... you tell me if this is okay.
Or talk about anything you want.
I'll provide more background on the artwork later. I just thought opining on the political correctness of artwork was the order of the day.
It's midmorning break time for me. Perhaps it's time for shopping. If you're shopping, I encourage you to use The Althouse Amazon Portal.
ADDED: Here's the wall card from the Indianapolis Museum of Art:
Posts
182 comments:
Poor composition. The dark-colored bear disappears against the dark forest. It would be much better to put the bear against the light background and the white tiger against the dark background.
And there's something wrong with the tiger's head, especially around the eye.
Symbolically... I see a bear and think Russia. No idea what to think of the tiger -- the Bengal Tiger might represent India, but that's an orange tiger not a white one.
White should be divided until a rainbow appears. Black should be altogether excluded from the color spectrum. The painting is politically incorrect and should be destroyed, lest people discover their dignity, reject [class] diversity, and embrace diversity. This type of historical propaganda poses a clear and progressive risk to the left-ward swing.
There's not a happy little tree anywhere in that.
Burn things you don't like.
Burn this bitch down.
Trees produce CO2 in darkness. Trees are first-order forcings of catastrophic photosynthetic global warming. Trees are evil. Just like PV tech that is a blight on the environment when the sun sets.
Don't know about the art, but unless the tiger makes a run for it, tiger time is nearly at an end.
When was the last time you saw Elvis on velvet?
Ms. Althouse thank you again for your support for our president. It seems that almost every website is filled with hatred of our President. Your blog is a nice respite from that and is a comfortable place for us supporters to gather.
H. Pippin has a talent for claws.
Trees produce CO2 in darkness. But not Democracy.
Looks racist to me. Althouse, please report to Rm. 101.
Abstract expressionism is the way to go. That way no one can tell if your art is good or bad.
Kellogs vs Post in the cereal wars.
The Siberian Tiger (Panthera tigris altaica) and the Siberian Brown Bear (Ursus arctos collaris) have overlapping ranges, so such a confrontation is possible however improbable. Nevertheless, white tigers are bad and need to be abolished. One mauled a gay man some years ago. Obviously, they are homophobic felines, and probably racist as well.
A white tiger fighting a black tiger?
Obviously painted by confederates and needs to be taken down.
It also clearly shows that Trump and all of his voters support or are secretly members of the KKK and the only redress is to help the democrats seize power with their antifa friends.
It also clearly shows trump colluded with the Russians and we need to leave the uniparty in DC alone.
Only you can prevent forest fires.
I can't wait until the next time one of you nice people appeals to my sense of tolerance.
Do you know, I actually believed in tolerance? As an idea, I mean; as an integral part of American civic life. As an ideal, even.
Sure you might not like this or that, guy, but embrace tolerance! Live and let live--make sure you're leaving politics and ideological considerations out as much as possible when you're relating to your fellow citizens. Leave some space between your personal and political lives--tolerance!
So much for that, huh?
Tiger in Jellystone.
I thought white tigers were now extinct in the wild.
...the Bengal Tiger might represent India, but that's an orange tiger not a white one.
Actually, the mutant gene for whiteness (abolish now!) is fairly common in the Bengal subspecies. Siberian tigers don't seem to have it unless they are outcrossed, which is why Seigfreid and Roy had so many of them.
People who are dumb enough to keep big cats as pets are dumb enough to outcross subspecies.
So does the winner get Godzilla in the winners' bracket or King Kong in the losers' bracket?
I'm a poor candidate to comment on art or political correctness. In fact, the latter would not have occurred to me had you not raised it.
With that predicate, I wouldn't put that picture in my living room. About the only use for it I can imagine is in the bedroom of a boy old enough to think it's cool. Or perhaps some low end dive.
I'd prefer a painting of a boatman, a cabbage, a goat and a lion, but I'm into math.
The title of the painting is "The Blue Tiger".
A white tiger fighting a black tiger?
Had to go back and check the source URL. Definitely a tiger vs. a bear. The painter may be artistically naive, be he knows his natural history at least somewhat. The tiger is digitigrade and the bear is suitable plantigrade.
Pippin served in the 369th infantry, the famous Harlem Hellfighters, in Europe during World War I, where he lost the use of his right arm after being shot by a sniper. He said of his combat experience:
I did not care what or where I went. I asked God to help me, and he did so. And that is the way I came through that terrible and Hellish place. For the whole entire battlefield was hell, so it was no place for any human being to be.[5]
While in the trenches, Pippin kept an illustrated journal which gave an account of his military service.[6][7]
This story didn't get much national play at the time:
CBS: St. Louis Man Beaten to Death With Hammers
This was a couple of days after the Ferguson riots. A guy, his pregnant fiancee, and their fried are driving home around 1AM. A group of "youths" block the car and start pounding on it--4 or 5 people all round. The guy, Zemir Bevic, gets out of his car and they attack him. He's beaten to death there, in the street. They all had hammers, you see, so they beat him to death. His wife said his last act was shielding her from the attack.
Anyway the murderers are young black and Hispanic men. Zemir was a Bosnian immigrant--typical white guy, I guess.
Didn't get a lot of national notice, just a local story I guess.
Hey, weird thought--do you think that fact pattern will play any role in the upcoming case of the ugly driver from Ohio? Do you think the jury will see some footage of Reginald Denny before they go back to their room?
Just kidding, just kidding.
Don't know about the politics, but the artwork is crap.
I remember that attack very well. No interest as he was the wrong color. These "White Nationalist" kids marching remember it, I'll bet.
This violent progression of the racial politics, and the Confederate monument thing is absolutely racist in origin, is very dangerous.
Just don't ask the left if they are ready to go to the fight. They know no history and are oblivious to the intent of their allies, the Palestinians and the BLM.
All that is at stake is civilization.
Perhaps we should simply agree that art is unnecessary, and therefore money raised by taxes should *never* be spent on art. Then we don't need to worry about the message carried by tax-supported art. All art will be private property.
I'd prefer a painting of a boatman, a cabbage, a goat and a lion.
First, the boatman takes the goat across. Then he returns and loads the cabbage aboard, which he takes across. On arrival, he unloads the cabbage and reloads the goat. Returning to the starting point the boatman unloads the goat, loads the lion, and starts across the river once more. At the destination shore, he unloads the boat, leaving the lion to watch the unappetizing cabbage, and returns to the starting point one last time. He loads the goat for a second and final trip across.
Why doesn't the lion eat the boatman?
Hood, if he were muslim, the national MSM would have been so confused about which identity group gets precedence that they wouldn't have been able to cover it.
It's definitely art -- not great art, but art nonetheless.
Maybe, it represents Antifa and Neo-Nazis battling it out in the wild...or maybe not.
Cheers all!
My grampa had a goat that would have eaten the boat.
The boatman is toast, so the lion won't eat him.
Why doesn't the lion eat the boatman?
Bribery.
Native primativist. Many works hang in the Met.
