"Three weeks on, the singing has stopped and social unrest is mounting as a significant part of the population, especially in the poorer south, realise that everything is not all right. 'They are no longer singing or dancing on the balconies,' said Salvatore Melluso, a priest at Caritas Diocesana di Napoli, a church-run charity in Naples. 'Now people are more afraid – not so much of the virus, but of poverty. Many are out of work and hungry. There are now long queues at food banks.'"
The Guardian reports.
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२४२ टिप्पण्या:
242 पैकी 1 – 200 नवीन› नवीनतम»That's Italy- couldn't happen here.
Of course, much of European culture is to food shop every few days, or even every day. So people may not have ten years worth of toilet paper stocked up or even ten days worth of food.
If grocery stores are not restocked as quickly as they need to be -- for whatever reason -- it CAN happen here. At least for some people, some families -- those that have not planned ahead and have a full cupboard of food.
Mark, that method of grocery shopping is standard in any large city where the people live in apartments, like Manhattan or large parts of Chicago.
I was being sarcastic in the first comment.
AH reporters at the press conference still think that the number one priority is to make Trump look bad.
If we embarrass Trump, it will save lives. That's the best medicine. If someone gets it, if they are really struggling, they just need to curse Trump, and then they will start to recover.
When the Italians start singing this from their balconies you'll know there's a problem.
And a big Mille Grazie to Germany for all the help.
I would never live in a large city.
But despite my best efforts, they are bringing the large dense city to me.
TO repeat.
I'd rather take a 0.6% chance of Fluhan death than a 100% chance of poverty.
Think about it dimwits.
Too many white people. h/t The Guardian
They should just listen to the experts and enjoy their staycations, amirite?
“ I was being sarcastic in the first comment.”
I don’t think you can blame him for misreading you. It's what you say about the deaths in Italy.
If the Mayor of Florence decided to once again endorse a "hug a Chinese person day" he'd probably be dragged through Florence by his neck.
In the US as a whole, Ken, the deaths like Italy won't happen. We will turn out more like Germany. But we are perfectly capable of destroying the economy enough to have social unrest.
[Two or three] " people across the country sang and played music from their balconies"
That was fake news; look up the videos the article didn't link to.
I guess Amazon doesn't do home deliveries in Italy.
Yancey
We are. And I agree if governors go crazy and impose 6 months at home despite the ability to test, we will. But the lockdowns won’t continue till that point. And the outbreak itself represents a serious threat to civil order. I doubt you have any greater faith in LA or Chicago or Baltimore than I do should things get very bad. Or Toronto tbh.
Nancy Pelosi in San Fran’s Chinatown Feb. 24: “We do want to say to people, come to Chinatown, here we are … come join us”
good times, good times
Drago
She's a menace, I agree.
When you shut down the economy and people can't work, obviously bad things will be the result.
I think that Virginia has already gone too far extending it to June. It’s one thing to try to slow the pandemic in its tracks so that we can better get a handle on it, it’s another thing to embark on the fool’s errand of trying to stop it completely. It can’t be done. I thought that Trump was looking at risk on a county level to lift restrictions slowly. I think that makes the most sense. And if you need to move to a different area, then quarantine yourself for two weeks, and if that’s too much, then the trip isn’t that important during a pandemic.
"e'd probably be dragged through Florence by his neck.”
The traditional treatment is to hang him from a lamp post.
Balcony singing in Italy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H3v9unphfi0
Allegrei
note the soprano at 1:35
I guess Amazon doesn't do home deliveries in Italy.
The socialists are toying with disaster and famine, just like they always do. Don't worry, it'll be different this time.
US farmland acreage is about the same as it was in about 1920 (it's been decreasing recently), but the number of people living on farms is down to < 2% of the population.
In other news, Maryland has re-opened the churches, backing down from yesterday's "closed by order of the government" directive.
They are not fully open -- they are still subject to the usual ten-person, six-foot rule that applies elsewhere, but they are now expressly authorized to operate in a limited capacity.
Somebody pointed out on Twitter that when the governor of VA extended it to June 10th, it was pretty funny that the primary was on June 9th.
< 2% of the population
I'm sure they'll be glad to share when nobody can pay them.
What we are doing, Ken, is the equivalent of chopping off someone's leg because of gangrene in one toe. The governors have already gone crazy- which one of them is going to lift a lockdown without new cases reaching zero in their state?
Someone this morning pointed out something interesting that I hadn't noticed- there has been zero public opinion polling done of the citizens regarding the states' various reactions to what their governors have done. Either the polling hasn't been done (the most likely explanation), or the results aren't liked by the media.
We have until about mid April before the grocery stores are emptied out. Toilet paper and hand sanitizer were the canaries. As stocks fail to be replenished, the stores will start trying to institute 1 per customer rules, but we already know what this precipitates because we see it during every hurricane disaster- the difference is going to be that there are no unaffected areas from which supplies are brought in to relieve the need. This was always going to be the problem with shuttering 50% of the economy- you can only do it for about a month- after that, you have to open it back up just to prevent social unrest.
The thing is, there is tons of MRE's (Meals Ready To Eat) in nearby Sigonella, and can be deployed in short order.
But can the Italians digest them?
Back when the Iraqi's were running north from Hussein, the US military air-dropped tons of these meals, and saved them from starving.
Allegri song (translation)
Have mercy on me, O God, according to your great mercies' sake.
And great compassion blot out my transgressions.
Wash me from my sin cleanse me.
For I know my transgressions, and my sin is ever before.
You only have I sinned, and you have made to be justified when you regard as wrong.
Here are conceived in iniquity, and in sin did my mother.
See, what you love and hidden insights have shown.
Purge me with hyssop, and wash me whiter than snow.
Let me hear joy and gladness: the bones.
Hide your face from my sins, and blot out all mine.
Create a clean heart, O God, and renew a right spirit within me.
Do not cast me not away from thy presence; and take not thy holy spirit from me.
Give me the joy of thy salvation, and strengthen me.
Teach thy ways, and sinners will return.
Deliver me from blood, O God of my salvation, and my tongue will face.
Lord, open my lips, and my mouth will declare your praise.
For if Thou hadst desired sacrifice, I would have given it: with burnt offerings: I will not be delighted.
A sacrifice to God is an afflicted spirit: a contrite and humble, God will not despise.
Do good, do good to Zion, so that the walls of Jerusalem.
