May 27, 2022
"White House officials are currently planning to cancel $10,000 in student debt per borrower..."
"The White House’s latest plans called for limiting debt forgiveness to Americans who earned less than $150,000 in the previous year, or less than $300,000 for married couples filing jointly.... Wiping out $10,000 of debt per borrower could cost roughly $230 billion.... The White House has been looking for economic measures it can enact without congressional approval since the collapse of Biden’s Build Back Better economic agenda at the end of last year.... The Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget estimated that roughly 70 percent of the benefit will go to those in the top half of the income spectrum. Critics of debt forgiveness also say it does nothing to address college costs or the troubled lending system. It’s not clear whether people who need to borrow to start college this fall, for instance, would be eligible to have brand-new loans forgiven."
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105 comments:
:O $150,000!!? Only people living in Washington DC could be so insane as to think that someone making $140,000 per year is in need of a government safety net.
Why would they not restrict it to people who ended up working at a Starbucks after all that college and all that debt? Most of us snicker at their bad choices, but we would understand a lot more easily. For these other people, the stories just write themselves. Sean was having a hard time financing his new yacht...
"The White House has been looking for economic measures it can enact without congressional approval since the collapse of Biden’s Build Back Better economic agenda at the end of last year.... "
"Economic measures"!!!!
It's a fucking BRIBE. Assholes.
(sorry for the profanity, but this really pisses me off)
How in the hell does a president get this kind of power?
If congress has to appropriate funds, shouldn't they be the ones to cancel debt?
And it goes without saying that the government should not be in the loan business.
Government fucks up everything it touches.
Households earning $300k are not exactly struggling, even in today's inflationary environment.
Last, the only debt I've ever had is one car and a house. Both because it was financially advantageous to have that debt.
Don't borrow what you can't repay.
This is not a difficult concept to understand.
It's okay if they take it from the schools.
The idiocy of this administration is absolutely stunning; it is either idiocy or it is deliberate. Shoveling ANOTHER $230 BILLION into an economy already in a state of accelerated inflation is absolute poison. Debt forgiveness, long-term, has the identical effect as direct spending on inflation; it's more play-money.
The income ceiling is much too high. "Regular" people will see that number and just know it's a scam benefiting the high earners. But I guess that's the Democrat Party's demographic these days.
Do I get a $20,000 reimbursement for my two daughter’s tuitions?
So easy to spend other people money...
I'll take it if it's given, but that's an absurdly high threshold for a bailout. Basically, if you're not rich, you qualify. If you're an already over-paid mid-level government bureaucrat, you qualify.
I am not sure that without Congress approving this that it can go forward? There is no way this falls under any executive powers I can find in the Constitution. When did our Government change from being only allowed to do certain things to being able to do whatever they want that is not expressly prohibited in the Constitution (or at least in the reading of 9 unelected judges, doesn't matter what it says or plainly meant, only what it can be tortured into).
Guess we need to get our kids to take out loans. Hate to leave money on the table.
Guess we need to get our kids to take out loans. Hate to leave money on the table.
"Wiping out $10,000 of debt per borrower could cost roughly $230 billion"
Without congressional approval?
Anyway, the federalization of student loans was always meant to make forgiveness a prog tool. The corruption is built in. The dishonesty is deliberate. The slap in the face for ordinary tax payers is a bonus. So it goes under Dem rule.
So what happens to all future student loans?
How can they just help people with student loans presently without first coming up with a plan to stop people from making such poor financial decisions again in the future?
Neither Biden nor anyone in his administration is familiar with the first rule of holes. Their stupidity is transcendental. May their suffering be commensurate.
I worked two jobs to get my $15k in grad school debt paid off so that I could buy a house.
I remember the first job I took out of grad school. I had a lamp, some clothes, a borrowed futon mattress, and a 1988 Toyota Camry with 298k miles.
I never expected anyone else to pay my debt for me.
And I don’t want to rob someone of the opportunity to pay off their own debt so I can feel better about my own guilt.
If someone cannot truly pay their debts, let them file for bankruptcy.
