I'm reading "Already voted for a candidate who dropped out? Here's how you can change your vote" (Milwaukee Journal Sentinel).
Among the dropouts in the past month were Democratic Senate candidates Alex Lasry, Sarah Godlewski and Tom Nelson, and Republican gubernatorial candidate Kevin Nicholson.... If you or someone you know already voted for a candidate who is no longer running for office, it's not too late to void your ballot and change your choice.
A voter can request to spoil their ballot through either a handwritten or emailed note to their local election clerk or in person at their polling place. Voters must provide a reason in their request that outlines why they require a new ballot. Casting a vote for a candidate who is no longer in the race is a valid and acceptable rationale to spoil a ballot.
I don't understand how the first ballot can be retrieved. Do they just allow someone to vote again based on the allegation that they'd voted for a candidate who has now dropped out? Votes for the dropouts, it could be said, don't matter. And yet, what if everyone who voted for one of them got a second vote and voted for them again? Also, what if the allegation is untrue and the voter is voting again for a candidate who hasn't dropped out? What is the safeguard?
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১৩৬টি মন্তব্য:
There are no election safeguards in WI. It is a corrupt state where the Dems run the election process and cheat at will.
"Also, what if the allegation is untrue and the voter is voting again for a candidate who hasn't dropped out?"
Just depends. Extra votes for Dems are fine.
"What is the safeguard?"
None. Dems like it that way.
Early voting, like absentee ballots, degrades "our democracy." The thing is, many people like it. Democracy, after all, is just another tool.
Welcome to the "insurrection".
It may not be fraud, but it sure does prompt a lot of questions.
Another source of voter fraud.......
To be honest, I believe that voting in Washington state is rigged. We have some morons that could give Joe Biden a run for his money, and they keep getting re-elected.
Early voting and vote anywhere fanatics rarely acknowledge the downside. Same with pushers of ranked-choice voting. This is likely pay-walled, but it is a good article.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/ranked-choice-voting-makes-a-joke-of-alaska-politics-primary-general-elections-nonpartisan-rounds-confusion-sarah-palin-santa-claus-11659107111
The problem, of course, is humans.
Excellent questions. Cynical me suggests the 'safeguard' is keeping Democrats in power.
What is the safeguard?
What we've been trying to tell you is...there isn't one.
Oh. Couldn’t people who voted for Biden change their vote?
Biden looks like he dropped out.
Safeguard? Democrats don’t need no stinkin’ safeguards.
Make election day great again.
I don't understand how the first ballot can be retrieved. Do they just allow someone to vote again based on the allegation that they'd voted for a candidate who has now dropped out? Votes for the dropouts, it could be said, don't matter. And yet, what everyone who voted for one of them got a second vote and voted for them again. Also, what if the allegation is untrue and the voter is voting again for a candidate who hasn't dropped out? What is the safeguard?
Seems the cure is easy- Election DAY
You know, like many other countries do it, like we used to- one day, set aside, for the election. Show up, prove who you are, and vote! The great liberal European democracies who the elites say we should emulate (except for their abortion laws and other things they don't like) have all rejected mail in voting for just this reason- it's open to fraud, there are no real safeguards.
I'd even be willing to go so far as they do in third world countries- after voting dip a finger in the purple ink that doesn't come off for >24 hours no matter how hard you scrub. That would prevent the bussing of street people from precinct to precinct in places like NYC- not that that's even happened....
I echo your concerns. I assume the envelope that the absentee ballot went into can be retrieved as I don't think they are opened until it's time to count. This is the problem with early voting though. If it were up to me I wouldn't allow voting before election day at all, except if someone is truly unavailable. But whatevs.
A ballot can be spoiled any time before it is counted. After spoiling it will not be counted. Early votes remain in the sealed envelope until election day. On election day envelopes are opened and run through the tabulator by polling staff. The rules on spoiling on election day are lenient. All you need to do is say you made a mistake. No one checks to make sure the mistake really was made because only one ballot is counted. There are limits (3, I think) on the number of ballots a person can spoil.
I don't understand how the first ballot can be retrieved. Do they just allow someone to vote again based on the allegation that they'd voted for a candidate who has now dropped out?
Giggle.
Sorry, that's one of the risks of allowing early voting. What if the guy you voted for were revealed to be under FBI investigation for sex trafficking?
It's actually worse here because the early returns impact who drops out. Vote on a lark, after all if that doesn't pan out you can vote again? What a horrible system.
Just because you're allowed to commit to one candidate weeks before you have to doesn't make it a good idea.
If you vote in-person early then I doubt that you can get another ballot with this claim. If you voted absentee or early by mail then they can spoil the unopened ballot and replace it with a new one. That does mean that they don't count any of the votes you made on that ballot. This is another reason why mail-in votes are usually not counted early so as to allow time for spoiling ballots via in-person voting. Also a reason why mail-in and other early voting should be discouraged in general.
"What is the safeguard?"
You must be kidding lady. Have you not been paying attention.
THERE ARE NO SAFEGUARDS. That's the whole point.
Your elections are fraudulent.
Early voting is yet another scheme by corrupt democrats. I'm not opposed to some early voting. but the left's ideas are all pure hot garbage.
'What is the safeguard?'
You're so cute when you're naive : )
Oh, that’s easy. If you voted for some that dropped out, then just say that and they’ll deduct the vote for that dropout. The person is already out of the race so it won’t matter. See, you can account…. Wait what? You think maybe someone who already voted for someone that polls say is coming in second might claim to have voted for the drop out to put in another vote to move second to first? Who would think of such a thing?
In Montana the ballot would still be inside two outer envelopes with your name on it, to be counted starting election eve. So it could be retrieved before being separated from the envelopes and tabulated.
It's Wisconsin. There are no safeguards. That's the whole point. It's the way Democrats now operate in the state. To get around the WI Supreme Court drop box ruling, Racine has now used its Zuckerbucks and invested in "mobile dropbox" vans. They are out there ballot harvesting in broad daylight like its a good humor truck.
Last week someone successfully requested Robin Vos' absentee ballot, and Wisconsin shipped it to an alternative address. Rather than address or fix the problem, the WEC freaked out and their attitude was "how dare someone do this and decrease faith in the integrity of our election system".
Only solution is the GOP better get going with ballot harvesting in red counties and start cheating themselves. Fight fire with fire. Let's have a free for all.
Wisconsin likes to pretend that zero personal effort is required to vote. Dems host ballot harvesting in the park right in broad daylight (Madison 2020) so their lazy voters don't have to make any effort. Then corrupt clerks mix the ballots with ones that were dropped off in order to destroy chain of custody and make any sort of challenge difficult. You know that shit is being stuffed and ballots are being "cured".