After his work was featured in a home county show, he became part of a traveling group exhibit with the Museum of Modern Art in 1938. Other prominent showings followed. With his work often characterized as folk art, Pippin portrayed scenes of African-American life as seen in Domino Players (1943) and Harmonizing (1944). He was noted for biblical paintings like Christ and the Woman of Samaria (1940) and his own richly textured self-portraits as well.
Pippin was also known for historical, politicized output with a series of paintings about abolitionist John Brown and President Abraham Lincoln. He was completely self-taught as an artist outside of a limited stint of classes at the Barnes Foundation and was featured in publications like Newsweek and Vogue.
Entirely too binary for me. It's a job for a computer scientist. Maybe the revelation of the context will help clarify the deep allegorical meaning. I wonder, too , is this a velvet painting like I see at county fairs and mall parking lots?
TrumpLegacy of Racial Healing
Old Man Trump
Words by Woody Guthrie, Music by Ryan Harvey
I suppose that Old Man Trump knows just how much racial hate
He stirred up in that bloodpot of human hearts
When he drawed that color line
Here at his Beach Haven family project
Beach Haven ain't my home!
No, I just can't pay this rent!
My money's down the drain,
And my soul is badly bent!
Beach Haven is Trump’s Tower
Where no black folks come to roam,
No, no, Old Man Trump!
Old Beach Haven ain't my home!
I'm calling out my welcome to you and your man both
Welcoming you here to Beach Haven
To love in any way you please and to have some kind of a decent place
To have your kids raised up in.
Beach Haven ain't my home!
No, I just can't pay this rent!
My money's down the drain,
And my soul is badly bent!
Beach Haven is Trump’s Tower
Where no black folks come to roam,
No, no, Old Man Trump!
Old Beach Haven ain't my home!
Digging up graves.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3173456/Vigilante-protesters-start-DIGGING-body-Confederate-general-Nathan-Forrest-KKK-leader-grave.html
Can I get Paddy O or Freeman Hunt to explain the slope is not steep, slippery and bereft of off-ramps?
Where did you find that event Poster for a Soros sponsored Wrestle At The Statue Mania?
There will be a show at every southern statue site. Bring your own clubs.
The attendance is usually 10 citizens, 50 paid Organizers, and 700 News Media personel.
rhhardin said...
"Kellogs vs Post in the cereal wars."
Tony the Tiger (Frosted Flakes*) versus Sugar Bear (Sugar Crisps*). Two get poured into the bowl, only one leaves.
I assume both names of the cereals were changed at some point but that is what they used to be called.
Quaestor said...
I'd prefer a painting of a boatman, a cabbage, a goat and a lion.
First, the boatman takes the goat across. Then he returns and loads the cabbage aboard, which he takes across. On arrival, he unloads the cabbage and reloads the goat. Returning to the starting point the boatman unloads the goat. The lion then eats the boatman, followed by the goat. The cabbage rejoices.
FIFY
This painting should not be burned or slashed to ribbons or covered over with red paint. But it SHOULD be sent to India because that is the only place in the world (after a full three minutes of Binging) where bears and tigers both live.
To have a painting of these two species in any other part of the world is cultural appropriation, and barely less inhumane than confining bears and tigers in the same zoo. And don't get me started on the reprehensible practice of putting animals in zoos in the first place!
The only way this painting could be more offensive would be to paint a pussy hat on the bear, since we know bears are more like dogs, and cats are already more aggressive to dogs than dogs are to cats.
The cabbage puts down roots on a distant shore.
This is why there are plants on every island with soil. Birds had nothing to do with it.
I see where Walmart is becoming publicly political. From WSJ: " Chief Executive Doug McMillon criticized the president’s initial unwillingness to specifically denounce the racist hate groups that rallied in Charlottesville over the weekend."
So baseball bats, shin guards, etc. will only be sold to those left of center?
Some more enlightened places still sell Sugar Crisp.
It's the alt-right battling the ctrl-left.
It's getting to the point that a plain white wall would be offensive to some.
The subjective has become all; the objective is meaningless to the point where many are convinced that their subjective experience has objective importance.
This habit will not end well.
The alt left now resembling the French revolutionaries that destroyed the remains of a thousand years of French kings.
Where does it end ?
Re Happy Warrior: A white wall?!?!?!?!
Horrors!!!!
"Where does it end ?"
It doesn't!
In other news, China and India are inching towards a border war.
Looks like there is finally movement to replace the Confederate monument in my hometown. Great!
Painting is poor but reminds me of "The Tiger and the Strawberry" in Zen.
What Trump's press conference demonstrated is that it is literally impossible to win a virtue signalling battle against the Left- literally impossible. And the ironic thing is this- the Left has already lost the overall war, it simply doesn't realize it yet. Only an extreme partisan doesn't recognize that Trump was absolutely right about the violence in Charlottesville and elsewhere. The mainstream media isn't going to regain its influence, and the way they are carrying on right now only ensures that outcome.
I shall talk of a happier time to come.
Specifically, October 1st, 2018, when all those journalists and politicians who are comparing conservatives and Republicans to Nazis will change their tone. For some mysterious reason.
The happy time will last until November 7th.
A shorter period of time than we may like, but such a time it will be!
Aspiring Democratic Party candidates will assure us that yes, we are important, and our opinions and values are important, and why would anyone want to deny us our rights? The first and second amendments? Big fans!
Republicans and gunowners are Nazis? No, they never said THAT, and if they did, they didn't mean it -- not that they are insulting our intelligence of course! No, its just...just...complex.
Hey, anyone hear from Brooklyn Homegirl Linda Sarsour lately? She used to be quite the thing in media circles. Had an opinion on everything. The guest of every march and the front page picture in every newspaper.
Wonder what happened?
I just want to say how pleased I have been to be an Althouse reader during these post-Charlottesville days. She's done such a good job of blogging the various storylines. To the extent that she has betrayed any opinion at all (which isn't all that much) she's been spot-on in my judgment. She's been careful, and yet still interesting. A pleasure to follow.
Having said that, I want to come back to one of my own themes which is this; making the nuanced argument about the rights of odious demonstrators like the neo-Nazi white supremacist groups is hard, and it takes great care and discipline. Althouse has it. Donald Trump does not. I really wish Trump had it in him, to be able to go on national television and change minds -- go "over" the media if he thinks he could -- about the importance of allowing even the most reprehensible speech to be given constitutional protection.
But Trump is the guy who lost all credibility with his claims that Obama wasn't born in Hawaii; and Trump is the guy who excoriated federal judges (like the U.S. District Court judge in Virginia who so rightly upheld the rights of the pro-statue demonstrators to assemble and speak).
And on and on. I wish that there were more disciplined legal minds on the American political stage; people with minds like Althouse. It sure isn't Trump.
Al Gore's Manbearpig paintings are getting stranger.
"I really wish Trump had it in him, to be able to go on national television and change minds -- go "over" the media if he thinks he could -- about the importance of allowing even the most reprehensible speech to be given constitutional protection."
