"... and a control group of 34 patients received gender-affirming care, but did not get top surgery. Three months after surgery, the patients who had the procedure experienced significantly less chest dysphoria than they had prior to surgery, while patients in the control group experienced around the same levels of chest dysphoria as they had at the start of their care. Prior studies have also shown that chest dysphoria is a pervasive issue for trans and gender non-conforming youth.... American Civil Liberties Union lawyer Chase Strangio went viral on Twitter Monday after sharing his own experience with top surgery, which he received in his mid-20s. 'There is not a day that goes by that I don't think about how it was the best thing I have ever done for my survival,' the tweet read."
From " U.S. /Top surgery drastically improves quality of life for young transgender people, study finds" (CBS News).
Posts
119 comments:
This is all insanity. How did we reach this point?
The propaganda will get more desperate as time, and lawsuits, goes by.
Drastically?
Quality of Life (as if that were merely a one factor outcome)?
Wow! Just plain, wow!
gender-affirming care
what the HELL, is gender-affirming care?
How about, the control control group? Where they told the little girls to GROW UP??
Total BS. They are asking mentally unbalanced people about their feelings. Feelings can change.
I see the Dem Media Industrial Complex is at it again. Next up will be that the consensus of scientists agree that top surgery is an existential to the lives of these people and that they can't wait until age 21.
Mid 20's is one thing, pre-20's is a whole other scenario.
Curious to see when the term "chest dysphoria" ever showed up anywhere.
Plus, I call BS more generally.
oh, wait! i see now, that not only wasn't there a control group, there were NO GROUPS AT ALL
Three months after surgery is NO TIME. What about 2 years? what about 20?
It is interesting that the survey was done three months after the surgery occurred. I wonder what the results would be 5 or ten years later.
First, what do you expect an ACLU lawyer to say.
Second, he made the decision in his mid-20's. Quite different from a teen.
It takes more than 90 days for cognitive dissonance to dissipate.
And how do you get this result? By measuring outcomes a whole three months out.
Dysphoria is the opposite of euphoria. Both are purely mental conditions, neither of which should be treated with surgery or chemicals.
Three months? That is meaningless. This study is an embarrassment and not worthy of JAMA (except for the fact that JAMA has surely gone woke like most of the other major medical and psych journals have). Of course they're going to feel better in three months.
And then in three years, and six years, and sixteen years from now a lot of them are going to be saying, "My god, what did I do to myself!" And very quickly after that they will be saying, "My god, what did those doctors do to me!" In a few years the lawsuits against these doctors will begin, if they haven't already. And deservedly so in the cases of the minors, IMO. I think this whole business being done on minors will years from now be looked on sort of like the Tuskegee Syphilis Experiment now is.
The subreddit r/detrans has over 39,000 members. To join you have to have to self-identify your de-transition status.
There’s enough data there to conduct a comprehensive study. It probably won’t be done because it might give the politically ascending group of our time the information they don’t want to have to digest.
34 is a very small sample, and 3 months is a very short time period. And how many of them were age 14 to 17, which is the main bone (so to speak) of contention? We're going to take away parental control of life-changing decisions by minors based on a study of maybe half a dozen cases only within 90 days of the surgery?
These people are evil
Chase Strangio 'might be', a little motivated to pretend that her self mutilation was a good thing; as it DEFINES who she is.
Chase Strangio is an American lawyer and transgender rights activist.
Chase Strangio is the Deputy Director for Transgender Justice.
Chase Strangio worked as a paralegal at GLBTQ Legal Advocates & Defenders (GLAD)
Chase Strangio was named to the Trans 100 list for "outstanding contributions to the trans community".
Chase Strangio was included in 2020's Time 100 most influential people in the world
Chase Strangio is known for Trans in America (2018), Growing Up Coy (2016) and Disclosure (2020)
Everything (i mean, EVERY THING) that has ever been 'good' in Chase Strangio's life is because she pretends to be a guy.. EVERY THING.
Back when she was Kate Bachrach, she was LITERALLY a NOBODY
Flawed study designed to create the result that it generated. First, three months out is but a single point in time, particularly for the younger end of the test group - three months is hardly enough time to fully heal and to mentally adjust to life - the thrill of the new without time to reflect on what might have been lost.
Second, and more telling, those that did not receive the surgery received "gender-affirming care," which (as I understand it) means that they were supported in believing their gender to be other than their birth gender - in other words, girls who thought they were boys were counseled for three months that "yes, you are a boy." This seems designed specifically to increase chest dysphoria, and does not seem to be an appropriate control group.
