Writes Jonathan Weisman, in "Is Anti-Zionism Always Antisemitic? A Fraught Question for the Moment/From the halls of Congress to America’s streets and universities, a once largely academic issue has roiled national discourse, inciting accusations of bigotry and countercharges of bullying" (NYT).
"... Democrats worry that the debate is blurring the line between political speech and hate speech. Tibetans pressing for freedom from the Chinese are considered unserious or even repugnant in Beijing, just as Native American activists demanding to reclaim parts of the United States might be to the owners of that land. But are they bigoted?"
A richly researched and nuanced account of Jewish life in stressed-out, polarized America would be timely, but this isn’t it. Instead, Weisman takes a chapter to complain about what he considers the major distraction preventing American Jews from being fully alert to the perils of the time — but this, a little surprisingly, turns out to be “Israel, Israel, Israel.”...
The second malaise Weisman identifies as blunting Jewish alertness to the peril of the times is the hollowing out of a Jewish identity that is neither uncritically Zionist nor devoutly religious. “The Jews who are most interested in a liberal, internationalist future, who wish to live progressive, assimilated existences free of threat,” he warns, “are disappearing.”...
But if “being Jewish” means nothing more than an ethically attuned solidarity with kindred disadvantaged at home and abroad, then the reawakening he wants will just evaporate in a cloud of airy good will....
पोस्ट्स
१२८ टिप्पण्या:
'For Republicans, the issue is simple and convenient. The raising of anti-Zionism in the debate over antisemitism amid the Israel-Hamas war pushes aside the presence of white-nationalist bigots on the fringes of the Republican coalition.'
Now white-nationalist bigots, here, support the white-nationalist Zionists they can identify with, calling others "savages" and "animals" as they kill people in numbers unheard of since the Nazis.
"Younger, left-leaning Jews, steeped in the cause of antiracism and terms like 'settler colonialism,' are increasingly searching for a Jewish identity centered more on religious values like the pursuit of justice and repairing the world than on collective nationalism tied to the land of Israel."
They've learned what Christopher Hitchens said: Zionism is a waste of Judaism.
Democrats worry that the debate is blurring the line between political speech and hate speech.
It one thing to say "free Tibet". It's much like free Ireland or India from the England. Nobody said push all the British people into the English Channel.
But accusing Israel of colonialism is dishonest and absolutely not historically accurate. I'm sure after Joshua showed up with a shitload of former Jewish slaves, somebody was pissed. Muhammed didn't come along until 700 AD, so saying Jewish people don't have a historical claim to the land is bullshit.
Leftists also like to remind us that ALL of America's land was stolen from the Native Americans. That's very true. Manifest Destiny. So, we gave them Casino's and allow the to spear fish as a concellation.
Father Guido Sarducci said on Johnny Carson that giving the Palestinians Casino's was a solution to the Israeli Palestinian conflict. It worked in America.
The raising of anti-Zionism in the debate over antisemitism amid the Israel-Hamas war pushes aside the presence of white-nationalist bigots on the fringes of the Republican coalition
Fringes of the Republican Coalition = Inconvenient liberal elites within the Democrat coalition
https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2015/09/nyt-quietly-removes-list-of-jewish-lawmakers.html
The leftist Jews are having an identity crisis. Too bad the Muslims aren't buying it. The American secular left are doing a nice Nazi imitation.
Bring out the violins, as this person and the Woke generation struggle with self-reflection and gray areas for the first time ever.
Democrats worry that the debate is blurring the line between political speech and hate speech.
Democrats purposely blurred the line between political speech and speech that actually proceeded violence. Obama was and is a Democrat when he said "get in their face", "punch back twice as hard". That was a call to violence against another group, but it wasn't called hate or violence. Sarah Palin creates a pamphlet that essentially says "target your campaign contributions to this race in Arizona", and because someone who never read the pamphlet committed violence, her pamphlet was called "hate speech", but that was actual political speech.
What is happening now is people are understanding what speech that proceeds violence actually sounds like. Calling people "colonizer" and therefore any violence enacted upon them is justified, then violence will follow. That's not political speech, as there isn't a call to use policies to create a change. It is a suggestion that policy is no longer satisfying certain people to get their way, so violence is now justified.
This new york times
https://m.jpost.com/opinion/op-ed-contributors/hearst-and-the-holocaust
The existence of Israel is at stake. This shouldn't be a left-right thing for Israelis.
Democrats worry that the debate is blurring the line between political speech and hate speech.
When liberals are in charge of labeling "hate speech" it becomes a broad category for censoring alternative opinions, and uncomfortable truths.
Pointing out REAL racial crime statistics in America is hate speech. "Merry Christmas" is hate speech. Claiming there are two genders is hate speech. Reminding people that Margaret Sanger was a eugenicists is hate speech.
Then there is "cultural appropriation". If you have a Mexican guy working in a kitchen making burgers or Italian food, in Madison, WI...that's not considered cultural appropriation. But if the Sigma Chi fraternity throws a Cinco de Mayo bash it is. The rules aren't hard to figure out, but they're ridiculous.
Now liberals are ok with men invading women's spaces like bathrooms and women's sports. With all the intellectual contortion, I'm surprised liberals aren't walking around with neck braces in addition to their COVID masks.
For Republicans, the issue is simple and convenient. The raising of anti-Zionism in the debate over antisemitism amid the Israel-Hamas war pushes aside the presence of white-nationalist bigots on the fringes of the Republican coalition... and instead forces Democrats to defend the pro-Hamas demonstrators on their own coalition’s fringes...."
It's always about fighting the other "side" - they're fellow Americans citizens - NOT about fixing or expelling that group of "white-nationalist bigots" within the GOP. They're nothing without racists, just as Israel's nothing without fascism.
The same problem across the pond
https://twitter.com/MrAndyNgo/status/1733200865471668712
Before October 7, anti-Zionism was not necessarily antisemitism. But it surely is now. Anyone who doesn’t think the marches and violence and calls for global intifada and “river to the sea” chants in response to the grotesque massacre is the best argument since the Holocaust for the success and survival of a Jewish homeland that’s a haven for Jews can have only one motive for that opinion.
Yeah, he seems nice…
When did the term “far right” become the throw away slur? It has no definition so you can throw anyone in the category and then just dismiss them. No need to talk about “them”…
The same forces who want to 'deconstruct' israel want to do the same to this country
"He proposes a unification of American Judaism around the defense of self and of others even more vulnerable: the undocumented immigrants, refugees, Muslim Americans, and black activists who have been directly targeted, not just by the tolerated Alt Right, but by the Trump White House itself."
Weisman is just another left-wing self-hating Jew. He claims that he is against anti-Semitism but he is more interested in supporting every other "marginalized" group than the Jews. He wants Jews to support Muslims and blacks who are anti-Semitic instead of opposing anti-Semitism. The fact that they are supporters of Hamas does not faze him in the least. I don't see any concern on his part about the left-wing anti-Semitism in the Democrat party.
