holy fuck https://t.co/PUDU69mqCT
— Sarah Silverman (@SarahKSilverman) May 19, 2022
१९ मे, २०२२
George W. Bush denounces "the decision of one man to launch a wholly unjustified and brutal invasion of Iraq."
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Clearly Iraq has been on his mind. It's not really an important slip, but it will be treated as such by those who think they can gain advantage by playing it up. People like Sarah Silverman.
you have to admit... He makes a good point!
The living definition of 'country club republican' and nepotism writ large.
His biggest problem was he didn't fight.
He was mercilessly attacked and never returned fire...not gentlemanly I guess.
Rs need to understand that it's a knife fight, not Marquis or Queensbury.
Talk about stepping on your dick....
did the audience laugh or clap or groan
who collected all the eyes rolling on the floor
A bad old man makes a verbal mistake, and a celebrity whose speciality is potty mouthed scatological slurs whilst showing off her breasts is shocked by it on twitter.
Next.
Almost beyond belief.
Does this reveal W's insecurity about his legacy, and explain why now he's so solicitous of approval and acceptance by the establishment and the media?
But the rest of his quote is just like America.... "In contrast, Russian elections are rigged," he said. "Political opponents are imprisoned or otherwise eliminated from participating in the electoral process. The result is an absence of checks and balances in Russia (America)..."
Bush deserves ridicule for this. I know a lot of people that defended him on Iraq only to realize too late that Bush quit defending himself much earlier. He failed to accomplish either mission in Iraq or Afghanistan.
The conscience is always in there struggling to get out.
Known as a Kinsley gaffe, when you inadvertently tell the truth. Like:
"We have put together the most extensive and inclusive voter fraud organization in the history of American politics."
Joe Biden, Oct. 2020
Can this clown just shut up and go away. Pushing for another globalist war in the Ukraine. Thousands are dying because Zelensky won't negotiate a new border. If the Donbas/crimea are in dispute, lets have a UN supervized vote on it.
I try to pay little attention to Bush, but from what I can remember he's made the following publized announcments in the last 1.5 years. 1) to push Amnesty, 2) to support war in the Ukraine, 3) to say how wonderful it was to have Biden as POTUS, and 4) was to call the Jan 6th protesters "violent extremists" who were like the 911 terrorists (who killed 3,000 Americans).
His hatred of the Republican voters has never been so clear. In a way, he reminds me of Jerry Ford. Two arrogant, stubborn, stupid men, full of contempt for the American middle and working class - and love of Big business and Globalism.
Iraq has been on my mind lately.
I believed in it at the time. But in retrospect, all those reasons why we just had to go in: We were looking out for our security, you people don't realize all they've done to pick this fight, sure they're smaller than us but they're a threat and we're not going to wait for that threat to come to fruition...
Well, they sound uncomfortably familiar these days. And as I follow the war in Ukraine, I understand much better how the Iraq war looked to citizens of other countries who looked at it all and said, "No. You didn't have to. All this is happening because your leader decided to do this." Some of them didn't wish us well. Others did. I wish I'd been more discerning.
Oh well. I joined the Army, to put my precious hide where my mouth was, and got sent to Afghanistan instead. The good war, that one. The one most all of us agreed was just and needed winning.
..., Batman
Bush and Cheney both voted for Hilary and Biden, they love that the world is at war.
His biggest problem was he didn't fight.
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whatcha mean >>> he fought Saddam who did not scare him!
it would not be prudent to fight people who scare you : daddy told him so!
George tries to get up on his high horse
Kinsley gaffe.
When he says unjustified, he says that it is possible that it could be justified, so really it’s all a simply question of whose ox is getting gored. When Putin starts using B-52s maybe Bush can come out of his spider hole. As it is, the murderous fiend should keep his mouth shut.
Are things better or worse in Iraq than they were 20 years ago? Honest question. I truly don't know.
GWB had so much help in deciding to invade Iraq—people forget, don’t they? Look at all the Dems who were tor the war before they were against it.
The biggest institutional failing was the failure to apply the Powell doctrine.
He still speaks better than Biden.
For Iraq there were at least two men, George W. Bush and Tony Blair.
I still support the USA's invasion of Iraq.
My justification for the invasion is rather diffuse. I thought (and still think) that the USA and radical Islam were headed toward a very violent collision. We were not close to such a collision, but it would happen in a few years.
In this situation, we had an opportunity to remove Saddam Hussein from power, and so we should do it. I thought that removing him might somehow delay or divert that distant collision.
I am not proud of that reasoning, with is not much more than a gut feeling. I cannot win an argument about its merits with a smart opponent.
Nevertheless, that is what I thought and still think.
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I suppose that the reasoning of Putin and his supporters about Ukraine is similar.
