I’m quoting “Washington at war: Dems aim for speedy impeachment push as Trump threatens whistleblower” (CNN).
I see everything needs to be fast, fast, fast for this to work. If another week passes without the whole country getting the cue to go “frenetic,” maybe the Ukraine phone call will fade away like 100 other impeachable offenses attributed to Trump. I’m put off by the pressure for speed. All the time we devote to electing a President and all the work lavished thus far into the next election, and we’re supposed to suddenly stop everything and throw this bum out? Quick! Don’t think! That makes me want to slow down and think quite a bit.
And I’m amused by the war metaphor, “Washington at war,” because I was just reading a diatribe in The Washington Post against Trump for quoting some preacher who used the words “civil war” to describe the impending discord over the impeachment. Real war is truly horrible, so what an outrage to use war as a metaphor! And then CNN tosses off the war metaphor completely casually... but in service to getting Trump impeached. Like it’s a one-way metaphor. You can use “war” to fight him, but he can’t say “war” to defend himself.
Trump is going to fight, and Democrats aren’t going to get their wish for a quick one-sided war.
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kangaroo court at full speed. It is all they have.
War metaphors - more "civility bullshit."
It's so important to the nation Congress couldn't cancel their Fall vacation...er...trip home to be with their constituents. Fast, but not that fast...
I observed Joe Biden bragging about committing extortion and bribery. Really. I saw this with my own lying eyes.
This is the issue at hand.
I'm 70 years old, and I'm not resorting to hyperbole when I say that the Democratic Party's media attempt to bury Biden's corruption in this avalanche of hysteria is the wildest episode of crazy lying I've ever witnessed.
Crazier even than the Kavanaugh hearings.
Theres nothing in that entire byline that relates to the truth.
Orville Redenbacher, call your office.
If we take our time the reasons for it fall apart.
Go big or go home. It's what dominators do, then the Trumpists will cry fowl.
With extra pouches, no examination of compass aud atkinson burismas shadowy ties to covert ops to the clintons, nor devon archer and the bulger whelp
The Democrats have become a giant joke. Anybody who doesn't see what they are up to, is either REALLY Naïve, or just plain dumbed down....just like they want their voters to be. I am still getting over that we can't say the words Illegal Alien in NYC or we get fined. I, myself got banned from FB for saying White Trash. 37 days in total. You can't shut us up, or stop us....WE are on to you Democrats!!! It is NOT going to end pretty.
It's like how Sarah Palin was demonized for using a target metaphor, but the media use that analogy all the time.
I think they realize that they are going to lose the impeachment process, and very likely lose the 2020 presidential election. This is aimed at draining White House time and resources, to limit the successes of the President (and by association the Republicans) in areas that will make inroads into the Demo political domination of minority votes. Because if they lose that, they lose everything.
they needed a fast start, so that they could take a 2 week recess.
It's the strategy that the Hare used. Fast off the line, then comfortable nap, meanwhile Tortoise Trump...
It's clear that the end game even before the inauguration was to impeach Trump on whatever pretext they could find, using the brute power of the Democrat establishment, the swamp, the establishment media, the never Trumpers, and willing foreign governments.
Would have worked too. Except that Trump fought back. And continues to do so.
Magnificent bastard.
Politics are about compromises.
War is about overpowering; no compromises.
I think Pelosi's "impeachment inquiry" is more about about the Democrat House "leadership" maneuvering to retain control of their caucus than actually moving on impeachment impeachment, so, no, I don't think it is going to move as fast as the media hope (hype?).
"I’m put off by the pressure for speed"
Rather than by the utter arrogance of the outrageous attack on the president?
"so what an outrage to use war as a metaphor!"
Ah, yes, we should have known: the words are the outrage. It's terrible! It's so sad! Why do they do that?
Anyway, Althouse, are you still neutral?
I still don’t understand the strategic thinking here. I could see some value for the Dems if they slow-walked this through the “inquiry” phase where people testify before Congress, etc., all to make Trump look bad going into the election. Why rush it? Once you impeach, you hand the keys over to the Senate GOP. Do you really think they’ll just do what will help the Dems?
I’m disgusted at how this process is being used and abused for political advantage, to influence the election, all because of a non-story that’s being totally twisted and blown out of proportion. I hope this blows up in the Dems’ face.
The Mueller investigation dragged on and on. Maybe the Dems decided that's why it didn't work, the rubes lost interest and wandered away.
Sounds like something PR and campaign people would conclude. Is that who's in charge of impeachment?
If it were done when 'tis done, then 'twere well It were done quickly.
And we know how that worked out for the MacBeths.
The House Democrats will try to use Nancy Pelosi's "impeachment inquiry" to demands tax returns, grand-jury testimony, White House documents and so forth and so on.
