Federal prosecutors in Washington sought and failed on Tuesday to secure an indictment against six Democratic lawmakers who posted a video this fall that enraged President Trump by reminding active-duty members of the military and intelligence community that they were obligated to refuse illegal orders, four people familiar with the matter said. It was remarkable that the U.S. attorney’s office in Washington — led by Jeanine Pirro, a longtime ally of Mr. Trump’s — authorized prosecutors to go into a grand jury and ask for an indictment of the six members of Congress, all of whom had served in the military or the nation’s spy agencies. But it was even more remarkable that a group of ordinary citizens sitting on the grand jury in Federal District Court in Washington forcefully rejected Mr. Trump’s bid to label their expression of dissent as a criminal act warranting prosecution.
I agree that it was remarkable (and awful) to seek this indictment. It was an ugly abnormality that needs to be rejected. But what the grand jury did was — or should be — the norm.
You know what this made me think of? This post from 2010:
Someone in the comments questioned my use of quotation marks around "heroic father," but I absolutely meant to do that. I said the father "behaved instinctively and even if he thought about [it, he did] pretty much all the only thing he could do to avoid a life of terrible pain and shame if the girl had died after he let her fall in.."
The grand jury was like the father. Not remarkable. Normal.
పోస్ట్లు
144 కామెంట్లు:
I don’t think that anything about this is normal.
Fuck the anti-American media and their version of democracy.
I agree that they did not commit any crime. Kelley violated the UCMJ, and that remains to be adjudicated.
However, they should be mocked and vilified for that performance.
A DC Grand Jury did not bring back an indictment against Democrats. What else would you expect?
That's quite a connection to make, but yes, that father was not heroic, he was normal. The story was sensationalizing the event.
I don't know enough about the laws around military readiness to know if these people should have been charged, but what they did was gross and at a minimum they should face public sanction. It was shameful, even if not illegal.
These vile dems chose their words carefully. Sure - the indictment seeking was a waste of time - but it does not change the fact that these dems are a-holes.
A DC jury cannot, it seems in fact, indict a ham sandwich.
I don’t understand why this was sought. Kelley should, however, be accountable under the UCMJ
Everyone involved had to know there was no chance of an indictment from a D.C. grand jury.
Republicans followed Democrats too far?
Trump and bondi need to pick their battles.
Meanwhile these same people would put half the country in reeducation camps for the crime of voting for Trump.
You actually don't know if the father was being heroic or not. Many people are terrified of water for good reason.
Likewise, you don't know if the grand jury was intimidated by a vengeful litigious power hungry Deep State whom joyfully murders people for disagreeing with out of control police state tactics.
Radar detectors (remember those?) stayed legal because they literally remind you to obey the law. I guess so do asshole Democrat congresscritters. CC, JSM
so it is normal for elected officials to encourage the military to refuse orders.
Its also normal for doctors and lawyers to state, as a matter of law and science, that men are women.
It's normal for elected officials to praise riots, to encourage violence against federal officials.
normal in bizarro world.
We used to understand that leftist ideology was a threat to our way of life. a serious threat to America.
It's normal now to celebrate those who wish to destroy us.
DC grand juries have not been "normal" at all since Judge Boasberg was put in charge of the GJ system.
The Grand Jury did the right thing.
While what the Dems said was a calculated stab at Trump - it was also carefully worded.
Trump and Company wasted their time.
But what the grand jury did was — or should be — the norm.
I agree it should be the norm, but I suspect if the party affiliations were reversed, the finding by the jury would also have been the opposite and I think we will see my suspicion born out if the Dems regain power.
It is far from remarkable that a DC grand jury rubber-stamps leftist desires.
Democrats skating in DC? Yes, that is the norm.
The new normal is unprecedented. That means it hasn't happened ever, which is not normal.
Pirro should be impeached simply for attempting to secure indictments against members of Congress for their protected speech.
Her incompetence is actually serving a useful purpose right now—it helps neutralize her malevolence.
I'm fine with not normal if it's better than normal, but if it's not better, it's dumb and dangerous.
Boyd: "I think we will see my suspicion born out if the Dems regain power."
Yes, I can see it now: R congresscritters reminding police that they "mustn't arrest people who haven't done anything wrong. Doing so would violate multiple civil rights laws along with ordinary criminal statutes. No, don't arrest people unless they have actually committed crimes."
The D US Attorney would quickly seek an indictment for inciting civil rights violations, aggravated insurrection, lese-majeste, or whatever else she can throw at the wall. And a DC GJ would true-bill it. CC, JSM
The Congressional leadership should have addressed this incident … firmly.
Oh, wait, I forgot. We have no Congressional leadership,
Never mind.
Just the facts, Ma'am;
"Two sources who were briefed on the matter told CBS News the Justice Department sought to charge the lawmakers under a criminal statute known as 18 U.S.C. § 2387.
