That's the top-rated comment on "FBI report confirms Alec Baldwin pulled the trigger in fatal ‘Rust’ set shooting" (NY Post).
१४ ऑगस्ट, २०२२
"Normally I would believe the FBI, but I have lost all trust in them. I don't like Baldwin, but the FBI has no ethics anymore."
"Can't trust anything they say. All local police departments have overseeing agencies, like Internal Affairs, Civilian Complaint Review Board, Inspector General etc, who do [you] call to make a complaint on an FBI agent?"
That's the top-rated comment on "FBI report confirms Alec Baldwin pulled the trigger in fatal ‘Rust’ set shooting" (NY Post).
That's the top-rated comment on "FBI report confirms Alec Baldwin pulled the trigger in fatal ‘Rust’ set shooting" (NY Post).
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This story highlights what I think is a big social problem in the US. We too often accept conclusions presented to us by authoritative groups as fact. We really should be asking "How do you know this?", rather than "What do you know?" interesting juxtaposition with people who are willing to pardon Trump based on can't trust the FBI with some of the same people who are willing to convict Alec Baldwin because of this story.
If Merrick Garland wanted to clean up the FBI, this may actually be the most effective approach. Is there anyone out there not actually employed by the FBI who doesn’t think that, at a minimum, it needs major reform? Right now, you could probably get a plurality to agree it’s beyond repair and should be dissolved and a new organization created from scratch. Another 6 months and an actual majority might demand it.
"FBI report conforms..."
How ever did they solve that one?
I never doubted Alec Baldwin pulled the trigger, but then I have in the past competed in events sponsored by the Single Action Shooting Society, and so I’ve done a lot of shooting with replicas of 19th century firearms. At any rate there’s a video floating around of him waving his revolver around with his finger inside the trigger guard. Case closed.
But they’re right about the FBI.
The FBI? Free Alec!
I am with Big Mike, although I don't have good level of experience with this kind of firearm. In this case, the FBI is saying something that should be obvious.
But have people like the NYT commenter really already forgotten that the DOJ's Inspector General has jurisdiction over the FBI?
It was less than a year ago that the IG released a final report essentially confirming that the FBI did not systematically make errors like they did in the Carter Page FISA warrant applications. Also two other reports in the previous 6 weeks, on how the FBI doesn't customarily document whether accusations of impropriety are substantiated when an agent quits or retires during the investigation into impropriety, and finding that dozens of FBI agents improperly leaked to the media before the 2016 election.
This was in question? How about seizing Baldwin's phone?
We really should be asking "How do you know this?",
=============
not asking how = mysticism variously known as religion
The best thing we can do as ordinary citizens to combat the corruption at the FBI and root out the weasels is to vote not guilty any time they're involved and you're sitting on the jury. Do it quietly and without a word.
Just: Not Guilty
They cannot stop you from doing that. And the best part is that it frequently only requires one person sitting on a jury to nullify the DoJ and FBI. A single citizen, doing his or her part.
Once the FBI and DoJ can no longer obtain convictions in cases where they are presenting "evidence" the agencies will be unable to defend their budgets.
Was there EVER any doubt? Triggers do not pull his/her/them/their/selves. Even new outa the box, a quality single action revolver will (when cocked) fire with VERY little trigger motion, and not much force. The gun was in Baldwin's hand. Baldwin fired the shot.
So did the guy who shot Steve Scalise, but we do not hear much about him any more either.
The FBI is seriously fucked. I've written two books about an out-of-control policeman who just wants to solve homicides. (These are comedies). And I instinctively had him hate the FBI.
Whodidit in the Supreme Court?
Whodidit With a Senator?
He's a cop in Washington D.C. Anyway, there has long been distrust between local police agencies and the FBI (who are very smug now in movies, if you've noticed).
Many years ago Jimmy Stewart made a movie called The FBI Story (1959) and the whole point of that propaganda was to make the FBI look good.
My cop mocks them (before a fistfight breaks out), something about Hoover wearing a dress. I'm too sleepy right now to dig out my own quote.
When you've lost the Alec Baldwin fans, you need to either rethink your marketing strategy, or threaten the press to cover for you better than they are.
The Vault Dweller said...
…interesting juxtaposition with people who are willing to pardon Trump based on can't trust the FBI with some of the same people who are willing to convict Alec Baldwin because of this story.
8/14/22, 5:30 AM
That’s the point. We know how a firearm works and the situation is very narrow, even if vaguely described [baldwin holding a firearm].
Because the FBI is demonstrating partisan politics, it’s enough to doubt the conclusion. Indeed, perhaps there was a failure of the firearm - not inconceivable, but highly unlikely - that the FBI found, but know that reporting this would damage their credibility even further. They report what is most likely to have happened.