Well buying votes at $10K per pop makes Slow Joe "cool Joe". OTOH he's stiffing welders, plumbers and construction workers, so there is that.
Will this be retroactive for those who graduated 50 years ago and paid their own debts?
Say goodbye the working class. Just pay off corrupt university admins making $300,000 per year. Pay off the tech censorship firms.
So what about all of us suckers who played by the rules?
Where's my $10,000?
They're going to give $10,000 to people making $150,000 a year? That's twice my salary, and I live in California. This is complete bullshit.
Wait til they get the tax bill. Will that be forgiven as well?
Wait til they get the tax bill. Will that be forgiven as well?
Nor does it address people already paid off loans or people who worked to avoid getting loans in the first place. What this rewards is people who were not as fiscally responsible and does not help those who did not go to college. If college is supposed to result in a net gain in income why would you give those people an extra benefit and have those whose income trajectory is lower foot some of the bill? (Someone's gotta pay for it.)
It's not nothing.
But it's pretty close.
In terms of doing any good for students or the decommissioned in general.
Is pretty wasteful of taxpayers money, though, so that's something.
This while student loan scam needs to be killed dead.
John LGKTQ Henry
Just an FYI: I oppose this even though three people in my household would directly benefit.
What is the statutory or constitutional authority for the President to do this?
Will he order the cancelation of debt owed on credit cards? If not, why not?
Note those earning limit. Those are the "tells" that this is not to help struggling middle class families.
Where does the WH get this power to cancel student debt?
Subsidy for the rich.
So a couple of childless doctors making $300K with a combined loan balance of $20K would have the entire balance erased but a single person with 3 kids making 50K per year and a balance of $80K would have $10K forgiven but still owe $70K? All to be paid for those who never took out loans or worked to pay them off as agreed.
Definitely not a wealth transfer scheme to a politically favored class.
Redistributive change through shared/shifted responsibility. Assuming there was fraud or deception in promises made (e.g. return on education), then the principle debtors are the government, lending institutions, and schools.
WE should quit paying taxes until Politicians learn where all the money they blow is coming from. I am sick and tired of working my ass off to pay off other peoples burdens. They don't believe in personal responsibility anymore. We are going down faster than I ever believed possible.
Pander Bear awakens.
Who the frick does this please?
Likely not legal.
$10k is a drop in the bucket to those leading the cancel charge.
It will (rightfully) piss off those w/o school debt.
Debt isn't cancelled. it is transferred to taxpayers.
It does nothing for the next/ongoing loan program (cancel THAT!).
Thank Obama and the college-industrial complex for this. He federalized student loans as part of Obamacare and colleges went on a spending spree.
Now they're buying votes with your tax dollars.
Why would anyone making 150k a year need a 10k debt reduction? The incompetence of the Biden administration is breathtaking. A politician who was not so out of touch would cut the income requirements in half. But people in DC and NY think they're impoverished single and making six figures.
If you only have the ability to persuade those in power to enact just and constitutional laws that promote sensible policies that align with the norms and intuitions of the public, how much power do you really have? Some, but not much, really.
One can only marvel at the power of the elements within the Democratic Party who apparently can ram through a measure such as this that is such obviously bad policy, unjust in several different ways, and almost certainly illegal. What could possibly be the hold they have over Biden?
This is bribery, straight up. It’s also illegal. Congress has appropriated nothing to this object. If Biden orders the Treasury to forgive these loans, he is spending our money (abandoning assets that produce income to the government) just as surely as if he had written a check.
Worse than this, however, is the inherent divisiveness: some will get a windfall, others will get less or nothing (all based on inane top-down categories of need or merit), still others will win the Chump Award because they acted honorably and paid back their loans. This will create a gigantic fund of red-hot resentment and encourage anyone with a brain to lobby for similar bailouts. The idea that debts are real and credit is credible will be greatly weakened as a general matter.
As Obama said, “Never underestimate Joe’s ability to f*** things up.”
"Now they're buying votes with your tax dollars."
Now?
