"... but President Obama said the plan has 'no chance of becoming law' and instead urged Senate Democrats and Republicans to reach a 'bipartisan compromise.'"
Hey! Why won't he compromise?
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१४० टिप्पण्या:
Now let's watch him explain why it won't pass - but without saying the word "election."
That ought to be rich,...
BTW - "Good job" to both the Republicans and the Tea Party:
You did good.
Be reasonable, do it my way.
Because he is a douchenozzle?
He already has. Accepting an all-cuts bill is a huge compromise when we have the lowest revenue collection in almost 60 years.
"Be reasonable, do it my way"
The GOP sentiment in its most succinct form.
The complaints about Obama not compromising are hilarious given that's all he's done from the start. Meanwhile, all of you scream for the GOP to do no compromising at all. Hypocrites.
Compromise = calling for bipartisan compromise, then only tweeting contact info for Rs.
BINGO! Whatever it takes to get Boehner's attention works for me!
Someday, the passing crowds may ask, "why did obama bypass compromise" when all the chips were on his side?"
I don't know the answer to that. But I suspect it's politics. And, obama thinking he's gonna get "Reid's bill" anyway ... So why not make the most of it?
WHAT A DUNCE!
I think us, the PEOPLE, have just won. Tea Party? Well, okay. It's not my label ... but it works for me. Just like the story of the tea that went overboard in Boston Harbor.
Is there any chance we can push harvahd into the Charles?
Simple, he doesn't even know where he stands. So how can he compromise!
"but President Obama said the plan has 'no chance of becoming law' and instead urged Senate Democrats and Republicans to reach a 'bipartisan compromise.'"
Just so I understand the terminology correctly:
-this bill with only Republican support isn't bipartisan but "Cut, cap and balance" which got 5 democrats wasn't either? Or wasn't bipartisan enough?
I guess now I'm struggling with PPACA that had 34 Democratic "no's" in the House and no Republicans "yea's" in the Senate ( I think it got one Republican "yea" in the House.)
I'm all confused about this bipartisan stuff
And I'm a centrist!
Any spending cut outside of Defense is a compromise for Democrats.
Little Zero doesn't want people to be reminded of this when he also has to explain away 26% unemployment (including "discouraged" workers), 10% inflation, and 1.3% growth.
Snowing people into voting for him again will be hard enough.
Given what the democrats are saying "dead on arrival" and so on, default cannot be as catastrofic as the democrats are saying.
If I follow their logic correctly, the president and the democrats are saying that default is preferable to the evil republican plan.
So, as long as the democrats hold firm and reject every evil republican plan, we dont have anything to worry about.. or something.
Hey! Why won't he compromise?
"I won."
Really, where is the compromise from the Senate and Obama?
I have to admit I'm feeling a little like Nancy Pelosi
Lets pass the bill and find out what's in it
He did compromise. Look at his plan.
Jim said...
He already has. Accepting an all-cuts bill is a huge compromise when we have the lowest revenue collection in almost 60 years.
Yes, miserable economic activity will do that to tax collection.
The complaints about Obama not compromising are hilarious given that's all he's done from the start.
Temper tantrums and fear-mongering are the soul of compromise.
90 batshit crazy teabaggers with bombs on their belts demanding amending the Constitution, or default. Very normal and very reasonable people to compromise with.
Meanwhile, all of you scream for the GOP to do no compromising at all. Hypocrites.
For some, touching the debt ceiling AT ALL was a huge compromise.
Regardless, this stopped being about "compromise" and the debt ceiling a long time ago.
Now it falls to McConnell.
Very normal and very reasonable people to compromise with.
Is garage calling disagreeable Americans abnormal?
"You want 2 terms. I want you to have zero. Let's compromise and call it 1."
-Iowahawk
I'm seeing some vintage speechifying here:
http://www.cnn.com/2011/POLITICS/07/29/debt.talks/index.html?hpt=hp_t1
I know you don't, but I do.
LMFAO @GM. That's been my favorite nutso meme: comparing the Tea Party Reps to terrorists -- because the Tea Partiers did their job and represented their constituency.
This is what democracy looks like. Neener neener.
Looks like the dems in the senate have the hot potato--what could go wrong with this?
And it looks like the tea party folks got their message accross to Speaker Boehner--
Interesting times as always
This is what democracy looks like. Neener neener
Maybe the Dems in DC can:
RUN AWAY!!