The demands will be refused with the argument that the entire House has not voted on the "impeachment inquiry" -- Nancy Pelosi alone has declared it.
When that dispute gets into the courts, this "impeachment inquiry" will drag out for many months. The dispute will have to go all the way up to the Supreme Court.
Donald J. Trump
Verified account @realDonaldTrump
....If the Democrats are successful in removing the President from office (which they will never be), it will cause a Civil War like fracture in this Nation from which our Country will never heal.” Pastor Robert Jeffress, @FoxNews
Lord of the Drama Queens
The best investigations are always done really, really fast.
That’s why the Mueller investigation took 2 years... wait, what?
Anyways i am pilgrim happens with a grisly murder on the lower east side of new york on what turns out to the most brutal day in thaf part of the world, it attracks the attention of a sherlock like retired operative
Only reason I can think of for the speed is that Dems have received word that indictments will be coming out of the DOJ’s various investigations into what government officials did in the 2016 election. Impeaching the President sucks some of the power from that. It attacks the legitimacy of anything he does and the DOJ acts in his name. So the indictments and the investigations will be brushed off as partisan hit jobs to help Trump’s re-election.
> everything needs to be fast, fast, fast for this to work.
Worked for the ACA, but that didn't need to be as fast.
Nothing says ‘fast start’ like an immediate two week House recess.
Trump needs to keep showing the transcript and Joe Biden's video confession--which he must have done because he believed he didn't do anything illegal.
It is amazing to me. I hear local Democrat politicians mouthing that we need more civility in our town council, implying that their Republican brethren are uncivil; but even locally it’s the Democrats that do underhanded things and get in trouble for tweeting obscenities at the President of the United States. And these national shenanigans don’t help to make their case.
Somebody needs to explain to the Post what “don’t start nuthin’, won’t be nuthin’ “ means.
In 1861 the Southerners thought the war they were so eager to lstart would be short, nearly bloodless, and victorious. Four years later Atlanta, Richmond, and Columbia, SC, had been burned to the ground and 240,000 of their young men were dead. The Democrats of today remind me of those Southerners of 1861.
Let's say President Trump is quickly impeached and convicted before the year is out. Is there any prohibition to his rerunning for president again in 2020?
Theres the backstory of the agent, and how he would come to discover the larger import of the crime, the organization he works for is called the division, hes trained as a doctor, hence the sherlock reference.
How much are they going to get done in the next two weeks when they're slumming in some resort on someone else's dime?
Now the protagonist has to have a worthy foe and i think pilgrim delivers, his plan is diabolical but his origin story explains his motivation
The same people who want this rush to judgment want to destroy the other constitutional mechanisms that resist mob enthusiasm: the electoral college and the Supreme Court. They are the same ones who called for Kavanaugh's impeachment, harried Nick Sandman, retweeted Jussie Smollett.
They got a bluff hand like le chiffre,
Few wars are quick (Hitler's blitzkrieg against Poland being an exception). A better metaphor here would be the Ox-Bow Incident.
Sebastian said...
"I’m put off by the pressure for speed"
Rather than by the utter arrogance of the outrageous attack on the president?
If they follow the usual established process, you can grant that they may, just possibly, have good intentions. The rush job takes away any possibility of good faith on their part.
"cry fowl." Howard? Sounds like something Biden would print.
What else they got seriously,
Twelve trimesters and in progress. What else are Democrats hiding that requires an accelerated judgment. Cancellation or abortion culture is in principle and practice a bigoted affair.
Trump needs to keep showing the transcript and Joe Biden's video confession--which he must have done because he believed he didn't do anything illegal.
Today's Reminder
Pelosi and House Dems did re-write House rules to make it possible to have an impeachment "hearing" and vote without any input from the Republicans. This should trouble even the most vehement Trump opponents.
God the news is awful....confirming and tracking what was actually said and by who has become an enormous time drain on me. Take Ann's post alone.
The media, and Ann repeating it, said Trump quoted a preacher used the words "Civil war"....
But not really, the actual quote was, "If the Democrats are successful in removing the President from office (which they will never be), it will cause a Civil War like fracture in this Nation from which our Country will never heal.” Pastor Robert Jeffress"
Civil-War-Like-Fracture - that's the phrase
A Civil-War-Like-Fracture could be about the division within the country in the decades leading up to the actual Civil War. It's not about the war itself; it's about a mindset. A difference of opinion. An inseparable divide in the minds of the members of this nation.
Is that an unfair assessment?
Words matter.
Another example is how the media is using the following phrasing, "Trump asked Ukraine President for Favor to investigator Vice President." This phrasing and variations of it are now repeated ad nauseum as fact.