40 mutilations per month at @$6000 per is almost $3,000,000 per year. For one ghoul/doctor.
Per the post the other
Of course it's beneficial. To the ghoul's bank account. Maybe (or maybe not) to the mutalee.
YEET THE TEET!!
oh Hell yeah
John stop fascism vote republican Henry
Whatever its root, LARPing as a man makes sense to her. Which circumstances in her life taught her that in order to be psychologically and emotionally whole, she must amputate her breasts and become dependent on exogenous testosterone? Why is being visibly female so intolerable that she’ll damage her health in order to hide it?
Maybe Strangio suffers from internalized homophobia?
Pushing the notion of ‘trans kids’ sets the gender-addled apart from ‘regular’ children, according them special status. The parents of these ‘special’ children also get to be special. Special people deserve privilege. ‘Trans’ means deciding to play on the boys or girls team, which is regular kids get no say in. Trans kids can choose to use the boys or the girls restroom, another privilege denied to standard issue kids. Gender-addled kids get to dictate how other people talk about them in their absence
I asked this question yesterday but didn't make it through the screening.
If cutting off young a woman's breasts is gender affirming, why then aren't breast augmentations (boob jobs) also considered gender affirming? Is it merely an insurance coding issue??
The former removes the unwanted growths to eliminate suffering from chest dysphoria, while the latter enhances the feature for females that want to be "more female" and experience chest euphoria.
"No Doc...I don't want them cut off, I want you to make them bigger. D-cups would be perfect. I like being female and just want my gender affirmed through surgery."
I think it makes perfect sense.
Three months! Try three years! And of course the most headstrong will stand by their choices.
It's those wimpier kids who got swept along who are sorry now.
Matt Walsh reply...
Wow.
So if you define "quality of life" as the absence of "chest dysphoria" (distress over unwanted breast development), and you remove the unwanted breasts, the patient's "quality of life" improves?
Whatever would we do without Science?
Why are we producing a generation of females that fear and hate being female?
There has never been a better time to be female than now. Women have more rights and freedoms than at any other point in history. Child birth is safer and more pain free than ever, and more importantly an option for those who behave responsibly.
Our government is referring to birthing people, and we just confirmed a female Supreme Court justice who claims not to know what a woman is. Men are pretending to be women, and out performing them everywhere.
Why the fuck are you women putting up with this?
I guess that's why so many of them commit suicide at some point afterwards.
It is intensely interesting to me that when Ann puts up a post and then waits some time to post the comments that so many of the comments are essentially the same.
Commenters here instantly figured out that this "study" was fatally flawed. Sample size was too small and three months is ridiculous.
I'm not a clinical statistician (I don't even play one on TV), but I have substantial doubt that a 3-month followup on the two groups has any real meaning.
You wouldn't expect the mastectomy patients to have had long enough to develop any regret, and you wouldn't expect the control group to have changed much, either.
I would expect the mastectomy patients to be reluctant for quite a long time to entertain the thought that they might have made a big mistake. Maybe they never have regrets, but those that do won't be immediate. It takes a long time to admit to yourself that you did something really stupid.
It is widely thought that people with gender dysphoria mostly grow out of it once they reach adulthood; I've seen 80% as a figure, but don't have a cite at hand. But that's after years of maturing, and coming to grips with their sexual oddness. To the extent that's true, it makes a 3-month followup look premature and ridiculously inconclusive.
Common sense says that people need to wait until the age of 25 to become eligible after passing a barrage of psychological testing.
Should we give anorexic people diet pills?
Wouldn’t that better affirm their body image?
So small sample over short time frame. It is your basic junk science study released specifically to be reported by the media to give it the "gravitas" it does not deserve. The only real difference from this sort of junk science now than, say, a couple of decades ago is back then the media would dutifully report these sorts of things because they couldn't tell they were being played, and today they report it because it supports the narrative and they are in cahoots.
Well that settles it then. We cannot allow the "chest dysphoria" plague distress our young people any more. It's Current Year, and progress must be made to solve a crisis that we just made up.
No blinding, no true control group, very short follow-up, no clear standard of diagnosis.
Woke science at its best!
Chase Strangio and "a study." Well, that's settled. The people who want to believe can continue.
Is that Stein's Law I see lurking in the shadows?
Sounds appropriate…
“Chest Fever” the Band: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=h_7q9_EJYvE
after sharing his own experience with top surgery,
Why would a guy need top surgery. The new pronoun convention is backwards.
gahrie said...Why are we producing a generation of females that fear and hate being female?