There's precedent, you know.
and I am sure I misspelled two words in my last post--apologies
As political games go ... obama did not gain traction for the democraps.
He thought he would.
But he didn't.
Boehner, on the other hand, has learned valuable lessons.
ONE: He's still at the table.
TWO: Showtime for obama may not help his side win in November 2012.
These are good lessons for all people to get under their belts.
Can obama, ahead, choose to "go it alone?"
Can democraps, ahead, afford to take political risks like Russ Feingold did?
I don't know the answer.
But time will tell.
And, it's good for politicians to hear Americans ROAR! If we didn't have the Internet we would not have been heard!
While "compromise" might have been the best option for obama to take. But now it's too late.
What about "unilateral?" Dunno abouat that. Because it's possible the democraps will seek to impeach? Nixon learned the hard way. Bill Clinton did not.
What to bet on a stacked deck of cards?
Ron Paul voted "NO." Here's the list of republican "NO" voters, for what it's worth:
Justin Amash (Mich.)
Michele Bachmann (Minn.)
Chip Cravaack (Minn.)
Scott Desjarlais (Tenn.)
Tom Graves (Ga.)
Tim Huelskamp (Kans.)
Steve King (Iowa)
Tim Johnson (Ill.)
Tom McClintock (Calif.)
Mick Mulvaney (S.C.)
Ron Paul (Texas)
Connie Mack (Fla.)
Jim Jordan (Ohio)
Tim Scott (S.C.)
Paul Broun (Ga.)
Tom Latham (Iowa)
Jeff Duncan (S.C.)
Trey Gowdy (S.C.)
Steve Southerland (Fla.)
Joe Walsh (Ill.)
Joe Wilson (S.C.)
Reid will pass some sort of bill with zero Republican support (just as in the House they had zero Democrat support.)
Compromise? Hahahaha ... no.
And our fearless leader will keep his secret plan secret, even to himself.
My take--not that anyone gives a damn: The senate will vote it down on a party line vote--it will go to conference committee which will come up with some bullshit and kick the can down to the white house--GOK what Obama will do--given his lack of sleep probably go on TV further anesthetizing the american public--The jug eared douchernozzle will have to make a decision--voting present is not an option.
The Tea Party folks asking to amend the constitution is no more radical than Charlie Brown requesting a signed contract from Lucy stating she will not, finally, pull the football away at the last second.
History is clear that "cuts" happen in out years and somehow never materialize.
By the way, adults don't compromise with children. Just ask the Prez.
"For some, touching the debt ceiling AT ALL was a huge compromise."
Why? These same people refusing to raise the debt limit did it with no fuss at all seven times in the last decade. I guess it wasn't a big deal all those times because they were the ones tripling the national debt and not some socialist Kenyan Muslim marxist maoist etc etc. Republican debt is just somehow more valid than Democratic debt.
Again: hypocrites.
US debt rating will continue to be base on our ability to pay, not our current unwillingness to pay which is being clouded by political smoke and mirrors. Once this political madness passes the US will pay its debts plus any accrued interest. If you are a bond investor you have to go with the US economy over say Greece.
"This is what democracy looks like. Neener neener."
Maybe you all need a Prime Minister to help you avoid blowing up your economy. Very short deadline now. Hopefully they'll get it together soon.
Ah well, the next week ought to be interesting. I expect CAD to go up.
Sheesh.
Don't you people know nothing?
Barack is keeping his plan in a secure, undisclosed location, along with Sen. Kerry's plan to end the war in Iraq.
It's obvious America won't be allowed to Obama's plan either...
"If you are a bond investor you have to go with the US economy over say Greece."
For the time being anyway....
I carry a certain amount of debt with a mortgage and whatnot. If it were to triple or quadruple I would be SOL and in dire financial straits.
That's why the "sudden" concern. Not race or some other shadowy reason.
There was, by the way, much noise about deficits during the Bush years from conservatives. It just wasn't reported by KOS and MSNBC.
Because, as even Harry Belafonte has come to realize, Barack Obama is a drizzly curdling heap of fetid dung, awaiting the dustbin.
Reid will pass some sort of bill with zero Republican support
That's not possible. They'll work out some bipartisan compromise that sells out the working class just as bad as the Boehner bill and call it a victory.
Wow, reading the comments on that article is depressing.
One guy is saying that *no one* thinks that limiting debt is a good idea and it won't preserve our credit rating. Of course, he doesn't say why or how what the Democrats want to do WILL.
