"The development follows a second round of talks on Thursday afternoon, as local leaders warned about significant impacts to Ukrainian cities and as a mass exodus continues."
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५८ टिप्पण्या:
There's something ludicrous about "ceasefire" talks when one of the combatants invaded the other one.
Invaded 'unprovoked' I should add.
Does anyone know who is actually winning? And has Russia given up the pretense they are just "helping the true Russian provinces like Donbass?" Marching on Kiev seems to not be in keeping with that goal....
So Russian can get supplies to its troops.
BBC reported this morning that a humanitarian corridor had been negotiated for Mariupol, but that civilians didn't dare leave their homes and apartments because the Russian shelling had been constant. The shelling there had also knocked out power, water and landlines, and there was little food left in the city for civilians.
And the Russians are doing this because...?
Fox: They did take control of Kherson they killed 300, they are saying the bodies, unfortunately, are unrecognizeable, what is your reaction?
Lara Trump: I mean it's just devastating
They have come up with the ultimate sanction, they are going to ban Russian kids from western universities! Putin has to be saying the whole thing was worth it after that one.
"Does anyone know who is actually winning?"
We will find out in a week or so who was totally full of shyte.
32 trimesters to declare a cease-fire after the violent inception of Obama, Biden, Clinton, McCain, Biden's Slavic Spring, perhaps with reconciliation and remediation to the native people affected.
they are going to ban Russian kids from western universities
Separation of Progressive Corporation and State. Our kids should be so fortunate.
Well, perhaps this signals the last of the Western peacekeeping missions in the "Spring" series from Africa to Asia to Europe.
Good news. Further, Russian troops are pertty much on their way to encircling Kiev, and also cutting off all the Ukrainian troops in Southern and Eastern Ukraine. Maybe the Ukrainian leadership is staring to face reality, and letting humanitarian cease fires go into to effect is step I in the peace talks that will end this unneccessary conflict.
If you want to who's "winning", look at current map showing where the Russian Troops are.
Original Mike said...
There's something ludicrous about "ceasefire" talks when one of the combatants invaded the other one.
hmmm, let's see what i can pull off the very top of my head
Korean War "ended" in "ceasefire" ( i say "ended", 'cause that one is STILL going on)
WWI "ended" in an armistice: a pause in fighting brought about by agreement between sides
(really ended at Versailles)
Also, the Korean War had about eleventy-million ceasefires before the current one
So they can get supplies to their troops? Of course they can. Who's stopping them - the Ukrainian Air force?
So tire repair has become a human right?
"Does anyone know who is actually winning?"
Neither
Russia is fighting with a lot of restraint from how their war doctrine is normally applied.
trolling wars getting out of control. founder of azov battalionNeo Nazi according to Wikipedia biletsky to kadyrov:[ Ramzan Kadyrov, the leader of Russia’s Chechnya region and an ally of Russian President Vladimir Putin] "if you want my head, come and get it"
https://twitter.com/RWApodcast/status/1499461555292880903
Flame wars with real flame and real war.
"Does anyone know who is actually winning?"
China
On the subject of the invasion, can anyone explain why our resident members of the collectivist Hive (Inga, Howard, et al) are taking, or pretending to take, such a hard line against Putin? I mean to the extent of accusing people who are actually sympathetic to the Ukrainians of being pro-Putin? This is a crowd of idiots who normally and historically side with and apologize for dictators (Stalin, Castro, Mao, Uncle Ho, etc.); what did Putin do to anger these State-fellators? Did he have a mental lapse and do something pro-freedom at some time? Are they members of, say, some Trotskyite wing of the Hive that hate Putin but like other dictators? Please enlighten.
Don't look to Washington Post if you want to know what is happening in Ukraine.
Someone is trying to remind Putin that he can't flatten cities and keep support even from the Russian public. Temporary Cease fires usually grow to indefinite stand in place if they are actually put in place. This is where career diplomats earn their keep. (I would never have the patience)
Wheat and corn prices are going to skyrocket with a presumably poor year for Ukraine
On the subject of the invasion, can anyone explain why our resident members of the collectivist Hive (Inga, Howard, et al) are taking, or pretending to take, such a hard line against Putin?
It's a side effect of their TDS and the Russian collusion hoax.
WaPo: "After call with Putin, Macron convinced that ‘the worst is yet to come’ and that Russia wants to take all of Ukraine"
gilbar, if Russia wants a "ceasefire" they can just leave. It would take very little "talking" with Ukraine to get them to agree not to fire on the retreating troops.