I didn't go to school in the States, and my wife and I never had all that much in the way of student loans in Canada. As an outsider, this idea of the Biden administration's has the hallmarks of something brought straight from an undergraduate classroom to the White House. We make it difficult to get ahead without a college education, and then we make it expensive to get that education. What to do? Let's act on the principle that all student debt should be forgiven, but then impose some limits to keep the cost down a bit, and make it look less like a gift to the rich. Surely individuals making between $100K and $150K, 200 to 300 for a couple, are fairly rich compared to a lot of people. So rich that $10,000 probably doesn't make the difference between going to school or not, having the career of one's choice or not. It might just encourage schools to raise tuition, so there will another payoff to privileged people.
Elections have consequences.
Stolen elections have dire consequences.
Those who actually cast a ballot for Joe Biden? It's your fault as well. You trusted both Biden AND the media. How foolish you look now!
As if the economy isn't already in the tank. They gotta go and put afterburners on it.
Thank you Biden voters. You really are the densest people around.
Sure, pay off $10,000. But don't make the taxpayers pay it. Make the colleges that were paid with that money. They got the advantage of it; they should pay for this lovely gesture.
"The White House has been looking for economic measures it can enact without congressional approval since the collapse of Biden’s Build Back Better economic agenda at the end of last year."
Joe Biden is looking for ways to buy votes using taxpayer money without Congressional approval ahead of the mid-term wipe out of Democrats thanks to $6.25/gallon diesel.
FTFY
If you get rid of the loan, you get rid of the economic incentive to vote Democrat. So the loan will not ever be forgiven. It can successively be lowered each voting cycle to continue using "loan forgiveness" to buy votes with taxpayer money (even worse, borrowed taxpayer money).
If the Biden administration were a novel, I'd put it down. Nothing new or imaginative ever happens.
John Hinderaker @ PowerLine on how the Democrats intended to dummy up authority to forgive all or part of student loans (the TL;DR is they deliberately misread a portion of the Higher Education Act of 1965 that created the original loan program that deals with the settlement of judgements, law suits, insurance claims, etc arising from the program but does not reference the actual loan debt)
Jim Geraghty @ NR on the demographics (As a number of folks have noted, a $150,000/$300,000 income cap is like none at all)
Sixty-seven percent of student loan borrowers are under 40, however only 57 percent of balances are owed by those under 40, showing that those with larger balances are more likely to be older (likely due to borrowing for graduate school). Under each of the considered policies (forgiveness at the $10,000 or the $50,000 level, with and without income caps), over 60 percent of forgiven loan dollars benefit those under 40 years old.
Despite being 25 percent of the population, borrowers who live in high-income neighborhoods hold 33 percent of federal balances, while borrowers residing in low-income areas hold only 23 percent of balances.
Under a $10,000 forgiveness policy, 33 percent of forgiveness would go to majority minority neighborhoods while 67 percent would go to majority white neighborhoods.
Increasing the forgiveness amount increases the share of total forgiven debt for higher credit score borrowers and those living in richer neighborhoods with a majority of white residents.
In other words, without an income cap, forgiving $10,000 per borrower would most benefit whites under the age of 40 who have graduate degrees and live in high-income, majority-white neighborhoods. This is one of the most Democratic-leaning and outspoken progressive demographics in the country.
They're still subsidizing the operation of the university. They, the universities, are not being held accountable, not having to manage their operation better, manage the salaries or size of their administration, their departments or department heads. They can just keep upping the prices, seek more for tuition, room and board, etc. knowing the Government will continue to cover the loan and eventually, inevitably, pass that cost back to the people who paid for it originally- the Taxpayer.
You get more of what you subsidize. Less of what you tax. The trick is to choose wisely. We do it backwards at almost every turn.
PS- those of you who will receive the $10,000 loan forgiveness, please note that the age of retirement will be so high by the time you get there, you'll have paid back that $10,000 a few times over in the form of taxes. But at least Joe Biden will have something to claim during this election cycle. Feel good about that.
Go for it, Biden! Given all the huge tax breaks afforded to wealthy individuals and corporate bodies, waiving $10,000.00 of loan debt to to college grads with loan debts often in the six figures is a small, but helpful gesture. (No self-interest here, as I never took out loans for college. My parents paid a good portion of my tuition, at a time--nearly 50 years ago--when tuition was much more reasonable than today.)
