Writes Kathleen Parker, in "Has Kamala Harris been sidelined?" (WaPo).
There are some similarities but also some differences. Sarah Palin was immensely charismatic, a vigorous presence who drew enthusiastic crowds. She needed to be reined in. Kamala Harris has never shown a glimmer of political oomph. Yes, they are both women, and I can see that Kathleen Parker wants to defend women, but part of the defense of women is the avoidance of stereotypes, and though both of these women served the interest of a presidential candidate who wanted credit for picking a female running mate, the details of what they liked about the woman — and what they, later, did not like — are very different.
TO BE FAIR: Parker does say Palin is "very different."
127 comments:
Serious Question
Were there EVER, two women MORE different; than Sarah and Kamela?
If you're going to compare Harris to Palin, don't use the word "popular." Harris isn't, wasn't, and never has been popular.
The only intersection point between them is ambition.
part of the defense of women is the avoidance of stereotypes
Defending women depends on their not acting like women. Never admit anything!
I'd say defending women depends on finding the positive stereotypes, mostly ones that have been suppressed, e.g. stuff women are actually interested in instead of climbing telephone poles.
That doesn't mean women are or will ever be any good at voting.
Kamala Harris has never shown a glimmer of political oomph.
Ah, but she could make certain members of her party shimmer and glisten.
Palin came under non stop ruthless, dishonest, and unfair attack by a press which viscerally loathed her. Harris has had the support of the entire media and the only attacks on her from the right have come from the rank and file, who are having fun with the way she became politically prominent, by keeping her head down, and her heels up. You won't hear any of those kinds of attacks on her in the media.
But she is being shut out by the Democrats, CNN wouldn't publish that attack for any Republican, and obviously the Biden people are having a huge case of buyer's remorse. Buttigieg is the golden boy now, given control over .25 trillion dollars in discretionary spending (slush fund), and Bezos just put up a puff documentary on his personal favor doing machine, err, I mean streaming service.
They all know they made a mistake when the selected Harris, and they have selected "Mayor Pete" now. We will see how this plays with black voters.
McCain's purported presidential hero was Teddy Roosevelt. Sara Palin was a reform governor who wasn't liked by her state's political machine. She was young with a young, large family. And she was a true outdoorswoman. So it seems pretty likely that McCain was selecting his hero.
There are some similarities but also some differences. Sarah Palin was immensely charismatic, a vigorous presence who drew enthusiastic crowds. She needed to be reined in.
Reined in because why? The object of the exercise is to win the Presidency; there is no silver medal provided by some committee. If McCain lacked the fire in the belly to win he should have retired to Scottsdale and clipped coupons.
Whatever. In the end, McCain stiffed Palin to his detriment. At least Biden made the cut...somehow.
Palin was the closest thing I've seen to Trump and paved the way for him.
People were begging for any kind of swag with her name on it, like the Trump stuff the local parties and indies sell now. I mean we buy and resell Trump hats and shirts and flags we buy ourselves, no waiting for any hapless campaign to send signs to us like we did in 2008.
Then when Palin came to speak she packed a mega church with adoring evangs who paid over $100 per.
I've never see anything like it. She was a very attractive brunette (unusual imo) who spoke their language.
Forgotten Ferraro, similar story. But weren't all VP nominees used by the standard-bearers (and, to the extent that it was possible, using them)? The relationship has always been, as they say now, transactional.
There are some similarities but also some differences. Sarah Palin was immensely charismatic, a vigorous presence who drew enthusiastic crowds. She needed to be reined in.
Well, if you were a fake Republican who wanted the rubes to vote for you, but didn't actually want to do anything Republican, she "needed to be reined in".
The people on McCain's team who sabotaged her (setting up her first introductory "interview" to be with a hard left partisan is not what you do if you want your person to show well) are now all publicly Democrats. Back then, they were just as Left, but not admitting it
McCain picked her because he thought picking a woman would help HIM. He and his cabal did nothing but demean and make her look like an ass. One of those idiots is now at MSNBC and lies her ass off all the time about White Supremacy. Nicole Wallace. The other is another Never Trumper who is on the laughable Lincoln Project, Steve Schmidt. Two idiots who ended up showing what wankers they really are. They are Progressive Pravda..and always were.
tim in vermont said...
They all know they made a mistake when the selected Harris, and they have selected "Mayor Pete" now. We will see how this plays with black voters.
So, they're switching from one incompetent identity politics buffoon who had to drop out before the Iowa caucuses, and switching in a different identity politics buffoon who dropped out on March 1 to help "pave the way for Biden", after having accumulated a massive 21 delegates?
I really appreciate that the Democrats are willing to let everyone know that "gay" beats "black" and "female" in the identity politics pyramid.
I mean, it's not like there's more black or female voters than gay voters, right?
/sarc
Palin had experience as an executive and corruption fighter prior to being governor. And the media was 100% vicious and brutal to her. Biden still thinks Tina Fey’s words were spoken by Palin.
Focusing on the fact that Harris is a women completely misses the point. She was added to the ticket because she is a radical progressive. Biden wasn't mollifying the female vote, he was ensuring that he did not lose the far left of his own party. Biden played to the middle and the Harris VP pick was the wink and nod needed to keep the progs in line through the election.