Wisconsin in now more inept and corrupt than Illinois. Turns out we really did envy those FIBS all these years. The outlying counties don't want to be like Illinois, but it does make sense that it would be a desire in Madison.
If a dead person voted ten times for a drop out can he get a do-over on all of them? Asking for a friend.
We have managed to make voting so much more difficult that it has to be. And that only opens up worlds of possibility for fraud. And when you bring up those possibilities you are put into a pen with the Climate Deniers and Vaccine Deniers. Election Deniers!
Well..."A voter can request to spoil their ballot through either a handwritten or emailed note to their local election clerk or in person at their polling place." Sure. Can you imagine the DNC and their consultants working on this one? Yeah...I er...voted for the wrong person. No, I mean I voted for a person who has quit. Please send me another ballot. And another. And another. And another.
I still don't understand why the vast majority of people cannot vote on one single day. Call it a statewide or national holiday. Give everyone a day off. Not enough? Give everyone two days off. If you cannot play citizen for a few hours once every two or four years, it's probably not that important to you. You'd probably wait in line longer to get tickets to see Billie Eilish. That we have to give people multiple chances to vote, on multiple days, using multiple methods, and allowing multiple ballots to be gathered by multiple collectors does not seem to paint a landscape of serene security. It is more of an open invitation to corruption.
Let's say you voted for a candidate that didn't drop out. You can just claim otherwise and request another ballot, and vote again for the same candidate. Who's going to check? You think Milwaukee and Madison are going to make any effort to make sure someone didn't vote twice? Come on. Get real.
Democrats and this lazy early/absentee voting bullshit. To bad they don't concentrate on paying their bills early.
Madison, Wisconsin in all its bullshit flailing around about "protecting democracy" has whittled away and destroyed it in our once great state. We are not this corrupt in Waukesha County. We work in private industry. Vote in person, with our ID before or after work.
We work our jobs...collect our pay...believe we're gliding down the highway when in fact we're slip sliding away.
Wisconsinites. It's over. Drink more beer.
I'm not sure what your problem is with a person changing their vote (at least up until election day).
Althouse asked: What is the safeguard?
That's really cute. Pretending that Madison, Milwaukee, GB, and Racine are interested in implementing voting integrity safeguards. The concern however is appreciated.
The WI voting system is designed by Madison to avoid safeguards.
Next we can pretend that Soros funded Democrat DAs in the state are interested in protecting law abiding citizens from criminals.
hello >>>> does anyone in USA know how to run election honestly?
Like, why is a safeguard needed? The original ballot gets spoiled (and therefore not counted), so what's the issue?
I can understand putting limits on how often you let people do this to reduce the cost in terms of how many election workers you need to hire, train, etc.
Its a feature of the coming election, not a bug. Create the possibilty to cheat and I'll be damned, Dems took the house again. How did that happen?
and thats why Covid exists.
I mean, it makes sense to safeguard against letting people spoil someone else's ballot, by, for example, requiring the person to show ID. But there's no real reason to safeguard against spoiling your own ballot.
If an early vote is put inside an envelope identifying the voter, it would be possible to retrieve the first ballot. It would also be possible to check whether the candidate you voted for the first time has dropped out, although I would expect that checking is against the rules and they will take your word for that.
i have NO IDEA, about your side of the river, but; i'm pretty sure over here, the mail in (absentee) ballots stay in their envelops until election day; when they're pulled out (in an inner envelope) and stacked in a pile (and ignored unless the margin of the win is taller than the height of the pile)..
There is far too much early voting. You can thank the Democrat Party for weaponizing that using yearly "6:59 p.m. fake voter crises" perfected by Cynthia McKinney and other southern Democrat and northern agitator race grifters.
And this is one situation where I call them Democrat Party, not DNC.
"A ballot can be spoiled any time before it is counted. After spoiling it will not be counted. Early votes remain in the sealed envelope until election day. On election day envelopes are opened and run through the tabulator by polling staff. The rules on spoiling on election day are lenient. All you need to do is say you made a mistake. No one checks to make sure the mistake really was made because only one ballot is counted. There are limits (3, I think) on the number of ballots a person can spoil."
How do they know which ballot is yours? That's my question. Does the out envelope have your name on it or some kind of identification number?
If you vote in-person early then I doubt that you can get another ballot with this claim.
i voted early last time (here in iowa), and what they did was.. Gave me an absentee ballot
No one checks to make sure the mistake really was made because only one ballot is counted.
unless the democrats need more votes, then they call a recount; which USUALLY counts the spoiled ballots too. This is why
*there were so many hanging chads
*there were so many votes for Buchanan and democrat senators
*washington state had more votes for a democrat governor(?) than votes cast
I've NEVER heard of a recount, where the number of votes decreases.. Have You?
I've NEVER heard of a recount, where the number of votes for the democrat decreases.. Have You?
"In Montana the ballot would still be inside two outer envelopes with your name on it, to be counted starting election eve. So it could be retrieved before being separated from the envelopes and tabulated."
Noted.
I would like the newspaper article to contain information like that about Wisconsin. How can the newspaper be so out of touch about our worries that the procedures are not adequate? I'm raising a simple and obvious question that should be answered in the article but isn't. And notice how stirred up so many of you got because it resonates with worries you already have.
What is the need to vote so damn early?
But also, if there is a procedure for removing the first vote, what assurance do we have that the procedure is followed? Here we'd have a voter who believed they were only voting once, but both votes could be counted.
100 years ago, we had very high voter turn-out even though most people did not have cars and there was no early voting. If a big scandal or revealing debate arises close to the election, early voting is a problem. This actually happens a lot. Unless you are house-bound, I don't think you should be allowed. Maybe have voting over 2 days.
For national elections, I very much oppose the networks calling states as soon as the polls close because the West Coast and Hawaii are still voting and can be influenced if they think their candidate can't win.
Would be hard AF to find the original tho. But we'd check the dbms to see when it is was logged in, and a dozen ladies would go through the trays of ballots and find it.
But do carry on with the conspiracy crapola.
I don't like early voting either. But we were already voting 70% absentee as it is was pre covid, because people just can't be arsed to make it to the polls on election day.
Witness said...
But there's no real reason to safeguard against spoiling your own ballot.
Sure there is! you're half way down the ballot, and you realize that you marked one (or more) of your votes in the wrong column
Let's say it's florida, 2000.. You're punching out your chads, and realize that you marked Buchanan for President (because it was where you thought Gore should be..
You raise your hand, and tell the poll person that you messed up your ballot..