Then there will be sacrifices, offerings and oblations, then on your.
Google translation ends rather abruptly. It's a good balcony song though.
"We have until about mid April before the grocery stores are emptied out. “
Based on what?
I like the Amazon warehouse closings and union strike threats. It's called leverage. It should turn everybody against unions pretty much.
the way the supply chain, is being stretched to breaking, if there are further restrictions and/or sizable part of the truckers or their families are infected, who will deliver the materials, we're on terra incognita here,
Still and all, I think it makes good sense to plant a food garden. A victory garden.
I live in an area where there is no real panic yet, Tim. But the shelves are already about half as full as they were 2 weeks ago- some food items are down to about 10% of what would normally be stocked- eggs, for example. I go again tomorrow morning to get fruit and dairy, I expect it to be worse. It won't be the case that it disappears 5%/day- it will happen suddenly once a threshold is reached- we are getting close to that. There are plent of reports from people who work in stock replenishment, both for the producers and the stores- they are telling us pretty unanimously that restocking deliveries are getting longer delayed and less fulfilled. You have multiple nodes of distribution from which items can be diverted if this gets bad, which it will if we don't change course in a couple weeks.
" It should turn everybody against unions pretty much.”
That’s how Mussolini got elected. He made the trains run on time by busting the unions.
I said on another thread and I think it bears repeating:
81 billion dollars in apartment rent due today; hundreds of thousands, perhaps already into the millions, of retail and restaurant workers laid off. They get a three month grace period before eviction but then all that back rent is due. Maybe between the $1200 worth of weed and being absorbed into Amazon warehouses (lucky order picking hasn't already gone all robot but that is coming) they won't get restive, but all the same, you retirees with paid off houses better start washing the sheets for the guest bed.
It might be time to float the argument that labor law is unconstitutional. X and Y should not be able to gain more rights against Z by joining forces than they already had individually. In particular they can't force Z to negotiate with them.
Terra incognita is my favorite color.
I will give an example: I buy a lot of yogurt- I actually skipped buying it last week because there was so little left in the refrigerated case- I felt too guilty to take the last three Chobani packs. I wonder if I find any at all tomorrow.
There's Henley's famous poem Evictus, about renters fearlessly taking possession of their souls.
Did Dr. Faulci just say that the distance guidelines wouldn't be lifted until there were "no more deaths" from Covid-19 - because we don't have a vacinne?
I thought the entire point of this "social distancing" was to "flatten the curve" and ensure that hospitals were not over-loaded.
Mitigation is not the same as "elimination" (of the disease). He scares me.
I hated those singing on balconies videos. I hated that someone was trying to make me think being locked in at home by your government was somehow life-affirming.
Yeah, I don't think a lot of Europeans have months worth of food in their freezer, if they even have a freezer. In fact, many are horrified that we eat food that has been frozen. ;-)
One other observation from last week's trip to the store- things like dried fruit (raisons, cranberries, dates, blueberries etc) and nuts were also almost gone- I took the last two packs of dried cranberries (I put them and the nuts in the yogurt). I haven't visited the canned sections in about a month, but I will take a look tomorrow just to see what the state is.
As I have written before, we have enough frozen items to eat for year in the two freezers. As long as the power stays on, I won't starve any time soon.
My wife has pointed out that one of the under-reported symptoms of the Coronavirus is that skunk stripe that is spreading across the top of her head.
Rhhardin notes: There's Henley's famous poem Evictus, about renters fearlessly taking possession of their souls.
LOL! :-D
laowhy86 put out I found the source of the coronavirus today.
And the evidence is persuasive. I'd say the odds are now 99% that the virus came from the lab across the street from the seafood market in Wuhan.
Also don't assume journalists are innocent of this knowledge. Within 2 days most of them will have seen this or something similar, and if they write an article like this isn't the case, then they knew what they were doing.
The one good thing about this is that this means it probably wasn't a bioweapon.
Still it was introduced to the human species by what seems to me to be negligent carelessness. And it seems likely that the Chinese government knew about the problem for literally months before the rest of the world did.
It's not unreasonable to wonder if the Chinese Communist Party deliberately spread it around the world once it was accidently introduced into China.
I agree that we can’t keep this up for a lot longer. Maybe the warm weather slows it down, and next fall we are in a different position, but these mindless extended closures are ridiculous. NYC may be an exception, but they are building herd immunity the hard way right now.
Where I part company with a lot of people here is that I don’t think this is much ado about a little flu. These are serious decisions with serious consequences on both sides for us collectively. Maybe 20 year olds can just get it, and figure if they are one of the unlucky few who needs hospitalization, well, move over grandpa, I got dibs on that respirator.
In San Diego we are 13 days in on lock down but at least 3 weeks in on the media generated shopping panic (IMO). When I went to the market yesterday there was no garlic, flour, sugar, bleach, cheese, yogurt, ice cream, or cleaning products. There was a limited selection of canned vegetables and pasta. When I say limited it means a couple cans of hominy, maybe some butter beans, and a few boxes of pasta. G
California extended its lockdown indefinitely.
There are people in our neighborhood that post every violation of social distancing (there was a person sitting inside of a Starbucks!!!!). The world is a scary dangerous place to them and their only hope of survival is if every person meticulously follows all orders.
There are people in our neighborhood that don’t want anybody to get sick and will comply with the order to the best of their ability. It isn’t the focus of their every move. They are staying home and maintaining distance - but a germ is a germ and life is for living. This group threatens the first group.
There is anger between the two groups and we are only two weeks in.
Living in California we are already seeing people become restive on pushing the shelter in place until May. Our friends in silicon valley, who crunch numbers for a living, are wondering out loud how is it Sf Bay area and LA have been spared having bodies clog the streets even though we had massive air traffic to and from China from December until Trump stopped all flights at the end of January. I know the overton window has shifted when my liberal neighbor is talking about how stupid the quarantine is and worried about the new boutique mushroom store he enjoys so much hanging on by its fingernails.
The corrected link: I found the source of the coronavirus
The poverty that should worry us is not immediate starvation. It's the loss of retail and blue collar jobs and businesses that can employ those people whenever we decide to sound the all clear. If we sacrifice the livelihoods of 150 million over 10 years to save the lives of (even) 1 million, that may compound the disaster. I hope that Trump and these State Governors will come to their senses in the next 2 weeks and realize that continuing this massive shutdown of the economy is not justified. The vast majority of those who are high risk of death know who they are. They can stay confined. But the 50 to 60% who are asympomatic and the healthy young who aren't at risk of death or severe consequences have to get to work building their lives. A decade of world Depression should not be the price we vulnerable demand.