And it's all fine that the echo chamber is trying to support Obama's claim that it's the Republicans that won't compromise.
Accepting an all-cuts bill is a huge compromise when we have the lowest revenue collection in almost 60 years.
Do you have any idea why revenue collection is down ? The rates weren't lowered. Any clue ?
"If you are a bond investor you have to go with the US economy over say Greece."
er....
Frankly, this has never been tried before. No textbook model here for what will happen in August.
By "compromise" he means: you all should do it my way.
"For some, touching the debt ceiling AT ALL was a huge compromise."
"Why?"
Because that was their opinion and policy and in order to support something else, they had to COMPROMISE.
"These same people refusing to raise the debt limit did it with no fuss at all seven times in the last decade. I guess it wasn't a big deal all those times because they were the ones tripling the national debt and not some socialist Kenyan Muslim marxist maoist etc etc. Republican debt is just somehow more valid than Democratic debt."
You say all of these things as if they are BAD. Are they BAD, Jim? ARE they?
Maybe some people can LEARN and some people can't? Maybe the economic melt-down was a wake-up call? Is that impossible in your world? Or does an opinion or action one day require slavish adherence to that opinion forever more?
"Again: hypocrites."
For having a bad idea and going along with unwise policies and then... deciding to do something else?
Really?
Honestly?
Lord above knows that the answer to MY financial difficulties is not only to borrow more money but to spend more money. After all, I spent irresponsibly in the past and I wouldn't want to be a hypocrite, would I.
(Dang, sprained my eyeballs again!)
Maybe, we all learned something from those enforced vollyball games in high school?
Look at what Wendi Deng DID!
Boehner? He got to shove the ball back into Obama's court. And, he got the house vote he needed to pass this "smells like a crap sandwich" bill to Harry Reid.
Maybe, just like in warfare ... all you need to do is take a shot that sends the enemy, full of fear, into scrambling backward?
You have confidence in obama?
We're not dealing with George Washingtron, ya know?
Even the democraps have memories of having better commanders.
Oh, if Reid "passes" it goes to the president's ROBO SIGNING MACHINE for signature. That's a bet.
Japan rating is aa. Their debt-GNP =203%. Still, they get credit with lower interest rates than Europe. after 20 years of stagnation.
Most Americans are stupid. They care more about American Idol and Brangelina than the nation.
Or they are parasites like Garage.
Jim said...
He already has. Accepting an all-cuts bill is a huge compromise when we have the lowest revenue collection in almost 60 years.
60 years ago the federal government was taking in more than $2.4 trillion?
Who knew?!
Jim let me fix this for you
Why? These same people refusing to raise the debt limit did it with no fuss at all seven times in the last decade. I guess it wasn't a big deal all those times because they were the ones tripling the national debt and not some socialist Kenyan Muslim marxist maoist etc etc. Republican debt is just somehow more valid than Democratic debt.
and lets not forget this quote from Senator Obama in 2007:
"America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership. Americans deserve better. I therefore intend to oppose the effort to increase America's debt limit."
Again: hypocrites.
fixed
garage mahal said...
That's not possible. They'll work out some bipartisan compromise that sells out the working class just as bad as the Boehner bill and call it a victory.
You couldn't possibly articulate, with facts, how the Boehner bill "sells out the working class"
Watching you and jim defend the indefensible with this drooling, imbecilic hyperbole is sad.
@Professor, I think you put the emphasis on the the wrong word in your question.
How about:
Hey! Why won't he compromise?
Five South Carolina Republicans voted "No." That includes my Representative Joe "You Lied" Wilson, and my new Rep. after reapportionment, Tim Scott. I think this reflects their view of the value of Federal funding, since Obama would not send these guys a dime to save them from Eternal Damnation.
South Carolina lead the 1860-61 movement to secede from the Union. That turned out well for the state.
No compromise in the Senate - McConnell is going to fillibuster Reid's bill.
This would all be really interesting if it wasn't so scary.
I sure hope August 2nd wasn't the drop dead date because it is now impossible for anything to get through in time.
One data point, but it is illustrative. Here in the Kansas-3 congressional district -- suburban KC and surrounding rural areas -- we were represented between 1999 and 2011 by a supposed 'blue dog' Democrat who in recent years refused to listen to his constituents about cutting expenses and voting against Obama-care.
With a couple of exceptions his electoral victories were well into double figures. This year he stepped aside in favor of ... his wife.