Sarah Palin was the perfect Girlboss. McCain was foolish not to support her with everything he had at his disposal. Whether she was denied effective campaign counsel or refused it, we’ll never know, but that disastrous interview with Couric could easily have been avoided. I went to her rally in Fort Myers. Many thousands swarmed the place and the line outside of those who couldn’t get in was thousands more. She was magnificent and was the only reason McCain got any votes at all.
- Krumhorn
She is the first woman, the first Black American, and the first South Asian American to be elected Vice President. For chrissakes, has everyone forgotten that?
Joe Biden boxed himself in when he loudly and proudly proclaimed that he was going to pick as his veep running mate a woman of color. That really limited his available choices of electable candidates. For someone who presented himself as a centrist, I was surprised that he didn’t pick Congresswoman (and former Dem candidate like Kamala) Tulsi Gabbard. A woman - check. Of color - check (part Samoan). An active officer of the Hawaiian Army National Guard - bonus check. Raised in an obscure religion - possible red flag, but probably not a big issue. However, based on how Tulsi has become a pain in the butt to Democrats with criticism of their out of control spending and policies in the last 6 months, maybe Biden’s team saw she could be a problem to Joltin’ Joe and didn’t consider her. Still, Joe handcuffed himself with his announced intentions after he had become the prohibitive frontrunner.
Kathleen Parker, like Jennifer Rubin, used to pose as some sort of Conservative, but she threw off the mask a long time ago, and just writes as a liberal Demcocrat who loves Big Business and Israel.
I don't remember Ms. Parker being very positive about Palin, quite the opposite. IRC, her opinon was like that of the WSJ "Feminist" Peggy Noonan. Of course, that just shows how idiotic this "We women must support each other" is. Its makes no more sense than "We men must stick together". The idea that 50 percent of humanity, who have nothing in common but not having (or having) a penis are somehow "on the same on team" is absurd.
As for McCain, its become clear that almost everyone on his campaign staff was a liberal/Leftist. Weaver, Wilson, and Schmidt all joined the Lincoln Project and are supporting Democrats. Michelle Wallace is a left-wing Democrat on MSNBC. Cindy McCain is now Biden Ambassador and Democrat.
Is it any wonder that John McCain wanted to run a "Bi-partisan" Administation with Liberal Democrat Joe Liebermann (GORE VP) as his VP? And no wonder, that his campaign staff kept making "mistakes" when handling Palin. Wallace for example, made the "mistake" of sending Palin out to do recorded interviews with hostile ABC/NBC/CBS, thereby allowing them to edit the footage and present her in the worst way possible. Wow, what a "Mistake" by "Friend" Wallace.
"part of the defense of women is the avoidance of stereotypes"
Huh? Since when? Most of the defense of women is based on stereotypes, as is feminism itself.
Of course, that is not a serious criticism: most stereotypes are correct, or at least a useful approximation.
Reading some of the comments makes me realize that some people never learn. Y'know if you're a conservative and you still think McCain was a "Good man" who just "Made mistakes". I got a bridge in Brooklyn I can sell you. Gosh, if only Mccain had lived, he could have built "the dang fence" or repealed Obamacare.
There’s a shred of truth to the comparison. Both women were picked by men who really didn’t give a crap about them. In fact, both men despised their picks which is quite hilarious, really. As for Biden now trying to unload Kamala, I was at first highly skeptical. There is no way in hell, thought I, he can dump a woman of color. Then I read speculation that he would replace her with Susan Rice. Whoa! This changes everything. Rice has more color cred, more O cred, and she is effectively running the country anyway.
Btw, resurrecting John McCain in this discussion made me want to give a shout out to his tumor. Sorry you lost your host, bud. But thanks for your service.
***my conscience: “That was horrible.” My rational brain: “Too soon?” ***
I vaguely remember hearing that Bill Kristol was involved in the choosing of Palin. Can anyone confirm that? (Serious question.) Strange bedfellows if so.
While I do think Palin was out of her league, and was brought into national politics too early, she was the only reason I voted for the McCain ticket enthusiastically. McCain himself did not appeal to me. His speeches were awful. Does anyone remember "bottled water"? And he reminded me of Dole - a decent man who was too old and out-of-touch, and unable to bring a real fight to his opponent. But I no longer consider McCain a decent man. Palin was more authentic, and had the common touch. She seems to me a tragic figure - used, cast out, and now seeking a place in the aftermath.
Has the VP candidate EVER made a difference? LBJ?
"members of her party"
Lol.
Palin was viciously attacked by other women. That hasn't been Harris's experience.
I'll note that when I read it, I immediately thought that it was like rhardin heroin. Haha
Sarah Palin had to be destroyed because she had the gal to insult the collectivist left's new dreamy boyfriend at the time. How Dare She!
Comparing Harris to Palin is like comparing Carter to Trump. The similarities are of course there - gender, candidacy or office - but are so overwhelmed by their differences that the parallel comparison fails utterly.
stereo-types
-----------
why are stereotypes considered to be in the restrictive '/singular/' ?image(!)
since stereo means left and right or at least two?