That law threatens a 10-year maximum prison sentence for anybody who "advises, counsels, urges, or in any manner causes or attempts to cause insubordination, disloyalty, mutiny, or refusal of duty by any member of the military." It requires intent to "interfere with, impair, or influence the loyalty, morale, or discipline of the military."
All six Democrats publicly condemned the move and applauded the grand jury. "
I would say, that they may well have violated the law, and the law is almost certainly unconstitutional. The jury may have agreed with me, which would mean that this is "jury nullification".
I am a little surprised that the defendants weren't more eager to have their day in court. Not a lot surprised, but a little.
DC Grand Juries indicted people for being present at the Capital on Jan 6 2020, but didn't commit any crimes.
So much for DC Grand Juries.
I'm also a bit surprised that it is apparently perfectly legal to urge disobedience to some specific order, as long as you aren't trying to undermine obedience generally. But most likely, there are other laws for that. No shortage of laws.
I'm fine with them not indicting, but we all know that there would have been indictments if the the parties were reversed, and unfortunately, that's known as "normal".
I don't think the congress critters should have been indicted, but lets be clear about what they were really trying to do. I've been in the army and you get plenty of training on not obeying illegal orders, which mostly amounts to teaching soldiers about the Geneva convention. Don't shoot prisoners, don't shoot people trying to surrender, don't beat on people trying to get info from them, speed prisoners to the rear as quickly as possible where the intelligence guys will glean info and keep them as safe as possible while doing so. Don't shoot civilians, don't steal from civilians, etc. A lot of the training is role playing with some playing an officer using euphemisms like "we don't have time for prisoners, take care of them" and you "refusing" the order by asking for clarification.
What the six congress critters were doing was threatening higher ups in the military and intelligence services. "You cooperate with the bad orange man and when we get back in power we will find a way to punish you for it, including charging you with crimes." And considering what they have inflicted on Trump and members of his prior administration its a credible threat.
It is because the Times does not trust their readers to evaluate straight news reporting on its own merits. They need to be nudged into the correct interpretations and opinions. This has become systemic at the Times, particularly in the headlines. It also reflects the intelligence and education of its readers.
"Not remarkable. Normal." True. Dems protecting Dems, serving Dem interests in blue jurisdictions, is not remarkable.
Democrats are traitors. They skirt the law and run right up to the edge and always their goal is to subvert the freedoms of other people and steal money from taxpayers.
They are acting in bad faith at every level.
They are allowed to act this way because of moral cowards like Ann and the fuck Desantis wing Republicans.
Some people just don’t care about freedom and trust in society as much as they care about what other people think about them.
I like how auto correct changed cuck to fuck.
"Peachy said...
Trump and bondi need to pick their battles."
They did, Trump - battles anything and everything. Bondi - the battle to keep her job.
This is like reading a review of a play about political theater, whereby the critic condemns the second act, but can't get enough of the first and third.
Ron Winkleheimer said...
I don't think the congress critters should have been indicted, but lets be clear about what they were really trying to do.
Muh Principles!
Democrats censored you when they got the chance.
They tried to kill your political leaders and they have thrown the people who fight for you in jail.
They killed Charlie Kirk in broad daylight.
And here everyone is whining and moaning about how uncouth Trump is.
This is pathetic. Everyone knows that Washington DC is full of traitors and thieves and they accept the lawlessness of the entire district because they don’t want to face a fraction of the heat Trump has to face every day.
You people don’t deserve freedom and you deserve to be ruled by someone like Joe Biden.
our Professor said:
.."I agree that it was remarkable (and awful) to seek this indictment. It was an ugly abnormality that needs to be rejected"..
kinda makes you (me) wonder what she would have thought, if republicans had encouraged the US ARMY to rise up and go to war against the O'Bama Admin?
Of course.. That would have been "different".. Because!!
I'm fine with them not indicting, but we all know that there would have been indictments if the the parties were reversed, and unfortunately, that's known as "normal".
I love when bagoh20 tells us, without any kind of evidence, what we "all know".
If his bullshit were anywhere near reality, Trump would be in jail instead of president.
I wouldn't have voted to indict but I know this for certain- had the party labels been reversed this grand jury would have voted to indict. It is nigh impossible to indict a Democrat politician using a D.C. grand jury.
Peachy said...
The Grand Jury did the right thing.
While what the Dems said was a calculated stab at Trump - it was also carefully worded.
Trump and Company wasted their time.
Of course. Utterly predictable and pathetic.
Trump is also a racist according to these people.
They are so much better than Trump and his supporters that they would never do anything that would make the beautiful people unhappy. The media might say they are as racist as the deplorables.
I love when bagoh20 tells us, without any kind of evidence, what we "all know".
All the evidence anyone with an IQ in the triple digits needs, Fredo, is to see what happened to the vast majority of the January 6th "criminals". They got the full taste of what juries made up of D.C. residents are capable. But, you wouldn't be called Fredo if you actually paid attention to evidence.
It could be "remarkable" was used because Gran Juries usually rubber stamp in these cases as the burden of proof to Govt. is just Probable Cause. A quick search on AI showed that Grand Juries only refused to indict 11 out of 162,000 cases in 2010. That's a very small fraction.