Trump asked for a favor as follows: " I would like you to do us a favor though because our country has been through a lot and Ukraine knows a lot about it. I would like you to find out what happened with this whole situation with Ukraine, they say Crowdstrike... I guess you have one of your wealthy people... The server, they say Ukraine has it. There are a lot of things that went on, the whole situation. I think you're surrounding yourself with some of the same people. I would like to have the Attorney General call you or your people and I would like you to get to the bottom of it. As you saw yesterday, that whole nonsense ended with a very poor performance by a man named Robert Mueller, an incompetent performance, but they say a lot of it started with Ukraine. "
About 100 words later - after an interspersed commented by the Ukrainian President in the transcript the President said, "The other thing, There's a lot of talk about Biden's son, that Biden stopped the prosecution and a lot of people want to find out about that so whatever you can do with the Attorney General would be great. Biden went around bragging that he stopped the prosecution so if you can look into it... It sounds horrible to me."
Is that asking asking for a favor in relation to Biden? Does it start with biden's son and then talk about the specific thing biden did?
It's certainly asking the Ukrainian President to check into whether Biden stopped prosecution of his son. Is that asking him to investigate Biden? is it asking for "a favor" in the context of this?
Words matter and in the news - and repeated often - words are becoming looser and looser.
We're talking Copperheads here. And CNN stands for Copperhead News Network.
I didn't know that dig faster was one of the rules of holes.
It looks like Shiff is attached to some of the Ukraine corruption now. I'm guessing he's not the only one.
War metaphors necessitate adopt military culture : HURRY UP and wait
I see everything needs to be fast, fast, fast for this to work. If another week passes without the whole country getting the cue to go “frenetic,” maybe the Ukraine phone call will fade away like 100 other impeachable offenses attributed to Trump.
It’s worked so well for them on gun control.
The Democrats of today remind me of those Southerners of 1861.
The Democrats of today remind me of those Democrats of 1861.
It has to be quick or it won't matter. Senators can say "I think he's guilty but the correct process is for the people to vote him out in 9 short months", etc. They are saying Thanksgiving. I think that's probably accurate. If it doesn't happen by then, it won't.
Impeachment was supposed to have happened this summer. But they tried to spike the football with Mueller testifying and he bombed. So they had to attempt a hail mary pass with a Whistle-blower. Now they are going to try a trick play by getting the whistle-blower testimony without being cross-examined.
The DNC has worked their base into such a frenzy over impeachment that they can't go back to the primary voters without having attempted it. There are AOC clones lurking in every "safe" Dem district. Can't have the impeachment issue on their left flank.
I really think some hope that Trump will resign. Beto made the argument. Unfortunately for them, Trump doesn't care. This is his swan song. He's not going to go back to real estate or write a memoir. All-in.
This pack of imbeciles couldn't keep a one-legged drunk off balance, much less Trump.
Hillary would be successful at killing a whistle blower.
*Seth Rich*
Trump would never do such a thing. The left know it. So what does the MSM-DNC do ? - they lie about threats to the sacred Mueller Whistle-blower.
“No, no!" said the Queen. "Sentence first–verdict afterward."
60 Minutes claimed the Whistleblower was under Federal protection because of threats to his life. His lawyer denies this claim.
Hysteria Media.
I dont want to give too much of the story, hayes did an incredible amount of research for this novel.
Unlike Althouse, I am actually perfectly willing to say that impeaching Trump is a bad idea. It is bad for the country and, I think, bad for the Dems.
Also unlike Althouse, I am perfectly willing to acknowledge that Trump is completely unsuited to be leader of the free world, leader of the US, or even branch manager at the local 7-11. He is now too old and stupid for the job, and he has some of the deepest personality problems that I have ever seen in a leader.
There have been only bad options since Trump and Clinton gained the nomination of their respective parties. Impeachment doesn't really improve the situation. We need better leadership.
Speed can work both ways. The Senate has the sole power to try an impeachment, but no obligation to conduct a trial. The Senate also sets its own rules, including the rules for conducting a trial there is one.
How about this? The Chief Justice convenes the Senate, the Senators take the oath, and each article of impeachment is read aloud and voted on immediately. No evidence taken either way and no debate. There won't be a two thirds majority on any article, so the President is declared not guilty, or whatever the proper term is.
There will be complaints from the Dems that it is a mere show of a trial and therefore illegitimate. So were the impeachment proceeding in the House. The trial procedure is a good way to show contempt for this impeachment nonsense.
It dawned on me last night that Democrats don't want to beat Trump in 2020. After all, you don't defeat Hitler at the ballot box. You don't vanquish Darth Vader with a campaign ad. Democrats (and the media and NeverTrump Republicans) correctly see Trump as an attack on their legitimacy as Very Important People. Trump's election is proof they are not as smart or successful or good as they think they are. The wound to their ego can't just be healed. It has to be undone.
