So writes Robin Givhan in "A thorough, revolting history of Trump’s behavior toward women" (WaPo). It was interesting to read that right after immersing myself in the meaning of "human scum."
Are we in a new age of squeamishness? Or are we just pretending to be disgusted?
Givhan writes:
Somewhere between the descriptions of casual groping and the lengthy investigation of Trump’s possible involvement in a threesome with an underage girl, you long to scrub your memory bank with bleach, to douse yourself with disinfectant.Do you? Personally, I am revolted by the idea of putting dangerous chemicals on my body. I'm never so disgusted with others that my impulse is to attempt to clean myself in some crazily exaggerated fashion.
Givhan goes on to say the book isn't shocking, because we've heard the main things before: "the affair with Karen McDougal, the sex with Stormy Daniels, the sexual intimidation of Ivana Trump, the gutter talk with Howard Stern, the ogling of half-dressed Miss Universe contestants, and the personal insults hurled at women ranging from Megyn Kelly and Rosie O’Donnell to former beauty queen Alicia Machado."
Gutter talk with Howard Stern. This is America in 2019? Disturbed by conversations with Howard Stern? I hope this is pretend offense. I've read Howard Stern's collection of interviews, which has lots of Trump, and it's lively and funny, and everything that's said is said for a reason. I wouldn't call it "gutter talk."
Givhan informs us that "All the President’s Women" has "a 70-page appendix filled with truncated tales of lascivious behavior — bonus nuggets of lechery." A fashion photographer calls Trump a "predator" because "He was always chasing models." The book says that in the presence of models, Trump "liked to paw their shoulders, cup their bottoms, grab at their breasts and plant sloppy kisses on them when they least expected it."
Paw, cup, grab, plant — How would your gestures of physical affection be described by your worst enemy? Every playful, tender move you make would be disgusting.
Givhan faults the book for collecting the stories but never analyzing why Trump is the way the stories, as told by the authors, make him look. What made him "a lecher"? Something about his childhood, his mother? Some "cultural forces"? "Was he created by some collision of generational, social and demographic storms? Is he a volatile result of a tectonic shift in gender roles?"
And what about us? What makes anybody want to read a compilation of all the scurrilous sexual material about Trump? What kind of result of a "collision of generational, social and demographic storms" are you?
Posts
156 comments:
Yeah, I read this just after seeing the Guardian stuff on Katie Hill, talk about "Ew". The difference is there are photos of Katie Hill with her staffer. What woman wants their hair brushed by another with her exposed vagina at the back of your head? If someone has a picture of Trump doing that; then I'll believe the "Ew".
Keep women angry, is the plan. Angry women will want to read it. Anger is entertaining to the angry.
Imus had a Larry Flynt impersonator announcing a Women of Malaysia Airlines Flight 370 issue, back when that happened.
"And what about us? What makes anybody want to read a compilation of all the scurrilous sexual material about Trump? “
I am reading a book written a long time ago that I found in a used book store. The pages are falling out, but it’s really good. It’s called “The Erotic Motivation in Literature” and it takes a Freudian approach to understanding the author, not the work itself. Anyway, given all of the caveats about seeing Freud as “scientific” there is still a lot of truth there.
For instance one could imaging that “The Handmaiden’s Tale” represents the repressed desires of Margaret Atwood, where does that imagery come from but her imagination?
It’s an old fashioned book so I think it would refer to this kind of material as representing a kind of “fetich,” stuff that is ostensibly psychologically painful, but secretly pleasurable. The pleasure center and pain center of the brain are ajdacent and sometimes the locus of certain feelings migrates. Well, it would at least be classed as a neurosis. An obsession brought about by some painful event, like the loss of a presidential election or something, I guess. I can’t imagine taking politics that seriously though that Hillary’s loss would take over my waking thoughts and even dreams.
Yech. Insincere pearl-clutching from a cosseted WaPoop hack. Pass the smelling salts and clear the fainting couch! Here comes Robin, bearing twice-told tales of Trumpian loutishness. We've heard them before and voted with full knowledge that Trump was a bit of a lad with the ladies.
Yawn.
Expect to see more of these signs.
And yet...
There seem to be very few women complaining about his behavior to them.
A question I don't think I've seen answered is whether he ever actually had sex with stormy Daniels. Has he ever admitted it? Do we have anything other than her sketchy allegation?
John Henry
These people are completely perfidious and malevolent. They have been pretending for 4 years that when Trump crudely stating that women are drawn to men with wealth and power it was some sort of shocking revelation that had never before been uttered in polite Society. Trump seems to be a pretty horny guy, but at least he likes post-pubescent women which does not seem to be true of most of our Elite Class. I kind of think that's why they hate him so much. He hasn't descended to their deaths of depravity and that's also why they can't get him. He's not corrupt in the same way they are and they don't understand.
These people can't be dealt with in good faith or bad. They will do anything to destroy Trump and all his allies, large or small. They're coming for all of us it's just a matter of time.
Will there be any point in the arc of Feminism where women will desist in getting the vapors?
Halloween is coming, and women will be able to wear their Handmaid's Tale costumes for real, if only for a day.
I know, I know: don't tell women to smile -- it only makes them angry.
I am Laslo.
Robin Givhan could never bring herself to tell you that Michelle Obama was wearing a wig every time you saw her for those eight years. Michelle has bangs!!! Michelle cut her bangs [The scariest experience in every woman's life!]!!!!
Michelle and Barack have the same length hair. There. Now you know.
She sounds a bit like a prudish Victorian spinster who would have fits of the vapours at the sight of a man with no shirt, but couldn't get enough porn about goings on between priests and nuns so she could keep track of what the Papists were up to.
Not much difference from the way the rockers I worked with dealt with women.
Like Trump, they were surrounded by groupies. The groupies begged to be groped.
I like the way the writer makes it appear as though women could barely stand to be around Trump. My bet is they were lined up 10 deep, throwing themselves at him and pleading with him to grab them by the pussy.
If such women got pissed at Trump, it was probably because he didn't pick them.
Feminism doesn't have any place for women who love men, especially love rich and successful men, and love for such men to paw and grope them.
ARM has surrendered on the facts and withdrawn to reporting on the emotions of liberals as if they bore some weight in the real world.