What’s normal is to indict Trump then try and kill him.
A DC jury isn’t going indict Democrats. It’s a company town.
@Achilles
"Muh Principles!"
It isn't a matter of principles, its a matter of tactics. They wouldn't have been able to get an indictment even if the congress critter came right out and stated that orders from the bad orange man need to be subverted and disobeyed because he is the bad orange man. So now we have headlines that are used to reinforce the propaganda that the bad orange man is a bad orange wanna be dictator.
Yes they push insurrection but its ok when they do it like innaugural day 2017
Yancey Ward said...
I wouldn't have voted to indict but I know this for certain- had the party labels been reversed this grand jury would have voted to indict. It is nigh impossible to indict a Democrat politician using a D.C. grand jury.
It is a good thing there are people like Rudy Giuliani who will go to jail then right?
Does it make you feel good to bend the knee to the traitors and scum? You sure made Freder and Kak’s day with your post.
When will you people support the people who are actually fighting for you against the traitors and murderous scum?
"A quick search on AI showed that Grand Juries only refused to indict 11 out of 162,000 cases in 2010. That's a very small fraction."
Taking the number for granted, one must assume prosecutors know when and when not to ask for an indictment from a jury made of a particular pool of residents. The Trump DoJ violated this condition- asked for an indictment that had zero chances of being handed down- literally zero chances.
What stands out to me is this line: " a group of ordinary citizens sitting on the grand jury in Federal District Court in Washington forcefully rejected Mr. Trump’s bid". Specifically the word "forcefully". As a reader, I want to know what made this a "forceful" rejection? Or is every grand jury non-inditement "forceful"? Its small words like that which are added for no reason that show the bias of the author and degrade the article as a whole.
These deceitful dems crafted their little carefully worded military bomblet and ran it by legal - and the word "IF" bought them a get out of jail card.
"When will you people support the people who are actually fighting for you against the traitors and murderous scum?"
I do support the people fighting for me. That doesn't mean I have to agree with every move they make. Some stuff is a waste of time, some is counter productive. I hear that hundreds, perhaps thousands of "protesters" in Minnesota are being arrested and charged with various crimes. Great! I hope they are following the money trail as well. You are never going to get an indictment of a D congress critter in DC, so every man hour spent on that was wasted. Man hours are a limited resource. They should be spent in the most productive way possible.
Ron Winkleheimer said...
@Achilles
"Muh Principles!"
It isn't a matter of principles, its a matter of tactics.
Trump is fighting degenerate evil murderous scum.
He is also fighting the hanky sniffing do gooders.
None of this gets better until judge Boasberg is arrested. But you people attack him when he charges seditious shitheads with sedition.
Trump is showing that he is willing to fight. Your ire should be directed to the evil people who live in DC and Boasberg in particular.
But instead the lilliputins on both sides are going after Trump.
Achilles - you're a simple minded idiot. Go play with Candy Ass and shut the fuck up.
Anyone who could not see the was a vindictive charge brought by the man baby in the oval office is jaded beyond repair, There is no sense doing a tit for tat as you can never graft a new idea on a closed mind. This was so obviously bogus I decided to place a wager on this FAIL weeks ago, The Right wing Judge hearing the other part of the case will make his decision known supposedly today, icing the complete vindication of this bogus charge, I would not be surprised if Judge reprimands trumps lawyer Pirro for bad faith filing, malicious prosecution and a vexatious litigant. Maybe even a right wing Judge will see thru this sham case. I told my right compatriot I wagered with to keep the wager and to use his head when making bets on a group that he idolizes rather than using his head ,research the issues and stay away from FOX entertainment program and an admin that is a proven fabricator of any truth .
Fredo, what cave have you lived in for the last 10 years? What President has ever been treated as bad as Trump? Spying, lying to FISA court, fake intelligence, intelligence community openly lying to influence an election, endless indictments, advisors jailed, supporters by the thousands investigated and jailed, impeached twice, shot. This was all done to a democratically elected President. Is that "normal"? Is that right?
We are now two countries. Us vs. them. Is anyone surprised by this outcome. Us vs. them. You can predict any judicial outcome in dark blue states.
The Power Line site was conservative, albeit not hard core. That has changed. Based in Minneapolis they have moved hard right.
John Hinderaker from Power Line ended his latest column with this: “ What possible basis for a common citizenship is there, between us and them? I don’t think there is one.”
Stunning admission.
"As a reader, I want to know what made this a "forceful" rejection? Or is every grand jury non-inditement "forceful"? Its small words like that which are added for no reason that show the bias of the author and degrade the article as a whole."
Any halfway decent editor would have had that "forcefully" removed, unless they were in on the propaganda.
In line with Mark @ 1059, "[...] that enraged President Trump by reminding [...]". Was he enraged? What evidence do that have that he was enraged vice angry, upset, or even generally ambivalent? Is it plausible that he calmly considered this a potential opportunity to attack opponents?
