From the article:
Of the many student activists who emerged from the tragic shooting last year at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School in Parkland, Fla., Kyle Kashuv stood out as a conservative defender of the Second Amendment, surrounded by classmates who were mobilizing for sweeping new controls on guns....
“While I support a conservative viewpoint on the Second Amendment, I know that finding common ground is the path to protecting our students,” he wrote [in his college application essay. “I still believe that from the pits of despair, goodness can and will prevail.”...A trail of derogatory and racist screeds.
On Monday, Mr. Kashuv revealed on Twitter that the university this month rescinded its admission offer over a trail of derogatory and racist screeds that it turns out Mr. Kashuv, 18, wrote as a 16-year-old student, months before the shooting that would turn his high school into one of the most famous in the country.
Some conservatives decried Harvard’s decision as unfair, once again thrusting the fraught issue of college admissions into the public eye. And the rescinded offer raised a question uniquely relevant to the digital age: To what degree should the pronouncements of young people who routinely document their thoughts online — in this case, in a private study document shared with a few classmates — follow them into adulthood?...Garnering attention is dangerous. It may inspire others to go rooting around in your garner, garnering things to which you don't want attention garnered.
Harvard informs students upon their admission that the college reserves the right to withdraw its offer for several reasons, including if an admitted student “engages or has engaged in behavior that brings into question their honesty, maturity or moral character.”...
Two other prominent Parkland student activists, Jaclyn Corin and David Hogg, both of them vocal proponents of tighter gun restrictions, are headed to Harvard this fall. Mr. Hogg, who is completing a gap year, garnered attention when he announced his acceptance last year after being rejected from other schools, including from California State University at Long Beach. On Monday, Mr. Kashuv’s defenders noted that Mr. Hogg had a 4.2 grade point average and scored 1270 on the SAT test, while Mr. Kashuv said in the interview that he had a 5.4 G.P.A., and a 1550 SAT score.
A video showing screenshots of what he wrote, including repeated racial slurs, was posted online last month by a former schoolmate. The screenshots show that Mr. Kashuv and other students used a Google Doc study guide as a chat, with several of them editing the document simultaneously and commenting on each other’s remarks. In laying out the story Monday morning to his 304,000 Twitter followers, Mr. Kashuv said the “egregious and callous” comments were made “in an attempt to be as extreme and shocking as possible,” not because of any personal beliefs....
“In the same document, I said a bunch of anti-Semitic stuff,” he acknowledged. “That’s not who I am. My parents are Jewish. I’m Jewish. I go to synagogue every single week now — I’ve been going the past few weeks.”...
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128 comments:
They don't need a student who isn't going to fall into line with the administration's positions, they figured.
Didn't hurt the Governor of Virginia.
Were all the people accepted into Harvard subject to the same level of forensic investigation? Or just the ones in favor of the 2nd Amendment?
I can't swear that I never said anything stupid as a teenager. In fact, I'm pretty confident I did. But I'm 52 so nobody can prove anything.
It's okay if you want to be Governor of Virginia though!!
He's a smart kid, and I'm confident he'll land on his feet. Given his unwillingness to follow along with the "guns bad" mantra, I'm betting Harvard would have been a "hostile work environment."
It does have the benefit of revealing what sort of cesspool Harvard to a few more people.
...what sort of cesspool Harvard is...
16 year olds say and do stupid things. The bravado runs wild.
Because he's not on the left, there is no forgiveness.
I'd be surprised if Kashuv ever thought he could be happy at Harvard if he did get in. It's ground zero for insane credentialists and he's too outspoken to ever fit in.
That said, the President should just cut to the chase and offer the kid an entry-level job. He's proven he has the gumption for the work: give him a chance. Anyways:
- teenaged shoplifter and junkie, but BLACK: here's your acceptance letter and multi-million dollar civil judgement!
- teenaged WHITE student who supports Trump on Facebook: Boo! Unclean! Hunt them down!
Message received, lawbloggers.
Badthink! Bad!
16yos are just working out the components of humor. Being mean is one component, which is what they were exploring.
All the things I said -- or wrote -- when I was young, no one gave a damn then nor does now. Self awareness and forgiveness are good things, much better for a young person that the social and physical effects of behavior modifying drugs.
I pointed out yesterday that a white young man will never hear the n word more than in HS. And not from other white kids. Pretty hard to hear a word constantly and be told it's forbidden. It's too tempting for many.
Harvard never disappoints. What a pleasure it would be to see them lose the Asian-American discrimination suit.
