From "So You Want to ‘Save Women’s Sports’?/More than 20 states are considering bills to ban transgender kids from girls’ sports. If only people really cared about female athletes" (NYT).Let me put it on Twitter too cause this needs the attention pic.twitter.com/t0DWKL2YHR
— Sedona Prince (@sedonaprince_) March 19, 2021
২৪ মার্চ, ২০২১
"Watching the recent surge of women’s sports enthusiasts clamoring to save female athletes from the transgender rights movement, it’s hard not to feel a little wistful."
"So this is what it’s like to matter.... But all this new passion has made me wonder, what if all these people claiming to be fighting for the future of women’s sports would really fight for the future of women’s sports? What if they suddenly said, 'We demand women’s sports get equal resources, equal media coverage, and equal pay'?... Consider last week: As the N.C.A.A. basketball tournaments began, female players demanded to know why the weight room in the men’s bubble had state of the art lifting equipment, whereas they got a stingy rack of dumbbells...."
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«সবচেয়ে পুরাতন ‹পুরাতন 247 এর 201 – থেকে 247Next time you're in Tokyo, make sure to see a game if you're a baseball fan : )
I was supposed be in Japan last September but that fell through, of course. It's doubtful that I'll be going any time soon or even ever again. :-(
Seems unequal.
It's not equal. It's not unequal. It's equitable as in politically congruent ("=").
Kay, I know you're trying to make a rational argument. It isn't working.
the Japanese picked up the litter in the spectator stands
Conservative religion (i.e. morality/ethics/law), traditions, and practice.
Professional sports, in which I include D1 college athletics, is entertainment. The more entertaining, i.e.; the more people that are attracted to watch, the more the participants are paid. That's all the economics you need to know. If the professional leagues want to allow men and women to comingle in sport, or allow trans athletes to participate, then I don't care; might actually be entertaining in a NASCAR car wreck sort of way.
Allowing cross gender or trans gender participation in youth leagues, MS, and HS will kill the girl's/women's programs, denying many, many females access to a terrific learning activity and experience. One that they are unlikely to pursue beyond high school.
Women are being treated the same as men, they just do not like it much. You have to look at the revenue being brought in. Look at how football players were treated in the 50s and 60s when the revenue was small, compared to now. Same for the NBA. If they can figure out a way to get people to like the games and watch them, then the revenues will come in and the facilities (and salaries for pro players) will improve with the revenues. There is nothing discriminatory about this.
Kay said...
So we know there are men who are worse athletes than Serena and some who are better. Is it hard to imagine that there may be some men in the middle? Why not just have men and and women of similar abilities play against each other?
Because no man who's pitiful enough to lose to a woman in a sports competition is actually competing.
Competitive 15 year old boys are better athletes than women who do it professionally.
Any guy you can find who competes at the women's level, is so pathetic that no one wants to watch him play.
What part of this are you not capable of understanding?
"I was supposed be in Japan last September but that fell through, of course."
I would make it a priority as it is a fantastic place...especially if you don't mind getting out of your comfort zone...
I guess you cucks are not long distance open water swimmers!
daskol said...
I've been a little bewildered by the reaction to Kristen Noem's veto and revision on the women's sports rights bill. To hear her tell it, she wants the law focused on high school sports, which the state controls without the complications that will arise if the state enacts laws contrary to NCAA rules.
But people seem furious with her over it. Is she wrong that such a law will prevent SD colleges from participating in NCAA conference athletics? That doesn't sound like bullshit.
Everything she said was a lie.
You have to present your birth certificate to Little League to get to play (got to confirm you're in the correct age range). Doing the same for schools is entirely reasonable.
All the NCAA could try to do is not allow SD to hold NCAA championship events. Not block all college sports.
And this is the era of the nationwide injunction. There's multiple Federal Districts where the only judges are Trump appointees / other conservatives. The NCAA tries to do something, you sue, and you get a nationwide injunction blocking them. The chance of getting 5 SC justices to overturn that injunction is pretty non-existent.
Norm claimed she was willing to fight for us. Then, when push came to shove, she blinked. "Ojh, I don't want to get in a court battle with the NCAA that I might loose!"
Then you are garbage, and don't get our votes.
Howard said...
I guess you cucks are not long distance open water swimmers!
Nope.
And neither are you. Although sh!t floats, so you've got that going for you
DavidUW said...
