tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post2674011592468416199..comments2024-03-18T23:08:20.960-05:00Comments on Althouse: "I'm Todd Akin... Rape is an evil act. I used the wrong words in the wrong way and for that I apologize."Ann Althousehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01630636239933008807noreply@blogger.comBlogger248125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-48895013699248895232012-08-22T07:10:25.447-05:002012-08-22T07:10:25.447-05:00Again PP.
What is being killed?Again PP.<br />What is being killed?Rustyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00938263272237104128noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-87416148408388963612012-08-22T04:30:20.468-05:002012-08-22T04:30:20.468-05:00Which brings me back to what should be the central...<i>Which brings me back to what should be the central lesson here- people in government do not have to be smart to rise high. Why do we want to give them any more power than absolutely necessary?</i><br /><br />Absolutely. !00% agree, and it's a pity that people on the left (who have has many political bogeymen as we do) don't see things this way. yashuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12716156754089411837noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-81100577622604326512012-08-22T04:07:21.626-05:002012-08-22T04:07:21.626-05:00Biden and Akin are both idiots, and it's easy ...Biden and Akin are both idiots, and it's easy enough to recognize that without going over their rhetoric with a fine-toothed comb.<br /><br />Which brings me back to what should be the central lesson here- people in government do not have to be smart to rise high. Why do we want to give them any more power than absolutely necessary?<br /><br />And for the people who do want to give them more power- name some names! Who is such a successful genius politician that you want to give them more decision making power in *your* life?MayBeehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11966319657113124861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-75045989972459126792012-08-22T03:57:18.044-05:002012-08-22T03:57:18.044-05:00This comment has been removed by the author.MayBeehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11966319657113124861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-1523590817509857292012-08-22T03:52:29.413-05:002012-08-22T03:52:29.413-05:00Maybee, fair enough, let's agree to disagree. ...Maybee, fair enough, let's agree to disagree. <br /><br />*I* hear that implication (or suggestion) in Akin's remarks as well as his later clarification of those remarks, in fact his clarifications make things on this count worse. (NB in one of his subsequent interviews he admits that rape *can* cause pregnancy, and says he was unaware of that fact as of two days ago. So IMO when he said "rare" he meant, he believed, basically virtually "never".)<br /><br />True, if we want to be very charitable and give him the full benefit of the doubt, one could exculpate him from having that implication in mind. The fact that I (and many others) immediately drew that implication, doesn't absolve him from the monumentally harmful clumsiness of his rhetoric (as you yourself agree). But unlike you, I'm not convinced that his "apology" and explanation (which so completely missed the point as to be delusional) exonerates him from having that implication in mind. <br /><br />I do impute that to him. You're right, I'm not being charitable, but given the entire context of his remarks and behavior, I'm not inclined to be charitable.<br /><br />I agree that in principle and generally speaking, <br /><br /><i>I do not believe that because people may be deeply emotional about something that happened to them, that we all must filter words spoken through their emotion and determine what the speaker meant based on what the offended felt about it.</i><br /><br />But in this particular case-- given the extremity of his apparent cluelessness and the fact that he's doubled down on it-- I disagree.<br /><br />It's like saying Biden's "they want to put y'all back in chains" remark contains no allusion whatsoever to slavery, only to the harmful economic effects of Wall Street deregulation. yashuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12716156754089411837noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-30561788331677763952012-08-22T02:19:19.988-05:002012-08-22T02:19:19.988-05:00It's a pity Akin didn't make this remark b...It's a pity Akin didn't make this remark before the primary rather than after. This has all become NYS wrestling which is a pity. The only saving grace of all this would be a focus henceforth on the science of the issue. <br /><br />Semantics are of minor importance except to those in search of butthurt. There are various forms of rape, such as: <br /><br />beaten/shot/stabbed/etc and raped, held down, incapacitated, legs forced apart, tied up, whatever<br /><br />raped with cooperation due to extortion, e.g., with a gun to victim's, children's head <br /><br />raped under influence of drunk, drugs, mental illness<br /><br />raped with fraud, e.g. it was dark and rapist pretended to be husband; or friend shared girl with his buddies; or under the pretence of a medical exam<br /><br />raped statutorily: age limits, miscegenation when that was illegal, incest<br /><br />raped as in regrets it later-she didn't get the part, he didn't pay her, he's not really a football player, he didn't call, she got caught by her parents or her husband...<br /><br />And no doubt others. Can anyone doubt that biological responses could differ across such cases?<br /><br />And intuitively, is it hard to believe, either that cortisols or any other ingredients of the biochemical stew in question could affect ovulation, fertilization, implantation, or indeed cause spontaneous abortion or miscarriage in a woman already pregnant? This is absurd? You think that if a pregnant rape victim lost her baby, there could not be a connection?<br /><br />Cedarford, repugnant as he is, at least offered a counterhypothesis, that rape promotes fertility. No evidence that I've seen, and I asked him for it, but it is an argument. Data might be gathered, say, in Bosnia.<br /><br />But it's just about the winning, about the goring of oxen. Epicteus would be so proud. <br /><br />Nichevohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12591460407621898458noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-85089215361606648722012-08-22T02:14:18.982-05:002012-08-22T02:14:18.982-05:00Yashu-