Enraged, Forcefully...NYT trying to WAPO itself
You know who the biggest obstacle to the SAVE ACT in DC is?
Mitch McConnell.
Mitch has principles too. They always seem to be an excuse to let seditious traitors be seditious traitors. At some point you people will have to figure out that 30% of the country is willing to kill you and throw you in prison and if they succeed in doing that to Trump your favorite desantis wing republican with a perfumed hanky is next.
"But instead the lilliputins on both sides are going after Trump."
Once again, disagreeing with a tactic isn't the same as "going after Trump." If Trump starts arresting judges then the GOPe will gladly work with the Dems to remove him from office.
"At some point you people will have to figure out that 30% of the country is willing to kill you and throw you in prison"
I know that, which makes it even more imperative to fight intelligently.
It's not remarkable that a grand jury drawn from a pool that is 90-95% Democratic would deny an effort to indict 6 Democratic politicians.
Serious legal question: don’t you have venue anywhere the message was received? Couldn’t they have found an airman in Idaho to say he saw the ad and was all ready to refuse orders until his NCOIC talked him out of it? And then just get an indictment there?
Or heck, find a state with an analogous state statute about inviting their Guardsmen, find a Guardsman who watched the ad, and indict in state court. If states can supposedly lock up ICEmen for insufficient gentility, surely they can indict congresscritters for subverting their militias? CC, JSM
"Trump and bondi need to pick their battles."
I agree, and now those Democrats can treat the "no true bill" as vindication for what they did. It probably would have been better to just leave it in the court of public opinion.
Humperdink said...
John Hinderaker from Power Line ended his latest column with this: “ What possible basis for a common citizenship is there, between us and them? I don’t think there is one.”
Stunning admission.
I got banned from Powerline in 2012 for telling everyone exactly who Mitt Romney was. Back then they had some turd DC lawyer who finally got kicked off the blog a few years later for his nevertrump bullshit. Powerline is a a blog for flatworm level Romney republican insight.
If Powerline blog is figuring it out there is hope for us.
Bleh - agreed.
The public was on Trump's side on this one. The dems looked terrible. but now the media(D) jason crow /mark kelly boo hoo media-Dem tour begins.
I still hold out hope that the all the former military dems who signed off on this stunt can be punished financially.
It would be nice to see less of the 'republicans' 'democrats' 'trump' as the instigators and victims, and instead focus on the acts - we have become too polarized into thinking 'they deserved it' based simply on the political affiliation, or who they are (in relation to political affiliation).
While there is a 'story' in "Trump went after Democrats", for a lot of people, the story ends there, and the details are irrelevant.
Ron Winkleheimer said...
"At some point you people will have to figure out that 30% of the country is willing to kill you and throw you in prison"
I know that, which makes it even more imperative to fight intelligently.
Those 6 senators committed treason and sedition.
They imported foreign soldiers and they paid them with tax money they took from us.
They put out video propaganda to weaken our military.
Every effort must be put forward to fight these people. There need to be more prosecutions not less.
The new normal is Democrats indicting, arresting, and killing Republicans.
The new normal is leftist DAs and Judges freeing murderers and rapists, who go on to kill again.
When Trump does what is accepted practice in leftist law fare, he is called out, right away.
The left wants us dead, or in camps. The left wants us silenced, banned, and suffering.
It's two separate countries, and yes it is a civil war.
Our side just hasn't decided too fight back yet.
"Equal justice under the law" is and always has been a pretty lie taught to schoolchildren. It isn't true and never has been. This is just another example. Call it Grand Jury Nullification - DC juries seldom vote against Democrats.
It’s A-Okay to throw sandwiches at law enforcement, too…
Democrat elite do not get indicted or convicted in D.C. Having said that, this attempt was out of line anyway. The midterms will go better if Trump and his people stop behaving and speaking like Democrats.
“If a kingdom is divided against itself, that kingdom cannot stand” Toast. We’re toast!
hombre said...
Democrat elite do not get indicted or convicted in D.C. Having said that, this attempt was out of line anyway. The midterms will go better if Trump and his people stop behaving and speaking like Democrats.
What was out of line? Trump charged people who committed sedition with sedition.
You people keep trying to treat these senator’s words like they exist in a vacuum.
They imported foreign soldiers.
They paid foreign soldier money they took from taxpayers.
They burned American flags with foreign soldiers in our streets.
They conspired with the biggest corporations to censor leading republicans.
They danced in the streets when Kirk was shot in broad daylight.
They committed open conspiracy for every previous act in this post.
You people want to lose.
Like trying to get an Alabama jury to indict klan members in 1920. Not going to happen.
Congressional representatives are not ham sandwiches. Duly noted.
What these Dems did was a sick stunt. My opinion of them and their stunt could not get any lower.
That said - they used careful language to keep them above a threshold. Specifically with the use of the word "If".
Again - battle spaces should be what we can win.
