"He wanted his band to be successful. But he didn't want to be the f**king voice of a generation. In reality, if he had lived, I would have had a dad. And that would have been an incredible experience.... Even though Kurt died in the most horrific way possible, there is this mythology and romanticism that surrounds him, because he's 27 forever. The shelf life of an artist or musician isn't particularly long. Kurt has gotten to icon status because he will never age. He will always be that relevant in that time and always be beautiful."
Said Frances Bean Cobain.
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Brian Jones, Jimi Hendrix, Janis Joplin and Jim Morrison all died at the age of 27 between 1969 and 1971. At the time, the coincidence gave rise to some comment, but it was not until the death of Kurt Cobain, about two and a half decades later, that the idea of a "27 Club" began to catch on in public perception.
Janis Joplin was also 27 when she died.
"Exceeding his ambition..."?
More like exceeding his emotional stability and maturity.
Good thing Martin Short didn't base a character on him back in the day, or who knows what Cobain would've been driven to do.
I am Laslo.
Cobain was a lonely, deeply rejected but talented man who self medicated his pain and fears. Rejection won.
I used to think the nature vs. nurture thing was 50/50. As time marches on, I'm thinking nature is 85%, and nurture was 15%. Maybe even 90/10.
On the phone, family members can't distinguish my son from myself.
From the comments...
Kurt Cobain's estate has an estimated value of $450 million, of which his daughter is entitled to 37 percent.
I hope she has financial help to evaluate risks. A pocket full of money can bring out the sharks.
It must hurt like hell to feel like your father didn't love you enough to want to live.
Through the last years of my husband's illness and shortly after his recent death I thought often of suicide. What would be left after me always stopped me. Most especially my son. I can't imagine leaving a child behind on purpose. How could he do that?
Is that the way conservatives view species extinction?
I wish people would drop the "voice of a generation" bs. He is my age and never spoke for me. I have zero affinity for him other than thinking a few of his songs were decent.
She sounds like a pretty smart, level headed young lady. Good for her.
Very striking young lady.
Interesting girl with some unique insights into pain and loss.
So why is it necessary to pepper her speech with all the f-bombs? Dies she think it makes her sound edgy?
Rhythm and Balls said...
Is that the way conservatives view species extinction?
Years ago, yes. Shotgun sequencing was an important method of reading extinct species' DNA.
I really liked Nirvana on the 90's. Not as much as the Pixies. But there were a really good go to sly rock band. And I really enjoyed their angsty Rock.
Then Kurtt killed himself and I went through about a month of sorrow followed by the remainder of my life not giving a crap.
If he was the voice of a generation then it's a pretty cautionary tale.
I now have the same view of him that althouse does of robin Williams. A sour note for sure.
Frack Cobain, he isn't worth discussing. He lived, he died and the world is no different.
I never really got the Kurt Cobain worship, but when I extrapolate it back to the awe I had for Jim Morrison when I was younger, it's easy to understand.
I don't know why, but 27 seems to be a perfect time to die young, even in my own rather mundane life, the year I remember as the best was when I was 26.
Duane Allman was only 24 when he died.
I've never had much use for the 27 myth. Plenty of musicians tragically died younger and older than that age. 27 is just a weird statistical mean.
Blondie Die Young Stay Pretty
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jO5VV5PISHU
I believe Debbie Harry still tours at age 69 (Laslo cue,) but I could be wrong about that,
I have seen some interviews with her, and she gives the impression of being rather mature, well adjusted, and insightful. Surprising given her DNA alone. Courtney Love always struck me as a rather intelligent woman with the capacity to be a talented actress. It's too bad she has such significant emotional and substance abuse issues. I was in junior high in the early 90s when Nirvana blew up, and I can remember the almost cult like status that developed around Kurt Cobain.
Robert Johnson was another to go at 27, but Bix Beiderbecke went at 28 and Charlie Christian at 25.
Wish they all could have made more music. More is better.
Seems like she's coming out surprisingly OK despite terrible circumstances. Celebrity kid. No father, and for one of the worst reasons. And, let's be honest, her one parent was Courtney Love. Sizable handicaps.
On the other hand, rich. If you're going to pick just one advantage to have, well ...
