"... where Richard C. Visek, the acting legal adviser at the U.S. State Department, urged a 15-judge panel not to call for Israel’s immediate withdrawal from occupied Palestinian territory.... On Wednesday, Mr. Visek asked the court to uphold the 'established framework' for peace that he said U.N. bodies have agreed to — one that is contingent on a 'broader end to belligerence' against Israel — rather than heed calls by other nations for Israel’s 'unilateral and unconditional withdrawal' from occupied territories.... On Tuesday, South Africa forcefully condemned Israel’s policies against Palestinians, calling them 'a more extreme form of apartheid' the race-based system of laws that deprived Black South Africans for decades.... The United States has remained Israel’s staunchest defender internationally. But the Biden administration, under increasing pressure from parts of the Democratic Party, has also shown signs of impatience with Israel’s conduct of the war...."
The NYT reports.
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"the Biden administration, under increasing pressure from parts of the Democratic Party, has also shown signs of impatience with Israel’s conduct of the war....""
Substitute "horrifying polling data" for "parts of the Democratic Party" and you have something.
They put the Jews and the Muslims on a scale, adjusted by closeness of polling data v. swing state status, consider how faithful the two groups are as automatic D voters and ta-da.... the Jews lose.
As I wrote last October- Israel would have anywhere from 3-6 months to fight Hamas/Hezbollah before the Biden Administration turned on them.
October 7th.
Forgotten.
I'm not buying the argument that Israel's campaign against Hamas should cease because the Palestinian death toll now exceeds the 10/7 death toll. When has that ever been a rule? Did the U.S. stop attacking Japan in response to Pearl Harbor once we inflicted a commensurate level of death and destruction on Japan? No, we declared war the next day and went on to crush the Japanese, not specifically in retribution for 12/7, but to destroy Japan's ability and desire to wage war against us in the future.
War has objectives. The Press is treating Israel's ground war in Gaza as if it is about proportionate punishment - that's not war. That's playground fighting. Besides which, proportionality just encourages escalation.
The question being ignored is: What is Israel's objective and how is that objective proceeding?
If their objective is the eradication of a functional Hamas, then how is that proceeding? Are they half way there? Nearly there?
Right now the press is treating this as tit-for-tat - Hamas invaded Israel and so Israel is invading Hamas and they should be done now for no measurable reason other than "we feel it's gone on long enough."
Meanwhile Iran is pushing regional war against Israel and has continud to expand those operations.
South Africa, now there is a place that can talk about apartheid. They suffered under it for generations. Well now it is payback time and boy oh boy are they paying it back. They are starving their own in the process and wrecking what is left of their country but it is all worth the pound of flesh they are getting from the whites.
The "world" has zero right to suggest Israel do anything until Hamas returns EVERY SINGLE HOSTAGE to the last man, woman, and child. Until then so sad, too bad.
Drag-o, the village people scum half, is very angry that Biden is supporting Israel because Holocaust 2.0 is good for his Trumpian allies in Tehran and the Kremlin. It's not all bad news, the GOP has done wonders for Putin in Ukraine.
Why doesn't Hamas turn over all 100 hostages in some face saving way? The pressure on Israel would vastly increase. Hamas must think it is winning.
"The question being ignored is: What is Israel's objective and how is that objective proceeding?"
Their objective appears to be the complete eradication of the Palestinian people and society, rather than merely the subjugation which has been the status quo for years. The proceeding of this objective is...proceeding.
Joe Biden is Corrupt said: October 7. Fogotten
Correct. But to be clear, it was forgotten on October 8. Israel had not yet even responded and world media, along with 'progressive' groups were already decrying Israel's potential response, or that they should respond at all. The world loves their Jews meek, docile, and ready to be slaughtered. They don't like Jews that fight back. Hard.
This ends the day after the kidnapped, raped, and tortured are returned. But we all know they will not be. At least most of them will not be. Hamas cannot let truth come out on how the kidnapped were tortured and raped continuously. They cannot let one ounce of Global 'Progressive' support slacken one bit. Not that it would at the sight of raped Jews. It didn't on Oct. 8.
I'll repeat what I keep saying: If Hamas gave one shit about Palestinian people, they would not have done it at all. And once done, they would have returned the kidnapped before Gaza was destroyed and thousands were killed in the name of Hamas.
Barisma Chi Com Mob-Biden is a two-faced pile of excrement.
Why would Israel withdraw without their hostages returned? And their ability to do another October 7th destroyed?