They give you a NEW ballot, which you punch out.. They take your messed up ballot, and place it into the box with all the other spoiled ballots (AND the provisional ballots, and the ballots that they just punched for fun)..
THEN! if Gore needs more votes (and it turns out that he needs florida), THEN they count that box
This is WHY, democrat strongholds never (Never (EVER!)) report their numbers until they know how many numbers they need (this is true for counts, recounts, and re-recounts)
“How do they know which ballot is yours? That's my question. Does the out envelope have your name on it or some kind of identification number?”
They know which ballot is yours because it’s still in the envelope that has your name address and signature, as well as the name address and signature of your witness on it. Your ballot doesn’t leave the envelope to get counted until after voting ends on Election Day, that is how I understand it.
The ballot database accepts only one vote envelope to be logged in per voter record. Any additional will be rejected.
The ballots would have been scanned in as "received" before being set aside for tabulation. You would have to delete that receipt so the new ballot won't be rejected.
It is no small matter to do that and as an ordinary ballot receiptor I wouldn't have the authority even if I knew how.
Our voting system is a joke on purpose.
and - what Temujin said.
Spoiling Absentee Ballot Explainer
What sort of horsestuff is this!?!? You should cast your vote and take your chances.
Ann: Here is a link to the Wisconsin absentee voting law passed by the legislature Although clerks and the WEC will do whatever the heck they want.
It’s pretty detailed.
I don’t think a reporter is going to read this, nor promote the law, when violation of it is the whole point.
Original Mike FTW!
Inga- do they hold the envelope up to their heads to divine who voted for who? Then what?
Do they contact the voter- or does the voter go and fetch their ballot, and re-vote.
I don't think you understand at all.
btw- the witness line on the envelope is for people who are unable to sign. it's rarely used at all.
Ann 10:17 - Good question.
The assurance is that a pack of Democrats say so, without provided proof. Is that enough?
You know what would easily solve this problem ? Voting in person on election day. But that would be "voter suppression."TM
What is the safeguard?
You are so cute when you write that.
Seems like someone who lived in Wisconsin who was curious about this could test this out and blog about their experience. Hey Jeremy from The Quartering lives in Wisconsin I could go to his YouTube channel and badger him about it. 👀
One thing that makes me suspicious about voting/voter registration/voter rolls is that the people in charge are always so hesitant to explain the process and safeguards.
I still remember in 2020 the person in Wisconsin saying over and over how meticulous they are in their process.
I'm told mail-in voting is needed because doing it in person is too hard for some people. For the sake of argument, say that's true. Then what about this?
"A voter can request to spoil their ballot through either a handwritten or emailed note to their local election clerk or in person at their polling place. Voters must provide a reason in their request that outlines why they require a new ballot."
Wouldn't it be at least as easy to just show up and vote on election day?
I see no justification for this. By voting early, the voter assumes the risk that events, any event, between now and election day would change his selection. Dropping out is only one of them. If the candidate drops out, treat his/her votes like any other write-in candidate. Who knows, he/she just might win.
Democracy Dies in Dropouts.
Blogger Carol said...
The ballot database accepts only one vote envelope to be logged in per voter record. Any additional will be rejected.
WI didn't remove 206,000 inactive voters from its voter rolls until 2021 after lawsuits etc... So if you're dead or moved out of state, your fraudulent absentee ballot can still be verified as "active". It was proven last week you can get anyone's absentee ballot sent to your address with just their name and date of birth.
If you have corrupt clerks (like Madison, WI and Milwaukee, WI) they can harvest ballots off these rolls by the thousands. They can even fill out a ballot for people they see didn't vote yet. That was the whole point to the Zuckerbucks.
In a state that swings on 10K to 20K votes, leaving 206,000 inactive people on the list is not an accident.
Who are the one's who bitch and moan about cleaning up the voter rolls? That's right. Democrats.
unless the democrats need more votes, then they call a recount; which USUALLY counts the spoiled ballots too
While shouting “count all the votes”, and if you mention “all legal votes, which wouldn’t count votes in envelopes without names or spoiled votes, well then you are called an “insurrectionist” that wants to destroy our democracy.
What happens if I voted in the Texas primary 5 months ago, then moved to Wisconsin, voted in their primary by mail, then decided Texas was better in move back in early August to vote for Beto in November? What if I don’t actually move from Texas but did buy property that shows I live in Wisconsin? I hear AirBnB’s are popular in blue states, so hypothetically I could open up a few of these in multiple locations. Better yet, I can invite a few friends to stay in my Airbnb’s so long as they try a new one after 30 days.
"The ballot database accepts only one vote envelope to be logged in per voter record. Any additional will be rejected."
It's almost like they take this sort of thing seriously.
When ballots are taken out of envelopes, state by state
Clarification…
in WI the ballots are taken out of the envelopes and begin to be processed after the opening of polls on Election Day.
“btw- the witness line on the envelope is for people who are unable to sign. it's rarely used at all.”
The witness line I am referring to as I said, is on the envelope. In WI to cast an absentee vote, a witness is required. The witness MUST sign and include their address on the envelope for the vote to be counted. I’m surprised there are so many “experts” from other states on how we vote in Wisconsin.
"How do they know which ballot is yours? That's my question. Does the out envelope have your name on it or some kind of identification number?"
Page 103 should help.
https://elections.wi.gov/media/13820/download
“Inga- do they hold the envelope up to their heads to divine who voted for who? Then what?
Do they contact the voter- or does the voter go and fetch their ballot, and re-vote.
I don't think you understand at all.”
If you had bothered to read any of the articles linked, the VOTER contacts the municipal clerk to spoil their ballot. Try not to be such a know it all when you know nothing.
One thing that makes me suspicious about voting/voter registration/voter rolls is that the people in charge are always so hesitant to explain the process and safeguards.
It's all published. If you are complaining about voter fraud in Wisconsin and you are not conversant in the elections manual, that's a you problem.
https://elections.wi.gov/media/13820/download
All this stuff is published. It's out there. Read it yourself instead of relying on what the My Pillow Guy tells you. 😉
If you start from the assumption that nobody follows the rules, you'll end up concluding that rules are pointless. For example:
Michael K wrote...
You know what would easily solve this problem ? Voting in person on election day. But that would be "voter suppression."TM
If you don't believe they'll follow procedure for properly spoiling of ballots, there's no real reason to believe they'll follow the procedure about only allowing people to vote once on election day itself, or whatever voter ID laws you want to pass, or anything else.
And of course, there's no need to provide any evidence that anybody actually violated the procedures, especially not the kind of evidence that will hold up in court. Just wave around the implication and assert the other side is cheating.