Our new Republican member is a hard-core expense-cutter and balanced budget guy. In 2010 he won the district by over 20%.
The Tea Party types think they have a mandate, because they do -- in this case a 40-point swing in a district reliably Democrat for a dozen years.
We sent them there to do a job, and there will be more in 2013.
These same people refusing to raise the debt limit did it with no fuss at all seven times in the last decade.
@ Jim
Actually....no.
The Tea Party Freshmen are the ones holding the line against debt ceiling raises. The were not there before and the REASON that they ARE there is that they have a MANDATE from their constituents to hold the line.
"These same people refusing to raise the debt limit did it with no fuss at all seven times in the last decade"
Well, that's not true. You miss the point of the Tea Party. They were elected to do things differently than the "no fuss" debt raisers, and they are trying to find a way to do that successfully. Refusing to raise the debt limit at this time was not the right way to proceed, but the issue of out of control spending is not going away,
Things are changing. This round of disputes won't solve much, but we simply can not continue the way we have been doing it in the past.
The bond market has already decided what will happen in August... not much. US treasury bond holders expect to be paid with accrued interest once the smoke clears. The rest is just political science, like global warming.
Watching you and jim defend the indefensible with this drooling, imbecilic hyperbole is sad.
What are we defending dipshit? We're pointing out a group of maniacs are on the verge of bringing the U.S. into default over raising the debt ceiling by giving us a list of demands.
@David, the Civil War turned out very poorly for the residents of Columbia, SC, on the night of February 17, 1865. Seems the soldiers under a fellow named Sherman remembered which state started the whole secession business.
Harry Reid and the Senate Dems will treat this bill like the Red Army treated the women of Berlin in 1945.
Earth to Jim and garage, the Daddy Party had to tell the fellow in the White House that we are broke, and we have to cut back.
"The bond market has already decided what will happen in August... not much. US treasury bond holders expect to be paid with accrued interest once the smoke clears. The rest is just political science, like global warming."
Don't count on it if this thing goes too far past August 2nd.
Wall Street (and the global economy) doesn't believe that the US govenrment would actually do something so insane. They think a compromise is going to happen. Eh,who knows? Maybe they will get it together in time.
tick. tock.
Let's be honest. The rating agencies and Wall Street will barely register any relief from debt ceiling increase. They won't relax until the long term imbalance and overspending is fixed. Dems and Obama and veteran Repubs are in denial but someone must pay the piper soon.
What are we defending dipshit? We're pointing out a group of maniacs are on the verge of bringing the U.S. into default over raising the debt ceiling by giving us a list of demands.
-----
Beautiful inversion of reality here.
What they're trying to prevent is the insolvency of the existing entitlement programs and prevent a default. That is what their "demands" are for. Democrats are left with unicorn farts and the power of positive thinking.
We're pointing out a group of maniacs are on the verge of bringing the U.S. into default over raising the debt ceiling by giving us a list of demands.
There is no danger of bring the US into default (aka not paying the interest on its bonds or basic entitlement obligations like SS and Medicare)....
If the Democrats would agree to quit spending.
In your personal life, when you have bills to pay and not enough money coming in, you have to make choices.
Borrow more money that you can't pay back already? No
Let your mortgage and car loans go into default and lose your house and car. NO.
Prioritize your SPENDING and cut back on those things that you can like hamburger instead of steak. Staying home instead of the vacation to Bocca. Wear last years clothing instead of an annual shopping spree at Nordstrom...>YES!!!
This is what the government refuses to do.
There is no danger of default if they would just STOP THE SPENDING!!
We sent them there to do a job, and there will be more in 2013.
7/29/11 7:26 PM
___
Dream on.
Companies with a AAA rating cannot invest - as far as I know - in countries with less than a AAA rating. Have fun with increased interest rates, etc etc..
As much fun as it may be for some to lambast the barbarians at the gate Repubs, let's review a little recent history on the Fed Gov's budget. We in the DC area track like the Fed budget like hawks, since DC is a company town, and that Fed money is our lifeblood.
The Fed gov experienced a brief shutdown in April of this year because there was not a continuing resolution to fund it. This would not have happened had there been a complete budget passed for the Oct 2010 - Sept 2011 fiscal year.
Notice that date -- Oct 2010. So a budget should have been in place BEFORE the Tea Partiers were even elected!
The Democrats could have passed a budget for fiscal 2010-2011 while they controlled both chambers and the executive. But they didn't.
