Hulyo 30, 2025
"We banned assault weapons, but our laws only go so far when an AR-15 can be obtained in a state with weak gun laws and brought into New York to commit mass murder."
Said New York Governor Kathy Hochul, quoted in "Even New York’s Strict Gun Laws Couldn’t Prevent the Midtown Shooting" (NYT).
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68 komento:
this makes NO SENSE!
this was a GUN FREE ZONE!
no gun COULD have 'brought into' the zone, it would have been ILLEGAL!
this ENTIRE THING could NOT have happened,
it would have Violated the gun free zone law!!
Gee Kathy maybe you should extrapolate that out to the Big Picture and see that most "gun control" laws do not in fact control the guns. Not at all. They just deny law-abiding citizens their God-given right to self-defense. But under all that, the reason "gun laws" don't work in the real world is Progressive policies: dismissing misdemeanor and low-level felony gun crimes if the perp is a minority in Blue City, no-cash bail when people do get charged with gun crimes, extraordinarily vicious application of low-level possession or use charges when the "perp" is actually defending themself against career democrat criminals.
Rather than cancel a law which is admittedly useless, double down, by insisting that every other state copy your useless law.
That's the kind of first-class noggin-using we've come to expect from NY politicians.
"You can't fight here, this is the war room."
How many out-of-state gun transporters are stopped and ticketed in NY and NYC? How many well-armed street gangs are raided and disarmed every month?
These aren't rhetorical questions. Hochul has laws she could "faithfully enforce" to keep her state safe. Is she doing so? Does she regret letting lawlessness reign so freely that a guy can walk around Manhattan with a long rifle clearly visible?
It's all theater.
We banned murder, but our laws only go so far....
Your big mistake was failing to outlaw murder. Because that would have prevented murder.
Why don't they pass a law outlawing really hot weather?
You beat me to it, Althouse.
Red state governor: "We banned abortion, but our laws only go so far when an abortion can be obtained in a state with weak fetus protection laws."
…with an open border guns can be obtained from any other nation and brought into New York…
cliche alert: "School shootings always happen in gun-free zones."
To state the obvious, by this logic the only solution is to return mankind to a state preceding his ability to craft and produce gunpowder or weapons like guns, as well as the ability to travel long distances.
This, in a nation without the state capacity to (fill blank with your choice).
While I think we are currently in a state of flux where as wokeness recedes more people are going to reveal their actual cultural preferences, even before this time period I think gun rights were one of the few areas that the right was successful in winning over the culture. Back in the 80's and 90's when gun rights were first becoming liberalized with conceal carry permits there were numerous Op-Eds predicting blood in the streets as minor traffic accidents would turn into homicides. That never happened. And as more and more people bought their own firearms they become unwilling to give them up themself. Also even if folks believed Governor Hochul's premise that strict gun control laws prevent crime, which I don't think there is good data to support, her argument can also be used against gun control laws because it points out how futile they are at the State or local level. There is a similar futility argument against even national carbon control laws, when other countries are more than willing to burn fossil fuels so they can have a growing economy.
Another loser Democratic position. The second amendment isn't going away. Deal with that reality. In a way, this is on the gun grabbers. If the left wasn't consistently trying to eliminate all gun rights, maybe the right would be open to some sensible regulations that would increase gun safety and identity folks whom are unqualified to keep and bear arms. A Well Regulated Militia, after all, is Necessary to the Security of a Free State.
Given it's hard-wired into the Constitution, I don't understand how state and local gun laws are not a violation of the interstate commerce clause.
Ann Althouse said...
"We banned murder, but our laws only go so far...."
CLEARLY, what We Need, is Another law;
this new law, will make it a CRIME, to violate existing laws!
SEE? once we enact this new law, it will be ILLEGAL to break the law..
so ALL CRIME will cease to occur
If our gun laws don't control guns, and our murder laws don't stop murder, then what we really oughta do is get rid of the cops altogether. Then we just won't see any of these problems anymore, amirite?