It is unclear why Trump and the DOJ are not in a deep dive (and perhaps they are) into the corruption under Gavin Newsum and Tim Walz. Billions of Tax Payer dollars lost to fraud. Billions and billions.
The entire D-leadership of MN should be indicted and it should be a slam dunk.
What was out of line? Trump charged people who committed sedition with sedition.
You realize that this statement contains the answer. Trump cannot charge anyone. To believe that Trump can charge people with crimes is ignoring the purpose of the constitution.
If his bullshit were anywhere near reality, Trump would be in jail instead of president.
Yeah, can you imagine the uproar if the Democrats had sought indictments of Trump and his associates for political purposes. That would be outrageous.
Oh wait.
And essayli will probably move on it, when the possum senators confirm him
Ordinary citizens selected from a biased pool
Achilles, you’re losing here.
It’s good to see push back from conservatives to Achilles’ outlandish assertions of what is sedition, of who deserves Constitutional protections…AS IF Achilles is someone who expresses opinions not based in his own extremism. Achilles will scold and pressure conservatives here to see the world as he does, it’s not working. It’s refreshing to see conservatives reject him and his unAmerican and unConstitutional “plans” for this Country.
All the evidence anyone with an IQ in the triple digits needs, Fredo, is to see what happened to the vast majority of the January 6th "criminals".
Weren't all of the January 6th criminals pardoned (even if they were on tape beating up cops)?
What President has ever been treated as bad as Trump? Spying, lying to FISA court, fake intelligence, intelligence community openly lying to influence an election, endless indictments, advisors jailed, supporters by the thousands investigated and jailed, impeached twice, shot. This was all done to a democratically elected President. Is that "normal"? Is that right?
To which I would respond which president has ignored the constitution, or committed more crimes (including trying to nullify the 2020 election) than Trump? Trump got away with all the shit he pulled because, if anything, the DOJ dragged their feet and let him run out the clock. Having his lackey in Florida in charge of judging the most easily proved (retention of classified documents) case let him get away with it.
And the idea that either of the shooters who targeted Trump were recruited by (shit I don't know who, make something up) is just bullshit. They were just two deluded lone actors who were able to get guns way too easily.
All the evidence anyone with an IQ in the triple digits needs, Fredo, is to see what happened to the vast majority of the January 6th "criminals".
Weren't all of the January 6th criminals pardoned (even if they were on tape beating up cops)?
Do you really think we are that stupid, Freder?
Google AI: As of early 2025, the average prison sentence for January 6th Capitol riot defendants is nearly two years, with over 1,300 years in total prison time handed down to more than 650 defendants. Sentences vary significantly, from probation to over 20 years for top seditious conspiracy convictions.
Key Sentence Data:
Average Sentence: Nearly 2 years (approx. 24 months).
Average for Guilty Pleas: Roughly 2.5 years (30 months).
Average for Convicted at Trial: Approximately 5 years (60 months).
Longest Sentences: Several individuals received 10 to 22 years for charges like seditious conspiracy and assaulting police officers.
Total Scope: Over 1,300 years in prison, 1,100 years of probation, and 1,100 years of supervised release have been imposed.
While many defendants received lighter sentences or probation for misdemeanors, those who committed violent acts or held leadership roles in groups like the Proud Boys and Oath Keepers received substantially longer, multi-year sentences.
Minn. Media Has Another Banner 'Journalism' Day Spinning ICE's Arrest of a Meth Dealer – Twitchy https://share.google/wwCQPAQNrUpPxWJmv
Do you really think we are that stupid, Freder?
You mean they are still in jail?
It took a blanket pardon
As with the j20 rioters
Democratic incitement to insurrection brayed from positions of authority. Sequester them at planned politicianhood and don't spare the f... fanfare.
’But it was even more remarkable that a group of ordinary citizens sitting on the grand jury in Federal District Court in Washington…’
Yes, remarkable that a group of ordinary democrats living in D.C. didn’t return a true bill on their fellow democrats.
After years of hearing about "lawfare," we find out that Trumptards *love* lawfare (but only when Gestapo does it). It hits different when the Gestapo does it.
@Achilles
The battlefield is as it is. What should be done and what can be done don't always intersect. And sometimes what can be done needs to be done quietly so that the enemy doesn't know what you know.
"After years of hearing about "lawfare," we find out that Trumptards *love* lawfare"
Your side set the rules. It never occurred to you that we might follow them? Achilles is correct that "muh principles" is bullshit.
Inga said...
Achilles, you’re losing here.
It’s good to see push back from conservatives to Achilles’ outlandish assertions of what is sedition, of who deserves Constitutional protections…
There you go Peachy, Ron, Yancy, and the rest of you
She wants you censored or dead. She has never cared about constitutional rights unless she could use them as a weapon to take your freedom from you. She cheered when Trump was banned from the internet and dances when conservatives are killed.
Inga supports importing foreign soldiers and burning American flags with them and she supports when they attack ICE and NG. You are giving this traitor the support she needs.