My assessment- I think the Russians are emptying the regions they control of ethnic Ukranians. A ceasefire allows the Russians to resupply their lines, and allows the Ukranians to leave the areas under Russian control, or soon to be under Russian control. If one can believe the various maps of troop movements (hard to trust any data being put out by the media anywhere), it appears the Russians are carving out a new western border that is a 100 kilometers further west, and taking all of the Black Sea coast to boot.
"This is a crowd of idiots who normally and historically side with and apologize for dictators (Stalin, Castro, Mao, Uncle Ho, etc.); what did Putin do to anger these State-fellators?"
Two words: Pussy Riot. The Left turned on Putin after he jailed Pussy Riot in 2012.
"Maybe the Ukrainian leadership is staring to face reality, and letting humanitarian cease fires go into to effect is step I in the peace talks that will end this unneccessary conflict."
Exactly.
"Wheat and corn prices are going to skyrocket with a presumably poor year for Ukraine"
Exactly. The rest of the world has a very, very strong interest in ending the conflict.
It was good for the Europeans to get their act together and hurt Putin. But how high a price are they willing to pay, and for what end result?
NY Post
Russia-Ukraine updates: Russia decimates Ukrainian city of Irpin
March 3, 2022 5:01pm
https://nypost.com/2022/03/02/russia-ukraine-war-news-latest-updates-from-europe-conflict/
Eerie drone footage without sound (probably shot by a Ukrainian citizen), of the devastation of apartment buildings in Irpin. A fire is still burning in of the upper floors. The video speaks for itself.
At the end, also some footage of destroyed Russian military vehicles.
Irpin is a town just outside the northwestern border of the city of Kyiv.
Who's stopping them?
Chinese tires
Maybe the Ukrainian leadership is staring to face reality, and letting humanitarian cease fires go into to effect is step I in the peace talks that will end this unneccessary [sic] conflict.
I read this to myself in Darth Vader's voice.
Daily Mail 3 March 2022
Top Russian general is killed by Ukrainian sniper as Kyiv claims 9,000 of Putin’s troops have died during invasion
"Major General Andrey Sukhovetsky, who was the deputy commander of the 41st Combined Arms Army of Russia's Central Military District, died yesterday as Ukrainian defence forces repelled the Russian offensive.
His death has not yet been officially confirmed by Russia's Ministry of Defence, but was announced on social media by his colleague Sergey Chipilyov and was widely reported by several Russian and Ukrainian news outlets."
"...[Sukhovetsky] completed several combat deployments in the Chechen war, Abkhazia and the intervention in Syria."
"...He also received special commendation for his participation in Russia's annexation of Crimea."
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10573429/Top-Russian-general-killed-Ukrainian-sniper-Kyiv-claims-9-000-Putins-troops-died.html
Now Sukhovetsky has also received a special commendation from a Ukrainian sniper.
It is comforting to know that our fuel prices are keeping Russian voices silent about Hunter, isn't it?
Go get 'em!
Bet The Clinton Foundation will be handling the rebuilding effort. Hunter, the point man, knows his way around there. Maybe John Kerry's boy too, you know, as an aide. Just like old times!
I wonder which side first proposed a "humanitarian" cease-fire? I suspect it was Putin because such measures generally work against the interests of the weaker combatant. So far, Ukraine has done a good job of waging an asymmetrical resistance, what the ignorati media label "people's war", which suggests their leadership understands Ukraine's position very clearly.
And why not? Together with Moldova and Belorus, Ukraine was under German occupation longer than any other region of the Soviet Union. Consequently, the partisan resistance movement was largely a Ukrainian phenomenon.
When the reconnaissance troops of the Wehrmacht entered Ukraine in the early summer of 1941 they were occasionally greeted with gifts of salt and bread from the hands of people who survived Stalin's Holodomor. The Germans are liberators, they thought, grossly misjudging the nature of National Socialism by their brief experience with lightly-armed scouts, typical self-deception engendered by despair. The behavior of the garrison troop refuted the initial perception.
But it was the arrival of the SS that spawned armed resistance. A few rusty rifles hidden from the OGPU under haystacks or down dry wells cunningly applied led to a near geometric growth of the partisan arsenal. By 1943 the rear-area resistance became a major fighting front for Germany -- a front without a frontline that disproportionately consumed the power of the Nazis in the East; one man in four fought the partisans.
Partisan warfare is part of Ukraine's national heritage, and still a living memory. Putin may be cunning and ruthless, but he may be a fool as well. Hitler never pacified the Ukrainian partisans, even though he could isolate them. I doubt Putin will do any better with his poorly trained and motivated conscript army. A much more powerful Soviet army was defeated in Afghanistan, a fractured medieval society with little contact with its distant allies except via mule trains over the Hindu Kush. Ukraine borders NATO, whose easternmost members have every reason to provide material support, including man-portable anti-tank and anti-aircraft weaponry.