Wait, it took 10 months for the FBI to figure out that a 150 year-old-design revolver functioned normally, and that Alec Baldwin has been lying his ass off in a characteristically self-indulgent, psychopathic sympathy ploy the whole time? And they're proud to announce this result? They're not just untrustworthy, they've passed 'incompetent' and moved on into 'clueless'.
There was some online discussion about whether fanning the hammer would fire the revolver. I don't know enough about guns, but it seems more likely that he had his finger on the trigger and made it go off through his horseplay. I still don't trust the secret political police though.
Wait, someone disputed that Baldwin pulled the trigger?
Big Mike is correct. I own several Single Action Army reproductions (both Colt and Remington) and unless the gun was defective the only way to drop the hammer is by pulling the trigger. Although I do not believe that it was intentional or that he had any responsibility for the gun being loaded with a live round; Baldwin did indeed fire the shot. Glad to see the FBI has performed an actual useful service, although I suspect a lot of money was wasted arriving at this conclusion.
Lurker21 said...
There was some online discussion about whether fanning the hammer would fire the revolver.
Fanning the hammer can only be done if the trigger is continually pulled back to the point where it disengages the sear.
Duh. It's news that Baldwin pulled the trigger?
What's news is that the FBI's involvement explains why a straightforward set of facts has dragged out for months without resolution.
My favorite comment:
What if he was framed?
...
There is a rumor Haylna was set to do a documentary on pedophilia in Hollywood.
Commenter does say the claim has been debunked by many "fact checkers" but I still like it.
John LGBTQBNY Henry
So it's OK to bash the FBI to get a lib off the hook?
I will assume this same person thinks Trump is stone cold guilty...
I don't understand why the FBI is even involved in this case.
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Who will watch the watchers?
-- Juvenal
If the FBI says anything, I will not believe it. I am sure that means a lot more folks will get away with crimes. But they are corrupt and can never be trusted. Ever.
I agree with the commenter 100%. I would basically just call anything an FBI said in court a lie until proven otherwise.
I honestly don't understand the Baldwin team's defense strategy here. He was clearly told the gun wasn't loaded with a real round. Yes, he is incredibly stupid for accepting that and pulling the trigger (I am 100% sure he did) while pointing it at someone. However, if I were a juror on the criminal trial, this testimony by the FBI would go into a "supports the defense" category just because I don't trust the FBI at doing anything any longer.
I think the FBI blow up in Die Hard
"I guess we need some more FBI guys."
Biden has previously stated he wants to see Trump prosecuted. Garland works for Biden and has major motivation for hurting Trump. Republicans should be demanding a complete investigation into Biden’s involvement and Garland’s tactics. That should be their total focus. As we’ve learned in the past, even suggesting the use law enforcement against a political opponent is a potentially impeachable offense.
This is exactly how the Democrats would respond. Republicans will continue to lose until they learn how to play offense.
"If Merrick Garland wanted to clean up the FBI ..."
I think you're a bit confused about Merrick Garland and what he wants.
I have read most of the Bill Butterworth (WEB Griffin) novels about the Philadelphia police department. In all of them, the FBI comes out as preening self absorbed jerks. I suspect that this has been the opinion of most cops for many years. The series starts in 1972 and he was being told the stories by a retired police chief. That was 50 years ago and the FBI has only gotten worse.
Original Mike said: "I don't understand why the FBI is even involved in this case."
They're there to make sure that the guy who parodies Donald Trump on Saturday Night Live and tries to make him look like an idiot doesn't face any real legal harm.
They certainly have no jurisdiction in the case. There is no legal federal involvement in local criminal cases. The FBI protects Hollywood because Hollywood is the public relations arm of the Democrat Party.
The only reason they are there is to protect Alec Baldwin from facing any legal ramifications since he's on "their team."
Corruption, through and through. This country deserves its fate.
Maybe some people on the left, who have been chanting about defunding the police, can now explain why they love the federal police, the Stasi, the KGB.
I'm a Republican, and I have a brain, so I completely understand why it's a bad idea to remove police from our society.
But federal police? We can actually defund the shit out of you. And I don't know if we'd miss you.
The FBI might not realize how precarious their situation is. Spying on Americans is not a good look for them. Invading the home of a former president is a really bad look for them.
If you've lost the Republican party, I wonder how well the Democrats are going to prop your sorry shit up. There are a huge amount of Democrats who are hostile to the police (and the army). You think if you just do shit to Republicans, you'll be safe?
When I was a kid, I wanted to be an FBI agent when I grew up.
(I read a lot of Batman).
Now, in my art? You're the fucking bad guys.
We live in a society that depends on trust. Anything that undermines trust weakens society. Trust is hard to earn and very easy to destroy. The FBI, as with so many government agencies and almost all of the press, have damaged or destroyed their credibility.
