१८ नोव्हेंबर, २०२०
"When I step outside, I step into a country of men who stare. I could be making the short walk from my car to the bookstore..."
"... or walking through the aisles at the supermarket. I could be wrapped in a shawl or behind two layers of face mask. But I will be followed by searing eyes, X-raying me. Because here, it is culturally acceptable for men to gape at women unblinkingly, as if we are all in a staring contest that nobody told half the population about, a contest hinged on a subtle form of psychological violence."
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१०८ टिप्पण्या:
Damn that Trump and Mar-A-Lago... wait a minute.
Oh, sorry.
Staring is violence
Wow, how in the world did the NYT allow a story to be printed that does not specifically point out how America is the worst place EVER? I guess the [maybe] President-Elect Biden has already changed EVERYTHING for the better, including America?
Young women (in the US) deliberately dress and behave in ways designed to attract attention from men. The problem arises when the "wrong men" pay attention. C'mon you ugly fatties, you know who you are; avert your eyes.
women really lap this crap up don't they? Oh look at me, look at me, damnit stop staring at me!
And the plainest women complain the loudest.
Not one mention of Islam in the article.
Hey, make us women Army women Generals. Follow us into combat. But just don't stare at us, we'll cry.
How many "He stared at me from behind his mask, and made me cry" articles is this in the New York Press? I think this is the 3rd article Althouse has blogged.
"When I step outside"
Well, there's her first mistake.
Didn't men stare at goats in Pakistan?
Khans country is also part of the great reset.
I don't think this is an "Islam" problem. Pakistan/Afghanistan seem to be unusually, maybe uniquely, misogynistic cultures. I would happily nominate Pakistan's North-west Frontier Province as the Anus of the World, largely because of this.
Khan is a tool of the boys of aapbara* and the army (the headquarters of the isi)
SGT Ted said...
Not one mention of Islam in the article.
11/18/20, 8:20 AM
Not relevant as anywhere you have "masculine" men and the patriarchy (can't leave that out), you have the willful subjugation and abuse of women that is not only condoned but also supported by the entire society, absolutely EVERYWHERE!
Well except for places that are majority Christian or majority Hindu or majority Jewish or majority agnostic, or, oh hell, everywhere but majority Islamic but that is just a freak coincidence and has nothing to do with the underlying issue. Oh and "hater!", women WANT to wear sacks everywhere, it protects them from men, except when it does not. On the bright side, it covers the bruises they get from their fathers, brothers, and husbands.
It takes a certain type of woman for me to stare at her: stunningly attractive or unbelievably ugly. The former is why I wear sunglasses on my beach walks and the latter reminds me of how fast I can look away when some fat, old biddy in a dress spreads her legs before standing up.
When I step outside I’m in a tyrannical state ruled by a governor drink in temporary power. We can’t keep a steady electricity supply going but we can beat the virus by driving with masks on and staying the magical distance of six feet from others. These rules are waived if you are carrying either a Mexican flag, a Molotov cocktail or a shield made from virgin petrochemicals, which our state says cause cancer (Prop 65 warning!) and which are actually illegal when used as a fuel but allowed when used as anarchists tools. Thank God it’s been in the high 80s lately, making to outdoor-only Thanksgiving parties with many rules that take seven times the paper to print than the US Constitution.
Let me guess: the NYT is beating the drum for war against Pakistan.
I live in a world where people avoid eye contact and move to the other side of the street when I walk outside.
I'm the owner of a pitbull.
Violence? What nonsense.
I need an editor.
If your tits are hanging out, Imma gonna stare. That's just the way it is.
But I thought all cultures were equally virtuous...
"Let me guess: the NYT is beating the drum for war against Pakistan."
Yup, now they we're (sorta) getting out, let's have a look at the real problem in the area.
They've been doing this, beating the drum, as long as I can remember. Quemoy and Matsu anyone? I did a Current Events report on that one when I was 8.
Psychological violence. Gimme a break.
2070
Let' get Grandpa to tell us about when he fought the Great Staring War on the Pak border...
Yes, but wait until the day her cycle asks "where's my fish?"
“I don't think this is an "Islam" problem. Pakistan/Afghanistan seem to be unusually, maybe uniquely, misogynistic cultures. I would happily nominate Pakistan's North-west Frontier Province as the Anus of the World, largely because of this.”
Sure, they may be worse, because more civilized religions have had a mellowing effect over time in regards to Muslims who live near them. But it is a religion that lends itself to gross misogyny, and abuse of women, because their founder, there Prophet was a horrible misogynist. The teachings of Christianity, Buddhism, etc can easily be interpreted to condemn misogyny and abuse. Islam condones it.