The "there are no voting safeguards in Wisconsin" from Dave Begley out of Omaha - that would be in Nebraska and works on down to the state residents who know that voters in the Badger state are basically honest folks. There is no giant group of conspirators capable of controlling voting. If there were, there would never be close elections. But if you are a Trump believer, you accept his view that everybody cheats, period - because Trump is a cheater.
When I lived in small-town Wisconsin, the manual voting was looked after by folks who asked you where in the district you lived and then asked for a description of your house. Just in case, some utility bills could speed up the process. That, of course, was way back when Google maps and GIS maps didn't exist online and high-speed internet wasn't available.
GRC calmly described how Wisconsin mail-in ballots work, but he might as well be talking to a wall. Health issues are the main reason that mail ballots exist in every state, even states that permit actual online voting (Yes Virginia, there are four - Idaho, Hawaii, Utah, Louisiana plus DC) via e-Ballot or email. A new concept in recent times has been permitting mail ballots without requiring a reason.
1. Establish early voting.
2. Keep pushing early voting for more people and farther from Election Day.
3. Establish problems with early voting.
4. Promote ranked choice voting as the only 'fair" solution.
5. Under ranked-choice voting, it becomes even more impossible to know who won.
6. Profit
But also, if there is a procedure for removing the first vote, what assurance do we have that the procedure is followed? Here we'd have a voter who believed they were only voting once, but both votes could be counted.
In general, it is better to find out the answer than assume that no one has ever considered the question before. There are answers to all of your questions.
ANSWER: the clerk is required to record it on GAB-124. And only the last ballot counts.
Also at the end of the process, the ward counts up the number of VOTES and compares it to the number of VOTERS who requested ballots. If those numbers don't match, there is a problem. This is really basic stuff. Not your finest hour, Ann.
“ I see no justification for this. By voting early, the voter assumes the risk that events, any event, between now and election day would change his selection.”
I agree!
“ Would be hard AF to find the original tho. But we'd check the dbms to see when it is was logged in, and a dozen ladies would go through the trays of ballots and find it.”
I too was picturing ladies looking through trays!
If you allow early voting, you should count those ballots at 12:01AM on election day. The early voting results should be published the minute the polls close.
Instead, mail in ballots are counted last.
It doesn't take a genius to figure out why.
The more election integrity is called into question, the more we move to make them less secure.
I don't see why someone would want to revote at this point. The only real race to talk about for this is US Senate. Why pull your vote now because you want to revote for Barnes? He's going to win the primary anyway.
Regardless, there's no rocket science here. First, nobody's vote has been counted yet. Absentee ballots are sitting in their sealed return envelopes. They are filed by the date they were received back in the clerk's office. That date is recorded on the voter registration database. It should be fairly easy to go through those return envelopes, which are filed by the return date and find a ballot. The person involved has their name and address printed on the back of the return envelope.
Just another reason why we should not have early voting. A vote is supposed to reflect the will of the electorate. Because people can change their mind, this will not be the case unless everyone votes at the same time.
I appreciate Althouse’s new found interest in election integrity, but I remember clearly after the 2020 fraud fiasco she had zero interest in the subject at its most crucial time, even posting publicly that she hoped the US Supreme Court would reject hearing the Texas vs. Pennsylvania lawsuit.
The opportunity to address this was missed. Now we are here, and people who seem like they are more centrist (like Althouse and Meade) are wondering “holy shit, is it really this loose”? Yeah it is. But I suspect people within this profile just wanted Trump gone, and averted their eyes at the time.
Trump new it. Giuliani new it. They My Pillow Guy new it. Even courts that denied hearing election lawsuits based on procedural bullshit or “standing” knew it. And everyone that attended J6 knew it too.
Sadly, Mike Pence and Bill Barr also knew it and did nothing. They betrayed the entire country.
It's over people. Drink more beer.
On April 7th, 2020 Wisconsin was the first state to have and election after the bs COVID shutdowns that began in March. Immediately Democrats and their propaganda press began pushing the idea that “you shouldn’t have to risk your life to vote in person.
It was all a fake lie; total bullshit. It was the setup for Wisconsin and nationwide absentee increased volume and abuse. Like most things COVID the panic and lies being pumped out had political gains in mind for Democrats wanting to get rid of Trump. You could see it unfolding at the time.
They even went so far in Blue States to contaminate nursing homes to increase the number of deaths.; include hospice patients as COVID deaths. The more dead the better. More fear… Then they vilified and outlawed any type of treatment (HCQ especially).
It was all designed for absentee ballot fraud in Nov 2020. COVID was the backdrop. It was the excuse.
It is not difficult to understand the electoral college and why WI, PA, MI, GA, and AZ were targeted and chosen as the concentration points for the absentee voter fraud. All purple states, with Democrat controlled metropolitan centers.
“ I see no justification for this. By voting early, the voter assumes the risk that events, any event, between now and election day would change his selection.”
So much effort spent fixing a "problem" that shouldn't have occurred in the first place. Don't allow promiscuously early voting and the problem does not arise. But if you can't show that much self-restraint, politicians, then at least make the early-voter live with the consequences.
Keep it simple, stupid, is everywhere and always a good principle. As a society, we have only so many resources and so much attention-span to devote to pressing issues. Let's save it for things we really need to address, not squander it on problems of our own making.
IMO, early-voting is driven by the "need" for "progressives" to vote against the evil Republicans as early as possible.
IMO, early-voting is driven by the "need" for "progressives" to vote against the evil Republicans as early as possible.
It gives ballot harvesters more time to pressure people to vote in their presence and harvest the ballots.
It facilitates pay-for-votes, as ballots can be marked and sealed in the presence of those paying the voter.
It gives fraudsters more time to figure out who's not going to vote, and thus won't notice a ballot was submitted for them.
It allows people without much time to live to vote, even though they won't be affected by the results.
Based on the links there appear to be safeguards against voting multiple times via spoiling.
Are there safeguards against spoiling other people's mail-in ballot?
It only takes their name and address. Send an email just before the spoil deadline an a new ballot will be mailed to them. They likely won't know what happened until after the election, if they even pay enough attention to notice then.
"If you start from the assumption that nobody follows the rules, you'll end up concluding that rules are pointless. For example:…"
Wow. This is completely backwards.
If you start from the assumption that nobody follows the rules, you end up enacting safeguards. For example: vaults in banks.
Once the dems get in control, it is hell getting rid of them. Just wait and see what happens to the mid terms rout Repubs are saying will happen. I look for more of 2020.
"How can the newspaper be so out of touch about our worries that the procedures are not adequate? "
Thy tell us repeatedly that the "worries" are unfounded. That widespread election fraud does not happen. That complaints are from racists that want to stop minorities from voting.
And you wonder why they don't address worries about the procedures?
