Mr. Bannon vigorously disagrees with Mr. Musk’s support for H-1B visas, which allow high-skilled individuals to work in America. Mr. Bannon has also warned that billionaires like Mr. Musk and other tech executives — many of whom supported Democrats before backing Mr. Trump — will abandon the MAGA movement.
For the annals of Things I Asked Grok: "Is this a mixed metaphor: 'He and I have a chasm that is probably insurmountable'?" And: "I think a good writer would see the concrete images behind these words and keep things coordinated. I believe George Orwell — 'Politics and the English Language' — supports my position."
But Bannon wasn't writing. He was speaking. I don't expect a speaker to avoid subtle mixed metaphors like that. It's impossible to speak that clearly. And Bannon is an excellent speaker. I loved his long podcast with Tim Dillon a week ago:
BANNON: The Silicon valley's an apartheid state. There's no blacks or Hispanics. And the South Asians or Indians are there as indentured servants. They're working for a third to 50% less than American citizens, often in kinda horrible conditions where four or five guys to a condo and working 20 hours a day, seven days a week, because if they complain, they get the boot. Okay. It's not acceptable....
DILLON: Vivek Ramaswami says it's because Americans are lazy and watch too much TV or they're not educated....
BANNON: They have not shown me — because they all backed off coming after me on H-1B visas — I said, show me one thing: I wanna see one fucking billet, one person in any of those billets — of the millions who are here — one, show me one in that billet that has a better education or a better skill set than an American. They can't show me one, I they can't show me one. And they won't show me one. Because it doesn't exist. It has nothing to do. And when the media says high skill, these are not more, these are not high skilled. This is basically, this is basically the, the essentially the mass programmers, right? The, this, this is not, it's all about getting it cheaper for one third. Because most of the cost of these companies is in the programming. Right? Or the technicians, the, the technical aspect of it. They pay one third to 50% less. They have higher margins. They have higher stock prices get bigger, bigger. Their warrant packages worth much. The math here is not complicated. But they can't show that the H-1B visas are bringing in more educated. We have plenty of educated people in the United States. Now, people in the United States are gonna want to get paid a certain amount 'cause they're not gonna compete against the world. Number two being Americans, you got, you know, you got a little cussedness and grit.... You're gonna be vocal about what working conditiosn are. That's what it means to be American. That same grit and tenacity and getting up in people's faces is the same reason that we won World War ii. The same reason we won the Cold War.... I want a total moratorium [on H-1Bs] until we get sorted exactly what's going on.... I would shut it all down — all of it. Deport immediately.... Every job in 60 days to an American citizen. And Bob's your uncle. And we have to be this hardcore.
For the annals of Things I Asked Grok: "What is the origin and ongoing usage of the phrase 'Bob's your uncle'?" And: "Explain why Steve Bannon uses the unusual word 'billet' in this passage...."
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৪২টি মন্তব্য:
How bout you shut the fuck up, Steve.
Bannon lost his mind long ago and now fills the air with"sound and fury signifying nothing". I initially thought he was a bit of a jerk, what I think now is not fit for a family blog.
I’ll take 1/100th of an Elon over Bannon. Elon ( although the democrats have lost their effing mind ) is ONLY doing this because he loves the country and mankind.
Prof, ref billets: Bannon is an old Navy man. The sea services refer to positions in the org chart as billets, I guess because years ago they literally had to find a place to sleep for every man. The Army calls them slots, probably dating back to low-tech manning boards where you slid a little name tag into a slot to show the position was full. The civilian government calls them full time equivalents (FTEs). I don’t know what the Air Force calls them; I presume that after a hundred more years, they may call them ‘hotel rooms’ or ‘boudoirs’ based on their history of taking really good care of their people.
JSM
Steve Bannon went to jail for Donald Trump so I guess that buys him something. The thanks of a grateful nation?
Bannon says Republicans are pussies, so there's that.
"He and I have a chasm that is probably insurmountable."
300 billion worth of chasm.
I thought the H-1B visa was being fixed with Trump’s 'Gold Card.' Companies desperate for unique foreign talent—whether U.S.-educated grads or overseas hires—could snag this visa for $5 million.
They may also have an obstacle that is unbridgeable.
I've been using 'Bob's your uncle' lately. I don't know why; it's not something I've said during my life, then all of a sudden it is. I would like to know where it comes from.