I hated what happened to Sarah Palin. A successful governor, she knew little about foreign policy. They should have admitted that, and sent her out for interviews where she could say, Well, I'm just getting started learning but I'll be ready when I need to be! Unlike me, our opponents have never run anything in their lives; they'll never be ready.
Instead, they had her cram foreign policy, then had an interview where she got quizzed and a wrong answer meant she failed. It was ridiculous and humiliating.
McCain would have lost anyhow, anyone would have against Barack Obama, but Sarah Palin was the only thing that gave him a chance.
Scotty, beam me up... said...
Joe Biden boxed himself in when he loudly and proudly proclaimed that he was going to pick as his veep running mate a woman of color.
----------
given Biden characteristic predilections I wonder if he thought VP with benefits oh yeah
Harris is responsible for being sidelined. It’s unimaginable that Palin wouldn’t attack any task with gusto. She has the executive chops and would know how to get things done.
Rumors, there are rumors!
On Tuesday night, Fox News’ Jesse Watters reported that Fox News congressional correspondent Chad Pergram “has been hearing whispers suggesting there could be some new, high-profile confirmation hearings on the horizon in the House of Representatives.”
The House only confirms VPs. The rumors of the "shade wars" between Biden and Harris had been around for over a month before any MSM chose to report any of it...
"She is the first woman, the first Black American, and the first South Asian American to be elected Vice President. For chrissakes, has everyone forgotten that?"
Did you read what you wrote? You're prioritizing race and gender over accomplishments, intelligence, and an ability to form relationships and work with people, none of which Kamala Harris has demonstrated. (If you disagree, I'd love to hear your proof.)
Even now, if Kamala Harris really believes she's being undercut, she could go to Biden's handlers and demand a change, else she'll take her case to the people and undercut him with her agenda. She's not without tools; she just has to use them.
Except she doesn't, because she's simply not competent.
Did you ever consider that prioritizing race and gender over political skill and accomplishments is why we're here now?
Both female. Both feminine. Palin was the model of equal in rights and complementary in Nature/nature. A wife, mother, and successful politician, administrator, and leader. The right choice.
Sara[h], Sara[h], no time is a good time for goodbyes.
Lotsa love for Harris in the Post comments.
Palin had experience as an executive and corruption fighter prior to being governor. And the media was 100% vicious and brutal to her. Biden still thinks Tina Fey’s words were spoken by Palin.
This plus, when Palin wanted to campaign in Michigan the McCain folks shut her off.
She was the best thing about his campaign.
Feminism and masculinism are gender ideologies. Palin is female sex, feminine gender, but not feminist. Equal in rights and complementary in Nature/nature. Reconcile. #HateLovesAbortion
"What has happened to [Kamala] Harris reminds me of another — but very different — female vice-presidential pick: former Alaska governor Sarah Palin..."
What this reminds me of another female to female comparison: "Mary Ann or Ginger?"
My answer: Palin!!!
You don't get it. The "political oomph" to lefties of Kamala is her "diversity". That is it. They don't care about what she says or does (stupid stuff). They care about her genetics.
rcocean: "Reading some of the comments makes me realize that some people never learn. Y'know if you're a conservative and you still think McCain was a "Good man" who just "Made mistakes". I got a bridge in Brooklyn I can sell you. Gosh, if only Mccain had lived, he could have built "the dang fence" or repealed Obamacare."
Precisely.
Can you imagine the high-fives the democraticals were giving themselves over McCain getting the nomination in 2008 and Romney/Ryan being the nominees in 2012? It was the democratical varsity team vs the democratical JV team in both of those election cycles.
The political class loved Kamala (past tense because she's a liability now) because she comes off as one of them. She's an affluent, childless (as in never had any of her own.) woman of color. Kind of like Oprah, if Oprah had gone to law school. So she fit right in with the rich lefty culture of California and DC.
They hated Palin for her cultural middle classness as much as for anything else. The very idea the she knew where baby section in Walmart was disgusted them. She wasn't their kind of people, so she had no right to be in politics.
Obama picked Biden as V.P. because Joe would never be able to upstage the One-who-we'd-been-waiting-for. Biden picked Kamala "c*ck holster" Harris for the same reason. Biden's a moron, which an insult for all self-respecting morons. Harris is good only to cackle about going to the border and making European photo-ops. She's a moron's moron.
gilbar said...
Serious Question
Were there EVER, two women MORE different; than Sarah and Kamela?
This needed to be the first comment.
Ann consistently judges people as her leftist foundations and core motivations direct her to. It is what leftists do. It is learned on an instinctual level.
Women in particular are driven biologically to be like all other women. If you physically composite 10 women's faces the aggregate face that is constructed is more attractive than any of the 10 used to make it. If you use 100 faces you will get a more attractive version than if you use 10 faces. This leads to treating all other women like all other women.
No individuals allowed. Female individuals fared poorly in tribes.
The difference between Kamala Harris and Sara Palin is larger than the difference between Kamala Harris and most men.
Photo leading the Post story has Kamala in a kitchen.