Ann Althouse said...
“ I see no justification for this. By voting early, the voter assumes the risk that events, any event, between now and election day would change his selection.”
I agree!
It certainly seems that a number of people are talking past each other. I am not from WI but as a matter of logic and common sense it seems that this provision would not in any way impact early in person voting (we in KY call it in-person absentee voting just be completely redundantly oxymoronic) since there is no way to identify the ballot and/or vote you cast once it leaves your hands. It's the same situation if an officeholder would die between Election Day and when they assume office. Of course, you can request a ballot you are marking at a voting center be spoiled and mark up another one if you make a mistake, or regret a choice. When I worked our KY primary we spoiled several people's ballots because they made stray marks or unreadable ones and let them complete another. We also posted big lists of withdrawn candidates. I see no reason why similar provisions can't be made for ballots held by the clerk until Election Day.
What most people are really complaining about, and I entirely agree with them, is the prevalence of ballots marked outside a secure monitored voting facility. The issue isn't really voting early, it's casting non-anonymous votes outside a secure location.
Original Mike said...
IMO, early-voting is driven by the "need" for "progressives" to vote against the evil Republicans as early as possible.
early-voting is driven by the "need" for "progressives" to vote against the evil Republicans as many times as possible
fify!
If you don't believe they'll follow procedure for properly spoiling of ballots, there's no real reason to believe they'll follow the procedure about only allowing people to vote once on election day itself, or whatever voter ID laws you want to pass, or anything else.
People might have an easier time believing the rules would be followed if it didn't require <a href="https://www.cnn.com/2022/07/08/politics/wisconsin-ballot-drop-boxes-supreme-court/index.html>going to the Supreme Court</a> just to clarify that indeed the rules need to be followed. Not that that's any guarantee of course, the Election Commission has shown little concern about the Supreme Court before and so long as the outcome can be presented as a <i>fait accompli</i>, nothing the Court can do about it anyways.
Gosh. It's almost as if mail in voting has problems.
More voter fraud enabled by "good idea" progressives. Pure and simple, that's what this is about.
There should be no way to "recover" an already-cast ballot, and if there is, then the elections are fraudulent with regards to their secrecy, which is in itself an entirely different sort of electoral dysfunction.
All of this BS about making it "easier to vote" should be labeled as what it actually is--Making it easier to vote, fraudulently. The "vote-by-mail" elections we've been doing are eventually going to be seen as exactly what they are, inherently corrupt and enabling voter fraud on a grand scale, generally by that criminal conspiracy masquerading as a political party, the Democrats. Enabled all too often by their partners-in-crime, the Republicans.
You want to fix any of this? Then what you need to do is ban anyone currently in office from ever again holding office, and further mandate that you don't get to make a career of politics. Every person in every legislature ought to be there for one term, and then be done with political office. Every bureaucrat above dog-catcher ought to be appointed for one term, and then be done with it, as well. Long-term position holding ought to be entirely illegal at every level of government, in the executive and the legislative branches. I'd even go so far as to say the same for the judiciary, which ought to be set up such that career lawyers were unable to become judges. Or, for that matter, politicians. You want to be a lawyer? Fine; lifelong advisory-capacity only. If you want a job as a legislator, tough titties; those who write the law should have no involvement in administering it, period. Too much self-interested "special" BS by career lawyers writing obfuscated laws, generating business for their own profession.
Frankly, if you can't write legislation and law such that it is easily understood by even a third-grader, you're doing it wrong.
In the UK, postal votes are very rare as they are difficult to get. Instead Election Day is on a Thursday with voting from 7am to 10pm - plenty of time to vote, with plenty of polling stations. Why can't the US do this?
A voter can request to spoil their ballot through either a handwritten or emailed note to their local election clerk
Wow, so I can go through a list of Democrat voters who've voted early, make fake email addresses for them with Gmail or live.com, and then get their vote tossed out by sending an email saying "I voted for a candidate who dropped out"?
wild chicken said...
In Montana the ballot would still be inside two outer envelopes with your name on it, to be counted starting election eve. So it could be retrieved before being separated from the envelopes and tabulated.
And we know that of course the Democrat "vote counters" in Milwaukee / Dane would never open a "spoiled" ballot, check what's on there, and then run it through anyway because they like the votes there.
I mean, only a insurrectionist or a fascist would complain about the total number of counted ballots being different than the total number of listed voters.
And no Democrat "vote counters" would ever just pick a random person who hadn't voted, and put a check by that person's name as a "voter" before keeping the "spoiled" ballot.
It's not like the poll watchers are allowed to get close enough to the "poll workers" to catch this. After all, that would "violate Covid safety".
There are very good reasons why people like me say "blocking poll watchers from monitoring every single thing the poll workers do immediately invalidates the vote results from that precinct".
There are problems that can only be prevented by an observer who is present, and lasting that observer you'll never be able to figure out what happened.
The Democrat "vote counters" kicking out the Trump campaign poll watchers in Fulton, Detroit, Philly, and Milwaukee, in and of itself, should have immediately invalidated all "votes" from those areas. Because doing that should be legal proof of vote fraud
How early does Wisconsin allow early voting? Before any candidates have announced that they are running? Have votes been cast yet for the 2024 presidential election? Is there some reason early voting needs to take place more than two months before election day? Can one "rescind" their vote if something horrible about their candidate came to light after the vote was cast (perhaps a "grab them by the pussy" comment, or a naked, gun-toting crack-addled son's computer content being revealed)?
what happens to spoiled ballots? We should assume the best.
Keniv @ 11:18 for the win.
"you can get anyone's absentee ballot sent to your address with just their name and date of birth."
Unless you're an expert forger they're not getting by me!
"Just wave around the implication and assert the other side is cheating."
You got it. Every city election the cranks in my party assert that the Dems musta cheated because how could they keep winning downtown council wards all the time? In a college town.
And by God, someone *not me* oughta look into it!
Lazy jerks.
The 'good' news here is some of the Althouse-style It's Thursday so we just need to move on types are a little more sensitive to the repeat of widespread voter fraud...
Technically, having the ability to recall your vote is the ability to vote more than once...
I could write a book about absentee voting, absentee ballots, spoiled ballots, witness signatures, etc. I have been a poll worker for over 10 years and have processed absentee ballots for eight of those 10+ years. I am a real stickler for following rules. It ticked me off at the last presidential election that all of a sudden a witness signature, signing the absentee ballot envelope, dating the absentee ballot envelope was not necessary according to the city clerk who said they got permission from the state elections board to not follow the law.