Exactly. If gender were merely "assigned at birth" and dysphoria were a real condition accurately diagnosed, you would expect to see roughly equal number s of men and women unhappy with their assigned gender. But that's not what we see. The male athletes and drag queens get all the press, but most people who want to live as the opposite gender are teenage girls.
Instead of mutilating them for profit, a serious society would ask why.
Study Link: https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamapediatrics/fullarticle/2796426?guestAccessKey=c50d5d6e-7fa1-4ed8-8b5d-f4da9753364d&utm_source=For_The_Media&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=ftm_links&utm_content=tfl&utm_term=092622
This is a nonrandomized prospective cohort study of patients who underwent top surgery between December 2019 and April 2021 and a matched control group who did not receive surgery. Patients completed outcomes measures preoperatively and 3 months postoperatively. This study took place across 3 institutions in a single, large metropolitan city. Patients aged 13 to 24 years who presented for gender-affirming top surgery were recruited into the treatment arm. Patients in the treatment arm were matched with individuals in the control arm based on age and duration of testosterone therapy.
Here's the key thing....there were 36 patients in one group, 34 in another. However, 11 patients dropped out and data was not included....
Not disclosed: What group did the 11 drop out of....?
Also, if you look at the data, I have zero idea if the changes were CLINICALLY significant. Some of the score changes were a 8% change in baseline. But in subjective measurements like this, in clinical research, oftentimes normal variations are ~20-30% from baseline. What that means is anything up to 20% variation is considered NOISE but these are not precise measurements. It's not like sending blood to a lab and getting a standard cholesterol reading, which maybe 99.9% accurate. The accuracies of these measurements might be 80%, for example. Which would mean that the results of this study are not clinically significant, especially in light of their drop out of 11 patients.
.......
I could go on, but this is why research + media nowadays is just narrative driving.
Three months? Laughably disingenuous.
Check back in five years, ghouls.
From the study:
METHODS:
Transmasculine youth aged 13 to 21 were recruited from a pediatric hospital–based gender clinic. Participants completed a semistructured qualitative interview exploring the experience of chest dysphoria and thoughts about or experiences with MCS. Interview transcripts were coded by 3 investigators employing modified grounded theory, with the median interrater reliability at κ = 0.92.
Child abuse. They should be jailed.
It's bad enough the whole educational/therapeutic establishment wants to lock kids into juvenile gay/lesbian identities.
That used to be just a phase too, for most of them.
Gusty Winds said...
If cutting off young a woman's breasts is gender affirming,
why then aren't breast augmentations (boob jobs) also considered gender affirming?
Here's a hypothetical question (one to base a hypothesis on ),
Of the girls with 'chest dysphoria', how many were unhappy because they were members of the
itty bitty titty commitee; and thought that being a boy would be better than being a dull, flat chested girl?
Maybe (just MAYBE!) what these gals REALLY NEED, to be happy and proud of their bodies..
Is a Nice Rack! You know, DD's, Something that they could stick into peoples faces.
Boob enhancement, maybe a nose job, some lippo; And these Gals might be PROUD, PROUD of WHO THEY ARE
Is gilbar saying this 'cause he gets commissions from Boob Job docs? To the best of Your knowledge no.
Is gilbar saying this, 'cause he's looking for hot new babes, to be pole dancing in front of him?
Again, to the best of Your knowledge, no (well, i guess we can all agree, maybe a little)
"Commenters here instantly figured out that this "study" was fatally flawed. Sample size was too small and three months is ridiculous."
I couldn't care less if it were the most carefully designed "study" ever performed in the history of evil bastards justifying their evil. If some twisted sister at Yale "discovers" "eye dysphoria", are we going to start paying greedy criminals with medical degrees $6k a pop to poke teenagers' eyeballs out?
I am starting to see, that Obamacare was even worse than we all thought. Worse than we even thought possible. When the "government" pays for "health care", everything becomes "health care".
At least they are all barren.
#self-limiting.
nonsense. they're mutilating depressed youth and it won't solve their real problems.
The corrupt vile left are operating on 14 year olds.
Insanity.
Looking it up, it seems many insurance companies (claim is most in California of course) cover gender affirming healthcare. Once it spreads everywhere we will all pay so University of Wisconsin Health can chop off young women's breasts. Heck even the US Military is providing gender reassignment care. We pay for that too.