I wouldn’t suggest googling it, but disgust is another common element of fetishes.
My favorite story in there was the picture of him sitting naked and combing his male subordinates here
Then there was the time he collected a hummer from a white house intern
Republicans are so gross... ewww
When Dems go poly and achieve release is liberating and beautiful, though.
I wonder what you'd discover if you took a good look at Dylan's lifelong behavior with women?
Actually, I know.
The groupies threw themselves at him, too.
What would you do if you were Dylan? I'd do exactly what he did. What the hell use is fame and fortune otherwise?
The feminist war on human nature is foolish and doomed, not to mention evil. The fight for love and glory will remain as it always has been. Thank God.
They could write a book a year if they wanted to focus on politicians predacious behavior with women. A book on Ted Kennedy. John F. Bobby. William. (Kennedy's could fill most of a decade). Chris Dodd. Bill Clinton (2 volumes). Estes Kefauver. Anthony Weiner. John Edwards. Wilbur Mills. There are more to list than I have the time to do. (and I'm leaving out Gary Hart, who was not in this class at all, but took the hit for all of them).
Yes, but Trump.
Good thing Bill Clinton didn’t do any of that shit!
Hugh Hefner had an entire Ideology of freedom for American Playboys and girls next door willing to be their playmates. At least Playboy Trump married at 3 and had children by all 3 and raised them with great care. And he did it all without drinking or smoking, which is a heresy in Hefner's fantasy.
Look at the pictures of Representative Katie Hill if you want to see a predator.
Eeuw is a contamination cry, according to sociologist Erving Goffman.
The list is, others present but not "with" them,
1. transition display. Brrr, Ahh, Phew.
2. spill cry. Oops, Whoops.
3. threat startle. Eek, Yipe.
4. revulsion. Eeuw.
"Observe, again, that there is an unserious note, a hint of hyperritualization"
What makes anybody want to read a compilation of all the scurrilous sexual material about Trump?
I don’t plan to read it but it sounds deliciously scandalous and entertaining. Same impulse that makes me want to read tabloids and watch reality TV would also make me enjoy this. But I don’t know if most people would read it with the same kind of light-hearted spirit because it’s about the Donald.
The picture of Kathy Griffin with Trumps bloody head disgusts me much more than anything Trump has ever SAID!!!
But is there evidence he brushed their hair naked?
I'm sure he has a nazi tattoo somewhere near his groin too. Ew. You grossed out? Metoo.
Expect to see more of these signs.
I am trying to remember a time when ARM posted a logical and coherent argument instead of throwing shells from the Peanut Gallery.
Your comrades are going to jail dude. You will need to up your game.
"What would you do if you were Dylan?”
You are not saying that women let him grab them by their pussy!
I hope I live long enough to witness a new generation of young women rise up in rebellion against the man hating, prissy feminists. I already know what they'll say:
"Shut up, you dried up old hags! I'm going to fuck my brains out and have a good time! You're just jealous because you don't have beautiful, young tits and ass like I do!"
It's coming. It's inevitable. I'll laugh my ass off.
Did they get the part where Trump said "Phwoar!" when he saw Princess Diana?
rhhardin said...Keep women angry, is the plan. Angry women will want to read it. Anger is entertaining to the angry.
It's as if women hungered for anger and were insatiable.
What shocked me about K Hill's photos is that she's not wearing makeup. And who took the photos?
... the ogling of half-dressed Miss Universe contestants...
Now, this bit is simply hilarious.
Can you imagine the suffering of these women who strut out in front of an audience of millions in bikinis? Trump ogled them!
The horror!
Francisco D said...
Your comrades are going to jail dude.
Giuliani is not my personal lawyer.
I think ARM’s point is that Democrats are really really upset and so we should see that getting rid of Donald Trump and erasing the election is more important than 800 year old concepts, long dodging the dustbin of history, like rights of the accused and the rule of law.
We should just get over looking at this rationally already, liberals are *hurting*!
Givhan has despised Trump since day one; she's hardly a neutral or trustworthy observer. Her fawning adoration of Michelle Obama's fashion mistakes also made me question her character.
Democracy Dies in Darkness!
Who would read it? I desperately try to avoid stereotypes, but, women?
So we have been forced by our betters to care about this impeachment misdirection, all the interviews are nothing but a game of telephone. 2cnd, 3rd, 4th hand recountings of OTHER peoples opinions. This charade is being pushed as fact finding, only, the meager fact of a single phone call is what we have. 20 people sharing their opinions about what anyone of them "feel" But it is not a recount of what they feel, but its a second persons interpretation about someone elses feelings.
This book is the same. 100% stories related far from its origins. about how the author feels of what she thinks about the feeling of others.
A question I don't think I've seen answered is whether he ever actually had sex with stormy Daniels. Has he ever admitted it? Do we have anything other than her sketchy allegation?
I've wondered about that, too. Paying blackmail used to be legal, I thought.
Is there a chapter on cigars in the Oval Office in that book?
ARM: "Expect to see more of these signs."
How long did it take you to make that sign?
Like the old joke about sex, "Don't! Don't! Don't stop!"
I have never felt anything like the need to shower after hearing a disgusting description of something. But then again, unlike Robin Givhan, I've never spent hours reading a book just so I can pretend to be revolted by what's in it. If I'm revolted, I stop reading.
I hope this is pretend offense.
You're in luck!
"gutter talk with Howard Stern"
Isn't that what Howard Stern is for? Gutter talk is what you do on his show.
Selective moral outrage by the hypocrite left. Another tedious day of it.
Bill Clinton was a sexual predator WHILE he was a politician in power.
But that's different, because reasons.
The timing, sequence and placement of these stories is almost something you'd expect if Trump raised the ire of an intelligence agency.
Almost.
Laslo said...
Halloween is coming, and women will be able to wear their Handmaid's Tale costumes for real, if only for a day.
You mean; their Slutty Handmaid's Tale Costumes ?
Trump could rape a woman on Fifth Ave and his base wouldn’t care and his lawyers would claim, as they have already, the Tweeter is above the law. So this book is just more scum that will be washed away.