When people start talking about the food distribution chain breaking down the breakdown follows. If the truckers quit delivering all the big cities have about three days.
MayBee said...
I hated those singing on balconies videos. I hated that someone was trying to make me think being locked in at home by your government was somehow life-affirming.
Ditto. I'm also getting tired of the toilet paper jokes, photo challenges, "take this quiz" challenges on FB. I guess it somehow cheers up folks but I'm about to "snooze" a few friends as a defense mechanism.
I did get a laugh from the Barefoot Contessa's recipe for a Cosmopolitan cocktail because "It’s always cocktail hour in a crisis!". I don't know how to link, but it's shared all over Twitter and FB.
Here are the items I need to buy tomorrow that I haven't had to buy in the last month:
Cereal- Honey Nut Cheerios and Great Grains Raisin Date Pecan
Oatmeal-Quaker's Raisin and Walnut.
Walnuts and Pecans (will regret not getting them last week is my guess)
Apples- there were plenty last week, but I didn't need them.
The weekly items:
Yogurt- Chobani black cherry
2% Milk
Tomatoes
Ground Coffee.
Bananas
California is a weird case, for sure. Possibly they got infected with a milder strain than what hit New York. There was talk early on that there was an L strain and an S strain, one of them worse than the other. I would have said that mass transit is less important, but San Fransisco has BART. It needs to be examined closely.
I have a month worth of nutrition in the form of rice and dried beans of all kinds as a last resort. I think everybody should have that, even in good times. I figure within a month we are either in Lord of the Flies territory, or the national guard will be handing distribution if there is a major breakdown.
Southern California may just be climate related. I don't what the weather has been like in Northern California- but I was under the impression that a lot of the Northwest US has been colder than normal for most of March.
LA and Silicon Valley is nothing like NY. SF has high density and some people use BART but the the rest of the metro area is spread out and everyone gets around by Car. All of Los Aegeles county is spread out. The State also has, still but not for long, large areas that are rural, small city/town, and not crowded.
Comparison to NYC metro area isn't comparable.
There was a really nasty “flu” that went around San Diego late fall. Man on the street opinion is that this is our second round. But the first round didn’t hit homeless and elderly. It was 30 to 40 year olds mostly - that I talk to
So completely unscientific
It is interesting that in Spain and Italy, the deaths have occurred in areas that have been locked into weather where the temps all the month of March didn't exceed 65 degrees F on more than one or two days total. Even Madrid which is usually quite warm in March was significantly colder than normal the entire month. And you do see the same pattern in the US as a whole.
I live in North Carolina. The state has had 9 deaths, seven of them in elderly people whose death was attributed to the virus, but could easily have been the one or more underlying conditions had. We have around 20 counties that are locked down but have zero identified cases; another 30 or so have cases numbering in the single digits. The most populous county has 444 cases and one death. We have been on a modified lock down since mid March with schools closed, all assemblies of more than 10 prohibited, restaurants allowed take out only, etc, etc. The whole state as of today has 204 people hospitalized. This is out of a population of 10.5 million. We can't flatten the curve because there isn't a curve. Yet, this week we started a 30 day period of total shut down with no one allowed out of their house except for grocery shopping and emergencies. I know all this probably gives Ken B a hard on, but the rest of us are starting to really get pissed off. By the end of the month there is going to be hell to be mass civil disobedience. In a couple of months everyone is going to be looking for the food crops the farmers couldn't plant. If someone wants to check my numbers, here's the NC website updated as of this morning at 11 am: https://www.ncdhhs.gov/
Tim, if you didn't see it in the overnight thread, I do apogolize for the angry retort. I didn't know exactly how personal this issue was for you, and I should have just let it go without a response, and especially the one I made.
Supermarkets run on very slim margins, and stock the shelves on a Just-In-Time basis, according to the normal turnover of goods. All it takes is people buying a little bit more than usual to upset their calculations and empty the shelves. Research in the UK finds that only 3% of buyers are actually hoarding, but that's enough.
“It's not unreasonable to wonder if the Chinese Communist Party deliberately spread it around the world once it was accidently introduced into China.“
In the next faux Tom Clancy novel, the Chinese Premier orders infected agents to travel the world to make sure the west is as crippled as the Chi coms are after the accidental release of the genetic engineered virus. But they infect South Korea, Japan, and Taiwan with a weaker virus as they want to capture their technical workers intact after the west is devastated.
Yet people claim the Trump and the American Right wasn't taking this seriously.
I like how we are keeping only stuff open that certain people need.
Amazon. Government staff gyms. Some parks but not all parks. Supermarkets. Hospitals.
Almost as if retired baby boomers are making all these decisions and we are only shitting down stuff that doesn't inconvenience them.
Fuck Schools. Restaurants. Small businesses. Anything parents need is non-essential it seems.
Closing schools but keeping hospitals business as usual makes absolutely no sense whatsoever unless the people making the decision are just selfish.
Future economic growth can just get flushed down the toilet.
I kinda hope they print off so much money your pensions and retirements and social security are worthless.
It’s alright Yancey, I have been getting a little too on edge. I need to let stuff go. I am working on it. I have been in isolation for 10 days now, 4 more days to go! But the state is locked down anyway, so not sure where I can go besides the grocery store once I am free.
Maybe I will order some chicks for meat chickens and layers and build a coop to take my mind off of things.
I am only in isolation because I came to Vermont to support my daughter. Just to be clear. Rule is 14 days.
So far I have not had much problem with groceries where I live just north of Atlanta. Went to a nearby Ingle’s this morning, where very few people shop (it was going to close later this year for the property to be converted to a car dealership). Everything I needed was available. The only things that seemed to be short were some things they had on sale and things that kids tend to want to eat - frozen pizza, hot dogs - since they are all home from school. Fresh produce, bread, can goods, meats, dairy, frozen foods - all pretty much stocked. Then went by a Publix on the way back home - which was much busier - but the same.
With all the unemployment it would seem that union dues are going to be hit very hard, no more cash for the bosses to give to dems. Or were the unions given millions in the bailout bill.