For fiscal 2011-2012, which we are in now, there's still no budget. Obama's budget was rejected by both Dems and Repubs in both chambers, and another budget has not been voted on.
The Dems want to keep their fingerprints off the budget for one simple reason: we're out of money, and the necessary cuts are going to hurt like hell. It's especially going to hit their constituencies, and they want no part in crafting their own electoral demise.
Companies with a AAA rating cannot invest - as far as I know - in countries with less than a AAA rating. Have fun with increased interest rates, etc etc..
First of all you don't know what you are talking about.
Second: banks are already changing their investment rules to say (paraphrased) AAA bonds or government obligations. OR. see the weasel words there?
However, you are right on about the increased interest rates. That is going to happen as a result of the debt, the undesirability of US bonds as an investment.
The rates have been artificially depressed for many years now. Greenspan was started this train wreck.
I don't know how old you are, but I vividly remember the Carter years. High interest rates, gas shortages, high inflation, unemployment.
Welcome back Carter.
We can survive this ONLY if we learn to stop playing with fire and change our wicked spending ways.
"There is no danger of bring the US into default (aka not paying the interest on its bonds or basic entitlement obligations like SS and Medicare)...."
yes. Default on the interest is less a danger then the government contracts. The USA is the biggest single purchaser of goods and services in the world. In term of the money people, failing to pay for these obligations is going to, as the kids say, freak their sh*t out.
After the next round of S.S. checks going out things will get very very interesting.
But maybe the debt ceiling will be lifted by that point.
Tick. Tock.
Reid will pass some sort of bill with zero Republican support
That's not possible. They'll work out some bipartisan compromise that sells out the NON-working class just as bad as the Boehner bill and call it a victory.
Fixed it for you.
The Dems want to keep their fingerprints off the budget for one simple reason: we're out of money, and the necessary cuts are going to hurt like hell. It's especially going to hit their constituencies, and they want no part in crafting their own electoral demise.
---------
Pretty much. The whole reason for the Democratic party's existence is patronage - paying off their constituents with government dollars for votes.
Well there's an inevitable crunch coming and less dollars = less votes. They're trying to find a way to finnese this shit because they've seen what's happening in Europe when leftist fantasy crashes into budget reality, social European parties are forced to alienate their own constituents in order to prevent default.
I don't know how old you are, but I vividly remember the Carter years. High interest rates, gas shortages, high inflation, unemployment.
I was working in finance and lending then.
16% house loans
23% + car loans
10% certificates of deposit
14% annuities
alternate days for gasoline
Hold onto your seat belts people. Unless we get this spending under control and reduce the debt to GDP...it is going to be a very bumpy ride.
Why is it that the Tea Party which loves our constitution is so eager to change it? No compromise there in this absurd bill.
Why is it that the Tea Party which loves our constitution is so eager to change it? No compromise there in this absurd bill.
----------
Is this comment supposed to make sense?
Borrow more money that you can't pay back already? No
B.S. This is a completely made up crisis. We have plenty of money, it's just not in anyone's hands anymore. Republicans voted for all this debt that now say is a crisis.
The bond market believes this is a six to nine month snafu... nothing more. The ten year US treasury fell in price this week due to increased demand. Bond holders are concerned that their euro investments may not be sound.
Why is it that the Tea Party which loves our constitution is so eager to change it?
Because the method of change that they propose is CONSTITUTIONAL.
Amending the Constitution through the proper and appropriate methods instead of by fiat and behind closed doors, by politicians who think they are above the rules and have deemed themselves to be our betters.
Tin pot dictators.
B.S. This is a completely made up crisis. We have plenty of money, it's just not in anyone's hands anymore. Republicans voted for all this debt that now say is a crisis.
---------
We have plenty of money but we had to borrow a trillion and a half in this year alone?
You are seriously sounding like a lunatic. You're not real! You're not real! Na anananananna I;m not hearing you!
@garage, many of the Republican who voted for "all this debt" lost in primaries last year. Did you not notice?
The Daddy Party is coming to fix things. The news may not be welcome, but daddies know how to deal with toddlers throwing tantrums.
The bond market believes this is a six to nine month snafu... nothing more.
Similar to what Logan International Airport authorities said in May of 2001.
B.S. This is a completely made up crisis. We have plenty of money, it's just not in anyone's hands anymore. Republicans voted for all this debt that now say is a crisis.
Really, then why is it such a BFD to raise the debt ceiling and borrow money if we have money.