I'm afraid that I do not believe that ...Yashu-<br /><br />I'm afraid that I do not believe that because people may be deeply emotional about something that happened to them, that we all must filter words spoken through their emotion and determine what the speaker meant based on what the offended felt about it.<br /><br />As for the example with my friend with cancer, she certainly did not think she must have *wanted* it to return, on some level, because her body did not fight it off for her. She didn't think that the practitioners telling her about positive thinking meant that if she got cancer again she must want it.<br /><br />The power of positive thinking and the "mind-body" connection are frequent beliefs in this country. I have never heard anyone who believes in those things say that people who then get a disease wanted it, have you?<br /><br />I don't see why a rape victim would be more susceptible to hearing such an implication (that isn't being made) than say, a breast cancer victim. Almost all of my friends with cancer have wondered on some level what they did to encourage their bodies to fail them(diet? plastic water bottles?). None of them think they must have secretly wanted cancer.<br /><br /><i>Don't you see how awful an implication that is? Even if there are many false claims of rape, tying that topic into the topic of pregnancy after rape and abortion is just beyond idiotic and offensive.</i><br /><br />He was an idiot to tie levels of rape to pregnancy at all. He seems to be a bit of an idiot in general.<br />But this particular term - legitimate rape- is going to be a problem for people who want to discuss whether rape is an exception for otherwise illegal abortions.<br />We do have a segment of society that tries to redefine rape down. We also have a segment of society who thought Dr Tiller was a hero because he was willing to perform late term abortions based on the poor "mental health" of the pregnant woman.<br />If laws like the one Akin wants are passed, we're going to have to deal with the definition of rape or we are going to have to accept that any woman who wants an abortion can just say she was raped and get one. Just as the women going to Dr Tiller were able to say they had mental health issues, no proof required.<br /><br />Now, I don't want any of that. And Akin did a terrible job of presenting his position, in part because he wants physiology to take care of the conundrum for him.<br /><br />But I don't think we need to make a connection that wasn't made, and is not made when people say similar things about other horrible conditions. We don't need to *add* meaning to make it more complicated or awful. MayBeehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11966319657113124861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-77957101937883240412012-08-21T22:04:05.646-05:002012-08-21T22:04:05.646-05:00Dear Ann Althouse:
We absolutely do not want Akin...Dear Ann Althouse:<br /><br />We absolutely do not want Akin to step aside. We like him where he is, bringing to the attention of the American people the extreme radicalism of the Republican Party. <br /><br />Akin's policies are Republican policies and they reduce the freedom of American women as they ram their religions down our throats. <br /><br />Just another chance for a political cheapshot from Ann. AlphaLiberalhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08711124490821422066noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-83465446081401223662012-08-21T21:01:15.067-05:002012-08-21T21:01:15.067-05:00Ann, GOP resisted throwing Angle and Christine O D...Ann, GOP resisted throwing Angle and Christine O Donnell under the bus in 2010... and it resulted in GOP defeats in both winnable senate racesjohn marzanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08036820667908976630noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-6033933595818133172012-08-21T19:43:36.039-05:002012-08-21T19:43:36.039-05:00And God so loved Claire McCaskill that he sent her...And God so loved Claire McCaskill that he sent her Todd Aikin for an opponent.uUnknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18194867861358564423noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-28806045840685301602012-08-21T19:19:14.604-05:002012-08-21T19:19:14.604-05:00Jay and Purplepenguin, guys are boring us all to d...Jay and Purplepenguin, guys are boring us all to death. Why don't you take it outside (email each other) or get a room.<br /><br />I'm beginning to thing that you are both sock puppets trying to derail the thread.. Scrolling past your petty bullcrap is tiresome.<br />Dust Bunny Queenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15115422951538885247noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-55949720785826252522012-08-21T17:28:11.044-05:002012-08-21T17:28:11.044-05:00purplepenquin said...