Russia and the West were headed toward a violent collision, eventually. In that complicated situation, taking Ukraine down a peg or two right now just seems like a good act.
However, justifying that gut-feeling intellectually to other people is rather futile.
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I suppose that's how a lot of wars get started.
They don’t even start with the same letter!
Am I imagining things, or did Bush not assemble a worldwide coalition of both parties of Congress and the vast majority of NATO nations before invading?
Bush got too close to Biden at the inauguration and dementia is contagious. It helps if you are a little slow to bein with.
"Are things better or worse in Iraq than they were 20 years ago? Honest question. I truly don't know."
You mean for the hundreds of thousands of Dead and Maimed Iraqis and the thousands of dead/maimed Americans? The answer is No. They're still dead or maimed for life.
Bush and Cheney are doing great though.
Things seem to be getting better in Afghanistan though.
Because the USA has stopped bombing and drone striking people.
When we think about that decision to invade Iraq, we should think not only about George W. Bush.
We should think also about Saddam Hussein. The US invasion of his country can be criticized as stupid, unjust, counter-productive, etc. However, to a great extent, Hussein brought that invasion onto himself with his own threatening, reckless and violent behavior.
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To some extent, Ukrainian zealots brought the Russian invasion onto itself when they compelled President Victor Yanukevych to flee from his recently elected position and from Ukraine itself in 2014.
That event in 2014 put into motion a series of events that eventually led to the Russian invasion of Ukraine in 2022.
Yanukevych should have been allowed to govern in his elected position. The proper recourse was to vote him out in the next election.
Instead, the USA's Obama Administration encouraged -- and probably secretly supported -- the months-long protests and riots against President Yanukevych. During that time, the Obama's "point man on Ukraine" was Vice President Biden.
I recommend that people watch this YouTube video about the Maidan massacre. In the first few minutes, you will see how violent the Maidan protests were.
The massacre has been blamed on Yanukevych, but the video shows that massacre remains mysterious. The snipers were shooting primarily at the policemen who were trying to control the rioters. Nobody knows who the snipers were or who why they shot all those people.
The video is 52 minutes. If you have that much time, then watching it is worthwhile.
Wince is probably on to something.
The Bush clan need more money, we need to know were Jeb put their money.
In a peroration about the superior virtues of USA democracy's system of checks and balances over the Russian monarchic model, this is slip worthy of Talleyrand or Bismarck--some hard-nosed realist.
In W.'s drive to invade Iraq, what meaningful check (even a reality check) did the Congress, the military, the CIA, the free press offer? Just as Putin's claim of "Nazis in Ukraine" overrides all opposition in Russia, so Bush's post 9-11 "You're either with us or with the terrorists" effectively silenced opposition to the Iraq invasion in 2002.
We are watching the same thing with Biden's proxy war in Ukraine. Each day, the voices of doubt about the proxy war get fainter and more marginalized in the media, Congress and the military-intelligence complex.
He keeps losing his verbal skills and he will qualify as a leftie presidential candidate. Not that is was W's strong suit.
Let's see Dubya on trial for his crimes in The Hague.
Does this reveal W's insecurity about his legacy, and explain why now he's so solicitous of approval and acceptance by the establishment and the media?
Definitely.
GW Bush is a neurotic pussy who needs approval from the established elite.
Things seem to be getting better in Afghanistan though.
Because the USA has stopped bombing and drone striking people.
Yeah, who actually believes that women really wanted to go to school and have careers? I'm sure they're delighted with the return of Burqas and child marriage.
All of those women driving around with co-exist stickers on their Prius and The Handmaid's Tale on their nightstand could not be reached for comment. The women in Afghanistan aren't allowed to comment, or even have an opinion.
Actually, it wasn't just the "decision of one man." Bush asked for and got support of both houses of Congress, including three future Democratic presidential candidates.
I remember the debate leading up to the October 2022 vote. Democrats wanted to put the vote off until after the November election. The thinking was that voting against the war resolution would hurt their reelection chances. In the end, Biden, Clinton, Kerry, Edwards, Lieberman, Schumer all voted for the invasion.
For once, George W. Bush has spoken truth!
"His hatred of the Republican voters has never been so clear. In a way, he reminds me of Jerry Ford. Two arrogant, stubborn, stupid men, full of contempt for the American middle and working class - and love of Big business and Globalism."
Sounds like many Republicans and the Republican Party platform.
Mick - I believe you are confusing the Gulf War under Bush pere, which didn't occupy Iraq, with the later invasion under Bush fils.
You had me at ending the first Iraq war, then you evolved, progressed to apologize for the Biden/Maidan/Slavic Spring in the catastrophic Obama world Spring series.
To some extent, Ukrainian zealots brought the Russian invasion onto itself when they compelled President Victor Yanukevych to flee from his recently elected position and from Ukraine itself in 2014.