My assessment- I think the Russians are emptying the regions they control of ethnic Ukranians. A ceasefire allows the Russians to resupply their lines, and allows the Ukranians to leave the areas under Russian control, or soon to be under Russian control. If one can believe the various maps of troop movements (hard to trust any data being put out by the media anywhere), it appears the Russians are carving out a new western border that is a 100 kilometers further west, and taking all of the Black Sea coast to boot.
Agreed. I figure that the Russians will eventually take Kiev and all of the Black Sea coast, and then fortify their position, eventually trading the former back to Ukraine in exchange for the everything else recognized as independent states. They get their buffer states and a more advantageous position WRT to the Black Sea, while the now weaker Ukraine gets folded into NATO, but isn't a threat.
Bilwick said...
'On the subject of the invasion, can anyone explain why our resident members of the collectivist Hive (Inga, Howard, et al) are taking, or pretending to take, such a hard line against Putin? I mean to the extent of accusing people who are actually sympathetic to the Ukrainians of being pro-Putin? This is a crowd of idiots who normally and historically side with and apologize for dictators (Stalin, Castro, Mao, Uncle Ho, etc.); what did Putin do to anger these State-fellators? Did he have a mental lapse and do something pro-freedom at some time? Are they members of, say, some Trotskyite wing of the Hive that hate Putin but like other dictators? Please enlighten."
They haven't been told to say anything different. This, of course, can turn on a dime.
Blogger Barry Dauphin said...
"So Russian can get supplies to its troops."
This works both ways.
Russia has President Putin and we have President Putz. No match. Trump is right that Putin is a genius and can outsmart the Putz in the White House knowing that the Putz is just a puppet and no one is really in charge.
So, no oil for you American people.
We have a Build Back Better Plan.
Are you scared yet, Putin???
Yancey Ward said...
If one can believe the various maps of troop movements (hard to trust any data being put out by the media anywhere), it appears the Russians are carving out a new western border that is a 100 kilometers further west, and taking all of the Black Sea coast to boot.
That's a scenario that's been going around for a few days now; Putin only wants the eastern half of Ukraine and the coast down to Odessa for access to the Black Sea. Western Ukraine is mostly farmland and its only urban area, Lviv, is close to the Polish border, not worth the effort.
Of course if that happens it will probably mean a Ukrainian resistance movement that will at some point end up dragging NATO in. I'm hoping one of the oligarchs will lost too much money to sanctions and offer one of Putin's generals a yacht to put a 9mm in the back of Vlad's skull.
Bilwick said...
On the subject of the invasion, can anyone explain why our resident members of the collectivist Hive (Inga, Howard, et al) are taking, or pretending to take, such a hard line against Putin?
According to his son, George Soros is 100% behind the Ukrainian Government
https://twitter.com/AlexanderSoros/status/1497937270367793156/photo/1
WHICH, should make you (me (All of Us)) wonder what the hell is going on?
Original Mike said...
gilbar, if Russia wants a "ceasefire" they can just leave. It would take very little "talking" with Ukraine to get them to agree not to fire on the retreating troops.
I'm NOT Sure, why you think they'll be leaving?
"Does anyone know who is actually winning?"
In the context of war winning and losing are terms almost devoid of meaning, to even pose the question suggests a fundamental misapprehension. Armchair generals blessed with 20-20 hindsight will tell you how foolish Hitler was to invade the Soviet Union. Napoleon tried it and it ruined him, they confidently chortle, ignoring Russia's three hundred years of Mongol and Tartar occupation. The dice player doesn't always make his point. Everyone thought Frederick the Great was doomed, however, the Seven Years' War, the conflict that shaped our own national story beyond the limits of plausible alternatives, turned on a dime thanks to the demise of Empress Elizabeth. And how could Hannibal lose the Second Punic War after Cannae? The dice of History are not loaded.
And what is winning and losing? Do we assume winning a war or losing a war have consistent meanings? Let's not be that foolish. If Ukraine loses it means the at the very least end of their national sovereignty. If Russia loses it means the end of Putin and his lackeys. If Russia loses militarily, it will also mean national humiliation. However, if the war ends with a 9mm solution applied to Putin's brain, the world may hail Russia as a reborn member of the community of nations rather than a despised pariah. Winning for Russia means embargos, sanctions, economic and cultural isolation, increased poverty, and perhaps war with much stronger foes than Ukraine. Winning for Ukraine simply means not losing.