You're funny.
What makes anyone think that DJT really wants to do that, but he's unable because he needs a better understanding of juris prudence? Is it impossible to imagine that DJT isn't doin' that good-person lawyerly type stuff cause he's a racist?
Sugar Crisp cereal is now Golden Crisp. Frosted Flakes were previously Sugar Frosted Flakes. Also, Sugar Pops are now Corn Pops.
Is it impossible to imagine that DJT isn't doin' that good-person lawyerly type stuff cause he's a racist?
Non-sequitur.
But that's no surprise.
It's funny as someone who doesn't like Trump but isn't committed to a narrative about him to see how many people are committed to the narrative. It's lot like a really bad marriage. Everything he does and says is viewed through a lens of disappointment or anger on the one side, or (less so now) idealism on the other.
Meanwhile, Guam is safe (remember how last week Trump's rhetoric was going to cause a nuclear war?) and China is responding interestingly about the South China Sea.
That's good, no matter what view I have about him as a person.
Crouching Tiger, Hidden Bear.
I thought some of the KKK/Alt-Right/Nazis during the torch lighting ceremony were pretty hot. I like the look-hair, clothes, and some of them had rocking bodies. They had a nice clean look to them and their faces glowed from the light of the torch. I like the haircuts too. I have to admit I got a little hard when they were walking through the campus with their torch. Although, some of them were calling people faggots-that is not cool!
Why so few women though? Find some hot chicks.
I could definitely see this look influencing the runways this season.
tits
What makes anyone think that DJT really wants to do that, but he's unable because he needs a better understanding of juris prudence? Is it impossible to imagine that DJT isn't doin' that good-person lawyerly type stuff cause he's a racist?
Here's where we gat back to that thorny business of facts and evidence-type stuff. If Donald Trump were a racist bigot, I'd like to see some evidence of it. I'm sure that some will cite to the decades-old Justice Department settlement with Fred Trump's company over racial discrimination in Queens housing blocks. Or Donald Trump's innumerable cloddish statements about race and racial relations. Or Trump's seeming obsession with denouncing and diminishing Barack Obama. They are all reasons that I never wanted Trump as a Republican nominee in the first place.
But I have no clear evidence of Donald Trump governing from a position of racial discrimination.
I do think that the overwhelming legal issue of this moment is the preservation of First Amendment rights for groups with odious viewpoints. The First Amendment doesn't mean much, if we can't rely on it to protect unpopular, disfavored and even offensive viewpoints.
That's where we need advocacy, from the Bully Pulpit of the White House.
And on that task, Trump is doubly disabled. He's an oaf of a debater; and he starts from a position of weakness given all of the other stuff I've mentioned.
Freeman Hunt:
What comment do you have about digging up grave sites?
Same question to you, Paddy O.
Chuck add to your list:
http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2016-election/donald-trump-says-central-park-five-are-guilty-despite-dna-n661941
And there are all the reports of stuff such as DJT not wanting to see black folks in certain position in his casinos. Sure, it's a 'they said, he said'.
Nevermind that, even though you don't see it, the racists are getting the message it's a new dawn w/ DJT in charge:
http://time.com/4569129/racist-anti-semitic-incidents-donald-trump/
And, that was before the newest racist-justifying by DJT.
P.S.
Does the protection of free speech rights require us to call the folks who join in with racist speaking 'very fine people'? Seems like saying that they have the legal right to speaking doesn't mean that we and POTUS need to say they're very fine people.
But, different strokes for different folks.
The coup to remove Trump is afoot. He is in the way of tempting monetary rewards for the Swamp Creatures to complete selling off America's wealth and Defenses. He is our last chance to keep the independent Republic that Washington, Jackson and Lincoln hammered out with strong leadership.
So far Soros and European Nazis have made the highest bid. And Murdoch has evidently decided to get his boys a place in the World Governance. And soon singing the Star Spangled Banner will be stopped because it always was hate speech to our new owners.
@tradguy, agree. When I got up this morning my wife told me "The War has begun."
Okay? It's crappy art, if that's what you mean.
So is this "art" Ann?
Would you be in favor of a law preventing me from destroying it?
Or perhaps deciding that I only liked the white tiger (like the Magic Christian and the nose). Would you favor a law that forbade me from cutting out the tiger and buring the rest of the painting?
Assuming that I owned it and there was no covenant preventing me from doing so.
Meade: I asked earlier if claiming that carrying out the trash in the kitchen was destroying a work of "art" and that you would not be party to this sacrelige. I wondered if you'd had a chance to try it out on Ann yet?
https://www.aol.com/article/2015/10/27/cleaners-mistake-art-installation-for-trash-and-throw-it-away/21254751/
John Henry
Birkel, in general or for a particular reason?
I thought that the repositioning of graves into Colma was an odd decision but I can understand it. It's something the government of San Francisco thought was necessary.
I also understand archeological purposes, though I can appreciate the sensitivity about that given how bodies were then used for entertainment purposes (museum or sideshow displays).
Digging up the body of Richard III was quite an interesting event. Sometimes it's necessary for DNA purposes, I suppose.
Digging up ol' John Wycliff was an evil act.
Speaking of monuments and grave sites. At my alma mater, there was a major memorial to an abolitionist who wanted to be buried on a campus dedicated to anti-slavery.
The tall memorial was removed a long while ago, because apparently its location right outside the windows of a women's dormitory led to complaints by said women. I forget if they said it scared them. Anyhow, when I was a student there twenty years ago, all there was to mark the grave was a plaque on the ground, in the middle of a small garden, between walkways. I only knew of it because I was given a historical tour of the campus as part of my history major orientation. Most students never knew it was there, and I'll bet most alumni still don't. But I'm pretty sure most students know the name of the founding president of the college and his anti-slavery obsession.
That's not really saying much of anything, just making note about how monuments come and monuments go, but people somehow still remember history.
"Can I get Paddy O or Freeman Hunt to explain the slope is not steep, slippery and bereft of off-ramps?"
If you build the slope to encompass ALL monuments and refuse to build any off ramps, than yes, it's quite slippery. Why you would build it that way, I have no idea.
I ask, Paddy O, because yesterday I assured you there was no logical stopping point for the Leftist Collectivists in this current situation. Today, we now know that Nathan Forrest's grave was disturbed - on video - by Leftists who wanted to remove his body.
So again I ask you what logical stopping point you see for Leftists? After all you cannot find yourself objecting to the removal of statues. I want to know if digging up a 100 year old grave as political protest is too far. And I want you to reconsider your support as you will never get the pee out of the pool.
"What comment do you have about digging up grave sites?"
In general? Or Bedford Forrest specifically? Or officials doing it? Or people doing it on their own? Or what?
Freeman Hunt,
The Leftists were digging up a grave because it contained a Democrat who fought for the Confederacy and was buried over a century ago.