If I were a woman and wanted a boob job I would sue claiming the boob job is my gender affirmation. Why should augmenting breasts be considered cosmetic, and cutting them off gender affirming "healthcare".
Imagine a whole new world where you can get cheap generic Viagra from GoodRx, and women can subsidized boob jobs. Now that's something I can support.
The Left is trying to normalize child abuse and criminal behavior.
"Experts say..."
"According to fact-checkers..."
: )
From the CBS News piece ...
Access to gender-affirming surgical care can be a life or death issue for trans youth. A study published in the journal Pediatrics found that nearly 51% of female-to-male respondents had attempted suicide, while the average youth suicide rate in the U.S. is 9%, according to a 2022 study by UCLA.
CBS News
From the National Alliance on Mental Illness ...
Suicidal thoughts are common among teens and young adults. In fact, about 11% of young adults (ages 18-25) report that they’ve had serious thoughts about suicide, and about 1–2% report a suicide attempt during the prior year. These numbers are higher among high school students — nearly 20% report serious thoughts about suicide and 9% report a suicide attempt. Among young adults 15–24 years old in the U.S., the rate of death by suicide in 2019 was about 14 per 100,000 people — slightly higher than one suicide for every 10,000 people in this age group.
NAMI
Note the large gap between self-reported-attempts rate and death-by-suicide rates.
As bad as this top surgery is, it is utter insanity to compare it to what the Jews suffered in the concentration camps. And we are not in a second civil war. For Buttwheathikes to post these equivocations shows how insane he is, and it trivializes what happened to the Jews in WWII, and what Americans suffered in the Civil War.
Gilbar said...
Maybe (just MAYBE!) what these gals REALLY NEED, to be happy and proud of their bodies..
Is a Nice Rack!
We're on to something here Gilbar. How many women do you think (lets say between 20 and 60 years old) who attended the women's march and wore pussy hats would turn down a free tax payer funded boob job?
I'm gonna go out on a limb and guess NONE! They'd all take it.
And if University of Wisconsin Health wants to improve campus moral, adding breast augmentations to the scope of their gender affirming surgeries would be wise. I'll bet you they'd be packed.
And if you can imagine it would make the "Jump Around" tradition at Camp Randall Stadium more run than it already is!
I'm sure others have commented on this, but three months? Seriously? That's exactly what's wrong with all of this. They're encouraging teenagers to make life-altering, irrevocable decisions. They don't have the perspective to do that.
"As bad as this top surgery is, it is utter insanity to compare it to what the Jews suffered in the concentration camps."
I tell you what. Next time someone compares something to "what the Jews suffered in the concentration camps", and that puts your tight little knickers in a twist, just substitute "what the Ukrainians suffered during the Holodomor". OK? Or maybe "what the Armenians suffered in the Genocide". Then your tight little knickers should fit just fine again.
TreeJoe said...
Study Link: https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamapediatrics/fullarticle/2796426?guestAccessKey=c50d5d6e-7fa1-4ed8-8b5d-f4da9753364d&utm_source=For_The_Media&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=ftm_links&utm_content=tfl&utm_term=092622
This is a nonrandomized prospective cohort study of patients who underwent top surgery between December 2019 and April 2021
Here's the key thing....there were 36 patients in one group, 34 in another. However, 11 patients dropped out and data was not included....
Oh, wow. Thank you TreeJoe!
1: A "prospective cohort study" means they're claiming that they set this study up with the participants beforehand
"nonrandomized" means it's crap, because by definition the controls and the non-controls are fundamentally different
"We lost 11 members of the study" with no details about what group they were in, why they dropped out, what their scores were like before they dropped out, compared to the rest of their group?
This is an utterly garbage "study" created to pursue a political agenda, not to advance understanding.
"Three months after surgery". These patients are from 18 months to 3 years ago. And they can't provide any data more than 3 months after the surgery?
3 months after the surgery their chests haven't healed enough to go about normal daily activities. They've yet to actually experience life without the breasts they mutilated.
The "feelings" they're "measuring" are "yay, I did this!", not "this is how it actually affected my life."
Finally, 14 years old? So much for the "you right wingers are lying when you say hospitals are doing this to minors!"
Top surgery? I have no idea what this might entail,
Is it related to a lobotomy?
gahrie said...
Why are we producing a generation of females that fear and hate being female?
There has never been a better time to be female than now. Women have more rights and freedoms than at any other
it's Not ALL women.. It's the flat chested dogs that can't get a date. That's WHY they hate themselves.
