September 24, 2025

"After all, if your employer allowed you to wear open-toe shoes, it would have to allow everyone to wear open-toe shoes, and when it comes to toes, our ideas of what is acceptable tend to vary according to gender."

"'Culturally we’re more accepting of women showing a bit of skin, whether cleavage on top or at the toes,' [said Susan Scafidi, the founder of the Fashion Law Institute at Fordham University]. 'And "mandals" have never read as business attire in the U.S.' Put another way: Your peep-toe pumps may be a casualty of his fisherman sandal."


Is that really the law? Can't you require men to wear jackets and ties without requiring women to wear jackets and ties? 

I am reminded of my post from August 2010, "Can lady lawyers wear peep-toe shoes?" A discussion about peep-toe shoes in court took me back to my time working in Wall Street law firm — 1982 to 1984. Somehow it was an occasion to tell you about all the shoes I wore: "2 pairs of closed-toe T-strap Ferragamo shoes — 1 brown and 1 tan... a pair of black Bruno Magli pumps — low-heeled — that were very comfortable and useful... beautiful Perry Ellis black suede high heels with thin, buttoned straps... [and] beige Evan Picone shoes that were sling-back and — yes! — peep-toe." I said: "It never occurred to me that there was anything wrong with them. Maybe I missed a dress-for-success memo, but they were beautiful, dressy-looking shoes. They looked perfect... a quarter century ago." 

They still look perfect in my memory, a distance now of 40 years. But it never occurred to me until today to think that if they accepted women in peep-toe shoes, they'd have to accept a man in whatever sort of crazy peep-toe man's shoe might exist somewhere.

51 comments:

RideSpaceMountain said...

I've long half-joked that the corporate world should institute the services' grooming standards for both men and women because nothing would get women out of the boardroom faster than having to meet any standard at all.

It's an office, not OnlyFans.

rehajm said...

I learned at the wedding this weekend the bride does not approve of open toed shoes, grandma. Wow...

Eva Marie said...

Good comment at the NYT:
“My daughter’s first job out of college was as concierge/receptionist for a prestigious family law firm in town. They required all employees to dress like attorneys in court. Skirt or dress and cardigan or jacket with closed toe shoes for females and suits of blazer and dress pants for males with shoes. The managing partner told her that she didn’t care if they wore the same outfit everyday or bought clothes second hand as long as they followed the dress code. My daughter quickly realized that vendors respected her and thought she was running errands for the firm, any member of the firm could run paperwork in to an attorney in a court proceeding and clients were as respectful to her at 22 as they were to their 40+ year old attorney.”

Left Bank of the Charles said...

AI says men can wear Birkenstocks to the office if shorts are allowed. And if women’s skirts are allowed, don’t men’s shorts have to be allowed?

Achilles said...

Governments and courts shouldn’t be involved in shoe wear discussions between employees and employers.

Women are always going to get special treatment wherever they go. They are born with inherent value.

Until society is able to be honest about this there will be conflict.

At least until AI powered artificial wombs are created. Women are going to very stupidly cheer for this innovation. Once they lose their inherent value proposition they are going to learn what men face.

Hey Skipper said...

Sometimes I wonder if men and women might be different in some fundamental way.

Wish I had a biologist on speed dial.

Aggie said...

That sounds like a ZZTop song: "Shady Lady Lawyers wearin' Peep-Toe Shoes."

Beasts of England said...

What in the heck are those shoes on the right?!

Art in LA said...

My work career spans over 40 years now!! Yikes! Early on it was ties for the guys. Just a few years later, late '80s, "casual Fridays" became a thing, khakis and polos for us worker bees in Silicon Valley. Then "business casual" pretty much every day.

One day I thought "what do I do with all of my ties?" I decided to wear a tie on Wednesdays, what I called "reverse casual day", ha. It's Wednesday! I should break out a tie today!

RCOCEAN II said...

WHy dont we just let people wear jogging shorts and tennis shoes? All these rules are BS.

Nancy said...

Althouse, can you show us pix of your shoes from the 80s?

tcrosse said...

Why not strike a blow for gender affirmation and let men wear dresses and high heels to work? Wouldn't it be trans-phobic not to?

Leland said...

I write this while currently wearing sandals. Sandals that I purchased for a trip to Hawaii and now have become my favorite and most comfortable and practical pair of shoes. I wouldn't wear those ugly things pictured.

I think the issue if once allowed/all is allowed is a bit related to being "post-binary". After all, if you allow women to wear sandals, and anybody can be a woman if they say so, then anybody can wear sandals.

I've worked in clean rooms at KSC, oil production facilities, and flight lines. An outsider will notice people in those places uniformly wearing the same clothes as appropriate for the facility. The reality of what they were to the job site might shock some. For instance, many of the workers in the clean rooms of KSC lived their private lives as bikers in Daytona, FL. You might not tell the difference from them and a roughneck if out in a public setting. Put them in a "bunny suit" for a clean room, and the average observer would assume they have Ph.D. in astrophysics (and some do).

