"I was a pleaser, agreeable... Knowing he was a director, I didn't argue. I was coming from a place of devotion."
From "Woody Allen's Secret Teen Lover Speaks: Sex, Power and a Conflicted Muse Who Inspired 'Manhattan'" (Hollywood Reporter).
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56 comments:
I wish I had one of those.
"his wit is magnetic," Engelhardt says. "It was why I liked him and why I'm still impressed with him as an artist. How he played with characters in his movies"
"His wit is magnetic." Ah, so that's why she left her number on his table.
How he played with characters in his movies! Now that's funny.
"How was our partnership not something more than just a fling?"
Funnier than anything Woody ever said.
Anyway, Trump was right: when etc. etc., they do let you do it.
She had just turned sixteen, so at least he was starting to see something in older women.
I wonder, did Woody ever travel on the Lolita Express?
"I was Good Enough, I was Smart Enough, and Doggone It, Woody liked me"
"I used to dream of making love to Woody," says the former assistant to Jeffrey Epstein. "Now I'm dreaming of him dying in my arms."
What's different about rich and famous males is that they get a lot more temptation than virtuous men.
I just watched Kleist's The Marquise of O. The count was a devil because she first saw him as an angel. Nevertheless it turns out they are each other's story and give bring forth a new line of Russians.
How?
How?
They had barbed tails.
Have you seen Woody Allen?
It doesn't compute. I don't get it at all.
Gives new meaning to teeny-bopper.
"It doesn't compute. I don't get it at all."
What are the odds that this sixteen yo trying to make it on her own as a model in Manhattan. Who dropped a note to ugly Wood. Had a backstory that wasn't an ideal peaches and cream situation.
I dunno.
Auntie da Shitter face says it's the girl's fault.
A Lefty WOULD say that.
It's become clear why he's called "Woody."
It was so obvious.
Have you seen Woody Allen?
It doesn't compute. I don't get it at all.
It's not so complicated. If I see a homely, short man with a beautiful woman it's a safe bit he's rich, and likely successful and/or powerful. Some women are drawn to that, looks don't matter.
There's sixteen, and then there's New York City Model sixteen.
But both are under-age.
I am Laslo.
Darrell,
my POV is that parents should have their sixteen yo kids well supervised. Cause there are rapists (like Wood was here, as is clear re law) and other scum.
The more complex situation is when the gal is early twenties and she's snapping her G-string.
Though for me that was never a tough call. Cause I'm a prude. And a foreva Clinton hater.
Likewise neva DJT today.
Call it Bayesian consistency. The opposite of tribalism.
This appears to be grounds for charging him with rape.
Robert Cook hates Hillary and he's a Lefty. One of the few according to him.
Neva?
A river in Russia?
"White snow" in Spanish?
Better regale us with some more mathematical terms.
Allen sure was deep into the shiksa fantasy on this one.
Do you know that shiksa means pussy.
And not just any pussy, but diseased, dirty pussy like a whore might have.
And can you tell me why people still use that term? And even have shiksas using that term?
"My father ran around in lederhosen. I had doors slammed in my face."
oh honey you have NO idea.
Despite the initial shock of jealousy, Engelhardt says she grew to like Farrow over the course of the "handful" of three-way sex sessions that followed at Allen's penthouse as they smoked joints and bonded over a shared fondness for animals. ("When Mia was there, we'd talk about astrology, and Woody was forced to listen," she laughs.) Engelhardt writes in her manuscript, "There were times the three of us were together, and it was actually great fun. We enjoyed each other when we were in the moment. She was beautiful and sweet, he was charming and alluring, and I was sexy and becoming more and more sophisticated in this game. It wasn't until after it was done when I really had time to think of how twisted it was when we were together … and how I was little more than a plaything." She continues, "While we were together, the whole thing was a game that was being operated solely by Woody so we never quite knew where we stood."
eee gads.
@Darrell,
Do you know that shiksa means pussy.
And not just any pussy, but diseased, dirty pussy like a whore might have.
No, it doesn't. The shiksa is morally problematic as an object of sexual temptation for the Jewish male more than as a sinful person in & of herself. It comes from the Hebrew word for "detested" into Yiddish. It carries the connotation of impurity, needless to say, but religious & ritual impurity. It isn't like calling a woman a "cunt". For one, thing, there's a male equivalent "shegetz", & just because you're a shegetz doesn't mean you're a putz.
so, to review....
Jerry Sienfield living with 17yr old => FINE
Woody Allen Living with Just Turned 16yr old => Fine
Roman Polanski drugging and fucking 13yr => Fine
....
That Alabama Judge going to movies with 17yr olds, and holding their hand => RAPIST!!!
Why is the dictionary definition "a non-Jewish" woman, then?
I heard the definition I wrote above from a Lithuanian Jew at work that had just emigrated with the help of a Jewish organization. One day we were sitting around at lunch and some of the Jewish guys were talking about their shiksa wives. He asked them if they know what "shiksa" meant and then he told them. He was a chemical engineer, but he had studied to be a Rabbi in Lithuania before he went into engineering. He told them that he could never see any reason to call your loved one a shiksa, unless you are trying to get them to humiliate themselves when they use the word itself. He said he found himself wondering about American Jews.
"He was a chemical engineer"
Never trust them.