I understand that there were periods in Trump's life where he was faithful and monogamous. He differs from our other horndog Presidents like JFK, LBJ and Bill Clinton in this regard. I'd like to see a deep think article on what could have possessed Trump to behave in such an occasionally honorable way. Well, I suppose we all have chinks in the armor. It is given to very few to be as consistent and thoroughly committed to their libido as Bill Clinton. I'd bet money that there was no other President who discussed weighty affairs of state whilst getting a blow job in the Oval Office. Well, maybe JFK, but no others.
Ann your turning in to an old gossip columnist - in NY parlance , a yenta.
Uh oh lefties.
It appears the "wonderful" Lisa Page, lefty/Dem DOJ operative par excellance and noted paramour of that "upstanding" FBI "hero" Peter "smirky" Strzok (LOL), was the one who literally edited and altered Gen Flynn's 302's even so far to have literally added a question and supposed answer from Flynn.
Horowitz report coming out, Durham moving to criminal investigation, and Comey and Brennan (as well as FBI vs CIA) already pointing fingers at each other, Sondland obliterating the latest lefty hoax lies, well.
Well well well.
Hey ARM, better break out your markers and cardboard.....you're going to need more lunatic signs!!
LOLOLOL
Serious Question?
Of these two (A,B) Which is a MORE Rhetorical Question?
A)Are we in a new age of squeamishness? Or are we just pretending to be disgusted?
B) Is A, a Rhetorical Question?
roesch/voltaire said...Trump could rape a woman on Fifth Ave and his base wouldn’t care
Another great example of fake outrage. Well done.
his lawyers would claim, as they have already, the Tweeter is above the law.
I wonder if there's anyone out there ignorant enough to think Trump's lawyers are the first presidential lawyers to make that argument. In fact, I wonder if there's anyone out there dumb enough to think that every president's lawyers don't make that argument.
Terrific, Althouse.
Witty. Insightful. Biting.
You've written a lot and I've read quite a bit of that volume.
This was one of your best.
Now do Slick Willy and Creepy Joe.
If women as a group are so uniformly repulsed by being degraded and treated like objects for a powerful man’s pleasure, can somebody explain to me why Fifty Shades of Grey sold, like, a bazillion copies?
And why the covers of romance novels—bought exclusively by females—always show big, powerful, alpha guys with subservient women staring longingly into the man’s eyes with that look? Usually on their knees or being carried or lying down?
Trump could rape a woman on Fifth Ave and his base wouldn’t care
Juanita Broderick could not be reached by lefties who really don't care.
That one really happened. George Stephanopilis traveled to the hotel room to try to discredit her account and couldn't.
Durham moving to criminal investigation, and Comey and Brennan (as well as FBI vs CIA) already pointing fingers at each other, Sondland obliterating the latest lefty hoax lies, well.
Schiff is racing to beat them to the courthouse. If he can spread enough lies, aided by the press, maybe he and Nancy can get an impeachment vote before the roof falls in on Comey, et al.
I would not rely on the Senate with weasels like Romney and Sasse there.
"Yeah, I read this just after seeing the Guardian stuff on Katie Hill, talk about "Ew". The difference is there are photos of Katie Hill with her staffer. What woman wants their hair brushed by another with her exposed vagina at the back of your head? If someone has a picture of Trump doing that; then I'll believe the "Ew"."
This kind of aversion to the human body and to sex is unsophisticated and unmodern to me. Would a man enjoy having a naked woman sitting behind him with her legs spread at his head level? If the answer is yes, then your comment seems homophobic. Is that what you mean to say. These are intimate pictures that Hill was unwise to allow to come into existence, but people expressing their sexuality often transgress in the realm of photography and create the opportunity for someone they trusted to hurt them.
There are other things about Hill, I believe, that deserve criticism. I haven't followed the story closely. (Should I?) But the activity you highlight is not disgusting (other than that a boss is getting sexual with an employee).
Roesch - NO - I don't think anyone, not even his most die-hard supporters, would allow Trump to escape the consequences of raping a woman on 5th avenue.
The progressive hivemind would allow their leftwing overlords to LIE about an accusation of rape against Trump. If Rachel and Schitt said Trump raped a woman on 5th avenue, and the walls are closing in - you'd buy it wholesale. right?
continuing to erode Trump down to evil incarnate to make Democrats appear to be angelic saviors. Unfortunately there is a long way to go. A long way.
Poor r/v.
All he and Schiff-ty and Freder and Stevie Uhr and the dems and the left and the FakeCon LLR's have left are their made up hypotheticals which somehow " prove" "guilt".
You would have to have a heart of stone to not point at and laugh at them.
AA: "If the answer is yes, then your comment seems homophobic. Is that what you mean to say."
Oh, here we go.....
Ann Althouse said...There are other things about Hill, I believe, that deserve criticism.
I have no problem with Hill's personal life. In fact, she's seems like a fun person to know. My problem is the hypocrisy that she wants to deny other public figures the ability to live the sort of private life she embraces. But then, I don't need the hypocrisy angle to hate her for that. It's hateful enough all by itself.
Blogger roesch/voltaire said...
Trump could rape a woman on Fifth Ave and his base wouldn’t care and his lawyers would claim, as they have already, the Tweeter is above the law. So this book is just more scum that will be washed away.
Trump said he could shoot someone on 5th Ave. and not lose any supporters the same way Sarah Palin said she can see Russia from her house.
As in, he didn't actually say that.
Dylan didn't treat Joan Baez very well. She sang a lot better than him, too.
Twice I remember asking my mother, `Why are operas always sad?' She tried no answer, but she was someone to whom I could direct such a perplexity. I would come to give myself various answers to the question - based on questions having to do, for example, with what occasions people to sing, and what plots best allow for such occasions, questions which I would later come to feel assumed the question, not answered it. I do not know that it is the most searching question one might ask of opera, but the most interesting directions for an answer I have been given to it come from another woman, Catherine Clément in her book _Opera, or the Undoing of Women_, published in 1979, translated into English some ten years later, when I came across it. Her answer is, in effect, that opera is about the death of women, and about the singing of women, and can be seen to be about the fact that women die because they sing.
Stanley Cavell A Pitch of Philosophy, p.132
"What makes anybody want to read a compilation of all the scurrilous sexual material about Trump?"