Making a sandwich for Joe most likely.
Who said we thought McCain was Conservative rcocean?? I voted for Palin, not McLyingProgressivepretendingtobeconservative. When candidates are chosen for you, sometimes you have no choice....but McCain didn't have a chance in hell BEFORE Palin.
Krumhorn said...
Sarah Palin was the perfect Girlboss. McCain was foolish not to support her with everything he had at his disposal.
Not foolish.
McCain knew exactly what he was doing.
That is why all of his staff are now democrats.
You people need to realize the Republican party is full of vermin and traitors. These people are the true threat and are doing far more damage to our country than democrats.
She is the first woman, the first Black American, and the first South Asian American to be elected Vice President. For chrissakes, has everyone forgotten that?
To which I add, so what?
Other than both of them coming equipped with a vagina, there is nothing remotely similar between Palin and Harris. One was competent and likable (Palin was immensely likable as Alaska Gov., before the butchers in the press changed her entire being), the other is immensely unlikable and seemingly without a talent for anything, as illustrated by her being the first Democrat to pull out of the primaries- even before the primaries started. She couldn't garner enough votes to make it worth sending her to any of the cities.
As I write this I recognize that with her lack of likability and skills, Harris could spend a lifetime as a Senator. She should have stayed as such, and may end up returning.
I liked Sarah Palin and never changed my mind. I could see even back then that the media machine had rolled out against her just as I later saw it in action against Trump, just as it's doing against Kyle Rittenhouse. Why change until you read a real story with a real point showing a real problem based on real facts? Never saw one. And - could McCain have controlled the media? - I think not. They liked him because, as a politician, he was a two-faced wimp as we found with his Obamacare vote. As soon as Little Girl (spirit name) realized the media was out to get Palin, he ran away and hid and blamed her for negative coverage. But he couldn't have helped, media wasn't something he could control, just something he went along with.
in 2015, Palin became the first legit national political figure to endorse Donald Trump. That was the moment when Trump's campaign went from Political Sideshow to Main Event.
Palin and Harris are the same age, 57. Palin was elected governor of Alaska in 2006 with 115k votes. Harris was reelected San Fran DA in 2007 with 115k votes, uncontested. (She ousted the less charismatic incumbent in 2003 with many more votes.) Harris went on to win 2 statewide elections as AG and 1 as Senator, with millions of votes. She had political oomph, but not enough on a national stage in a crowded field where the electorate viewed the incumbent as worthy of impeachment a threat to the future of America. Apparently, the threat remains, filling Democrats with dread and a critical eye for the 2024 nominees.
Still, had she not dropped out in 2019, I would have voted for her in the California primary over the woeful field made up exclusively of sentenegarians.
I agree with "Scotty, beam me up". Tulsi has much more charisma and common sense than Kamala. Maybe you are right, Biden's handlers were afraid that Tulsi would outshine him. If she had been the VP candidate I might have voted for Biden. With Kamala I was like no thanks, I'll settle for Trump.
Biden still thinks Tina Fey’s words were spoken by Palin.
Most of the Democrats I know attribute those infamous words to Palin and not Tina Fey.
The DNC media entertainment complex negatively stereotypes every national Republican candidate, whether male, female, Black, White, Asian or Hispanic. You all know this and have experienced it for the past 50+ years going back to Goldwater.
When they depart the national stage, they are treated much better. However, Trump and Palin really scared them by siphoning off Blue collar and minority votes. They will be vilified forever.
I voted for John McCain, who was not a conservative, because of Sarah Palin. In retrospect, Palin changed over time, likely because of Steve Bannon's influence and her one-after-another family crises. But I didn't abandon hope for her until she turned Trumpian.
Kamala Harris has no personality, doesn't smile and doesn't have magic glasses.
Palin was said to hunt moose with a .338 Winchester Magnum before heading off to school. A woman after my heart. She frightened people with her version of womanhood.
Fox is insinuating that Kamala may be resigning as VP.
https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/matt-margolis/2021/11/17/huge-vacancy-rumors-swirling-on-capitol-hill-n1533771
Guess that means Hillary! could end up being one tragic accident away from the Presidency.
"She is the first woman, the first Black American, and the first South Asian American to be elected Vice President. For chrissakes, has everyone forgotten that?"
I assumed that was sarcasm!!
Achilles called you people "you people"
gadfly: "In retrospect, Palin changed over time, ..."
LOL
She hasnt changed 1 iota.
Still, had she not dropped out in 2019, I would have voted for her in the California primary over the woeful field made up exclusively of sentenegarians.
You didn't get the chance to vote for Bernie because he was paid off too soon.
Harris is the standard Democrat you vote for. Race is all she offers.
Achilles: "McCain knew exactly what he was doing.
That is why all of his staff are now democrats."
Not just democraticals, but the farthest of the far left lunatic democraticals.
You know, the sort of people McCain greatly admired while despising republicans and conservatives.
Anybody besides me notice that Sarah Palin’s complexion is very neatly as dark as POC Kamala Harris?
Rabel,
Photo leading the Post story has Kamala in a kitchen.
