Althouse: "Despite claims of transparency and calls for a 'simple up-or-down vote,' there is nothing simple about this process."

March 15, 2010

"Despite claims of transparency and calls for a 'simple up-or-down vote,' there is nothing simple about this process."

Paul Ryan on the House "reconciliation" bill.

31 comments:

Bushman of the Kohlrabi said...: I don't see a transparency problem. The Democrats are so transparent you can see right through them.; 3/15/10, 9:10 AM
Amexpat said...: Bismark; 3/15/10, 9:15 AM
Fred4Pres said...: It is like Cirque du Soleil over in the Capitol right now. That Peolsi is so limber!; 3/15/10, 9:15 AM
Anonymous said...: I dare these people to attempt to pass this forced insurance bill without an up-or-down vote on this bill.

Heads will roll.

The government will lose all legitimacy if Democrats attempt this Slaughter Solution.

Vote the bill up or down. Or fuck it - understand that you will live with the consequences of this god damned tyranny.

And you motherfuckers better know this: you will not enjoy the fruits of these labors.

Got that? Even if you cram it down, it won't stay fucking down.; 3/15/10, 9:15 AM
Bruce Hayden said...: I think that Bushman is exactly right there. As Ryan points out, these bills have little to do with controlling health care costs, and, indeed, are highly likely to greatly expand them through giving subsidies to a large percentage of the population, as well as decreasing competition in the health insurance market. Rather, this is a socialist power grab, with the government grabbbing control of some 1/6 of the economy.

You can tell that this is the case, since the Democrats really don't care what is being passed, but rather, just that it is being passed. They ignore the trillions that it will cost, and whether or not choice is lost, but abortions are gained. What is important to them is that some form of socialized medicine is in place before this Congress ends, and they lose their chance for the next generation (or two at this rate).

And the libtards here will be parroting the same in short order - that it is more important to pass something, than to get it right, even if a mistake here costs trillions in dollars and innumerable lives.; 3/15/10, 9:19 AM
Hoosier Daddy said...: They ignore the trillions that it will cost

Go figure. Moody's to U.S.: You're closer to a debt downgrade

In all honesty I think the Democrats are in full blown denial that we're hanging on the edge of a complete meltdown of our credit rating. The alternative is that they are fully aware that we are on the brink and are doing their damndest to push us over the edge.; 3/15/10, 9:29 AM
Bruce Hayden said...: Here is a link to an interesting article at Mother Jones (a far from unbiased source): The Senate's Big Abortion Flub.

The general sense of the article is that the only reason that abortion is an issue in the Senate bill is because in the rush to pass it, massive midnight rewriting accidentally dropped the abortion restriction for community health organizations (which MJ claims have never performed abortions - but doesn't explain why they might not, if that were the only way to get federally funded abortions).

But how many other holes are there in these 2,000+ page bills written in the middle of the night over a very short time frame? My guess is a lot.

We shall see.; 3/15/10, 9:33 AM
Bruce Hayden said...: Go figure. Moody's to U.S.: You're closer to a debt downgrade.

I am sure that a reduction to B or lower would be a worthwhile sacrifice, according to the proponents of this bill.

WV: wines - what we will need a lot of if this pases.; 3/15/10, 9:35 AM
themightypuck said...: I don't think the thing will pass although intrade is around 70 at the time of my posting. I think it would be a good short.; 3/15/10, 9:35 AM
KCFleming said...: It's over, at least this democratic republic is over.

I'm encouraging my kids to get a job in government, however long it lasts.; 3/15/10, 9:44 AM
Unknown said...: Poster parody -- the Slaughter-Rule Massacre: http://optoons.blogspot.com/; 3/15/10, 9:45 AM
garage mahal said...: Has anyone scored Ryan's budget proposal I wonder? Why yes they have

His plan loses 2 trillion over 10 years, slashes Medicare and Social Security, and cuts in half the taxes paid by the richest 1 percent, while 90% pay more in taxes. This is the new GOP wunderkid?; 3/15/10, 9:50 AM
Chennaul said...: On top of it all -take a look at this:

The retirement nest egg of an entire generation is stashed away in this small town along the Ohio River: $2.5 trillion in IOUs from the federal government, payable to the Social Security Administration.
It's time to start cashing them in.
For more than two decades, Social Security collected more money in payroll taxes than it paid out in benefits — billions more each year.
Not anymore. This year, for the first time since the 1980s, when Congress last overhauled Social Security, the retirement program is projected to pay out more in benefits than it collects in taxes — nearly $29 billion more.

Social Security is Starting to Cash in Uncle Sam's IOUs; 3/15/10, 9:51 AM
kent said...: There's no way this incomparably cynical and corrupt enterprise -- this nakedly unapologetic power grab -- survives the immediate, inevitable constitutional challenge, should it (by some chthonic miracle) pass.

Either way, however: the jackboot political left in this country are busily ensuring their own micro-minority status, at both the state and federal level, for the length of an entire generation with this club-footed kabuki.