You wouldn't read it for sexual titillation, because Trump doesn't interest anyone as a fantasy sexual partner, does he? In real life, you might be interested in him as a partner because he's powerful and fun to talk to and rich or something, but for sex itself, it's not what anyone wants, I don't think.
So why read a lot of sex stories with him in it? Because you want to experience 400 pages worth of disgust?
I don't believe anyone wants to read this thing.
I suppose the reason the Liberal/left always have their outrage/disgust meter on 10/10 is because it works. It doesn't with me. No one can be constantly outraged by Trump-Hitler 365/24/7 as the Liberal/left pretends to be. I'm glad Althouse is calling them out on it. I'm quite sure that over his 70 year life, Trump kissed/gropped a few women without getting prior written permission. Attempted rape? No sexual blackmail? No,
The other problem is that many women like to make shit up and/or exaggerate, when they can get attention and/or hurt someone they don't like. CF: the women (hundreds of them) who claimed to have been assaulted by Kavanaugh. Or the goofy 50 y/o writer who claimed Trump attacked her in a Department store, or [insert 500 million other examples]
"Isn't that what Howard Stern is for? Gutter talk is what you do on his show."
"Gutter talk" is a phrase for a ridiculous old prude. I've listened to many hours of Howard Stern's show, and it's full of sex and outrageousness and transgression. If it was "gutter talk," there would be many Howard Sterns but there is only one and he is magnificent.
"Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...
Francisco D said...
Your comrades are going to jail dude.
Giuliani is not my personal lawyer."
No, Michael Avenatti is
"but people expressing their sexuality often transgress in the realm of photography and create the opportunity for someone they trusted to hurt them."
I love it when our "Sex expert" gives us a lesson on sexuality. Here is a gal who was a single mother for over 30 years and lead a sheltered life as a youth.
I'm not too clear what Trump did with Stormy Davis that was so terrible, except have consensual sex with her and watch Shark week. And of course, as the owner of a beauty pageant, you're expected to manage them so to speak because you're running the show. Remember the silly women who got upset because Trump called her Fat. She was a beauty queen, her job was to look beautiful, not be chunky slob.
Bleh on Howard Stern. He's too much of teenage sleaze and unfunny. I was surprised Althouse was a fan, since I imagined his audience was boys ages 12-17.
And the idea that any WaPo liberal is shocked at the Howard stern show is laughable. Those characters live in the gutter. If they're not uttering 4 letter words every sentence, they yapping about Tea-bagging or some weird sexual practice. This goes way back. Ben Bradlee was OK with JFK fucking his wife. Imagine some liberal reporter says she'd give Clinton a blow-job in public, and getting applauded for it by everyone at the WaPo, & then these reporters turning around and saying their shocked at Howard stern! They certainly weren't shocked at Harvey Weinstein.
"Dylan didn't treat Joan Baez very well. She sang a lot better than him, too.”
That’s one side of the story. His side is “I gave her my heart and she wanted my soul." And Joan Baez’s high intensity vibrato is not for everybody.
Open the Clinton Impeachment files.
You wouldn't read it for sexual titillation, because Trump doesn't interest anyone as a fantasy sexual partner, does he? In real life, you might be interested in him as a partner because he's powerful and fun to talk to and rich or something, but for sex itself, it's not what anyone wants, I don't think.
For some people the fantasy may be to imagine yourself as the Donald doing all this grabbing and stuff.
Would a man enjoy having a naked woman sitting behind him with her legs spread at his head level?
Depends. Not if she is wearing them.
When I spent my summer as a medical student in the VA psych hospital, a psych resident (a rare sane one) told me how he was doing "physical contact therapy" with a female patient. Yes there were female vets there. Anyway, he was combing her hair. She was enjoying it so much she peed on him.
No, probably would not enjoy it. I don't enjoy the smell of tuna fish,
Besides this is personal. We already did this song and dance in the 90s.
Some were willing to vote the former rapist-in-chief back in the WH as First Man when you know what he is.
Over 20 times on Epstein's plane.
Epstein did not have a painting of Trump in his house.
Stop clutching your pearls.
there was a Stephen McIntyre thread that showed burismas defense team, blue star strategies and their ties to the Truman project which includes buttigeg and Samantha power, you see why they have been covering with pillows,
that was nina Burleigh the one who offered to (redact) bill Clinton, for keeping abortion legal, an excerpt from the book, cost the telegraph a pretty penny,
No thanks. She’s terrible. It’s like asking me to read Charles Blow.
Not. Gunna. Do it.
I don't believe anyone wants to read this thing.
True, but you can buy the book and put it right next to your unread post-election Hillary Clinton book and seem all woke-y and part of The Resistance™.
The left are so corrupt and desperate for power, they get to time travel and mine for any dirt they can find on Trump.
All this while the Bidens and the Clintons get off unscathed after decades of million-dollar international pay-to-play self enrichment.
And yes - ANN - bravo for your insight here.
"Gutter talk" is a phrase for a ridiculous old prude
...and Pulitzer winning editors...who are ridiculous prudes who think if they say those things about Trump he will magically disappear.
No President could beat JFK in this category. And Kennedy did these things while in office!
Note that Althouse equates sexual degeneracy with sophistication.
Estes Kefauver:
"Best known for the 1950s Senate hearings that brought the Mob to popular attention, Kefauver was a notorious womanizer and drinker, supposedly yelling, "I gotta fuck!" on the way out of a bus after a campaign trip. One FBI source said that the Democrat "made love in plain view" with his date at a Mayflower Hotel party, only to trade women with JFK afterward. He also led a campaign against the corrupting effect of sexualized, violent comic books. Indeed."
Ted Kennedy used to make 'waitress sandwiches' with his good friend Sen. Chris Dodd. Trump is a Puritan compared to these guys. Katie Hill would scare me from wanting to be a Hill intern. She scares me here in Florida.
Robin Givhan is Robin Givhan. Small mind. Big stage.
Estes Kefauver? Nooo!
If women as a group are so uniformly repulsed by being degraded and treated like objects for a powerful man’s pleasure, can somebody explain to me why Fifty Shades of Grey sold, like, a bazillion copies?
Yah. There are cable mainstream channels devoted to stories of women being degraded, exploited, stalked. Women watch like crazy. 3x the audience of CNN...