Btw? Real female athletes don't much fear Trans-women talking over their games. Bring It!
...
the men, even disguised as women, will always win, eh?
>>
Mary E. Glynn
Are you a woman? A natural born XX woman?
I can go to any state high school track meet and pick a boy or three who would beat world class female track athletes today.
A world class female athlete would not get on the medal state at any state high school boys' championship meet. Probably wouldn't even qualify for the meet.
-----------------
I am a competitive woman, not a trans-.
I was not defending trans women competing as women. They will always carrying the male chromosome. I belive in science, not social science.
Hth!
Re. all those of you who prefer high school sports over professional women's teams. ENJOY! The pro women are not interesting in competing at the high school level, boys or girls. Hth. Your fears are needlessly being stoked here.
Women and men, boys and girls, who enjoy watching competitive womens' pro teas are growing in the areas where womens sports are marketed, televised, discussed, participated in and written about in sports coverage. That's the future. I don't think the NBA was always "profitabl" either in the building years...
Live and let live.
Sports for men, and women.
Dont' be soo afraid of me you have to delete or distort my opinions to win in your word games. OK? And good luck to your sons in their high-school careers. Your daughters too. ;-)
Peace, out.
Competitive 15 year old boys are better athletes than women who do it professionally.
------------
A lot of people will watch professional female athletes compete who simply aren't all that interested in high-school boys games, or bodies.
Lotsa of prep athletic supporters in here today, it seems. Good on ya! Maybe that kid'll win ya a scholarship and free up your college-planning funds, eh?
Joe Smith,
This is some "cut the ball off the boys so they can sing higher notes in a medieval boys' choir" shit right there.
Um, it never worked like that. Castrati were made eunuchs when they were still boy sopranos, yes, but the idea wasn't to make them sing higher; it was to catch them before their voices broke, so that they could stay sopranos as adults. And their golden age wasn't in "medieval" times, but in the 18th century, where a top male singer w/o balls out-earned his lady soprano colleagues, and certainly any man singing in a normal "male" register.
It's true, though, that the age at which voices break has been getting lower for a long time, due mostly to improved diet I think. In the 18th c. it was common to have 17- and 18-year-old male singers with unbroken voices in choirs. You have to shave several years off that now. And that does make it much harder -- today -- to perform works meant for choirs of men and boys, b/c the boys have much less time to learn the art of singing and the music to be sung. There are still good boys' choirs out there, and good all-male "mixed" (SATB) choirs, but it isn't quite the same as it must have been, oh, 300 years ago.
There's always military service too,
for the prep athletes who don't get paid to play in college at the next level in their sport. They can qualify for scholastic funds that way, when the athletic careers end after their peak at whatever level they top out at...
Community colleges, generously funded in the latest pandemic relief bill, also often offer college sports and military men and women retain their eligibility to compete after serving, I am told.
And there are always Adult Rec leagues too, offered in most localities, but those are only for the sports that last well into adulthood. Most aren't playing football or contact sports much past the early 20s. For good reason.
Those pickup weekly mens b-ball leagues can get crippling, and most guys only play for a few years before getting hurt and bowing out, or finding competing family interests for their time.
Still, options exist to keep playing, if you pick a lifelong type sport and can field a team. Pickleball has really grown in popularity amongst the middle-aged in many areas. It's not high-school boys b=ball level competition, but it can get you up moving YOUR body and at your age, that's kinda the whole point...
Yes You Can.
Just Do It.
If You Market It, They Will Come...
Pro women basketball players wouldn't be pro-women basketball players had they not had HS experience. Allowing boys to play at that level would simply discourage them, as they wouldn't have experience. There's a scarcity involved. There are only so many roster spots even at the HS level.
Joe Smith,
Re: the Japanese picking up trash after baseball games, &c: They had better be careful. "Picking up after yourself" is probably one of those !!!!White Supremacist!!!! behaviors that ought to be un-taught, like reasoning from premises, or showing up on time, or not hitting the teacher in the head. As the Japanese are now officially "White-adjacent," any hints of such vile behavior will be punished as seriously as the vile behavior of that little white girl in the corner, quietly reading a book.
I think that not too many high school boys who realize that female athletes have more opportunities to play their sport -- any sport -- at the next level if they are good does not make most athletically competent young men to decide they will "cut off their balls", present as female, and take female hormones to win a championship.
