Mr. Mandela’s quest for freedom took him from the court of tribal royalty to the liberation underground to a prison rock quarry to the presidential suite of Africa’s richest country. And then, when his first term of office was up, unlike so many of the successful revolutionaries he regarded as kindred spirits, he declined a second term and cheerfully handed over power to an elected successor, the country still gnawed by crime, poverty, corruption and disease but a democracy, respected in the world and remarkably at peace.
December 5, 2013
"Nelson Mandela, who led the emancipation of South Africa from white minority rule and served as his country’s first black president..."
"... becoming an international emblem of dignity and forbearance, died Thursday. He was 95."
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102 comments:
Nelson Mandela was a truly great man.
He believed in liberation but not in vengeance.
That set him apart from such nutcases as Mugabe--and that's why SA didn't end up like Zimbabwe, Uganda, Rwanda, Sudan, etc.
Can South Africa maintain Mr. Mandela's heritage? May God receive him.
Thank God he will not see what SA will become.
That's very sad. I fear for South Africa's future. Too many people like Julius Malema coming up in the ranks of the ANC. (I know, Malema was thrown out, but he's forming his own party now.)
If you ever wanted an illustration of what a stone-cold racist Matt Drudge is, his current page is a perfect example. Arguably the greatest leader of the second half of the last century dies and he leads with the change in radio station affiliation of a fat serial fornicating drug addict.
"Arguably the greatest leader of the second half of the last century dies..."
aaaand cue the over-the-top white liberal hagiography...
...while carefully refraining from examining the actual condition of South Africa now, compared to before.
So how's South Africa doing these days?
Bret Baier doing a Chris Matthews imitation interviewing Jesse Jackson about Mandela on FNC.
a courageous, principled man co-opted by slime that he couldn't begin to understand.
"Arguably the greatest leader of the second half of the last century dies and he leads with the change in radio station affiliation of a fat serial fornicating drug addict."
Ronald Reagan is dead?!
And Bill Clinton has changed radio stations?
So how's South Africa doing these days?
Rumours of our demise and the ever promised race war have yet to come to fruition. Our President is an embarrassment and a thief. Crime and corruption is unacceptably high. However, on an interpersonal level the various ethnic, religious, language, and racial groups get on remarkably well. This is still one of the most beautiful, vibrant places on the planet.
ARM great call, he changed it as soon as he got back from Christmas shopping
Stephen Reynolds said...
ARM great call, he changed it
He took his time and presumably got considerable flack over it.
Our President is an embarrassment and a thief.
We share your pain.
"that's why SA didn't end up like Zimbabwe, Uganda, Rwanda, Sudan, etc."
It will.
CUT AND PASTE:
I would kindly like to inform you about the ongoing white genocide in the Republic of South-Africa. Since 1994, the end of the so-called Apartheid, whites people, especially white farmers, have been subject to extremely brutal and racist murders. About 50 people on average are murdered in South-Africa per day, of which at least 20 of them are whites(95+ % black on white murder rate). Please take into consideration that white people make up only 9% (4 500 000) of the demographics in South-Africa and therefore the white murder rate in South-Africa is quite significant. (read more - warning: contains pictures of violently murdered children and grown-ups)
ARM. Because nothing says racist like not having the lede right.
Michael said...
ARM. Because nothing says racist like not having the lede right.
He had the story on his page. Apparently didn't think it was important. Certainly not as important as the fat fornicator's move from one AM station to another.
Drudge is a chronic race baiter. It is interesting to see which stories he picks from the Daily Mail, which is a kind of American freak show. He constantly links to stories about blacks behaving badly while linking much less frequently to equivalent stories about whites, of which there is no shortage online.
Ululating Umlungu said...
So how's South Africa doing these days?
However, on an interpersonal level the various ethnic, religious, language, and racial groups get on remarkably well. This is still one of the most beautiful, vibrant places on the planet.
This is Mandela's legacy. In the hands of a lesser man it could have been a blood bath and not without some justification.
ARM. i wonder about people like you, so quick to call others racist. I am sorry things arent working out for you as you had hoped, but sluring others wont make it any better.
Michael said...