For legitimate reasons I was driving in my mid-sized city the other night, after 8pm. Nothing unusual happened, but the entire atmosphere was just spooky. And this will be continuing until . . .
"For legitimate reasons I was driving in my mid-sized city the other night, after 8pm"
No HSP, huh?
I want to offer my apologies also to those I’ve been snappish with, including but not limited to Freeman.
I’m scared and sick of my house and worried for my children whose peace and psyche are being disrupted. Not an excuse, but being aware, I will try to do better.
Tim, I have been praying for your daughter; Meade, I know your positions are well-intentioned.
I am grateful to this community and its hostess/bouncer and wish you all health and happiness.
So I have enough food for a month or so. Should I buy more? Am I part of the problem if I do?
We have a little money; should I buy stocks and a piece of furniture we need, or will I be kicking myself in a month for wasting it?
I’m also worried for the 2600 direct reports my husband had to furlough yesterday.
Has anyone broken down New York's COVID cases by actual address? I know you can find the data at the borough level, but I have wondered about spread within large apartment complexes. I know the "journalists" did a spate of stories over the last 3 weeks that spread in the air of an apartment building isn't a worry, and they gave all kinds of reasons why this would be true, but, still, these things have enclosed spaces that a lot of people have to enter every day- elevators.
And grocery store stock is only part of the problem. Can’t buy if you don’t have money.
This morning there were literal brawls at the stores in my city because the EBT cards reloaded overnight. Cops just watched.
Meade, I know your positions are well-intentioned.
Saying other people accept millions of deaths is not well intentioned.
"California is a weird case, for sure."
For those who missed it referenced on Instapundit:
https://www.nationalreview.com/2020/03/coronavirus-pandemic-california-herd-immunity/
"No HSP, huh?”
That made me laugh.
Also, thanks Pants. We are all in this together. I know everybody is pissed about the two trillion, and yeah, I expect it to be inflationary, but this will be over, allowances will be made for everybody, my guess is that there will be jobs. For one thing, we should be bringing a lot of manufacturing back from China. Well that’s my guess.
The stories in the media are mostly inspirational or sad. I haven't seen any horrible stories, but they're out there. They probably won't grow exponentially, but they will grow....Broccoli always seems to be in abundant supply.
It seems we are entering the valley of despair. The new normal is no longer novel, the lack of in person social interaction is wearing on nerves. The fun coping tactics and actions have come to be seen as contrived, cynical even. This is the time we each must show resilience, fortitude, and commitment to success. We are one day closer to the resolution of the crisis - we just don't know when that will be. As they say in AA: one day at a time. We don't have to, and cannot, solve this today other than by committing to try tomorrow.
We have somehow collapsed into
extraordinary delusions and the madness of crowds.
And I don't mean to ignore or belittle the concerns of those most severely affected. Those of us that can must help those, like Pants, that are in dire straights, or close to it.
I called Jimmy Buffett an asshole on 680’The Fan this morning And they ended up laying that snippet on the Nick and Chris so after several
Commercial breaks because I immediately apologized for the profanity. Which was nice.
Buffett is a big, the help aren’t allowed to address him or look at him directly kinda guy. Talk about your frauds.
Here's what I think is going to happen:
The economic shutdown periods coming from the local authorities are simply not realistic. The economic dislocation will be more than the populace can bear after a relatively short period of time. The question, for the politicians is -- what is that limit? How far can the populace be pushed? According to modern medical wisdom, the farther, the better.
What will happen is that there is going to be a wave of from-below civil disobedience like the country has never seen. The cops will cease, out of both sympathy & frustration, to enforce the social quarantines. They are cops after all and not an army of occupation.
After the ground-swell from below, the various government bodies will make a great show of bowing to The Will Of The People. And, then, what will come, will come. The plague will work its way through the population, attenuated by the epidemiological steps taken up to that point, medical treatments, &, by the grace of God, warmer weather.
Come what may, the politicians will be able to say to the electorate if the shit really hits the fan --- "We tried, but you wouldn't listen". If the course of the virus is relatively mild, they will join us all in a Mass of Thanksgiving, and be publicly grateful for being spared this time, like the rest of us. No one wants to be a bad sport & shot the wounded after the battle is won, after all.
Only a few months ago, every Democrat I encountered was hoping for some sort of economic calamity to rid us of Trump.
Funny how that's exactly what happened, isn't it?
Even more amusing is that we voluntarily made it happen.
Playing that snippet.
After, not so after.
"For one thing, we should be bringing a lot of manufacturing back from China."
Well, we have found out that a lot of our media is evidently 'owned' by China, considering the daily regurgitation of Chines propaganda talking points.
I understand we need ventilator manufacturing now, but I would feel more confident about the future if some plants were retooling for guillotines.
I am Laslo.
Just need the tail end of “Nessun Dorma”:
�� “Vincerà
�� Vincerò”
The Chinese know that sentimentality is the weakness to be exploited in spoiled Americans.
Yancey Ward said...I will give an example: I buy a lot of yogurt- I actually skipped buying it last week because there was so little left in the refrigerated case- I felt too guilty to take the last three Chobani packs. I wonder if I find any at all tomorrow.
You should consider making your own. I did this as a teen in the late 70's. It was kind of a fad. It's super easy. I don't eat enough to justify making it. I do make my own limoncello because I have productive citrus. Also, plenty of frozen lemon and lime juice.
Well, we have found out that a lot of our media is evidently 'owned' by China, considering the daily regurgitation of Chines propaganda talking points.
Call them out on it. The little fuckers think they can buy our opinions. Show them that they can't.
I am not gay, but I would gladly fuck Anderson Cooper's bloody neck stump after the blade had its way.
And -- still not being gay -- I would fuck Jim Acosta's neck stump, even though we are both male.
But if I needed to prove my not-gayness afterward I would then fuck the neck stump of pretty much any CNN female talking head.
I would do this for America.
I am Laslo.
It’s not our opinions the Chinese are buying. It’s our tears.
GERMANY TO INTRODUCE CORONAVIRUS 'IMMUNITY CERTIFICATES' FOR RECOVERED PUBLIC
These antibody tests will be far more important than the antigen tests.
We have fallen into a trap that we cannot bear to see or acknowledge.
Because it would require us to harden ourselves.
Yancey Ward said...I will give an example: I buy a lot of yogurt- I actually skipped buying it last week because there was so little left in the refrigerated case- I felt too guilty to take the last three Chobani packs. I wonder if I find any at all tomorrow.”