The principle is straightforward: neither the aggressor who started the war nor its allies — ideological, religious, or “enemy of my enemy” — have any say in how the aggressed upon country responds.
Israel’s mistake is in conducting a slow campaign calculated to keep down civilian casualties. Don’t do that! Don’t give Hamas and the Gazans hope that they can win through international pressure as the war draws on.
Terrorists and Nazis. These are evidently vital constituents of the Democratic Party coalition. Do they really want that? Trump is going to make some epic hay from that, boy howdy.
You'd think the Resident's handlers would see that coming and vehemently disavow this NYT piece as an iniquitous rumor, but you'd be mistaken. Understandably mistaken because you assume the White House staff are intelligent, but you're mistaken there as well. This comes from abysmal ignorance of the typical Millenial/Gen Z poli-sci grad that the Dems collect like dust bunnies under a couch. Imagine FDR trying to appear evenhanded in the matter of the British Empire versus Adolf Hitler. Appalling, no?
The Allies' goal in WWII was Unconditional Surrender. This was supported by the USA despite it having suffered only trivial damage to its mainland, and only a single significant attack on any of its territory at Pearl Harbor. That attack, which lives in "infamy," was a purely military target with minimal civilian collateral damage, by uniformed and regularly constituted military forces. American response was total war, against military and civilian targets, and was highly successful in the long term, but undeniably brutal. Some people fooled around, and found out.
Israel has been attacked by an immediate neighbor, one who targeted civilians, and in violation of multiple Geneva Conventions. Hamas continues to hold hostages, and continues to hide itself in civilian settings.
It should not have to be said, let alone repeated, that the Israelis' cause is just , and that it is Hamas that bears the responsibility for however many innocent Gazan civilian casualties occur.
Unfortunately, it does have to be said, and must be repeated, until the IDF achieves its objectives, by its own definition. If that means Unconditional War until its sworn enemies agree to Unconditional Surrender, so be it.
Hamas, Gaza, and the rest of the world are finding out.
I wonder if Chalhoub was one of the history professors who rated Trump last among presidents?
The chairman of Harvard University's history department is a member of a faculty group, Harvard Faculty and Staff for Justice in Palestine, that posted an anti-Semitic cartoon over the holiday weekend depicting a hand emblazoned with the Star of David holding a noose around the necks of one black man and one Arab man. In the background, a black arm swings a machete scrawled with the phrase, "liberation movement."
The image was posted alongside a message from the faculty group arguing that blacks and Palestinians are natural allies: "African people have a profound understanding of apartheid and occupation," it read.
Several prominent members of the Harvard faculty belong to the group, including History Department chairman Sidney Chalhoub. The Brazilian historian has sparred with Harvard leadership in the wake of Hamas's Oct. 7 attack on Israel—in November, he signed a letter condemning the school's "Combating Antisemitism" initiative, which he and other signees called "dangerously one-sided."
As chair of Harvard's history department, Chalhoub "play[s] a key role in the life of the department," according to a 2022 university handbook. He is responsible for developing the department's "curricular plan"—the history classes Harvard will offer—as well as recruiting and promoting faculty and overseeing "the process for graduate student admissions." Chalhoub also resolves "departmental disputes," holds "regular department meetings and social occasions that help to build community," and monitors "tenure-track faculty," according to the handbook.
Harvard condemned the image on Monday, calling it "despicable," and the faculty group said it did not "condone" the images "in any way." Yet Faculty and Staff for Justice in Palestine circulated an amended graphic with an image of Stokely Carmichael, a Black Panther Party leader who praised Adolf Hitler in 1970 as the "greatest white man" and later complained, in a 1990 address, that "zionist pigs have been harassing us everywhere."
Chalhoub did not respond to a request for comment.
Unconditional surrender by Hamas is the only path that leads to peace for both sides. Hamas can surrender at any time before they are all forced into captivity or killed. Or Hamas can be killed off until the rest cannot fight back, and then taken captive. Hamas must be tried for its crimes against the Palestinian and Israeli people. It is solely Hamas that is the cause of continuing this war.
This is all about Michigan's 15 electoral votes. Biden needs these. The Muslim community there is prepared to withhold them. The callous math on this is: each EV is therefore worth 80 Israeli lives cruelly snuffed out on October 7th. With, in the typical Swamp fashion of spending ahead, many more to come if Hamas is not exterminated beyond the possibility of renewal.