Halyna had a copy of the Epstein Island list. Simple as that. She called her lawyer, and said, "I'm scared. I can't trust anyone." Her lawyer replied, "I understand. Let's schedule an appointment next week. Have you ... told anyone else about this?"
Flashback to years ago. Alec is in the Clinton White House for a visit. Bill says to Alec: "Some day, and that day may never come, I will call upon you to do a service for me."
Halyna had a copy of the Epstein Island list. Simple as that. She called her lawyer, and said, "I'm scared. I can't trust anyone." Her lawyer replied, "I understand. Let's schedule an appointment next week. Have you ... told anyone else about this?"
Flashback to years ago. Alec is in the Clinton White House for a visit. Bill says to Alec: "Some day, and that day may never come, I will call upon you to do a service for me."
Top. G-Men.
Of course he pulled the trigger. That's what he was supposed to do. It's also not at all surprising if he doesn't remember doing it as it was immediately followed by something so shocking and traumatic. The incident is not Baldwin's fault in any case. Actors are not responsible for weapons on a set.
BOTK: "This is exactly how the Democrats would respond. Republicans will continue to lose until they learn how to play offense."
There are at least 25% of elected republicans in DC that are actually democraticals, 25% more elected republicans in DC that actively want to remain in the minority, and 40% more elected republicans in DC that are there just to cash in and all 90% of them hate Trump and all his supporters.
Did Alec Baldwin commit a crime? It was an accident. Was he negligent? Maybe. I'm not a lawyer, but it seems to me it would depend on what is expected of actors in the movie business regarding safe gun handling. What's the industry standard? Are they trained in anyway? Are they certified to handle guns safely before they can use them in a production? I don't know, but I kinda doubt it. Maybe they will be going forward after this tragedy.
If the industry standard is to rely on the armorers to keep everybody safe, then Alec Baldwin isn't nearly as culpable as Reed. That girl screwed an overgrown Saint Bernard on this one.
It is the anti-arms, pro-hero, transhumane abortionists who assure our civil rights remain a viable choice. Thank you.
The American Gestapo aka the FBI, MAY be right about Baldwin. Or they may be wrong. Their word is shit, and we need some OTHER police group to verify their results.
Given the FBI is leftwing, and Baldwin is leftwing, I suppose we can believe the results. And not dismiss it out of hand. but there's no way I'd believe the American Gestapo without outside verfication.
BTW, why aren't all the lefties attacking Baldwin> A rich white man killed a woman. And Baldwin doesn't seem too sad about it either. Are leftists even human? Did they cry over anything? Or it just ALL politics with them?
There is always the option of not merely believing the FBI because it is the FBI, or disbelieving it because it is the FBI, but judging things on a case-by-case basis.
I know - crazy idea to use your own sense and skepticism to judge things.
I don't understand why the FBI is even involved in this case.
Exactly.
Here in Michigan, the plot in 2020 to kidnap Gov. Whitmer was BIG news at the time, widely blamed on Trump and the right wing, even by the governor herself. But later a funny thing happened. A jury couldn't find enough evidence to convict, and they even concluded that the FBI itself was probably the driving force behind the plot (presumably to help Biden win a key swing-state). I've never been a conspiracy theorist, but this one has me putting on my tin foil hat.
David Brooks was partly right in his column the other day. There is a low level of trust in institutions right now, like the FBI. Only in his Brahmin bubble he doesn't understand why. But there are reasons for the distrust.
bentoak: "Here in Michigan, the plot in 2020 to kidnap Gov. Whitmer was BIG news at the time, widely blamed on Trump and the right wing, even by the governor herself. But later a funny thing happened. A jury couldn't find enough evidence to convict, and they even concluded that the FBI itself was probably the driving force behind the plot (presumably to help Biden win a key swing-state). I've never been a conspiracy theorist, but this one has me putting on my tin foil hat."
You will recall that all the Usual Althouse Left Suspects (Inga, Howard, gadfly, et al) were prepared, at that time, to impeach and remove Trump from office on that one FBI hoax alone.
The Boston field office was notoriously compromised with a large number of agents receiving "gratuities" from crime figures. From that sewer emerged Peter Strzok.
"The incident is not Baldwin's fault in any case. Actors are not responsible for weapons on a set."
I wasn't aware there is an "actor" exception to manslaughter culpability. I don't recall (and am too disinterested to look up) exactly what Baldwin could be charged with, but manslaughter seems about right since he didn't have mens rea (is that the right term?) for a murder charge.
Wouldn't the local law enforcement pull in the FBI for analysis if the local LEs didn't feel they could properly investigate? I think they're consulting, not in charge.
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