Absentee ballots are kept in the city clerks office until Election Day. They are filed alphabetically by ward so your ballot could be found and spoiled according to state law. There are forms that need to be filled out to record spoiled ballots and the ballot is marked as spoiled on the face so it cannot be run through a voting machine. There are times a ballot can be ripped or folded that results in a spoiled ballot after it came in through the mail. On election day we processors can mark the ballot is spoiled and remake the ballot but two people must do that process together. And you both sign off that you remade a ballot that was spoiled . I have had ballots that came in that someone let their child mark on the ballot with crayon. Stupid adults let this happen but they send in their ballots like that. That ballot cannot be processed through the voting machine so we have to remake that ballot. Absentee ballots are a very time-consuming process and it irritates the hell out of me as someone who has done this for so long that people can’t make time to actually vote on election day.
WHY do people need to vote this early?? So they can vote more than once?? Seriously. There should be one day voting with an ID. If they have to do it early...one day is enough. This is getting ridiculous.
"There are no election safeguards in WI. It is a corrupt state where the Dems run the election process and cheat at will."
Assuming this is true (of course it is not) are Republicans, who have controlled both houses of the legislature since 1995 (but for two years), blameless?
And of course, there's no need to provide any evidence that anybody actually violated the procedures, especially not the kind of evidence that will hold up in court. Just wave around the implication and assert the other side is cheating.
How's this?
This informational hearing, moderated by investigative journalist Lara Logan, presented evidence of fraud in the 2020 Presidential Election and addressed the concerns in the 2022 elections.
I know. Facebook says all was hunkey dorey
jim1234 doesn't seem to know that elections are run by Secretaries of State who are not in the legislature. That is why George Soros spent so much money electing them.
To be honest, I believe that voting in Washington state is rigged. We have some morons that could give Joe Biden a run for his money, and they keep getting re-elected.
No. It's not. The morons here are elected by even bigger morons.
Voter should absolutely assume the risk of voting early. Who can look through 1000s of envelopes for the correct one to throw away? Ridiculous! Wouldn't really happen. An early voter never knows if the candidate will be arrested for sex with a child or animal before the actual election day.
Jim5301 said...
Assuming this is true (of course it is not) are Republicans, who have controlled both houses of the legislature since 1995 (but for two years), blameless?
The GOP is to blame. They were stupid enough to create the corrupt and worthless Wisconsin Election Commission in 2015 to try and shut the Dems up after Walker legitimately won in 2010, and increased his margin in the bullshit recall. After the 2011 FREAKOUT and Capitol insurrection over Act 10, Judge Prosser beat JoAnne Kloppenburg by 7000 votes in 2012 for the Supreme Court Seat (Dems wanted the Supreme Court to legislate and overturn Act 10), Walker was again reelected in 2014. There was NO making Democrats STFU, so the WEC was created.
The WEC in 2020 bent all legislative rules passed by the WI State Legislature and usurped their authority. Illegal drop boxes were allowed. 200K+ inactive voters were left on the voter rolls. Zuckerbucks flowed in to targeted blue counties. Ballot harvesting and destruction of chain of custody took place in broad daylight (Madison), and the WEC did NOTHING to reel it in. Other than Bob Spindell they were all part of the fraud.
The execution of laws (including election laws) belongs to the Executive Branch. We have a current Governor and Attorney General that don't care. They'll even let your town burn rather than send in the National Guard to protect you (Kenosha). The WI Supreme Court proved in 2020 that no relief was available in the face of obvious voter fraud, and know one was a bigger coward than Justice Brian Hagedorn.
Something happens to some people when they spend too much time in Madison, WI. They get drunk on the ripe fruit, tax $$$ and student debt $$$, or they become intimidated by frothing liberals showing their titties. The place is crazier than Berkeley, CA.
Madison is Wisconsin's meth lab. I recommend drinking more beer.
The Democrat "vote counters" kicking out the Trump campaign poll watchers in Fulton, Detroit, Philly, and Milwaukee
When did observers get kicked out in Milwaukee? I've done election observing lots of times in Milwaukee and never had any problems with poll workers. Do you have an actual citation for this?
paminwi just gave us more information on the process than I've seen in the media or on any government website. That's part of the problem. I can be convinced that the process is secure, but the general means of persuasion is "Trust us. Don't question. Shut up."
Another weakness is signature validation. How is that done? My signature isn't consistent over time. It depends on the pen used, the paper being signed, the space provided, the surface the paper is sitting on, etc. How can vote counters validate thousands of signature in a timely manner? I assume there is some software, but how does it work? How accurate is it? Does it yield a yes/no answer, or does it give a score with low scores being rejected? Who decides what the threshold score is? Can it be changed?
Blogger paminwi said...
I could write a book about absentee voting, absentee ballots, spoiled ballots, witness signatures, etc. I have been a poll worker for over 10 years and have processed absentee ballots for eight of those 10+ years. I am a real stickler for following rules. It ticked me off at the last presidential election that all of a sudden a witness signature, signing the absentee ballot envelope, dating the absentee ballot envelope was not necessary according to the city clerk who said they got permission from the state elections board to not follow the law.
I'm assuming you are from Wisconsin, because this is EXACTLY what the corrupt WEC did. Worst part is local city clerks were willing to ignore laws the swore to uphold.
D.D. Driver said... Me: The Democrat "vote counters" kicking out the Trump campaign poll watchers in Fulton, Detroit, Philly, and Milwaukee
When did observers get kicked out in Milwaukee? I've done election observing lots of times in Milwaukee and never had any problems with poll workers. Do you have an actual citation for this?
Milwaukee stopped counting in the middle of the night, while they still had votes to count.
Are you claiming that "shut down" does not mean "kicked out the press and poll watchers"?
Are you claiming that "shut down" meant "all human beings left at the same time, there were armed guards patrolling, and no one working the precinct was allowed inside until the poll watchers and press were also allowed in?
Because anything else translates to "the poll watchers and press were kicked out while there were still ballots left to count." And that's something no honest vote counters ever do. Because at an absolute minimum it creates the appearance of impropriety, and gives proper and reasonable grounds for the other side to doubt the outcome of any election that you win.
Jim5301 said...
"There are no election safeguards in WI. It is a corrupt state where the Dems run the election process and cheat at will."
Assuming this is true (of course it is not) are Republicans, who have controlled both houses of the legislature since 1995 (but for two years), blameless?
The GOP State Legislature is blameless for Democrats engaging in corrupt activities.
They are blameless for Democrat elected officials conspiring with the Democrats at the WEC to violate Wisconsin election law in 2020
They are blameworthy for ever acting as if Democrat elected officials can be treated as decent human beings, because they clearly are not
I think the funniest thing in this discussion is the insistence of the Defenders of Election Law are happy to point out all of the citations, rules, regulations, etc.