No Ivy league university will let him in with this air of notoriety.
Any acceptance anywhere else will be big news and catnip for "activists", as well as probable pressure from deep-pocket alumni, most of which by this time are aligned against the caste he represents, regardless of him being Jewish. The American Jewish community that has deep pockets in the main despises Israelis, especially conservative Israelis.
There is very little institutional courage in the US.
Of quality institutions in the US only a state school, or some of them anyway, will feel obliged to accept him. A university in Israel may be the best option.
So three student from Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School were admitted to Harvard this year. I would like to see statistics on the number of MSD students admitted to Harvard in the previous five years. If we are betting 'over and under' and the number is three, I'll take the 'under'.
So, what horrible horrible things did he say?
I couldn't read the article, but I'm assuming that the NYT doesn't offend the virgin eyes of woker readers by reporting what he actually said, leaving the less woke unable to form their own opinions on the horribleness of said sayings.
First of all, everyone does stupid things when they're 16, that's why we don't let them drink or vote. I'd hate to have to answer the rest of my life for what I did and said when I was 16.
And yet while I agree this is probably just pretense for punishing someone on the right, I do think Harvard is perfectly justified in doing this. I just wish they punished both sides of the fence.
Scott Adams went nuts about this. He was having trouble verbalizing his disgust for Harvard.
I couldn't read the article, but I'm assuming that the NYT doesn't offend the virgin eyes of woker readers by reporting what he actually said, leaving the less woke unable to form their own opinions on the horribleness of said sayings.
I've read it was anti-Semitic stuff, which was confusing, since the kid is Jewish.
buwaya said...
Of quality institutions in the US only a state school, or some of them anyway, will feel obliged to accept him. A university in Israel may be the best option.
6/18/19, 9:24 AM
Ouch. Are they saying he -has- to go back? I accept your point, although I think "quality institutions" is flagrant false advertising for anti-Semites who hate the native American population.
What I got from this was that a 16 year old, in an attempt to be shocking and funny, wrote a bunch of stupid things in a study group's shared Google doc. In our modern that's-not-funny era, that (oestensibly, but totally not because he's expressed his support for the second amendment) makes him a pariah. All I can say is that I'm glad the internet was still in its embryonic state when I was that age.
He wrote the n word. I'm guessing the anti Semitic stuff came from the other kids. But we all know Harvard doesn't care about anti Semitism.
Fuck Harvard. He’s better off without them.
Honestly he’d ave had a terrible experience there, always pushing rocks uphill.
All of the things were pre shooting too. If there was ever a good catalyst to change one's perspective and how to treat others...
I don't remember anything I did at 16. Soloed an airplane. You had to be 16 to solo but I wasn't yet able to drive in NJ, for which you had to be 17, so it must have been 16.
Bad remarks on the school bus, probably. That was pretty continuous.
So, what horrible horrible things did he say?
Just like A. Lincoln and black people throughout this great land of ours, he used the .... "n-word"! (gasp).
But, unlike Lincoln, who spoke of avoiding the n-words and sending them back to Africa, the kid's usage was nonsensical to the point that race didn't enter into it:
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/parkland-teen-kyle-kashuv-apologizes-racist-remarks_n_5ce6908be4b09b23e65ead62
Hey white kids, don't be racists! "N-word" is for blacks only!
(I'm being hypocritical by saying "n-word" rather than the real word, but it's just because of google's censorship. I'll take a shower and get over it).
I said a bunch of anti-Semitic stuff ... I’m Jewish.
I think these dopey kids are just trying to get a reaction, like saying "fuck" 50 years ago.
Given the way shared editing works, the words, once typed, are never gone. Even if he had deleted them, the trail would still be there.
I feel bad for the kid, but I think the NYT's comment is right -- as is TWW, upstream. Harvard, at a certain point, is distinguishing otherwise indistinguishable smart kids based on some evidence of bigger life purpose or capacity. You win by the subjective standard, you lose by the subjective standard.
Also remember, this has happened before to other non-conservative kids. Althouse has even blogged about it before.
I don't remember anything I did at 16.
I drank beer in the desert and got my Dad's Chrysler stuck in a wash.
Harvard takes only a tiny fraction of applicants. The other rejected students would all be saying why him not me if he had remained admitted. I've no doubt he is remorseful and has grown, but that stuff was still inconsistent with how he was portraying himself in his application. Don't overthink admissions decisions at the hardest college to get into in the country.
You don't hear the n-word from retired people, which is odd since they're not vulnerable to mob punishment. Apparently the inclination to use it only comes up when there are people complaining about how terrible the n-word is, and you doubt the intelligence and wisdom of the complainers and just want to rub that in.