You two think there is a natural stopping point in the current movement to demonstrate Will to Power. I am suggesting that indulging the impulse of the Leftist Collectivists in any way will make it harder to stop the coming conflagration.
This is a no contest. My money is on the bear.
Freeman Hunt,
The Leftists were digging up a grave because it contained a Democrat who fought for the Confederacy and was buried over a century ago.
No, I do not support people going out and deciding on their own to destroy monuments and dig up graves. I am fine with communities going through official channels to make changes (or not) wherein citizens can support or object to such things.
If I were in a community with anything honoring Nathan Bedford Forrest, I would be very strongly on the supporting removal side.
" I am suggesting that indulging the impulse of the Leftist Collectivists in any way will make it harder to stop the coming conflagration."
And I am suggesting that being totally unreasonable, taking an arbitrary hard line, and agreeing with them that all of these things are the same only bring on the (possible) "coming conflagration."
It is impossible to say if this is good art or bad art until we know who created it.
I am curious who came up with the look for those guys. There was definitely some thought put into it and some of them are rocking it. They have definitely had conversations with each other about hair/clothes and the look. I don't think I ever did a nazi before, but I can't be sure.
The more I look at it, the more I like it. I almost certainly would not pay the asking price for the painting, but I wouldn't mind it in my house.
Hey, anyone hear from Brooklyn Homegirl Linda Sarsour lately? she twitted her support for the Antifa defending the Jewish people(hers words , more or less,For Ripley)
Let's remember that lost causers dug up Nathan Bedford Forrest's original grave and moved him to the Memphis city park where his remains now rest. It's not a cemetery, so should it really be regarded as a final resting place?
"Reasonable people can clearly differentiate between the legacies of men who fought against the United States in order to maintain an economic system built on the institution of human slavery and men honored as founders of the nation, be they flawed men who owned slaves themselves.
"Erasing that difference in order to defend the men who led the fight for cecession does a disservice to historical fact and to the ideals championed by Washington and the rest of the founders. ...
"Still, even as those distinctions were (perhaps erroneously) wiped away, it's crucial to note that the distinction between Confederate monuments and monuments to slaveholding Founding Fathers remains. Conflating the removal of Confederate monuments with a broader attempt to erase history is inaccurate both philosophically and empirically."
Can You Tell The Difference Between Confederate Leaders and George Washington? Baltimore Officials Can.
Why so few women though? Find some hot chicks.
As with some of the islamofascists, this could be part of their problem.
Freeman, doesn't removal of the Taney monument destroy the writer's entire argument?
Can Baltimore officials tell the difference between real dangers and inconsequential manufactured disputes about laughable cartoonish groups?
220 murders in Baltimore this year so far. 220 people dead, and more injured because of violence.
None of this bloodshed caused by having statues of Confederates in the city.
Reasonable people
Facts not in evidence, as the TV lawyers say.
The bear looks like he came off the pages of "Where The Wild Things Are".
"So again I ask you what logical stopping point you see for Leftists? After all you cannot find yourself objecting to the removal of statues."
I can't find myself objecting to removing all statues? In every possible setting? That's a sweeping statement I don't think I implied at all.
I don't speak for Leftists. I just speak for myself. I agree with Freeman.
I think desecrating graves is wrong. And people should be rightly prosecuted. I think arresting one of the protestors who pulled down the statue was a right act. I wish the police had acted more forthrightly during the whole of the Charlottesville protest.
I just don't think all statues have to be left forever. Like Freeman very nicely wrote about yesterday, that would mean getting lost in a sea of perpetual statuary.
We can change our decoration at different points in our society. It'd be odd if we didn't. A 40 year old guy wearing his high school letterman jacket is a bit creepy (except maybe at a reunion). I don't have my high school graduation tassle hanging from my rear view mirror.
Leftists, as always go too far, but it doesn't mean there's a point worth hearing that's shared by non-Leftists. Leftists are fundamentalists, dependent on rage and community shaped by a shared enemy. But like as in Christianity I don't have to choose between being a Fundamentalist or an atheist, and can critique both sides each in their own way, so too in politics.
Red means stop. Green means go. Yellow means caution.
Freeman Hunt:
You don't understand the Leftist Collectivists.
In the coming years you'll be able to reconsider at many points of departure. But there are no off-ramps on the slope you've chosen.
"Freeman, doesn't removal of the Taney monument destroy the writer's entire argument?"
No, it proves his point.
"Look no further than Mount Vernon Place in Baltimore. On Tuesday, the monument to Justice Taney shared the square with the monument to Washington (and another to the Marquis de Lafayette, the revolution-era French general). Today, only Washington and Lafayette remain."
"Leftists, as always go too far, but it doesn't mean there's a point worth hearing that's shared by non-Leftists. Leftists are fundamentalists, dependent on rage and community shaped by a shared enemy. But like as in Christianity I don't have to choose between being a Fundamentalist or an atheist, and can critique both sides each in their own way, so too in politics."
Exactly.
"But there are no off-ramps on the slope you've chosen."
No, that's the slope you've chosen, the All Statues Are the Same slope.
How many people in Baltimore live in serious poverty -- multi-generational poverty? How many lack even a third-grade level education and are consequently essentially unemployable? How many live in despair and spend too much of their day self-medicating on alcohol or some drug?
There are some things that have a much greater priority if people really cared. Statues and the existence of small groups of loser-punks who call themselves neo-Nazis or white nationalists is far, far, far down the list.
Paddy O:
I do not count you a Leftist Collectivist. So please pay attention to what I wrote. I asked you what logical stopping point you think they have.
When does the Will to Power stop?
Freeman Hunt:
Help me out by pointing to the historical precedents in which appeasement worked.
"Help me out by pointing to the historical precedents in which appeasement worked."
You are calling it appeasement because you don't agree with it. It's not appeasement to me and other libertarians and conservatives like me. It's something we support regardless of what progressives want.
When does the Will to Power stop?
It stops when the practitioner and society itself is in the grave. It stops the same way it stopped with the guy who came up with the phrase -- with suicidal nihilism and despair.
Mark said...
It is impossible to say if this is good art or bad art until we know who created it.
Horace Pippin! He was a self-taught African-American painter. The injustice of slavery and American segregation figure prominently in many of his works.
So exiledonmainstreet got it right!
"mtrobertslaw said...
This is a no contest. My money is on the bear"
Oh, I don't know. Muscle density and quality in that cat is much higher than the bear. I don't think anybody is walking away from this one.
The distinction between the Founding Fathers and those who championed secession is interesting. But there's a counter-argument. The Founding Fathers were in a position to outlaw human slavery but did not. Had they done so, there would have been no secessionists.
This whole thing illustrates the problem of treating long past generations as if they were alive today and holding them to particular standards that happen to be in vogue today.
3rdGradePB_GoodPerson said...