"War is cruelty, and you cannot refine it; and those who brought war into our Country deserve all the curses and maledictions a people can pour out." - William T Sherman
I think Israel should use the words: "unconditional surrender". At least for Americans, it might clarify what is happening. Until Hamas is gone, destroyed, root and branch, this war must not end. If there are Gazan "civilians" who just want to live in peace, they can tell the IDF where to find members of Hamas (they must know where they are), or they can band together and go into Hamas' hiding places, pull the vermin out, and kick them to death in the streets. But all I see are Gazans who support the barbaric behavior that began this war. They will suffer the fate of all barbarian tribes on the borders of civilized lands. They will go the way of the Apache. Whether it is right or wrong makes no difference at this point. It just is. This is why nation states exist.
"If Hamas Islamists lay down their arms, there will be peace. If Israel lays down her arms, there will be no Israel." Old Israeli proverb.
The Al Qaeda training camps are reportedly back in Afghanistan. Biden continues to give aid to the Taliban, Iran, Hamas etc. You know, terrorists.
It doesn't seem like too much for Democrats to let him have a tiny corner of the moral high ground to support Israel's survival.
Regarding "proportionality," consider this historical fact:
When the US suffered a surprise attack by the Japanese at Pearl Harbor, a total of 2,403 Americans (68 civilian and 2,225 military) died.
By the time WW2 ended, total Japanese deaths totaled somewhere between 2.6 - 3.1 million. So about 1,000 dead Japanese for every American killed in the initial surprise attack
If you want to definitively solve a conflict, there's your historical yardstick for measuring "proportionality."
Israel isn't doing anything remotely like what the US ultimately did to Japan during the existential crisis of the 1940s.
"'a more extreme form of apartheid'"
Not that it matters, but the charge makes no sense, except of course as a tool of vilification for the Jew-haters. Arab citizens of Israel participate freely in society, and as a country Israel wants to remain apart from people who want to wipe it out. Some "apartheid."
We lose the twin towers and we go on a 20 year rampage of iraq, afghanistan, syria, egypt, libya, sudan, iran.
Israel ( by percentages ) loses orders of magnitude more people in much, much more horrific methods and they ACTUALLY attack the terrorists instead of the silver penny over there.
Yea, we have a lot of morality to share, the rest of the world just hates and has always hated the jews.
South Africa is another one that is hilarious to quote as they are literally targeting white people for confiscation.
"Blogger Tacitus said...
This is all about Michigan's 15 electoral votes. Biden needs these. The Muslim community there is prepared to withhold them. The callous math on this is: each EV is therefore worth 80 Israeli lives cruelly snuffed out on October 7th. With, in the typical Swamp fashion of spending ahead, many more to come if Hamas is not exterminated beyond the possibility of renewal."
You can never forget that the democrat party ( the minute they are elected ) work 24/7 to gain MORE political power. Everything they do is calculated to gain more political power, everything. If you keep that in mind, you always know what the long rang plan is.
Has the NYT's ever reported on the death count in Gaza, in the last month? Or detailed all the atrocities and war crimes committed by the IDF against innocent Arab civilians, both Christian and Moslem?
I don't remember them doing so. According to the Palestine Health authority the death toll of women, old men, and children stands at 29,000. How many of these are Hamas fighters? 500?
Instead of giving of details of what Israel is doing in Gaza, we get high level mumbo jumbo at the international court, made abstract and high level. You see the same NYT's propaganda technique in Ukraine. The MSM rarely shows us the human toll on Ukraine or discusses the Number of civilians killed in the breakaway republics. Instead its all emotional "rah,rah, lets give Zelensky what he needs" or childish insults hurled at Putin.
In seems the propaganda stunt regarding some obscure Russian dissident called Navalny has died down, and he'll be forgotten by next week. Reading the USA MSM is like reading Pravda.
Isn’t it too late for Biden to placate the Michiganders that are upset with him? Is he now going to have to pivot to rhetorically support Israel in order to placate the Jews in his base? He really seems to have no moral compass. Floating a two state reward was inane.
I think Israel is about to learn the historic lesson of Vietnam. Only the very pure deserve to be allies of the United States or, at any rate, of the Democrat Party. There is a significant faction who view Netenyahu with the same baleful eyes that they regarded Diem. He's just not worthy of our support.....Re unconditional surrender: That's not such a great idea. We--and by we I mean MacArthur and not New Deal Democrats--gave Japan a loophole and allowed for the Emperor's continued existence. The State Dept. people wanted him tried as a war criminal but they deferred to MacArthur's judgment. In Europe, similarly, they wanted Eisenhower to press on towards Berlin and thus assure the complete defeat of Nazi Germany. Eisenhower wisely allowed the Russians to have that honor. The Russians suffered some 100,000 casualties in their drive on Berlin.....I don't know how Israel should define victory, but they'd be damn fools to let the Dems or the UN to define the terms.