Good.; 3/15/10, 9:54 AM
kent said...: Has anyone scored Ryan's budget proposal I wonder? Why yes they have

The mouthpiece organization of a former Clinton toady and Carter apparatchik? Bitch, please.; 3/15/10, 10:00 AM
Chennaul said...: If the Democrats are so sure that the American public wants this bill then why don't they-in effect- let the electorate vote up or down on the Health Care Bill?

They could run on the proposed legislation for the upcoming election of the House. The election is less than nine months away.

Instead they are jumping through legislation procedure to get a bill done that no one knows what will be in the bill till the end.; 3/15/10, 10:01 AM
Hoosier Daddy said...: If the Democrats are so sure that the American public wants this bill then why don't they-in effect- let the electorate vote up or down on the Health Care Bill?

We're a Republic not a nation that legislates by plebiscite. In essence the elctorate has 'voted' through demonstrations, town halls and writing their electe representatives. I would say the message from the great unwashed is pretty clear otherwise this would have been a done deal a long time ago.; 3/15/10, 10:17 AM
Chennaul said...: Ya I was just trying to tee -up garage.

You know, why don't they do that garage.

Because they're pretty damn sure it wouldn't be a winner.; 3/15/10, 10:32 AM
Chennaul said...: Basically what they are doing is pretty damn non-democratic for a party that calls itself-Democrat.; 3/15/10, 10:34 AM
Hoosier Daddy said...: Basically what they are doing is pretty damn non-democratic for a party that calls itself-Democrat.

Par for the course for a Party that generally thinks the majority of the electorate are ignorant of what is in their best interest and that's why smart people like Pelosi and Reid are there to ensure we don't hurt ourselves.

Rather hard to not be a paternalistic pol when you're ideology is based upon the premise that the average Joe Q. Citizen can't wipe his ass without a government funded and approved instruction manual.; 3/15/10, 10:49 AM
garage mahal said...: Math notoriously has a left wing bias.; 3/15/10, 10:50 AM
Henry said...: His plan loses 2 trillion over 10 years, slashes Medicare and Social Security, and cuts in half the taxes paid by the richest 1 percent, while 90% pay more in taxes. This is the new GOP wunderkid?

Raise Taxes + Slash Benefits =
Lose Money

That's your math?

All I can say is, I'd hate to pay the bill for the plan that doesn't raise taxes and slash benefits.

Oh wait a minute. That's the plan we have now.; 3/15/10, 11:00 AM
Chennaul said...: without a government funded and approved instruction manual.

In the future this will be known as:

Government Charmin.; 3/15/10, 11:07 AM
garage mahal said...: That's your math?

Nope. That's Ryan's math.; 3/15/10, 11:07 AM
Henry said...: Garage, I read the CBPP article.

Sigh.

I know what Ryan's about. He sees the cutting of taxes on capital gains, etc., as way to ensure economic growth -- an engine that generates tax revenues far more aggressively in the long term than raising taxes.

The CBPP disagrees. Since they disagree with Ryan's revenue projections, they disagree with the his deficit targets.

This is pretty boilerplate stuff. Obama wants the same benefit of the economic growth projections, with far less justification. Rosy projections of economic growth makes it so much easier to bet the farm on raising chinchillas.

Personally, I could go without Ryan's tax cuts for the rich. I don't care enough, though the economic arguments against capital gains taxes and the AMT are quite sound. I'm also not crying when the Bush Tax Cuts expire.

But I also have no patience with scare stories about "slashing" benefits from the folks who are backing Obama's health-care plan. We're talking about six years of benefits from ten years of taxes, based on economic growth projections and hypothetical cuts in the growth of Medicare that no one takes seriously.; 3/15/10, 12:10 PM
Hoosier Daddy said...: Heck, I guess we might as well pump up the benefits we can't pay for. It's worked so well for Greece.

What's funny is the masses rioting in the streets are are the recipients of all that government largess are demanding that the 'rich' just pay more.

Which is funny since, anecdotally the national pasttime in Greece is tax evasion.; 3/15/10, 12:25 PM
Sloanasaurus said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 3/15/10, 12:53 PM
Sloanasaurus said...: Democratic lawmakers should be mindful of the Ben Nelson experience. With Ben Nelson, he saw that the health bill was a net negative for his state so he was going to vote against it until they offered the corn-husker kickback. That changed his vote. Yet, now after getting his vote they have annouced they are reneging on the cornhusker kickback because the kickback is hurting them politically. Now Obama and the leaders are making all kinds of new promises to swing voters to get the bill passed. I wonder how many of these promises they intend to keep once the bill is passed.......; 3/15/10, 12:57 PM
Anonymous said...: "Which is funny since, anecdotally the national pasttime in Greece is tax evasion."

That's also the national pastime among the elite in the Democrat Party, and specifically the fucking asshole who heads the IRS and Treasury - Timothy Geithner.

That asshole cheated on his taxes for years before getting caught and only paid up so he could be hired by Barack Obama.

Let's not hate on the Greeks. They're pikers next to the fucking tax cheats running this country.; 3/15/10, 1:30 PM
kent said...: Math notoriously has a left wing bias.

Not so much, evidently.; 3/15/10, 3:59 PM
kent said...: For the Professor's attention, RE: the increasingly obvious unconstitutionality of law being passed via "Slaughter Solution."; 3/15/10, 4:08 PM