"religious values ... like the pursuit of justice and repairing the world than on collective nationalism tied to the land of Israel."
"Religious," right. As in prog religion, the kind that needs no God or scripture. But lefty Jews are discovering that, try as they might to blend in as good progs, they will always be reviled and they will remain the source of evil. They are also discovering, though not yet acknowledging, that their actual allies are people they revile.
"they see Israel as the centerpiece and guarantor of continued Jewish existence in an ever more secular world"
Well, it is, so far. Not a total guarantor though.
"For Republicans, the issue is simple and convenient."
They pounce again.
"forces Democrats to defend the pro-Hamas demonstrators on their own coalition’s fringes...."
But the fringes are out and about on the streets and major campuses. The Progressive Caucus is fringe now?
https://freebeacon.com/biden-administration/biden-admin-pays-anti-israel-group-that-spreads-lies-about-gaza-war-to-fight-disinformation/
The word "Zionist" is used by cowards too afraid to admit they hate Jews and they want Israel destroyed and given to the butchers.
Do Democrats ever have 'simple and convenient' issues?
They dont represent a majority
The Crack Emcee said...
Now white-nationalist bigots, here, support the white-nationalist Zionists they can identify with, calling others "savages" and "animals" as they kill people in numbers unheard of since the Nazis.
Historical quibbles aside, if we are the murderous people you think we are, and I think we are, perhaps you would do well to address us with more deference and politesse, and be grateful that we don’t go off on everyone we don’t like in this country. Perhaps instead of reparations future white people will get really fed up and decide to give you more of the same. This is not impossible, taking a long view of history. Is there a moral imperative to let gangs of feral young people despoil our great cities? Does kissing minority ass in education and employment NEVER END? Is there a place in the world that People of Color are better off than the United States? And if so, why aren’t they lining up to go there instead? Here they are at the mercy of murderous white people who may have standard of behavior. Do I want the Jews to win in Israel? You bet I do. And I am happy, yes HAPPY for them to pile the skulls of people who rape young women to death and burn babies in ovens. I cheer the bloody end of Hamas and all of its supporters. Death to the savages!
Leftist intellectuals who have lived soft, protected lives and are detached from the real world will eventually help destroy Israel much as they are doing in the rest of the Western world.
"Is anti-Zionism always antisemitic?" Given the nature of anti-Zionism and the identity of its major purveyors, the answer is "yes."
He does get it right about white nationalist bigots being on the "fringes of the Republican coalition." As a sometime, usually reluctant, member of that coalition I find those people so "fringy" that I rarely meet or hear about one.
As for the "fringes of [the Democrat] coalition," one need only look to the streets and campuses at any given time. It takes some balls to assert that this gaggle of "pro-Palestinian" demonstrators are a fringe element of the Democrats. They, along with Antifa, BLM, Gay Pride and other woke cohorts are the most visible element of the party.
We will be seeing pushback now from secular progressive Jews like Weisman striving to maintain their cred as antisemitic Democrats show their true colors. "Look over there. White Nationalists." "Those Democrats supporting Hamas terrorists are a fringe."
(Can you imagine writing a book linking Trump to antisemitism? Mark Levin compiled a list of Trump's pro-Jewish accomplishments. It is staggering.)
Anti-Zionism is not per se anti-Semitic. But it's really a philosophical question as there are no real world examples to work from.
It must be incredibly disconcerting to find almost all of the true anti-semites inside the Democrat coalition.
cassandra lite said...
"Before October 7, anti-Zionism was not necessarily antisemitism. But it surely is now."
Translation: This is another one, freaking out, and demanding America no longer be America, so they can calm down in the safety of fascism.
"Anyone who doesn’t think the marches and violence and calls for global intifada and “river to the sea” chants in response to the grotesque massacre is the best argument since the Holocaust for the success and survival of a Jewish homeland that’s a haven for Jews can have only one motive for that opinion."
“From the river to the sea” was used by the Israeli ruling Likud party as part of their 1977 election manifesto, and repeated by Menachem Begin. Israeli politicians, like Gideon Sa'ar and also Uri Ariel of The Jewish Home also used it. Even the Israeli Prime Minister, Likud's Benjamin Netanyahu, has said it in speeches.
Now - is there REALLY "only one motive" at work here - or are you hyperventilating, and trying to take away people's rights, at the same time?
Zionists are the only colonizers to claim A) they are the aggrieved party - not the colonized - and B) no one has the right to defend themselves or resist whatever Zionists decide. We know this to be true because, along with their current outrages to human decency, Zionists provided Apartheid-era South Africa with weapons to keep Nelson Mandela in prison. They are no fans of freedom or justice, so can't recognize them.
"they kill people in numbers unheard of since the Nazis"
Come on now, really? You must know how false this statement is. Wrong by orders of magnitude. So, killing only counts when it is done by Jews? What does that say about how you must view the various Arabs and Africans who have slaughtered far more than 17,000 in the years since WW2. Are they not fully human, so can't be held accountable? It's either that, or you just prefer to not think about them and focus your hatred on the Jews. Why is that?
Zionism/Jewish hate, is a real threat to the lefts valuable tool of identity politics.
If the left is forced to agree such nuanced examination is required, it becomes impossible to blithely label a person or group racist. Quesitoning Obama was out of bounds or you were labled a racist. Pointing out the vapid ramblings of Harris is a little easier, but you still open yourself to accusations of racism.
Zionism/Jewish hate, has exposed the laziness of he left's narrative building.
@Crack: The raising of anti-Zionism in the debate over antisemitism amid the Israel-Hamas war ...
What, precisely is this Zionism of which you speak?
Ladies and gentlemen, an announcement from our self-appointed superiors"
"Would everyone please stay clearly within the boundaries of their appointed tiers in the good-person-good-group/bad-person-bad-group hierarchy? The lines are getting blurred making our management of the various benefits bestowed to each tier more difficult. Your docile cooperation will be greatly appreciated."?
We now return you to your regularly scheduled distraction-dripline of soft porn, royal family fights, bad officiating contentions, the Kardashians and other real people, and the clear and present dangers of DJT.
NYT headline: "Republicans pounce ..."
Evergreen. It's not just Cedars and Hemlock Firs that are green all year long.
South Africa would be a much better place now if it were still under Apartheid. Evil as the regime was, it was preferable to what followed.
@Crack: "Before October 7, anti-Zionism was not necessarily antisemitism. But it surely is now."
Translation: This is another one, freaking out, and demanding America no longer be America, so they can calm down in the safety of fascism.
Translating Crack's translation: I can make up whatever bovine excreta I want, no matter how invisible the connection to what someone actually said. Oh, you should stop using the word "fascism" until you learn what it means.
Fringe politics never lead anywhere good — there’s always a desire to be more extreme. Watching them pivot from “healthcare for all” to “Israel has no right to exist” has been a pretty good indication of this.