That event in 2014 put into motion a series of events that eventually led to the Russian invasion of Ukraine in 2022.
The second part, certainly. The first part was the beginning of the war prosecuted by the Kiev regime and aligned military and paramilitary axis targeting Ukrainians over 8 years, 2 years under Zelensky. After the Biden/Maidan/Slavic Spring, Kiev should have reconciled with the disenfranchised, restored essential services, honored legal titles, and ended, domestically, or with external force(s), the in progress assault of Her people. They didn't, Russia answered the call, first from Crimea (with compelling shared interests), then through invitation from Ukrainians in Donbas. The illicit operation of Wuhan-style biological hazard labs only exacerbated Kiev's precarious choice(s) and forward-looking viability.
"We should think also about Saddam Hussein. The US invasion of his country can be criticized as stupid, unjust, counter-productive, etc."
And criminal.
"However, to a great extent, Hussein brought that invasion onto himself with his own threatening, reckless and violent behavior."
Not in the least. Hussein was powerless to threaten us, as the US well knew. Our criminal invasion of Iraq was justified by lies and endless propaganda to the effect that Hussein was somehow allied with bin Laden and the terrorists who flew planes into the Twin Towers, the Pentagon, and an empty field, that he possessed extant weapons of mass destruction, and that he was developing a nuclear bomb that either he would use against us or that he would pass off to the terrorists--not because of any behavior he exhibited. The US knew full well there was zero connection between Hussein and bin Laden and that he had no bomb in the making. They also knew had had destroyed all his WMD years before.
What "threatening, reckless and violent behavior" do you refer to, explicitly? He cooperated with the UN Inspectors, who, four months into their inspections, had found NO evidence of any WMD. They said they needed a few more months to complete their inspections, but Bush/Cheney told them to leave Iraq, as the attack was scheduled to begin imminently.
We invaded Iraq because we wanted to for other reasons, not because there was any belief by the White House that he was the slightest threat to us.
"Oh well. I joined the Army, to put my precious hide where my mouth was, and got sent to Afghanistan instead. The good war, that one. The one most all of us agreed was just and needed winning."
Nope. Afghanistan had nothing to do with 9/11. Our invasion was another stupid, criminal, futile waste of resources, lives, limbs, and money.
"GWB had so much help in deciding to invade Iraq—people forget, don’t they? Look at all the Dems who were tor the war before they were against it."
Yep, the Dems are scarcely slackers in the rush to approve wars and give the War Department billions more dollars every year to waste.
"The biggest institutional failing was the failure to apply the Powell doctrine."
Not even by Powell, who lied to Congress to convince them to go to war.
Yeah, who actually believes that women really wanted to go to school and have careers? I'm sure they're delighted with the return of Burqas and child marriage.
I'm sure they're delighted the war is over, and that they (and their menfolk) are no longer being killed/maimed by US Drones and Airstikes.
As for getting rid of Burqas and Afhan girls being able to work at Starbucks or study 3rd Wave Feminism - don't worry. I'v been told that help in on the way. Mitt Romney and Lindsey Graham are heading up a special elite combat unit and will overthrow the Afghan government just as soon as they eliminate Putin.
Never voted for the man. Did not like his little skit of looking for WMD's in the White House. Liz Cheney seemed to have no problem with any of that, He obviously never read The Art of War. Makes sense hes on the dem side now. The swamp.
So much not to like about him.
I question the strategery.
Bush was an awful president. Bush and Gore weren't much to choose from. Bush versus Kerry was the most dismal choice (or lack of choice) in my lifetime.
Saddam wasn't an Islamic radical. Taking him down opened the way for ISIS. Complaints about the Arab Spring also apply to Bush-Cheney's Iraq Adventure. Taking out dictators doesn't mean creating stable and lasting democracies, or any kind of democracies.
Bush's greatest moment was saying in the Gore debate that he wasn't going to do "nation building." He went back on that pretty quickly. The mistake wasn't so much the nation-building, but going into Iraq in the first place.
Thank you. Mike Slywester @ 10:18.
First of all, WMDs. No one should think of invading a country because of WMD development and those who said they supported the war because of WMDs were foolish. It has never been done. The Congressional authorization listed the 23 reasons for the war, in Part 1, with paragraphs starting with "whereas...",
I thought everyone knew the reason, to remove Hussein, and all the WMD talk was the equivalent of police saying "do you smell gas" before kicking in the door.
Hussein was a threat to his own people and his neighbors. Almost immediately after the invasion the mortality rate improved, infant mortality rate improved, and the population surged. The invasion probably saved 75,000 lives a year as the mortality rate dropped from 8.5 per 1,000 to 5.2. It was never under 8.2 under Hussein and is now 3.9. And the economy boomed.