@Jeff Brokaw - good observations!
If women as a group are so uniformly repulsed by being degraded and treated like objects for a powerful man’s pleasure, can somebody explain to me why Fifty Shades of Grey sold, like, a bazillion copies?
I'm guessing it satisfies a fantasy many women have about the power of love to fix all sorts of problems. It starts as kinky sex, but ends up at the altar. Looking over the plot line, the woman triumphs over something that terrifies her (an emotionally distant man who enjoys dominating/hurting women ends up committing to/loving her and moves away from that). Her love "heals" him... or so I've gathered from the 90 gazillion gushing articles/headlines on this deeply stupid series.
Women, like men, aren't uniformly *anything* because neither sex is monolithic. Also, the sexual fantasies of women (like those of men) don't neatly correlate with their moral code or their real-life desires. I've had a few thoughts that - were they to happen in real life - would either terrify or repulse me. Safe to wonder about in the abstract, but not something I would ever want to experience IRL.
Men are likewise interested in all sorts of themes in porn that - I hope - they would not act out in real life (gang rape, women being hurt/humiliated, etc.). We can't always help what turns us on - or off.
And why the covers of romance novels—bought exclusively by females—always show big, powerful, alpha guys with subservient women staring longingly into the man’s eyes with that look? Usually on their knees or being carried or lying down?
Why does so much erotica aimed at men turn women into little more than mindless props incapable of anything except unconditional, thrilled acceptance of whatever the guy wants to do to her? It's a fantasy - I don't know any real men who want women to act like live blow-up dolls, though such men probably do exist (hopefully, in small numbers :p).
People are an odd mix of animal impulses, contrary emotions, and occasionally coherent thoughts. The mind is a terrible and beautiful thing :p
If it was "gutter talk," there would be many Howard Sterns but there is only one and he is magnificent.
There are many "Howard Sterns" out there. Try listening to any FM station during morning drive time. The term "shock jock" was coined to describe them. There are many more on YouTube and podcasts.
Joe Rogan's podcast is infinitely better than Howard Stern's radio show.
that book is an artefact from when they were still taking calls from avenatti, before bezos and his paramour provoked the mega divorce,
https://spectator.org/impeachment-misfire-william-taylors-smokless-gun/
now miss hill who called Kavanaugh a predator, and paid her assistant a consultant fee of 14 K
Some of my happiest memories are of having my head in a woman’s lap. Even just looking at the stars.
I could stand in the middle of 5th Avenue and shoot somebody and I wouldn’t lose voters. quote from Trump.
Judge Denny Chin pressed him on how the crime would be handled while Trump remained in office. “Nothing could be done, that’s your position?” he said.
“That is correct,” Consovoy replied.
Just to be clear on the issues.
The democrats only hope is the wine mom vote.
Gutter talk
leaves in the eaves.
"Why does so much erotica aimed at men...” There is every kind of erotica aimed at men, a lot of it involving very strong women and vulnerable men.
I am just guessing here but I bet there is a lot less variety in porn aimed at women. Women are less susceptible to fetishes, though apparently they will suffer them in the men they love... in the world where porn is real life, anyway.
Does Givhan explore the habit of a certain power-awed segment of female Manhattanites to literally and figuratively throw themselves at wealthy men? Any exploration of the well documented premise that if you are a “star” women let you do just about anything? Does Matt Lauer comment? Is there any discussion of how Trump was able to get so many women to disrobe without a door-locking rape button like other NBC “stars” had in their offices?
with jfk its a contest whether he ticked off the spy chief ex-husband, of his second paramour, the one of the Chicago gangster, or the east german stasi that employed miss rometsch,
roesch/voltaire said...
Trump could rape a woman on Fifth Ave and his base wouldn’t care and his lawyers would claim, as they have already, the Tweeter is above the law.
Bill Clinton committed sexual harassment in the Oval Office (the "imbalance of power" between President, and whatever Monica was, makes any sexual contact between them automatic sexual harassment. See multiple lawsuits about CEOs & low level female staff), and Democrats fought like rabid wombats to keep him in the White House.
Clinton's VP publicly "found it credible" that Clinton had raped at least one woman. Yet the Left refused to impeach him, refused to punish him, and rewarded Hillary for covering for him.
You don't get to do moral outrage, Leftie, because you've conclusively proved you have no morals
lengthy investigation of Trump’s possible
The Orange Man Bad narratives reminded me of:
"RationalWiki write some hit pieces based on out of context quotes if not outright fabrications. Left-wing journalists (as most journalists are) parrot RationalWiki, as it certainly beats doing independent research. RationalWiki then quotes the resulting articles as a citable, authoritative source."
You are not saying that women let him grab them by their pussy!
That video was funny because, just after he made the "they let you" statement, Trump was introduced to a fairly attractive young woman and he was very polite 'n' proper, almost shy.
well literally, the Obama administration, targeted two American citizens for drone strikes, in awlaki and son, the first had certainly earned it, the second was too stupid to know not to follow his father's footsteps,
The issue with Hill that is so interesting is the double standard issue, in the era of me too, since she is female, and there are power issues that in the current era, are ethically challenging.
Same with the Ilhan Omar cheating on her husband, and probably lying about her Brother / husband.
Not to mention Bill Clinton's sex life, that compared to Trump is a Saint.
Plus the NBA Players that lecture Trump, yet their agents spend more time with illegitimate kids issues, than negotiating contract issues.
Not to mention how NBC covered up Matt Lauer's sex scandal. Charlie Rose, etc.
The Democratic allies seem to have a lot more interesting sex scandals, than the GOP side. The one recent exception was Mark Sandford.
This constant barrage of calumnious drivel from the idolators who kissed the feet of the rapist William Jefferson Clinton and Crooked Hillary who denigrated his victims to cover his lecherous ass.
Will the hypocritical bullshit never end? Although, in fairness, a number of Democrat icons have been sacrificed on the altar of helpless, hand-wringing feminism to lay the groundwork for attacking Trump.
Yeah, R/V should read the facts on Juanita Broaddrick as reported by Slate.
My favorite line was that she was lying because she was abused by her husband, according the the Clinton bimbo eruption squad. There is enough evidence there to lock him up for forcible rape, including the account of her friend saying, under threat of prison for lying, that she found Broaddrick bleeding and crying with torn clothes in the hotel room. She had five witnesses, all told. All of them went under oath.