If you want uniformity of appearance, then provide a uniform. Most do so only when it is needed. I think younger generations are getting further away from dress codes, as they move further away from judging people on appearance.

tim maguire said...

Every company that doesn't require actual uniforms has a stricter dress code for men than for women--business attire being a much narrower category for men. It's not really a problem unless people make it a problem.

Leora said...

My boss had a background as a nurse and hospital administrator. She wouldn't tolerate open toe shoes in the office.

Randomizer said...

Appropriate dress is tricky and should be left to management to figure out. If the organization has a dress code, keep it vague. Management should have a low-key, informal method to help the person understand what is expected.

For that shoe on the right, a comment like, "You were lucky the lawn mower blade missed your toes. Since you're going to need new shoes, I can recommend the Nunn Bush cap toe Oxford. It's a good shoe for the price."

If the person doesn't take the hint, then management knows that something's wrong.

Ann Althouse said...

"Althouse, can you show us pix of your shoes from the 80s?"

The only ones I still have are the Perry Ellis

EAB said...

Yet another example of the loss of common sense in favor of narcissist silliness. A woman wearing a peep toe shoe doesn’t mean a man can wear open toe sandals. When I moved to NYC from SF around 2013, I was told the NY office didn’t allow peep toes. I wore them anyway. Low heeled wedge shoes that I had in various colors. My attitude was if young women in the office could wear very short skirts or low cut tops, I could display a bit of toe.

Evan Picone! I haven’t heard that brand in forever.

n.n said...

Equal in rights and complementary in Nature. What does it all mean? Signed, Flabbergasted.

RideSpaceMountain said...

"Equal in rights and complementary in Nature."

It means it sounds great on paper, and that's about all.

rhhardin said...

Crocs.

Marcus Bressler said...

Rules against open-toed shoes might be justified due to safety concerns (in certain businesses).

john mosby said...

And of course the woman wearing open-toed shoes in the office, most likely in the summer, will complain about how the AC is giving her frostbite. While the man in Chelsea boots just sucks up the 10 minutes of heat during his walk to and from the car.....CC, JSM

ChrisSchuon said...

"It's an office, not OnlyFans."

cc: Kristi Noem

ceowens said...

24 comments and no mention of the Roman Empire. I do not know you people anymore!

loudogblog said...

Wearing footwear that doesn't fully protect the toes from injury is asking for trouble in the workplace. It could be a legal liability issue. There's a reason why shoes evolved the way they did.

Where I worked we were required to wear steel toe, or equivalent, shoes.

Lazarus said...

The "Fashion Law Institute" sounds like some phony baloney USAID money-laundering operation, or maybe it's what you do when your parents wanted you to become a lawyer, but you live entirely for fashion.

But if they are real, where do they stand on the workplace "toe cleavage" that distracts and entices so many otherwise decent foot fetishists and causes their downfall?

MC said...

"Is that really the law? Can't you require men to wear jackets and ties without requiring women to wear jackets and ties?"

Isn't that precisely what the Bostock decision was about? A man who worked at a funeral home wanted to dress like a woman, the funeral home said, "No, you're weirding out grieving families," and Gorsuch, et al, said that was sex discrimination.

Rabel said...

Socks with sandals seems like a reasonable compromise.

Rabel said...

"My attitude was if young women in the office could wear very short skirts or low cut tops, I could display a bit of toe."

Pics?

dbp said...

I used to wear Birkenstocks at work all the time--I got some looks, but nobody ever told me I couldn't wear them. For a lot of the year, I would come in with boots, because of the weather and didn't want to clunk around in boots all day, so I would slip-on the sandals, with nice-looking socks. After a lunch-time workout, usually jogging, I would wear the sandals barefoot, since I was still overheated for a while.
If I had to go to a lab or meet with customers, I would put on normal shoes for that. Between sandals, running shoes, boots and normal shoes, I had a pretty decent collection under my desk.

Anthony said...

I for one think men should not wear sandals of any kind in public unless they're pool-/beach-side. Mainly because men tend to have ugly feet. Especially old men. Pairing with socks just looks dumb.

All MO of course.

buwaya said...

In the 80's and 90's, different employers, I was required to wear coat and tie, even on factory floors or service yards. With a hardhat.
In 2001 this changed when our manager took to wearing shorts and sandals and a ponytail. And a hardhat.

Christy said...

I regret I must admit, I was used as an example for years in safety training of what not to wear on one's feet at a power plant. I was there to discuss a design issue not expecting to leave the offices and my laced, heeled sandals were very pretty. (I was young and, ok, stupid.) I ended up crawling around the bowels of the facility, climbed over a safety rail and jumped to the catwalk below landing on an 8" bolt sticking straight up. Took a chunk out of my foot, but because it was past working hours and I wasn't assigned to that facility, No lost time accident!

The Cracker Emcee Refulgent said...

“It's not really a problem unless people make it a problem.”

Bingo! Which is why I say “keep it professional” and let them figure out what that means. Among normal people, uncertainty usually moves folks to aim for the high end. The person that can’t be bothered probably can’t be bothered to do a lot of things.

Skeptical Voter said...