I remember one during what there was of her "campaign." Making, allegedly, jerk chicken (she's half-Jamaican, dontcha know!), in an apron so fresh out of its packaging that the original folds were plainly visible. When will these photo-op people learn that you have to iron it first, put it through the wash at least once, and maybe add a stain or two? No one had ever worn that garment before. Or, likely, since.
Can of Cheese for Hunter,
Sarah Palin had to be destroyed because she had the gal to insult the collectivist left's new dreamy boyfriend at the time.
"Had the gal"! Sometimes, typos are your friends.
M Jordan said...
As for Biden now trying to unload Kamala, I was at first highly skeptical. There is no way in hell, thought I, he can dump a woman of color. Then I read speculation that he would replace her with Susan Rice. Whoa! This changes everything. Rice has more color cred, more O cred, and she is effectively running the country anyway.
Takes a majority in the Senate, as well as the House.
Get rid of Harris so you can appoint a new VP? There's no Dem VP to tie-break, no Democrat majority, no new VP.
She could move up if they have to toss Joe. But they're not going to toss her
Harris is the first female Vice President...ever. This used to be a big deal. The Dems went ballistic to make sure a Republican wouldn't make that mark.
And no one is really promoting the fact we now have that, nonetheless she's also POC.
Why is that? The Democrats should be screaming that from the rafters. but they're not; not really. It's like it doesn't really matter, or that *she* doesn't really matter.
They hated Palin for her cultural middle classness as much as for anything else. The very idea the she knew where baby section in Walmart was disgusted them. She wasn't their kind of people, so she had no right to be in politics.
Just like Trump who ate fast food, well done steaks and two scoops of ice cream. How terribly gauche.
"McCain's hero was Theodore Roosevelt. . . ." Of course: TR, a statist.
"Fox is insinuating that Kamala may be resigning as VP."
While I am sure there are parts of the Democratic party leadership who would welcome the idea of a do over for both Kamala and Joe, I don't see her willingly going without the pressure of some huge public scandal. Fox is just trying to read goat entrails on this one.
"I’m afraid Harris, who by most accounts has been sidelined by the president"
Name for me a president who picked a more capable, charismatic or politically ambitious candidate than himself to be vice president.
The vice presidency has for at least 100 years been considered a fairly irrelevant job. There's lots of very witty and interesting quotes about the topic.
mAH ye/s
I wasn't a great fan of either. Palin was another politician who didn't live up to what one hoped was her potential. Between not being able to name a favorite news source and giving up the governorship it wasn't hard to lose faith in her. She did have some competence and a spark of personality or originality, even if you didn't like her.
Harris doesn't appear to have either ability or charisma. I feel sorry for her when I hear the things people say about her. You know the things I'm talking about and the names they call her. But the fact that she was too stupid to realize that people would talk about her in that way given her record, makes me feel angrier and less sympathetic. It shows a lack of the moral sense (I'm not thinking of her personal relationships, but how she used them to advance her career), and perhaps worse, it shows a lack of intelligence.
Temujin said...
the other is immensely unlikable and seemingly without a talent for anything
Now! Now!! Be Fair!!
Kamela Harris can suck the chrome off of a trailer hitch
Kamela Harris is a c*ck sucking Whore! That isn't Just a talent; it's the oldest profession!
I vaguely remember hearing that Bill Kristol was involved in the choosing of Palin. Can anyone confirm that?
So say Google and Wikipedia. Kristol promoted her candidacy, defended her after the election and criticized McCain for not making better use of her. Kristol later soured on Palin, though it's not sure exactly when.
'Kristol later soured on Palin, though it's not sure exactly when.'
When his balls fell off, although many would argue that he never had them to begin with...
Mckinley.
Palin was the only reason I bothered to show up at the polls that year. I got the feeling that McCain knew she was the reason he got a lot of the support that he did and he resented her for it.
OT:
Proof NBC news is pure hack.
She is the first woman, the first Black American, and the first South Asian American to be elected Vice President. For chrissakes, has everyone forgotten that?
I don't know if this was meant to be a serious interrogation of our consciences or ironic or sarcastic but it prompted me to wonder when was the last time I actually noticed 'the first' of or at something. I guess Mr Obama's nomination-- 13 years ago, almost. It seems more distant than that.
Lurker21: "I wasn't a great fan of either. Palin was another politician who didn't live up to what one hoped was her potential."
She was exactly what she was: a fightin' politician who overthrew the old boys corrupt network to win the Governorship against great odds. She was never going to be super refined or reflect a deeply philosophical outlook.
Lurker21: "Between not being able to name a favorite news source....."
The aide who knew quite a bit about Palin and set up that interview, along with some handy tips for Katie Couric to ask about, was none other than Nicole Wallace.....who coincidentally was also the person responsible to prep Palin for that interview.
See what happened there?
Lurker21: ".....and giving up the governorship it wasn't hard to lose faith in her."
The quirky Alaska laws allowed Palin to be sued as an individual for performing her Governor duties without compensation by the state. Palin and her family were being frivolously sued into personal financial oblivion by the democraticals while the republican Murkowski machine corruptocrats cheered them on.