"I thought the H-1B visa was being fixed with Trump’s 'Gold Card.' Companies desperate for unique foreign talent—whether U.S.-educated grads or overseas hires—could snag this visa for $5 million."
That would test Bannon's position. He's saying this foreign talent is not special. U.S. companies just want cheap labor. Cheap and uncomplaining.
I also would like to know the truth of Bannon's portrayal of H-1B sweatshops.
H1-B numbers are a huge issue. I agree it’s needs to be scaled back if we want American workers in those jobs. Once H1-B hires become managers, all they want to do is hire more H1-B from their home country. That’s not America First.
My view on the H1-B is generally the same as Bannon’s.
Shohei Ohtani is a unique foreigner who can do what Americans can’t. He also gets $70 million a year.
But Bannon stole money from MAGA people who donated to build a wall. Bannon is a scumbag grifter.
Here you have it, Original Mike’s your uncle:
https://x.com/i/grok/share/ALDNesrZX8DHj3ypBugucjfdC
I define the difference between Musk and Bannon as the difference between meritocracy and nativism.
Musk thinks anyone who comes here and works hard and contributes to the "American Dream" should be an American.
Bannon tends more towards the people born here version.
I side more on the Musk side. I would happily trade 80% of our college graduates to Mexico for the hard working blue collar men and their nuclear family units. I would also like to trade all of our Ivy league grads to India for their best engineer grads.
I would happily trade out all our lawyer and poli sci grads for physics and chem majors from pretty much anywhere.
And Steve Bannon’s your other uncle:
https://x.com/i/grok/share/Wf0ADvKtxFlvvnLt7RAYnM3it
Bannon is in the unfortunate position where everything he says can be taken in a way that is self-aggrandizing. Musk, on the other hand, is working for free while putting quite a bit on the line, every day. Whatever their actual positions and relationship might be, this is the obstacle that Bannon faces - but not Musk. Somebody has already lost.
Howard said...
Bannon says Republicans are pussies, so there's that.
Bannon isn't wrong there. Political/Laptop class Republicans are just pathetic.
For example Ron Desantis is a moral coward, stalinist, and a piece of crap.
This should humiliate anyone who supported Ron Desantis. You should feel really fucking stupid right now. It was easy to see who Ron Desantis has been from the start.
Oh, Prime Minister Robert "Bob" Gascoyne-Cecil, the 3rd Marquess of Salisbury. Got it!
Bannon: "They're working for a third to 50% less than American citizens, often in kinda horrible conditions where four or five guys to a condo and working 20 hours a day, seven days a week, because if they complain, they get the boot."
Source? This reads like one of those, "Everybody knows" and "Too good to check" statements. Of course Bannon is "preaching to the choir" so no research is required. And he's probably too busy anyway.
The Left is doing all they can to divide the right, to split off voters from the Trump coalition. This helps them.
And on the list of things that need improvement, H1B visa's don't even register.
Speaking as someone who has managed H1-B visa employees... The law's requirements for deciding if a company has adequately attempted to hire a citizen into the role are a joke. Specifically the standards for salary, and rules for stating job task requirements. Probably 95% of H1-B employees could, and should, be replaced by citizens.
An unfolds le river stands between us
Fred @ 6:02pm is right on.
Bannon was Trump’s right-hand guy until an immigrant from South Africa came along offering to do the job better and cheaper.
Steel sharpens steel.
Meade said..."And Steve Bannon’s your other uncle:"
Thanks, Meade. Sounds like it's a necessary program (" the sheer volume of H-1B approvals—over 386,000 in fiscal year 2023, with 65% in computer-related fields— … the U.S. graduates around 112,000 computer science students annually, a number insufficient to meet total demand without supplementation.") that some of the less than top-tier companies exploit to save money. A not-surprising mixed bag.
My next question would be do U.S. graduates have trouble finding work due to the competition from H-1B visa recipient?
Achilles said...
...
I would also like to trade all of our Ivy league grads to India for their best engineer grads.
I wouldn't. I've met too many Indian "engineers". They generally know less then any US Navy Class "A" school graduate. And since they bring their caste prejudices with them, refuse to learn from anyone with experience- especially those of us with real work experience in fields like wastewater management, work done only by untouchables in their home country.
Let them stay in India and improve the infrastructure there.
Hinduism and islam are both incompatible with the American ideals of equality and freedom of religion. As well as being incompatible with each other- demonstrated on the Indian subcontinent almost daily.