All the while actively ignoring the fact that in Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Arizona, and Georgia in 2020 the explicit, clearly written laws of how elections are governed were strategically ignored by the executive branch Dems who were supposed to "faithfully execute" the laws of their states. This includes clearly illegal "ballot curing" that happened in WI and which the hyperpartisan Dems of the WEC insist they will continue doing despite the very clear illegality of that behavior.
Pretending there is a lack of clarity where there is none is a key mark of the Soros Socialists of the WEC. The love them some sweet, sweet, Dem-approved Zuckerbucks.
Gusty Winds: I am from Wisconsin and have processed ballots in Madison, Verona & Waunakee. Since I made a stink in Waunakee about processing absentee ballots I have not been asked to work elections again. I am going to be an observer this year at mid-terms.
Narayanan said...
hello >>>> does anyone in USA know how to run election honestly?
Yes, we do. The problem is that the Democrats are mostly corrupt, so fight tooth and nail against doing so
1: Require photo ID issued by the State gov't only to State Residents in order to be able to register to vote, and to vote. No, you can't use your US Passport, out of State Driver's license, or State University photo ID in order to vote, because none of those establish that you are a Resident of the State
2: If you allow absentee / early voting, you only do it for people who can prove they're going to be out of State on Election Day, or who have a physical condition that makes it nearly impossible for them to get to the polls, while not having any mental conditions that would keep you from being able to vote on your own, rather than just mark whatever box someone else chooses.
3: Require secure chain of custody. Value poll watcher ability to monitor everything over "efficiency".
4: Any time poll workers "discover" "missing ballots", do an investigation and fire every single person responsible for those ballots, and everyone they report to. In this case "fire" means "you can never work again in any election related capacity, anywhere in the US, for so long as you live. And attempting to do so is a felony punished by a minimum of 10 years in jail."
5: No voting equipment that has an internet connection can ever be used in any capacity
6: No voting equipment using closed source software can ever be used in any capacity
7: Anyone who votes gets an indelible ink purple thug / other finger. Which is part of why you can only vote on Election Day.
8: You have to register to vote well before the election. Absolutely no same day registration & voting
9: No one can go into the voting booth with you, or inspect your ballot before it's put in the voting machine / box. 10 years in jail felony for doing so
Chain of custody, electronic ambiguity, open voting schemes, variable voting viability, shared/assumed responsibility, irregularities, fraud, misinformation, disinformation, influencers, and steering engines where democracy in aborted in darkness.
That said, a conspiracy of foreign and domestic special, peculiar, and Democrat interests processed over more than 24 trimesters including nationwide insurrections, neighborhood incursions, and fascist rites including diversity [dogma] (e.g. racism, sexism, ageism) and cancel culture that violate human and civil rights.
All this stuff is published. It's out there. Read it yourself instead of relying on what the My Pillow Guy tells you. 😉
I have no idea what the My Pillow Guy has to do with this.
It's published, fine. But they should be shouting the information from the rooftops. Each election, they should get themselves on local tv, in the newspapers, on twitter, have town halls. Explain exactly what will be done and how it will be done and who will be doing it. Explain what you should do if you think your right to vote has been impeded. Explain what you should do if you believe you've spotted voter fraud.
It's important for citizens to have good information. Treat it like its important.
Because anything else translates to "the poll watchers and press were kicked out while there were still ballots left to count." And that's something no honest vote counters ever do. Because at an absolute minimum it creates the appearance of impropriety, and gives proper and reasonable grounds for the other side to doubt the outcome of any election that you win.
When did they "shut down"? Citation please.
https://www.cbs58.com/news/milwaukee-election-commission-aims-to-provide-full-transparency-on-election-day
"At least 100 volunteers will work though the night to get the counting done. Officials estimate results by 4 a.m. Wednesday, Nov. 4, at the earliest."
Where are you getting your information? I have never known MKE to "shut down." I have personally observed elections until 2 a.m. before. Maybe you are right, but I'd need to see some actual evidence and not just parroting the My Pillow Guy.
Milwaukee stopped counting in the middle of the night, while they still had votes to count.
https://www.fox6now.com/news/ap-joe-biden-projected-winner-in-wisconsin
"In Milwaukee and Kenosha, though, the ballot-counting effort went on through the night. Both cities have their own central count location, which processes all absentee ballots for the respective city. That's unlike other municipalities, where the absentee ballots are counted at the local polling place. A city using a central location to count all absentee votes cannot release any absentee results until all of its absentee ballots are counted.
Milwaukee finished the count around 3 a.m."
Weird. All the news sources are pretty consistent. They must be in on it I'm sure.
retail lawyer said... Who can look through 1000s of envelopes for the correct one?
Sadly, retail lawyer seems to know Nothing of the power of a B+ tree for search and retrieval
paminwi said...
They are filed alphabetically by ward so your ballot could be found and spoiled according to state law.
this is THE DEFINITION of a B+ tree
Berkeley California 1950's. Voters come to house used as polling place. Sign register. Given ballot from sequential list.
After polls close, local citizens running polling place count votes. Put up outside polling place an official record of votes from the precinct by candidate, and any initiatives, for anyone to look at.
Send the ballots and the results from the precinct to the county. Results posted same evening. True story. I was there. Too young to vote.
Easy to check. # of voters. # of ballots. Same? Good.
Today, only God knows when the results will be produced, and if they are true.
@8/1/22, 3:46 PM, Greg The Class Traitor said...
Add to your list:
10: Once done counting votes, all locations will notify state headquarters (wherever that is) that they are done counting AND NOTHING MORE. Once headquarters has received notification that all counting locations are finished, vote totals will be requested and totaled. These totals will not, under penalty of imprisonment of all involved, be released until all other states have finished counting, too.
Releasing partial vote counts has to stop.
The safeguard is that they calculate the people inclined to cheat will be overwhelming Democratic. When that is perceived to change, received opinion will change to be outraged at the looseness of the process.
"Today, only God knows when the results will be produced, and if they are true."
Internet meme:
A few weeks ago, over 300 million lottery tickets were sold in four days. Within hours of the drawing, lottery officials knew how many winning tickets were sold and where the winning tickets were sold, down to the specific store locations.
Four days after voting has closed, some voting officials don't know how many people voted, how they voted, who they voted for or what the accurate results are.
The US election system is broken on purpose.
It seems like that system was designed to be corrupted.
It seems like that system was designed to be corrupted.
My wife and I early voted so that we could go out of state on a vacation.
After giving our photo ID, we got a ballot from the city clerk (Ozaukee County municipality). We completed our ballots and then took them to the clerk. We sealed them in envelopes that had our names and addresses on them. We signed and dated the ballot envelope in the presence of the clerk. She then signed/dated the envelope.