I think most trans-girls in high school want to wear makeup and nails and pretty fashions and identify as feminine females. Not to play with the athletic girls and sweat alongside them.
Again, if the child gets hormones pre-puberty and does not develop a male body, the issue is moot. NOt saying as a society we should tolerate these types of medical procedures, no matter what the child allegedly "chooses". Too bad my opinions were deleted and then misconstrued. the moderator helped you beat up on a strawman today, feel big?
Joe Smith re Japan urges: I would make it a priority as it is a fantastic place...especially if you don't mind getting out of your comfort zone...
I've been there several time, just not lately. I fell in love with Japan and felt extraordinarily comfortable there. :-)
Ron Jeremy would like a word
Bad form, Joe Smith, bad form.
You'll receive a bill for my ruined keyboard shortly.
They are a gracious people.
You don't see that here in America much anymore.
Too much namecalling and the need to be dominant.
Americans need to myob more like the Japanese.
Grace brings peace.
Hatred makes you age, and uglier.
#NeverForgetButForgiveThoseWhoHaveTrespassedAgainstYou
"...but the idea wasn't to make them sing higher; it was to catch them before their voices broke, so that they could stay sopranos as adults."
Sorry if my writing was vague, this is what I was trying to convey.
The point of it was the idea of maiming someone pre-puberty to maintain a desired trait.
In one case continuing to sing in a higher range, in another, diminishing athletic ability...
"Picking up after yourself" is probably one of those !!!!White Supremacist!!!! behaviors that ought to be un-taught, like reasoning from premises, or showing up on time, or not hitting the teacher in the head.
------------
You forgot the big two lessons going unlearned:
Carrying your own Weight.
WOrking to support your own family, without government subsidies.
(Market regulation will help more with the latter, as more and more jobs will pay living wages once we stop subsidizing the stock market shareholders and the corporations in this country. Workers/labor will be valued again.)
Remember when childhood was quite carefree? Imagine having to decide what gender you want to be? We have become a very sick society.
[The] age at which voices break has been getting lower for a long time, due mostly to improved diet I think.
There you go! No need to cut their 'nads off. Too messy. Just starve 'em half to death.
"I've been there several time, just not lately. I fell in love with Japan and felt extraordinarily comfortable there. :-)"
I'm glad you had the opportunity...it is a wonderful place. It is a second home to us...I wish we'd been able to stay a lot longer than we did.
Just to echo Bruce Hayden.
Physical fitness leads to a better longer life. Trans sports discourages females from participating in sports.
While I understand why Noem is having a hard time with the SD bill because of the NCAA she could have made it apply only to HS.
Do they still have mandatory gym class in Elementary and High Schools?
Thanks, Greg. So she's a lying liar, which I have to admit is how she came across in the Tucker Carlson interview. I give her some credit for doing that interview, although it sounds like it was a poorly construed attempt at damage control rather than actually trying to clarify her position. Too bad. She should have maintained the facade of a principled warrior for a bit longer and she'd have fooled enough people to maybe make it big-time.
My guess would be that women's sports is a net loss and men's is a net profit. In other words, more is lost ("spent") on the women. How is that unfair to them? They are being subsidized by the profitable men's sports. They are correct that it's not fair. Not fair to the men, but the men never complained about that.
No need to cut their 'nads off. Too messy.
Castration, augmentation, too. Care of progressive religions. Science takes a knee to social progress.
Just starve 'em half to death.
Yeah, fat is beautiful is a comorbidity, which, apart from the Planned Parent/hood venue and rites, social contagion driving herd stampedes, and intuitive science progressing statistical vulnerability, is the single reason for progressive conditions in our society unlike any other. The irony of gluttonous and malnourished.
I'll cut Noem some slack until I understand the issue better. Seems to me that the issue was that the law as written would invite a legal free-for-all that parents would be ill equipped to fight on an individual basis. You may win, but we all know the problem is affording the fight in both time and money.
Noem has shown uncommon courage in the last year, and I doubt that fear is something she gives into easily. She may be rightfully concerned for the cost to her constituents for supporting a bad bill just to look right in the eyes of people who don't understand what they are jumping into. As I said, I don't fully understand the bill, but cowardice does not seem part of her makeup. Asking the bill to be adjusted is not caving in. We'll see. It will take more than a weak interview and a poor explanation to get me to abandon the only governor in the nation with a set of balls.