Meade’s your tech support!
https://x.com/i/grok/share/FagjaYKJ68IVPzCfddfE776Pf
Damn, the aether ate my laboriously crafted comment.
Shorter comment: per Meade's 5:50 link it does seem that the U.S. doesn't graduate enough workers. Do U.S. graduates have trouble finding a job because of competition from H-1B recipients?
Fowler calls it galvanic stirrings of metaphors thought to be dead.
There were a few years around 2005 with I was logging in on computers in India to do software work. There was a very long character delay, resulting in me using /bin/ed, even to this day. Visual editors were out of the question.
How to reconcile these numbers: "annual cap of 85,000 new visas" vs "volume of H-1B approvals—over 386,000 in fiscal year 2023,"?
Original Mike said...
My next question would be do U.S. graduates have trouble finding work due to the competition from H-1B visa recipient?
My experience is that it depends on management. If you get an H-1B (or former H-1B) they'll only hire H-1B's. Also, if you get an American manager who's out of their depth on a technical level you'll mostly see H-1B's working for them because they're not considered a career threat.
I've seen the H1-B thing from 2 of the 3 sides. It can be a great opportunity for college grads who don't have green cards, but they also get exploited--to the tune of 35K the last time I heard (back in 2018 or 19). That's how much of their first year's salary they had to pay to the broker who would get them the H1-B.
From the other side--that of U.S. science and technology workers--H1-B holders substantially reduce the salaries of American-born workers. Every time I point this out, people say "But salaries are excellent for programmers . . ." and mention some nephew getting 120K straight out of college. And that's great. But that 120K might be 150K if wages weren't being depressed by H1-Bs.
That means, on margin, that some portion of the people who would have wanted gone into tech will do something else- (sadly, usually MBA or law school rather than something more directly productive). Additionally, people in the technical sides of tech find that to make better money, they have to jump to management even if their hearts are in engineering. Of the 25 brothers in my fraternity in my graduating class from Carnegie Mellon who majored in STEM subjects, only 3 are still doing engineering. Huge loss of talent, but you can't blame them for wanting to make better money (when we stop paying lawyers and MBAs more than engineers, we'll get more innovation).
If there aren't enough talented, hard-working Americans to do these jobs, the solution is to increase the number of Americans in the educational pipeline. At worst you could have used H1-Bs for 4 years while you increased the number of students in key majors. It's funny how soi-disant capitalists who believe in the magic of the market and the laws of supply and demand in EVERY other aspect of human endeavor except where it comes to letting the price of labor rise high enough to draw more people into those careers.
Supporting Bannon, has everyone forgotten that Disney fired its entire IT department, include many with years of experience, to replace them all with H1b s to save money. Then Disney had the chutzpah to require the fired employees to train the newbies as a condition of receiving severance! Seemed to me that should have been a crime.
It's patently obvious that Americans who invest in getting higher education are being undercut by the flood of H1bs.
"allow high-skilled individuals to work in America."
LOL, he makes them sound like Papa Conehead, who could, with no problem, demonstrate that he had skills that no American citizen possessed, but in fact, these people are, as Prof Drout said, just keeping down the wages of American born programmers.
Globalists? Was Bannon referring to the owner of Tesla? The company that produces more than half of its vehicles in China, including those for export to Europe?
Interesting thing -- Bannon and Trump are starting to use the word -- "globalists". Who are they? America has always protected its weak industries. The US has had a 25% import duty on light trucks for as long as I can remember. That's why everybody set up plants in the US to build trucks -- Toyota, Isuzu, Hyundai, BMW etc. There companies became the biggest exporters of vehicles from the US. Why, because they are better products. Apple employed the same principle with phones, build them in China. I guess these are the globalists. Protectionism always works for a while. But eventually it leads to weak globally uncompetitive companies. Just as the US car industry is today.
Auctioning only a fixed number of H1B visas would go a long way toward allocating them to the highest productivity foreign workers.
"I initially thought he was a bit of a jerk"
He did that "build the wall" fundraiser and kept the money for himself. A scam that audacious (because it was in full view of everyone) is a giant red flag for sociopathy.
Bannon's not without a point here - Immigrants here are hired (often out of local universities) because they're cheaper than experienced candidates. What he's missing is they're also more motivated. They aspire to wealth and success and aren't shy of the work required to get them. They won't be cheaper for long.
How many Indians or Asians do you know have therapists? How many do you see at campus protests? How many do you hear conducting activism at work? You won't find that kind of self-satisfied narcissism in that demographic.
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