Mike
It’s a good point, Althouse. Given the rate of outrage-churn that social media demands, is it even possible to maintain focus on a process like impeachment? For the frozen chosen, sure. For everybody else, it becomes static from yesterday.
Lord of the Drama Queens
Says the scene shifter of the party of drama.
Speed can work both ways. The Senate has the sole power to try an impeachment, but no obligation to conduct a trial. The Senate also sets its own rules, including the rules for conducting a trial there is one.
How about this? The Chief Justice convenes the Senate, the Senators take the oath, and each article of impeachment is read aloud and voted on immediately. No evidence taken either way and no debate. There won't be a two thirds majority on any article, so the President is declared not guilty, or whatever the proper term is.
There will be complaints from the Dems that it is a mere show of a trial and therefore illegitimate. So were the impeachment proceeding in the House. The trial procedure is a good way to show contempt for this impeachment nonsense.
The word that stuck-out to me was "engineer a fast start to their impeachment efforts..."
Off balance seems to be Trump’s wheelhouse. So much so he never seems to be off balance.
Our Beloved Professor Althouse said ...
You can use “war” to fight him, but he can’t say “war” to defend himself.
Not just that! Anti Trumpers can say that Trump
A) Committed TREASON for beating Hillary Clinton
B) NEEDS to be EXECUTED for that Treason
Anti Trumpers can
A) hold up Bloody Heads, saying KILL THE BASTARD!
B) complain when their ticket sales drop
The Dems were concerned that Trump would win the election. Al Greene said so. "I'm concerned that if we don't impeach the president, he will get re-elected," https://www.foxnews.com/media/al-green-trump-impeachment-public-turn-on-democrats
And so they brought forward a hearsay accusation by an anonymous person.
The House leadership then agreed to an "impeachment inquiry" that did not require a vote.
America's Got Impeachment is to be a six ring circus, complete with trained seals barking in unison, clowns, and the tiniest intellects in the world playing to canned applause. Not a committee engaging in reasoned deliberations, but six committees fighting for a spot on the nightly news. No Republicans need apply.
And this Circus Maximus has a high wire act - for the most likely outcome is that it will be a badge of honor throughout history to have been attacked by The Disgraceful Congress, that people will see the whole mess as what it is: RussiaLite at warp speed trying to cancel another election.
Survival Prep: Picture Nastyface Greta calling you names and controlling Congress and the media in order to reverse one American election and prevent another. Do this ten times to become accustomed to The Disgraceful Congress. Avoid drinking games involving how many times a given lie will be repeated. Prepare a list of needed jobs to do to work off anger - with this simple trick your house and lawn will shine like diamonds in six weeks. Finally, watch Sunset Boulevard - Hillary is coming again
Jersey Fled: "It's clear that the end game even before the inauguration was to impeach Trump on whatever pretext they could find,...."
Wrong.
It's clear that the end game even before the inauguration was to impeach Trump on on obstruction charges that the dems and media manufactured.
And now with the "whistleblower" rules changes that allow hearsay and double hearsay and triple hearsay and obama moving hundreds of partisan dems into key agencies just prior to departing office combined with Pelosi's changes to impeachment rules to preclude any republican input (Note: All of these things done before Trump took office or right at the time of Trump assuming office) all exposed its clear manufactured obstruction was the preferred route for the dems.
Once Mueller and his team of hacks failed this was Plan B.
Expect wave after wave of hearsay based BS "whistleblower" complaints followed by thousands of congressional subpeonas which completely infringe on executive privilege which will not be given over by Trump which will constiturte the bulk of "obstruction" items populating the dems sham impeachment articles.
"Like it’s a one-way....".
.... everything.
All the headlines in the MSM this morning say that 'the whistleblower's safety is a concern'. The CNN article is not just intentionally misleading but libelous. The MSM has really gone totally off the rails now. They're all in for impeachment and hope to convince the public. Sad. Not just sad but disgusting.
Blogger CWJ said...
Let's say President Trump is quickly impeached and convicted before the year is out. Is there any prohibition to his rerunning for president again in 2020?
35 years old - Check
14 years living in US -Check
Natural Borne US citizen - Check
Nope. No Constitutional restrictions at all.
John Henry
Blogger TreeJoe said...
But not really, the actual quote was, "If the Democrats are successful in removing the President from office (which they will never be), it will cause a Civil War like fracture in this Nation from which our Country will never heal.” Pastor Robert Jeffress"
Civil-War-Like-Fracture - that's the phrase
Thank you TreeJoe. I thought I was the only one to notice.
Several places claim that PDJT is actually calling for a civil war by retweeting Jeffress.