"Are we in a new age of squeamishness? Or are we just pretending to be disgusted?"
Well, not new new. A newish age of strategic squeamishness and useful pretense, both to be dropped when progs take over.
For example, does any prog pretend to be disgusted with, say Ilhan "Omar"? Did any prog object to the possibility of returning Juanita Broaddrick's rapist to the White House in 2016?
Ann Althouse said...
"Yeah, I read this just after seeing the Guardian stuff on Katie Hill, talk about "Ew". The difference is there are photos of Katie Hill with her staffer. What woman wants their hair brushed by another with her exposed vagina at the back of your head? If someone has a picture of Trump doing that; then I'll believe the "Ew"."
...
There are other things about Hill, I believe, that deserve criticism. I haven't followed the story closely. (Should I?) But the activity you highlight is not disgusting (other than that a boss is getting sexual with an employee).
Go to the Daily Mirror, and look at the version of the photo that shows the aid's face. She is NOT enjoying the situation.
32 year old woman and her husband, neither of them in the least bit attractive, find a 22 year old girl, fresh out of college and unemployed. They offer to take care of her if she joins their threesome.
She does
The wife hires the girl as "campaign staff". They take her on trips and screw her a lot.
Wife wins election. Wife does NOT hire the girl to be Congressional staff (note: the reason why people are paid staff for campaigns is so they can get a job as paid staff when the candidate wins).Wife uses girl some more, then dumps her for a member of the Congressional staff.
Hill has admitted to all but the last of this
What part of this does NOT mark Hill as an evil user of others?
Ray - SoCal said...
The issue with Hill that is so interesting is the double standard issue, in the era of me too, since she is female, and there are power issues that in the current era, are ethically challenging.
Same with the Ilhan Omar cheating on her husband, and probably lying about her Brother / husband.
You left off the part where Ilhan Omar got her husband fired from his job with another Democrat politician. Presumably in an attempt to make him more dependent upon her salary, so he'd keep quiet about her cheating on him, and not try for a divorce.
But I guess abuse of poewr is ok, when you're a Democrat
Trump is subject to a lot more offerings and temptations than the normal middle class male. He may be an actual saint by scorekeeping rules.
What traditional saints were wealthy enough to attract groupies as a test.
What makes anybody want to read a compilation of all the scurrilous sexual material about Trump?
The point of the elites is to feel superior to those around you.
Part of being in the club is a continuous supply of evidence to maintain your delusions.
What kind of result of a "collision of generational, social and demographic storms" are you?
People who have no intention of being nice or getting along.
Like many in the Commentariat, we have Mothers and Sisters and Wives and Daughters, so we're not total Neanderthals on this issue.
If Trump were accused of rape or sexually assault during his Presidency, I would be very alarmed and concerned.
However, this flood of "claims" is mostly bullshit. For example, Here's Stormy Daniels, after all the hubhub, denying the affair. .
So, it sounds like a large compilation of allegations (not evidence) by the "Get Trump" Squad to do what they've been doing since Jan 20, 2017 -- Get Trump.
A further point: Bill Clinton committed adultery in the White House, with a cigar, paid $850,000 to settle a sexual harassment claim with Paula Jones, and was credibly accused of rape by Juanita Broaddrick.
Neither the media, nor his Democrat supporters, nor his wife, seemed to mind at all.
So, what pray tell is the standard that applies to both parties.
A fashion photographer calls Trump a "predator" because "He was always chasing models." The book says that in the presence of models, Trump "liked to paw their shoulders, cup their bottoms, grab at their breasts and plant sloppy kisses on them when they least expected it."
One person's opinion, and not necessarily unbiased. What we may be talking about here is "Bidenesquerie", or overly "hands-y" greetings. Maybe Trump wasn't randomly grabbing and groping models and beauty contestants "when they least expected," but was combining a hug and kiss with a little hands-y grope. What's acceptable in the fashion world can take on a sinister appearance when an outsider does it. I'm not convinced that Trump (or Biden) was just grabbing and groping whenever he felt like it. He may have been making the most of his greetings.
Givhan faults the book for collecting the stories but never analyzing why Trump is the way the stories, as told by the authors, make him look. What made him "a lecher"? Something about his childhood, his mother? Some "cultural forces"? "Was he created by some collision of generational, social and demographic storms? Is he a volatile result of a tectonic shift in gender roles?"
Is he really so different from other Wall Street guys and hustling entrepreneurs? When they're young, ogling models and going to strip clubs is part of the "Master of the Universe" persona that they aspire to. They don't actually own beauty pageants, so their opportunities are limited.
Remember the Clinton years and "The Death of Outrage"? Bill Clinton definitely moved the ball down the field, but now we really do have the death of outrage. Whatever you charge a politician on one side with doing, you can find a politician on the other side doing, so outrage is muted. It's not necessarily a bad thing. Respect for political figures can do more harm than disrespect, and crusades against perceived wrong-doing are so often politically motivated and end up going too far.
Robin Gihvan thinks Trump is icky—IMPEACH!
had Hillary won, would we be discussing "All the President’s Victims"?
Obituaries with a
"a 70-page appendix filled with truncated tales of Arkancidal behavior"
"Halloween is coming, and women will be able to wear their Handmaid's Tale costumes for real, if only for a day."
https://img.buzzfeed.com/buzzfeed-static/static/2018-09/20/16/asset/buzzfeed-prod-web-06/sub-buzz-1728-1537477160-1.png?downsize=700%3A%2A&output-quality=auto&output-format=auto
Who killed Seth Rich?
Just to be clear on the issues.
It annoys me when people say they are trying to be clear, but they have not even tried to make a cogent point. They just throw some unrelated words, quotes, gossip and pseudo-facts out there and claim to have made a decisive point.
I am guessing that clarity of thought is not your strength, r/v.
Remember, the lefties hate Pence just as much as Trump.
They called Romney, McCain, GW Bush, HW Bush AND Reagan "literal Hitlers".
No one us buying the lies anymore, not even the lefties launching the attacks.
Its all for show.
But only every single bit of it.
Blogger roesch/voltaire said...