I hope your handkerchiefs are properly perfumed.
Kurt Schlichter
@KurtSchlichter
·
1h
2/11/26 - The Grand Jury Joke
The Trump DOJ went to a DC grand jury to try to indict the six jerks who did the *wink wink* thing about "only trying to tell troops about their legal rights* and the GJ refused to indict. I guess this is a huge slam against the Trump DOJ...oh wait, it's not.
Grand juries almost always indict - there's no defense presented, and the standard is low. But the jury pool in DC is 93% Democrat. DC jurors indicted every single J6 person (and the judges helped the process with obnoxious decisions). There are groups out there encouraging them not to indict (or convict at trial) any Democrat. It's all a scam, yet another abuse of the system designed to keep Republicans from exercising the power they earned at the ballot box.
Don't fall for the okey-doke. This is not about DOJ incompetence. It is about politics. Everyone absolutely knows that if these were six Republicans doing the same thing to a Democrat admin, they would have been indicted. In fact, not a single leftist gloating about it has denied it. It's a pure power move by the left. Hey, if they want to change the rules...
They already tried 4 times to frame Trump - note that Democrat grand juries (and one red state GJ) were happy to comply. The idea that this reflects anything other than pure partisanship is a joke. But I think that if this continues, no one will be laughing when it plays out.
https://x.com/KurtSchlichter/status/2021631550547484886?s=20
Ron Winkleheimer said...
"After years of hearing about "lawfare," we find out that Trumptards *love* lawfare"
Your side set the rules. It never occurred to you that we might follow them? Achilles is correct that "muh principles" is bullshit.
Pick a side. They are not following the rules. If you pretend the law protects you from them despite years of them attacking us you are just stupid. You are the same people that said Trump should drop out and we should nominate Desantis because he was acceptable to democrats.
You are either helping democrats or you are helping us.
One of us is going to win.
You aren’t better than us because you refuse to fight evil.
"You aren’t better than us because you refuse to fight evil."
I'm not refusing to fight evil, as Sun Tzu said, "Being pissed off is not a plan." Was it "refusing to fight evil" when the Allies attacked North Africa when the US entered WWII instead of going directly to Normandy and assaulting the beaches on December 12th? Or was it "refusing to fight evil" when MacArthur, faced by overwhelming force, evacuated from the Philippines, vowing to be back? Strategy and tactics are shaped by the situation we find ourselves in, not by what we wish it to be.
“There you go Peachy, Ron, Yancy, and the rest of you.”
Maybe these conservatives (and many more) don’t hear the voices in your head that only sing to you.
the dems have been practicing lawfare for 50 years, they openly backed what became islamic state, 20 years ago, alonong with al queda
when we secure an indictment lke habba and halligan did, the possums made it impossible for them to convict the protected members of the swamp like james and comey,
they protect terrorists and rapists, murderers and drug dealers,
corrupt public officials who have been stealing and protecting their brethren,
So anyway, we can disagree on how best to achieve a goal without denouncing anyone who doesn't agree with us on how to achieve it as insufficiently enthusiastic and a traitor to the cause. If I thought that attempting to indict the congress critters would help achieve the goal I would have been all for it. Its not a matter of civility, I just don't think it helps achieve the goal.
In addition, I have supported Trump since he announced his bid for the nomination in 2015. Voted for him every time. But that doesn't mean I have to agree with everything he says and does. Sometimes he makes mistakes.
Freder Frederson said...
"Do you really think we are that stupid, Freder?
You mean they are still in jail?"
Tell me about the Jan. 6 defendants that were jailed for years without a trial. And don't tell me to prove it because you can use google just as well as I can.
Tell me about the Jan. 6 defendants that were jailed for years without a trial.
I agree, most of them should have been free before trial. But it is your side that screams every time someone advocates even modest bail reform. Yours is the side that believes alleged criminals deserve pre-trial detention.
comandante freder takes exceptions,
what is the proper punishment for the seditious six
NYT yet again misspells "Democrat Activists" as "Ordinary Citizens"
remember the libby jury, had a post reporter, a lefty blogger, and a host of other ringers,
’I agree, most of them should have been free before trial. But it is your side that screams every time someone advocates even modest bail reform.’
Modest bail reform? That’s the issue, re: J6ers? lol
they drove seven men and woman to suicide,
’Maybe these conservatives (and many more) don’t hear the voices in your head that only sing to you.’
I hear the same things as Achilles and others. That we have different reactions and approaches to their resolution doesn’t make it voices in his head, sung only to him.
same with the Stevens jury, a motley collection of denizens from the star wars cantina, that convicted sans need of evidence
Democratic precedents selectively enforced isn't novel, not a green expectation, but a progressive recession. That said, all's fair in lust and abortion.
What is remarkable (and awful) is that 6 sitting members of Congress attempted to instigate a mutiny while covering their asses with weasel words.
Leftists vilify the ordinary, mock the commonplace, and make the abnormal "normal". It's part of fundamentally transforming a healthy, functioning society into the kind of dystopian hellhole that welcomes leftist revolution.
