ADDED: The Milwaukee Journal Sentinel has a story titled "Man dead in Madison police shooting had been subject of violence complaints," that begins:
According to a department incident report, Robinson, then 18, was arrested [on April 25] with the two other men and one woman shortly before 6 a.m. as they were fleeing an apartment with electronics, a shotgun and other property. Police were called when a witness saw several men, one armed with a long gun, enter the building. No injuries were reported in the case, police said. Robinson pleaded guilty to felony armed robbery and received three years of probation, according to court records.
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59 comments:
How many black children are going to be killed by other blacks (Chicago) or the law enforcement officers deadly reminder that being empowered by Obama does not give you an "all clear" to attack others and a responsive police officer? Another officer assisted suicide example totally unlike Selma's bloody Sunday. Pitiful!
These shootings have become a psychological projective test for white conservatives and black leftists.
Every time one of these shootings is reported:
Black leftists instantly assume that a white racist cop needlessly killed an innocent black guy.
White conservatives instantly assume that an innocent cop defended himself against a rampaging savage black thug.
Me, I just wait patiently for the facts to be in.
Events have a way of wrecking ideologues' preconceived notions.
bu bu but what about blacks killing blacks? huh?????? Just consider this thread owned.
People need to be emotional. People need to be angry.
No, people should wait and see what the facts are and then, if necessary, act on them. Getting emotional and angry is not helpful.
No, people should wait and see what the facts are and then, if necessary, act on them. Getting emotional and angry is not helpful.
Getting emotional and angry from the beginning is the reason people can't accept the facts even when they are right in front of them.
A statement from The Young Gifted and Black Coalition read that Robinson, “suffered the ultimate penalty of state violence: a death sentence without a trial. He was robbed not just of due process but of his life...
Does this statement seem true to anyone who lives in Madison? Does Madison, WI employ Judge Dredd-like powers and tactics on its police force?
For a city consistently ranked as one of the best places to live this would seem rather out of character.
Unless, it's a great place to live for only those employed by the State of Wisconsin, or UW, while the rest of the population feeds on the leftover cake.
pleaded guilty to felony armed robbery and received three years of probation, according to court records.
Felony armed robbery gets you probation???
"Just consider this thread owned."
Phrasing, bitchtits, phrasing.
Not sure that a fat person of pallor who likes to describe African-Americans as "the blackys" should be using the word "owned" when talking about "blacks."
I agree with Shanna's disbelief. If he had received an appropriate sentence, he would be alive today. Therefore some blame for his death really does belong on the "system'.
Where are the protests against Hiz Honor da Mayor for Life, Soglin?
Three years probation for armed robbery?
A juxtaposition of racial progress.
I am Laslo.
Felony armed robbery gets you probation???
If you are young, Black and live in a blue state, yep.
It's looking better and better for the cop - if he was reacting to a report of someone being strangled, his decision to go in to the apartment is justified, and it would be hard indeed for anyone to argue that he did not have a reasonable fear for his life if attacked.
But what was wrong with Robinson??? Was he having a bad drug reaction - did he have a psychological illness?? This seems like a case of mania!!
People are saying that maybe probation was a mistake, but if Robinson was psychologically unstable, it probably wasn't.
If it was a drug reaction, then I am afraid that the "the slammer cures all" crew are probably right.
All in all, a totally depressing story with no redeeming features. One is sorry for the family, sorry for the cops, and I confess to becoming an ardent critic of the Young, Gifted and Black brand of reasoning.
One more unhappy and superfluous comment - as someone who believes that police violence is a problem, and that the justice system often does work to the prejudice of the young disadvantaged in our society, seeing an incident such as this become a focus for protests against the "system" is deeply disturbing.
That's because in this case, it does not appear that any systemic perversion was present. The incident was sparked by truly violent and threatening behavior against civilians when no officer was around, the escalation occurred before any officer hit the scene, and the previous judicial sentencing was very lenient and clearly designed to give this young man a chance at a much better life.
So those who want to dismiss the claim that there are frequently systematic problems are getting a great big gift handed to them.
This is why I hope some older person takes the Young, Gifted and Black dupes aside and reasons with them as forcefully as necessary. The key to real reform is NOT setting up an impossible standard for police officers.
When the black Jamiel Shaw was shot deaf a few days ago by an illegal immigrant gang banger just released from custody then nary a peep.
A Great City needs a great demonstration. And if Armed Robbery gets 3 years probation, then rioting probably gets folks a community service credit hours for any future extended probation for murder.