ARM. i wonder about people like you, so quick to call others racist. I am sorry things arent working out for you as you had hoped,
My life is fine, almost certainly a lot better than yours. That doesn't mean I can't point out what a race-baiter Drudge is. It is an important part of how he makes his living.
I suppose now we'll get a great big statue of Mandela on the Washington mall. Maybe we can rename the Washington monument or something in his honor.
Some would scoff that Mandela wasn't an American, so why would we do that?
Well, we had nothing to do with the Holocaust and yet we somehow ended up with a museum on the mall dedicated to it, so why not a monument to St. Mandela?
Describing someone as a fat serial fornicating drug addict doesn't seem so reasonable to me.
Drudge is simply posting notable news stories, some of which involve black-on-white crime and other bad black behavior. It only seems like he does that a lot because the mass media completely ignores those stories. If Drudge didn't post them and force them onto the national agenda nobody would know they existed. He's doing a real public service by providing a counterbalance to the liberal media.
Mandela was a man of courage, honor,and decency. There is every reason to admire the man and mourn his passing......The smart money says that South Africa is headed for the crapper, but, because of Mandela, it will take a generation or two longer to arrive there. That's a greater legacy than most 20th century politicians.
heyboom said...
Describing someone as a fat serial fornicating drug addict doesn't seem so reasonable to me.
Only if it's not true. To be fair, he has lost some weight. Presumably a surgical intervention.
MnMark said...
Drudge is simply posting notable news stories,
No. He carefully selects a subset of stories to reinforce certain biases. This is how he makes a living. Otherwise his readers could just go to the original news sources. He very rarely breaks a story.
When the picture of the world that you project is less balanced than that of the Daily Mail you have a problem, albeit a profitable one.
yes and the White House's method to honor Mr Mandela was to tweet out a picture of...........Barack Obama.
The smart money says that South Africa is headed for the crapper
From everything I've read, it's pretty much already there.
(I think Mandela was, and remains, overrated as a leader, though not as a symbol.)
The South African struggle against apartheid was seen in this country through the lens of our own Civil Rights struggle.
It was much different. The fight against apartheid was often framed by by the world in Marxist or anti-imperialist or whatever western term du jour, but it was also the rise from utter disaster of the Xhosa people, of which Nelson Mandela was one.
The Xhosa were involved in a long & often armed struggle against the Dutch & the British since the late 18th C. In the mid-19th century, they almost destroyed themselves in a millennial frenzy called the Cattle Killing Movement.
South Africa didn't have two imperial powers --- the British & the Dutch --- it had three --- the Zulu. The Zulu Empire at its 19th century height had an estimated 14 million subjects. All three imperial powers shared one thing in common: the Xhosa were to be a subject people. Under apartheid, the Zulus had, then as now, much self-determination in KwaZulu, and they often backed the apartheid regime.
The rise of the Xhosa under the ANC was not just a white vs black or an anti-imperialist struggle. It was the story of a broken & despised tribal people rising to power from the ashes. It's a story that is much more interesting in its own terms than in the terms that the rest of the world uses to it.
RecChief
I figured you must be joking.
ARM. No. "He carefully selects a subset of stories to reinforce certain biases. This is how he makes a living."
He carefully links, prominently, to a moving remembersnce by Mandela's friend Bono.
Cue a picture of President Obama gazing out the window of a bus.
MnMark said...
Drudge is simply posting notable news stories, some of which involve black-on-white crime and other bad black behavior. It only seems like he does that a lot because the mass media completely ignores those stories.
This is a particularly ridiculous statement because Drudge links almost exclusively to the mass media. He doesn't do any reporting himself.
He caters to an audience who cannot cope with the complex world view presented in the mass media but instead require something simpler and much narrower.
AReasonableMan said...
I assume your handle is meant as a joke, right? Like a big man nicknamed 'Tiny'?
ARM ". He caters to an audience who cannot cope with the complex world view presented in the mass media but instead require something simpler and much narrower"
Which is why he links to Kos. the Guardian, Itar-Tass, Mother Jones et al
You really dont seem to be very open minded.
ARM, I expect you have observed Drudge long enough to know how he operates his site and therefore your blather here just reflects your pure partisan BS. Most people who visit Drudge draw news and opinion from many sources. We aren't stupid and neither are you. Why you choose to use this incident to attack Drudge is a bit immature. Are finals over?