I do think marking the income threshold at $150,000.00 for individuals is a bit high; maybe incomes of $99,999.99 and lower is a little more proportionate, or setting the amount of debt waiver at different sums over several income strata starting low and going up to $99,999.99, with greater relief at the lower income end and lower relief as income approaches $99,999.99.
A possibly more helpful action would be to make federal student loans interest fee; with accruing interest, student loan borrowers may end up paying more in interest than their original loan principal. As with credit card interest, payers may pay for years and remain far from clearing their debt.
So can I have $10,000? I made decisions about school to purposely avoid loans.
How is it that the government can spend over $200 billion on a new thing without legislative approval?
Prepare to be stunned by the lack of gratitude.
At what point do I stop putting $5,000 per year into each of my grandchildren college fund. Now 4 and more on the way. Getting expensive and since 3 are male (at least for now) and males and college don't mix very well, maybe I should stop and assume government will cover this later.
A college education should be far less important than it is. The result is that not only are colleges being dumbed down, but also the whole educational structure beneath them. Education in this country s*cks. And people pay good money for that degraded product.
$230 billion? Is this so the $40 billion to Ukraine looks like pocket change?
PS- those of you who will receive the $10,000 loan forgiveness, please note that the age of retirement will be so high by the time you get there, you'll have paid back that $10,000 a few times over in the form of taxes.
Actually, in the case of loans, I will pay less than I get back because it will be distributed across all tax payers, not just loan forgivees. However, all the other give-aways, which might NOT benefit me, will also cost me, such that I may or may not come out ahead, depending on how many I get.
Robert Cook. The student loans are like the guns that leap into killer’s hands with agencies of their own. Gosh how on earth did I get this horrible unfair debt ruing my life. And they will howl when they get a tax bill for the forgiveness of that debt, a two thousand dollar surprise. So unfair. Just because I promised…
So can I have $10,000? I made decisions about school to purposely avoid loans.
Sorry, you took bad advice from the purveyors of fiscal responsibility. You chose ... unwisely.
Rutabaga Joe didn't come up with this scheme. In fact, it would not surprise me if this scheme was cooked up by two or three White House staffers who have managed to pay their student loans down to about 10K. "Put it on the teleprompter, and have His Vegetability read it!"
Anything goes, as long as Dr. Jill doesn't object.
Elon Musk (0 income most years) and Jeff bezos ($89,000 annual income) both seem to qualify for it.
Contrary to what a couple of commenters have wealth or being rich has nothing to do with who gets it.
It is based solely on income.
John LGKTQ Henry
Punish the Normals and reward the Irresponsibles. That's the Progressive Way. But of course we wouldn't want the people to give up their Netflix subscriptions, their new iPhones every two years, and their avocado toast.
From a WH strategy perspective, I have no idea what this gains.
It's not going to pass. It's clearly for the well off ($300k households college educated households!?!?). It's legally extremely questionable. So even if it's a distraction from a disasterous administration, it's not a good distraction.
You could not devise a better vehicle to drive the Latino working class into Republican arms.
And if the Latino working class joins the white working class as reliably Republican, Democrats will be out of power for a generation.
This is immoral, plain and simple.
Let me guess........the people with the heaviest loan burdens majored in some lame program like gender studies.
These are not the STEM people that can find decent paying jobs.
I would bet that $10,000 is around the average tax cut that most of the people commenting here got from Donald Trump.
"If the police don't arrive and save us from violence, how can this event support the argument for restricting guns? This is the very situation that makes the most responsible people want to own guns."
So Althouse's take from Ulvalde is more guns and make it easier to get guns.
" It reminds me of the summer of 2020, when there were riots, and the police stood down.
I think Althouse has started her holiday early with the wine boxes.
The White House has been looking for economic measures it can enact without congressional approval
And what in the world makes the Biden* Admin think they can just wipe out $230 billion owed to the Federal Government without Congressional action?
https://www.statista.com/statistics/758502/percentage-distribution-of-household-income-in-the-us/
82% of American households make less than $150k a year. 90% make less than $200k
WTH did Biden get that $150k number?