I am disappointed that people who commit suicide are treated as normal members of society, even thought leaders.
Why don't news stories start, "Unstable, selfish, self-destructive Kurt Cobain..."
Also, I'm not sure about her claim (and others') that Cobain grew in stature because of his death. He had attained pretty significant stature already, and I think it would have grown from his potential further achievements as well. And maybe I'm wrong, but I think his Gen X cohort is more cynical than the Boomers who worship Lennon. I don't think death elevates him.
I was pretty much in his target demographic. I was on my first job when he died, and the people I worked with were all Boomers. I had to explain to them why it was such a big deal. They seemed unable to relate, for some reason.
But the loss that hit me hardest was Stevie Ray Vaughan.
Love is an interesting case of lack of self awareness. She wrote a famous screed on how artists were screwed by the labels. One of the big reasons it was famous was that a lot of the details were accurate (probably cribbed from Passman's book on the music industry.) Unfortunately, she never realized that she it the record companies best case for why they should get all the money. Hole was a respectable, but unremarkable, bar band. The second or third best band in any medium sized city in the US. Yeah, they had some of Cobain's lesser songs, but they were nothing special. The record company brought all the value to the table in that deal. They were the one with the rare resource. Hole was a dime a dozen.
Also, I'm not sure about her claim (and others') that Cobain grew in stature because of his death. He had attained pretty significant stature already, and I think it would have grown from his potential further achievements as well. And maybe I'm wrong, but I think his Gen X cohort is more cynical than the Boomers who worship Lennon. I don't think death elevates him.
I think death elevates young people on an uphill gradient and Cobain probably qualifies. Lennon was ten years past his peak. No one in his right mind can/could think Lennon's best days were ahead. One can at least think that about people who died before an obvious long decline.
Nick Broomfield's documentary Kurt & Courtney is fascinating viewing for anyone interested in the subject.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FWJC_jfC0L0
Kurt Cobain died so that Foo Fighters could live.
And Nickelback.
I am Laslo.
I really liked Nirvana on the 90's. Not as much as the Pixies.
We can be friends forever for that statement.
You people who didn't think that Cobain worship went into overdrive following the suicide weren't teenagers during that time. Multiple girls at my school wore their KC memorial shirts for the next year. Everyday. It was pretty creepy. Frances Bean has it correct.
Amy Winehouse is another member of the 27 Club.
Rhythm and Balls: "Is that the way conservatives view species extinction?"
How do the leftists view the planned and purposeful murder of a hundred million members or so of the human species in the last 100 years at the hands of their progressive masters?
If it was not for the Heroin and fame contributing to his depression/mental illness, he might still be with us. Then again, without the fame and heroin, Courtney would never have given a Kurt a second look and Francis wouldn't be here.
To answer a question above, people don't commit suicide because they are selfish, but in their illness, they think everyone is better off without them.
To answer the question why she says fuck so much, it's probably just an everyday world in her family.
There is not a lot to like about Courtney (Hole's 2nd album sounded very Kurt. No wonder they couldn't repeat that success after Kurt's death). I liked her even less after seeing the doc on Hole's drummer Patty. When Patty was homeless and turning tricks for drugs, she called Courtney for help and Courtney thought it was funny she was strung out and homeless. What a jerk.
What Ever Happened To Courtney Love?
"Parsons' body disappeared from the Los Angeles International Airport where it was being readied to be shipped to Louisiana for burial. Before his death, Parsons stated that he wanted his body cremated at Joshua Tree and his ashes spread over Cap Rock, a prominent natural feature there; however, Parsons' stepfather organized a private ceremony back in New Orleans and neglected to invite any of his friends from the music industry.[37] Two accounts state that Bob Parsons stood to inherit Gram's share of his grandfather's estate if he could prove that Gram was a resident of Louisiana, explaining his eagerness to have him buried there.[38][39]
To fulfill Parsons' funeral wishes, Kaufman and a friend stole his body from the airport and in a borrowed hearse drove it to Joshua Tree. Upon reaching the Cap Rock section of the park, they attempted to cremate Parsons' corpse by pouring five gallons of gasoline into the open coffin and throwing a lit match inside. What resulted was an enormous fireball. The police gave chase but, as one account puts it, "were encumbered by sobriety," and the men escaped.[37] The two were arrested several days later. Since there was no law against stealing a dead body, they were only fined $750[40] for stealing the coffin and were not prosecuted for leaving 35 pounds (16 kg) of his charred remains in the desert. Parsons's body was eventually buried in Garden of Memories Cemetery in Metairie, Louisiana."