When did the Guardian get excluded from the mass media?
SteveR said...
ARM, I expect you have observed Drudge long enough to know how he operates his site and therefore your blather here just reflects your pure partisan BS. Most people who visit Drudge draw news and opinion from many sources. We aren't stupid and neither are you. Why you choose to use this incident to attack Drudge is a bit immature.
To deny Drudge is a race-baiter is naive. It is his modus operandi. This particular incident was over the top, as indicated by the fact that he changed his page after some time. He treads a fine line.
Hey, ARM, got anything to say about Nelson Mandela... you know, the subject of the post? We already know about your irrational hatreds of conservative media figures (not really relevant here, you know).
In the post apartheid world, South Africa fell off the radar of the media. There are many tragedies unreported which are Mr. Mandela's real legacy. The most tragic to me is not the lawless, murderous society which he fostered, but the systematic plan to remove the rest of the white population from the country. We hear that the man had no bitterness against his former captors. I think the opposite is the truth. It is impossible for any young white person to get a job in South Africa. So they are forced to leave their family and head for the UK and Australia. Their parents cannot follow them because they are not allowed permanent status in those countries. When the parents age and die, there will be no white people left in the country. They will have succeeded in cleansing the country in the same manner they were treated in the old days. Mandela did not bring democracy to the country. He has imprisoned good people behind their gates in a country unsafe for almost any travel. He has separated them from their families. They will never see the joy of their grandchildren growing. 13000 whites are murdered yearly. Nothing ever happens to the murderers. He led his people to freedom and then destroyed the country. In 50 years it will be back in the third world.
ARM." When did the Guardian get excluded from the mass media?"
Who said it had been?
Paco Wové said...
We already know about your irrational hatreds of conservative media figures (not really relevant here, you know).
I don't have an irrational hatred of Drudge. I read him regularly. I think he is a shrewd judge of his audience.
Still a race-baiter.
I am waiting for comments about Winnie Mandala and her gasoline fueled "Mandela Necklaces".
ARM what's amazing is how you so easily fall into the trap.
I like this blog because the comments are not the run of the mill same ol', same ol'.
It is a bit disappointing to see how ARM and Garage Mahal are able to
play some here so easily.
All they gotta do is throw out some obvious bait to generate responses.
ARM especilly is pretty darn good at it, I know he is laughing every time he does it. I would generally give him an easy 8 out of 10 on the troll scale. Today, I gotta go with a 9.5 ( nobodys perfect)
AReasonableMan said...
I don't have an irrational hatred of Drudge. I read him regularly. I think he is a shrewd judge of his audience.
Still a race-baiter.
And you're an idiot.
Don't think so? Well, there is at least as much backing up my assertion, as there is backing up yours, above.
Full Moon. You over rate both. And as Steve Reynolds notes they both construct traps of their own making. Neither are very bright.
Paco Wové said...Hey, ARM, got anything to say about Nelson Mandela...
ARM doesn't give a shit about Mandela so no, he doesn't have anything to say. Bush, Cheney, Drudge - those are ARM's obsessions. Perfect example of the progressive marching moron.
ARM trolls a lot of threads discussing whatever hair is across his ass that day without much regard for the thread subject other than to use it to segue in.
In this thread, he segued in with racism bait.
@Rich B
No I wasn't joking
http://twitchy.com/2013/12/05/next-step-selfies-narcissist-in-chief-keeps-it-about-him-on-day-of-mandelas-death-pic/
To those who call him a communist and a terrorist, it should be remembered that Mandela was fighting against an oppressive, racist dictatorship
Guess which side Republicans are on!
And now we gm , who also would rather use the death of a great and honorable man to diss his enemies (both real and imagined) rather than celebrate the achievements (like preventing South Africa from becoming another Zimbabwe) of said great man. Thank you GM for never disappointing us.
This song is evocative of the time before Mandela was released from jail. I regularly think of this song and the spirit of the times, which is now largely lost.
"To those who call him a communist and a terrorist, it should be remembered that Mandela was fighting against an oppressive, racist dictatorship."