Is anti-Zionism necessarily bigoted? No.
Is anti-Zionism used by antisemites to justify their position while trying to remain respectable? Yes. And often.
Have many “principled” anti-Zionists fallen into the antisemitism trap, acting like this latest atrocity is just business as usual, and treating this situation as nothing out of the ordinary when it is obviously nothing of the sort? Yes. There are a lot of lazy thinkers out there, and a lot of them are implicitly or explicitly supporting genocide because they are not smart enough to notice they have led themselves into a very dark place.
As for young, left-wing Jews who want some vague “heal with world” cause, even after recent events have given them the mother of all wake up calls, no, they are not going to eat you last, even if you ask nicely. They will probably eat you first, given you have left yourself defenseless. People who are too dumb to live should be ignored.
"Y'all a bunch of racists"
Crack: "Now white-nationalist bigots, here, support the white-nationalist Zionists they can identify with...."
Israelis are not "white nationalists." Jordanians call Palestinians "the Jews of the Arabs" (Yes, I have been there and heard the term.) Studies have shown most Jews and Arabs share a common ancestry*. With few exceptions one cannot distinguish Arabs from Jews walking the streets of Israel (Yes, I have been there.).
*See: https://www.science.org/content/article/jews-and-arabs-share-recent-ancestry
Of course, one cannot make the comparison in Arab territories because Jews are not welcomed by Muslim Arab bigots.
Trying to make this Islamic jihad about color makes as much sense as LGBTers demonstrating in support of Hamas who given the chance will throw them off of buildings.
Oso Negro said...
"I am happy, yes HAPPY for them to pile the skulls of people who rape young women to death and burn babies in ovens.
And if there were no rapes of young women and no babies burned in ovens or decapitated - but just Zionist lies? Then what? Will you feel like cheering for fascism then? Will killing women and children warm your soul?
Oso Negro said...
"Historical quibbles aside, if we are the murderous people you think we are, and I think we are, perhaps you would do well to address us with more deference and politesse, and be grateful that we don’t go off on everyone we don’t like in this country."
Step up, Fool. I know we need laws to keep your dumb ass in-check, but anytime you're feeling frisky, I don't know anyone scared of you. (You're even scared of my dick.) I mean, Hamas fucked-up Israel, and that's like Rocky losing his first fight to Gary Coleman.
You be you.
half of all the jews in europe, were slaughtered, this was what Eichmann revealed to Sassen,
now as for precious Azania, what a wreck Madiba made it, I was for Buthelezi even as a youth,
Umkhonto was on the Soviet side, as was the precious provos, and Fatah,
It's not hard for me to pick sides. The Palestinians vow death to America and Israelis do not. So, I side with the Israelis. The Palestinians wish to wipe Jews off the face of the earth and I believe them. I pity any Jewish American (or any American) who can't come to terms with reality.
If anti-Zionism is only anti-Semitic 50% of the time, is that OK? How about 75%, or 25%? Pick any number from 1% to 110% and ask if that amount of anti-Semitism makes anti-Zionism less than just a cover for truly anti-Semitic Jew hatred.
The most famous anti-Semites in history weren't anti-Jew all the time, either. Sometimes they were anti-Gypsy, or anti-Homosexual, or anti-Catholic in their search for a Final Solution to their society's nonhomogeneity.
If every time an anti-Zioist pops up I have to search to determine if they are also NOT an anti-Semite, I am wasting a lot of time I could be better using hating the anti-Semites of the world, including those who hide behind anti-Zionism. I'll just skip the extra steps and presume all anti-Zionists are anti-Semites, and save myself the time and effort.
Crack: "...as [Zionists] kill people in numbers unheard of since the Nazis."
Syrian Bashar al-Assad killed over 200,000 of his own people during a war that claimed 500,000. In South Sudan the death toll reached nearly 400,000. Millions were displaced from their homes by the aggressors.
Oh wait! Those don't count. The killers and displacers were Arabs and black Africans, not Jews.
I stepped outside the antisemitic narrative with facts. What was I thinking?
The raising of anti-Zionism in the debate over antisemitism amid the Israel-Hamas war pushes aside the presence of white-nationalist bigots on the fringes of the Republican coalition... and instead forces Democrats to defend the pro-Hamas demonstrators on their own coalition’s fringes...."
The Jew haters n the GOP side Are "on the fringe".
The Jew haters on the Democrat side are the core of the Party.
Stop lying, lefties
Can we just admit that there are a few kapos on the Jewish left?
I remember when Tom Friedman, said Hama rules, when Papa Bashir crushed that city on the Orontes, was a reason to trust him
Let's just say that Crack is real bad at math. Numbers confuse him, her, they,Xi? I want to get the pronouns right.
@Crack: And if there were no rapes of young women and no babies burned in ovens or decapitated ...
Both those links go to articles written just a few days after the attack.
Since then, the atrocities have been widely attested to, so why don't you stop it with this nonsense?
"It should be obvious by now that so many of the creeps who purport to weep for Palestine don’t really care about Palestinians, dead or alive, or about Israelis, or about the historical and moral intricacies of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. What they want is an excuse to indulge in something deeper, more libidinal, ancient, and indeed erotic — hating Jews.” Don Surber
The nazi definition of Jew was "a person with one or more Jewish grandparents." To nazis, Jews were people who were fit only for slavery or extermination.
Many if not most Muslims, have the same attitude towards Jews- it's in their Koran, and, unlike the Old and New Testaments, is still viewed as actionable by Muslims, as well as by many leftists in the Anglosphere and elsewhere.
Jews with a sense of self preservation would do well to keep these unpleasant facts in mind, and act accordingly.
A Zionist gets beat down for assaulting a Muslim.
This is like Italians after seeing Rocky.
A New Yorker's view of Jews and the right. Sorry if I just shake my head and move on. It's as tiresome as reading a dozen Crack comments trying to persuade the world of the evils of an existing Israel and the gall of Israelis fighting back against the very people who have been trying to end them for decades. Love how the Palestinians are, in the minds of so many now, separate from Hamas. They were not separate on Oct. 7 when they celebrated in the streets. And not on any day previous when they went along with Hamas building their tunnels and ammo dumps under their hospitals, schools, and homes. No word when the thousands of rockets over decades were shot off from their very neighborhoods. Just more celebrating and handing out sweets, dancing in the streets, then back to the schools where they teach about the evil Jew and why you must work to kill them all.
Crack- you keep on making your case. But this did not happen out of the blue. It did not just occur to Israelis to level Gaza. They have tried- since 1948- to live alongside the same people who are not welcomed by any other Arab nation. They did not even have to leave the land of Israel in 1948. They chose to go to war then, and have never abated. It is not the desire of Israelis to kill thousands. It is the desire of Israelis to wipe out Hamas before Hamas wipes out the Jewish state. And who is Hamas? Why...it is the Palestinians, who have never separated themselves from Hamas, never pushed them away, never pushed them out. Instead, allowed them the leadership, the money, the arms, and the destruction.