Red Headline at Drudge all morning "TRUMP TWEETS CIVIL WAR WARNING" which is a lie on at least 2 levels: He did not Tweet it, he retweeted it and, as you note, it is not a civil war warning, it is a warning about a fracture like a civil war. Big difference.
The Drudge link goes to a Hill story with the headline
"GOP lawmaker blasts Trump for quoting pastor warning of civil war over impeachment"
Republican Rep. Adam Kinzinger (Ill.) on Sunday criticized President Trump for quoting a pastor saying impeachment could trigger a "Civil War-like fracture" in the country.
"I have visited nations ravaged by civil war," Kinzinger tweeted.
"I have never imagined such a quote to be repeated by a President. This is beyond repugnant."
https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/463592-gop-lawmaker-calls-out-trump-for-quoting-pastor-warning-of-civil-war
Again, fake news.
John Henry
Blogger pacwest said...
It looks like Shiff is attached to some of the Ukraine corruption now. I'm guessing he's not the only one.
That was yesterday. He still is connected to a corrupt Ukrainian arms dealer but now Nancy Pelosi is getting into the act. She is also connected. Picture and story here:
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2019/09/breaking-update-speaker-pelosi-and-adam-schiff-connected-to-prominent-ukrainian-arms-dealer-photos/
John Henry
In the two weeks the Dems are doing depositions so they can draft the articles of impeachment.
Then have hearings, with the Pelosi rule change, with no republican involvement.
Then the house vote.
See conservative treehouse for details.
My guess is the Democrats think impeachment by the house will make Trump unelectable.
It worked on Nixon!
What sort of president would retweet anything with the words Civil War in it as it describes a future after Trump removal. Does Trump want a civil war? Reminds me of the threats from his henchman, Roger Stone, during the election when he thought he’d get cheated out of some delegates. Didn’t he mention blood in the streets?
Giuliani is the problem here. The Dems should have investigated Giuliani before impeachment. Stone cold loser.
Mike Sylwester said...
The House Democrats will try to use Nancy Pelosi's "impeachment inquiry" to demands tax returns, grand-jury testimony, White House documents and so forth and so on.
The demands will be refused with the argument that the entire House has not voted on the "impeachment inquiry" -- Nancy Pelosi alone has declared it
That may b the plan.
The refusals to provide documents will become another article of impeachment.
The bonus feature is that the GOP get no input into the process because there has been no vote on a formal process
Real war is a distinct possibility, but it won't be caused by Trump.
In spirit at least you already have a "true war".
Your political sides hate and fear each other, indeed the important people (those who really do make war) hate the other people openly.
A depressing thought at midnight. Over here the powerful have a very powerful sense of noblesse oblige re the majority, the poor, however much they do not serve their interests. They understand their own hypocrisy.
Over there, it is open contempt, and fear.
We *are* at war and anyone who doesn't recognize that hasn't been paying attention. What Hagar said above. This is new in the last few years. When one side will do *absolutely anything* to accomplish its goal, without compromise, that is war. Whether the other side responds commensurately or not. When the other side does, it gets particularly ugly but that is just a matter of degree (McClelland/Sherman). The Republicans remain too decorous and/or stupid to respond in kind to the egregiously unrestrained bellicose assaults of the Democrats - even with the Repubs' great warrior at the helm.
World War II began for the Americans when the first Aichi bomber left the flight deck of the Akagai on Dec. 7 - not when that attack was responded to on Dec. 8. And yes, I know that no one is shooting now - much. Mercifully, it is a cold war we are in now - but don't tell me it is not war.
Fast, fast, fast..... Well, they are now on a 3 week recess.
It needs to be fast, so no one actually scrutinizes the impeachment causation. The second need for speed is to deliver an anchor to his reelection campaign by tying him up in a Senate trial, which they will slow down from day 1.
Remind of the technical charges against Trump. I can't seem to find them anywhere.
Big Mike said...
Somebody needs to explain to the Post what “don’t start nuthin’, won’t be nuthin’ “ means.
In 1861 the Southern Democrats thought the war they were so eager to start would be short, nearly bloodless, and victorious. Four years later Atlanta, Richmond, and Columbia, SC, had been burned to the ground and 240,000 of their young men were dead. The Democrats of today remind me of those Southern Democrats of 1861.
Fixed it
“The House Democrats will try to use Nancy Pelosi's "impeachment inquiry" to demands tax returns, grand-jury testimony, White House documents and so forth and so on. “
“The demands will be refused with the argument that the entire House has not voted on the "impeachment inquiry" -- Nancy Pelosi alone has declared it.”
“When that dispute gets into the courts, this "impeachment inquiry" will drag out for many months. The dispute will have to go all the way up to the Supreme Court.”