Get them a nice rack, some lippo, hair extensions; maybe a little gymnastics training..
and these ugly dogs will become regular love puppies (and Everybody LOVES a love puppy!)
The Problem is: LOW SELF ESTEEM
Gender dysphoria, chest dysphoria, body dysphoria All just come down to Self HATRED
And The Cure IS... Plastic Surgery to make these babes, BABES!!
Quit cutting, and Start Pumping!!
typingtalker said...
Note the large gap between self-reported-attempts rate and death-by-suicide rates.
Most of you, are my age, or older.. Remember When?
Remember when you Wanted Something?
And you'd tell mommie; "If you don't let me; i'll hold my breath until i DIE!"
???
Seems to work, for today's kids
10 years for a novel vaccine.
The long-term study was performed by Johns Hopkins, where the conclusion was that simulated gender (i.e. masculine, feminine attributes) did not help the individual and left a corrupted body and mind.
These are Mengele-style experiments performed on a captive population, underage people... persons. Human rites are performed as life-affirming remedies executed in abortion chambers.
The person who wrote the CBS article is down with the cause.
but this is why research + media nowadays is just narrative driving.
Handmade tales with "benefits".
“How many women do you think (lets say between 20 and 60 years old) who attended the women's march and wore pussy hats would turn down a free tax payer funded boob job?
I'm gonna go out on a limb and guess NONE! They'd all take it.”
Good grief. You think all the women who attended the Women’s March would have boob jobs if they were offered for free? You really think most if not all women would undergo the pain of breast surgery? For what? Do you really think women think that much about their boob size to undergo surgery? Seriously? Sheesh dude, there is more to life than women’s boobs, especially for women.
why so much dwelling on what was past?
why insist on trans- label for life after?
like >>> Christians = eternal-life = trans-dead = vampirism??!!
Stop calling it "top surgery." That euphemism masks cloaks the truth about this: these money-grubbing quacks are performing double mastectomies on healthy CHILDREN.
These people are sick. Full stop.
There will be absolute hell to pay.
3 months does not seem like enough time to sufficiently evaluate this. Surgery produces immediate results while talk therapy takes years, if it works at all. I'd like to know who is better off something more like 5 years later.
So people who had their breasts removed were cured of the symptom of "wanting to have their breasts removed" and those that did not have their breasts removed were not so cured because they still have breasts. SCIENCE!
"Chase Strangio" is a woman who had her breasts removed while in her 20s. She later gave birth to her child. Strangio is not a crazy person, no, not at all, which is why her opinion on mental health matters is so valued.
Gender affirmation is acknowledging that women and men are equal in rights and complementary in Nature/nature. The Progressive Cult ran this indoctrination scheme before with women and girls to take a knee to sexual promiscuity at progressive ages a la transgender conversion therapy (e.g. popular culture) and to dread the "burden" bump that may follow with her first choice: to abstain or fuck, that is the question and consent to human rights.
why insist on trans- label for life after?
Trans refers to a state or process of divergence (from normal). Simulated and stimulated divergence through medical, surgical, and psychiatric corruption is a persistent and, according to Johns Hopkins studies, a progressive condition that is a first-order forcing of catastrophic anthropogenic gender (i.e. physical attributes, sexual orientation) change.
I have a novel idea. Why don't we let the patient and his doctor decide? I would think the Republican party would not want this to be the role of the government. Guess I'm wrong from reading the comments.
Top surgery is very very different from bottom surgery in my mind. If the person regrets it later the person can always have breast enhancement surgery. But it seems that most people don't regret their decision. So leave them the fuck alone.
Inga said.
"Good grief. You think all the women who attended the Women’s March would have boob jobs if they were offered for free? You really think most if not all women would undergo the pain of breast surgery? For what? Do you really think women think that much about their boob size to undergo surgery? Seriously? Sheesh dude, there is more to life than women’s boobs, especially for women."
Well. They universally vote Democrat, and they did were stupid hats, so yes.
The lack of a control group where patients were not affirmed for who they are is deeply troubling. I'm unclear what exactly their counseling is entailed, but it doesn't appear they were counseled that they don't need surgery and their bodies are perfect the way they are - which would be the correct control to say "Is surgery better than counseling"
Stop calling it "top surgery."
Planned Genderhood
Funny to see Rod Dreher's "merited impossibility" at work in close to real time; the shift from "this isn't happening, no one would perform surgery like that on 14 year old kids" to "of course it's happening and it's great that it's happening--look at how great the outcomes are for those 14 year old kids" with no pause between the two is just great to watch.
