used now by most businesses to hold all their business data and run their manufacturing software such as Oracle and SAP and Peoplesoft and Sales Force. That by itself is a gigantic amount of data. AI is only adding to the already large demand for server farms.
So all the uproar against data centers makes absolutely no sense whatsoever, unless, of course, you've not done your homework to understand what they are used for. Ignorance is not bliss, it's dangerous.
The G.O.P. is racing to disorganize and dilute Black electoral power across the South and the Voting Rights Act is all but dead.
Stopped reading right there.
40 years ago, you'd approach Houston through a series of small towns. The towns might have a flashing yellow, they might be big enough to rate a stoplight. From the north, you could drive through piney woods past occasional trailer parks, liquor stops, biker bars, and seedy used car lots, as you got closer. Then the ranchettes started appearing, then improved roads, then planned communities. Today, you drive into Houston on divided highways, some of them tollways. The time for me to get to Houston is at least a third less than back then.
The point is, the gradual expansion of the metropolitan area is relentless, and mostly organic. Now we have a societal shift with these data centers and technology giants, and logistical giants starting to appear. The Teslas, the Samsungs, the Amazon Logistics centers, etc etc.
Nobody's going to stop that progress. But the opposing forces have costumed themselves as being grass roots, when in truth they are being underwritten by the Soros Open Society people, the Chinese Dark Money competition, the Rockefeller and Ford foundations. The people that are against American growth, not the citizens. I think this is the updated front to the same NGO supporting underwriters that previously funded the waves of illegal immigration, the BLM riots, the Black Block agitators, the non-charging, release-the-criminal prosecutors. This is their new war front, throttling economic growth and forcing the US to lag behind in technological advancement.
They lock the language in the closet: until they stop resisting
Times have been tough in this Ohio town ever since the woke mob shut down the old Choco Taco factory. So when local hero JD Vance promised to put in a data center, they finally had something to cheer about. But then everybody's electricity bills tripled.
I live in ruralville. Farmers and other locals hate huge subsidized solar farms that half the year (nighttime) produce no power and output the other half is subject to vagaries of weather. Snow, hail, rain, clouds, that sort of thing. And huge windmill farms, they are also universally despised. And rarely (if ever) produce their full nameplate output, and, are subject to vagaries of weather. Like no or not enough wind or too much.
Data center hate appears to be emanating from a centrally planned opposition. It's not organic. Like the idiots (all older white people, like me but ignorant) in a city that isn't going to get a data center standing on a street corner protesting both data centers and Trump. Where did they come from? Who told them to be there? Who PRINTED their professionally printed signs? Or rather, who paid to print them?
Conduction, convection, radiation. The 3 forms of heat transfer. The first two are totally interrupted by vacuum. The 3rd doesn't care. It's easier to calculate radiative heat loss in a vacuum.
RideSpaceMountain said...
"In its second hour of trading, SpaceX is priced at $175....
One son got 10 shares, another 4, at the IPO price. They're holding on to them long term.
And just think. We have $2T+ more of this nonsense coming with OpenAI and Anthropic. $4T for 3 companies that make no money.
The stock is 'worth' $63 according to Morningstar. But sure... $175 today. Nailed it.
The pump is supposed to look good on day one. That's the whole point.
Their headline findings are:
• The stock’s probably worth $63 per share, a 53 per cent discount to the $135 issue price.
• In a (metaphorical) moonshot scenario, where SpaceX pioneers orbital data centers and captures 20% of AI computing capacity by 2040, the company would be worth $1.97T, or $154 per share.
• Morningstar assigns only a 7% per cent chance of the moonshot scenario happening.
• For Starlink, Morningstar estimates the global market to be worth about $129b, which is rather less SpaceX’s estimate of $1.6T. “Technical constraints and unit economics limit the business primarily to lower-density markets,” it says.
Here’s a link to the full note on SpaceX valuation:
https://d1e00ek4ebabms.cloudfront.net/production/uploaded-files/OneSmallStepForSpaceX_060826-1ff7873c-8c12-4540-b45a-60f3a9051851.pdf
And here’s its note on Starlink market sizing: https://d1e00ek4ebabms.cloudfront.net/production/uploaded-files/Our_Realistic_Starlink_Market_Sizing-915d25bb-5968-4e1f-ae0b-ad5999a9aa87.pdf
Space cadets and attached bankers, do please tell us in the comments what Morningstar gets wrong.
"She even pled the 5th when asked her name."
"Is that the ActBlue exec who was testifying to Congress?"
Yep, and her name was on the placard in front of her. It's a circus.
https://www.amazon.com/Solar-Power-Satellites-Wiley-Praxis-Technology/dp/047196817X
Solar Power Satellites, first popularized by Peter Glaser. Looking at the used price on Amazon I'm going to have to rummage through some book boxes and see if I can find my copy...