It is sometimes said that one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter, and in fact there is no reason one can't be both. Freedom is a goal, terror a tactic. But we should nonetheless remember that the terrorist does not attack the "oppressive, racist dictatorship" he is supposedly fighting. He attacks someone who has done him no harm, selecting them precisely because they are weaker than he is. If you admire that, then I guess you are the sort of person who finds that admirable.
A great man. Remember when Dick Cheney voted against a resolution calling for his release from prison? Good times, good times.
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2013/12/05/don-t-sanitize-nelson-mandela-he-s-honored-now-but-was-hated-then.html
Remember when Robert Byrd was in the KKK? good times good times
YoungHegelian:
There were similar stories in America. The fullness of history is lost when we classify people by monolithic labels such as "skin color". The empires, nations, and tribes in America were not simply "Indian", they were competitors, imperialistic, murderous, and domineering of each other and the recurring European immigrants. Apartheid among these "Indian" groups was implicit and served a practical purpose.
Actually, the same thing happened in the Middle East, before the establishment of Israel. Apartheid was a common practice in Arab and Muslim countries generally. Same thing in China, where a minority ethnic group rules over the majority. Where doesn't this happen?
I wonder why South Africa received special recognition for their diverse apartheid regimes.
Interesting choice to turn a tribute post about Mandela into a complaint against Drudge, Limbaugh, Drudge's audience, and Dick Cheney.
Mandela was perhaps the greatest example of rising above expectations of our time, yet some people take his death as an opportunity to be petty.
Mary asked...Violent crime?
Murder and rape rates are high, yes. Official statistics state that most murders happen between people who know each other, alcohol abuse is usually blamed. Incidents of rape were exacerbated by the myth of having sex with a virgin will cure AIDS. This has fortunately fallen out of favour; however, the new scourge is child on child rape.
I’ve lived here all my life and no one in my immediate family has ever been victim of a serious crime.
Anthony Mason says Mandela had an elegence and dignity to him.
It sounds like the Obama 2008+ estrogen flood.
It must be an unthreatening but plantation-dwelling black person thing.
Clarence Thomas doesn't get the treatment. He's not on the planataion.
Ululating: Thanks for the first-hand view. #1 or so in why I like blogs.
Maybe Mandella was the black president we should have had.
What made Mandela great was not his politics -- like very politician he had to mesh the ideology of his party (in the old ANC's case a somewhat dire socialism) with the realities of the day. South Africa has problems; they did not go away when he became president. Some of the problems are worse today.
What made him great were two things -- first the fact that after so many years in prison he was able to forgive and second that after gaining power, he was able to walk away from it with no regrets when his term was done.
Think about those two things. Many liberation figures in Africa became tyrants (like Mugabe) and those that did not (like Kenyatta for example) bequeathed a one party state and often left office through death or coup. Mandela was elected, served his term and walked away.
"Mandela was perhaps the greatest example of rising above expectations of our time, yet some people take his death as an opportunity to be petty."
Trolls gotta troll.
Notice how the proggs honor a great man. They must compare him to people they hate. Instead of honoring him on his merits alone.
To those whining about the political nature of the posts, Mandela was always a polarizing and political figure. There was intense opposition to his goals. He was jailed for 27 years. To ignore this is to ignore his achievement.
He is now a secular saint but within our lifetime he was labeled as a terrorist, by the usual suspects.
Dude.
You're the one who's whining.
Anthony- very well put.
The biggest problem with South Africa is the ANC's grip on power. 2 generations of blacks were oppressed and purposefully under-educated by the Apartheid regime. Those that were freed from that system will vote for the ANC as long as they live.
The younger generation, they're starting to branch out and look at other political parties. My hope is that they move towards parties that are more interested in moving the country forward than retributive "justice".
.To those whining about the political nature of the posts, Mandela was always a polarizing and political figure. There was intense opposition to his goals. He was jailed for 27 years. To ignore this is to ignore his achievement.
Nobody is ignoring that, nor is anyone complaining about your political posts.
I am remarking on the pettiness, which is something Mandela had none of.
"'Arguably the greatest leader of the second half of the last century dies....'
"Ronald Reagan is dead?!"
Well, yes...for some time now. But then, the honorific would not in any event ever apply to Ronald Reagan.
"...a courageous, principled man co-opted by slime that he couldn't begin to understand."