“You should consider making your own. I did this as a teen in the late 70's. It was kind of a fad. It's super easy. I don't eat enough to justify making it. I do make my own limoncello because I have productive citrus. Also, plenty of frozen lemon and lime juice.”
Making your own yogurt is so easy, then strain it and you have the best Greek yogurt ever. Use whole milk, not 2%. People have lost so many skills our forbearers had, what better time to rediscover them?
@Laslo,
I am not gay
Oh, that's what ALL the neck stump fuckers say!
rhhardin said...
Terra incognita is my favorite color.
**********
I once told some people greeting me after a trans-Atlantic flight that it was great to be back on good old terra cotta.
The confused/embarrassed expressions on their faces were priceless.
One big difference between S. California and New York is cars vs. mass transit. Cars are safer, aloofness is better. This Coronavirus is going to destroy woke culture. Even global warming, totally built on models, will take a hit because a great awakening is now beginning on how corrupt models are, thanks to Imperial College’s Neil Effing Ferguson.
"Many are out of work and hungry."
Surprise.
The pro-panic faction, here and abroad, will have a lot to answer for.
But Italy was always going to be a tough case: in poor shape as a country before the Wuhan virus hit, and unlikely to have succeeded in targeted quarantines. Perhaps they had no alternative.
Fortunately, thanks in part to the Trump economy, we were not as close to the edge of the abyss. But fall we can.
Let’s get real. The only reason for the lockdowns is so old people have a chance to use the health care system. Spare me I know young people are occasionally hospitalized too
There’s no immunity. No herd immunity. Everyone is going to catch it.
We’re simply prolonging the time period of excess deaths. And possibly saving a few oldies so they can live off taxpayers for a few extra years. Except. There won’t be any taxpayers in another 2 weeks
This is stupid. Quarantine oldies. Pick a family member to get tested so he or she can deliver food. Let the rest of us get to work.
Yancey
I live in an area with cases, though few deaths yet. Under a lockdown emergency order, with cops enforcing. The stores are well stocked. They were out of TP but restocked. They were out of milk but restocked. Only flour and bleach and bleach wipes are out. Wonder was available and paper towels. Truckers are being heroic, so are store workers. So far no sign of famine by mid April.
YoungHegelian said:
...The question, for the politicians is -- what is that limit? How far can the populace be pushed?...
There is a line of thought that the backlog of virus testing in California will suddenly get pushed through and presented to the public when the public gets pushed to the point of refusal to comply with the lockdown order. See...you must stay on lockdown because the situation is dire!!!
I think we’ve all had our little emotional breakdowns, it’s best to forgive oneself and others. We can do better, we can use this time productively. Stimulus money will help those in the most dire straits, it can help small businesses too, and big business always seems to get bailed out. Plus there are some brilliant scientists working on a cure/ vaccine/ meds, treatments as we speak, some really promising things in the news today. There is going to be more heartache for many people, but if we just throw our hands in the air and wail, what good will it do?
@DavidUW
As I said, the Chinese know that our weakness is sentimentality.
Our sentimental moral image of ourselves will not allow us to make triage decisions.
Laslo
Your dedication is an inspiration to us all.
Wash afterwards.
Thoroughly.
like the soldiers in the terrible 3rd mummy film
YH-I wish I saw that upwelling as clearly as you, but a quick look at my Facebook feed confirms to me that there is an army of excitable biddies out there who are almost erotically excited about All The Drama, All the Danger and All the Sanctioned Tattling. The women of this country, who by and large think with their vaginas, have been successfully convinced that the sky is falling and they are not going to be easily convinced it’s safe to come out or that they can stop spying on their neighbors.
We’re in a shadow war with communist China.
Sorry about the repetitious wording. I’m typing on phone while being climbed on by freshly bathed toddlers.
Yancey
Mail order coffee. I kid you not. We have a place in Canada we use.
I had to buy 2% milk, the 1% being gone. Bought the wrong brand of cereal too.
Not alarming I must say.
"you have to open it back up just to prevent social unrest"
Otherwise, some senior staycationers may find their staycations rudely interrupted.
Anyway, what can't go on, won't. In a few weeks, governors will have CYAed long enough. Any new infections will be due mostly to people not abiding by quarantines. The rest of us will go back to kinda-normal, because we must.
But the question is, will it happen gradually and peacefully, or will it happen suddenly, restlessly, and violently?
Seeing the way the media has been with China, it makes me wonder how much China was pushing the Russia collusion theory to them.
Oh boy, just when I think someone has come to her senses. I’ve seen more drama from selfish young women than any biddy. What vulgar negativity.
But you should see the posts in my neighborhood FB group. “I see people walking too close together!” “I see people visiting their neighbors!” “Lady in the red truck, I know you live on the next street over!” “I’m calling the police if I see this again!!!”
It’s all such FUN! The EXCITEMENT! The SAVING GRANDMA FROM CERTAIN DEATH!!! The HEROISM!
Won’t be easily pried loose from these people now that their bird brains have been cemented that their interference with strangers’ behavior is a matter of life and death.
@Sebastian
The infection rate is already beginning to look as if it is flatlining in NYC and my county in upstate NY.
My. That is our model.
Inga, but you know I’m right.
What happens in a few months when it becomes apparent, as I suspect it will, that this virus is not much more calamitous that the usual ten year peak flu epidemic?
Unrest happens. That’s what.
ST, the shutdowners will congratulate themselves on a job well done, of course.
@Pants,
YH-I wish I saw that upwelling as clearly as you, but a quick look at my Facebook feed confirms to me that there is an army of excitable biddies out there who are almost erotically excited about All The Drama, All the Danger and All the Sanctioned Tattling.
With all due respect to you & your FB homies, madam, they are probably white women of a certain age & class. They will certainly not be at the forefront of the Revolution. Who will be will be the blue collar populace of every color & ethnicity, especially the men. They are living close to the bone even in the best of times. They cannot fail their families. They will be followed by the small business owners who will not sit idly by while their life's work gets trashed. If you don't own a small business (and I do), you simply can't understand how for a business owner, the business is his baby.
Americans are, by and large, a law-abiding people. But, we're not a people given to socially suicidal displays. There's a limit here, and we're not there yet, but we're getting there. In the DC area, a lot of the trades' guys already seem to be moving on as normal, if they can (e.g. no one wants a painter in their house right at this moment).