Community members said Robinson graduated from Sun Prairie High School in 2014 and was preparing to enroll in college.
Apparently Mr Robinson was taking a community based course in armed robbery during his gap year before going to college...
you know...
Watch One
Do One
Teach One
Liberals have a solution!
Ban all guns from blacks. They tried it in the 1960s, so why not now? Oh, the NRA... bummer.
But its far more than guns that is the problem. Illegitimate children, no fathers present, gangs, drugs, poverty, etc...
All products of "The Great Society' and welfare. All Democrat programs.
The guy may have been a lookout during the robbery, and a first time (adult) offender. His PD makes a deal with the DA because he was "in bad company", so he gets a break, How were the other three robbers sentenced?
Anyway, with threat of probation revocation because of current criminal activity and under the influence of drugs or alcohol it is easy to imagine him attacking the cop while trying to escape.
White liberals get to prove what good people they are by jumping to the conclusion that the cop was racist and the shooting was unjustified, or that the shooting was caused by "systemic racism", even if, ESPECIALLY if, it is later proven that the perp brought it on himself. They get to say the equivalent of "Look how anti-racist I am, believing Whitey is to blame despite all evidence to the contrary. What a paragon of compassion and virtue
I am.".
MaxedOutMama said, "That's because in this case, it does not appear that any systemic perversion was present."
I can't help but imagine what the reaction would be if something like this happened in Menomonee Falls, Butler, or Wauwatosa.
Something tells me Madison and UW would be busing in protestors to make sure this was labeled 'systemic'.
But I'm not expecting the bongo circles to be fired up during this week's warm weather. Everyone has a reputation to protect, or a brand to market.
"Group makes demands"
Yes, don't they always? Not request, demands. Because you can't be a militant unless you make demands?
Because no one may demand anything of you. Or even request it. Because you're the righteous demander: you demand, and they better comply!
Or something.
Ok, he was a troublemaker and a punk. Apparently a charming punk who helped out his siblings.
But what was it about this incident that required deadly force? We are getting nothing on that question.
"Gahrie said...
Felony armed robbery gets you probation???
If you are young, Black and live in a blue state, yep."
"State" has nothing to do with it. It's a county thing. And sure, first offense armed robbery getting probation is probably the norm in Madison...and Milwaukee. Elsewhere in WI? Probably not.
Where are the protests against Hiz Honor da Mayor for Life, Soglin?
The feeling in my neighborhood is he's been there long enough, and it's time for new blood.
Binks, we’re a community who is grieving and trying to work through a very extraordinary situation. Some will shout, some will march, some will pray, some will write. We all have our own ways of trying to work through the complicated emotions surrounding this. A young man was lost to his family, his friends and his community to the gun of a policeman who we gave exceptionally broad powers and discretion to work in our name. While I am sad that it happened, I am glad it’s getting the attention it deserves, seeing past the finger-pointing and onto something more transformative.
"Every time one of these shootings is reported:
Black leftists instantly assume that a white racist cop needlessly killed an innocent black guy.
White conservatives instantly assume that an innocent cop defended himself against a rampaging savage black thug."
There would be validity to this comment if once, just once the white community was the first to jump the gun. Instead, in recent incidents there is no whitey backlash until the cop is accused, the system is accuse, the black perp and/or victim is glorified as an innocent and the marches have begun.
Diligent reporters were able to discover that, contrary to appearances, both Jeb Bush and Mitt Romney were bullies during their school. Days. I have the feeling that this kid and also Brown and Martin gave some people they went to school with a hard time. I also get the feeling that the people they bullied will be in no big hurry to come forward and that no reporter will make much of an effort to seek them out.......The latest Cosby rape victim to speak out said that she didn't come forward before because she, as a black woman, didn't want to besmirch the reputation of a revered black man. (And, in my opinion, she didn't want all the grief and hate the black community would direct at her for making such an accusation.)......Someone above said that we should let all the facts come out. The fact is all the facts will not come out........Some facts are factier than others. George Zimmerman has had rather turbulent domestic relations. You can bet that this turbulence will be reported on extensively. Trayvon Martin's father has neck tattoos and several past marriages. The guess here is that there's a certain amount of domestic turbulence in his--and Trayvon's--past and that these disturbances will never ever be spoken or written about.