Of course Mandela understood the sort of people surrounding him, and knew well the compromises he had made while governing. It is the nature of politics that even courageous and principled men (and women) must deal with and make bargains with unprincipled, cowardly men and women of low and dishonest character. A man who spent 27 years in prison as a result of his efforts to fight apartheid can only be a realist about the nature of humankind and of those who seek power.
Your remark is condescending.
"Maybe Mandella was the black president we should have had."
Maybe?
Drudge is a chronic race baiter. It is interesting to see which stories he picks from the Daily Mail, which is a kind of American freak show. He constantly links to stories about blacks behaving badly while linking much less frequently to equivalent stories about whites, of which there is no shortage online.
Writes the man who has never (as far as we know) ever posted a blog article on his own.
Too much effort?
El Pollo Raylan said...
Writes the man who has never (as far as we know) ever posted a blog article on his own.
What has this got to do with anything?
And, while we are on the topic, I was perfectly happy to post on your blog but was never invited. Apparently it was too exclusive to include alternate points of view. Not that I am complaining, everyone has the right to run their own things however they want. I respect this. That doesn't mean I can't point out what and ass-hat Drudge is.
AReasonableMan said...
He caters to an audience who cannot cope with the complex world view presented in the mass media but instead require something simpler and much narrower.
AReasonableMan said...
I read him regularly.
ARM makes a Kinsley Gaffe.
Marshall, the ambulance chaser, chimes in with a non sequitur. How's that Zimmerman fellow you were so high on some months back working out?
ARM said: I don't have an irrational hatred of Drudge. I read him regularly. I think he is a shrewd judge of his audience.
Drudge just puts things out there that the MSM choses to ignore or downplay. The MSM itself creates the appetite people have for Drudge.
Still a race-baiter.
I think you need a good counter example which Drudge chose to ignore to support that hypothesis.
P.S.:
Roger Simon mused the other day about the media coverage of Obama with the line: Around Obama there is an unprecedented silence, almost a media omertà.
This is what drives traffic to Drudge.
ARM
All conservatives are perfect angels. Conservatism can never fail, only we can fail conservatism. They are never, ever wrong, and there is never, ever anything wrong with a conservative. The problem is with you.
El Pollo Raylan said...
I think you need a good counter example which Drudge chose to ignore to support that hypothesis.
Drudge has a recurring theme that I label 'bad shit black people do'. He gets a significant fraction of these links from the Mail Online site. Thanks to Drudge I started reading this rag and, if you go to the source, you see that there is a balance of 'bad shit black people do' and 'bad shit white people do' stories but Drudge is very selective in what he links to on this site. It is hard to argue that the Mail Online is not MSM, we don't need further selective editing from Drudge. But, he knows his audience. They don't want a steady diet of 'bad shit white people do'.
Garage chimed: ARM
All conservatives are perfect angels. Conservatism can never fail, only we can fail conservatism. They are never, ever wrong, and there is never, ever anything wrong with a conservative. The problem is with you.
Conservatives are not perfect angels. But the attitude the D.C. media has with Obama is that they really, really, really, really want to see this man succeed to the extent that they will cover or down play the bad.
Out of fairness, you can counter-argue that Conservatives really, really, really want to see this man fail.
The reasonable reader is forced to pick and chose (but not ignore) all the sources.
That is the status quo with media coverage. There's nothing new about that at all.
garage mahal said...
Conservatism can never fail, only we can fail conservatism. They are never, ever wrong, and there is never, ever anything wrong with a conservative.
In many ways I am very conservative. I believe in marriage as the key foundation of a civil society with adequate wages to support a traditional family structure. I think we should avoid risky wars that are not essential to our national interests. I think we should conserve our natural resources as best we can. I am against shopping on Thanksgiving. For conservatives like me there is not much in the current formulation of the Repub party that is of great appeal.
For good and bad the Catholic church is truly conservative. This quote from the pope is remarkable.
“While the earnings of a minority are growing exponentially, so too is the gap separating the majority from the prosperity enjoyed by those happy few. This imbalance is the result of ideologies which defend the absolute autonomy of the marketplace and financial speculation. Consequently, they reject the right of states, charged with vigilance for the common good, to exercise any form of control.