I could stand in the middle of 5th Avenue and shoot somebody and I wouldn’t lose voters. quote from Trump.
Find the full quote. He talks about his campaign giving him the latest poll results from Iowa. Talked about the high loyalty numbers in the poll. They (his campaign/advisors) tell me I could shoot someone on 5th Avenue and not lose any votes.
I can't quote it because Google won't give me nothing but left-wing sources.
I saw it and heard it live.
that's why larry flynt hired dan moldea, the one who starr had helped out of a jam, with his book project to investigate rob Livingston and henry hyde, with hyde they went back 32 years before he was in congress,
The warlock trial progresses and liberalizes.
So, what pray tell is the standard that applies to both parties.
The Pro-Choice quasi-religion or "ethics", and political congruence (e.g. profit, leverage). Democrats form the bulk of the assembly, but there are overlapping and converging special and peculiar interests.
Trump "liked to paw their shoulders, cup their bottoms, grab at their breasts and plant sloppy kisses on them when they least expected it." How would your gestures of physical affection be described by your worst enemy? Every playful, tender move you make would be disgusting.
Let's imagine Trump playfully, tenderly cupping Althouse's bottom, grabbing at her breasts, and planting sloppy kisses on her lips.
Question for Althouse: Does that vision conjure disgust? If not, can you imagine how it might for women who don't have an Orange Crush?
Sometimes the muscles of the moral imagination need a little stretching before they work properly.
Trump is no moral paragon, but last I looked Bill Clinton is a respected elder statesman and Ted Kennedy revered as a great man. And she has nothing to say about them. And now we see more evidence that Biden, serial groper, has also committed financial corruption that would make Boss Tweed blush.
At least Trump's offenses were not made when he was as a powerful politician. So, Clinton and Kennedy and Biden are worse, in that regard.
Also, I don't recall Trump leaving a young woman to die while he talked to his lawyers.
So Givhan can sod off. And you know what I really mean by "sod."
Paw, cup, grab, plant — How would your gestures of physical affection be described by your worst enemy?
In all fairness, the President actually did say "grab them by the pussy" - 'twas his very own description.
Tho, a case could be made that he is his own worst enemy. And I also reckon there are those who would consider that to be a playful, tender move...so nevermind.
Why it's almost as if Bill Clinton never existed.
If Ms Givhan's suddenly delicate sensibilities are offended by reports of presidential sexual misconduct long before their term in office she "...better put some ice on that."
Would be nice if these "victims" came forward and provided a few witnesses and evidence.
Can we believe what the Fake Media told us without proofs? No.
ARM: "Expect to see more of these signs." (Our expectations for you were low, but HOLY FUCK!)
Referring to Democrat debates,am I right?
Trump said he could shoot someone on 5th Ave. and not lose any supporters the same way Sarah Palin said she can see Russia from her house.
As in, he didn't actually say that.
While it is true that the SNL skit got far more attention than what Palin actually said about being able to see Russia, the Trump quote came right out of his own mouth.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I'm sure she was shocked--shocked!--by Bill Clinton's reported trips to Epstein's "Fantasy Island."
By the way, Trump shtupping Karen MacDougal is probably the achievement of his I envy most.
Wow, the lefties on FB are really singing the blues. They are no longer satisfied by the sugar high of the latest "bombshell" bringing trump down now its moved on to "How can republicans in good conscience stick up for Trump!??" People who gladly supported Bill Clinton and Ted Kennedy really do not have the moral standing to question how someone can still support a politician after being exposed as a womanizer. I'm sorry, those days are past.
I hope this is pretend offense. I've read Howard Stern's collection of interviews, which has lots of Trump, and it's lively and funny, and everything that's said is said for a reason. I wouldn't call it "gutter talk."
Sometimes, Prof. Althouse, you amaze me. I live among the True Blue Liberal Tribe, and, sexual squeamishness is a vital part of the class pretensions of upper-middle class Liberal women. You must have seen this in the course of your professional life & life in Madison.
Let me give you a concrete example. One of my clients is an auto repair shop. I bring them & my other clients home-made candies for Christmas. On one such visit to the shop, the manager gave me a small "cheesecake" desktop calendar from an auto parts maker. We both laughed & I mentioned how, growing up in Bible-belt, conservative Protestant, northern Alabama, every auto shop had a cheesecake calendar. Here in suburban DC, none of them do. "Oh, Lord, we can't do that here! Our female customers from [a very liberal suburb of DC] would tear us a new one the instant they came in the door!".
The prissiness of liberal women is worse than Alabama church ladies of the 60s & 70s. The church ladies knew that 1) sexually, men are pigs & women aren't much better 2) all have sinned and fall short of the Glory of God & 3) they, too, had a lot of need to be forgiven. Liberal priggishness has no such inherent limits, and sees its virtue as absolute. They feel that if they continue to aggravate the shit out of the rest of us, one day we'll all just give in & do it their way. It seems to be working so far.
No, probably would not enjoy it. I don't enjoy the smell of tuna fish,
Interesting comment from a man who has been married a couple of times and was a playa back in med school. Ritmo had the same mis-informed opinion.
I have smelled far worse. I can still remember a D&C on a 250 pounder back in the days,
We need a better and more complete taxonomy of Trump Derangement Syndrome.
Hitler analogies.
Discomfort with Trump's sexuality.
Deep concern over Trump's misspellings.
Disbelief that a President would indulge in name calling.
Trump family nepotism.
Trump family wealth.
Furor at Trump racism.
I'm sure this is not well organized, and lacks many other aspects of TDS.
if it were true, but it's just Gloria alred's paid up criers, but that book came out two years ago, from nina Burleigh, who has written among other things about mary Pinchot meyer, the well bred wasp exwife of a spy master, and who reportedly was having an affair with jfk and furthermore was reputedly sharing lsd, who happened to be killed on a dc tow path two years after the assassination, and whose diary was confiscated by james angleton, and hidden by ben bradlee,
so you take reid Hoffman, who 'found' all these concerned Russian bots, the ones they used to flag tulsi as a Russian tool, around judge moore's campaign, well he was in partnership with Epstein on a tech venture,
tom wolfe called the press around the time of the right stuff 'the Victorian gent' but then they were genuinely interested in painting a positive image of the astronauts,
"...the Trump quote came right out of his own mouth."'=
Interesting, first time I have seen it. He actually says "THEY SAY I could..etc."