Iraq was the good war and Afghanistan was the bad war. Obama escalated and 1,700 US troops died on his watch. 20 years later Iraq is doing well and Afghanistan remains as it was. And bin Laden was in Pakistan.
I agree that that the US costs were too high but the international community should do something when Rwanda, Cambodia, type situations occur. 43 countries agreed.
Ukrainians mined their own harbors and they can’t export wheat, so the US, in another gambit to provoke Russia to attack NATO and start WW3, which is what the US wants, is floating the idea of giving Ukraine advanced anti ship missiles.
They played Putin into striking first by increasing shelling of Russian speaking areas of Ukraine while Putin’s army was massed at the border. This is what they did rather than pick up the phone and talk to Putin. The US sees this as a golden opportunity to rough up Russia’s navy while blaming Russia for the approaching global famine. If you think that the border is bad now, wait until the starvation starts in South America. The US has to find a way to deflect the blame. Putin just said that Ukraine is free to export grain and Russia will not stop them. US will ignore this statement in pursuit of escalation, starvation in the global south be damned.
US had a number of very good reasons to invade Iraq and remove Saddam. Russia had a number of good reasons to invade Ukraine and put an end to slaughter in Donbas. W must see that very clearly. Thus, the confused speech.
Nope. Afghanistan had nothing to do with 9/11. Our invasion was another stupid, criminal, futile waste of resources, lives, limbs, and money.
Well, Cook has returned to his Stalinist roots. The invasion was appropriate. It was the occupation that was a waste.
Cook said: And criminal.
You seem to think that policies you do not approve of are criminal. How arrogant.
There is an old saying, "You can call a dog a bird, but you can't make it fly".
To be fair to Junior, these gaffes are a daily occurrence nowadays.
Biden today: "And that's how it works when leaders derive their power from the consent of the government -- governed."
I guess Congress wasn't consulted and months of debate did not happen.
Two Russian pranksters say that, posing as Zelensky, they got Bush to admit that he wanted Ukraine in NATO.
That powerful nations decide they have "very good reasons" to invade countries and remove their leaders does not make those decisions correct or ethical or their implementation anything other than war crimes. No one who can applaud the US invasion of Afghanistan or Iraq has any legitimate stand to condemn Russia's invasion of Ukraine or of any nation invading any other nation to destroy its cities and rape, torture, and kill its citizens. Japan decided they had "very good reasons" to bomb Pearl Harbor. Hitler felt he had "very good reasons" to try to take over the whole of Europe.
Just be honest and admit you are amoral and see relations between nations as being strictly one of the strong eating the weak. The strong, in your view, are justified in any act of violence they take against any other nation. Their victory, no matter how savagely won, is their vindication.
"Well, Cook has returned to his Stalinist roots. The invasion was appropriate. It was the occupation that was a waste."
For your being a doctor, I'm often startled by how barren of thought or sense you demonstrate yourself to be.
"Stalinist?" That is a total non sequitur. How are my views expressed in this context "Stalinist?" You're just calling potty names because your spleen prevents you from forming a coherent reply. If anything, it was our invasion of Afghanistan that could be deemed "Stalinist."
Also, how could the invasion be appropriate but the occupation a waste? One comes with the other. What would have been the rationale to swoop in and invade them and then simply leave? No nation invades a country without plans to occupy it, otherwise, what is the point? Like many Americans, made stupid by our own self-regard and self-mythologizing, you just got your rocks off at seeing the US military applying its might to another nation, getting revenge against people who were not even part of the 9/11 planning or execution. In the doing, we maimed and killed many more innocents than were killed on 9/11 by the terrorists.
An accidental slip or a confession of sorts, I suppose.
I supported it at the time, but looking back now I see my reasoning was flimsy.
Just be honest and admit you are amoral and see relations between nations as being strictly one of the strong eating the weak. The strong, in your view, are justified in any act of violence they take against any other nation. Their victory, no matter how savagely won, is their vindication.
If you were not so obnoxious, I might agree with you more.
Historically all wars have unintended consequences, and the consequences are mostly negative for everyone involved, even the winners. Bismarck's victory in the Franco-Prussian was--taking the long view--a catastrophe for Germany. Still, it's better to be young and rich rather than old and poor, and it's better to win rather than lose a war....Bush didn't win any Big Door Prize in Iraq, but Saddam was patently the biggest loser... . Maybe something good will come out of our involvement there. There has to be a plus side to hanging a tyrant like Saddam.
rcocean said...
Yeah, who actually believes that women really wanted to go to school and have careers? I'm sure they're delighted with the return of Burqas and child marriage.
I'm sure they're delighted the war is over, and that they (and their menfolk) are no longer being killed/maimed by US Drones and Airstikes.
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Yeah. Mistakes that killed a tiny number of people are exactly the same as a policy applied to all the women and girls.
Exactly the same.
snort
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