Naturally, just as soon as Palin was gone the Alaska legislature changed the laws so that never happened again.
Again, see what happened there?
I guess in a world where Ted kennedy, who left a woman to die, is a respected figure, then John McCain was a "decent man" by comparison.
Salter has written how Palin got chosen. McCain wanted Lieberman and thought he was going to get him until a few Republicans told the Campaign Managers that there would be a floor fight. That's why there was discussion of Lieberman as VP in early to mid August 2008. The campaign staff finally convinced a Pissed-off Mccain that he couldn't survive a Convention floor fight over Lieberman and would have to choose someone else.
The final VP list was: Palin, Crist, Pawlenty, Romney, and Bloomberg. McCain decided on Palin because he wanted to "Shake things up". Bill Kristol had almost nothing to do with her being selected. Note that of the 4 men on the list, two are now liberal Democrats, and the other 2 are never-trumpers.
Kristol liked Palin because she was neo-con in foreign policy. And he thought he could use her. He had the same attitude toward Dan Quayle. Once Trump came along, Kristol decided the Republican party was useless for pushing his neo-con policies. Hence the support for Hillary and Biden.
He's always been a fake. Just like Romney, Ryan, and girly men at National Review.
Harris and Tucker Carlson and Montel Williams are in the news today. I wonder if Ann is going to leave me out of this one too? Everyone seems to be leaving Williams' history of Hosting talking to the dead psychics out of their reports. Once you do that, what's the point?
I liked the Sarah Palin I saw (yes politicians of whatever stripe project an image--unconsciously or otherwise). I thought that a person like Palin could be a friend of mine.
I don't like what I see in Harris--and if a person like that tried to become a friend of mine, she'd fail.
That just may be the "charisma' thing (I'll leave George H. W. Bush's waffling about the "vision thing" aside), but it's there, and it's real. Sarah had it. Kamala doesn't.
Name for me a president who picked a more capable, charismatic or politically ambitious candidate than himself to be vice president.
Cheney was more capable than W.
Kamala could be my friend. She seems like she would be a lot of fun at parties, but then again, though I love my friends, I wouldn't task any of them with running the United States.
rcocean: "Salter has written how Palin got chosen. McCain wanted Lieberman and thought he was going to get him until a few Republicans told the Campaign Managers that there would be a floor fight. That's why there was discussion of Lieberman as VP in early to mid August 2008. The campaign staff finally convinced a Pissed-off Mccain that he couldn't survive a Convention floor fight over Lieberman and would have to choose someone else."
This is absolutely true.
McCain was spitting mad after having his moronic dream of a democrat as VP was shot down by those horrible conservatives.
It was then that McCains serious dislike for conservatives turned to visceral hatred.
Though I voted for Obama in ‘08, I was pleased to see Palin nominated, and I thought her convention speech was excellent. It was discouraging to watch her struggle later against a hostile press. But what was truly eye opening was to watch all the lefty women and men treat her with utter contempt. That was when I first realized that all the left’s rhetoric about valuing women is just empty talk.
Howard said...
Achilles called you people "you people"
The blind squirrel finds a nut every now and then.
Name for me a president who picked a more capable, charismatic or politically ambitious candidate than himself to be vice president.
McKinley who would have been a damned good president.
"She is the first woman, the first Black American, and the first South Asian American to be elected Vice President. For chrissakes, has everyone forgotten that?"
She is also the first vice president to have f***** a con artist while working as a US prosecutor. Has everyone forgotten that?
"Everyone seems to be leaving Williams' history of Hosting talking to the dead psychics out of their reports."
Not one of Montel's better obsessions.
Every time Harris cackles.___________________________
Here’s the latest conspiracy theory on the Kamala Dump Project. They offer her a Supreme Court seat (which they yank out from under 80-year-old Breyer), install Michelle Obama as Veep, then Joe steps aside to let the Obama reign continue.
Whacky, eh? But strangely somehow believeable. I suggested earlier Susan Rice would actually be a way around dumping a woman of color but she pales in comparison to Michelle.
I do hope this all comes true. Trump vs. Obama in 2024. Now that might get our first 100 million vote-getter.
"This plus, when Palin wanted to campaign in Michigan the McCain folks shut her off."
I don't think McCain et. al. treated Palin so badly because they hated her politics, although in the big picture I'm sure that played a role. One of the things Palin was supposed to do was energize a base that no one running the campaign respected, and she certainly did that.
I think McCain was shocked and pissed when she turned out to be a much better politician than he was. And McCain was known to have gold-leaf-thin skin. (Sort of like Biden.) So she had to go.
WHY, WHY, WHY do you insist on reading this shit from places like the Washington Post???
If it wasn't for Sarah Palin, Maverick McCain would have lost by 90 percent. Most of the people who voted Republican voted for HER, not McCain.
And if it wasn't for POSs like Kathleen Parker's POS buddy Nicole Wallace sabotaging Palin, they would have won.
McKinley served an entire term. His first VP did not, dying in office of natural causes. His replacement running mate succeeded him early in his second term and ended up on Mount Rushmore.
Sara Palin was not incompetent. Harris is.