Oh....wait....you mean take the communist tact of confiscating the money, wealth and property to distribute.
Remind me who has been in control of Congress (the purse strings) since 2006?
This isn't to say that the Republican RINOs don't deserve a severe beating as well.
The problem is systemic. (look it up).
Sometimes amputation is the answer to save the patient.
Bond holders know that they must by US constitution be paid before granny gets her SS check. No politician alive in Wash DC can withstand the fury of granny denied.
Libtards. They really are this stupid.
One day, we'll learn that the corpse of a 400-pound mama's boy had to be crained out of his taxpayer funded mancave in his mama's basement.
His name will be Garage.
As much as I dislike the answer as to what happens next, I think Ezra Klein is correct:
Why won’t Obama just declare the debt ceiling unconstitutional?
"Seems the soldiers under a fellow named Sherman remembered which state started the whole secession business."
Sing it like we used to sing it fifty thousand strong,
While we were marching through Georgia
Sherman's dashing Yankee boys will never make the coast!
So the saucy rebels said and 'twas a handsome boast
Had they not forgot, alas! to reckon with the Host
While we were marching through Georgia.
We had the war against drugs, the war against poverty, the fight against illiteracy...I officially dub this latest, the very nadir of political thought in this age or any other, the liberal WAR AGAINST MATH.
Leftists can defeat conservatives at the ballot box, but they can't defeat math. But by golly, they're gonna try!
"Bond holders know that they must by US constitution be paid before granny gets her SS check. No politician alive in Wash DC can withstand the fury of granny denied."
There's not enough to pay interest on treasuries, SS, medicare/medicare and legal government contracts.
we're not taking about shutting down the national parks. Or even just a thermo-nuclear govenrment shutdown. We're not talking about just defaulting on treasuries.
America is threatening to default on all government contracts. By choice. In August.
I expect some unhappy creditors to come-a-knocking.
garage mahal said...
What are we defending dipshit? We're pointing out a group of maniacs are on the verge of bringing the U.S. into default over raising the debt ceiling by giving us a list of demands.
Uh, you're defending more debt and insane spending.
PS, you economic illiterate, "default" isn't happening just if the debt ceiling isn't raised.
One day, we'll learn that the corpse of a 400-pound mama's boy had to be crained out of his taxpayer funded mancave in his mama's basement.
I know you'll run and hide like you usually do when asked a tough question, but would you care to make this interesting? If you work, [which is questionable], you'll have a W-2 statement from last year's earnings. We compare yours and mine, and we can talk about that here. Deal?
garage mahal said...
What are we defending dipshit? We're pointing out a group of maniacs are on the verge of bringing the U.S. into default over raising the debt ceiling by giving us a list of demands.
PS, Harry Reid just killed the House approved legislation.
By your "logic" you should be blaming him.
But you're incoherent so I'm not surprised.
you'll have a W-2 statement from last year's earnings. We compare yours and mine, and we can talk about that here. Deal?
AHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAAHAHAHA!
BWAAAAAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAAHA
Back to this again!
You make so much money garbage. Keep telling yourself that...
The offer was made to you as well Jay. Never heard back.
http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2011/07/douglas-holtz-eakin-explains-it-all-to-you/242345/
garage mahal said...
The offer was made to you as well Jay. Never heard back.
Here is your answer:
You're a moron.
You're also a documented liar.
PS, here is a hint for you: those with real wealth don't have to go around bragging about W2's on the Internet.
Clown.
gadfly said...
As much as I dislike the answer as to what happens next, I think Ezra Klein is correct:
Good grief, you have no credibility.
Why doesn't Obama just declare the 4th Amendment "unconstitutional"
?
You're also a documented liar.
Only one way to prove it Jay. You won't take a wage bet with a dirty fucking hippie? Bet you won't be bragging about THAT one on the blogs!
If Obama doesn't want to do this again next year he should have come to an agreement with Congress and told Democrats it was the best they'd get and that he'd sign it and the Senate ought to pass it. Over and done with before election season.
That's what he wants, right?
As it is, the plan passed by Congress passed by no more than a hair. What this means is that Boehner got as far away from the demands of the Tea Party sorts as he was able to get without going over the line entirely. He needs something that will pass. He found the limit that he could go toward what Democrats want and still get it to pass.
That's all he can do.
Obama can whine all he wants and Reid can posture, but unless they're prepared to pull a plan out of their asses that will get the votes, they've got nothing at all.