Well open toed shoes, and mandals and Birkestocks may be okay in Manhattan---but down in Muskogee Oklahoma USA "Beads and Roman Sandals won't be seen". There's more Muskogee in this world than Manhattan, thank goodness.

boatbuilder said...

Would those things on the right be OK if worn with white cotton ankle socks? Just askin'.

RideSpaceMountain said...

ceowens said, "24 comments and no mention of the Roman Empire. I do not know you people anymore!"

The footwear of Roman Legionaries were known as caliga, and a little known fact is that was the genesis of Caesar Augustus Germanicus' cognomen, Caligula, due to his childhood fondness (likely influenced by his impressively martial father) for wearing roman soldier's uniform custom made for him.

His fondness for them had disappeared by the time he put on his toga virilis, along with his fondness for the name.

Kirk Parker said...

"Equal in rights and complementary in Nature."

See, this is why I think n.n. is a bot, not a human: stock words, stock phrases, entire stock sentences... Over and over again in various combination.

When actual meaning occurs, it's only a random accident.

The Cracker Emcee Refulgent said...

n.n.is the Beat poet of the Althouse commentariat.

tcrosse said...

As an octogenarian I choose to wear sandals with socks, to soothe my hurty feet. If sandals were good enough for Jesus, they're good enough for me.

Richard Dolan said...

"A discussion about peep-toe shoes in court took me back to my time working in Wall Street law firm — 1982 to 1984."

So, was S&C just catching up with the world, or was it ahead of the pack? Back around that time, ST&B was still a bit fussy about how men dressed (on the first day, the managing partner explained to us that the pants will match the jacket -- one guy from Indiana being a bit clueless on that score), but much less fussy about how the smaller contingent of women dressed.

Gospace said...

Leland said...
... I think younger generations are getting further away from dress codes, as they move further away from judging people on appearance.


You're deluding yourself if you think younger people are moving away from judging people on appearance. They can identify drug dealers based on appearance- just as we could in the 70's. And the non-tattooed are judgmental of the tattooed. And piercings? Yeah- where they're visible serves as a warning signal. As does purple hair...

Suits and ties? Still impress. But common now only in professions where other clothing is actually more functional. Suits and ties on construction sites can be dangerous- especially ties.

KellyM said...

I worked high-end boutique retail in the late 80s/early 90s, and we had a strict dress code: suit and tie for the men, skirt suits or modest dresses for the women. No trousers or flats allowed – a two-inch heel was the standard. When I moved on to office work I started in a small tech company with barely a dress code – at least for the engineers. Jeans and a collared shirt were the norm, and occasionally Birkenstocks snuck in in place of sneakers or oxfords. The administrative/executive side of the company still required proper work dress. One Friday I mistakenly wore jeans rather than casual trousers and got an earful.

Dress code requirements seem to be all over the map these days, what with the whole work from home bit and Millennials/Zoomers who were never really schooled on proper attire etiquette. No one knows what to do. I’ve seen it lead to garish workday outfits that were bordering on club-wear, or outdoor REI gear on the men which in some cases had seen better days.

n.n said...

RideSpaceMountain, exactly. It is literary offal with the intention to cause digestive disorders that will force you to take a knee to the modern modality of the day for capital and consensus reaped by an means necessary. We normalize a favorable juxtaposition of the sexes with ordered cause. The people who feign confusion or disaste are few and far between harboring ulterior motives.

Craig Mc said...

Open toed footwear is a real or imagined safety issue to employers. That's why it's not allowed.

Craig Mc said...

There's no point making engineers wear collars, ties and suits. They will always look like crap because they're the masters of minimal plausible compliance, and they intrinsically hate those things.

le Douanier said...

"I've been told that a lawprof shouldn't wear sandals, but I've often worn sandals teaching."

:)

Art in LA said...

@Craig MC, in the old days, engineers (including me) wore collared shirts and ties, along with a pocket protector to keep pens, etc. In the movie "Falling Down", Michael Douglas' character is a laid off defense worker/engineer and he's got a collared shirt on with tie and pocket protector. The movie was set in the early 1990s. That's a classic enginerd look!!

Mason G said...

The engineering look where I work is Levis/Wranglers and a work shirt of some sort. Carhartt is popular. Ties? Never.

JK Brown said...

I ran into this in the late '90s working a research ship. Rule was no sleeveless shirts on the mess deck during meals. So an older engineer wore a shirt with the sleeves removed he wore working in the engineroom. Complaints from the scientific party. Not unreasonable, as it was unattractive. But they didn't like the rule being enforced equally for men and women. The young female scientists complained, I told them to blame feminism and to put on sleeves for meals. We didn't even complain if someone walked through, just if they were sitting down.

Post a Comment

Please use the comments forum to respond to the post. Don't fight with each other. Be substantive... or interesting... or funny. Comments should go up immediately... unless you're commenting on a post older than 2 days. Then you have to wait for us to moderate you through. It's also possible to get shunted into spam by the machine. We try to keep an eye on that and release the miscaught good stuff. We do delete some comments, but not for viewpoint... for bad faith.