Chuck add to your list:
http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2016-election/donald-trump-says-central-park-five-are-guilty-despite-dna-n661941
Right; point taken. It may not have been overtly racial, and indeed the "innocence" of the Central Park Five is in some reasonable dispute. Certainly the city settlement with them is a dubious matter. But Trump's own pronouncements on the case were outlandish and unjustifiable. More baggage for Trump as a national advocate in the 21st century.
And there are all the reports of stuff such as DJT not wanting to see black folks in certain position in his casinos. Sure, it's a 'they said, he said'.
On that one, my personal hunch is that Trump said stuff just like that. But like you, I'd like some better proof.
Nevermind that, even though you don't see it, the racists are getting the message it's a new dawn w/ DJT in charge:
http://time.com/4569129/racist-anti-semitic-incidents-donald-trump/
And, that was before the newest racist-justifying by DJT.
I can't speak for the neo-Nazis or the white supremacists since I've never been part of any of their groups. I'd have to say that I'll judge Trump on what he says and does, with little regard to how any non-governmental organizations choose to respond to Trump.
P.S.
Does the protection of free speech rights require us to call the folks who join in with racist speaking 'very fine people'? Seems like saying that they have the legal right to speaking doesn't mean that we and POTUS need to say they're very fine people.
But, different strokes for different folks.
No, I think it is sloppy and stupid to utter anything like "they are some very fine people" in a neo-Nazi organization.
Ann Althouse hasn't ever once to my knowledge uttered anything like the notion that there might be "some very fine people" among the neo-Nazis and white supremacists. She has rhetorical discipline. And much more effectively than Trump, she is making the case that First Amendment rights exist for all of us and need to be taken as seriously as anything in this case.
See, Freeman Hunt, you just cannot understand that I would agree with you if - and only if - I thought there would be an end to all the controversy by ceding a single point. But read these comment sections and see how many Leftists are arguing in good faith. See how many would not simply move the goalposts and keep right on pushing.
They know they have lost political support during the Obama Administration. But they're pushing their cultural fight because that is where they sense weakness.
If I thought there was somebody with whom to negotiate in good faith, like yourself, I would more than happily cede lots of points. Ceding a single point to Leftist Collectivists earns you nothing but their contempt.
Well, if Horace Pippin was an African-American, then this would presumably be good art.
But, society reserves the right to change that view in a hundred years and to then rip his works off the wall and toss them on a bonfire.
@Wagner, that painting is not as bad as it looks.
OK, I just read a bunch of articles about the look they want. They want to be sexy and hip. You also need to work out. Fatties are not welcome. There will be cameras and they don't want to look like a bunch of gross fatties-I am with ya girl. The look is actually more important than their grievances-love that! Your white polos should stop right in the middle of your bicep to accentuate your guns-love it! Also the shirts need to be tucked in and no longer than the beginning of your Member-excellent! Short, well sculpted hair-natch! Prefer clean shaven but if you have a beard it must be well trimmed-of course. And yes the fashion world is already taking note.
Jesus they sound like me! Those comments were from the blogger who runs Stormfront which is now down and I am devastated. I need to get more info. I guess he has a store on the site too!
Birkel, you asked me to answer for what Leftists will do, not what we will do as a society.
I have no idea what will get them to stop. But, we know from society that Christian fundamentalists lost their power to control over the last 50 years. The Christian Right in the 80s was not a expression of power, it was an expression of power being lost, so got all dramatic.
As a nation we're not ever going to agree and there are sharp divisions that will never go away. So we organize ourselves in certain ways so that the majority has a strong influence without being able to tyrannize the minority.
I like what those old Virginians put together back in the late 1700s. I think that created a system that allowed tensions and resolution to find balance. I wish they extended its protections to all people who lived in this country, basically punting the problem to future generations, but I can understand how politics blunts ideals.
So, the rule of law is in place. We can and should follow that. I'm against mobs, but I'm okay with elected officials or overall resolutions that point to change.
What will get Leftists to stop? Probably nothing. That's part of the brilliance of our system. A person can keep having whatever opinions they want, and have the freedom to declare it out and loud. Leftists get to keep being leftists and call for whatever they want to call for. As a society, we as a whole listen and adjudicate through our voting who we as a whole want to be. If the Leftist convince more people, then that's how society wants to be.
My impression is there's a vast number of people who are tired of both sides, and a vast number of people who are doing on the ground healing that aren't caught up in the dysfunction that the media emphasizes. I refuse to let my emotions or my energy be dictated by multi-national corporations and political hucksters.
As a society we can and should follow the laws we made, and that's what constrains all the crazies in every direction.
"Ceding"
It's not ceding if it's what you already think. You may just as easily say they are ceding to you. Why allow them to own an issue alone that you agree with them on?
omg-everything should be fitted too-not too tight, but fitted to show off your assets-bingo-I am sold. When is the next rally? I want to work that runway with a torch!
"Ceding a single point to Leftist Collectivists earns you nothing but their contempt."
This is why I keep bringing up Christian fundamentalists. The same is true for them. But now where are they? Crying "Shame!" and rousing true believers didn't actually result in winning. More people are turned off by that even if they wouldn't say so in public. Maybe it's part of our British heritage, we like debate but are embarrassed by extremism and don't want to be a part of that.
The more they display their contempt, the less people are convinced their contempt is worth caring about. They're exhausting their moral outrage.
"No, it proves his point."
His argument was that reasonable people could distinguish between those who fought against the US and those who did not.
Taney did not fight against the US, but his statue was removed. The reasonable people argument fails.
Their moral outrage is unlimited. Look how the causes the Leftists have pushed are further from the middle. The middle voted on many things and the Left pushed further. Judges agreed and suddenly it was settled law and the next outrage started. Again and again.
Even when I agreed with the Left on specific topics I was insufficiently supportive. And they kept pushing. Recognizing the pattern, I must now resist.
"And they kept pushing. Recognizing the pattern, I must now resist"
And I think you're good resisting. We need Democrats to be Democrats and Republicans to be Republicans, and we need people on different sides of issues to argue with each other.
I think the pushback against the Leftist mob is entirely right. Even as I suggest not meeting them on the fields of battle they choose, but rather putting them off guard and exposing hypocrisy and their own fascist tendencies.
Titus,
If that's all they've got, you're letting them off too easily.
How about some attention to quality. I haven't read their founding documents, only your assessment of such. But, I've seen the pictures. Wearing a "Polo" polo shirt is tacky enough, but these folks are way beyond that lameness. They're in the "Walmart" polo shirts--and not ironically!!!
Also, the shoes/boots are a total giveaway. Instead of garbage made in China, how about some Italian leather? White folks come from there. Sure, Salvatore may not make stuff that's good for stomping on the rights of minorities. But, Gucci has made some tough-ish boots, from time to time. A favorite from a few years back had a buckle (maybe two, I should dig them out) and laces--can stomp all day, and they'll stay put.
Anywho,
carry on.
I guess what I'm saying is I don't have faith in the Left or the Right, but I have faith in the American people, even when I disagree with a good many of them on a lot of issues. There comes a time to say, STOP. And in our history we've been better at that then most any other nation.