“But you should see the posts in my neighborhood FB group. “I see people walking too close together!” “I see people visiting their neighbors!” “Lady in the red truck, I know you live on the next street over!” “I’m calling the police if I see this again!!!”
It’s all such FUN! The EXCITEMENT! The SAVING GRANDMA FROM CERTAIN DEATH!!! The HEROISM!
Won’t be easily pried loose from these people now that their bird brains have been cemented that their interference with strangers’ behavior is a matter of life and death.’
Well, maybe that’s how people behave in Texas, in your area, but you don’t see this here in Wisconsin, even in Madison. People actually pass each other on the street and nod and smile. My daughter with the two little boys ages 5 and 3 go out for a nature walk to one of the many parks and nature areas, every single day. No one harasses them.
I Have Misplaced My Pants said...
I want to offer my apologies also to those I’ve been snappish with
You were not as snappish as some here are on a regular day.
You are, ARM. a willing or unwilling propagandist for the Chicoms.
In practice, your motivation makes no difference.
"But if I needed to prove my not-gayness afterward I would then fuck the neck stump of pretty much any CNN female talking head."
Ah. At last, my chance to meet Laslo face to face.
Shouting Thomas, propagandist for the Chicoms.
Could you point to your long string of posts complaining about the fact that the Chinese are killing our manufacturing sector? I would be curious to read about your thoughts and long-standing concern on this issue.
ARM: "You were not as snappish as some here are on a regular day."
Its my policy to be snappish with ChiCom propagandists.
“Could you point to your long string of posts complaining about the fact that the Chinese are killing our manufacturing sector? I would be curious to read about your thoughts and long-standing concern on this issue.”
Many of the conservatives here in Waukesha County bought their McMansions with money they made outsourcing their companies manufacturing to China for the last 20 years.
March was cooler and rainier than usual in California; or, at least, I can personally attest this was the case in both the San Francisco Bay Area and in the Los Angeles metropolitan area.
rcocean is absolutely right that there’s really no comparison in density and mass transit to New York City. San Francisco proper is dense, but only about half as much as New York, and mass transit ridership has never been as high as New York. San Francisco also has about 1/8th the population, while the entire population of the Bay Area is smaller than New York City. Outside of San Francisco, people in the Bay Area get around primarily by car, just like in the Los Angeles area.
I’ll hazard a guess that the subway was the main vector for the disease in New York.
Ahh, Drago, another who failed to question the wisdom of selling out our manufacturing to China until it was too late. But then you believed the lie about WMD in Iraq, so expectations were not high.
I know people up waukesha way, they strive to avoid the strangleholds china puts on corporations after they siphon their ip away.
Inga said...
Many of the conservatives here in Waukesha County bought their McMansions with money they made outsourcing their companies manufacturing to China for the last 20 years.
This is true all across the country. Quislings every one of them.
You aren’t curious about anything, ARM, any more than you’re reasonable or Aristotelian.
You’re a trickster.
In practice, you’ve been ranting incessantly about your hatred for the president who’s led the trade war against China and sought to repatriate manufacturing to the U.S.
And, as I’ve said, you’ve repeatedly claimed that Trump’s admirable practice of always stating positive outcomes and cheerleading for them is a form of lying.
You’re a very confused, and quite malicious man. You exude malice. And jealousy.
Kathryn51 said...Mitigation is not the same as "elimination" (of the disease). He scares me.
--
I heard it the same..and agree.
I get the sense he is being given a long leash now but will get some form of hook in a bit.
My real barometer will be when Pence snaps and refuses to hold up another revised sign.
Inga said...Many of the conservatives here in Waukesha County bought their McMansions with money they made outsourcing their companies manufacturing to China for the last 20 years.
Sure, half of conservatives own manufacturing businesses. The other half are preacher-scam artists.
What a fucking idiot.
If anybody knows what it is to be a Quisling, it’s you, ARM.
Hard to say whether it’s deliberate or just out of malice, jealousy and stupidity.
Yeah, I always rely on Facebook postings to find out what's really going on with statistically significant accuracy. I'm not seeing any of that bullsnot here in New England. I think it's because people here are very smart have tons of common Sense and they understand the situation and they're doing their bit with typical Yankee determination.
My wife got the first prototype surgical mask completed beautiful fit and seal. She will crank out half a dozen for our immune compromised daughter who keeps working in her essential biotech industry job.
Many thanks to Inga... those links on mask making that you posted really helped her get up to speed quickly.
Food lines?
Berno says "Food lines are good!"
narciso said...
I know people up waukesha way, they strive to avoid the strangleholds china puts on corporations after they siphon their ip away.
The Chinese are bad actors. This doesn't mean US factory owners weren't also bad actors.
Pants, you remain in my prayers. I know it's a struggle.
It’s all such FUN! The EXCITEMENT! The SAVING GRANDMA FROM CERTAIN DEATH!!! The HEROISM!
Yes, there are a lot of everyday heroes around.
In Chicago, they sent out a hotline number to report businesses that are open that don't seem essential.
Around me, the worst of it is on Nextdoor. A woman saw two teenagers entering the store standing close to each other and laughing. She was shook. Sho shook she had to post about it on the internet. Where are their parents, she wondered/
ST: "The infection rate is already beginning to look as if it is flatlining in NYC and my county in upstate NY." Yes, and in WA. We may have a soft landing yet.
"What happens in a few months when it becomes apparent, as I suspect it will, that this virus is not much more calamitous that the usual ten year peak flu epidemic?"
There will be a reckoning. And the backtracking tropes of the pro-panic faction won't help.
"ST, the shutdowners will congratulate themselves on a job well done, of course."
But millions of us will remember. Not sure what form the discontent will take.
“This is true all across the country. Quislings every one of them.”
I wonder what all those Conservative outsourcers are going to do now? I’m glad my son in law sold his share of the business to his partner. He started a small manufacturing company right here in Wisconsin, which is now shut down for the duration. I don’t hear him and my daughter bitching and moaning about it. They seem to know what they can do to mitigate the damages. Stimulus money isn’t just for employees, it’s also for employers.
I worked for the law firms that organized and created the legal justification for outsourcing American jobs.
Left those firms in 1996.
Those firms were 100% Democratic. In fact, those firms were powerhouses in Democratic Party finance and policy making.