Don't forget to vote for the super-wealthy, inexperienced Socialist candidate folks, then all of your problems will be over, plus you'll have that great feeling when you wake up.
I think gilbar may have something there.
Maj Toure is an interesting guy when it comes to defending the 2nd amendment. Black Guns Matter... and white guns, too. Maj is an equal opportunity gun rights advocate - among other things.
"We banned assault weapons" she says.
But they did not. They banned New Yorkers from owning them. Recent lower court rulings have said that a legally acquired gun cannot be denied entry to a state with laws against that weapon, because it denies the gun owner of their 2nd Amendment rights. Same with private property. Gun rights have been evolving towards the plain interpretation of the 2A lately, thankfully. So it's not even clear to me if the perp was in fact illegally in possession of the AR. The mayor's weird comments about "parts" having been purchased by a third person are irrelevant but more of the "magical thinking" type of laws Leftists try and impose on us.
As someone once famously said: The root cause of crime is criminals. Yet we never hear the call for more criminal control in blue cities or states. Indeed, the most advanced among us work to make life more convenient for criminals. It's the guns, completely disconnected from the criminals wielding them, that are the source of crime.
Apparently, this guy didn’t ‘obtain’ the rifle; he assembled it.
- Krumhorn
The UK seems to be testing pre-crime laws by policing speech, since their laws against murder and rape only go so far [apparently in allowing immigrants to commit those acts and residents to complain about it].
The preferred assault weapons are double-edged scalpels, machetes, and other renewable bladed weapons of mass abortion, a particular, peculiar preference of DEIsts and progressive-minded liberals of left-wing blocs.
See the problem is, he used a gun. If he had pushed people onto the subway track or soaked them with lighter fluid and burned them to death, then it would be fine so long as no one was foolish enough to stop the murderous act.
An AR-15 is not an "assault rifle"
You can make a submachinegun with just a lathe and few tools... The British STEN subgun was very cheap and easy to make... and, of course, a pump shotgun, sawed off, is legal in ALL 50 STATES... you don't need a AR to commit mass murder...
But liberals don't see it that way... they want to take your guns.. one at a time via classification and incrementalization!!!
If the murderer had been carrying a concealed handgun, he would have been far likelier to have done even worse damage.
cliche alert: "School shootings always happen in gun-free zones."
We should ban schools. Problem solved.
By definition, criminals are people who don’t obey the law. Mentally ill people quite often break the law as well. It’s nothing short of magical thinking to believe that enacting yet another gun control law will get criminals and the mentally ill to stop using guns. Murder is against the law everywhere and yet it still happens. As for the weak argument that if guns were outlawed everywhere, then criminals wouldn’t have access, explain how drugs are smuggled into the country every day.
Is anyone else wondering how a guy can walk about in upscale Manhattan with an openly-carried semiautomatic rifle and no one called it in to the police?
Walking around NYC with a weapon? OMG- or maybe not.
Been a while since I've been walking there. In the early '80s I had no trouble walking the streets transporting two drill rifles with bayonets. Had a heckuva time catching a cab. Did catch one- and driver turned out to be cousin of someone I went to HS in suburban NJ with. Small world syndrome- everyone in my family suffers from it.
Also discovered that weekend that if you walk through a crowd with a buddy and you're both in full dress with swords- the crowd melts away in front of you and reassembles as you pass. You're not impeded in any way.
New Yorkers are inured to all kinds of oddities walking around. A long gun? So what? He's not shooting it or waving it around, is he? They'll react to that.