There is no alternative for Israel but to eliminate the threat. Every chance was given to live alongside. And at every point it was rejected, usually by bombs, rockets, or deadly ambushes. If you lived there, you'd get it. From here you can protest on a blog and feel superior. Its just not that easy.
@ The Crack Emcee -- "as they [Zionists] kill people in numbers unheard of since the Nazis."
The killed in Gaza is heading toward 20,000. The killed in the Iran-Iraq War topped one million. Well over 20,000 died in wars in Syria, Rwanda, eastern Congo, Sudan, and Myanmar. We don't hear much about them because who cares about those people dying? Going back a little further, there's Bangladesh and Biafra. And of course Vietnam (and adjacent areas), Iraq, and Afghanistan.
1994 Rwanda genocide — in 100 days estimated 500k-800k Tutsi murdered. I can’t understand why Crack wouldn’t know about this but thinks Israel is committing the worst genocide since the Holocaust. Poor guy, must be tough to be so obsessed with the Jews.
So, people who oppose Regime policy in Israel/Gaza are villified as antisemites (i.e. racists). Some are fired and cancelled. Isn't that how the Regime always responds to anyone who opposes it's agenda.
Or is it different this one time?
Zionism was the term used prior to and during the Jewish migration back to the Holy Land prior to the establishment of the state of Israel. Once Israel was established, it was synonymous with Zion. Therefore, anti-zionists are defacto anti-Israeli. The difference between anti-Israeli and anti-semite is splitting hairs.
Wow, the New york Times sure is concerned with Jews. Sometimes I feel like I'm reading the Jewish Daily Forward or the Jeruselum Times and not "America's paper of record".
Not that there's anything wrong with that.
Anyway, good that Jews are reconnecting with their religion of peace. Maybe they can put some pressure on Israel to stop committing genocide in Gaza and killing civilians.
And of course, pressure those anti-semites at Harvard to stop persucuting Jews.
If Israel were really 'far right,' they would carpet bomb Gaza and then start in on the rest of the Arab world.
"religious values like the pursuit of justice and repairing the world"
That might seem odd but I think this explains it.
The IDF/Israeli government needs to release the videos that they have been showing to journalists and others in closed-door settings.
It won't shut up Hitler wannabes like Crack, but it will at least destroy the 'It's Zionist propaganda' bullshit.
And if it doesn't even then? Then those people are soulless...
Zionists were community leaders of Jews in the unincorporated territory and through migration and purchased land, in the wake of the fall of the Ottoman empire, divestment by the British empire, the Nazis' social justice movement, and the genocidal ambitions of the Arab Spring. Anti-Zionism is anti-Judaism motivated by diversity, equity, and indoctrination (DEI).
The far-right is the left-right nexus is leftist (i.e. authoritarian) in the governing spectrum.
Joe Smith said...
"The IDF/Israeli government needs to release the videos that they have been showing to journalists and others in closed-door settings."
A crack in the dyke appears. It's funny how everyone recognizes this in the case of Derek Chauvin, a white man, but you can't understand it when it comes to Hamas.
"It won't shut up Hitler wannabes like Crack, but it will at least destroy the 'It's Zionist propaganda' bullshit."
Hypocrites. I have posted this link to the LA Times investigation saying there was no rape at least three times, and you guys haven't accepted it's results, so don't give me this bullshit about I have a hard time with facts and want to be Hitler. You guys can't face those results and are on the side of people who are killing people by the thousands, not me.
"And if it doesn't even then?"
I just said you guys have been rejecting facts, as I've been posting them, all day.
"Then those people are soulless..."
Your projection. You're just describing yourself.
"Is Anti-Zionism always Antisemitic?"
Of course not. Those who say so seek to make any criticism of Israel unspeakable. It is equivalent to calling critics of America's actions or policies "Un-American," or to say, "America: Love it or Leave it!" In short, to define such criticism as treason. Such rhetorical ploys are deployed by mindless fanatics or knowing liars, those who cannot imagine or tolerate any criticism of state actions or those intent on erasing criticism of state actions by prior restraint.
"Father Guido Sarducci said on Johnny Carson that giving the Palestinians Casino's was a solution to the Israeli Palestinian conflict. It worked in America."
Not really.
Adam Carolla has semi-seriously proposed moving the Israeli Jews to Baja California. It’s desert, like the Negev, it’s bordered by water, like the Jordan River and the Mediterranean, and, let’s face it, Mexico could use an influx of smart, industrious Jews. Might solve our immigration problem!
What, precisely is this Zionism of which you speak?
As Howard helpfully notes above, Zion is Israel, the same way America is the USA. They are interchangeable terms. Being anti-Israel perhaps in some hairsplittingly nuanced way could exist apart from antisemitism, but every commenter that articulates an anti-Zionist position also tends to use clearly antisemitic language. One thing all thinking people should be able to see from this article about confused young Jews is that the Jewish people are not a monolithic group that all believe and behave the same, just as every other group identity is false when extended to every person that is conceivably "in" the group. Therefore, given the variety of thought and passion among Jews the statements that "they" run the media or run the world is false and defamatory on its face. "They" are demonstrably not a monolithic group acting as one the world over.
The only "group" that comes close to fitting that monolithic character is Progressives/Marxists. And that group is not dominated by any one race or national origin or religion. It is a sickness that infects across all demographics.
The IDF/Israeli government needs to release the videos that they have been showing to journalists and others in closed-door settings.
Compared to today, the world was actually in pretty good shape when Donald Trump was president. He didn't start any new wars, we were talking to the North Koreans and they had calmed down a little. Then of course Dr Fauci's gene edited virus hit. Remember when Dr Fauci redefined "gain of function" to allow dangerous research to continue, and when the fool thought that if we did it in China by paying the ChiComs to do it, we would be safe? When Trump said that Covid would burn out in a few months, he was parroting the wishful thinking of his guilty science adviser?
I wish we were still in the halcyon age of Trump, before millions of "asylum seekers" with a right to shelter and medical care, and the same right to work as a green card holder, weren't competing with Americans for homes, medical care, and jobs. Joe says that there are lots of jobs. Maybe so, but it takes two or three of them for people at the bottom to pay their bills, so that's not such a brag.
What's amazing to me still I that Joe prioritizes the continued flooding of the United States with these young men by the millions over his own war in Ukraine. He could get his sixty billion in a minute from Congress if he would bend on securing the border, and yet he steadfastly refuses. What does that tell you about his genuine intentions? It's his theory that a great replacement will mean that Democrats never lose another election. People on the left go along with this because they believe that the things that they need to do to "solve" their perceived problem could never be implemented in fair elections.
@Crack: Hypocrites. I have posted this link to the LA Times investigation saying there was no rape at least three times, and you guys haven't accepted it's results, so don't give me this bullshit about I have a hard time with facts and want to be Hitler.