Because here, it is culturally acceptable for men to gape at women unblinkingly ...
Wait! I thought multiculturalism meant that we were supposed to respect all cultures?
Modern female rights was spawned by the pagan barbarian Celtic, Germanic, and Viking tribes. That's why White Privilege still dominates die Welt. The monotheistic desert madman religions are askeered of strong women.
The Crack Emcee said...
I live in a world where people avoid eye contact and move to the other side of the street when I walk outside.
I'm the owner of a pitbull.
I'd scrutch him Crack. But then, my last words will probably be, "What a fuzzy bear you are!"
Stare back.
I will be followed by searing eyes, X-raying me
Ah...don't worry about it honey. One day you will be older...maybe even 40 years old OMG!!. Things will begin to sag, crease, wrinkle and droop. All the nasty meanness you treasure in your soul will be reflected in your bitter sour wrinkling visage.
No one will be looking at you anymore with their horrible searing eyes. You will be just another invisible old lady.
There. Feel better now sweet cheeks?
Crack reports: I'm the owner of a pitbull.
Why am I not surprised?
Gee, that Islam stuff really comes up a lot.
Do you think her treatment could have anything to do with Surah 4:34?
Nah.
"Men are the caretakers of women, as men have been provisioned by Allah over women and tasked with supporting them financially. And righteous women are devoutly obedient and, when alone, protective of what Allah has entrusted them with.1 And if you sense ill-conduct from your women, advise them ˹first˺, ˹if they persist,˺ do not share their beds, ˹but if they still persist,˺ then discipline them ˹gently˺.2 But if they change their ways, do not be unjust to them. Surely Allah is Most High, All-Great."
In boot camp we were taught not to "eye fuck". In grade school the girls told us to "take a picture" if we stared too long at them because "it lasts longer"
when I step outside in my blue town wearing a MAGA hat...
Despite the fact that they use it constantly for sexual advantage, I don't think women understand just how powerful the visual is for men. It's really more exciting than the actual sex or the closeness, and that's by design. Most plants and animals have an existential dependence on one sex or the other being attracted by visual cues. Stop acting like it some sickness. Controlling it may serve an important purpose, but it's unnatural to do so.
So Pakistan is just like Manhattan?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b1XGPvbWn0A (10 Hours of Walking in NYC as a Woman)
Isn't this the same as shaming women for dressing so men are attracted visually? Whats the difference? At least men don't make a political statement that staring is their right and not liking it is misandry, which is the response I get when I suggest that maybe you shouldn't dress so that I can see the goosebumps on your ass.
I guess it's another of the endless examples of it's automatically right if women do it.
mockturtle said...
"Crack reports: I'm the owner of a pitbull.
Why am I not surprised?"
My dog's name is William F Buckley.
Levi Starks said...
Stare back.
Men in Pakistan/Afghanistan are in general animals. Most women are beaten daily there.
There is a lot of snarky bullshit talking here from a bunch of coddled people who have no idea what the world is like outside this country.
Annie C. said...
"I'd scrutch him Crack. But then, my last words will probably be, "What a fuzzy bear you are!""
He's great: doesn't bark, doesn't bite. Just wants me to stare at him constantly.
bagoh20 said...
Isn't this the same as shaming women for dressing so men are attracted visually? Whats the difference? At least men don't make a political statement that staring is their right and not liking it is misandry, which is the response I get when I suggest that maybe you shouldn't dress so that I can see the goosebumps on your ass.
I guess it's another of the endless examples of it's automatically right if women do it.
Women dress this way to get attention from males.
They don't want the ugly/poor ones. These complaints are used to screen out as many undesirables as possible.
All people attempt to use the tools given them to get the best genes for their offspring.
This is just bargaining Tina Fey style.
When my wife turned a certain age, she was shocked and hurt that men began looking through her as if she were invisible. She became what felt like a non-person because she was no longer of sexual interest.
What felt like harassment in its former context became a signal of validation for how she presented herself to the world. She still misses it.
Not my country
Not my gender
Not my problem
women: "Take a picture-- it lasts longer!"
Hefner: "Great idea! And we'll pay you handsomely!!"
women: "Hmmm! OK!"
...later...
women: "You're a pig and you objectify and degrade us!! Where's my check??"
...... "Why did I do it? I did it for me-- it was empowering"
A lot of people seem to think this is a story written by an American woman in the United States.
Maybe she should add some warts to her face so she can pretend she's deformed and get more sympathy points. (See next item from Ann.)