Anyone know what the specific charge was? I don't imagine the proposed indictment is public.
From: will no one abort these troublesone "burdens", to: will no one deny these inconvenient orders. Subtle progression, passive aggression.
A Whitmer conspiracy revisited? Plausible and probable in the wake of the Pelosi-rrection and Democratic Planned lawfare... hood to deny civil rights in witch hunts and warlock trials. Throw another fetus on the barbie, it's over? Maybe, baby, not.
One of Churchill's secretaries, John "Jock" Colville told of saying "The way the Thames winds is extraordinary." Churchill corrected him by saying it was was extraordinary at all, but it was "remarkable."
It has been said that you can indict a ham sandwich, the bar is so low. I guess that only applies in DC if the sandwich is Republican.
What is remarkable (and awful) is that 6 sitting members of Congress attempted to instigate a mutiny while covering their asses with weasel words.
Oh, I don't know... Was the willingness of these 6 members of Congress to get some airman or sailor or soldier to face mutiny charges in order to pat themselves on the back about Trump a rarity on the left? Because the organizers of the Minneapolis protests, including (of course) the teachers who, we are always assured, only ever think of The Children, have been ginning up kids' enthusiasm for placing their own young bodies between ICE agents and illegal immigrants. And giving the kids whistles so they can get those ICE agents properly stressed out.
The left often seems willing to put innocents into harm's potential way in order to create good - that is, terrible - press for their side. I don't find it remarkable at all.
OT: In CO - ugly and vile Jenna Griswold(D) - who lives on MSNBC - is refusing to cooperate with the federal government on election integrity.
I love when bagoh20 tells us, without any kind of evidence, what we "all know".
Yeah. That's your territory.
Jamie - how is your knee?
Also - Excellent 4:12 post.
Knee is coming along, thank you for asking! (Which means the nerve block is wearing off and it hurts like heck, but it hurts in a way that already feels temporary, unlike the way it was hurting before yesterday, so I'll take it!)
Sleeping last night was like sleeping in the back row of economy class on a transatlantic flight... but I know that's temporary too.
What are you people so afraid of. Of course our military personnel are expected to not obey unlawful orders. The context was Trump's threats to militarize Democrat cities. Given was subsequently happened with the ICE murders of innocent protestors, this reminder was totally justified.
So between the reminder that troops have agency against rogue commanders, the standing down of ICE in Minneapolis and the grand jury action, Mission Accomplished. The system is working.
Bondi just got her ass handed to her by Massie.
Kash Patel committed clear and obvious perjury when he told congress under oath that there was no child sex trafficking in the Epstein files.
You all are probably right. Bondi probably sandbagged the attempt to indict the seditious shitheads.
Patel and Bondi are still employed. This is despicable. They are absolute failures in every possible way and it looks like Patel belongs in jail. Bondi is his boss so she is probably complicit.
Trump is just too nice to do this job properly.
Howard said...
What are you people so afraid of. Of course our military personnel are expected to not obey unlawful orders. The context was Trump's threats to militarize Democrat cities. Given was subsequently happened with the ICE murders of innocent protestors, this reminder was totally justified.
So between the reminder that troops have agency against rogue commanders, the standing down of ICE in Minneapolis and the grand jury action, Mission Accomplished. The system is working.
The system is democrats importing cheap labor for corporate oligarchs and foreign foot soldiers for their color revolution.
Of course it is working. Gotta keep those working class wages low.
That way we can afford all those bullshit DEI/HR jobs for women to sit in air conditioned comfort. Democrats get their rich white women to vote for them and they get poor illegals who depress wages to vote for them.
I don't think that Trump or Bondi or Pirro were under any illusions as to the prospects for a successful indictment or prosecution in DC, notwithstanding the rather clear facial violation of a somewhat constitutionally dubious federal statute (especially after the Comey shenanigans). They were fulfilling a political obligation to take action. Had they done nothing a substantial portion of their base would have been very unhappy. And the rejection by the DC jury reinforces the political talking (and selling) point that DC remains a partisan Democrat "swamp," against which Trump is fighting the good fight.
Jamie - Your attitude will help you thru.
Howard said:
" The context was Trump's threats to militarize Democrat cities. "
uh - no.
Democrats act like little hitlers all day and night.
but - The assumption is Trump and his admin are all "Rogue commanders"
toss off.
Why does the Trump Administration try to do this stuff in Blue States/Blue regions? Its not going to work. I am sure the Don Lemon thing will fail too.
thomas Massie is a child. and a fraud.
“I'd like to think it's totally normal”
There are many things we’d like to think that just aren’t true.
he has been dissapointing lately
I lived in or around the District of Columbia for 47 years. This was a DC jury and the defendants are leading Democrat politicians. Pardon my cynicism, but it would be amazing to me had the grand jury returned a true bill. Ergo, it’s normal, if not for the reason Althouse thinks.