This is all the Democrats have left. Blatant bribes to influence an election. I hope they get wipe out in November.
Incidentally, Loan forgiveness is treated as income by the IRS. Just ask Bill Clinton.
I would bet that $10,000 is around the average tax cut that most of the people commenting here got from Donald Trump.
Do you mean the tax cut passed by Congress and signed into law by President Trump?
Let's see. Who is the autocrat? A POTUS who signs legislation passed by Congress into law or the one who thinks that he can simply sign an executive order to change things to his liking?
"I would bet that $10,000 is around the average tax cut that most of the people commenting here got from Donald Trump."
LOL.
I didn't think you could ever top your assertion that Hunter Biden receiving $85k/month from Burisma was not suspicious, but you have done it. Congratulations.
'Given all the huge tax breaks afforded to wealthy individuals...'
What tax breaks are those? I don't get any tax breaks other than a mortgage deduction.
We pay the highest federal and state tax rates so the government must think we're wealthy.
I guess we don't know the secret handshake...
8% inflation, and slow Joe says all the economy needs is ANOTHER $230Billion printed.
That is some serious inflation mediation happening.
I would bet that $10,000 is around the average tax cut that most of the people commenting here got from Donald Trump.
Charles, there is a big difference. That tax cut was always my money.
Now Biden is giving my money away to dead beats that aren't smart enough to understand the time value of money. They call themselves 'College Graduates"
"The White House’s latest plans called for limiting debt forgiveness to Americans who earned less than $150,000 in the previous year,
That's very nearly TWICE my last year's salary (2017: $80,000)
I graduated in 2002 with NO debt...
WHERE THE FUCK IS MY MONEY????
WHY THE FUCK AM *I* PAYING FOR THIS SHIT????
TWO types of people in this country
People PAYING MONEY to the government... People GETTING MONEY from the goverment
Which group has More Ammo?
Blogger MikeR said...
:O $150,000!!? Only people living in Washington DC could be so insane as to think that someone making $140,000 per year is in need of a government safety net.
Serious Question: Can someone post a listing of this people, with their addresses and inventories?
Gol durn it. What about the Free Market? This is socialism boy. Unlike open borders and sending jobs to china and giving $40 Billion to the U-Crane to stop those damn Russkies from Conquering the world.
What's the USA coming to.
Gol durn it. What about the Free Market? This is socialism boy. Unlike open borders and sending jobs to china and giving $40 Billion to the U-Crane to stop those damn Russkies from Conquering the world.
What's the USA coming to.
I thought we'd aleady accepted the idea of bailing everyone out, when we gave $Billions to AIG and the banksters in 2008.
I would be fine with this if Congress funded it with a special tax levied against the beneficiaries of these student loans, viz. the colleges and universities that took the money and left their graduates, apparently, unable to repay the money they had borrowed.
I made a comment earlier that now has a little trash can next to it. Is that AA telling me I need to delete that comment?
It isn't YOUR money Biden will be using, It's China's.
I made a comment earlier that now has a little trash can next to it. Is that AA telling me I need to delete that comment?
Every time you log in to the same account you posted under, all of your posts should have that trash can so that you can delete your comment should you wish to. Althouse has nothing to do with it.
I don't understand this desire to "forgive' the loans. I hope it is not constitutional - seems like it should not be. My guess is that forgiving the loans is going to piss off more people than it pleases. It's got to be an inside the beltway thing.
I also agree that the schools that participated should be forced to give back part of the proceeds.