In and out in 5 minutes.
I was glad to see that the ballot drop box was sealed off and a big sign directed people not to drop ballots at the box.
As for changing a vote, I don't think you should be able to do it. If you voted on election day, you get an attempt or two, then they cut you off if you can't figure out how to do it properly. Similarly, if your preferred candidate drops out and you don't know about it, that's either a willful act on your part or ignorant; but either way, you had the opportunity.
Four days after voting has closed, some voting officials don't know how many people voted, how they voted, who they voted for or what the accurate results are.
An audit was plausible but not probable or forthcoming, thus Pelosi et al's handmade riot to steer the narrative to fertile grounds, 8 trimesters in progress.
Why is this not a proof of why it is insane to have people voting on July 26 for an election that won't occur until over three months later?
--gpm
D.D. Driver said...
"In Milwaukee and Kenosha, though, the ballot-counting effort went on through the night. Both cities have their own central count location, which processes all absentee ballots for the respective city. That's unlike other municipalities, where the absentee ballots are counted at the local polling place. A city using a central location to count all absentee votes cannot release any absentee results until all of its absentee ballots are counted.
Milwaukee finished the count around 3 a.m."
Truth matters here and Driver is correct. As of 11:30pm on election night Milwaukee, West Allis, Oak Creek, and Franklin were still counting because they were flooded with absentee ballots. These are not "well run" communities in Milwaukee County. At 11:30pm Trump still had a 109K vote lead. Milwaukee had mathematically impossible precincts totals with 90% "turnout", and 90% plus going to Biden. Nobody else in the state had those numbers.
Absentee ballots should be counted in the precinct where they belong. Milwaukee's centralized absentee counting just means you need a small number of people to break all rules. Madison was different. That was illegal ballot harvesting in broad daylight, and purposeful destruction of chain of custody.
Nobody was EVER allowed to audit the absentee ballots. How many were "cured"? How many were allowed through because the WEC said signature and address verification weren't required that night? All they did was a fake "recount". That's not and audit.
The other states GA, PA, MI, and AZ stopped counting. And over the course of the next week or two, somehow those Democrat run metropolitan areas just kept whittling away at the gap behind cardboard covered windows, with "poll watchers" absent or kept far away.
“Why is this not a proof of why it is insane to have people voting on July 26 for an election that won't occur until over three months later?”
Oh for pity sake, this election happens August 9th. It’s a partisan primary. What is wrong with you people? You seriously think that people are voting now for the election in November?
Carol said...
"you can get anyone's absentee ballot sent to your address with just their name and date of birth."
"Unless you're an expert forger they're not getting by me!"
Wanna bet? They are looking to see if it's signed. They aren't comparing signatures.
D.D. Driver.
Why were the absentee ballots counted in a separate location? Were there any poll watchers present?
Once that absentee ballot leaves your hand you have lost all custody of your vote. You cannot claim with any assurance that your vote will be counted they way you intended. There are political operatives whos sole occupation is that on election day their candidate gets elected by any means necessary. And you're going to say,"Whoa. Rusty! How can you know that?" Well. D.D. I'm from Chicago and I know Democrats.
D.D. Driver said...
Weird. All the news sources are pretty consistent. They must be in on it I'm sure.
That is one of the stupidest things I've ever read. Congratulations.
The reason why I no longer take anything you say seriously is because of your completely delusional detachment from reality
Hunter biden's laptop.
Exactly how many of your "news sources" reported before the election on the solid information in Hunter Biden's laptop that showed that JOE BIDEN was a crook who used his son to sell access to the VP in exchange for larges sums of cash?
Zero?
How many of them, to the extent that they reported about it at all, reported that it was "Russian disinformation"?
All of them?
How many of them carried the obviously fraudulent "Trump Russia collusion" hoax stories as if they were real news?
All of them?
(If Trump had been Putin's Manchurian candidate, then that fact would have been a secret of the highest order. Anyone who spilled that secret would be hunted down and killed. The fact that Steele could not say "I got this information from a Russian State Security agent who I pad to defect to the US, he's currently getting debriefed by the CIA & FBI" was solid proof that the stories were all bullshit. This was obvious two weeks in to anyone with a functioning brain)
So, all that being said, while I read before going to bed on Election Night, that places were closing down while they still had votes in to count, and while my Democrat wife had heard the same thing from her sources (we discussed it before going to sleep that night), I can not now find those articles, except for Fulton County.
So I'll withdraw that claim for MKE until I can back it up
Which just leave the ~90k new "indefinitely confined" "voters" (more new ones than had signed up in all previous years combined), and things like this: https://www.survivethenews.com/wisconsin-election-group-findings-44272-permanently-disabled-residents-voted-without-proof-of-id-while-margin-of-victory-only-about-20000/
For why no honest person can say that Biden honestly won the WI vote.
So I'll withdraw that claim for MKE until I can back it up
LOL. That's might white of you. Keep looking for "those articles." Your guy lost. It happens. Go hug your kitten.
OR
Go watch the polls next week here in Milwaukee. Central Count is on Richards Street (or used to be). Go watch. And come back and report on all the shenanigans you observe. LOL.
OR
Cope.
So D.D. Driver, tell us what you know about Hunter Biden's laptop?
Or do you believe there must be nothing there because "All the news sources are pretty consistent" that it's no big deal?
So D.D. Driver, tell us what you know about Hunter Biden's laptop?
How is this possibly relevant to whether Milwaukee County "shut down" vote counting in the middle of the night? Isn't that the issue? I do not trust the media. But, to your point, there were plenty of news sources that reported on Hunter Biden's laptop: The New York Post, The Daily Mail, The Washington Times.
Do any of these sources confirm your hoax that Milwaukee "kicked observers out"? If they did, I'd love to read the article. If not, what are you trying to accomplish? Do you really think I would believe some random internet know-it-all peddling utter bullshit that (as far as I can tell) you made up? Is that what you are trying do? You are failing.
D.D. Driver said...
So D.D. Driver, tell us what you know about Hunter Biden's laptop?
How is this possibly relevant to whether Milwaukee County "shut down" vote counting in the middle of the night?
Ah, so what you're saying is that what you write is such total shit that even you don't bother to remember it?
A reminder:
D.D. Driver said...
Weird. All the news sources are pretty consistent. They must be in on it I'm sure.
Just like "all the news sources" said that the Trump Russia collusion BS was real.
Like they said that the Hunter Biden laptop was "Russian disinformation", or just didn't cover it at all.
So, are you now agreeing that it was really stupid of you to write that?
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