And each time you egregiously misrepresent that article. By this time it can't be a mistake.
There was no investigation. At all. Not even a little bit of one. Instead, there is this:
For the record: 6:12 p.m. Oct. 9, 2023: An earlier version of this column mentioned rape in the attacks, but such reports have not been substantiated.
That is called a caveat, not a repudiation.
The reason we don't accept your claims is because they are delusional. At best.
Ya know? Before the Ethel Mermon-esque response of one side in favor of the Palestinians I might have been a little concerned about the plight of Palestinians in Gaza. But the over the top hand wringing and excuses for murderous behavior I no longer give a shit. At all. Launch the Gaza strip to the moon for all I care.
"If Israel were really 'far right,' they would carpet bomb Gaza and then start in on the rest of the Arab world."
They probably would like to do that but they're likely concerned such an action would antagonize their "best buddy" and major benefactor (that's US!, the USA) such that we might withdraw political, financial and other support to them, (especially given that we are also besties with other Arab states).
'Your projection. You're just describing yourself.'
The God I believe in says that I have a soul, and that's good enough for me.
Have a great day...
Einstein!!!
"The existence of Israel is at stake."
No, it's not.
'Adam Carolla has semi-seriously proposed moving the Israeli Jews to Baja California.'
I don't know that we need that many scientists, doctors, accountants, etc. streaming over the border.
As I pointed out with two of my links, Weissman, comes with a checkered past as does the Times, going back to how they covered the Holocaust vis a vis Hearst for instance, who gave the issue a hearing as well with the Holomodor and Mr. Jones,
"Weisman is just another left-wing self-hating Jew"
Anyone who uses the term "self-hating Jew" can be dismissed out of hand, as it is the ploy either of morons or (more likely and more often) of dishonest actors who seek to discredit Jewish critics of Israel's actions but are unable to present a concrete argument to that end. It is as laughable (and specious) as if, in the civil rights days, someone accused white supporters of civil rights for black Americans as being "self-hating whites." (Actually, there are similar derogatory terms, such as "race traitors," that were and may still be in use by many ethnic groups. In all cases, those using such smears reveal their own dishonest and hateful mindsets.)
The idea of arguing with fools is not appealing to me, especially those dishonest, dedicated Jew haters who have no interest in giving up their hatred. For instance, calling Israel a fascist state -- when talking about the Middle East that is laughable. Israel is a multicultural, multiracial democracy. Gaza last had an election in 2006, Abbas was elected 2005, elections in Iran, Syria, Egypt have one candidate, etc. etc. etc.
Generalizing about those young Jews who are extreme left wing trying to define for themselves a Judaism divorced from Israel, is also foolish. Every major branch of Judaism from Orthodox to Reform, representing Jews who know their religion and the history of the Jewish people, recognizes the intrinsic and unbreakable bond of the Jewish people with Israel, particularly Jerusalem. Jerusalem is mentioned over 600 times in the Bible, and not mentioned even once in the Quran but we are supposed to believe Jews have no connection to Jerusalem but Muslims do? Or that Jews are colonizers of their own home?
Similar nonsense is the suggestion that anti-semitism is caused by the existence of Israel. Anti-semitism existed for centuries in Europe and the determination of Nazi Germany to systematically commit genocide of European Jewry took place when there was no Israel.
Suggesting that Jews should quit being Jews or believing in God or deny their connection with Israel are all ridiculous and hideous solutions to the bigotry of anti-semitism. That was true under the Romans who thought Jews didn't have the right to their own country and it is true now. Holding Israel or Jews to standards of perfection that no other country or people have ever been held to in order to invalidate their existence is also bigotry.
“A New Yorker's view of Jews and the right. Sorry if I just shake my head and move on”
Antisemitism is, and has long been, 99% on the left. Even before the democratization of WW II, it was mostly within the Dem party. Their KKK was avowedly antisemitic. Jews were mostly hated by competing ethnic groups - competing with the for power in the Dem party. By 50 years ago, it was effectively dead on the right. It was only by redefining national socialism as being on the right (when it was avowedly socialist, just anti-communist socialist) that the left has been able to claim that the right is antisemitic. Open antisemites on the right are barely, if even that, tolerated. By the time I was in college, a bit over 50 years ago, it was something that our parents, born before WW II, might espouse in private. But it effectively died, on the right, with the Boomer generation. When the guy in the room next door, your best friends, etc, in college were Jewish, you quickly learned that they didn’t eat babies, but rather got just as drunk as you, suffered through the same tribulations of coming of age, etc.
Israel is foreign country. We all have a right to attack, even say it should be destroyed. Just like various people on the internet call for "wiping out" gaza.
Discussing foreign countries is political, protected by the 1st Admendment, speech. Its so obvious and clear-cut their should be no argument unless you somehow believe Israel is the 51st state.
If an American Jew wants to assert he feels "Threatened" by someone in the USA disliking Israel, he'll just have to suck it up. Or use pure naked power, in violation of the constitution, to shut people up.
The first question on the issue of Who Owns The Land should be is who determines that. Then how is that determined.
The Palestians are descended from Arabs who invaded Palestine/Israel 1400 years ago.
So do we determine Who Owns the Land by going back only to 800 AD?
Same for the Native Americans. And each tribe. The argument that it’s OK that tribes killed and took over land from other tribes but it was Horrible that The White Man did to them what they did to each other is embarrassing.
The existence of Israel is at stake. This shouldn't be a left-right thing for Israelis.
The Israeli left want Netanyahu out by whatever means necessary. They are supported by the US Democrat party.
The conundrum for the Democrat party is to support Israel, but not its head of government without appearing overly sympathetic to Hamas.
Crack. Pro tip: read articles before linking them to substantiate a claim not in the article. Funny. The link makes the opposite point.
Two things. First, holding Israel to a different standard from other countries might not be anti-Semitic. However, I am going to err on the side of caution and assume it is until I am convinced it is not. Second, I notice that certain commenters here like to disparage "Zionists," and then hide behind the truism that criticizing Israel is not the same thing as criticizing Jews. Then why don't they just criticize Israel? As most Jews believe in Zionism, attacking Zionists certainly seems like a way to attack Jews.
Cook (12:47): '"Is Anti-Zionism always Antisemitic?" ...Those who say so seek to make any criticism of Israel unspeakable.'
So all criticism of Israel must be grounded in anti-Zionism? Really? More lefty logic from Cook.
Anti-Zionism is different from criticizing the actions or policies of the Israeli government. Since the State of Israel exists, as a practical matter anti-Zionism is now only relevant as a call for the annihilation of the Jewish State of Israel. The only way to do that is to exterminate the Israeli Jews populating the State of Israel. Exterminating Jews. Does that seem like antisemitism?