In posts this year to his Facebook page, Robinson appeared troubled, writing, “I hate my mind” and “I don’t need help im not crazy.” In a January 19 post, he declared, “My soul is dying.” In a series of messages on February 11, Robinson wrote, “You arent shit to your family when you grow up,” and “Iv been getting lied to my whole life… Mostly by famliy members.” In December, a day after linking to a video showing a police officer applying a chokehold to a man, Robinson wrote, “The only thing cops are getting trained for is to shoot first and ask questions later.”
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David said...
But what was it about this incident that required deadly force? We are getting nothing on that question.
Few facts here, but let me postulate a scenario:
1. (fact): Multiple 911 calls about a 'disturbed man" at least one of which said the man was 'strangling a patron'
2. (fact) Police officer responds and enters an apt building where noise is being heard.
3. (Observation). the act of strangling is both attempted murder and done most often 'without a weapon'
4. (Question). Does the Officer first observe Robinson at close range? Is he strangling somebody? On parole, does he fear going to jail for 3 years and lunge at the officer or the door to escape? Was there a non-gun weapon involved?
A young man was lost to his family, his friends and his community to the gun of a policeman who we gave exceptionally broad powers and discretion to work in our name. mrs e.
How much effort is it to keep the complete set of facts from intruding on your bubble?
The police report also says the shooting victim attacked the police officer, punching him in the face and then grappling with the officer after he hit the ground.
It seems like Madison Police Officers don't work in pairs. I wonder if they should.
Back when I watched Adam-12, there were two policemen in the car. The police I see driving around Madison don't have a partner. You can't wait for back-up if there's a report of someone being strangled, but a single person is going to be more apt to lose control of the situation, I think, rather than a pair.
Someone might argue that this would increase cost -- two policemen to each car -- but I'll argue it will decrease it: Only half the number of cars needed.
"The police report also says the shooting victim attacked the police officer, punching him in the face and then grappling with the officer after he hit the ground.". That's enough to prove that it none of that happened, to the BGI, Thughuggers, and self-hating white leftists. And mrs. e, I'm an individual who celebrates the flushing of that POS Robinson.
Someone might argue that this would increase cost -- two policemen to each car -- but I'll argue it will decrease it: Only half the number of cars needed.
But it would mean they could only answer half as many calls. I don't know what the police presence/need is in Wisconsin, but that could be an issue some places.
A young man was lost to his family, his friends and his community to the gun of a policeman who we gave exceptionally broad powers and discretion to work in our name.
And that is certainly sad for his family, but we give officers discretion for a reason. Sometimes they are in the right. Shouldn't the community wait to know all the facts before they decide that the officer is at fault?
If, in a fight, only one of the parties is armed, said arming is by definition only temporary.
One punch and who it is that is armed, changes.
So, don't bring a fist to a gun fight, applies.
Here's a bulletin for the outraged: there is no way a cop is going to, or should be expected to, take a beating. They have a gun, and deserve to be able to go home at the end of their shift, to wife and kids. And they deserve the benefit of the doubt.
It's that simple.
And contrary to the despicable Holder and Obama, your anger is NOT understandable. It is completely unjustified.
sinz52: "Black leftists instantly assume that a white racist cop needlessly killed an innocent black guy.
White conservatives instantly assume that an innocent cop defended himself against a rampaging savage black thug.
Me, I just wait patiently for the facts to be in."
Well, while you patiently wait for the facts to come in you are busy larding up on mischaracterization and false equivalences.
The way this usually works is the following:
Black guy gets shot by cops.
Black leftists instantly assume that a white racist cop needlessly killed an innocent black guy.
White conservatives say "hey, haven't we seen this play before?" and then refuse to go along with the rush to convict the individual who shot the black guy.
Lefties immediately accuse conservatives of racism.
Later, conservatives are proven to be correct in their refusal to rush to judgement.
Even later, other lefties decide that refusal to rush to judgement is precisely equivalent to the other sides rush to judgement and post such drivel on blog sites.
mrs.e: "Binks, we’re a community who is grieving and trying to work through a very extraordinary situation."
I am afraid this situation has become anything but "extraordinary".
The feeling worthless to the family once grown comment struck me as truly tragic. Had he been raised with traditional American values he would have seen the opportunity to get a job and contribute to the family. Raised in the progressive state of America, he believed his only value was in contributing to his mom's government check. The challenge is overcoming that mindset. Didn't Clinton do something about it that Obama walked back?
The crazy talk may not be anything. Didn't we all feel crazy sometimes when we were that age?
"How much effort is it to keep the complete set of facts from intruding on your bubble?"
What facts in that sentence did I misstate?