Long-term studies are for chumps anyway; remember all the "kids are resilient, this'll be fine" takes a year ago regarding school closures? Eh, it's just the most vulnerable members of our society, why *shouldn't* we subordinate their physical and mental well-being to the demands of a tiny, radical minority's desires?
Clown world.
Blogger Inga said...
You think all the women who attended the Women’s March would have boob jobs if they were offered for free?
Ok-ok. Maybe not 100% but I'll guarantee you it's a strong majority. Way more than 51%.
Inga also said...
Do you really think women think that much about their boob size to undergo surgery? Seriously? Sheesh dude, there is more to life than women’s boobs, especially for women.
Sorry. I was probably projecting a little ;) But....
Annually there are about 300K boob jobs performed each year in the United States, and 600K abortions. Considering two boobs per surgery that's a 1 to 1 ratio. In 2020, even with COVID reductions American Women had 12.4 million cosmetic procedures as compared to 1.1 million for men.
So yeah. I do think a majority of pussy hatted women at the march would gladly accept a free boob job. And Inga, I thought you'd be a fan of my gender affirming idea. Free boob jobs would probably lead to an increase in the need for free abortions.
That's a win-win for college educated white women...no???
“They universally vote Democrat, and they did were stupid hats, so yes.”
You didn’t wear a stupid hat to make you stupid. Although your hat does look pretty stupid on you.
“Annually there are about 300K boob jobs performed each year in the United States, and 600K abortions. Considering two boobs per surgery that's a 1 to 1 ratio. In 2020, even with COVID reductions American Women had 12.4 million cosmetic procedures as compared to 1.1 million for men.
So yeah. I do think a majority of pussy hatted women at the march would gladly accept a free boob job. And Inga, I thought you'd be a fan of my gender affirming idea. Free boob jobs would probably lead to an increase in the need for free abortions.”
There are 165 million women in the US. Also cosmetic surgery includes much more than just boob jobs. I think your assertion that the majority of women at the Women’s March would have breast augmentation if it was free is just plain dumb. So no I’m not buying your silly idea that having breast augmentation is gender affirming. Do you need penile augmentation to feel like more of a man? And tell me why you think it’s a good idea for there to be more abortions? You are one confused man.
We are awash in never ending bullshit.
jim5301 said...
I have a novel idea. Why don't we let the patient and his doctor decide?
Um, well, how about because that's not how we do things in the US?
See: pain pills. See FDA cracking down on doctors for prescribing "too many" pain pills
For that matter, why does my doctor get a vote? Why is it not "my body, my choice"?
Why can't I go out and get testosterone shots just because I want to be higher T?
Why can't I go out and get human growth hormone? Why does the FDA get a choice about that?
How many athletes have been sanctioned for taking drugs prescribed by their doctor, that were ruled to be "illegally performance enhancing"?
Why are you so completely full of shit, Jim? Is it just because it's required as being on the Left?
Of, and final point: I'll be more in favor of "me and my doctor decide" when it's just you paying for the "treatment".
No insurance. No Medicare / Medicaid. Because "he who pays the piper calls the tune." And if you're going to make us pay for it, we deserve a vote
And you'd tell mommie; "If you don't let me; i'll hold my breath until i DIE!"
Well these kids are learning that they do have agency. Boy, do they have agency! They have agency in spades!
And when they look back they know they did this to themselves. But they'll blame the adults anyway.
Inga also said...
Do you really think women think that much about their boob size to undergo surgery? Seriously? Sheesh dude, there is more to life than women’s boobs, especially for women.
Not for the women getting this "top surgery". because otherwise they wouldn't be getting it
A whole three months!
I feel like a boy.
Breasts are things girls have.
I hate these things on my chest.
Those things have been cut off.
I no longer hate the things that are now NOT on my chest) i.e. experienced significantly less chest dysphoria.)
What a surprise.
jim5301 said...
I have a novel idea. Why don't we let the patient and his doctor decide? I would think the Republican party would not want this to be the role of the government. Guess I'm wrong from reading the comments.
Top surgery is very very different from bottom surgery in my mind. If the person regrets it later the person can always have breast enhancement surgery. But it seems that most people don't regret their decision. So leave them the fuck alone.
***********
Yeah, sure----reversing "top" surgery removal of breast tissue with breast enhancement surgery using artificial materials will completely return the breasts to their former ability to provide milk for those women's babies.
