tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post1683145896100469550..comments2024-03-18T20:41:46.283-05:00Comments on Althouse: When Hillary books collide.Ann Althousehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01630636239933008807noreply@blogger.comBlogger68125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-32157585432177217232007-05-31T14:34:00.000-05:002007-05-31T14:34:00.000-05:00Democratic he may not have been, but General Augus...<I>Democratic he may not have been, but General Augusto Pinochet certainly loved himself some free markets.</I><BR/><BR/>As mass murdering dictators go, Pinochet was kind of a wuss -- the death toll of his regime was around a hundred people a year, mostly Communist dissidents.Revenanthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11374515200055384226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-24579254972123380242007-05-30T21:50:00.000-05:002007-05-30T21:50:00.000-05:00Whoever heard of a market-economics democracy guy ...<I>Whoever heard of a market-economics democracy guy mass murdering his own people. I haven't heard of one?</I><BR/><BR/>Democratic he may not have been, but General Augusto Pinochet certainly loved himself some free markets.Freshly Squeezed Cynichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04659151201579945779noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-60700994799796050422007-05-30T20:00:00.000-05:002007-05-30T20:00:00.000-05:00But Clinton was well and truly despised and accuse...<I>But Clinton was well and truly despised and accused of things nearly as horrible as W is now.</I><BR/><BR/>As was Reagan, for that matter. Remember the "Reagan WANTS nuclear war" meme, for example? Then there was Carter, who (unbelievable as this seems today) was even more unpopular than Bush is. And so on, and so on.<BR/><BR/>Really, Bush Sr, Ford, and Eisenhower are the only Presidents in the last century that didn't inspire crazed loathing in the opposing party.Revenanthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11374515200055384226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-66199814435432191252007-05-30T18:23:00.001-05:002007-05-30T18:23:00.001-05:00By the way, if Fen wants to kill socialists, he wo...By the way, if Fen wants to kill socialists, he would advocate them being hanged.<BR/><BR/>I assume them being "hung" refers to literally being hung up in some public square after being tarred and feathered, and thereby subjected to ridicule.blakehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05430444326700437630noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-68170635950495362112007-05-30T18:23:00.000-05:002007-05-30T18:23:00.000-05:00Newman,Then you had better stay away from Daily Ko...Newman,<BR/><BR/>Then you had better stay away from Daily Kos and Huffington since they both want their opponents dead and have said so.dickhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08976498133597991337noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-10092715304710324932007-05-30T18:22:00.000-05:002007-05-30T18:22:00.000-05:00I ran into "The Clinton Chronicles" a number of ti...I ran into "The Clinton Chronicles" a number of times from a number of sources. It's pretty far out. Not, in my opinion like the 9/11 truthers, since the Clinton conspiracies were all about behind-the scenes stuff. (In other words, you didn't have to discount what millions personally witnessed live in order to believe them.) <A HREF="http://www.snopes.com/politics/clintons/bodycount.asp" REL="nofollow"> Snopes has a takedown here.</A> And then there's the fact that Monica Lewisnky lives on.<BR/><BR/>But Clinton was well and truly despised and accused of things nearly as horrible as W is now. Which says to me, the <I>next</I> President is going to have it even worse. <BR/><BR/>Just wait. Human sacrifice, cannibalism, slave trading, dogs and cats living together....the accusations will mount.blakehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05430444326700437630noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-86823071577799705672007-05-30T18:02:00.000-05:002007-05-30T18:02:00.000-05:00Newmann,The pleasure was mine.Newmann,<BR/><BR/>The pleasure was mine.