I think the fact that ‘this was done without a House vote, but rather by Palsi and a handful of henchmen/chairmen, behind closed doors, and eprives both the minority and the President of any participation, will ultimately be sufficient to distinguish this fro the Nixon case. Trump will assert Executive Privilege over pretty much anything the Dems want, and I do not think that the courts will ultimately force hi to give up what they want. It helps that Trump has had a large number of judges confirmed, as well as the Republicans (currently) holding a 5-4 majority in the Supreme Court.
One big problem with the Dem strategy here is that if it is accepted by the courts, it will become the norm, with the majority impeaching Presidents of the opposing party with some regularity. This slippery slope is one reason I believe that the courts will accept this Dem stratagem.
Somehow you are forgetting the quid pro quo: after Ukraine president thanks US for aid, which Trump had blocked, Trump asks for a favor. So he's asking for help in his campaign from a foreign governor, and compromising US foreign policy to get it.
The aid was unfrozen weeks later, 2 days after the whistle blower report became known.
How exactly can you ignore this? Oh yea: Hillary.
Why rush it? Once you impeach, you hand the keys over to the Senate GOP.
The quicker it is, the less time for junior senator Mitt Romney to get his head out of his ass, and others like him, and see what is actually going on here.
So a request by Trump to “meet [his] accuser face-to-face” is, according to the mediaswine at CNN, “a threat.”
Small wonder in an era when cowardly intelligence officers break the law and betray their country to peddle confidential information anonymously to further the DNC/leftmedia political goals. It certainly won’t do to expect that a real person take responsibility for the calumny being shoveled on Trump. Or worse, perhaps the “threat” is that it will be discovered that it is not a “person” blowing the whistle, but a partisan combine.
Blogger Howard said...
Go big or go home. It's what dominators do, then the Trumpists will cry fowl.
9/30/19, 7:19 AM
------
Duck! Turkey! Guinea Hen!....
Oh, it's war alright. Think "Battle of the Bulge" or maybe Divine Wind.
"The Democrats of today remind me of those Southerners of 1861."
They too, were Democrats.
Dems are in a hurry because this is a preemptive strike as is Pelosi’s gratuitous attack on Bill Barr. IG reports, DOJ investigations, investigation of Biden by Ukraine all pose real threats to the immediate future of prominent Democrats who want to be able to bray, “Retaliation.”
Anyone who is not reliant on leftmediaswine for information knows that at least Hillary, Clapper, McCabe, Rice, Biden and maybe the Big O are likely candidates for indictment. Granted, it would be a surprise in the swamp that is DC, but Barr is capable of surprising.
If another week passes without the whole country getting the cue to go “frenetic,” maybe the Ukraine phone call will fade away like 100 other impeachable offenses attributed to Trump.
I like this subtle sarcastic slap by Althouse --"..like 100 other impeachable offenses.."
The "Get Trump" Squad has been trying to impeach Trump since Jan 20, 2017. They never accepted the 2016 electoral results. Indeed, they rigged it for Hillary and still botched it! Heh.
h: "Pelosi and House Dems did re-write House rules to make it possible to have an impeachment "hearing" and vote without any input from the Republicans. This should trouble even the most vehement Trump opponents."
Are you insane?
This is the type of thing the left loves the most. Setting up incredibly biased and unfair conditions to attack their political opponents is precisely what the leftists want, and have always wanted, anywhere in the world the left gains power.
Abuse of power IS the name of the game to the left.
Off topic, but the girl that accused the boys at the Christian school of cutting her hair has now admitted the story is false.
I doubt they'll ever actually vote out articles of impeachment. They'll use the hearings to try and subpoena anything and everything under the sun, making it clear that this is just another Russiagate. This time, though, it's going to cost Biden, and Hunter Biden, and other democrats real capital - both political and financial.
I still think, in the end, the Democrats will balk at actually impeaching Trump. I write this because the evidence just isn't there for doing so, and I think people like Pelosi do see this, but can't say so openly. However, for purposes of my comment, I will assume the Democrats do impeach before Thanksgiving. So, what will the trial in the Senate look like?
I think the Senate might well just issue a preemptive "Not Guilty" and not even hold a trial. The Democrats will howl to the Moon, but it would a fitting action given the absolutely ridiculous grounds for impeaching in the first place- give the impeachment the respect it deserves- none. However, a quick judgment might not be what Trump wants- he may well savor the once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to get some people under oath and in the most public testimony ever seen in the US.
In any case, I predict the trial would be over by Christmas- it is to no Republican's benefit to drag this out more than a month after Articles of Impeachment are passed by the House.