Riiiigggghhhht
I have a novel idea. Why don't we let the patient and his doctor decide? I would think the Republican party would not want this to be the role of the government. Guess I'm wrong from reading the comments.
No, we think it should be the role of the parents, when the proposed patient is a minor, particularly a minor with a mental condition that causes him or her to hate his or her body.
Of course it's up to the patient and doctor when the patient is an adult. But that condition - adulthood - doesn't negate the prior condition - gender dysphoria - which the left as represented by our media betters appears to believe should be treated solely by indulging the imagination of the sufferer.
It's old hat now to bring up anorexia, but - anorexia.
Yep, you can go twitter & read a tweet by a woman who had her healthy breats removed for aesthetic reasons & recommends the procedure to others, but you can't read any tweets by Trump.
Because they are dangerous!
Why is CBS publishing this?
Jupiter said...
I tell you what. Next time someone compares something to "what the Jews suffered in the concentration camps", and that puts your tight little knickers in a twist, just substitute "what the Ukrainians suffered during the Holodomor". OK? Or maybe "what the Armenians suffered in the Genocide". Then your tight little knickers should fit just fine again.
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I noticed that your friend Buttwheathikes has removed his post. Good. I am a Reagan Republican. He was the first Republican I ever voted for. But you and your asshole friends here claim that what is happening right here, now, in the United States, September 28, 2022, is the exact same thing that happened in the Nazi concentration camps against the Jews. And you and your idiot friends claim that what is happening now, September 28, 2022, is the exact same thing that happened in America during the Civil War. You are a troll and are being paid by the left-wing Democrats to try to stop the Republicans from winning this election. Eat shit and die. Please.
If you've to a beach or public pool you have probably seen a number of cis teen boys with breasts. (They are usually the boys wearing shirts in the pool out of shame.) Are we offering these boys the same care as a trans boy? Why not? That boy suffers hard from "breast dysphoria." The kid is wearing a shirt to conceal his shame. This is also the type of boy that the left likes to ridicule and call an incel.
"Study says..."
That settles it. Mutilation of children is a good thing. Don't ask again.
"And how do you get this result? By measuring outcomes a whole three months out."
We just heard the other day that these quacks lose contact with their patients, so follow-up data isn't very good. Maybe three months is long term for these folks.
Keep women affordable, available, and taxable, and the "burdens" of evidence aborted, cannibalized, sequestered in darkness, in abortion chambers. And, NOW (pun intended), keep girls barefoot, barechested, and on bended knee, in progressive clinics. This is how feminism/masculinism first liberalized to torment women, girls, men, boys, and babies... fetal-Americans... People of Pink, too. One step forward, two steps backward.
"Maybe childhood makes you sad sometimes, and there are solutions other than hand me the dick saw."
I tell you what. Next time someone compares something to "what the Jews suffered in the concentration camps",
To be fair, babies are aborted under the same pretense: life deemed unworthy of life, but fetuses are socially distant and essential sacrifices, as Jews were alleged to have "Jew privilege" and deplorable, therefore their termination was prosecuted under a regime of social justice. Also, girls are less than human, merely an abstraction of a humanoid model, to be reordered and corrupted in Mengele-style experiments, to be aborted as excess "burdens" in some ethical, secular seance. That said, there is no conflation. We have the capacity to appreciate wicked solutions separately and jointly.
The problem is that the change is PERMANENT. Nobody, at 17, is the same person they will be at 30 or 40 or 50.
Tattoo removal, after all, is a big business.
This is the Big Lie of the transsexual medical industry: your gender identification is a permanent part of your identity and your psyche. It will never change.
What does the APA say about female transsexuals that change their mind months or years after their surgery? Are they crazy now or were they crazy then? Does the APA think that the de-transitioners have a mental disorder? Are they crazy? Does the APA recommend that regretful transsexuals receive counseling to accept the reality of their newly assigned sexual identity?
I wish it was called what it is: a double mastectomy.
"Top surgery drastically improves quality of life for young transgender people, study finds" (CBS News)."
How young? At what age does CBS enable the normalization of kiddy mutilation?
Next week on CBS: "Anal sex drastically improves quality of life for pre-schoolers who could, possibly, some day, maybe, identify as gay, study finds."
Child mutilation. Child molestation. Why not? God permits sexual depravity in those so inclined. "So God abandoned them to do whatever shameful things their hearts desired. As a result, they did vile and degrading things with each other’s bodies." Romans 1:24 (NIV).
Of course, God favors children, but the reckoning for the adults will come along later.