Obama doesn't want to be doing this next year.
What did he think would happen?
And if Obama and the Democrats in the Senate had agreed and passed a longer term Republican plan they *still* could have blamed it on the Republicans.
Are they afraid that things would have actually gotten better? Where is the down-side to passing an austerity sort of thing and then blaming the Republicans for it?
Garage: you'll have a W-2 statement from last year's earnings. We compare yours and mine, and we can talk about that here
Will the discussion include your Silver Star and all the love letters Angelina Jolie sent you?
*snicker*
Will the discussion include your Silver Star and all the love letters Angelina Jolie sent you?
Nope. Just a verifiable copy of your last year's earnings, and mine. C'mon dude, I'm 400lbs and live in my mom's taxpayer funded basement! Let us see who is paying more taxes. You in?
Will the discussion include your Silver Star and all the love letters Angelina Jolie sent you?
Nope. Just a verifiable copy of your last year's earnings, and mine. C'mon dude, I'm 400lbs and live in my mom's taxpayer funded basement! Let us see who is paying more taxes. You in?
-----
Just post yours if you're that pathetic and insecure. No need for a trade.
Nobody's going to go through the hassle of scanning and blacking out relevant info on their W2s just to impress you.
Garage: Nope. Just a verifiable copy of your last year's earnings, and mine
Ok. Post yours now, liar.
"Are they afraid that things would have actually gotten better? Where is the down-side to passing an austerity sort of thing and then blaming the Republicans for it?"
At this point the D's have been convinced by the R's that debt-mageddon is not going to be that big of a deal.
All the energy in WA DC is going toward no compromise. I think both sides want to make it go smash -- just to see what happens.
In terms of the practical downside of compromise? Members of both parties are afraid of loosing elections - either through a primary or in the general.
It's all about gaining personal power and political games.
This will not end well.
"Compromise," in Obama-speak, means "Doing what I want, when I want it done."
That about sums it up.
Ok. Post yours now, liar.
Now we're getting somewhere! But I don't negotiate like Obama. What about yours?
BTW - here's a great cartoon showing Obama's thinking style and position on taxes.
http://www.gmsplace.com/?attachment_id=7333
Garage; Now we're getting somewhere! But I don't negotiate like Obama. What about yours?
Ha. I knew it.
You're the one denying you're a 400-pound mama's boy living in a taxpayer funded mancave in his mama's basement.
Put up or shut up, little bitch.
Let me know. Mine can easily be verified by any number of people that live and post here. I'll let you off the hook if you apologize.
Garage: Mine can easily be verified by any number of people that live and post here.
So why are you backing out?
I'll let you off the hook if you apologize.
I'm not on the hook. You are. You keep issuing this challenge, but when called on it you run away.
Last chance....
All the energy in WA DC is going toward no compromise. I think both sides want to make it go smash -- just to see what happens.
In terms of the practical downside of compromise? Members of both parties are afraid of loosing elections - either through a primary or in the general.
It's all about gaining personal power and political games.
No, I don't think the Democrats want to see it go smash. I just think they don't know how to use the tools at their disposal. Often it seems they don't know how to even pick them up. There is, however, an element of fascination on their part with the TPers.
Nor do I think both sides are afraid of *losing* the elections. I don't think the TPers are.
We don't want to borrow more.
Obama and the Democrats do.
The compromise is that we'll let them borrow more if they spend less.
I hope that clears up any confusion.
So, someone or other as I was clicking around made the claim that what the Democrats want is the Dem plan that they can blame on Republicans.
I was trying to figure out what the downside for Democrats to going with the plan the Republicans would like to have and being able to blame it firmly on the Republicans would be. What is the downside to the Democrats if they did that?
They get a debt ceiling raise in exchange for what would amount to symbolic government shrinkage. And if it causes any discomfort they can blame Republicans.
Down side?
But if what they really want (other than Obama not wanting to deal with this next year) is to be able to blame Republicans for their OWN plan... then that is different. Obama hasn't given us his plan and neither have Democratic lawmakers, so what the Dem plan is is a mystery. If the Republicans pass what amounts to the Dem plan, who's to know if later the Democrats claim it was all the Republicans fault?
Or is that too convoluted?
If they know it will all be bad, no matter what, it might make sense to want to symbolically attach the Republicans to a "bi-partisan" plan so that they can force Republicans to take "credit" or at least keep Republicans from using the bad economy during the campaign season.