I think a lot of what motivated the whistleblower and his co-conspirators was the desire to preempt and deflect the possible indictments that Mr. Durham is hopefully preparing with regard to the CIA's spying on the Trump campaign. I include in the term "spying" any arrangements the CIA made to have friendly foreign intelligence agencies task informants onto the Trump campaign. I assume that the CIA did just that and wants to protect its relationship with those foreign agencies, which is why it is resisting so ferociously any declassification of that information.
"Real war" is a distinct possibility. If it happens it will be because the Democrats have pushed the people too far.
The left has been itching for war for quite some time. And now they're upset at the rest of us for pointing it out?
Somehow you are forgetting the quid pro quo: after Ukraine president thanks US for aid, which Trump had blocked, Trump asks for a favor. So he's asking for help in his campaign from a foreign governor, and compromising US foreign policy to get it. - jim
Change your name, please. It's embarrassing to be associated with such stupidity.
On reason to still tune in the Sunday shows...
Hugh Hewitt says Schiff lost all credibility based on what he said on Meet the Press
I didn't watch MTP but based on the clip it looked like all the panelists were going to start laughing hysterically.
“Abuse of power IS the name of the game to the left.”
And the base doesn’t care. My oldest son and wife are Democrat activists in Portland. They simply ignore any negative input about Democrats that doesn’t come from the leftmedia which, of course, never offers negative input about Dems.
The trick is to forward the narrative while avoiding the discomfort of cognitive dissonance.
rehajm said...
If we take our time the reasons for it fall apart.
9/30/19, 7:18 AM
Winner. Especially for making the point with brevity.
Trump gets in trouble because he reads debunked conspiracy theories about Ukraine working with the dems in 2016, and believes them. You guys only have yourself to blame.
I just saw a headline that says Trump's Civil War tweet is grounds for impeachment.
These people are crazy.
“Real war is a distinct possibility”. Chill before you start shooting the parents of your kids’ friends.
Dems, Republicans, intelligence and the press should have all agreed some months ago to comprehensively fuck over Giuliani, in the national interest.
Judgment in Cases of Impeachment shall not extend further than to removal from Office, and disqualification to hold and enjoy any Office of honor, Trust or Profit ...
__________________
There is Seth Barrett Tillman on whether Presidency is Office
https://conlaw.jotwell.com/constitutional-officers-a-very-close-reading/
Jim: "Somehow you are forgetting the quid pro quo: after Ukraine president thanks US for aid, which Trump had blocked, Trump asks for a favor. So he's asking for help in his campaign from a foreign governor, and compromising US foreign policy to get it.
The aid was unfrozen weeks later, 2 days after the whistle blower report became known.
How exactly can you ignore this?"
Easy - To have a quid pro quo you have to have quid - an offer of something that is being withheld in order to elicit a favor. At the time of the infamous call with Ukraine, the aid (as far as Ukraine knows) was already released. So there's no quid - no leverage - when Trump asks them to look for the Crowdstrike server and to work with the US Attorney General on an official inquiry into corruption that may or may not take place.
Certainly the President of the US is allowed to ask foreign officials to work with US officials in an official capacity on a topic that is enshrined in a treaty signed by both countries? The only leverage available to Trump to have the Ukes work with Barr is that the two leaders are being friendly on the phone and both want good relations between the two countries.
Or does being an Orange Man mean he's not allowed to ask foreign officials to do official stuff with US officials?
See how easy it is? No quid, no pro quo. Unlike the Dems, Trump is telling the truth in his tweets. Just like (taking an additional example) no collusion. Just like no sexual assault. Trump told the truth all along about all of these topics.
Trump's been telling the truth all along, but because Dems can't handle the truth and mentally separate it from Trump's self-aggrandizing bluster, they are unable to think or act rationally.
@Yancey - why would the Democrats impeach that quickly? Much better I think to spend the rest of this year and much of 2020 work8g on impeaching, and fighting Trump and his Administration over their subpoenas. They seam to really, really, want the Mueller evidence badly. And they are going to try to make Trump look bad when he denies it to them. Besides, they, likely probably don’t really want a Senate trial in this Congress, with the Republica majority. Much better to do it with the Dems in the majority (even knowing they won’t get a conviction).
According to CNN Trump's statement that he deserves to meet his accuser is a threat. I thought being able to face your accuser was part of the 6th Amendment. Now the Dems oppose the 1st, 2nd, 6th and 10th Amendments. I wonder what part of the Constitution they support.
"I still think, in the end, the Democrats will balk at actually impeaching Trump."
Possibly, but they wanna drag it out -- keep the sword of Damocles hovering over the throne of Trump.
The impeachment is only useful if it drives Trump's poll numbers down and gives Warren or Biden a better shot to win in 2020.
The one thing Republicans and/or Trump supporters should not do is sacrifice Trump to impeachment with the mistaken belief that President Pence will be a "true" conservative to lead the country. That'd be a big mistake. If Trump goes down with help of weaselly Republicans, many folks will stay home Nov 2020.