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-12657704965755714722007-05-30T17:27:00.000-05:002007-05-30T17:27:00.000-05:00Mike,It's been a pleasure having a conversation wi...Mike,<BR/><BR/>It's been a pleasure having a conversation with you. I'll be checking out now. I don't hang out on sites where people openly advocate the death of their political opponent. Even if they're kidding. I'm not referring to you, of course, but to Fen.newmannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11868012718215239163noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-19451842684668789822007-05-30T17:23:00.000-05:002007-05-30T17:23:00.000-05:00Thank you, Newmann. I don't doubt any of your inf...Thank you, Newmann. I don't doubt any of your information. I guess I don't consider most of those names to be important. Richard Mellon Scaife, for example, I would equate with George Soros. Important maybe because he's got a lot of money, but not really a serious voice. Paul Weyrich, I'll give you that. Limbaugh, he probably was just having fun with it, but I don't know, I didn't hear it. I'd be surprised at the Wall Street Journal taking it seriously. I'll do some digging on that.<BR/><BR/>"Joseph Farah, G.Gordon Liddy, Dick Morris, and Representative William Dannemeyer." Liddy and Morris, who cares? I'll have to look up Dannemeyer to see who he is. Being an elected official, he'd rate as important. I don't know Joseph Farah.<BR/><BR/>Anyway, if, as has been reported, several tens of percent of people can believe that 9/11 was an inside job (another thing I find hard to believe) I suppose it's possible that a lot of people believe that Bill Clinton murdered Vince Foster. Every day more evidence rolls in that there are an awful lot of nutcases out there.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-14281707483133986532007-05-30T17:05:00.000-05:002007-05-30T17:05:00.000-05:00newmann,mike doesn't want "links." he could give ...newmann,<BR/>mike doesn't want "links." he could give a damn about any of it.Luckyoldsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11489310035114843752noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-9764271395762062812007-05-30T17:03:00.000-05:002007-05-30T17:03:00.000-05:00mike,and i'm supposed to care what you and the res...mike,<BR/>and i'm supposed to care what you and the rest of the right wing crowd here thinks about me...or anybody else who doesn't toe the right wing line?<BR/><BR/>and when YOU say: "You don't have to be a feminist to be offended by Bill Clinton's sexual escapades in the White House. You don't have to be a prude, either. You only have to view the Office of President with respect."<BR/><BR/>are you including the current resident of the white house's denial of torture? cheney's continuing to say saddam had WMD or a partnership with osama...or the outing of a covert CIA agent? that's what YOU call "respect" for the office of the president???<BR/><BR/>and please...you're part of the same crowd who also think anybody who disagrees with bush, his policies, the iraqi invasion, the war, the administration's lack of empathy for those without health care, those who want us out of iraq now, anybody who thinks the american public was lied to regarding the reason for invasion, WMD, intelligence matters, wiretapping, torture and many other issues...is un-american or as fen puts it; anti-american or socialist vermin.<BR/><BR/>i happen to be a liberal who speaks his mind, something you absolutely hate to hear...because it's not something you already believe to be so.<BR/><BR/>*and please, don't give that crap that you're not "commenting on your manner of protecting your women"...because that's exactly what you're doing and you know it.Luckyoldsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11489310035114843752noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-18616060955409872632007-05-30T16:38:00.000-05:002007-05-30T16:38:00.000-05:00OK, Mike, if you don't mind not having the links.F...OK, Mike, if you don't mind not having the links.<BR/><BR/>First, I don't know why I'm not supposed to include Falwell, since he was obviously a very prominent conservative. However, I will assume you mean to have a larger list.<BR/><BR/>The next obvious prominent conservative would be Richard Mellon Scaife, who was the primary financier for the tape After him, Paul Weyrich.<BR/><BR/>Many sources claim the video was advertised on Rush Limbaugh's show. I haven't been able to find any independent verification of this, so I'm doubtful. However, when Bob Dornan subbed for Rush, the show became an outlet for some pretty outlandish conspiracy theories--In particular the so-called "Clinton Body Count," including the theory that the Clinton's had Vince Foster murdered. <BR/><BR/>There were two major conspiracy theories that were portrayed in the "Clinton Chronicles." The first was the theory that clinton was involved in drug trafficing. The second was the CBC, or Clinton Body Count, which is essentially the notion that Clinton had dozens of people, including Ron Brown and Vince Foster, murdered. The drug trafficing charge was briefly expounded in the Wall Street Journal Editorial page, which also spent a brief period fixated on conspiracy theories regarding the Vince Foster suicide. In an act of extreme disingenuousness, the WSJ editorial page actually published the 800 number where the "Clinton Chronicles" could be purchased, simultaneously denying any knowlege of the tape's veracity (or lack thereof.)