The wacko left will oppose them the moment Elon drops launch cost to where they would be feasible. Birds and planes would have to fly through the microwaves being beamed down- at incredibly low power density. Really low. The rectennas would be huge- as in 3-5 miles diameter, and further from the equator the more ovoid they would be. One big difference between SPS ground stations and photovoltaic farms? The ground underneath can be farmed or grazed, with no harm to to the animals or plants or rectenna overhead. And power production could be 24/7, with power received from whichever SPS station is passing within range.
The L5 Society, later the National Space Society, was a big proponent of SPS back in the day. I let my membership lapse a few years back.
Data centers. Back in the day (15-20 years ago) my corporation funded internal research to figure out how to reduce power requirements to operate a center. Before the research the rule of thumb in planning the power requirements for a new data center had been to calculate the power requirements to operate the equipment, and then double it to cover the power requirements for cooling.
I was not personally involved in this research project, but I knew many of the people who were, so I sort of knew what they were doing. I know they had some wins, but I don’t know whether they’d got the ratio of power needed to run the hardware versus power to cool the hardware down to 60/40 or even 55/45, but I know they made at least some progress.
The lead researcher was very bright but fancied himself a biker dude. There was a phone conference scheduled for after business hours on a Friday evening with corporate brass, and he dialed into it drunk (or so I was told) and proceeded to rip a new butt hole in his Sector President with corporate officers on the line. Monday morning when he arrived at the office he was met by an HR rep and an armed security officer, given a box to remove personal effects from his office. His laptop was collected, he was escorted from the building, and that was the end of the project.
Democrats need viable organs. Transition therapy. Throw another baby on the barbie.
"4,000 Current and Former SpaceX Employees Become Millionaires After IPO, Including Cafeteria Workers"
The girls on the view say that the world's first trillionaire is a dummy. He faced near certain bankruptcy in 2008, and couldn't convince anyone good to be his chief rocket engineer, so he took the job himself. What, was Joy Behar too busy?
I purchased shares of SpaceX today - Morgan Stanley was able to accommodate it's clients at 45% of registered orders. Fidelity was accepting registered orders for everyone with more than $2,000 in their account and I'd guess they prorated the sales in a similar way. I am disappointed that I won't get a stock certificate with a picture of a rocket on it - my stepmother had one for RCA with a radio- but I expect additional value on a long term hold. Starlink will have a few billion users in time and as the cost of lift into space declines there will be many opportunities including space data, space manufacturing and space transport. This assumes the left's culture of intimidation and assassination is controlled. If not, my loss of investment will probably be the least of my problems as an elderly Jew.
"Jane Fonda to Host Event to Counter Trump’s UFC Freedom 250 White House Event"
Word on the street is that she plans to man an anti-aircraft gun and shoot down the Air Force Thunderbirds and the Navy Blue Angels without reloading. Then, go up against the UFC match with a workout dance routine for seniors. Fierce courage!
Goldman Sachs notes that AI infrastructure alone is driving about 50% of S&P 500 earnings growth in 2026. Strip out AI and energy, and the rest of the market grows at roughly zero.
Averages are becoming useless. The market is riding on a narrow tail of winners — classic sign of late-cycle concentration.
I'm playing the counter bet by investing in Hank Johnson's new IPO that plans to turn Guam into a giant rochet launching system that uses the island's inherent instability to slingshot rockets into space. Jasmine Crocket is being lauded as the chief engineer and spokesperson. Governors JB Pritzker and Chris Christie have been rumored to be involved in launches with the new secret technology.
The new undisclosed Guam based technology is code-named T-TER-TOT-R.
"The market is riding on a narrow tail of winners."
Like Elon Musk is with his limited portfolio, or any WNBA team that's willing let Caitlin Clark play her game.
SpaceX signs $30bn deal to lease computing capacity to Google ~ FT
Every major AI player is clamoring for capacity. SpaceX is renting out theirs. It really casts significant further doubt on the Goldman analysis, if a significant part of the balance sheet is leasing this capacity out.
I think it’s more a symptom of decades of easy monetary policy and the enormous amounts of liquidity still sloshing around the system. If crypto with no intrinsic value still has a multi-trillion dollar market cap, why not have a conglomerate of half baked pipe dreams valued at a few trillions.
I think it's quite appropriate to repeatedly point out that SpaceX will never be worth its current market cap. It takes about 5 minutes of financial analysis to prove this out. SpaceX did $19B in revenue last year, mostly from Starlink. There is no scenario where any of the SpaceX lines of business grows into the IPO valuation, even collectively.
"At ~40x earnings (or higher multiples relative to some estimates), critics questioned if (Google) was overvalued post-dot-com bubble. There were worries about competition (e.g., from Yahoo, Microsoft), sustainability of search/ad revenue, and whether Google could maintain growth or independence as a public company.
Google proved the doubters wrong spectacularly. The stock has risen dramatically (thousands of percent since IPO, with market cap now in the trillions), turning early investors into massive winners despite the high starting valuation.