I'm guessing not too many Harvard grads posting here. (Me neither.)
I don't actually like racists that much. Go bother someone else.
Harvard rescinding an acceptance is not normal readering.
There is no acceptance office whimsy in this case. If they had rejected him that would be the usual thing and no matter, but this is not that.
There is no overthinking here.
The problems with your top universities are all consequences of a corruption of their souls, a cultural dedication to evil, as a result of the interests they serve.
Also remember, this has happened before to other non-conservative kids. Althouse has even blogged about it before.
I don't doubt that it has. But in this case, one could infer that the reason this little piece of information came to light at all was that somebody within that study group was not happy about this kid's outspoken position on the second amendment. A cynical person might conclude that if it weren't for that, if he had either kept his mouth shut or publicly taken the opposite position, this information might not have come to light. That might not in fact be the case, but who knows?
I think it's unfortunate that teenagers are being judged so harshly for the stupid things they've said or written. I wish people were more understanding and forgiving.
buwaya said...
Harvard rescinding an acceptance is not normal readering.
Perhaps, but they've done this before for the exact same reason.
I’ll go the other way. Does not a diverse student body require racists?
Also people who are pro-gun and pro-life.
Shouldn’t the class of 2023 include shoplifters and meth dealers?
And fat people. Is the class representative of the nation’s BMI?
All these are required to make the student body appropriately diverse.
If the canard that diversity is truly something to be valued that is, and not just a scam to admit blacks and keep out Asians.
For Harvard read any other top US university. They are very similar.
The exceptions among the "quality", are few. These are Cal Tech, which is admirably dedicated, still, to purity of intellect, and surprisingly perhaps most State schools that have less room to maneuver in selection decisions.
"the inclination to use it only comes up when there are people complaining about how terrible the n-word is, and you doubt the intelligence and wisdom of the complainers and just want to rub that in."
This could almost be a working definition of "hipster racism" if you just remove the hipster part.
It's sad for him that the trajectory of his life is suddenly altered. That takes some getting used to. The world is full of great people who didn't go to Harvard.
We need to bring back the scarlet letter it appears. Brand a big R on him.
I was brought up to accept apologies. I guess that marks me as out of step. But perhaps perpetual punishment really is better.
Kyle will be fine. Unlike Hogg, he wasn't an SJW accept at Harvard. He had the GPA and the SAT scores that put him solidly in. He'll reapply to college for the fall of 2020, and he'll either find an internship or a job on a political campaign for this year. Get some paid gigs to talk about what happened and use the money to do some traveling. It will be a "gap year".
"This could almost be a working definition of "hipster racism" if you just remove the hipster part."
"Hipster" is just a word. It acquires meaning through use....
Eh, they got their scalp.
Kid used racist words, kid's private conversation/use of those words got published, kid admitted what he did and expressed contrition...but Harvard said nope.
Is it unfair? Is it a product of bias? Probably, but so what? The Left owns the Academy. That's not news. It's shitty of Harvard to wait to rescind until after the application deadline for other schools (for which he probably would have qualified/to which he would have been accepted), but that's their call.
The only part that's worth noting is all the prominent people publicly taking pleasure in the kid getting punished. The same people who say I have a duty to forgive rapists, murders, domestic terrorists, etc and shouldn't cheer when they face consequences (legal, social) get downright giddy when they can "get" a kid like this. Not surprising, but worth pointing out.
I suspect that kids apply to Harvard as a sort of bragging rights thing.
I applied to the Mass General for internship. I didn't really want to go there as the intern salary was $750 per year.
But it would have been nice to say they wanted me.
I think Harvard today is a ticket to Wall Street or some other status symbol. I don't think the education is what they are after. I doubt it is worth the tuition but there are many kids there, especially POC, who do not pay tuition.
Confronting white twitterers much more aggressively than other twitterers is racist. Surely, you agree with that, don't you?
Harvard shows its true self. Kyle dodged another bullet.
Harvard and the other Ivies are a near-necessary first rung on the American cursus honorum, much more so today than ever before. This cuts across all institutions.
Credentialitis rules, on the management track anywhere.
Old examples are old, they are obsolete. For instance the old trope of engineers leading technology companies is being expunged as we speak.
The enhanced control of the cursus honorum is one of the major weapons in the American caste war.
They are applying the same standard to each student, including comments about white men, Christians, rap song lyrics, and anti-semitic comments?