I think Hitler depended on a particular soft view of Americans too. As did Stalin. As if Americans will just keep putting up with whatever.
And when we've failed, then we rightfully should acknowledge the fact, be ashamed we didn't live up to our self-expectations, then try to put things right. Our treatment of slaves or native Americans isn't historically unique, cultures throughout world history and the present do the same. It's that our self-identity was built on something better, and those reflect how we betrayed our own priorities as stated in our laws. We should have done better because we're trying to be better than what the rest of the world is about.
Lee and Washington were both Virginia Aristocrats. They both lead an Army of Virginians who were in rebellion against Authority established by the Anglican Church. And The Anglican Church loved the slavery system of Scottish Slaves, Irish Slaves and finally African Slaves that made them immense wealth as the overseers worked them to a quick death in the Sugar Islands.
But they were both intelligent men who knew how to win the hearts and minds of men. Not that that is any excuse.
Apparently now that "Russia Russia Russia" has lost all its exclamation points, and Lil Kim has decided to let Guam tip over on its own, the new bogeyman for those prone to hysteria is... "Nazis!" They may be coming to your town! Quick, tear down those statues to keep them away!
America is full of Nazis! They elected Trump as their leader! That makes him... OMG... literally Hitler!
Blake’s tyger burning bright intended, according to a friend, a Blake expert, to be a comedic interlude into a parody (beats me), but this looks like a mortal arbitrament. I like the art. A lot. Frozen-in-time enemies. Powerful.
The Nazi haircut is very close to USMC regulation. It stemmed from WWI so that troops would get a good seal on their gas masks by avoiding facial hair entrainment.
They all had to have the same torches too. This was wonderful choreography and planning. It was like a Broadway show!
And there were inspections! fabulous.
Freeman Hunt said...If I were in a community with anything honoring Nathan Bedford Forrest, I would be very strongly on the supporting removal side.
Including his fucking grave, I guess. What should be done with the body, do you think?
Dig him up, prop him against some wall for people to throw stones at? The Leftists did that during Spain in the 30's, to nuns and priests, didn't they?
Freeman Hunt said...You are calling it appeasement because you don't agree with it. It's not appeasement to me and other libertarians and conservatives like me. It's something we support regardless of what progressives want.
Paddy O
If these conversations were had 20 years ago, as Bill Clinton was entering his second term, I might very well have taken the position that statues and flags and all the rest was a reasonable move. I thought Clinton a capable individual (if amoral and personally repugnant) and the Congressional leadership adult. Now there are no prominent moderate voices of import in the Democrat caucus. And frankly, I trust the Republicans even less. And the president can be a blunt instrument.
I trust you'll fully join my position when the lowest of the low hanging fruit are consumed. We understand one another, at least.
Paddy O said...Maybe it's part of our British heritage, we like debate but are embarrassed by extremism and don't want to be a part of that.
Good thing it's not the Leftist Media who get to define extremism, huh?
Good thing the Left hasn't successfully taken over most of academia so as to get to define extremism, huh?
Good thing the Left doesn't control virtually all the levers of cultural power, giving them the ability to selectively define extremism as they see fit, huh?
Otherwise we might be in some trouble!
Blogger Freeman Hunt said...
"Ceding"
It's not ceding if it's what you already think. You may just as easily say they are ceding to you. Why allow them to own an issue alone that you agree with them on?
I think we need to start a pool.
How many years after all of the statues of democrat leaders of the confederacy are removed will it be before the first grade school textbook lists the leaders of the confederacy as "alt-right/conservatives?"
I say 15 tops.
“ ... Nazi haircut is very close to USMC regulation ...”
Didn’t tell me that when I went to join the Marines.
Going from memory, hair cannot interfere with any headgear, there was an inches-to-bulk rule, something about buns and bandanas (I forget, did not apply to me), but the ‘racks FAN sometimes required a gas mask, so I'm doubting that the protestors sleep together, in any organized way.
You don't care about these statues, you agree with the Left that they ought to come down. Ok, fine, good, take 'em down, dig up the graves, whatever. Have fun.
It's just stupid to think it'll stop there, but you've got faith; good for you.
Hey, have you noticed that while you sided with the Left you helped normalize the idea of caving to Leftist tactics, and mob tactics, to effect social change? Did you stop and think "gee, even if the result is one I support, maybe it's dangerous to lend my voice and my consent to the Left's extralegal actions--maybe enforcing the idea that the government and/or society at large should follow the dictates of the screaming (Leftist) mob isn't such a good idea?"
Or no, I guess not. I guess all you smart people insisting "there's only one side" and happily joining with the Left in calling me a Nazi know better.
Just 'cause I'm curious: what % of the people who voted Republican in the last presidential election do you think are Nazis, too? The Left says 100%, of course, but I guess if you're one of them you think it's a little lower than that. I didn't vote Republican, but I'm still a Nazi now--so under the Rubio/Romney/Holder "good real American" standard how many of those people are on the wrong/bad/immoral/bigoted racist Nazi side?
BTW Ach,
Speaking of text books, a while back the libs were all fussy about this:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/answer-sheet/wp/2014/09/12/proposed-texas-textbooks-are-inaccurate-biased-and-politicized-new-report-finds/?utm_term=.f47efea3b28e
Do you know what eventually happened?
I don't.
I.e., not rhetorical Q.
My cafe comment is that I look at what happened not just last Saturday, but what I see in the commentary from McCain, McConnell, and other people I once respected, and I am depressed.
So...I found this on Horace Pippin. It's interesting: http://artistproject.metmuseum.org/5/josiah-mcelheny/
Self-taught artist that depicted scenes that were unusual themes (e.g. the life of poor blacks at the turn of the century, being a soldier in WWI) for the time the pictures were painted, which put him the "outsider art" category.
The art itself isn't aesthetically realistic, but the guy was painting with an arm that was nearly shot off in WWI. His first oil painting was this presentation of the his company fighting Germans in the trenches: http://www.philamuseum.org/collections/permanent/46280.html
Yeah, the people and airplanes are crudely rendered, but the the layers of texture are fantastic. Trees, trenches, fences of barbed wire, black layer on black layer.
The Left starts with symbols, moves to groups, and eventually gets to individuals.
You don't like these symbols so it's "you go, girl! That righteous civil disobedient mob pulling those racist hate symbols down, yeah! In your face, Nazi racist bigots!"
What do you care? You're not a Nazi. I wasn't, either, but last night I found out I am! Mitt Romney--a guy I voted for!--told me I am a Nazi because I'm not on the side of the good people like Antifa is. So, you know, bad luck for me. Oh, Rubio said that my being a Nazi justifies violence against me, too, so that's double bad luck.
And nice people like you smart Althouse commenters obviously wouldn't want a Nazi to be tolerated--that's "not who we are." If some good Lefty engages in direct action and cracks my head open, well, that's just what I get. I understand.