Religion of Peace®
Bago is right. It takes a strong will and conscious effort not to stare at shapely women in public. I would assume that that would be a little bit easier if they were bags over their bodies like they do in the middle East. Maybe showing less is actually more titillating and it is part of the reason why they can't help themselves from open mouth gaping.
DustBunnyQueen @9:14am FTW!
In boot camp we were taught not to "eye fuck".
One-eyed grunts are less efficient...
Pakistan: Shit-hole country or not? Discuss.
Freeman Hunt said...
A lot of people seem to think this is a story written by an American woman in the United States.
I noticed this too.
Attention spans have been shortened recently.
People stare in India, too. Must definitely be a cultural thing.
Its only been this way since general zia and his islamic crusade in the 80s
A guy that worked for me had been deployed to SA during Bush the Elder's crusade (ANG, base security); the Saudis always wanted to buy the US servicewomen--assuming in their way that such women were prostitutes, brought in for the comfort of the infidel soldiers.
Another friend with experience in SA described how the local guys would line the fence around the Westerners' gold course and beat off to the sight of female knees, a quarter mile away.
Not my country, not my gender, SO not my religion, not my problem.
Narr
Coddled but rational
It’s a regional problem...
Q: What does the average Iranian husband do when his wife withholds her nightly affections?
A: Ghotzbadeh
I have been assured it's much worse in predominantly white countries.
Iman said...
Q: What does the average Iranian husband do when his wife withholds her nightly affections?
A: Ghotzbadeh
11/18/20, 10:41 AM
Color me shocked! I did not even know Iranian wives had that "option"...
DBQ @ 9:14: Well played, girl! ;-)
Sounds like Pakistani men are assholes.
I did an image search...not sure if I found her.
She's good-looking but not 'stare at' or 'stalker' material.
Maybe in Pakistan she's a 10...
The Crack Emcee said:
I live in a world where people avoid eye contact and move to the other side of the street when I walk outside.
I'm the owner of a pitbull.}}}}
I move to the other side of the street when I'm walking my dog and a pitbull/owner are also out walking. I love dogs and understand that not all pitbulls have a behavior problem. Unfortunately, the two pitbulls I usually see in my neighborhood are absolute terrors. They fight with their owners to get to my dog and tear him apart. I know one of the owners well and they are great, gentle people who have been trying to train their pittie out of this behavior for years.
I think there's something missing from the article I read. I couldn't find the part where it explains how it's Trump's fault.
In 30 years she'll write an article complaining about how she is invisible to men, now that she's old.
RigelDog said...
"I know one of the owners well and they are great, gentle people who have been trying to train their pittie out of this behavior for years."
The only thing gets my dog excited is cats. He won't play ball, won't growl or bark or snap, and thinks birds are weird. Other dogs are fine as long as they don't show me attention. He thinks I'm there to carry his train and doesn't want me distracted.
"Young women (in the US) deliberately dress and behave in ways designed to attract attention from men."
I was at the supermarket yesterday. A 20-ish woman was there and we passed each other in the aisle many times.
Couldn't see her face obviously, but she was in SHAPE...as in fitness model, olympic athlete kind of shape.
Kind of tough not to look, especially when she was walking away.
But she was wearing a tiny half-top thingy and the tightest yoga pants I've ever seen.
I know as much about her as her OBGYN.
She knew what she was doing...
Men and women come at procreation from two different perspectives. We would all do better if we acknowledged this and discussed it.
Women become pregnant and require support and have a direct personal survival interest as well as a deep attachment to the child. THey become the advocate for the child which will require at least 12-15 years of support before it can survive on it's own.
Men deposit sperm and have a different interest in the outcome. They can obviously take more risks. In almost all cases the dominant male or males in the group deposited sperm in more than one female.
Men tend to aim for highest overall survival rates.
Women take it more personally and individually.
This is just playing out in modern times. Child support looks different when you boil it down to competing interests.
Can't read the article so I don't know how the author defines her treatment in Pakistan.
But--of course women are treated like crap in Pakistan. It's one of the most backward countries in the world; a true shit-hole where misogyny is baked into every aspect of life, society, religion, and government.
And yes, it's wrong to stare at women the way that they do. It's not a compliment. It's being closely surveilled wherever you go by the gaze of hungry tigers.
MayBee said...
People stare in India, too. Must definitely be a cultural thing.
This is hardwired in all our brains.
It takes conscious thought to avoid an instinct that is drilled into our genes by the desire to pass on.
Pakistan also has the highest rate of honor killing in the world. I question why someone writes about being stared at as "the worst" experience when women are beaten and/or murdered for offending their family's honor by dressing improperly or dating the wrong person or disobeying their fathers or husbands. Here's a clue -- See: Afzal Kohistani: 'Honour killing' whistleblower shot dead
Joe Smith said...