What all of the “he’s better off” types in this thread are overlooking is that every other liberal-leaning college is now going to do the same thing to him. If any other college accepts him, and word gets out, the same twitter mob is going to make it so that the college goes through the same thing.
"I shouldn't be judged based on what said when I was 16," says the 18 year-old applying to colleges that entirely base their decisions on high school resumes.
Althouse: That's the top-rated comment on "Racist Comments Cost Conservative Parkland Student a Place at Harvard" (NYT).
Stupid comment. Amusing though, because the lack of a Diversity Of Thought at the NYTs and in it's comments will lead to yet another Shocked Election Night. They should pay me to comment there, to keep them from being blindsided again.
I bet we can find hundreds of current Harvard students who made racist remarks on social media, and that Harvard made no attempt to cull through their accounts. I wonder if that would come out in discovery?
I feel bad for the kid, he's truly brave. But Harvard is not what it once was, so this may be a blessing in disguise.
This could almost be a working definition of "hipster racism" if you just remove the hipster part.
How is it any kind of racism? If anything the opposite.
The kid writing the n-word imagines baiting not blacks but whites with it. That's the humor. The whites who claim to know what fragile egos blacks have. That's the real racism, on quite the other side.
And this is from the Sarah Jeong NYTs, who tweeted "dumbass fucking white people” and “how much joy I get out of being cruel to old white men.”
Still employed by the people who lecture us about things they don't really believe in.
Did he call somebody a pederast?
Was it Harry Reid?
Does anybody know?
What if he had been an African-American who had been arrested for shoplifting when he was 16 years old?
Old white men can hold their own. It's the employed white men that have to worry about that they say, lest a mob descend on their employer with demands.
If you seek truth, seek an old white man.
The story isn't the Conservative being rejected, but the frothing at the mouth activist being accepted despite far lower academic credentials. Hogg's age has protected him from libel so far, but it won't much longer.
Pederast is okay these days. Pedophile is today's libel per se charge.
On the one foot, on the other foot, thing.
Harvard waiting this late to rescind that offer is something I dislike.
Where can he now be admitted, in June before a semester starts in August/September?
Harvard is a cesspool.
What all of the “he’s better off” types in this thread are overlooking is that every other liberal-leaning college is now going to do the same thing to him. If any other college accepts him, and word gets out, the same twitter mob is going to make it so that the college goes through the same thing.
You're right. Conservatives should call their Senators, explain why this is a political hit job (destroying a kid who was courageous enough challenged the Parkland gun control narrative) and ask the Senator to reach out to colleges in his state to offer him a 4 year scholarship.
We keep losing these culture war battles because we let them single out our people for public destruction while we just watch. And then wonder why conservatives are afraid to out themselves and make a stand.
Harvard just proved they have a high ranking complete idiot in admissions, is all.
Fen beat me to it. Sarah Jeong was 26 and a graduate of Harvard Law when she indulged in her most notoriously career enhancing bigotry to date.
Sarah Jeong NYTs, who tweeted "dumbass fucking white people” and “how much joy I get out of being cruel to old white men.”
Still employed by the people who lecture us about things they don't really believe in.
She, they, subscribe to a pro-choice quasi-religion ("ethics"). What they "believe in" doesn't matter, but is relative to the context and interest.
From a Forbes article (unrelated to this story):
"...Federal student financial assistance has enabled colleges to raise tuition fees dramatically, as they take advantage of loan and grant programs to extract most of the federal largess for themselves. In an era of relatively high income and estate taxation, tax privileges conferred by the federal government have helped institutions like Harvard build extraordinarily large endowments. So-called private colleges have willingly forfeited some of their independence to federal bureaucrats in order to keep the federal bounty coming. Those bounties are huge for powerful senior members of the Harvard community –full professors average roughly $250,000 annual salaries with light teaching loads; endowment managers make literally millions, etc."
Get Harvard out of My Tax Dollar's Uterus.
I am Laslo.
For instance the old trope of engineers leading technology companies is being expunged as we speak. <
Ford found this out the hard way back in the late 60s when they put accountants in charge. Now it's lawyers.
It takes a decade or so to ruin a company.
Harvard doesn't deserve Kyle. He doesn't need Harvard, the racist institution.
Glad he pointed out their treatment so we can know their hypocrisy.
THEOLDMAN
I suppose that Harvard does not have to enroll many racial minorities who cannot and will not read at the university level, as many ordinary universities feel compelled to do.
However, Harvard's racial minorities as a group probably lag significantly behind the other students.