Also, the big cat will start with a burst of total ferocity, whereas the bear's commitment can be iffy when it experiences something unpleasant. There's a reason we think of bears as "lumbering".
Fuck it; I'm down with the cat.
Ach,
You'll be happy to know that, so far, textbooks are speaking the truth, as written by the cons/alt-right:
"On Page 126, a caption in a section about immigration referred to Africans brought to American plantations between the 1500s and 1800s as “workers” rather than slaves."
https://www.nytimes.com/2015/10/06/us/publisher-promises-revisions-after-textbook-refers-to-african-slaves-as-workers.html
"A Chicago pastor has asked the Emanuel administration to remove the names of two presidents who owned slaves from parks on the South Side, saying the city should not honor slave owners in black communities."
Well, perhaps public art isn't dead after all. It seems we can just remove statues of America's first hate-President from "black communities". Then I guess we'll need to get ol' hate-FDR out of Japanese communities. I suspect the German communities won't be too happy about him either, or Wilson. And pretty much everyone from hate-Polk on will be unwelcome in the Mexican communities.
Paul's right.
Always bet on Big Cat:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=12&v=AIfYMIgoPCw
[and PFT]
CBS Chicago: Pastor Calls for Washington, Jackson Names to be Removed from Park
Bishop James Dukes, pastor of Liberation Christian Center, said he wants the statue gone, and he wants George Washington’s name removed from the park.
“When I see that, I see a person who fought for the liberties, and I see people that fought for the justice and freedom of white America, because at that moment, we were still chattel slavery, and was three-fifths of humans,” he said. “Some people out here ask me, say ‘Well, you know, he taught his slaves to read.’ That’s almost sad; the equivalent of someone who kidnaps you, that you gave them something to eat.”
Dukes said, even though Washington was the nation’s first president and led the American army in the Revolutionary War, he’s no hero to the black community.
“There’s no way plausible that we would even think that they would erect a Malcolm X statue in Mount Greenwood, Lincoln Park, or any of that. Not that say Malcolm X was a bad guy; they just would not go for it,” he said. “Native Americans would not even think about putting up a Custer statue, because of the atrocities that he plagued upon Native Americans. And for them to say to us ‘just accept it’ is actually insulting.”
“I think we should be able to identify and decide who we declare heroes in or communities, because we have to tell the stories to our children of who these persons are,” he said.
He said parks, statues, or other monuments honoring Presidents Washington and Jackson might be appropriate elsewhere, but not in black neighborhoods.
“In an African-American community, it’s a slap in the face and it’s a disgrace for them to honor someone who was a slave owner.
---
“I am feeling ambivalent that I would have to walk my child, attend a parade or enjoy a game of softball in a park that commemorates the memory of a slave owner,” he wrote. “Therefore, I call on the immediate removal of President George Washington and President Andrew Jackson names from the parks located on the southeast side of Chicago. They should not have the distinct honor of being held as heroes when they actively participated in the slave trade.”
The man's got a point, Paddy O. Washington and Jackson's names make people uncomfortable, so they gotta go.
All this hassle because Hillary lost the election. Maybe they should have nominated someone else.
3rdGradePB_GoodPerson said...
BTW Ach,
Speaking of text books, a while back the libs were all fussy about this:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/answer-sheet/wp/2014/09/12/proposed-texas-textbooks-are-inaccurate-biased-and-politicized-new-report-finds/?utm_term=.f47efea3b28e
Do you know what eventually happened?
I don't.
I.e., not rhetorical Q.
I am still reading that article. It is long. It effectively demonstrates exactly what we are up against. There are a lot of confederate/progressive apologists around who would be happy to see those statues go. A lot of "what is wrong? bullets below are wrong too.
But my opinions are subjective too. Everyone has an opinion and everyone's opinion is subjective. This just reinforces the truth that we need to go to a voucher system and stop giving commissions ike this absolute control over what kids are learning.
3rdGradePB_GoodPerson said...
You're funny.
What makes anyone think that DJT really wants to do that, but he's unable because he needs a better understanding of juris prudence? Is it impossible to imagine that DJT isn't doin' that good-person lawyerly type stuff cause he's a racist?
You can imagine it all you want. But it doesn't make your wish come true. Nothing Trump has said or done in response to Charlottesville has been remotely racist. You leftists are just mad your Antifa/IWW/ANSWER thugs are getting called out too.
Yes, the more I think about it, the more obvious it becomes.
This is not even a fair fight. The bear gets shredded before it even knows what is happening.
Case closed. Are you kidding me? A bear? Shit.
"Including his fucking grave, I guess. What should be done with the body, do you think?"
One good idea might be to remove it from the park and put it in a cemetery. Perhaps they could put it in the cemetery it was originally in before they dug it up and moved it to the park in 1904.
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Huh?
"I just thought opining on the political correctness of artwork was the order of the day."
Indeed.
A statue, or any artwork, can represent different things to different people. A statue of Washington can represent a slave-owner to one person and American independence from tyranny to another. I'm genuinely curious about what those confederate statues represent to those who oppose their removal. It's probably not even the statues themselves that people care about, but what the removal of the statues represents to them.
We are presented with an opportunity to start a public dialogue so that we can understand each other better. But unfortunately in our PC climate, one side of this argument has been deemed virtuous and the other side is dismissed as racist. People are afraid to be othered or branded as "nazi-sympathizers" for wanting to give a voice to the "deplorable" Americans-- as is happening to Trump. As a result, real dialogue is replaced with virtue-signaling platitudes, and resentment grows in those who feel shut out.
Too bad.
http://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2017/08/16/officials-condemn-racism-trump-charlottesville-both-sides-tapper-monologue-lead.cnn
Titus said;
"I am curious who came up with the look for those guys."
He worked in Germany back in the 30's. Then he either died or moved to Brazil, it's not clear which.
Seriously, Titus. This is the first time you noticed that NAZIs look hot?
Busted! You got me, Freeman. Dig him up, by all means.
Whatever you think is best. You're one of the good people.
HoodlumDoodlum said ...
"Whatever you think is best. You're one of the good people."
Actually, I think in the end Freeman will turn out to be one of the Bad People. But you and I will go much sooner. They will eat Freeman last.
Enjoy your world, good people.
All it took was one asshole murdering someone for mainstream Republicans like Romney and Rubio to endorse Antifa and Leftwing violence.
All it took was the Left choosing the correct target for good non-Lefties to cheer them on and agree that anyone who might disagree, like me, is a hateful racist Nazi bigot.
This has been an educational few days, genuinely.
HoodlumDoodlum said...
"All it took was one asshole murdering someone for mainstream Republicans like Romney and Rubio to endorse Antifa and Leftwing violence."
Take your own medicine, Hoodlum. What makes you sure it was a case of an "asshole" murdering "someone"? What if it turns out to be someone trying to get away from a murderous mob armed with baseball bats and running over a couple of them in the process? We don't know what the driver was thinking, but we know what the people with the bats were thinking. Don't let the shitheads control the narrative, just 'cause one of them got killed during their riot.