He said he never heard of it...<i> purplepenquin said...<br />He said he never heard of it happening...no exceptions given.</i><br /><br />No, he didn't.<br /><br />The full transcript was posted to refute your lies, yet you keep lying.<br /><br />See, stupid, the question was about a 12 year old who "<i>happens to get pregnant</i>" and the answer was "<i>I just haven’t heard of that being a circumstance that’s been brought to me in any personal way</i>"<br /><br />Of course with your high school education, you can't follow the grammar rules and are unable to see the importance of you truncating the quote.<br /><br />Just admit you were duped and be done with it.Brian Brownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01772632205321099314noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-18835300113525078642012-08-21T17:23:20.825-05:002012-08-21T17:23:20.825-05:00purplepenquin said...
I do agree that some others...<i>purplepenquin said...<br /><br />I do agree that some others have made an unfair summary of his actual statement.</i><br /><br />You did, retard.<br /><br />Your very first post here was an effort to validate what "machine" said which was inaccurate.<br /><br />What you continue to do is propagandize the whole thing.<br /><br />Just admit you were duped and be done with it, you silly, gullible hack.Brian Brownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01772632205321099314noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-15559545986822774652012-08-21T17:21:58.682-05:002012-08-21T17:21:58.682-05:00purplepenquin said...
The basic meaning is the s...<i>purplepenquin said...<br /><br /><br />The basic meaning is the same no matter if it is the exact quote or the statement I used to sum up his quote.</i><br /><br />Actually it isn't because you're not referencing the question, which was also misrepresented.<br /><br />Hey, you know who plays silly, bullshit games like that?<br /><br />People telling the truth.<br /><br />Really, they do!<br /><br />Asshole.Brian Brownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01772632205321099314noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-49408886153251506922012-08-21T16:40:10.383-05:002012-08-21T16:40:10.383-05:00But you DID post a truncated quote, that changes t...<i>But you DID post a truncated quote, that changes the basic meaning of what was said.</i><br /><br />The basic meaning is the same no matter if it is the exact quote or the statement I used to sum up his quote.<br /><br />The truncated quote would be untrue if the part that was left out was "but I've read about some cases" or something similar....but he didn't clarify anything of the sort, did he? He said he never heard of it happening...no exceptions given.<br /><br />I do agree that some others have made an unfair summary of his actual statement. For example, he never said it was impossible for a rape victim to get pregnant, but I never said that he did say that.<br /><br />purplepenquinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17985523216476971244noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-41875647924805886682012-08-21T16:30:11.030-05:002012-08-21T16:30:11.030-05:00Once he decides you are a leftist its all over,
H...<i>Once he decides you are a leftist its all over,</i><br /><br />He reminds me of <a href="http://purplepenquin.com/2011/08/i-think-ive-meet-this-guy/" rel="nofollow">Sally's dad.</a><br /><br />~~~~~~<br /><br /><i>So who do you think takes you seriously, idiot?</i><br /><br />Do you really talk like that in real life? <br /><br />That aside, it looks like AReasonableMan just did take me seriously. Right there in front of ya and you still missed it. <br /><br />You sure are one dumb unicorn.<br /><br />purplepenquinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17985523216476971244noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-29832517271921751872012-08-21T16:20:03.722-05:002012-08-21T16:20:03.722-05:00Pretty obvious that you're just a Moby...'...<i>Pretty obvious that you're just a Moby...'cause your schtick is too far over the top to be beleivable.</i><br /><br />But you DID post a truncated quote, that changes the basic meaning of what was said. <br /><br />That's like Maureen Dowd with her sudden ellipses. Known Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15029003649395214104noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-26982484047150387322012-08-21T16:17:42.507-05:002012-08-21T16:17:42.507-05:00purplepenquin said...
Seriously - are people sup...<i>purplepenquin said...<br /><br /><br />Seriously - are people supposed to take you serious when you act like this? </i><br /><br />I'm not the one truncating quotes and lying.<br /><br />You are.<br /><br />So who do you think takes <b><i>you</i></b> seriously, idiot?Brian Brownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01772632205321099314noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-80092747561738449762012-08-21T16:16:54.048-05:002012-08-21T16:16:54.048-05:00AReasonableMan said...