Name for me a president who picked a more capable, charismatic or politically ambitious candidate than himself to be vice president.
All three? That's a hard ask. Theodore Roosevelt turned out to be more capable, charismatic and ambitious than McKinley, but nobody saw any of that when McKinley picked TR, the dandy who pretended he was a cowboy. Johnson was more experienced and probably more competent than Kennedy, but lacked charisma. Mondale may have been more competent than Carter, but he certainly lacked charisma. Possibly, he was so uncharismatic that he would have ended up as poor a president as Carter. Coolidge would have had to be more competent than Harding, but he certainly wasn't charismatic or especially ambitious either. So yes, in general, vice presidents are chosen because they are second raters and they usually turn out to be second rate.
My mom, starting '56, only voted Democratic ticket twice. '08 because of Palin, '20 because of Trump. (She liked RFK in '68, but ....)
The likeness was to chose a woman who had star power, saavy &an upward trajectory- tie your wagon to her and then stop her career in its tracks. It isn’t the women who are similar, it is the tactic of pairing male/female to hook the woman and similar- minded votes. And then “sideline”. Or, clothesline, which is pretty much what McCain did to Palin.
I loved her energy back then, before he ruined her. He absolutely did ruin her- twisted her trust, rattled her security and accused her of theft. She was so amazing to watch in her debates- “can I call you Joe?” Lol.
She lost her family, the microscopic attention caused untold harm to her kids. She would have matured on Alaska time if she had never been chosen. Talk about the regret of embracing one simple little word: no.
Of not embracing… I think I meant to say. It’s late and chores start at 5…. Thank u for this post. I really liked it and the comments
Both Sarah Palin and Kamala Harris are "glamour-pusses" feather-weight politicians picked solely for their female gender as sole "statement", despite their otherwise obvious lack of credibility and experience. And both were picked by lackluster stupid Old Men, guys with super-egos and little legitimate resume accomplishment, candidates with neither leadership skills or intellect, but picked "because it's their time". Frankly, both did little as senators, and it's a race-to-bottom, whether McCain or Biden is/was stupider guy because both graduated at bottom or near bottom of their college class.
Thankfully McCain lost, though Obama was frankly incredibly weak candidate too, and won simply because he was handsome hip guy, and his half-blackness was enormous PC virtue-signal for his voters. Biden, now, is an embarrassment, an Harris doubly so. LGBTQBNN!
McCain was a war hero, more-or-less, but after Palin's phenomenal introduction at the Rethug convention (Trumpismo avant la lettre!) , the ticket surged ahead of the "unbeatable" Obamazoids and stayed ahead for a few weeks before McCain was somehow convinced by the insider cabal (see above in this thread) that he had to throw her the bus right now! Palin was probably forcibly prevented by that cabal from calling out Obama on his outrageous proclamation, "We're going to see a fundamental transformation of the USA", to which our Soviet Media somehow never worked up the cojones to ask, "What exactly, Senator Obama, do you have in mind; and what exactly needs to be so fundamentally transformed under the present American political and cultural dispensation, why, and now?" Total sound of crickets. McCain's inner swinishness ran clear and true to his demise, when he loudly and publicly forbid then President (!)Trump from attending his upcoming soon funeral.
Oh, everyone's pointing out why a comparison between Palin and Harris is asinine. So much so that I should point out one major similarity. Neither woman had a powerful "machine" backing them in the way the Bushes or Kennedys inherited. Whatever you think of them personally, Clinton, Obama, and especially Trump built their own political machines. Both were big fish in small ponds, and were promptly devoured when they were promoted well beyond their abilities. Palin had scummier "advisers" on Team McCain, but she really should have had the horse sense to kick them to the curb and do her own thing. Hell, promising to break McCain's knees probably would have won her at least two extra states and given 2008 Obama a bit of tarnish.
Harris, however, has never been anything more than the charmless, aged-up whore who was installed as VP in 2020.
Dick Chaney was more capable and ambitious than Bush. Rummy had the charm.
Had they existed in the same political time frame, a Trump/Palin candidacy would have been a hoot.
gilbar said...Were there EVER, two women MORE different; than Sarah and Kamela?
They are both youngish women chosen by an old man to spice up a tired uninspiring campaign. That’s about the extent of their similarities.
(Over 100 comments ...)
Media and Dems hated Palin, worse than Bush.
Publicly, and without getting fired from network TV, called her a c*nt, like they also called Ivanka, and I'm sure the Dems will go all "Civility!!!" when normal Reps call Harris names.
Like the Civility Bullshit (could be the most lasting phrase from Althouse) has come out on both FJB (spelled out) AND "Let's Go Brandon" - euphemistically vulgar.
Harris is a loser - but might still become President.
Achilles point, again:
"McCain knew exactly what he was doing.
That is why all of his staff are now democrats."
Palin, even more than Trump, was a worker, a normal person. Mayor of small Alaskan city, then governor. But never part of the elite.
Harris is just a hole or two waiting for elite male member to come home to.
"Civility Bullshit" will get a bigger workout with Harris as Pres, then FJB or Let's Go Brandon.