Gabriel is correct
AOC and the Squad were pushing this loan forgiveness by Biden using an executive order. That way, they avoid a conflict of interest in voting for it in order to cancel their own student debt. Since they earn $174,000 per year, at least they don’t qualify for the loan forgiveness like they were hoping to get. But, damn, this still hurts those of us who work our asses of to pay for these slacker twits’ education. Both of my sons worked jobs during their recent college years. And my oldest son joined the Army National Guard to pay for college on the GI Bill (and he is still serving while his commander-in-chief throws free money to these slacker twits). And now my kids are going to help pay for these slacker twits’ loans while making a hell of a lot less money than these slacker twits earn…
Ha Ha FU I just took out 8K in student loans for summer math classes that only cost 5K! Beiden, Show me the money! you suckers will be paying me for my entertainment! If Mr MBNA bank does not follow thru with the cancelation I can drop the courses and pay back the loan with the refund! Beiden will pay for my big summer vacay!!!!
I made a comment earlier that now has a little trash can next to it. Is that AA telling me I need to delete that comment?
It’s the universe, not Althouse.
iowan2: “Charles, there is a big difference. That tax cut was always my money.”
So what, the loans to be cancelled was never their money.
The problem with bailouts is that the entity that got rich in the scam never pays. I'm good with forgiveness of student loans as long as the endowments of the colleges and universities pay for it.
>>It's okay if they take it from the schools.
I would agree, but it ain't gonna happen and I don't see how it could legally happen (I have also seen questions about the legality of this loan forgiveness, though I don't know enough about the issue to have an opinion). Cui bono? While there may have been other ripoffs, it seems pretty clear that the schools used the availability of the loan money to scoop up tons of extra cash, which apparently went to bloating up (likely useless) administrative positions. That's the real scandal.
And will they cut back the loan programs? Fat chance. Just ramp them up with everybody understanding there ultimately won't be any need to pay back the loans.
--gpm
>>There is no way this falls under any executive powers I can find in the Constitution.
Hah, hah, hah, hah. That's so cute! As if silly stuff like that matters.
--gpm
>>If someone cannot truly pay their debts, let them file for bankruptcy.
Not my area, but I believe student loans were made non dischargeable in bankruptcy at some point in the last twenty years or so. But who needs a bankruptcy discharge when JFB can just waive a wand and eliminate the liability?
--gpm
I worked, used my savings, the GI Bill, and lived like a pauper to avoid having to take out student loans while getting an engineering degree. So I guess I should have just partied in school and racked up the student debt so the Democrats in Congress could buy my vote from the public purse.
The crybaby socialist darling of the left says it isn't enough. She is crying that she will have to pay for her Tesla AND her student loans. SHe should be forced to pay double since she obviously learned NOTHING in college about economics in the real world, whilst studying economics at Boston University.
Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez
@AOC
$10k means tested forgiveness is just enough to anger the people against it *and* the people who need forgiveness the most.
$10k relieves most the people who owe the least. What relief is there for the most desperate? For them, interest will undo that 10k fast. We can do better.
you know, this 'sounds like' a nice little program...
But a quarter $TRILLION here, and quarter $TRILLION there.. (and there! (and there! (and THERE!)))
Pretty soon, you're talking Real Money!
or, more correctly; pretty soon you're talking enough 'money' to buy a loaf of bread
Serious Question: HOW MANY TRILLIONS of extra cash has Jo Biden spent in the last year and a half?
"What tax breaks are those? I don't get any tax breaks other than a mortgage deduction."
Then you're not really wealthy.
"I made a comment earlier that now has a little trash can next to it. Is that AA telling me I need to delete that comment?"
++++++++++
"It’s the universe, not Althouse."
++++
So it's the universe out to get me, not AA. That's good to know.
(Thanks for the responses and clarification. Good to know I can delete my comment if I review it later and think maybe I was being a snarky jackass -- not that THAT would happen).
I think Robert Cook should pay off the debts. He seems like a very generous fellow.
gpm said...
>>If someone cannot truly pay their debts, let them file for bankruptcy.
Not my area, but I believe student loans were made non dischargeable in bankruptcy at some point in the last twenty years or so
Nope. https://www.tateesq.com/learn/student-loan-bankruptcy-law-history
Change came in 1976, because law students and med students were graduating with tons of debt (for the time) and declaring bankruptcy immediately.
You CAN try to discharge your student loan debts in bankruptcy, it's just hard
Things must be looking bleak for the Democrats if they have to bribe their own constituency to vote for them.
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