Ignore Jay. I once wasted s...<i>AReasonableMan said...<br />Ignore Jay. I once wasted some time trying to get him to see sense over some relatively simple thing</i><br /><br />Hysterical.<br /><br />I bet you did.Brian Brownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01772632205321099314noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-18398198572109464922012-08-21T16:15:42.522-05:002012-08-21T16:15:42.522-05:00Ignore Jay. I once wasted some time trying to get ...Ignore Jay. I once wasted some time trying to get him to see sense over some relatively simple thing. Basically everyone of his posts is some variation on the theme "GET OFF MY LAWN".<br /><br />Once he decides you are a leftist its all over, nothing you say will be of any value, you are just a lying bag of shit like all the other damn leftists.Beloved Commenter AReasonableManhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14139261862363663232noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-21706726674891912672012-08-21T16:04:45.624-05:002012-08-21T16:04:45.624-05:00Nice meltdown Jay. I see that once again you are c...Nice meltdown Jay. I see that once again you are choosing to go with quantity rather than quality.<br /><br />Seriously - are people supposed to take you serious when you act like this? Do you really talk like this in real life, with the constant name-calling and repeating the same insults over&over again?<br /><br />Pretty obvious that you're just a Moby...'cause your schtick is too far over the top to be beleivable.<br /><br />purplepenquinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17985523216476971244noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-59775292871987926202012-08-21T16:02:31.575-05:002012-08-21T16:02:31.575-05:00And had I gotten cancer while not eating a raw die...<i>And had I gotten cancer while not eating a raw diet, she would never have thought I must have, on some level, wanted the cancer.</i><br /><br />Of course, and that analogy is fair to an extent. But surely you're aware that in our culture the topic of "rape"-- as opposed to the topic of "cancer"-- is entangled with inflammatory memes such as whether or not a woman really "wants it" or was "asking for it" or "enjoyed it," memes that touch on the raped woman's complicity or blame or shame. <br /><br />And not just memes: the experience of rape has heavy psychological consequences, which often involve feelings of shame, humiliation, guilt (even though these feelings are objectively irrational). <br /><br />Seen from that perspective, there's no comparison between cancer and rape. <br /><br />You say your friend "believed a raw diet and positive emotions would keep her cancer at bay," and go on to say what you did or didn't think when she relapsed, but you didn't mention what *she* thought. It's possible that a person who really believed that might in fact blame themselves for not maintaining the positive emotions necessary to keep the cancer at bay. <br /><br />Just so, someone who took Akin's remarks seriously and believed them might regard a woman who got pregnant after being raped as someone who very likely wasn't "legitimately" raped, someone who for whatever reason failed to "shut it down." Why did her body fail to shut it down? Why did her body instead welcome it in? <br /><br />Can't you see how something like that might lead to culturally toxic and psychologically damaging notions that shame and blame the rape victim for getting pregnant? Even if Akin himself didn't mean that, his rhetoric all too easily lends itself to that. <br /><br />And by the way, the fact that Akin has doubled down and is apparently utterly oblivious about what was wrong with his remarks, makes me more apt to think he did mean it that way:<br /><br /><i>AKIN: You know, Dr. Willkie has just released a statement and part of his letter, I think he just stated it very clearly. He said, of course Akin never used the word legitimate to refer to the rapist, but to false claims like those made in Roe v. Wade and I think that simplifies it….. There isn’t any legitimate rapist…. [I was] making the point that there were people who use false claims, like those that basically created Roe v. Wade.</i><br /><br />!!!! So he's saying that if you get pregnant after being raped, that would lead one to conclude (just statistically, doctor) that the rape was likely to be a <i>false claim</i>. Not necessarily-- but probably. <br /><br />Don't you see how awful an implication that is? Even if there are many false claims of rape, tying that topic into the topic of pregnancy after rape and abortion is just beyond idiotic and offensive.yashuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12716156754089411837noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-13479086819302829732012-08-21T15:50:54.606-05:002012-08-21T15:50:54.606-05:00purplepenquin said...
Tho, in all fairness, I see...<i>purplepenquin said...<br /><br />Tho, in all fairness, I see that his spokesperson is now claiming that he never said those words at all, so maybe the TV reporter just made the whole thing up</i><br /><br />Complete & utter bullshit.<br /><br />You can't post without lying.Brian Brownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01772632205321099314noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-50249358766498152552012-08-21T15:38:47.966-05:002012-08-21T15:38:47.966-05:00purplepenquin said...
Really-truly. I don't r...<i> purplepenquin said...<br /><br />Really-truly. I don't read TPM on a regular basis. <br /><br />What leads you to think I do?</i><br /><br />Because you're a silly, ignorant leftist.<br /><br />And, everything you post here is a lie or in service to a lie.<br /><br />Kind of like TPM.<br /><br />Brian Brownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01772632205321099314noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-39398528744436940722012-08-21T15:37:53.463-05:002012-08-21T15:37:53.463-05:00purplepenquin said...
Except you did. In this thr...<i>purplepenquin said...<br /><br />Except you did. In this thread.</i><br /><br />No, I didn't<br /><br />And you accusing me of something doesn't make it true.<br /><br />No go truncate another quote, you big truth teller you.Brian Brownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01772632205321099314noreply@blogger.com