"Their objective appears to be the complete eradication of the Palestinian people ..."
Hoo boy what a crock.
Complete eradication of Palestinian people? I leave you with on acronym, MOAB. Israel could, indeed, wipe out the Palestinians with far less cost in men and materials if Cookie's fevered dreams were even close to reality.
The only good HAMAS is a dead one. Keep going Israel!!!
And FJB!
Robert Cook said...
"The question being ignored is: What is Israel's objective and how is that objective proceeding?"
Their objective appears to be the complete eradication of the Palestinian people and society, rather than merely the subjugation which has been the status quo for years. The proceeding of this objective is...proceeding”
Robert, this is both untrue and beneath you. You can do better.
By the way, have all hostages been released? Did I miss that?
They could call on the rest of Hamas to surrender.
That’s how it works in a war. You keep killing the other side until they surrender. The way to do this is to kill off their leadership. Of course, you have to be willing to accept civilian casualties. As many as it takes until the other side’s leadership surrenders or is killed.
There are about 50,000 Hamas members. Some of the underlings have been captured or killed. Some of the higher ups have been captured or killed. But the vast majority of Hamas members are still alive.
Tojo didn’t swing from the rope until after the US dropped two nukes on smaller cities.
This is all about Michigan's 15 electoral votes. Biden needs these. The Muslim community there is prepared to withhold them.
@Tacitus, + 1
The upcoming election will be where the Left discovers how well their efforts to pretend that anti-Zionism is not really antisemitism (despite abundant evidence to the contrary) are working. How well can a political party maintain a coalition that includes both Jews and people chanting “Death to Jews”?
@TreeJoe: My interpretation of Israel’s military objectives are (1) to kill or capture all or most Hamas combatants and (2) to locate, destroy and render permanently unusable the Hamas network of fortified tunnels. My best guess is that Israel is about 1/3 of the way towards each objective. Continuing the offensive to the Southern border of Gaza is essential, and that might take another few months.
Over-compensating non-combat "vet" JmHowitzer Howard: "Drag-o, the village people scum half, is very angry that Biden is supporting Israel because Holocaust 2.0 is good for his Trumpian allies in Tehran and the Kremlin. It's not all bad news, the GOP has done wonders for Putin in Ukraine."
LOL
Yeah, that's really going to make the world forget the alliance between the New Soviet Democraticals and the islamic supremacist pals.
Keep trying Howie. Since you've dug the hole that deep you've got nothing to lose tossing out more drivel!
Too funny.
The IDF estimates 15K Hamas fighters have been killed. Aprox. 3/4 of Hamas regiments destroyed. Israel knows they have to hurry and finish this.
Hamas factored in the horrific sacrifice of Gazan civilians as part of their arsenal. The more dead the better for their cause in the court of public opinion. It’s a horror that they instigated. On the other hand the flaw in their strategy imo is that if that’s how they view their own people, as pawns, why should they matter to anyone else? (Unless you are a Palestinian, or a dedicated Jew hater looking for excuses to attack Zionism) Still Hamas has succeeded in getting a lot of people on the Left screaming about genocide. That claim is absurd considering the efforts by the IDF to get civilians to evacuate combat zones.
The expectation that Israel is supposed to take better care of Gazan citizens than Hamas is really insane, but then the whole stupid plan by Hamas is insane.
Extermination of Hamas is a worthy goal.
According to the Palestine Health authority the death toll of women, old men, and children stands at 29,000
According to one side of the war.. The other side is mean and nasty!!!
Their objective appears to be the complete eradication of the Palestinian people and society, rather than merely the subjugation which has been the status quo for years.
How did that "Status quo" work out for Israel, huh?
Rosalyn C. at 1150:
"Hamas factored in the horrific sacrifice of Gazan civilians as part of their arsenal."
Hamas factored in the horrific sacrifice of Gazan civilians as much as Adm Nimitz factored in the number of fish that would die as a result of America attacking the Japanese Navy at the Battle of Midway.
Hamas is a death cult, with no regard for the lives of anyone but its own leaders.
Rosalyn C. at 1150:
"Hamas factored in the horrific sacrifice of Gazan civilians as part of their arsenal."
Hamas factored in the horrific sacrifice of Gazan civilians as much as Adm Nimitz factored in the number of fish that would die as a result of America attacking the Japanese Navy at the Battle of Midway.