I suppose there is a philosophical argument about Zionism, but the antisemitic, Islamist, Hamas jihadis and the hoards of Jew-hating demonstrators on campuses and in the streets don't strike me as philosophers. Neither does "No Rapes Crack."
Michael said...
"Crack. Pro tip: read articles before linking them to substantiate a claim not in the article. Funny. The link makes the opposite point."
Look in the righthand corner - where the correction is.
hombre said...
I've posted that link to the LA Times 4 times but I'm still "No Rapes Crack."
That's how into facts y'all are.
'Israel is foreign country. We all have a right to attack, even say it should be destroyed. Just like various people on the internet call for "wiping out" gaza.'
You certainly do.
And if the 'Palestinians' can defeat the Israelis then they can have their own country. Hell, they can have Israel.
But they can't defeat Israel in battle and never will because they aren't as smart as the Jews.
The average IQ of those in Gaza is 85, about the same as that of African Americans.
While the average IQ of Ashkenazi Jews is 117.
You see the problem?
Michael: "Crack. Pro tip: read articles before linking them to substantiate a claim not in the article. Funny. The link makes the opposite point."
Reading comprehension is literal white supremacy.
Crack can "explain".
Since some of you seem confused about the roles of colonizer and colonized - and forget the colonized have a right and duty to fight back while the colonizer does not - I thought we should make it clear who's colonizing who, so when the question "Are we the baddies?" comes around, we're clear:
Jimmy Carter on Israeli apartheid
Amnesty International - Israel’s apartheid against Palestinians: a cruel system of domination and a crime against humanity
Patrick Buchanan - "Gaza is an Israeli concentration camp."
Ron Paul: Palestinians in a Virtual Concentration Camp
Human Rights Watch - Gaza: Israel’s ‘Open-Air Prison’
David Cameron: “Gaza cannot and must not be allowed to remain a prison camp.” (2010)
Did Israel’s national security minister just admit to apartheid policies?
And they lied about "widespread raping" and decapitated babies and all the rest. Sorry, but the 'good guys' just don't do that.
This is how Zionists are treating "suspects" and they don't expect any blowback. Just incredible.
@Crack: Michael said...
"Crack. Pro tip: read articles before linking them to substantiate a claim not in the article. Funny. The link makes the opposite point."
Look in the righthand corner - where the correction is.
Wrong. Again. Some more.
'This is how Zionists are treating "suspects" and they don't expect any blowback. Just incredible.'
This video just shows the military superiority of the Jews.
Hamas gambled and lost...this is the logical result.
Btw, why are these men so fat? Lots of moobs here. I thought they were all being oppressed and starved?
"Cook (12:47): 'Is Anti-Zionism always Antisemitic?" ...Those who say so seek to make any criticism of Israel unspeakable.'
"So all criticism of Israel must be grounded in anti-Zionism? Really? More lefty logic from Cook."
You're not very bright, are you? Or are you you feigning being so obtuse? It would actually be stunning to me if you're not pretending.
HA! BREAKING: Israel APOLOGIZES For 'Abu Ghraib' POW Images
Joe Smith said...
"This video just shows the military superiority of the Jews.
Hamas gambled and lost...this is the logical result."
BREAKING: Israel APOLOGIZES For 'Abu Ghraib' POW Images - proving you assholes can't recognize when a wrong is being done.
Anytime anyone wants to provide compelling evidence of "widespread raping," please be my guest. Don't just sit on the sidelines and say I'm wrong: PROVE IT. "Widespread raping" should have LOTS of evidence - photos, actual victims, cell phone videos, evidence of rape kits being ordered and used, etc. - so either put-up or shut-up.
Being called names is getting old. Be men and women, instead of children for a change.
Hey Crack - you ever live in the Middle East? I did so it’s a “ lived experience” in DEI bingo parlance. If you lived there you would understand how despised and rejected the Palestinians are by their fellow Arab neighbors. Why? Because they are trouble! Black September in Jordan, the civil war in Lebanon, supporting the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt. The ONLY ones supporting them are the religious crazies who will fight to the last Palestinian just to kill Jews.
Hamas acted because they saw the last domino about to fall with the Saudis recognizing Israel - like the other Arab states have that have profited from that action. Also Iran is fully funded by Joe Obama relaxing the sanctions on them allowing them to fund this nonsense. But hey - none of that counts in oppression world.
As for colonizers - maybe you should ask how the Middle East got “converted” by the Arab waves that wiped out the local civilizations - the Copts and the Berbers might want to give you a nice chat on how they were treated by the invaders. In addition these fine folks wrecked North Africa - desertification was advanced immensely by their neglect.
And the “ parading” of stripped “fighters”? Suicide belts come to mind? In a just world the “ fighters” with no uniforms would be summarily executed by the rules of war. But the IDF doesn’t do that.
"...if the 'Palestinians' can defeat the Israelis then they can have their own country. Hell, they can have Israel.
"But they can't defeat Israel in battle and never will because they aren't as smart as the Jews.
"The average IQ of those in Gaza is 85, about the same as that of African Americans.
"While the average IQ of Ashkenazi Jews is 117.
"You see the problem?"
Well, perhaps. Such stats, to the extent they are accurate, suggest the damage to emotional and cognitive capabilities of those living under constant oppression and its concomitant conditions, such as poverty, social exclusion, poor nutrition and access to adequate medical services, hindrance of education, loss of self-esteem/internalized self-hatred, constant fear, stress, environmental violence and trauma (experiencing directly or witnessing the injury, arrest, "disappearing" and killing of one's friends, families, and neighbors), to mention some.
That's pretty low, sneering at populations of people and saying they deserve the shit they get because they're afflicted with deficiencies and pathologies that are the result of the shit they get.
This is hilarious: All Netanyahu had to hear is the President of the International Criminal Court met with the Secretary General of the United Nations and he freaked-the-fuck-out, releasing an angry video - accusing them of antisemitism of course - and denying he's guilty of anything. So what's so funny about that?
They never said they were investigating him - he's just feeling hella guilty and paranoid.
As he should,...
"Antisemitism is, and has long been, 99% on the left."
Nice factoid to pull out of your nether region. Where is the sustaining data?
"Even before the democratization of WW II, it was mostly within the Dem party. Their KKK was avowedly antisemitic." Another factoidal turd.
"It was only by redefining national socialism as being on the right (when it was avowedly socialist, just anti-communist socialist) that the left has been able to claim that the right is antisemitic."
A third turd (it rhymes!) plucked from your behind.
“Maybe some, or even most, but there are a number of orthodox Jews who have been protesting against Zionism and Israels response to October 6, in Israel, Europe and the U.S.”
No link, so not sure the nature or quantity of this number, but you can find fringe elements in any population. Anti-Zionists probably number around 0.1% of Orthodox Jews. And they aren’t really anti-Zionist. They oppose a secular Jewish state. They only want a religious state. Zionism is intrinsic to Judaism; there is only some fringe disagreement on the details.