Gotta fight bogus impeachment, gotta fight for his reelection. No other options.
Yancey,
It would be to the Republicans advantage to actually have a trial - that's the best way to get all this crap out into the open.
When Trump talks about a "war" all that really means in practical terms is that some supporters will decide it's time to shoot up the local mall or university.
The essential argument against Trump -- whether from a Democrat or Republican Never Trumper -- is that Trump beclowns himself and disgraces his office and the country.
Then why do the Democrats and Never Trumpers try so hard to be just like him?
Interesting piece on Nancy's motivation and proposed Republican response.
Real war is truly horrible, so what an outrage to use war as a metaphor!
Remember that the next time feminists--who have never been subject to the draft--talk about a "war on women." As they fight for the right to decapitate and dismember unwanted babies.
Read any MSM account - All written as if it's illegal to look into corruption on team D.
Hillary corruption - why you cannot look at that.
Hillary dirt - Illegal to dig into.
Biden's son was set up to ride his dad's power in order to pocket millions in an industry he has no knowledge about - ---why that's illegal to discuss, and besides it's all a conspiracy!
Our media is corrupt.
fight for the right to decapitate and dismember unwanted babies
Quite literally a Silent Spring that persists under a quasi-religious, sociopolitical cloak of privacy.
“Certainly the President of the US is allowed to ask foreign officials to work with US officials in an official capacity on a topic that is enshrined in a treaty signed by both countries? The only leverage available to Trump to have the Ukes work with Barr is that the two leaders are being friendly on the phone and both want good relations between the two countries.
Or does being an Orange Man mean he's not allowed to ask foreign officials to do official stuff with US officials?”
Dem Presidents, VPs Senators etc are all apparently entitled to do the quid pro quo thing with foreig countries but not a Republican President? Because of #OrangeManBad? We have Pencil Nexk Schiff taking campaign money from a Ukrainian arms dealer investigating the guy who was elected to conduct foreig policy for this country. Presumably justified again by #OrangeManBad.
The Barney Fife war mongers yen for the thought of armed conflict. They forget that revolutionaries need balls. That's why it's offensive to Brownshirts to call Trump's Chumps fascist
Apparently brennan visited ukraine in 2016, witu a false passport.
I'm actually more angry at the quisling republicans in Wash DC who are cravenly cowering in their offices wishing the Sheriff wasn't so belligerent with the outlaws ala "High Noon". If Trump had just a handful of senators ridiculing the democrats for bothering with something that is this DOA in the senate, I doubt they would continue. The only thing that makes sense is this is spoiling attack before the OIG Fisa report and other Barr releases. Otherwise, why pursue it? It sucks all of the oxygen out of the room that could be used for legislative back scratching and payoffs. There will be no legislation coming out of congress until February 2021 which is fine by me but unbearable for the swamp.
Interesting you jump to the conclusion war automatically means guns.
Its clausewitz war by other means
https://thefederalist.com/2019/09/30/did-the-inspector-generals-office-help-the-whistleblower-try-to-frame-trump/
@Drill SGT (10;59), accepted as a friendly amendment.
BCARM @ 1:37
I like how your first instinct is to employ underhanded deception. Why isn't your first instinct honesty?
I expect the President will make counters to the Dem and Media's take down shots and soon win this game, set and match. But Fox News has forever exposed itself as another enemy of the people.
I honestly think Giuliani is harming the Republic. Trump is an addled old man and Giuliani is feeding him conspiracy bullshit to make him look even more out of touch with reality than necessary. It certainly isn't advancing any of Trump's nominal policy goals. Giuliani is no better than Alex Jones.
AA, if the Democrats believe that the "Impeachment Push" needs to be fast, fast, fast, etc. Then tell us why Pelosi has 6 house committees involved in President Trump's impeachment. Last time I took notice of any Committee in Congress, "fast" is not what they are known for!
Won't work! Trump is faster and more agile than any/all of the Dems.
ARM is going deeper and deeper into his delusions as the moderators take another day off.
" honestly think Giuliani is harming the Republic. “
Yes. Trump should not be allowed a lawyer to defend himself against charges of colluding with Russia, which Shitt is still “investigating” and he certainly should not be allowed to gather exculpatory evidence in places where it would appear that the collusion originated.
As for the Alex Jones comment. There is a lot of documentary evidence coming from the government of the Ukraine, for one thing, that the Democrats originated the whole collusion narrative overseas. Alex Jones is a better analogy for Schiff’s shtick. Go ahead and call bullshit and I will link it all again for you for the fifth or sixth time.
The usual suspects seem ,.....confused. Perhaps the reality of Trump is out stripping their ability to build a narrative. They certainly sound adrift.
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