Criminal control is the problem. The People are not opposed to criminal control. The elite are. Most of us are perfectly happy with capital punishment laws- gets rid of the criminal. The laws need to be reformed so all death sentences are carried out within a year. Or even 5 months. No reason for endless appeals. And three strike laws? Expanded and carried out. If you remember- I do- the first criminals sentenced to life for that 3rd strike were hand picked by prosecutors for relatively minor 3rd crimes- like, for example, kiting a check, and another one- stealing a slice (or maybe slices) of pizza from some outside diners. They thought the public would be outraged that someone got life imprisonment for -STEALING PZZA SLICES! Turns out- the public did care- they were fully in support. A 3rd strike is a third strike. And in each case, accompanied by a few dozen misdemeanors in addition to the 3rd felony. Some of the public- like, for example, me, would be happy with a 3rd strike death penalty... or a 10th misdemeanor death penalty. If you cannot learn to live within the rules- no reason to keep you around.
Well, why haven't they passed a law against murder?
NYPD are still under de-policing conditions. I wonder how many officers saw the bad guy buy didn't see him. Midtown during rush hour should have a lot of foot posts = I think that is the 17. And a lot of officers showed up really fast once the Officer Down and Active Shooter calls went out. So chances are high someone was already close by.
I also would like to see the tape of the gun battle between the offender and PO Islam. I wonder if his training made the PO hesitate, thinking of the dire consequences of being wrong. Now his family has NYPD and PBA insurance, plus whatever collection his blue brothers and sisters worldwide took up. Had he shot and been wrong, he'd have nothing and no way to earn more.
Not blaming the victims - blaming the regime that doubly victimizes them.
Archangel Michael/ميكائيل, patron of police, pray for our brother Didanul and all who emulate you by standing the community and the enemy/ شَيْطَان
RR
JSM
"Well, why haven't they passed a law against murder?"
It wouldn't do any good unless all the other states did it too.
why haven't they passed a law against murder?
That would be the logical next step.
So its my shotguns fault I suck at skeet.
Is anyone else wondering how a guy can walk about in upscale Manhattan with an openly-carried semiautomatic rifle
Are you suggesting a Whitmer-conspiracy to entrap? An Obama-era gun runner to force American Civil Liberties Unburdened? A Pelosi-rrection in the breach? A noose, a phobia, and me, too. The audacity to think people will take a knee.
... to take a knee. To voluntarily prosecute selective-child policy, perform a human rite, a wicked solution? What is this, China? Not even there.
Killer not deterred by NYC parking laws. Avoided walking far to the building by just double parking outside.
Muzzie cops. Another reason to avoid NYC.
"and, of course, a pump shotgun, sawed off, is legal in ALL 50 STATES..."
@Paul, I am having trouble squaring the above quote with what I know about regulation of shotguns. See, e.g., "Sawed-off Shotgun Laws – by State".
Narr: I might agree, but historically police forces have been a good way for immigrant groups to assimilate. Think of how the Irish went from subhuman status to the core of the urban middle class.
Expose people to Anglo-American justice and logic, give them a salary they can buy a house with, and you coopt them into the culture.
Course a lot of it depends on whether the people running the system actually want to preserve it.
RR
JSM
Fred Drinkwater said...
An AR-15 is not an "assault rifle".
Indeed it is not. But Hochul used the term “assault weapon” which is a made up term by the gun grabbers based primarily upon superficial characteristics. It was made up to blur the differences between assault rifles and non-assault rifles so that a ban on the former can be extended to the latter.
Strange how criminals don't follow "strict gun laws."
Well, like the Governor, in the blue states, we all can just pick n' choose what laws we want to obey. She and her Democrats buddies have decided they wont obey the immigration or drug laws. Others don't want to follow the gun laws. Sads.
"Hey its the guns" is just a rhetorical defense used by the Left, to not do anything about crime. You'd think people would've picked up on that, but I guess not.
A better term is military style semiautomatic rifle in which the fully automatic version is used in assaulting the enemy.
I can sort of see the appeal of gun control laws (though I'm against them). After all (using myself as an example), there was a law (actually a regulation on the Air Force base where my school was located, which some may recall was in England, with Gahrie) against having and/or using pot when I was in later high school, as well as a reg against purchase and consumption of alcohol by under-21s who were not active duty. Because of those regs, I neither tried pot nor drank in high school - I had no idea how to acquire either substance, since doing so would have meant a foray into the soft camo underbelly of the base.