Therefore, even Harvard too has to engage in the self-criticism sessions bewailing hysterically that the minority students are so traumatized by the pervasive racism on the campus that they cannot study adequately.
Harvard's expulsion of this particular student is part of the continual drama portraying the campus as a hotbed of secret racists. Although this particular racist student was exposed and expelled, he is living proof that the campus is infested with secret racists. More of them need to be exposed and expelled.
All the students, teachers and administrators need to be eternally vigilant. This is not paranoia. Rather, this is justified fear about real racism threats on the campus.
"'I shouldn't be judged based on what said when I was 16,' says the 18 year-old applying to colleges that entirely base their decisions on high school resumes."
They look at the student's resume, but what are they looking for?
The student's potential as a contributing member of the student body.
And, yes, character is an aspect of that. But how much does this incident say about his character? Does anybody really believe that we can judge a person by the dumbest thing they said during a late-night study session?
And then wonder why conservatives are afraid to out themselves and make a stand
Operating within their preferred frame of reference, including words just words, hasn't helped. Breaking out of the box is one way that Trump set himself apart. Before him, Palin did the same to national acclaim. Fortunately, people are reassessing past, present, and progressive claims on merit (e.g. principle), and reaching independent conclusions, thus unwinding the ball of narratives spun over decades.
Federal student financial assistance has enabled colleges to raise tuition fees dramatically
Shared cost. Progressive price.
Jewish, perhaps practicing, conservative, pro-Second with a developing sense of humor? My guess is Harvard secprogs decided he was too far gone to be rehabilitated.
It will be interesting to see how The New York Times covers this story, since it continued to employ Sarah Jeong after her history of anti-White-male tweets was exposed.
And she was a lot older than 16 when she was writing her tweets.
The NYT explained that she just exercised some bad judgment for a while, so it all is OK now.
Sarah Jeong is on the NYT editorial staff.
Perhaps she herself could write an editorial arguing that Harvard should grant to this young student similar understanding and forgiveness as the NYT granted to her.
My son graduated from public h.s. here (one of the top-rated ones) in 2004, and the stuff he and his buds wrote in their yearbooks was . . . not edifying.
When I graduated in '71, we talked trash of all sorts but didn't write it down (except in men's room stalls); my son's cohort wrote the trash down on paper; now high-schoolers broadcast it to the world.
Narr
Progress!
I just caught up with Alternate Althouse at the Yellow Rose.
It's been a spell, but I remembered her from that article about the aspiring law student who's social media account got hacked and published. Poor thing. It was just a private conversation, a thoughtless remark clouded by emotion. She could have been anything she wanted, even... a professor of law at a prestigious university. Maybe even a Justice on the Supreme Court?
A hot little waitress, too young, brought me my usual Stoli. Ann came out for her number and I slid up to the stage (stepping around the vomit) and caught her eye. She crawled across to me with a hungry look and I slid a dollar bill into her g-string.
"Come see me when you're done. I've got $40 for a few lap dances"
"Thanks!"
But she still has that melancholy vibe. I'll have to buy her a round. I try to help:
"I know, it was just a word"
"What?"
"Oh nothing. Nevermind"
If Harvard was really serious as this as their standard, they would probably have to expel at least half the student body and probably more like 90%. Also, they would probably have to can most of the professors and administrators. Doing stupid things at 16 is pretty much the default in human experience.
And she was a lot older than 16 when she was writing her tweets.
But she's just a groveling goblin gook with diminished responsibility and shouldn't be held to the same high standards as white teenagers.
The premise that it was a stupid thing should not be accepted.
He probably ought to avoid Oberlin, too.
So, was it a one-time blackface, a colored comment in a limited frame of reference, a general libel (e.g. against neighbors), or an orientation that is in progress?
Are young African American rappers permitted as students in the Ivy League? Have they "sung" the words nigger and motherfucker? If not why not.
Jewish, perhaps practicing, conservative, pro-Second
The change is conceived with "Jew privilege", or "White [male] privilege" in modern memes, and progresses leftward.
readering said...Harvard takes only a tiny fraction of applicants. The other rejected students would all be saying why him not me if he had remained admitted. I've no doubt he is remorseful and has grown, but that stuff was still inconsistent with how he was portraying himself in his application. Don't overthink admissions decisions at the hardest college to get into in the country.
If his application was rejected that'd be a solid summary. But it wasn't--he was accepted. He beat out tons of other applicants based on his merit. Then, after being accepted, the Media published his private comments, Harvard asked him to send info on it, he complied, sent copies of all his comments and his apology, contacted the Harvard office of student diversity (or whatever it's called)...and then Harvard rescinded his acceptance (too late in the admissions calendar for him to apply/be accepted/accept scholarship offers to another school, probably).