Gram Parsons died age 26 per Wikipedia.
Gram Parsons died age 26 per Wikipedia.
If rock artists die between the ages of 20 and 35, it's axiomatic that there must be a median age.
I'd like to see a distribution of ages (plot) of death ages for rock musicians.
Apply some science to the myth!
On the first "anniversary" of Cobain's death the local fishwrap published an article quoting a lot of prominent rock musicians commenting on Cobain. Most of them said stuff like, "He was under such pressure, he must have felt so tortured" and the like.
The Rolling Stones' Keith Richards said,
"I figured he was in the wrong business. What's so hard about being lead singer for one of the world's biggest rock bands? You just deal with it."
I know 2 people who have known Courtney Love. Not well, not intimates, but they knew her, and completely independently of each other.
They both think she killed him.
It's striking how she references her own father in the distant way that she does. Completely understandable, of course - she was so young when he killed himself - but striking nonetheless that it feels like she's referencing a distant ancestor, not her own father.
But if course it's obvious she'd talk about him that way. She can't speak on any intimate terms about him because she never got to actually know him. It's obvious, yet at the same time both striking and sad. There's this sense of arms-length distance in her mentions of Kurt - not hateful or spurning, just neutral - yet there's also an obvious albeit very well handled yearning to have truly gotten to know him. It's sad when a child has to talk about their parent in the same way we talk about older generations who are long gone, but it's the situation she's found herself in. Frankly, given the circumstance, she's remarkably well adjusted. And that's a damn good thing.
I'm a huge Nirvana fan, thanks to my youngest uncle (about 6 years older than me). I was not even 10 when Kurt Cobain killed himself, and I cried for about an hour because it meant I'd never get to see a Nirvana concert, and why would such a great guy do that? Later I learned more about who Kurt was and his struggles, both self-made and the issues he had dealing with explosive fame. To this day, anytime I see a pop-culture reference to Nirvana (like in Captain America, or that song by Bowling for Soup) my heart leaps a little.
I'm not sure why I should care about any of these people, as my antediluvian idea is that the good part about commercial art is that one can buy the art without having to put up with the artist (or the artist's temperament).
In any case, it's (unfortunately) not true that "The shelf life of an artist or musician isn't particularly long"; if that were true we wouldn't have geriatric rock acts like the Rolling Stones.
What is true is that a rock musician has to get on the shelf at a young age. And it remains true that the work of a died-at-a-young-age artist is likely to appreciate in value after the artist's death.
What remains to be seen is whether any commercial music act can ever again be as big as were the big stars in the age of the record and the CD and its associated long form, the album.
How can a voice of a generation be one that mumbles so badly?
I liked Nirvana, but to pretend you could actually understand their lyrics without hearing a song A LOT is laughable.
I know MTV was front and center with Kurt being "The voice of this generation" when he did it.
Otis Redding was 26.
His plane crashed into Lake Monona.
Otis Redding wrote:
Otis Redding was 26.
That's crazy. He looked like he was 40. I would never guess he was that young.
"He will always be that relevant in that time and always be beautiful."
No, he will always be dead, until the final trump, at least. The memories of fans and children will have zero effect upon him, because he is dead.
Unless one believes in the eternal soul, and the Mystical Body that is. But I'd bet few of his fans do.
You know, his time in the spotlight was really so short. I'd say 1990-April of '94. You could narrow it even further from post-Nevermind to his suicide, a space of 2.5 years.
I remember right before he seemed to be suddenly attempting to be happy and content with his success and life. It was a real change in his public face which, in a way, made him less attractive because his whole appeal was his firm stance on many issues ( gays, feminism, the stupidity of lad culture) that had not yet flipped and therefore caused pain. I remember thinking 'and so it begins.' (The transformation into a more typical rock star.) But it didn't. It ended.
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