Note that Senator Kelly may yet find himself in legal jeopardy because he is technically still under the UCMJ.
@Jamie (4:36), great attitude! Good luck.
So do I have this correct? Six former intelligence or military members followed the exact plan the CIA uses to destabilize and delegitimize foreign governments against the sitting president of the US. Yep, nothing to see here. Move along.
I'm beginning to think America's justice system has been corrupted by Democrats. Normal? The Democrats indicted Trump for something NO ONE had ever been indicted for, except for one other Republican. Democrat Hillary Clinton paid a nominal fine for a similar but more egregious violation. Normal?
I would like to know what remarkable looks like.
From an article in Reason,
“ Speaking of obstruction, there is a fascinating article in the New York Times Magazine by James Rosen, titled "The Secret History of the Deep State." He reveals seven pages of never-before-seen grand jury testimony from 1975 between former-President Nixon and WSPF prosecutors. The story is very long, and I cannot do justice to it in a single post.
The biggest takeaway is that an Navy enlisted man, Yeoman Charles Radford, who worked in the White House, was a mole. No, not for the Soviets, but for the Joint Chiefs of Staff. He would routinely make copies of documents from Nixon administration officials and share them with people in the Pentagon. Radford would pilfer documents from Henry Kissinger and Alexander Haig and make copies of them.
Selected to accompany General Haig, Kissinger's deputy, on trips to Vietnam and Cambodia, Radford deployed all his gifts for theft, including raiding the general's briefcase. According to "Silent Coup," Radford turned over "a huge government envelope overflowing with hundreds of pages of documents." . . .
In June 1971, having received superlative reviews from General Haig, Radford was chosen to accompany Kissinger on a tour of Asian capitals. On a stopover in Pakistan, the accompanying press were told falsely that Kissinger had fallen ill; in fact, he flew secretly to Beijing to finalize Nixon's trip. "Don't get caught," warned Radford's direct supervisor, Adm. Robert Welander, ahead of his departure. Once again, the yeoman snatched every document within reach, including rifling Kissinger's briefcase. Radford collected so much material that he enlisted a contact at the embassy in New Delhi to ship it back to the Pentagon via secure diplomatic pouch.
The purpose of this espionage was to check the incumbent president from taking actions that the deep state opposed. You have to read through a lot of background to get to this shocking takeaway. Here is the key excerpt, where Nixon reveals to the prosecutors about the deep state "can of worms":
That's when Nixon warned the prosecutors not to open "that can of worms," adding, "There is even more, because [Radford] not only ——"
Ruth, the lead prosecutor, interjected: "We are not opening it up."
"Yeoman Radford was not only there," the ex-president persisted, "but he was a direct channel to the Joint Chiefs of Staff."
There it was, finally — the secret Nixon had sought to keep under wraps: It was not the far left that most actively sought to sabotage the Nixon-Kissinger foreign policy but the hard right, not lowly pencil-pushers in the civil service but the most senior commanders at the Pentagon.
The prosecutors had heard enough. They did not want Nixon to elaborate. Jay Horowitz, the last questioner, cut in.
"Sir, if I might take us back now to ——"
Nixon would not be deterred.
"This indicates to the members of the grand jury, if I might address them for a moment, why it is that" the Radford project "had to be top secret." He added: "Particularly, I didn't want the Joint Chiefs of Staff involved."
JIM - this case is not the best example - but you are correct. The democrats have corrupted our courts.
peachy said...
JIM - this case is not the best example - but you are correct. The democrats have corrupted our courts.
2/11/26, 10:08 PM
If that's the case, AG Barbie needs to say so. Chas Martin insisting that she "nuked" the Democrats aside, this is yet another failure from her DOJ, and President Trump really needs to fill the position with someone ready to pick winnable battles. Or preferably arrest an Obamajudge, I'm good either way.
Remember, Kak and Inga and Ronald fully and enthusiastically support Democrats in government literally murdering US citizens with zero accountability. Anything happen to the people at Waco, or Ruby Ridge? The FBI agents who shot Levoy Finicum in the back? (He deserved it for protesting! shouts the left). the FBI Using an entire battalion to invade the home and kill a man who couldn't even walk in Craig Robertson. We don't even have the body cam videos released. Democrats gave medals to the guy who killed Ashley Babbit.
But if you "parade" through the People's House, staying inside the velvet ropes and passing through the doors the nice officers hold open for you, it's two years hard time with no trial and the only way out is by presidential pardon, because as all Democrats will tell you, protesting against them is a crime if possible.
Note that Inga, Kak, and the rest have not said a word about the Democrat candidates running right now on a platform of "Arrest Trump and have him executed! But never, ever use the death penalty for anyone other than Republicans!"
Vance said...
“Remember, Kak and Inga and Ronald fully and enthusiastically support Democrats in government literally murdering US citizens with zero accountability.“
My first thought would be that’s a blatant lie but to be generous, it’s more likely an unintended manufactured memory to reinforce your alternate fact world.
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