Anyway if you want to say "it's just as super choose-y school being choose-y, whining about unfair treatment doesn't make sense" you'll then have to account for the large number of people who were also admitted, with lower academic qualifications, and many of whom almost certainly said/did thing at least as bad as this kid.
I know, I know: lots of people are speeding but the cop pulling you over isn't inherently unfair if you were going to fast...but in this case places like HuffPo went out of their way to publish articles about his private comments, which is how Harvard found out to begin with, so you can't really avoid concluding the kid was "targeted," if not by Harvard then by other Leftist groups.
Also: Harvard isn't the hardest college to get into. It's very hard, for sure.
Every kid should learn invective. For one thing, it's prayer in reverse.
Practice practice practice.
Its a shame Harvard timed their decision for maximum negative impact.
Its not like the kid posted something really really really really racist like "Department of Black People".
I suspect the racist statements he made were that Asians should be admitted to Harvard without regard to their race. This is verboten at the Ivy League schools, where discrimination against Asians is the norm.
I wish I thought there would be sufficient blowback (from alums, media, donors) for Harvard to reconsider this. Unfortunately I suspect the opposite will occur. Harvard's new President has paid lip service to free speech, but he doesn't seem to be standing behind it.
His life was going to be made miserable at Harvard- they were probably doing him a favor by rescinding the offer, though he won't see it that way right now, and it probably wasn't Harvard's intent, either.
My alma mater is stringing together a really miserable record this spring. Ending freedom of association in clubs (both male and female); relieving the Housemaster of Winthrop House of duty because a bunch of snowflakes objected to who he provided legal services for; The Dean of the College tells the graduating seniors that hard work has nothing to do with success; taking a couple of second rate anti-gun applicants and dumping a qualified pro gun applicant in a most harmful way. The new president seems to be willing to put up with any PC move by the Dean of the College who, if not in fact evil, is a boil on the ass of what used to be a fine institution.
I have been rooting for the Asians right from the beginning and continue to do so.
If you seek truth, seek an old white man.
Bernie Sanders, is that you?
Ford found this out the hard way back in the late 60s when they put accountants in charge. Now it's lawyers.
Did you read David Halberstam's book The Best and the Brightest?
I thought McNamara and the Whiz Kids came on board in the 50's, but its an old memory.
What is astounding about all this is how blatant Harvard is being: They admitted David Hogg, SAT 1270, while even disadvantaged minorities have an average in the mid 1400's. Meanwhile Kyle Kashuv scored higher than the discriminated against and highest scoring accepted Asians.
Harvard, if one recalls, also rescinded an admission of a woman who was convicted of murdering her 4 year old disabled child. Though they seemed to have done it more out of worry about what conservatives would say than any reservations about the student herself. I guess saying mean words is worse than murder, at least to the panjandrums of Harvard.
Hogg's entertainment value to students, faculty, administration and alumni of Harvard far, far exceeds that of this much more normal person. Why admit someone who doesn't dance in the blood of the dead? Where is the fun of that?
It’s not stupid administrators. They mean to do what they do.
This is systematic and deliberate, semi-organized at least.
Khe Sanh, your old Harvard is part of that inimical system.
Part of the array of institutions on the other side of you, in this fractured country.
All the old rules and expectations and customs are gone.
This is a new world, a much uglier world.
Loyalties need to be re-evaluated, taking into account current reality, seen without nostalgic lenses.
Interesting. But this exercise has a large potential to devour its proponents. Let's see how the worthies at Harvard react when/if their admissions staff is found to have engaged in racial discrimination against Asian-Am applicants.
When I was in high school, I got to make a fool of myself in front of my family, teachers, neighbors, and friends. Now I could do it in front of the whole world.
If you wouldn't say it to your mother, don't put it on the internet. If you have got a point, you can figure out a way to put it across without embarrassing yourself.
David Hogg, by the way, is a fellow who was never under threat (he was in another building) and who climbed to prominence on the bodies of his dead schoolmates by spouting something that the media and the political left wanted to hear. Kyle Kashuv, by contrast, is a fellow who was never under threat (he was in another building) and who climbed to prominence on the bodies of his dead schoolmates by spouting something that the media and the political left did not want to hear.
It's not an elite school if you have to go there with people like Hogg.