She knew what she was doing...
And men know what they are doing.
The issue with this female that most men will have is they all know she is out of their league. She can do better than them and they all know it. And we all have that ranking mechanism constantly running in our animal brains. And she will tell most men she is out of their league. Women sort and select while men broadcast.
In the US she will use claims of sexual harassment to sort out lesser specimens. In Pakistan males will stare at her until she stops reminding them she is out of their league.
We all need to deal with this in a better way.
RigelDog reports: Unfortunately, the two pitbulls I usually see in my neighborhood are absolute terrors.
Same here. There are two pairs of pit bulls in my immediate vicinity and all are horrible. The woman who owns one pair can barely control them on their leashes. I not only cross the street with my dog but always carry a canister of bear spray. The other two I never see in the street but are contained [I hope!] behind their gate. They not only growl menacingly but fight each other. No, they're not playing. IMO, people should not adopt pit bulls. Pit bulls and pit mixes account for most of the dogs in our Humane Society' shelter and well-meaning people, especially single women, seem to feel sympathetic toward them but these dogs should probably all be put down rather than adopted out. I know of too many cases of children being maimed or killed by their 'family pet' pit bull.
"A: Ghotzbadeh”
Johnny Carson fan here, I see.
Those of you who were just pwned by Achilles. Stop and think how wrong you must be for that to happen. And yet it did.
"And men know what they are doing."
If she's showing it off, most heterosexual men are going to look.
Fair is fair : )
I walk my dachshund (Best Dog In The World) around the neighborhood frequently, and 95% of the people and dogs we encounter are OK.
Some days we go past a house full of Hispanics who keep a pit in the back yard. The sucker goes nuts when we walk by across the street, and tries to leap the 6-foot wooden fence.
His snout clears the fence by inches; if some moron leaves something along the fence inside that he can use to get over it, there will be blood.
Narr
And maybe a visit from La Migra
bagoh20 said...
I don't think women understand just how powerful the visual is for men
oh! here's my chance; to repeat myself!!
Men's thoughts are visual; they think in images
Women's thoughts are verbal; they think in words
This is why
Men Lie
and Women use makeup
GolF course, not golD course.
Narr
Of course of course
My usual unrelated anecdote:
Early morning entering Supermarket a young braless women jiggles past me. Without thinking, I exclaim Thank You!. Without hesitation, she turns and says, You're welcome.
Went back to same store at same time every day for a week, no luck.
She was probably there to buy cigarettes. Smokers will leave house pre shower and without make up if they don't have their morning cigarette.
Years ago when I was backpacking through Asia with a couple of other guys, Western women travelers would ask to join us while we went through Pakistan and Afghanistan, as they had been advised that they were the two worst countries for single women walking brazenly undressed in jeans and bulky sweaters.
Once we hit India they went on their way.
(In retrospect Kandahar was undoubtedly and by far the WORST shithole I encountered during my travels, and I've been in a lot of countries.)
11/18/20, 11:47 AM
Blogger tim in vermont said...
"A: Ghotzbadeh”
Johnny Carson fan here, I see.
Heh... actually, it was Al Franken on SNL doing his best Carnac the Magnificent impression.
One of the few jokes Franken ever told that I found funny.
Joe Smith said...
"And men know what they are doing."
If she's showing it off, most heterosexual men are going to look.
Fair is fair : )
I agree. Men designed yoga pants after all. Women appreciate the looking.
But differentiate that from the way men in Pakistan treat women. Their stares offer promise of violence and it is delivered every night to most women of child bearing age.
This is all part of a broader cultural issue. Women and men need to find common ground in the staring and agree to the parts that make us all happy.
@wholelottasplainin'
When traveling in Morocco in the early '80s, there were a lot of 'Missing' posters in the hostels of western (mostly blonde Swedes) women who had disappeared without a trace.
Even as a strapping young man back then I knew enough to find a travel companion before visiting.
Morocco seems to be more civilized now (fancy hotels, etc.) but it was a dangerous place back then...
Couldn't see her face obviously, but she was in SHAPE...as in fitness model, olympic athlete kind of shape.
Kind of tough not to look, especially when she was walking away.
You hate to see her go, but you love to see her walk away...
Men and women are equal in rights and complementary in Nature.
That said, individual dignity, intrinsic value, inordinate worth. #MissingLinks
Pakistan is certainly a shithole, and Islam is part of the problem. But the FBI says that 127,945 rapes were reported in the US in 2018. Call it 350 a day. Reported. So, while we're chatting away, women are having dicks shoved into them by men they want nothing to do with. I can sympathize with women who think our society is insufficiently upset about that.