This fits a common pattern with successful tech IPOs: high initial skepticism around "overvaluation" or business durability, followed by strong growth that far exceeds early market caps. Similar doubts have appeared with later high-profile IPOs. In short, yes—plenty of people questioned whether Google would live up to (or meaningfully exceed) its IPO valuation."
I too think the SpaceX valuation is pretty damned high, but doing the impossible is kind of what Musk and his people do for a living.
You know who REALLY hates data centers? The Chinese. They dole out a lot of money to baizuo. I suspect that if members of Congress were required to wear their sponsors logos like a NASCAR drivers, you'd see a lot of foreign flags, with the Chinese right there at the top. The Chinese want to win the AI race, and they are not above sabotaging American AI companies with astroturfed opposition to data centers in America. You know where data centers don't get protested against? In China.
'If' I were to be a buyer -- I'd look at SpaceX in 6 months when it comes back down to earth.
Like I said before, somebody seems to have a lot invested in the prospect of SpaceX failing, and they seem to be spending a lot of effort trying to paint a negative picture, and it seems to be less in the spirit of public interest, and more in a rather focused, desperate need to prove something.
If you don't think it's a good investment, you shouldn't put your money into it. But why all the drama? Why the long posts? Why the arm waving? Seems a little overdone - maybe it's paid influencing. I think Althouse readers expect a better crafted, more convincing variety, though. It's pretty likely that there won't be any peggable outcome for quite some time.
The Althouse commentariat has correctly predicted 500
of the last two recessions…
Remember all that talk, not necessarily here, of Elon and his crazy pipe dream of acquiring X all on his own? Tee hee…
'KKKak/Richsockpuppet/ paidActbluetrollaccount(TM)
"I were to be a buyer -- I'd look at SpaceX in 6 months when it comes back down to earth."
What does that even have to with anything with the subject of the forum? What does that have to do with democrats and their rapist Swawell, or their Nazi Maine Kampf rapist Platner?
Apparently KKak thinks he is democrat's paid latest incarnation of Lord Haw Haw.
Come on, people don't hate data centers THAT much, only demented greenies and right wing Luddites.
In any case, 5-10 years from now Musk will have put them all in orbit running on solar power.
I remember when I was covering Global Crossing as a young HY analyst in the late 90s and companies were buying and selling capacity. It really feels the same now.
“And it also helps the Chinese dominate us economically and militarily which is another plus.”
Sorry, but no. Iran was armed with $Billion$ of Chinese arms, traded for Iranian crude. And much of it was obliterated during the first day of kinetic action, without scratching the paint on US and Israeli equipment. The Chinese war goods looked good on paper, but in reality turned out to be shoddy, and technologically inferior. And their military is probably no better. It’s totally unblooded. They have seen occasional border skirmishes with the Indians, an embarrassing war with Vietnam, and over 70 years ago fought us in Korea. The US, on the other side, really hasn’t gone even a decade without fighting, somewhere in the world, since 1942. In the Army, at least, it’s hard to get stars without having had time under fire. Our military is run, esp now, by warriors. The Chinese military is run by political brownnosers.
But what the ChiComs are good at is propaganda- like the statement I was responding to. And we have seen, with our little tiff in Iran, that their talking points are eagerly, and instantly, picked up by the DEM/MSM media. Why is that? Because much of the opposition is pro-Chinese because it is anti-American. And, yes, much of it is funded by the Chinese.
The point though is that you can often tell what the ChiComs are worried about, by what the DEM/MSM are pushing. They don’t want data centers in space, because the Chinese don’t effectively compete in that space.
Anybody who was a good or even adequate analyst in the 90's should be worth many many millions today. Few were and fewer are.
Leora said...
And it also helps the Chinese dominate us economically and militarily which is another plus.
They don't.
And yet here they are on CNBC, still charging $99/month for newsletters. Turns out 'good analyst' and 'quietly rich' are two different careers.
"Anybody who was a good or even adequate analyst in the 90's should be worth many many millions today."
And those who weren't buy their groceries by posting their master's scripts on influential blogs.
lefty troll kak-a-bitch is suffering from Musk's wild success.
Hombre said:
"Democrats count on the veil of ignorance of these voters as their policies ravage the working class and the black community. This veil is expected to keep certain segments of society loyal even as Democrats destroy them: the working class, blacks, more recently Jews and yes, even women."
6/12/26, 10:55 AM
...
So Democrats want to go back to dial up internet? You have to decide if you want AI cat videos or just plain internet without the bells and whistles, you can't have both. Who's running the DNC? Kamala Harris?
Michael, where are you quoting John Robb from? The article Althkuse is referring to has a different author, and there is no mention of Robb in it.
Gee, it would be so much more effective if she mentioned, with civility, anything other than Blacks (note the honorarium capitol B), or a women (small letters, designating relative contempt), and then, far worse, "white dudes wearing Carhardts," as if they're feral beasts. Way to unite, that piece of prejudiced scum. Any man of any race aligning themselves with such crap is either a black racist or a white castrato.
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