War is always a gamble, though someone like Putin who has won so often he thinks himself invincible probable believes it to be a solvable equation. Alea iacta est, may the foolish suffer the consequences.
Look Squirrel!...
https://www.frontpagemag.com/fpm/2022/03/afghan-adjustment-act-would-legalize-36000-daniel-greenfield/
Read what's happening. Fog of War?
Agree with messrs. Ward and Wibble.I
The Russians are letting the Ukrainians out without killing them.
They won't let them back in.
Reports now that the largest nuclear power plant in Europe (in Ukraine) is on fire, after alleged Russian shelling.
CNN: Opinion: "I'm a Black, African woman. It's time to change the channel on Ukraine media coverage"
"Wheat and corn prices are going to skyrocket with a presumably poor year for Ukraine"
Wheat was "limit up," 7% today on the Chicago Exchange, Ukraine is a huge supplier of wheat in normal times. Inflation set to come in at 10%, this war is not going to be without costs fo us. I guess it's worth it to not allow Ukraine to be neutral.
Bloomberg is the best way to follow this war, none of the emotional video, and insights like giving Iran the bomb because we are now so desperate for oil thanks to Joe Biden. Supply chain disruptions out the wazoo, not just Ukrainian wheat, but no cargo flights between Europe and Asia, India and Brazil desperate for Russian Ammonium Nitrate would rather sit this one out, Korea given a pass on sanctions on Russia, etc. Heart rending video is not that informative, and drags you into the war.
I hope they stick to it. I fear it won't.
Democrats have been beating the war drums against Russia for five years, you can't blame them for getting exited when their plan fell together.
I figure that the Russians will eventually take Kiev
========
will there be a game of contending Patriarchs in Kiev and Moskva
"This is a crowd of idiots who normally and historically side with and apologize for dictators (Stalin, Castro, Mao, Uncle Ho, etc.); what did Putin do to anger these State-fellators?"
Putin is seen as a Russian nationalist. Reds are allergic to them because they are a bogeyman of Soviet disinformation. The reflex against them remains even among those who hadn't reached maturity when the USSR collapsed.
Hey Ann... Ruskies now have shot up a nuke plant... radiation levels going up...
Are we all happy here with Brandon? He caused this... caused it all.
I'm hoping one of the oligarchs will lost too much money to sanctions and offer one of Putin's generals a yacht to put a 9mm in the back of Vlad's skull.
At this point some of them would probably be willing to do it for more personal reasons. Given the performance of the Russian military, there have to be more than a few generals worried about receiving lead injections.
as a mass exodus continues...
======
if WaPo means refugees out of Ukraine to other countries : these will be women and children ; not war-fighting age young men who are not allowed to leave? ageist? discriminist?
"This is a crowd of idiots who normally and historically side with and apologize for dictators (Stalin, Castro, Mao, Uncle Ho, etc.);"
Where is your documentation supporting your claim that this "crowd of idiots" you vaguely refer to "normally side with and apologize for dictators (Stalin, Castro, Mao, Uncle Ho, etc)...?"
"Does anyone know who is actually winning?"
The weapons makers and merchants and any parent or ancillary corporate entities.
I lived through the Sixties, Cookie. Not only that, but I went to college in the Sixties. I well remember your gang of State fellators singing the praises of whatever communist dictators we're around, and the bigger the body count, the louder they sang. Ever heard the phrase "useful idiots," attributed to Lenin, about the American and European Left? I remember one professor praising Mao and when forced to comment on Mao's vast kill-count essentially repeated the old omelettes/eggs cliche. Ever heard of Herbert Matthews, or Walter Duranty? A few years back, I think it was Joseph Sobran who wrote a long article, with quotes, detailing how the Left apologized and even praised various dictators throughout the 20th Century--even Hitler early in his reign. I can also refer you to Erik von Kuhnnelt-Leddhin's scholarly LEFTISM in which he dissects a very sadistic streak in the Left, going back to De Sade himself, that causes them to like dictators, the bloodier the better. This is the gang that our useful idiots here belong to.
Bilwick:
That you have a grudge against radical college students in the 60s has no bearing at all with, and--even with all your after-the-fact spittle-flecked huffing and puffing--does not in the least support your claim that "our resident members of the collectivist Hive (Inga, Howard, et al)" are "a crowd of idiots who normally and historically side with and apologize for dictators (Stalin, Castro, Mao, Uncle Ho, etc.)...."
Completely specious and intellectually dishonest.
Thanks. Going forward,I can ignore your comments as having been preemptively impeached...by you.
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