From lurking at /detrans for a few months I get the impression that these kids are mainly boys who don't think they're macho enough and girls who don't feel femme enough.
Based on oldtime stereotypes, e.g "girls like pink."
It's that lame.
When I was a teenaged male, I'd have loved, absolutely loved, to have a pair of tits to play with any time I wanted. Oddly, this wasn't considered bodily dysphoric, just hormonally horny.
Three months seems a bit short when we are talking about people who are going to live another 70-80 years. Let me know how they feel when they are 30.
mikee said...
When I was a teenaged male, I'd have loved, absolutely loved, to have a pair of tits to play with any time I wanted. Oddly, this wasn't considered bodily dysphoric, just hormonally horny.
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I've always said that if I were a male trapped in a female body, I'd be easy to spot feeling myself up and grinning.
gender-affirming care
Now THERE's an Orwellian "who you gonna believe, me of your lyin' eyes?" phrase for you.
A medical doctor is supposedly "affirming" a delusion and "caring" for it by cutting off some kid's tits or wiener----both signs of sex and NOT gender---off.
For those willing to look at another side of the gender dysphoria issue, there's an excellent article here.
There are also thought-provoking links inside the article.
Child mutilation. Child molestation. Why not?
Forward! And don't spare the babies, or the children, or the teenagers, or the 30-somethings who wish upon a rainbow.
Next week on CBS...
Was last week on CBS, seemed like just last trimester on PBS, remember the back... black hole... whore h/t NAACP and DIE.
" ... one group of 36 patients received top surgery ..."
These criminal swine hacked the breasts off of 36 young women. They should be stood against a wall and shot.
" But you and your asshole friends here claim that what is happening right here, now, in the United States, September 28, 2022, is the exact same thing that happened in the Nazi concentration camps against the Jews."
Well, a) I don't have any asshole friends here, they are mostly "Holocaust" believers like you, and b) I made no such claim, I just note that the concentration camps had one fuck of a lot of survivors. Things didn't turn out so well in Armenia and Ukraine. But somehow, what happened in Poland in 1944 was the worst thing ever. Listen, what's happening to Uighurs in China right now is every bit as bad as what happened to Jews and Gypsies in Poland, maybe worse. So much for "Never again!".
Ampersand said...
It takes more than 90 days for cognitive dissonance to dissipate
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Or rather, confirmation bias. Voluntarily submit to an irreversible bodily harm, most gonna be reluctant to claim regret.
See repeated MRNA jab seekers for more proof.
Commendably honest journalist Jesse Singal dug into the study and found that it was measuring patients' responses to a series of questions that had nothing to do with dysphoria and instead just measured whether you had breasts that caused discomfort. I.e., of course your scores on that scale will change once you no longer have breasts. The study is basically just measuring whether the surgery was effective in removing patients' breasts, not whether they were happier afterward.
https://twitter.com/jessesingal/status/1575280120876748807?t=IamJ1w68MvG-iv83nNvChQ&s=19
Blogger Jupiter said...
. . .
But somehow, what happened in Poland in 1944 was the worst thing ever.
. . .
Are you talking about the part where the SS Werewolf brigades killed the patients in a Catholic hospital, flogged its Nun-nurses, raped them, and then murdered them?
'Cuz while that may not be the worst thing that one group of human beings has ever done to another group of human beings, it was pretty bad.
If you are LGB or black and find it curious how quickly the Ts rose to power in your Victim Hierarchy, look no further than these hospitals. Mutilating children has become their new cash cow.
"I asked this question yesterday but didn't make it through the screening"
But somehow Howard's ad hominem does, I find that hysterical.
Anyways, this is all about keeping hospitals in business via normalizing mental illness to justify elective surgery.
Expect more "studies" that frame skeptics as Science Deniers. If you thought Climatology perverted the Sciences, hold on to your hats. Transgenderism is going to make Climatology look vanilla missionary porn.
Blogger Inga said..
LOL I love the irony of homosapien females who LITERALLY evolved their bodies to present full breasts outside of breastfeeding... pretending they wouldn't stampede offers for free breast augmentation like a Black Friday sale at Walmart.
Only slightly less amusing is Inga Althouse's longevity as a sock puppet troll on this blog. Ann must think you guys are really stupid.
The topic of gender-affirming surgery seems to be Althouse affirming as well.
I just think it's really a seminal moment, culturally. The SPCA must be very, very proud: Their campaign toward getting people to neuter their household pets has become so overwhelmingly popular that people are now reaching out and starting to neuter their children with the approval of the medical community.
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