Other Jewish opposition just comes from the usual set of appeasers you can find in any threatened minority. They mistakenly think the crocodile will eat them last.
Crack Emcee, disingenuous per usual.
"Between the sea and the Jordan there will only be Israeli sovereignty," was the Likud's slogan. Ergo, no two-state solution, which back then was what all the West believed.
Same year, Begin made peace with Egypt, and in 2005 every Jew was extirpated from Gaza. We know very well what "river to the sea" and "globalize the intifada" mean.
My father, a refugee from 1930's Germany, told me that if you forget you are Jewish, someone will remind you.
Leora said...
"My father, a refugee from 1930's Germany, told me that if you forget you are Jewish, someone will remind you."
That's how being colorblind works: as soon as you try to forget you're black, someone will remind you.
Weissman and the progressive Jews he loves so much are just modern-day capos.
Zionists were community organizers who led the Jewish minority in the Palestine mandate, the majority of Jews in the Soviet Union, survivors in Europe, and disaffected Jews abroad to settle through ownership and purchase of their ancestral homeland. Anti-Zionism is not a criticism of Israel, but is antisemitic, specifically anti-Jew. It is diversitist of the progressive order.
The Times uses the word 'fraught' a lot. Everything is fraught with emotion or danger. On language, I also noted how the left lean, since they are left-leaning, but the right lurch, lurching over to the far right, since they are extremists, these terrible lurchers. The world is fraught with crises because people lurch to the right rather than lean to the left.
THIS is the crux of the matter.
"But they can't defeat Israel in battle and never will because they aren't as smart as the Jews.
The average IQ of those in Gaza is 85, about the same as that of African Americans.
While the average IQ of Ashkenazi Jews is 117."
"The Crack Emcee said...
Since some of you seem confused about the roles of colonizer and colonized - and forget the colonized have a right and duty to fight back while the colonizer does not"
There are no rules Crack. The colonized can rape and kill to their heart's content, until the colonizer decides to put a stop to it.
I'm using your definitions of colonized/colonizer here for simplicity's sake. The reality, of course, is precisely the opposite.
Robert Cook,
Your point addresses the deficiencies of Gaza Palestinians (I'm not at all convinced that the stat is accurate, fwiw) but not the superiority of the Ashkenazim. 17 points above average (IQ 100) is a very substantial gap. Maybe the tests are biased :-) Or maybe they ought to include the Sephardim, and the Ethiopian Jews, and all the Middle Eastern Jews who fled in 1948 from the Arab countries that had formerly been their homes. (About the same number that fled Israel, as it happens; but they are seldom mentioned.) The Jews still residents of Arab nations can be counted on the fingers of one mutilated hand. The Arabs who are Israeli citizens are about two million, just about the population of Gaza.
Crack, your original claim was that there was no "raping" at all. Now it has to be "widespread," i.e., over a large geographic area. Well, OK then. It doesn't matter how many Israelis and others were raped, so long as it was in a very confined geographic area. Isn't this fun?
Do you deny that an Israeli grandmother and Holocaust survivor was murdered on camera and the vid then uploaded to her own Facebook page so that her relatives could see it? Cool, huh?
You sicken me, Crack, you really do. Anything at all will do as long as it hurts Da Jooooooz.
Michelle Dulak Thomson said...
'Crack, your original claim was that there was no "raping" at all.'
Provide evidence when you say things like that or you have no credibility and are a liar.
'Now it has to be "widespread," i.e., over a large geographic area. '
You're an idiot. Widespread means it was common - a fact of the assault if you were female.
Well, OK then. It doesn't matter how many Israelis and others were raped, so long as it was in a very confined geographic area. Isn't this fun?"
It's fun to see a white person make a fool of himself, assuming I'm ass dumb as he apparently is.
"Do you deny that an Israeli grandmother and Holocaust survivor was murdered on camera and the vid then uploaded to her own Facebook page so that her relatives could see it? Cool, huh?"
Nope, never denied that. The claims were widespread raping, decapitated babies, and babies put in ovens. I've asked for evidence. That makes me an antisemite.
"You sicken me, Crack, you really do."
You do realize we don't know each other, right? I don't even recognize your name. Why should I care how you feel? Narcissism is AMAZING.
"Anything at all will do as long as it hurts Da Jooooooz."
The bad guys are the Zionists, not the Jews. I've made that very clear, but you're too stupid to get it: "widespread," i.e., over a large geographic area. '? You're dumb as a box of rocks.
'Well, perhaps. Such stats, to the extent they are accurate, suggest the damage to emotional and cognitive capabilities of those living under constant oppression and its concomitant conditions, such as poverty, social exclusion, poor nutrition and access to adequate medical services, hindrance of education, loss of self-esteem/internalized self-hatred, constant fear, stress, environmental violence and trauma (experiencing directly or witnessing the injury, arrest, "disappearing" and killing of one's friends, families, and neighbors), to mention some.'
If there is so much poverty, poor nutrition, and oppression, why are most of the prisoners so fat?
Western nations, and Israel themselves, have been supporting Gaza for many years. They couldn't function on their own.
And when Israel builds a beautiful irrigation system, the Palestinians take it apart to use the pipes as rockets. Then they complain that they're living in an 'open air prison.'
Who is this stupid? Asked and answered.
OK, now let's do any nation in sub-Saharan Africa. They run their own countries and are a large majority black.
Any Wakandas in that bunch? Would you want to live in any of those nations?
What readers have to understand is Crack has internalized the entire middle east conflict as a "Mississippi Burning" framework which is why Crack will never admit to his adolescent and child-like lies denying thousands of years of Jewish presence and the deepest of all comnections of any peoples to the land of Israel/Judea/Samaria.
Just think about how weak a "new age" type mind you would have to have to become Fully Hamas-ed and ISIS-ed in just 60 days!
But now Crack is a real "Believer" and on his way to convert.
I give it 12 months before Crack straps on an explosive vest and walks into a Jewish school.
"What readers have to understand is Crack has internalized the entire middle east conflict as a "Mississippi Burning" framework"
I'm not generally a fan of Drago's somewhat cute and smug comments, but this one hits it dead-on. Crack has never grown up, and there is no fixing that at his age. Crack would never be a suicide bomber. He loves himself far too much. Suicide bombing is for the little people. There is no shortage of them...
"Is Anti-Zionism always Antisemitic?"
Of course not. Those who say so seek to make any criticism of Israel unspeakable. It is equivalent to calling critics of America's actions or policies "Un-American," or to say, "America: Love it or Leave it!" In short, to define such criticism as treason.
What a crock. Israeli society criticizes its government plenty. There was just a whole year of that. Anti-Zionism means you want Israel to be disestablished. Even Israel’s non-Jewish population don’t want that. Cook is being obtuse. His assertion would necessarily make the massive numbers that have been protesting Netanyahu for a year or more anti-Zionists. They are no such thing. This just goes to show you how ignorant people who whitewash anti-Zionism are.