And their golden age wasn't in "medieval" times, but in the 18th century, where a top male singer w/o balls out-earned his lady soprano colleagues, and certainly any man singing in a normal "male" register.
Barry Gibb kept his balls (Five kids and married 28 years) and does a pretty good falsetto.
Michael K,
But we aren't talking falsetto; we're talking full voice, only in an unnatural range. There are a couple of recordings of the last living castrato (Alessandro Moreschi, I think), that sound like shit, both b/c the sound is unbelievably primitive ( 1902-3?) and b/c the guy himself was in his late 60s at the time. Still, you can tell that it's not like a falsettist or a countertenor. It's a natural voice, just pitched much higher than it would be for an "uncut" male.
Kay @ 3:22pm,
" I don’t have the answers"
The answer is easy, obvious, and unacceptable: this is not a "problem" that can be "solved"; not a "question" that has an "answer".
daskol said...
Thanks, Greg. So she's a lying liar, which I have to admit is how she came across in the Tucker Carlson interview.
And now she's apparently whining that it's "cancel culture" for people to go after her for her failure to lead.
I do wonder how stupid one has to be to "think" that "voting against politicians who take positions you don't like" is wrong.
How stupid you have to be to fail to understand that we're supposed to treat private citizens differently than we treat politicians.
But I say pulling that kind of desperation move, rather than, oh, trying to make a reasoned argument for her position, makes it pretty clear that she doesn't believe she has a reasoned argument for her position.
For her to maintain the facade of a principled warrior for a bit longer would have required her to sign the bill. And then she would have had to fight left-wing "culture warriors", and their CEO supporters.
And she just wasn't willing to do that.
Then there's her "I got legal advice that I'd lose."
For who?
She doesn't say.
Why?
Well, because her "advisors" are the kind of people actual Republicans don't trust, and it would make her look bad to name them.
bagoh20 said...
I'll cut Noem some slack until I understand the issue better. Seems to me that the issue was that the law as written would invite a legal free-for-all that parents would be ill equipped to fight on an individual basis. You may win, but we all know the problem is affording the fight in both time and money.
No
Making a private cause of action for the parents and athletes means that, if they want to, they can go after the ones harming them. No one is worse off for having that given to them.
The people who would be worse off would be our enemies, the ones trying to destroy women's sports by letting the men in.
What happened was that Noem was told that left wing CEOs would be unhappy with her if she signed the law, so she nuked it.
Yay, she did a great job on Covid.
But when it's a fight between we the People, and them the rich leftist a$$holes, she's with the rich leftist a$$holes.
Scott Walker's 2016 Presidential campaign imploded because he wasn't willing to oppose the rich a$$holes who want more illegal immigration, so they can pay their workers less. This left him completely out of sync with the voters, he got nowhere, and pull out early.
Noem is doing the same thing. just worse. Because she announced she was going to fight for us on this one, then caved.
You can't cave on a big fight, then tell us you'll fight for us. We're not that dumb
Making Castrati of young boys may have been the priesthood's way of keeping them boys forever. They like boys. A lot.
mockturtle, if you can't see any difference between the priesthood of 300 years ago and the priesthood of today, you're . . . um, nuts. The 20th-21st c. priesthood has had to deal with a whole lot of stuff, of which the "gaying" of the clergy is only part.
And anyway, if you think someone like Farinelli was a "boy forever," you're dreaming. Castrati didn't have "boys'" voices, but adult voices in soprano range, with the power consistent with their lung volume and such. And Farinelli had far more power than almost any priest in Vienna.
MDT: Ever read Rabelais?
Coming soon: Too many dix, not enough chix
mockturtle, I have not read Rabelais. Though I do know about Rosenmueller, a church musician (not a priest) who got into serious trouble for, erm, diddling the choirboys. (Who, as I said, were a lot older then than now, but what evs.)
But my point is the same. The problem of priests and boys (NB almost never girls!) has gotten much, much worse in the last 50 years or so. It is true that boys (and not girls) serve at Mass, but priests have "access," if you like, to both sexes, through confession and schools. If they weren't predisposed to males, why the huge difference in assault rates?
Well, yes, they are predisposed to males and young males in particular. But I don't think that's new. What's new is that people are reporting it.
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