I note that the Times didn't have balls enough to allow comments on this story.
Hungary is much better. There the women get upset if you don't look at them.
But the FBI says that 127,945 rapes were reported in the US in 2018.
How many was Kavanaugh responsible for?
So, while we're chatting away, women are having dicks shoved into them by men they want nothing to do with.
Not only dicks:
"In 2012, the FBI issued a revised definition of rape as "penetration, no matter how slight, of the vagina or anus with any body part or object, or oral penetration by a sex organ of another ... "
https://theconversation.com/whats-the-difference-between-sexual-abuse-sexual-assault-sexual-harassment-and-rape-88218
Jupiter said...
Pakistan is certainly a shithole, and Islam is part of the problem. But the FBI says that 127,945 rapes were reported in the US in 2018. Call it 350 a day. Reported. So, while we're chatting away, women are having dicks shoved into them by men they want nothing to do with. I can sympathize with women who think our society is insufficiently upset about that.
************
Careful......that number includes sexual assault, which is not rape-rape, as Whoopi might put it.
Here's a site that puts forcible rape at about 99,000 incidents a year. Their definition is also broad, as it includes both sexes.
You will notice that the rate has decreased since the early 90's, with an uptick beginning in 2014 during the Lightbringer Era, but still substantially lower than 30 years ago.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/191226/reported-forcible-rape-rate-in-the-us-since-1990/
"Insufficiently upset" sounds like a great way to live.
But, I'm a guy, so . . .
Narr
YMMV
"I can sympathize with women who think our society is insufficiently upset about that."
Which is why I believe every woman should own a gun and know how to use it.
Joe Smith said...
"I can sympathize with women who think our society is insufficiently upset about that."
Which is why I believe every woman should own a gun and know how to use it.
Most rapes are committed by someone the rapist knows.
In a lot of those situations a gun is inappropriate and out of reach until it is needed. In a purse or car or some such. It is rarely a stalker jumping out of the bushes. Almost always in a social gathering with other people present(downstairs.) They are socially awkward with a lot of miscommunication involved.
A nice key ring knife or belt/pocket knife will actually be the weapon I teach my daughters how to use for this kind of defense in most of these situations.
Knives have better lethality statistics compared to pistols.
Had a friend who prosecuted sex crimes bureau in Kings County NY. Had horrific stories, EVERY age group.
Had the impression they lacked resources to take basic he said she said cases to trial because there were so many monsters to take off the streets.
But that was long before me too.
I am sure Biden via AOC will make it a right to not be stared at. But really this wall-flower can surely wear aburqa and foil the stare-hungry guys
Knives have better lethality statistics compared to pistols.
Never leave home without a scalpel. A baby, a rapist... rape-rapist, a burden. Wouldn't it be ironic?
I've been credited often by my wife with not staring at beautiful women. She also thinks, after 30 years of marriage, that I lift and lower the toilet seat with every use. Of such harmless but mistaken beliefs is a happy marriage maintained. I don't insult her by staring at women, in her presence, and I am careful not to leave the toilet seat wet. For my part, she tells me I'm still handsome. God, what a woman I found!
So multiculturalism ain't all its cracked up to be.
mockturtle said...
"IMO, people should not adopt pit bulls."
That's insane: they're the most intelligent dog breed of all.
You don't punish an animal because their owners are psychos.
In Yurp, people stand too close. I can be on a corner, minding my own business, taking in the view, and then someone will come and stand next to me, trying to see what I'm looking at.
It was crazy making.
"Not only dicks:
"In 2012, the FBI issued a revised definition of rape as "penetration, no matter how slight, of the vagina or anus with any body part or object, or oral penetration by a sex organ of another ... "
https://theconversation.com/whats-the-difference-between-sexual-abuse-sexual-assault-sexual-harassment-and-rape-88218"
You pay more for that.
In the immortal words of the late, great Mike Royko. " Nobody ever raped a .38."
Achilles information notwithstanding.
Blogger The Crack Emcee said...
"In Yurp, people stand too close. I can be on a corner, minding my own business, taking in the view, and then someone will come and stand next to me, trying to see what I'm looking at.
It was crazy making."
Yup. It's one of those weird, herd instinct things that must be hard wired into us. It's a similar thing to when you choose a parking space all way away from all other cars, just to have some bonehead come and park right next to you. Makes me crazy.
I'm reminded of the saying, "Even a cat can look at a king."
A silly saying, of course, as more than a few people may, depending on context, take direct eye contact as a personal challenge.
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