Anti-Zionism means no political or national rights to self-determination for Jews. Two groups who do so aren’t antisemitic: Fringe ultra-orthodox lunatics who meet with Iran’s leadership and believe only a fictional messianic figure can allow Jews to govern themselves, and communists - who believe that nations in general shouldn’t exist. So morons who don’t live in practical reality.
And, oh yeah - Islamists - who reject nation-statehood generally since only a caliphate (religious empire/imperial theocracy) makes sense.
So anti-zionists could be religious wackos, commies, jihadi Islamic supremacists, and ignorant people who can’t get a definition right.
And anti-semites. Which of course doesn’t preclude dual-membership in at least a couple of those groups as well. And as for the commies’ history with the Jews check out how Stalin treated Jews. (And millions of others. Sometimes mass-murderers are apparently ok with killing lots of Jews and depriving them of rights, too).
Anyone who still takes cult-woman-loving pretend macho man Butt-Crack Emcee seriously has to understand that he doesn’t even take himself seriously. I stopped reading him weeks ago.
But check out how he posts as evidence denying rapes, an article from October 9th - more than two months ago. This was before the IDF had even finished securing Israeli territory, let alone collecting all the forensic evidence, eyewitness testimonials, jihadi GoPro/body cam footage, etc., that’s accumulated in an avalanche ever since. So the guy doesn’t even check the dates of his own sources for an event in progress that’s unfolded for MORE THAN TWO MONTHS SINCE HIS “SOURCE.”
This guy couldn’t have graduated high school, let alone anything beyond that. Wikipedia articles of current events have better fact-checking.
And of course he can’t cite a single law that in Israel that has anything to do with “white nationalist” Zionism. Israel is as brown and black and white and off-white as any society comes. The Palestinians aren’t much different that way, either. And yet, they didn’t lynch each other, there was no Israeli Jim Crow or slavery (of which the Arab-Islamic world has a rich history) and nothing like the anti-white resentment that American Black nationalists stoke. Crack is probably jealous of that, and resentful as hell.
Crack is a great name for a guy who can’t put the pipe away. He named himself for the substance, not his performance skillz. Or maybe he’s just pro-rape, the way he’s pro-redlining of Jews. He’s not very big on rights, much bigger on resentments.
The bad guys are the Zionists, not the Jews.
Meaning that he thinks most of Israel’s population of 9.8 million are “bad guys.”
He thinks their nation is allowed to exist, just without any political or national rights. Stateless, landless, defenseless.
Kind of like how he was when his cult-following girlfriend ruined his life and showed everyone what an emasculated b*tch he was.
That’s Crack. No self-respect, no ability to grow up and learn. Just complain, complain, complain and never take responsibility for anything. Except for beating your chest and calling yourself “macho.”
This conflict really reflects itself in its followers. People who like Israel respect those who can get on their lives and want to make something of themselves. People who identify with Palestine are irresponsible whiners who blame everything on everyone else. No wonder their base consists of old communists and young entitled children who learn about history from TikTok.
And jihadis and antisemites.
they kill people in numbers unheard of since the Nazis.
The Allies killed way more Nazis (and civilians) than the Nazis inflicted on the Allies.
It’s nice of you to compliment Israel by comparing its military successes with the Allied victory.
"If there is so much poverty, poor nutrition, and oppression, why are most of the prisoners so fat?"
Being fat does not denote wealth, good health or proper nutrition, or do you think Americans are the healthiest people in the world?
'Being fat does not denote wealth, good health or proper nutrition, or do you think Americans are the healthiest people in the world?'
I understood it when I wrote it.
Americans are fat because we are wealthy enough to consume far more calories than we need.
Same for Gaza.
Truly poor people are not fat as they cannot consume enough calories.
Poor people in this country are subsidized by the government.
Gazans are subsidized by the world. So yes, that does denote 'wealth.'
Well, I mean there is Blinken's statements from CNN:
"Blinken calls sexual violence inflicted by Hamas 'beyond anything I've seen'"
The New Yorker:
"How Hamas Used Sexual Violence on October 7th
Physicians for Human Rights Israel issued a report collecting evidence of sexual and gender-based violence. One of its authors lays out their findings." They note that some of the witness accounts have been corroborated by the BBC and other news agencies.
The UK Times reported on survivors and witness' accounts: Evidence has emerged of the terrorist’s shocking brutality, including families burned alive, babies slaughtered in front of their parents, inhumane torture and other horrors.
Police say they have been exploring evidence of sexual violence, ranging from alleged gang rape to post-mortem mutilation.
BBC 12/5: The BBC has seen and heard evidence of rape, sexual violence and mutilation of women during the 7 October Hamas attacks.
WARNING: CONTAINS EXTREMELY GRAPHIC DESCRIPTIONS OF SEXUAL VIOLENCE AND RAPE
"Multiple photographs from the sites after the attack show the bodies of women naked from the waist down, or with their underwear ripped to one side, legs splayed, with signs of trauma to their genitals and legs."
I mean, there are also several Islamic Scholars who have asserted over the years that raping the enemy's women is absolutely a right of the righteous warrior.
So why stop looking for sources 2-3 days after the attack when evidence was still being gathered?
Why are the numbers from Hamas about persons killed in the counter-attack (especially those indicating that the child death rate is something like 140% of the total) are being taken at face value with absolutely NO demand for evidence?
The casual observer might have to start drawing conclusions about that.
Crack: "I've posted that link to the LA Times 4 times but I'm still 'No Rapes Crack.'
That's how into facts y'all are."
Facts? It's an article in the LA Times. The sexual assaults have been documented, confirmed by foreign correspondents and Secretary Blinken.
Why would anyone be so ridiculous as to deny rapes in the midst of hundreds of terrorist murders?
Michelle Dulak Thomson said...
'Crack, your original claim was that there was no "raping" at all.'
Provide evidence when you say things like that or you have no credibility and are a liar.
This is proof, as if more was needed, that you are a moral cretin, on top of being impenetrably ignorant.
Aside from some amount of torture porn evidence* you require to stop calling other liars, there is the astonishingly counterintuitive conclusion that you have reached that, yeah, ok, parents were murdered in front of their children, and people were burned to death, etc, but RAPE? NEVER!
But wait, there' s more. Immanuel Rant above noted Islam's direction to use captured women as sex slaves.
So, given all the atrocities we do know about, and Islam's encouragement of rape, what do you think is most likely the case?
*There are very good reasons for suppressing these graphic images, and if you can't suss them, Crack, you really need to seek out therapy.
They love me. They really, really love me.
"Americans are fat because we are wealthy enough to consume far more calories than we need...Truly poor people are not fat as they cannot consume enough calories."
The most fattening and non-nutritious foods available on grocery shelves are also among the cheapest. Obesity in low-income neighborhoods is an indicator of cheap food making up the staple diet in those communities.
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