At 18 he shouldn't be judged on what he wrote at 16? Why not? It's only a couple years ago. If he was 28 or 38 he'd have a case.
Anthony Borges is worth a couple hundred of Kyle Kashuv and the eponymous David Hogg put together.
can he sue? Are they allowed to selectively/arbitrarily hold one applicant to unequally applied standards?
Is promissory estoppel in play?, and/or defamation based on their publicizing the reason for their decision?
Was the timing strategic-- wait until he turns down all other offers, then burn him?
"Anthony Borges is worth a couple hundred of Kyle Kashuv and the eponymous David Hogg put together."
Probably, but he could never make it on to your credentialist cursus honorum.
Its not that Harvard should not select the academically gifted, but that having been to Harvard matters so much to your system as far as selecting your leaders. You have a caste system nearly as impenetrable as Indias. This was not the case in the past.
Pleasures of invective -
Some time ago I happened to be working on a kind of satiric poem for which I wanted some especially resonant tonalities of invective. But, although I regularly find much to grumble about, I couldn't become furious enough long enough about things, to turn out the particular kind of turbulence I needed. Then a possible subterfuge occurred to me. Why not go through the Pauline Epistles, and assemble "efficiently" in one place the various bits of vituperation that are scattered through the books as a whole?
I tried the experiment, and I'd like to end up by exhibiting the result...they served to provide the kind of verbal music I wanted...
...Bah! There are those greedy of filthy lucre, blind of heart, alienated from truth, heady, highminded, lascivious, slothful in business, of cunning craftiness, given up to uncleanness, the double-tongued, those of darkened understanding, covenant breakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful, deceitful workers, ministers of sin, transgressors, false apostles, adulterers, those given to idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, herisies,.....
Kenneth Burke "Language as Symbolic Action" p.303
Why would he want to attend Harvard these days?
Answering my own question- Harvard is part and parcel of the rise of credentialism in the U.S. and probably its most apparent icon. Buwaya is quite correct that people must look at Harvard through non-nostalgic lenses in this changed world of academic institutions run amok.
Kashuv is a really bright kid. So I agree with Amadeus 48 that he is smart enough to have known that using the n word, if only for its shock value, is a bad idea that can come back to bite you. I can remember being 16, unless my memory is deceiving me, and I think I knew not to mess with that word because it is very dangerous.
It's pretty hard to "explain" what he did in today's hyper-political environment. So maybe he realizes that this is a tough break but he did it to himself.
He doesn't need Harvard (easy for me to say, I know).
buwaya @ 10:18: “The enhanced control of the cursus honorum is one of the major weapons in the American caste war.”
Brutal.
It's possible to get too worked up about the politics on campus, though. Last Friday I attended my youngest's UCLA graduation. First, I was amazed at what a well-behaved, well dressed and enthusiastic graduating class they had. No protests, no arm bands, no raised fists. Then, the speaker was scientist/astronaut Anna Lee Fischer. When she said one of her great heroes was Margaret Thatcher, I almost fell out of my seat. But not a peep from the audience. The students I have met from this class are without exception polite, well-behaved and ambitious.
So, there are lots of problems with colleges these days, but I am not worried about the future of the country.
I can remember being 16, unless my memory is deceiving me, and I think I knew not to mess with that word because it is very dangerous.
"Oh baby, it's just a word. Wanna buy me a drink?" purrs Trixie Ann, sliding into your lap. "You look like a fancy attorney! Know what? I almost went to law school too, I could have been a professor. Wanna go back to VIP? You can touch me in VIP."
johns@121: that sounds encouraging. Here at the UCLA of sw Tennessee, I doubt that 1% of the grads would have any idea who Margaret Thatcher was; maybe 30% of the faculty, but we never listened to the speakers so that's moot.
Narr
They're up to a 53% 6-year graduation rate!
johns; do you think it possible they didn't know who Margaret Thatcher was?
Narr and Gojuplyr: yes, i realized after i wrote it that maybe no one but the faculty knew who Thatcher was. But i even liked the faculty who spoke about their graduating students. someone is now going to say, what are you smoking? My point is that i was very surprised at the atmosphere and the upbeat nature of the students. And I only heard the word "diversity" once or twice.
On Sunday at the biology graduation, the speaker was an alumna who is a forensic pathologist who ended up as a writer for CSI. No SJW stuff there either.
16 year old boys are going to act like 16 year old boys.
However...any Ivy League Board of Trustees is going to be a heck of a lot more risk adverse then Oberlin's board. Apparently the student made a joke that had some violent wording. The Dean of Admissions would see the Board of Trustees coming for his job if anything negative happened once that student arrived on campus.