These decisions were not made on the local level.
One way that I'm preserving fresh vegetables is by making pico de gallo. Couple onions 5 cloves of garlic four jalapenos two habaneros 5 tomatoes two Orange bell peppers some citric acid some red wine vinegar salt pepper and oregano made a little over 2 quarts.
“One way that I'm preserving fresh vegetables is by making pico de gallo. Couple onions 5 cloves of garlic four jalapenos two habaneros 5 tomatoes two Orange bell peppers some citric acid some red wine vinegar salt pepper and oregano made a little over 2 quarts.”
Ah, thanks for reminding me I still have some canning jars and lids, I haven't used for years. I hope the rubber gaskets are still good.
Now, Howard is a realist.
You’ve got to admire his acutely correct analysis that the Deep State is engaged in a war to override Trump and take back what is theirs.
Shouting Thomas said...
I worked for the law firms that organized and created the legal justification for outsourcing American jobs.
I don't doubt this.
I’m more sympathetic to Howard’s viewpoint.
You can make an argument out of it that makes sense.
Allegri song (translation)
That's Psalm 51, rh, the Miserere.
It was sung exclusively on Good Friday in the Sistine Chapel. Not even the song notation (sheet music) was available to others than the papal choir.
Then one day a young Mozart heard it on a visit to home. He went home and wrote down what he had heard by memory.
And that is how we today are able to hear it.
There’s no doubt about it, ARM.
I was just an IT worker in those firms.
In this regard, I’m just a whore. I work for the highest bidder. I’m not a policy maker.
So what's the alternative to the Deep State Thomas? A return to the spoil system? That sounds great with Trump in charge but what will you people do when it's AOC's people?
nga said...
I still have some canning jars and lids
I am thinking of trying to make jam now that I have mastered bread. Not sure how to start. We have some frozen strawberries.
“Sure, half of conservatives own manufacturing businesses. The other half are preacher-scam artists.”
That’s not a nice way to speak about your fellow conservatives. But I guess you know them better than me.
It is a dilemma Howard, and one that Althouse, I think, has addressed often but not directly.
Can Trump win this fight or does he just plunge us into endless chaos, without regard to your moral outlook about right and wrong?
I don’t have the answer.
If there is a way for Trump to win, I’m all in for him. If there is no way for him to win, then I’ve got to bail at some point in the future.
Here is Allegri's Miserere sung by the Tallis Scholars at the fifth century Santa Maria Maggiore in Rome (fairly close to Termini) on the occasion of the 400th anniversary of the death of Palestrina.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xpzdB0G3TJU
I made a loaf of bread today from pastry flour. It turned out to be pretty dense but very tasty. I also made a giant pot of beans then split it to make refried beans out of half and a chili type stew out of the other half. This will feed me and the wife lunch and dinner for the next week. Based on all the supplies I've laid in we can go until the end of June with what we have on hand.
The deep state is effectively the spoils system, look who predominates? They wetr the ones who were focused on everything other than the cdcs original charter.
“I am thinking of trying to make jam now that I have mastered bread. Not sure how to start. We have some frozen strawberries.”
I’ve made jam out of frozen fruit, I added a package of jello to thicken it up and give it a bit more sweetness. No added sugar needed. I have several bags of frozen cranberries in the freezer yet, I might make some cranberry, blueberry jam.
The whole world is lock down for few days. Sports fraternity are joining hands to help from this this virus
Howard said...
So what's the alternative to the Deep State Thomas? A return to the spoil system?
We already have the spoils system with government positions offered to political loyalists. They just always go to Dems even when Reps win elections.
That sounds great with Trump in charge but what will you people do when it's AOC's people?
How would this be any different from what we have now?
Personifying this shadow war with China in Trump, I agree, is a mistake.
He’s our servant and warrior. He’s got to find a way to win at a reasonable cost, or he’s got to go.
I think that with the Mueller investigation the impeachment debacle and now the coronavirus pandemic, Trump has probably had his fill of chaos. If we come out the other side of the quarantine with less than 100000 dead I think Trump has a very good chance of winning re-election. I heard the other day he was talking up his infrastructure bill that would be a good idea.
Technically, the Miserere is chanted, not sung, to the extent that there is a difference.
Howard said...
I made a loaf of bread today from pastry flour.
Is this the same as plain flour? I have made bread from bread flour and plain flour and couldn't detect much different. Whole wheat flour on the other hand was a total pain in the ass. I never got that to work properly. Didn't like the taste either.
“I also made a giant pot of beans then split it to make refried beans out of half and a chili type stew out of the other half.”
I do that too. I’ve been making my beans in the Instant Pot with a ham hock, which is gross but really gives the beans wonderful flavor. I have three meals from that one pot of beans, bend and rice, refried beans- German style. My friend calls me Beaner Schnitzel, because of my German style refined beans. Plus I have bean soup with big thick homemade noodles, like my German mother used to make.
I bought a 10 pound bag of rice and laughed at myself thinking I’d never use it, but now I’m actually glad I bought it because I heard that people were having problems finding rice.
Rick: The AOC wing of Democrats are also opposed to the current nature and flavor of the deep state. If they have the power to fire all of those hundreds of thousands of bureaucrats they would replace them with college students and dime store philosophers.
Is this the same as plain flour? I have made bread from bread flour and plain flour and couldn't detect much different. Whole wheat flour on the other hand was a total pain in the ass. I never got that to work properly. Didn't like the taste either.
No. Pastry flour is a tender flour better used for baking cakes and pastries, lower in gluten. You want a higher gluten flour like bread four for a really nice bread loaf. I’ve never uses all whole wheat, never more than half whole wheat and half white all purpose or bread flour.
Shouting Thomas said...
He’s got to find a way to win at a reasonable cost, or he’s got to go.
To be fair to Trump I think that horse left the stable some time ago. Any retrenchment is now going to be very costly. Necessary if we are to remain a premier nation, but very costly. Who is going to tell the consumers that every manufactured good now costs twice as much?
Pastry flour has less gluten and less protein in it then high quality bread flour. I think I might have screwed it up a bit by heating up the water too much that I mix the yeast into and so it didn't rise as much as usual. I also added a lot of herbs and spices including tablespoon of salt two teaspoons of ground pepper one tbsp of ancho chili powder one tbsp of crystallized garlic powder a tablespoon of onion powder and a tablespoon of oregano
After losing 50 lbs., my body has plunged into deep Keto burn.