MadisonMan wrote,
"Back when I watched Adam-12, there were two policemen in the car."
Adam-12 was a TV show. The format requires a second actor independent of anything in actual police work. Try to think of a show that doesn't have at least two regulars to play off each other.
The crazy talk may not be anything. Didn't we all feel crazy sometimes when we were that age?
Maybe, but it's also an age when serious mental illness often presents.
What an excellent opportunity for everyone to decide that this case conveniently reinforces their pre-existing beliefs. You could just start it with "white cop shoots black man ____" and you know half the nuts will complete it with "...because of institutional racism" and the other half will complete it with "...because the black man did something stupid and threatening and thuggish."
In the meantime, I'll wait until more facts are released before I form an opinion on this. The outrageists have sort of used up everyone's quota for the past couple years.
Three years probation for armed robbery? Madison could be the next Vegas for felons.
Gusty Winds: criminals and their political enablers consider ANY use of police force "Judge Dredd-like" tactics.
Maxed Out Mama: we don't know that. Eric Holder hasn't counted the traffic tickets yet.
CWJ -- LAPD uses two-man (Adam) and one-man (Lincoln call sign) patrol cars. The one-man cars are usually sergeants or other supervisory ranks.
Blogger Bill, Republic of Texas said...
I agree with Shanna's disbelief. If he had received an appropriate sentence, he would be alive today. Therefore some blame for his death really does belong on the "system'.
Not the system, the VOTERS!
Just another gentle giant peacefully kneeling in prayer at the local altar when he was ruthlessly gunned down by slavering racists!
richard mcenroe,
Thank you. I trust you are correct. And that's interesting.
Now we know why no one would ever make an LA based cop show titled "Lincoln-12."
sinz52:
Every time one of these shootings is reported:
Black leftists instantly assume that a white racist cop needlessly killed an innocent black guy.
White conservatives instantly assume that an innocent cop defended himself against a rampaging savage black thug.
Brando:
What an excellent opportunity for everyone to decide that this case conveniently reinforces their pre-existing beliefs. You could just start it with "white cop shoots black man ____" and you know half the nuts will complete it with "...because of institutional racism" and the other half will complete it with "...because the black man did something stupid and threatening and thuggish."
Can either of you point out any instance where this has happened and either
A. group 1 turned out to be correct, or
B. group 2 turned out to be wrong?
Looking for way to see us all as one.
I wonder if this happens. Adults shield children from the tough side of life while also trying to equip them with attitudes that will get them through when the kids encounter that tough side. As if they were on a ship called childhood. And always there comes a time for a family when the good ship Childhood is breaking up on the other side of a dangerous surf lined shore. And the children have to swim through the turbulence and breaking waves to the safe shore of being an adult. And if they start to sink then rescuers spring into action, throwing lifelines and struggling in the surf themselves and trying to draw the strugglers ashore. And how heartsick they feel when their kids don't make it? - anyone can imagine how they sit down and talk of that wonderful little guy, now lost.
I'm suggesting that these parents, grandparents, aunts and friends know quite well that the kid in question was acting like a thug and endangering people around him. It's just that they also know that other kids have acted the same and still been drawn safely ashore. They remember all the reasons they had for thinking that they could get Trayvon or Tony past the danger. They think of what he was like at twelve. They think of all the kids who were scared away from crime when went into court and got another chance. "Then, why not mine?"
A newscamera is shoved in their face and they pour all this out and the TV ratings go up for the station. A socialist transforms it into a reason to introduce socialism. A race hustler makes money off it. Then the Levite and the Pharisee continue on their journey, leaving them wounded by the wayside. And where is the samaritan these days?
People need to be stupid.
I was wrong. They came out in full force at the Capital to protest.
The youth have already passed judgement on the cop.
Am I the only person who wonders if this guy got probation for armed robbery because he snitched, turned state's evidence,ratted out his pals or whatever they call it in Madison? I mean this is a law professor's blog, after all. Any informed speculation?
People are ignorant of the most basic truths.
Emotions are secondary, not primary. Thoughts cause emotions. Think certain things, have certain emotions. Think a different thing, have a different emotion.
This happens whether the thing you are thinking is actually true, or not. It matters not, to the emotion.
Then, of course, emotions are often catalysts to action.
So what possible good, or in what way is it at all understandable, that anger over an alleged (no facts yet) racial injustice is appropriate in 2015 America?
It is the height of folly. Dangerous and self-destructive.
Shame on those who encourage it. Wake up, you who fall into the trap.
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