"This has been an educational few days, genuinely."
So Obama was right to Tweet the Mandela quote. Change can happen.
"No one is born hating another person because of the color of his skin, or his background, or his religion. People must learn to hate, and if they can learn to hate, they can be taught to love, for love comes more naturally to the human heart than its opposite."
It is heartbreaking that such terrible violence occurred in recent days, but at least it resulted in you changing your ways, HD. Hopefully, like you, DJT will realize that very fine people don't hangout at racist rallies.
Why does the tiger have black stripes?
Perhaps Pippin was drawing attention to reconciliation and a color guard opposition.
Although, the bear does have white claws, but they are less diverse than the tiger's stripes. Apparently, it was [class] diversity with diversity at the nails' fringe. Clearly there was support for a Pro-Choice settlement through decapitation, dismemberment, and a Planned Parenthood-like harvesting regime... served with liver, kidney beans, and a nice Chianti.
3rdGradePB_GoodPerson said...
"Hopefully, like you, DJT will realize that very fine people don't hangout at racist rallies."
Maybe. I'd say it is a good deal more likely than you admitting that people who get run over in the middle of a crowd of rioters swinging baseball bats may not be entirely sweet and innocent themselves.
You think it's Nelson Mandela we're going to see now, 3rdGrade? Try Winnie. I don't know what the over-under is on the first necklacing, but I know which way I'd bet.
I don't have any "ways" to change. I've learned where everyone stands, though, and that's valuable stuff.
When people I've respected endorse the worldview, tactics, and justifications of people who would happily see me destroyed (socially ostracized, fired from my job, beaten in the streets, etc) for being insufficiently deferential to their Leftist demands...well, like I say, educational.
Right Jupiter,
Your POV that Heather deserved what she got sounds like a winner. No need for you to change.
Hoodlum is woke!
"I was born on this rock, but I've been travelin' thru space,
Since the moment I first realized
What all you fast-talking cats would do if you could,
You know, I'm ready for the final surprise."
"Your POV that Heather deserved what she got sounds like a winner. No need for you to change."
I didn't say that!
Maybe she just went down to the park to play some softball wuth her bat-toting friends. She seems the type. Softballer, I mean.
But it's hard to think of an excuse for anyone to be driving around the streets of Charlottesville in an automobile. That guy was clearly looking to hurt someone.
We really don’t know whether bear and tiger brains are just number crunching algorithm processors. We assume that brains are information systems, operating as survival tools. I don’t know what evidence we have for tiger and bear brains as crunching fight game numbers, algorithmically, rather than in a Stanislas Dehaene 'innate' sort of way. Perhaps lion and bear brains abstract objects into numbers for pure pleasure. Without warnings about fire and fury. And Guam. Maybe they know their own brains as a form of a turing machine? And they wonder what it’s like to a bat to be a bat?
At least she was a white chick, so we don't need to hear a bunch of crap about how she was "turning her life around".
"That guy was clearly looking to hurt someone."
You're getting closer to reality.
Just change the "someone" to "many people."
Trump was going to talk about his infrastructure plan which included building in the inner city. This would get jobs into desolate areas. But the media disrupted that discussion.
Walker got Foxconn to come to Wisconsin but the Democrats are trying to prevent 22,000 good paying jobs from reaching Wisconsin workers, many of whom, in that area, are black. But the media is talking about whether or not to dig up Confederates.
If you don't support digging up Confederates you are a racist - supposedly.
I think that the current issue is Foxconn in Wisconsin and the Trump infrastructure plan nationwide. If they don't go through it will not be good to belong to a Democrat/media complex that DID NOTHING ABOUT JOBS AND HATES THE AMERICAN WORKER. Not even one which can boast that its supporters dug up every Confederate grave in the South and burned Mount Vernon to the ground.
3rdGradePB_GoodPerson said...
"That guy was clearly looking to hurt someone.
You're getting closer to reality.
Just change the "someone" to "many people."
Got it, PB. Anyone who drives a car is quite evidently a mass murderer. And anyone who goes to a riot and hangs out with a bunch of bat-wielding rioters is a Saint. Pretty simple, really. Hard to see how anyone could fail to see the logic of your position.
People divide neatly into Good People and Bad People? That explains the corresponding belief that all statues must be maintained or destroyed.
Perhaps other possibilities exist.
Freeman's right,
Find a middle ground where the statues remain.
It's been done by other countries.
https://journals.worldnomads.com/rayen/photo/7596/207119/Paraguay/der-Betonklotz-mit-den-Resten-der-Statue-des-Diktators-Alfredo-Stroessner
3rdGradePB_GoodPerson said...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/answer-sheet/wp/2014/09/12/proposed-texas-textbooks-are-inaccurate-biased-and-politicized-new-report-finds/?utm_term=.f47efea3b28e
Do you know what eventually happened?
No, but all that stuff about Moses is strange considering -
"As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquility, of Mussulmen (Muslims); and as the said States never entered into any war or act of hostility against any Mahometan (Mohammedan) nation, it is declared by the parties that no pretext arising from religious opinions shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries."
++
The reason was that the books were so lousy. They were false. They were hurried. They would try to be rigorous, but they would use examples (like automobiles in the street for "sets") which were almost OK, but in which there were always some subtleties. The definitions weren't accurate. Everything was a little bit ambiguous -- they weren't smart enough to understand what was meant by "rigor." They were faking it. They were teaching something they didn't understand, and which was, in fact, useless, at that time, for the child." -- Feynman
(Feynman cont)
We came to a certain book, part of a set of three supplementary books published by the same company, and they asked me what I thought about it.
I said, "The book depository didn't send me that book, but the other two were nice."
Someone tried repeating the question: "What do you think about that book?"
"I said they didn't send me that one, so I don't have any judgment on it."
The man from the book depository was there, and he said, "Excuse me; I can explain that. I didn't send it to you because that book hadn't been completed yet. There's a rule that you have to have every entry in by a certain time, and the publisher was a few days late with it. So it was sent to us with just the covers, and it's blank in between. The company sent a note excusing themselves and hoping they could have their set of three books considered, even though the third one would be late."
It turned out that the blank book had a rating by some of the other members! They couldn't believe it was blank, because [the book] had a rating. In fact, the rating for the missing book was a little bit higher than for the two others. The fact that there was nothing in the book had nothing to do with the rating.
My favorite ‘public’ Feynman came in his investigation of the Challenger wipe out, saying NASA and the corresponding secular fideism of politicos, had all fooled themselves and lived in fantasy - worse than "new math," but not much.
3rdGradePB_GoodPerson said...
It is heartbreaking that such terrible violence occurred in recent days, but at least it resulted in you changing your ways, HD. Hopefully, like you, DJT will realize that very fine people don't hangout at racist rallies.
You mean racist rallies organized by Jason Kessler the Obama voter and Occupy Protester?
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