Although I stopped counting calories at a rate that guarantees I’ll lose weight, I’m continuing to lose weight at an alarming rate.
Tonight, I tried eating a shitload of carbs to try to stop the Keto burn. Chicken parm, spaghetti marinara, garlic bread... probably 2,000 calories of carbs.
I’ll see at tomorrow morning’s weigh in whether I’ve halted the Keto burn.
ARM: "The Chinese are bad actors. This doesn't mean US factory owners weren't also bad actors."
The communist totalitarian mass murderers who imprison millions and harvest prisoners organs and force women to have abortions and who lied about the virus and then got the WHO to lie about the virus and who purposely shipped faulty medical products around the globe in the middle of a global pandemic and who have stolen US firm technical secrets and hacked every major agency of our government...........are just as bad as US factory owners.
Got it.
You know what else is getting hard to get? Kitty litter! I had a full 20 lb box left over from when I had my son’s cat before his cat died in December. Today I actually found out my neighbor down the road was having trouble finding kitty litter, so I gave her the big box of litter, about 30 cans of Fancy Feast and a 10lb container of dry cat food. I put it outside my front door and she came to pick it up and we yelled at each other through the closed door and ended up laughing like a couple of old biddies.
"Who is going to tell the consumers that every manufactured good now costs twice as much?”
We are not the same nation that we were a month ago. We have had our nose rubbed in some stuff, but good. Trump was right about China all along, you forgot to say. I am sure you have some snappy comeback to that, but really, you don’t.
Instead of a ham hock I used a smoked turkey leg to cook the beans in. I also made a super mirepoix consisting of onion carrot celery rutabaga beets and parsnips.
The stew was so rich I ended up diluting it down to a soup concentration and then served it over basmati rice. For dessert I had a thin slice of bread with a schmear of peanut butter.
Blogger Inga said...
“Sure, half of conservatives own manufacturing businesses. The other half are preacher-scam artists.”
That’s not a nice way to speak about your fellow conservatives. But I guess you know them better than me.
4/1/20, 8:45 PM
Inga probably does not realize it, but she is talking about the US Chamber of Commerce types. They are free-trade, open-borders types. They hate Trump.
There is much more intellectual diversity on the Right than there is on the Left. If you don't believe me, look up the history of the Sierra Club's embrace of open borders in the 90s. They were schooled when a big-pockets donor told them that the environment mattered less than flooding the country with illegals.
We conservatives don't fall in like that. We are ornery.
Howard said...
they would replace them with college students and dime store philosophers.
Why would we care it's a slightly different group of otherwise unemployable political loyalists?
"The Chinese are bad actors. This doesn't mean US factory owners weren't also bad actors.”
It’s the globalists. They buy factories on the idea that they can run them cheaper, then they break ‘em up and send ‘em to China. Joe Biden is the candidate of the globalists. Donald Trump is the candidate that the globalists hate.
N.B. I am not breaking into the dried beans until the grocery store shelves are empty. Those are emergency rations.
Drago said...
are just as bad as US factory owners.
I will let all the US manufacturing workers who lost their jobs to overseas workers and now have crap jobs on crap pay make that call.
Thomas you might be interested in the fasting mimicking diet. It's not for weight loss. It's like doing a reset. It might help you get out of keto. You mimic a fast for about 5 days hitting about 800 calories a day equal fat and carbs and 10% protein. You will probably lose anywhere from 3 to 5 lb.
After the 5 days, you go into refeeding mode where you eat high-quality low on the food chain nutritious fruits and vegetables with a small ration of fish and or meat. over the next five days you should put that weight that you lost back on. But the way that you put on will be and healthy organ tissue and in muscles not in fat.
rhhardin said...
Balcony singing in Italy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H3v9unphfi0
Allegrei
note the soprano at 1:35
Did you know that the high soprano part was actually a transcription error? It was not originally that high.
My absolute favorite piece of music ever.
Its like with subprime, initially banks didnt want to get involved but between govt pressure from the top and communitu activists from the bottom (one name comes to mind) so they configured their business model to fit this intrusion, and we knoe the rest of the story.
God, Rick you're tedious.
Trump get's his trinkets made in China and hires illegal immigrants. Look at what they do when their money is on the line, not what they say or do when other people's money is on the line.
“Instead of a ham hock I used a smoked turkey leg to cook the beans in. I also made a super mirepoix consisting of onion carrot celery rutabaga beets and parsnips.
The stew was so rich I ended up diluting it down to a soup concentration and then served it over basmati rice.”
Mmmm sounds good, Basmati rice is my favorite, love the texture and flavor and it’s lower in starch, yay! I make a roux with garlic and smokey paprika and mix 1/3 of my beans into it after smashing them up a bit. I always cook my beans with celery, onions lots of spices. I’ve used smoked turkey wings, which I haven’t found in the stores lately.
They repeat yao zao back to us, as if was orinal thought.
Lewis Wetzel: "Inga probably does not realize it, but she is talking about the US Chamber of Commerce types. They are free-trade, open-borders types. They hate Trump."
All the lefties here are operating off a 1980's/Monopoly Man version of the republican party, even after the campaign of 2015 and 2016!
Amazing. It's happening right in front of them and they still can't see it.
The entire Koch brothers/Chamber of Commerce/Establishment Republican party went All In for Hillary, and was quite vocal about it. And that includes where the dollars flowed. Trump ended up flipping hundreds of counties that had gone for obama and these guys still don't understand.
It's all right there, but nope. It's like it never happened.
Same thing happened in the UK. First the country goes with Brexit. Then, in the December 2019 elections the Conservative Party sweeps to massive victories by flipping Labour seats in the North that had voted Labour for generations....all the while running on a platform of Get Brexit Done, and be done with the EU.
Poland, Hungary, Italy, Spain, Brazil, etc, all following the same pattern.
Inga said...
I added a package of jello to thicken it up and give it a bit more sweetness.
Regular jello, like strawberry flavored jello?
Inga said...
Many of the conservatives here in Waukesha County bought their McMansions with money they made outsourcing their companies manufacturing to China for the last 20 years.
This is a stupid and mendacious lie.
That’s worth a try, Howard.
I shamelessly steal and riff off of the recipes of cowboy cook Kent Rollins. His refried bean recipe is to die for.
https://m.youtube.com/user/krollins57
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