<BR/><BR/>Other propogators of Clinton Body Count theories include Joseph Farah, G.Gordon Liddy, Dick Morris, and Representative William Dannemeyer. <BR/><BR/>The only conservative voice I've read that denounced these conspiracy theories was Pat Bucchannan, who said on Hardball that he used to receive copies of the "Clinton Chronicles" all the time, and he believed the tape was "beyond the pale." Unfortunately he made this denunciation at least a decade after the fact, and there was no explanation as to why he didn't speak up at the time.<BR/><BR/>I have been unable to find any citings of conservatives denouncing the "Clinton Chronicles" or its various conspiracy theories at the time they were being propogated. I'm not suggesting that it didn't happen. Bucchannan's comments indicate that these tapes were pretty widespread in the conservative movement and being pushed strongly. How many actually believed them is impossible to say, but apparently many gave them their tacit support.<BR/><BR/>Your point regarding "Worlds in Collision" is a decent one, but I just don't buy it in this case. We're talking about tapes marketed pretty much strictly through far-right media sources at a time before the internet was really big. I doubt that many of the purchasers were just curiosity seekers. Also, the video is still available, with updates, on many sites, and a quick google search will locate a shocking number of sites where people still believe it. Some of these sites, Farah's for example, are quite large.<BR/><BR/>As I said, there were a lot of people who believed those theories, a lot who propogated them, and not many who denounced them. Not much has changed as far as conspiracy theories go.newmannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11868012718215239163noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-72902541697099656292007-05-30T16:33:00.000-05:002007-05-30T16:33:00.000-05:00Lucky, I'm not commenting on your manner of protec...Lucky, I'm not commenting on your manner of protecting your women. I'm commenting on your manner. You are abusive, rude, unthinking, and, well, just about everything you call everybody else here. You've made this a much less fun place to visit.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-34885814470893402112007-05-30T16:31:00.000-05:002007-05-30T16:31:00.000-05:00Socialists have had kind of a bad run recently. L...Socialists have had kind of a bad run recently. Look at some of the more famous socialists: Stalin, Hitler, Pol Pot, Castro, Hussein, Chavez....<BR/><BR/>The funny thing about socialism is that it's hard to avoid the totalitarian dictator thing if you want to move further into socialism. <BR/><BR/>Whoever heard of a market-economics democracy guy mass murdering his own people. I haven't heard of one? <BR/><BR/>I guess socialism could work if you had the perfect person as your leader, such as Jesus or Al Gore. But anyone else would be limited by those prickly human traits.Sloanasaurushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15787488302564761993noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-31663631904416400662007-05-30T16:25:00.000-05:002007-05-30T16:25:00.000-05:00Well, yes, LOS, the VA is a socialist endeavor. he...Well, yes, LOS, the VA <I>is</I> a socialist endeavor. hence it's total crappiness was inevitable.<BR/><BR/>Fen's right. Hillary is a socialist. And now that Obama has come out for national health care, he exposes himself as one as well. <BR/><BR/>yes, I know the new new term is "progressive", but socialists they are. And what a misnomer: bowing to failed socialist policies isn't <I>pro</I>gressive, it's <I>re</I>gressive, ...<I>reactionary</I>, even.KCFleminghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00124201866124646626noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-92116604905504559972007-05-30T16:21:00.000-05:002007-05-30T16:21:00.000-05:00What on earth do you hope to gain from a discussio...<EM>What on earth do you hope to gain from a discussion with someone who says something as ignorant as "All socialists are vermin"?