They're sneaky.
@Darrell,
The meaning of slang terms is notoriously fluid. In the community of that Lithuanian Jew, maybe the word took on seriously negative connotations. But, if your American Jewish co-workers referred to their wives that way, that seriously argues against the term being considered truly nasty in the American Jewish context. The Wikipedia entry tends to agree.
Think about the word "bitch". When two high school girls call each other a bitch in the hall, a fight about to break out. But, for couples, it can carry with it a mean sort of jokishness about it, as when one looks over the breakfast table at one's clearly not in a good mood wife, and asks her "So, how we doin' today, bitch?".
--YoungHegelian.
I know. And I trust your take and your take has nothing to do with the defiition you will find in all the prominent dictionaries that I have seen--"A non-Jewish woman." Why is that? Obviously the word in Yiddish means something more. Why is that hidden from shiksas?
And don't call your wife a bitch at breakfast. Even if you are asking her to pass the butter.
But Truuuuumppp!
..or something.
Will this "news" piss off Soon Yi?
I think this might demonstrate the difference between men's and women's sexuality better than just about anything.
A Woody might make a great companion to hang with, male or female, but sex? Are you kidding me?
Hey guys, how many of you wanted to have sex with Phyllis Diller becuase she made you laugh?
"This is superb! I like it.
very nice article and very helpful
Thank you for sharing good and important information."
See? With the right lines you can get anything.
"I used to dream of making love to Woody," says the former assistant to Jeffrey Epstein. "Now I'm dreaming of him dying in my arms."
That was weird. The whole thing was weird.
I wouldn't pick Mia Farrow as engaging in three ways. That's off brand. The other characters played their expected roles.......The young girl involved seems to have had a pleasant and interesting life. Woody and Mia had long and successful careers. As a morality play it doesn't offer much of a moral. Our lives should all turn out this good...... I think it's wrong to have threesomes with sixteen year old models and movie stars. That's why I've never engaged in such activity.
"Now I'm dreaming of him dying in my arms."
More common than you think . . .
The reputation of Mia Farrow will take the hardest hit in this story. Me, three.
Why did this person even do this interview? "Hey, I don't have anything against this person, but here's a whole lot of alleged private stuff about him."
I thought it was rather a good article, and she came across as considerably more sensible than the current moral panic would allow.
Men go for youth, health and good looks - proxies for fertility. Women go for status - proxy for good genes and ability to provide and protect. He found her attractive. She found him attractive. She's still happy that she had a relationship with an important, famous, witty guy; but a little disappointed that she wasn't as big a part of his life as he was of hers. But she's smart enough to understand why.
Step outside the box of transient cultural norms (or rather norms of a small minority of scribblers) and imagine, say, what has been common forever. Important powerful men - Kings, Khans, Sultans - with hundreds of wives, mistresses and concubines; most of them way younger than him, and most of them not very important to him outside the bedroom.
We may find it uncomfortable to modern tastes, but there's nothing remotely weird or abnormal about it. It's Human Nature 101. On both male and female sides.
Dickin'Bimbos@Home said...
Have you seen Woody Allen?
It doesn't compute. I don't get it at all.
The male equivalent of beautiful woman is not handsome man, it is powerful man.
William said...
That's Why? I was wondering why you hadn't; and now we know
"Men go for youth, health and good looks - proxies for fertility."
They're not "proxies"* for fertility, they're indicators of fertility.
*(Substitute, stand-in, surrogate, etc.)
Of all the Woody Allen scandals. I especially like the early, funny ones.
I was a pleaser, agreeable.
Doesn't this sum up why men like teenage girls? They are pliable and trainable, so young and naive.
"Woody Allen Living with Just Turned 16yr old => Fine"
She was 16 when they met but turned 17 within two months.
People talk about the asymmetry of power between a middle aged man and a woman who is barely legal. The asymmetry works both ways--he is more experienced, has wealth and connections. But she has youth and beauty and can attract other high status males.
Everything Lee Moore said above for the win.
While we may find relationships like this at least a little bit creepy, with a victim and a victimizer, the romance novel business begs to differ.
Maybe the #MeToo zealots would like to explain that one.
Sydney said:"Doesn't this sum up why men like teenage girls?"
The ease with which some people move from specific instances to generalization is stunning.
She should be in the dictionary next to Jailbait.
Why did this person even do this interview? "Hey, I don't have anything against this person, but here's a whole lot of alleged private stuff about him."
She wanted her 15 minutes of fame.
It's why she was seeking out celebrities in the first place.
Think about it. This woman was celebrated in a fairly major work of cinematic art. Granted, the man did all the work. But she inspired him. And now she wants a little credit!
In the movies, Woody is a hapless nerd who struggles to find a girl who will not ignore him. That's why they call it acting. In real life, he was a stud muffin who struggled to fend off the advances of teen age models. He was kind of a reverse Rock Hudson.
It's like Helen giving an interview 30 years later.
"Hey, you know that Trojan war? The famous one with the horse? I started that."
So, in 1976, self-loathing 41-year old Jewish comic genius, Woody, gets jiggy with teenage Eva Braun for 8 years?
Lotta psychiatrist bills later...
I am not Laslo.
Who really gives a shit about any of this?
I had been going back-and-forth in my mind about Woody Allen but that's over.
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