Note - blogger said there was an error on my first comment. Also my second. Twice. But third time I see first one approved. Don't know if second got into moderation acceptance place.
Palin was Trump before Trump.
An outsider getting elected to top executive and immediately started kicking over rice bowls
If I remember correctly, she was under a handful of investigations. Classic lawfare, and Republicans were fully engaged in trying to get rid of her. When she resigned to accept the VP ticket, all those lawsuits quietly evaporated. Palin had the IT quality, and was at least average in intelligence. For sure more intelligent that Biden and Harris combined.
Sound familiar?
If anything Palin and Trump expose the massive corruption in Government, and how impossible it would be to clean house.
The takeaway from this isn't that Harris is Palin, but that Biden is McCain, and the similarities aren't that hard to see: two petulant mediocrities who talked big, acted out of personal pique, and didn't have much of a grip on what was going on around them or what was important.
There are some differences, though. Biden is a pure partisan, while McCain delighted in putting down his own party. Biden affects folksiness to take the edge off his sharp corners, while McCain was unfiltered Captain Queeg. And When McCain ran he was younger and less senile than Biden is now.
"She is the first woman, the first Black American, and the first South Asian American to be elected Vice President. For chrissakes, has everyone forgotten that?"
The only reasons she got picked, because it certainly wasn't due to her talent or political acumen.
Hanoi Paris Hilton: "McCain was a war hero, more-or-less, ....."
Less.
McCain was quite the war klutz, but he was a prisoner-of-war-hero. That is not meant in anyway to denigrate him. It's just a much more accurate characterization.
Thanks to someone for reminding us that McCain was a "war hero". People who liked him, including the MSM, mentioned that every single day for 35 years. He must have been called a "war hero" at 10,000 times in the MSM.
Bob Dole and George Bush were "war heroes" But managed not to mention it except when on the campaign trail. Goldwater and McGovern were also "war heroes" but rarely talked about it.
Of course, Megan McCain is still mourning for her dead 82 y/o father. Because he was a "war hero".
"Biden is a pure partisan, while McCain delighted in putting down his own party."
Biden doesn't have to "Put down his own party", sincemost D's agree with Biden on almost everything. McCain, hated the Conservatives in his party and trashed them every chance he got. The only time he liked Conservatives was on the campaign trail.
He wasn't a "mavericK' he was just a NYT establishment Republican. That's why the MSM Loved him.
That's the difference.
Ann's just gonna ignore the whole Montel talking-to-the-dead issue - like everyone else - even though she knows newsmakers read her and it would help straighten out the nation.
She's as worthless as the rest of the media.
The NewAge Movement has eaten this nation, whole, in my lifetime.
Like a rattlesnake consuming a deer.
When she resigned to accept the VP ticket, all those lawsuits quietly evaporated.
No, they started after the 2008 election to force her out of office.
"That's why the MSM Loved him."
They did until he was the only thing standing between the light bringer and the white house. Then he became (like every other Republican nominee) evil incarnate. Once he lost, he reverted back to being every Democrat's favorite Republican.
A man of character would have observed this dynamic and concluded that the folks giving him journalistic fellatio were not his friends. In McCain's case, his ego was too in need to care. He was willing to perform sodomy on his own party (by voting against the repeal of Obamacare) just to gain the praise of such people. Truly a despicable human being.
The Crack Emcee: "Ann's just gonna ignore the whole Montel talking-to-the-dead issue - like everyone else - even though she knows newsmakers read her and it would help straighten out the nation."
If the dead are going to keep voting democratical then there is no reason Montel shouldn't try to chat with them.
I live in Alaska. I was here when Palin was elected. The central political issues that year were taxation and regulation of the petroleum industry, with lots of debating about numbers and legal fine print. Palin at the time struck me as nerdy-smart in a way that would work against her as a state-wide candidate. Watching national media portray her as stupid was a learning experience.
Drago said...
"If the dead are going to keep voting democratical then there is no reason Montel shouldn't try to chat with them."
But there's a HUGE reason why Ann should be pointing that out - and she isn't. She's as worthless as most newspaper editors today. Oprah spread misinformation, quackery, and pseudoscience? who has time to reveal that?
I'm surrounded by idiots.
Harris is going nowhere unless it's up. I don't think the Dem PTB have the leverage necessary to get her out, and she's certainly not going to do it voluntarily. It would kill her political career, and then she'd actually have to work for a living.
More important than checking the identity boxes, she represents what the progs think is the future of the Democrat party. White women are toxic again after the progs started reading the VA cross-tabs. DOCTOR Jill and President Klain are living on borrowed time.
The Democrats badly need somebody who can nationalize the 2022 midterms. They are sure to lose the House, the only question is how badly, but they have a hope of hanging on to the Senate with sufficient zeal from the base in key states. They aren't going to get that from Biden, nor are they going to get it from Harris in her current position. The subtext the progressive base is taking from that CNN article is that Harris could be effective but she's being stabbed in the back.
Biden isn't looking at McAuliffe for a WH job. They're vetting him for the VP slot. He's shown himself to be down with the progressive project, and he'll be able to get through a 50-50 Senate based on the 'old boy' network, and support from Bill Clinton.
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