Hamas is a death cult, with no regard for the lives of anyone but its own leaders.
To all you israeli supporting tough guys and keyboard warriors, stop crying about October 7th, IF anything and everything is allowed in war. I'm getting tired of you blubbering over Israeli children and women dying and then smirking and cheering when innocent Arabs are killed. Or crying over "evil putin" and turning a blind eye to genocide in Gaza.
Also, admit you don't care about war crimes, atrocities, or bombing innocent civilians. Because - according to you - "that's war baby". You seem to have no clue that your attitude conflicts with an oppostion of genocide.
To all you israeli supporting tough guys and keyboard warriors, stop crying about October 7th, IF anything and everything is allowed in war. I'm getting tired of you blubbering over Israeli children and women dying and then smirking and cheering when innocent Arabs are killed. Or crying over "evil putin" and turning a blind eye to genocide in Gaza.
Also, admit you don't care about war crimes, atrocities, or bombing innocent civilians. Because - according to you - "that's war baby". You seem to have no clue that your attitude conflicts with an oppostion of genocide.
Robert Cook:
If their goal is the total eradication of the Palestinian people, they are going about it in an extremely ineffective manner.
The population of Gaza is over 2.3 million, and they are extremely fecund. Even if we accept the Hamas-influenced numbers for deaths, which I understand hovers around 30K, that may be below the replacement rate. It would take hundreds of years to kill off a significant proportion of the population -- and that is just Gaza.
Also, if Israel was hell-bent on genocide, they could have taken out a significant proportion of Gaza's population in a few hours, using only a small fraction of its estimated nuclear arsenal.
The current privations suffered by Gaza are not even severe enough to prompt the release of the most vulnerable of hostages taken on 7 October, 2023, let alone all of them. Or even access to the hostages by the ICRC.
Nor, genetically, is there much difference between those who identify as Palestinians and other significant populations in the area. Perhaps, you could argue, Israel is trying to wipe out a culture rather than a genotype. Is that your argument?
HAMASS out of the UN!
And who will enforce the cease fire on Hamas? When do we ask them to back off?
[You] cheering when innocent Arabs are killed…
A. That didn’t happen. Show me where I’m wrong.
B. We are advocating for the complete eradication of Hamas, which is exactly what Israel has articulated as the one and only goal.
C. War is Hell. Hamas should not have started one. There was a cease fire in effect on 10/6.
D. You’re a dishonest jerk who can’t articulate an argument without lying about what those you disagree with are saying. Address the facts or fuck off.
@Blogger West TX Intermediate Crude
"Hamas factored in the horrific sacrifice of Gazan civilians as part of their arsenal." I said that because of an interview I saw with Hamas leader Khaled Mashal on Al Arabiya TV dated Oct. 19. He defends the high death rate of Gazans (he expects) as a necessary sacrifice for the sake of liberation, and compares it to many other liberation movements. The interviewer is actually asking about the otracities committed against people in Israel but Mashal clearly is talking about sacrifices by liberation movements of their own people, not the casualties of their enemy's forces. Too bad this interview didn't get the exposure it deserved.
IMO Hamas was expecting the loss of Palestinian lives as an Israeli reaction but possibly underestimated the extent to which Israel has been willing to commit to this war. Israel never wanted to enter Gaza with ground troops in the past other than very brief incursions. This time Israel's intention is to end the rule of Hamas. So perhaps Hamas was not prepared for the extent of the damage to Gaza. But as you said, they are killers who only care about themselves and their agenda.
Keyboard pacifist and scold rcocean said...
"To all you israeli supporting tough guys and keyboard warriors, stop crying about October 7th, IF anything and everything is allowed in war. I'm getting tired of you blubbering over Israeli children and women dying and then smirking and cheering when innocent Arabs are killed. Or crying over "evil putin" and turning a blind eye to genocide in Gaza."
Also, admit you don't care about war crimes, atrocities, or bombing innocent civilians. Because - according to you - "that's war baby". You seem to have no clue that your attitude conflicts with an oppostion of genocide.
*************
Yeah, that's it---there's never been any body of law called "The Laws of War". That guy Groetius just made shit up. Likewise the Geneva Conventions are just doo-doo from goo-goos--no one follows them.
All the Nazi war criminal were sent free after apologies given them at the Nuremburg tribunals.
William Calley got the Medal of Honor for My Lai, not a court-martial and prison time.
Finally, about a tenth of a percent of Gaza has died in the war. Some "genocide"!!!
SNORT
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