A new tyranny is thus born, invisible and often virtual, which unilaterally and relentlessly imposes its own laws and rules. Debt and the accumulation of interest also make it difficult for countries to realize the potential of their own economies and keep citizens from enjoying their real purchasing power. To all this we can add widespread corruption and self-serving tax evasion, which have taken on worldwide dimensions. The thirst for power and possessions knows no limits. In this system, which tends to devour everything which stands in the way of increased profits, whatever is fragile, like the environment, is defenseless before the interests of a deified market, which become the only rule,” – Pope Francis.
To all this we can add widespread corruption and self-serving tax evasion, which have taken on worldwide dimensions.
Of course we're automatically supposed to think of people like Mitt Romney and Google and the off-shoring of wealth. We're not supposed to think of the people in the middle and at the bottom. But tax evasion is almost a high art in countries like Italy, Greece, and Spain which also happen to be be among the worse off in the EU.
In my own backyard, I watch nervously at the steady growth of enormous untaxed flea markets, and also the growing underclass of untaxed income.
AReasonableMan said...
Marshall, the ambulance chaser, chimes in with a non sequitur. How's that Zimmerman fellow you were so high on some months back working out?
Amusing. While making an erroneous accusation of a non-sequitur, ARM makes a non-sequitur.
And isn't it revealing that ARM has to mischaracterize everything in order to make a point? I think that would concern a deeper thinker than ARM.
El Pollo, you are right about the widespread nature of tax evasion. Contractors around here routinely want to be paid in cash. I don't think the Pope is singling anyone out in particular.
Marshall tell us more about that Zimmerman fellow. You were a true character witness for him when it counted.
AReasonableMan said...
Marshall tell us more about that Zimmerman fellow. You were a true character witness for him when it counted.
I see you're still a liar.
As usual, so completely blinded by your hatred of liberuls that you can't remember your sophism du jour.
AReasonableMan said...
As usual, so completely blinded by your hatred of liberuls that you can't remember your sophism du jour.
I don't hate "libruls", I disdain idiots.
But how amusing you, who mischaracterize what you read 5 minutes ago if doing so supports an attack, claim to remember my comments better than I. I don't doubt you remember that impression, lying to yourself about what others write is how you justify yourself. But if you look back at my writing you'll see no such thing.
If you were better able to distinguish people's actual beliefs from the caricatures you invent you wouldn't misunderstand them so consistently.
I see Obama will visit SA to honor Mandela, which is very appropriate.
Thatcher though, can rot in her box, right?
ARM,
He's still alive. The thug that attacked him is deader than a doornail, though.
Broomhandle said...
ARM,
He's still alive. The thug that attacked him
Unsubstantiated supposition by a Drudge reader.
Marshal said...
I don't hate "libruls", I disdain idiots.
Now you really are lying through your teeth, since you have previously acknowledged that no liberal that has ever commented on this site meets your standards of probity.
Even the partisans on this site would recognize that you are a dull-witted pedant, whereas some of the liberals are quite interesting or nice, or even both.
AReasonableMan said...
Now you really are lying through your teeth, since you have previously acknowledged that no liberal that has ever commented on this site meets your standards of probity.
The previous point was about leftists, not liberals. It's obviously false since Althouse meets the standard. It is strange you think honesty an unfairly high standard for liberals.
Even the partisans on this site would recognize that you are a dull-witted pedant,
"Pedant" is exactly what those incapable of clear thought think about those who are. You're the case study for Dunning Kruger.
I do love how when caught lying you resort to insults to hide your errors. You might be thinking it's better to be thought a jerk than an idiot, but in truth your only choice is idiot or both. Nice choice.
The worst "bad shit white people do" is cling to their white privilege.
And of course this means that no non-white can do any bad shit.
Marshal said...
I do love how when caught lying
Only in your narrow little mind. In the real world, where most of us reside, I have no trouble getting my point across. You of course have never had a point, just a sad little underemployed ambulance chaser with too much time on his hands trying pointlessly to score points off the hated liberuls. If only all those dratted liberuls would go away you could live in peace and harmony. Instead you have to be on constant vigilance to restore ideological purity to the world - and underemployed version of edutcher.
It's a sad way to spend a life. Live a little. Throw away your pedantry, kick off your shoes, feel the sand between your toes and really live. You'll like it, if you try it.
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