Which gets to the heart of the problem. I didn't know how to acquire pot or booze because I didn't hang around with the young GIs who would happily have acquired either one for me. But those regs certainly didn't stop the GIs from either gaining access or giving (or selling) the illicit substances to high school kids (especially girls). And many of the high school boys did their own research and likewise had no problem.
So - if the person putting forth the gun control law is a person like me, who is not inclined to try to overcome the practical obstacles that a law sets up (out of fear, guilt, morals, or whatever), then that person might well believe that such a law would indeed deter gun crimes. So the question, I suppose, is how many opportunistic, almost "accidental" gun crimes are committed by people who wouldn't ever try to circumvent a gun law but when overcome by anger while the gun is sitting there, would actually pick it up and use it.
That's the scenario the gun control advocates always say happens all the time. But does it?
Kathy Hochul Loogie
Jamie, that is an interesting question. I would say that rule followers, who won’t do the often simple things needed to get a prohibited item, are probably the type of people who won’t go ape even if the prohibited item is available.
It reminds me of a gun-rights cliche: Switzerland and Japan both have low crime rates. Switzerland has very loose gun laws. Japan has very strict gun laws. If the two countries exchanged their gun laws, they would both still have low crime rates.
Because it’s not the laws keeping them from murdering people, it’s the culture.
RR
JSM
"and, of course, a pump shotgun, sawed off, is legal in ALL 50 STATES..." (commenter at 8:52 a.m.)
I'm pretty sure that is not true. My comment to that effect, posted but then disappeared. Is that a thing that is happening now?
John Mosby said;
"I also would like to see the tape of the gun battle between the offender and PO Islam.
In a gun battle, unless the opponents are 10 ft or less apart, the long gun will always win.
Exactly! That’s the message for you lefties who particularly despise Amendment Two, isn’t it Kathy?
Expect more soon under Mandami. A politician is a gun aimed at someone.
And I have an AR-15. From my deceased brother. Far too powerful for me to use, unless I have to.
Local Yokel Hochul.
William51: “ In a gun battle, unless the opponents are 10 ft or less apart, the long gun will always win.”
True (although I might quibble over the exact number of feet). But in NYC, indoors, most of your engagements are going to be at short range.
My point is less about pistol v rifle, though, and more about action vs reaction, and whether training and doctrine slowed down PO Islam’s reaction. Which would have an effect even if he was sat behind a laser-sighted Gatling gun at his guard desk.
RR
JSM
Thanks for providing an example of the rhetoric used to blur important distinctions, Howard.
The nation could have a no gun at all law and people would still get guns and kill other people.
@ Tina Trent
Have you ever fired it? They don't kick much at all. They are loud and a lot people find them pretty heavy at first.
Jsm,
It's actually not a very good question.
30 years ago it might have been, as a conjectural matter; But now we have decades of experience at bringing state and federal law into closer compliance with the Bill of Rights, and nothing in that experience shows any sign of the parade of
horribles that the detractors kept warning us against
William50, you need to up your game. Up to more like 10 yd, things are pretty even all else being equal. And if the handgun shooter has good cover to shoot from that breakeven distance goes up a bit more.
William50 said...
"In a gun battle, unless the opponents are 10 ft or less apart, the long gun will always win."
So are you saying that when a man with a .45 meets a man with a rifle ... the man with a pistol will be a dead man?
Local Wokel Yokel Hochul.
Let me second Bob Boyd's questioning. An AR is actually fairly low-powered for a rifle -- not of course as low recoiling as a 22, but still pretty modest.
If you really would consider using it in extremity, then it's not too powerful to do occasional practice with.
@ Immanuel Rant: I love that movie.
@JSM--
The world needs optimists.
Personally I'm disinclined to trust Muslims carrying guns, or even sharp objects.
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