The comments on the vid are refreshing. Imaginative, witty, thought provoking creative, yet somehow familiar .
“I'd bet money that there was no other President who discussed weighty affairs of state whilst getting a blow job in the Oval Office. Well, maybe JFK, but no others.”
I’d bet on LBJ and FDR for starters.
"... the many allegations that depict Trump’s relationships with women as vulgar, misogynistic, demeaning, sometimes violent and always puerile. "
Has any President so thoroughly promoted women in his organizations, both political and business? Seems to me he has a healthy heterosexual drive as well as a healthy respect for women. Some people can't imagine both those things in the same man, becuase they have a warped view of men in general, and especially ones they don't agree with.
I have a question for the Trump haters: Is there anything about the man that you can respect, or admire, anything at all? I bet there would be a lot if you didn't know the identity of the person with his characteristics and accomplishments. If you were told he was a Democrat, or even a Communist dictator, I bet you would find lots to admire.
"“I'd bet money that there was no other President who discussed weighty affairs of state whilst getting a blow job in the Oval Office."
If not for Trump winning, we might have ended up having two Clintons with that accomplishment.
Mary Jo Kopechne was not available for comment.
purplepenquin said...
Trump said he could shoot someone on 5th Ave. and not lose any supporters the same way Sarah Palin said she can see Russia from her house.
As in, he didn't actually say that.
While it is true that the SNL skit got far more attention than what Palin actually said about being able to see Russia, the Trump quote came right out of his own mouth.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
That is not what he said.
You all know you are all lying sacks of shit.
You cannot deal with the truth and you just make up whatever you need.
The loving looks from Melania confirm Givhins disgust. QED
Howard is threatened and emasculated by supermodels beauty.
Trump never has been.
And now Trump is destoying the democratics over and over again while delivering the best economic performance in 3 generations.
That kind of performance and power drives women to distraction.
Howard has never driven women to distraction so he misreads the cues.
Unexpectedly.
Howard, your time could be more profitably spent googling definitions of common terms.
Hot chicks do not dig illiterates.
Btw, is it really true the treasonous marxist pro-muslim brotherhood moron Brennan hasnt tweeted at all for about 7+ days now?
LOLOLOLOL
I believe somebody's lawyer told a certain treasonous commie to shut his pie hole and stop digging his hole deeper.
Come on Johnny boy!! Tell us more about your "patriotic" attempt to overturn an American election!!
I half expect Brennan or one of his minions to tell us the following: when you are a powerful and corrupt lefty the DOJ/FBI let you grab the constitution by the genitals...a la Smirky Strzok and 302 "re-imaginer" Lisa Page!
Blogger Drago said...
Howard is threatened and emasculated by supermodels beauty.
You know? I kind of agree. Howard slips these little snarky comments but I think he is a cuck at heart, Maybe an NPC
I avoid the Washington Post and the NYT. If they can't find it in themselves to treat our current First Lady with respect, I will not spend a second caring what they have to write on any subject.
Well well well!!!
Super "Patriot" (LOL) Li'l Andy McCabe just dropped his lawsuit against the DOJ for canning his little treasonous butt!!
LOLOLOLOL
Durham and Barr investigate the origins of the dems/lefty's/LLR's treasonous hoax russia collusion lies and voila!!
Durham moves into criminal investigation mode and massively expands the scope of his effort and ramps up staffing, then...
The CIA (and commie secret muslim Brennan) and the corrupt FBI'ers turn on each other bigly, then...
Clapper the lying moron throws obambi under the bus, then...
We find out Lisa Page doctored the 302's which were used to frame Flynn, then...
We find out that Horowitz' report on democrat Stasi-like abuse of the FISA process and courts is about to drop, then...
We hear Durham is going to yank the a**-holish Brennan and Clapper in for a little under oath, on the record "chat", then...
Mr commie ex-CIA director and traitor hack Brennan goes radio silent on twitter, then...
Treasonous hack McCabe drops his lawsuit against the DOJ/FBI for unlawful dismissal....
....and so very much more!!
Have a great weekend dems/lefties/LLR's!!
Have a fantastical and marvelous Trump-delivered amazing economy weekend!!
No one deserves that more than each and every one of you.
Goose and doc hardest triggered
Blogger Howard said...
Goose and doc hardest triggered
Howard, you had better delete those emails from Strzok and Page before Barr comes knocking on your door. I know they are just links to porno sites but it would look bad,
Funny how you can't find Drudge mentioning anything about McCabe's lawsuit being dropped or how the DOJ has not turned this into a criminal investigation. I wonder what his traffic has been like since he turned full MSNBC?
I betcha this stupid woman didn't read a THING about Clinton's encounters with women (or Hillary's, for that matter).
"You wouldn't read it for sexual titillation, because Trump doesn't interest anyone as a fantasy sexual partner, does he?"
This kind of aversion to Donald Trump and to him as a sex partner is unsophisticated and unmodern to me.
All the President’s Women: Donald Trump and the Making of a Predator
That sounds like defining "predator" downward for political reasons - the sort of thing that lets real predators like Harvey Weinstein off the hook. I wouldn't say Biden was a sexual abuser or a pedophile because he liked touching people (of all ages and genders), and wouldn't say that Trump was a predator because he got hands-y and Bidenesque sometimes in his greeting women.
I suspect that something like half the presidents elected since I was born have used language like that on the Access Hollywood recording, and some of them may actually have done the things Trump mentions on the tape (which there is no evidence of him actually doing): Kennedy, Johnson, Clinton, and at least one Bush (Nixon may have talked that way, but I'm pretty sure he didn't do anything like that).
I can see that Trump hasn't been a model of chivalry, but the outrage - if it actually is outrage - about him is selective.
"tom wolfe called the press around the time of the right stuff 'the Victorian gent' but then they were genuinely interested in painting a positive image of the astronauts..."
Actually in The Right Stuff Wolfe called the press "The ultimate hypocritical Victorian gent"--always trying to evoke the "right" response, the correct feeling (in this case reverence for the astronauts), in their readers, while being complete cynics themselves.
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