But if it will all be bad anyway, isn't it even easier to do that if they conspicuously let the Republicans get their way and position themselves to heroically take the high ground by *letting* them?
Just a gut feeling, but I feel sure that Obama invoking 14th amendment to usurp Congressional budgetary authority would push lots of otherwise reasonable people into support for impeachment. It be a sure sign of too much executive power.
I sincerely hope that it doesn't come to that.
garage mahal said...
Let me know. Mine can easily be verified by any number of people that live and post here. I'll let you off the hook if you apologize
Has anyone degenerated to this level of beclowning on the Internet before, ever?
EVER?
Dems should get a reliable polling read on that move-invoking the 14th-before they run with it. It sounds like a real bright line transgression.
So why are you backing out?
I'm not. For the 3rd time I'm asking how you plan on producing your half of the bet. What is it?
Well naturally chickenlittle, it would go to the courts. There's no question.
Ann's gotta link the Boehner clip. Put something on the table.
How this little smoach ended up a leader of the rep party instead of hanging out on someone's concrete patio slab fronting the Gulf of Mexico, drink in one hand and cigarette (boo) in the other, talking about going fishing tomorrow is beyond me.
What a cutie patootie.
Garage: For the 3rd time I'm asking how you plan on producing your half of the bet.
What bet?
Just stop wasting our time and admit you have no intention of providing evidence you're not parasite. Its all bluster.
"I was trying to figure out what the downside for Democrats to going with the plan the Republicans would like to have and being able to blame it firmly on the Republicans would be. What is the downside to the Democrats if they did that?"
The downside for D's is that they could loose an election if they cut medicare, ect.
And they don't have enought to sell it to their supporters at home.
And Obama & allied dems are worried that an austerity program will hurt the economy which will hurt his election chances [for example: what happened to England after they passed their austerity program.] Worried about growth slowing due to austerity.
Really, the Ds aren't voting for the same reason as the Rs. can't sell it at home.
Fenny:
I said....
"We compare yours and mine, and we can talk about that here"
When you are ready , let me know.
Why do I need to prove anything?
You're the one who insists he's not 400-pound parasite living in a taxpayer funded mancave in his mama's basement.
You claim you have W2s that prove you're not a farce. Prove it.
C'mon, just admit you're bluffing. You're relying on the fact that no one will post their personal financial info on the net.
You have no intention of ever posting your W2 proof. Because it doesn't exist.
Garage: We compare yours and mine, and we can talk about that here. When you are ready , let me know.
Ok I'm ready. Since you're the one with zero credibility here, you go first.
He Won.
That's why.
wv cingboid
I have no idea but it made me smile.
Remember when he told the Republicans they would have to sit in the back of the bus?
(Did you really vote for this guy Professor? Yuck.)
We don't want to borrow more.
Obama and the Democrats do.
The compromise is that we'll let them borrow more if they spend less.
Also -- Rs don't want to borrow more. Ds want to borrow enough to "get us through" 2012. The compromise to 0 months vs 18 months is 9 months "worth" of money. And, y'know, if the Dems want to stretch that to cover 18 months, have at!
(I bet you a million dollars that Obama will not sign off on anything that doesn't "get him through" the election. Pansy.)
"(I bet you a million dollars that Obama will not sign off on anything that doesn't "get him through" the election. Pansy.)"
I'd take that bet. He'll sign off on anything he'll get because nothing will hurt his election chances more then debt-mageddon.
Unemployment & financial chaos & falling stock prices are not good for winning elections.
My question is: Will he get anything on his desk? Can anything pass both the House and the Senate?
Why not just raise the debt ceiling no strings attached? Or get rid of it altogether. Right now, if the debt ceiling isn't raised, the POTUS can pick and choose what to spend money on. This can't be right.
And Obama & allied dems are worried that an austerity program will hurt the economy
So raising tax rates like they want to won't hurt the economy? And how many billion will actually be cut before the election? Considering everything else he's done, Obama either doesn't care about the economy or knows nothing of economics.
garage, I don't have a W-2, but I can tell you that my pension from where I used to work was $7,320. I had no Federal tax taken out and had $130 taken out by Wisconsin. Eventually, on all my various investments, I paid $303 in Federal taxes.
Ok, let's see yours.
Nancy Pelosi: “What we’re trying to do is save the world from the Republican budget. We’re trying to save life on this planet as we know it today.”
Really. She said that.
Well Garage? Where is your proof?
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