</EM><BR/><BR/>Who said this. It's brilliant. <BR/><BR/>How about all socialists are scum.Sloanasaurushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15787488302564761993noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-75367354309761303432007-05-30T16:13:00.000-05:002007-05-30T16:13:00.000-05:00mike,like i said; you can handle situations as des...mike,<BR/>like i said; you can handle situations as described any way you want, but i come from a background where men do their best to handle things like as men should...i "personally" never felt i could just leave it up to the "womanfolk."<BR/><BR/>again, this is MY opinion, but i feel that any man who would allow such an occurance, without responding...is gutless.Luckyoldsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11489310035114843752noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-91221834481946062142007-05-30T15:56:00.000-05:002007-05-30T15:56:00.000-05:00"Womenfolk" was meant to mock you, Lucky.Vintage L..."Womenfolk" was meant to mock you, Lucky.<BR/><BR/>Vintage Lucky, everyone:<BR/>http://althouse.blogspot.com/2007/04/ive-dished-it-out-for-long-time-and-now.html#comments<BR/><BR/>The fun starts about 1:00 pm in the comments.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-21048894135963734272007-05-30T15:52:00.000-05:002007-05-30T15:52:00.000-05:00roost,i just love aggravating right wing misogynis...roost,<BR/>i just love aggravating right wing misogynists like fen.Luckyoldsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11489310035114843752noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-81626760053162193202007-05-30T15:49:00.000-05:002007-05-30T15:49:00.000-05:00mike,oh...and your use of the term; "womanfolk" te...mike,<BR/>oh...and your use of the term; "womanfolk" tells me exactly where you're coming from.Luckyoldsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11489310035114843752noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-57899885273656320192007-05-30T15:48:00.000-05:002007-05-30T15:48:00.000-05:00mike,ohhhhh, now i remember you.you're the one who...mike,<BR/>ohhhhh, now i remember you.<BR/><BR/>you're the one who said: if someone walked up to a table where you were having dinner with your mother, sister or wife...and called one of them a whore...you'd let THEM handle it themselves.<BR/><BR/>and i said: if anybody said something like that to my mother, sister or wife...i'd do what i could to knock their teeth out of their head.<BR/><BR/>i realize we're all raised differently, but under those circumstance, if i didn't do something, i'd be ashamed of myself, as would everybody else involved...and when my father found out, he'd be even more so.<BR/><BR/>to each his own, mike, but i find it hard to believe that even you and you best pal, fen would allow someone to say something like that.Luckyoldsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11489310035114843752noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-68638823235365236652007-05-30T15:33:00.000-05:002007-05-30T15:33:00.000-05:00Lucky, I avoid you, but I was one of the guys you ...Lucky, I avoid you, but I was one of the guys you declared gutless because we didn't think it was necessary to beat people up if they dissed our womenfolk.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-42260238587518941572007-05-30T15:28:00.000-05:002007-05-30T15:28:00.000-05:00And from the other side:Lucky,What on earth do you...And from the other side:<BR/><BR/>Lucky,<BR/><BR/>What on earth do you hope to gain from a discussion with someone who says something as ignorant as "All socialists are vermin"?Roost on the Moonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17418683905180670249noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-66608722653193410202007-05-30T15:18:00.000-05:002007-05-30T15:18:00.000-05:00oh, roger...how could say such horrible things?you...oh, roger...how could say such horrible things?<BR/><BR/>you two aren't...you know...Luckyoldsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11489310035114843752noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-47048893290603044482007-05-30T15:17:00.000-05:002007-05-30T15:17:00.000-05:00Fen: I love you man--but why do you interact with...Fen: I love you man--but why do you interact with LOS--unless you have a some kind of masochistic streak that I normally don't attribute to marines. Come on, man--You know better!<BR/><BR/>Just my two centsRoger J.https://www.blogger.com/profile/12639676792043324100noreply@blogger.com