Oberlin's Board of Trustees was a lot less risk adverse then any Ivy League is gonna be. And now the Oberlin Board will be a lot more attentive to risk.
Major Universities, and of course all the Ivy Leagues, have in-house counsel. Administrations, Universities, Boards are all increasingly risk adverse and make frequent use of their lawyer's advice.
When she said one of her great heroes was Margaret Thatcher, I almost fell out of my seat. But not a peep from the audience.
Doesn't that suggest that those kids did not know who Margaret Thatcher was?
The kid has the high IQ thinker's burden. And he was caught playing with friends expressing bad ideas and bad words that are now unforgivable religious blasphemy at Ivy League secular institutions. Too bad his dad did not put him into Military School for 5 years. Then he would have learned some self control over his brilliant mind. And the he could have become President, which is still possible if he uses his courage and good heart to win, win and then win.
I find it strange that an institution that does all it can to extend your childhood would punish you for being childish years before you get there. He dodged a bullet. Take the money you save and start a business. You already have everything you need to get started. Make your own world rather than being force fed someone else's fantasies.
Bobb said...
I suspect the racist statements he made were that Asians should be admitted to Harvard without regard to their race. This is verboten at the Ivy League schools, where discrimination against Asians is the norm.
6/18/19, 11:38 AM
Whatever he said, it wasn't that bad.
How do we know? Because we know.
We know, because they won't tell us.
The Dean of Admissions would see the Board of Trustees coming for his job if anything negative happened once that student arrived on campus.
Speaking of anything negative, how ironic if a shooter came onto the Harvard campus and lit up a classroom full of freshmen taking a mandatory class, in which room was David Hogg, but was not Kyle Kashuv.
It's always weird to me that racism is considered more evil than statism. You can be a racist (as many of our relatives are or were) and live for decades without hurting anyone. Statism, on the other hand, kills. If Mr. Kashuv had expressed admiration for a mass murderer such as Mao, he'd be going to Harvard.
On Monday, Mr. Kashuv revealed on Twitter that the university this month rescinded its admission offer over a trail of derogatory and racist screeds
He should instead try to get a job at the NYT editorial staff. They are far more accepting of racist tweets.
All the things I said -- or wrote -- when I was young, no one gave a damn then nor does now.
Well, clearly this is not the case, as the Virginia Governor and Kavanaugh both found out. A lot of very vindictive and sneeringly horrible people are interested in ANYTHING that can bring discredit on a person no matter how long ago.
The crazy thing about calling people racists is that it almost never applies to actual racists, and actual racists have no problem if you call them that. It's a lot like gun control: it only works on the people who you don't need to control. The actual targets laugh at your feeble misplaced exercises in virtue.
What a tedious screeching liberal harridan Althouse is turning into. Very boring.
Someone way upthread said he didn't think any commenters on this blog had gone to Harvard. Well, I did -- so I guess I've kept my immense intelligence pretty well concealed.
When I was there in the early-mid '60's, Harvard was liberal-to-leftist (lots of ban-the-bomb-ers, who nevertheless rooted for Kruschev in the Cuban Missle Crisis), but I don't think I ever heard of anyone being bounced for lack of poltical correctness ("politically incorrect" was a concept we associated with the Soviets' attitude toward their dissenters, and left and right we all mocked it).
In my day, you heard plenty of students use the n-word -- as well as the k-word, the w-word, the p-word, the c-word, and several others that I've mercifully forgotten. This was regarded as bad taste, but not a hanging offense.
From what I've heard, Harvard is MUCH more intolerant than it was in my day. I wouldn't recommend it to any young person, whatever his/her political leanings. Kyle Kashuv will do just fine, and in due course will bless Harvard for not taking him in.
A key moment for those paying attention was in 1999 when a Washington DC administrator was made a subject of controversy for using the word "niggardly" in discussing budget allocations.
Most people considered the controversy idiotic at the time, but it drove home that not only can you not use the word, you cannot use words that sound somewhat like the word, even though they are totally unrelated to the word.
It is the word that dare not speak its name.
Kyle Kashuv just got a dunking in the mill pond, and he floated. He must be a witch. The devil buoyed him up. No Harvard for him.
PS. David Hogg sunk like a rock. Pull him out, dry him off, and send him to Harvard. He hasn't been shown to have used the word or words that sound like the word (but I bet he has).
To the upper class, Harvard grads are known as “the help.”
What's wrong with saying derogatory things about Blacks? They earn it constantly.
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