Watch the whole Q&A session here.Oracle's Larry Ellison says a surveillance system of police body cams, cameras on cars and autonomous drones, all monitored by AI, will constantly record and report on police and citizens, leading everyone to be on their best behavior pic.twitter.com/RAq5XGaNmZ
— Tsarathustra (@tsarnick) September 15, 2024
১৭ সেপ্টেম্বর, ২০২৪
We'll all be on our best behavior, because — with cameras everywhere, monitored by AI — we'll all be supervised.
Says Oracle's Larry Ellison:
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The future sounds lovely. Constantly monitored. "There is no God or sky daddy watching you constantly - so lets make one." Free will? What's that?
That brave new world we read about as young people is here now. And it makes me glad I'm the age I am. It's not a freer world. It's a totalitarian world, coming to your community, town, or city. I'm feeling the joy.
"Person of Interest" was a way of conditioning us for this.
Those security cameras sure helped Epstein. Just as cops say “Oops, I forgot to turn on my bodycam” there will be accidental failures of cameras at Key times. The FBI are masters of this.
This is coming from a man who defends his fortune through an army of lawyers. Oracle's technology is nothing special, but he has a large installed base of corporate users. He aggressively monitors his "assets" and bullies anyone who steps out of line. He may well be the most extreme bully in tech.
What the tech-totalitarians may not realize is that they are recreating the functional conditions of a conflicted theocracy, such as Catholic Rome, Prohibition-era New York City, Communist East Germany, and modern Iran. Government monitoring always creates a parallel underground economy of secret codes, speakeasies, black markets, and doublespeak. Bullies live well in these conditions until another bully takes them out.
NVIDIA sells turnkey systems to cloud providers and data centers. Their Eos system has 4608 H100 GPUs. Oracle can also sell turnkey systems to the same customers. Amazon, Google, and Microsoft get the same system that they don’t have to maintain and it has higher performance than generic systems.
Oracle has always excelled at leveraging its database products business and milking its customer base. Yet Ellison is also very astute at assessing where the market is going and making far-sighted strategic moves which often work out. I wouldn't bet against him.
No, no, no...it's only the bad people who'll be monitored. The good people, those who exhibit properthink, will...also be monitored, but, hey, if you're clean, why should you care...?
Larry is 80 and worth billions.
"But it was all right, everything was all right, the struggle was finished. He had won the victory over himself. He loved Big Brother."
One word, Benjamin: data centers.
Except for people like Larry Ellison or those who are part of the monitoring department. We don't get to monitor what the FBI and alphabet soup organizations. It is only a one way system.
So there will at least be SOME upside to the total civilizational collapse in our future. Aside from most people dying off that is. The 1970s and 80s are starting to seem like an improbable golden age.
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Agreed. AI can detect possible arson and then evaluate if it malevolence or in support of social justice.
Some people need monitoring more than others. So to be fair, ALL will be monitored...
Step out of line, the men come and take you away.
I started re-reading that novel, but it was too fresh, too painful.
So should that have been a semicolon because I dropped the coordinating conjunction "too fresh and too painful" or used the comma, because it was a list? Or should I have just left the "and" in there for a stronger impact?
I go with #3 after thinking about it.
Not all. But those who are monitored will not be permitted to question the actions and decisions of those who are not. If you do, even at home, there will be a response from AI. You'll receive a warning. If you keep it up, maybe your bank card won't work anymore or maybe a fine will be automatically withdrawn from your account. No need for a judge. "It's unimpeachable."
Your rulers will tell you that for obvious reasons, monitoring them will interfere with them doing their jobs.
Even amongst the monitored, favored individuals or groups can be held to different standards and granted different privileges.
You will be on your best behavior, wild chicken.
Get your ticket to that wheel in space
While there's time
The fix is in
You'll be a witness to that game of chance in the sky
You know we've got to win
Here at home we'll play in the city
Powered by the sun
Perfect weather for a streamlined world
There'll be spandex jackets one for everyone
What a beautiful world this will be
What a glorious time to be free
The control freaks are ascendent. Don't get in their way. Don't get in the way of progress.
How unbelievably evil. I work in tech and so many people there think this is just fine. We’re going to leave our children and grandchildren a horrible world.
It's 'The Lives of Others' with better technology.
Last night, I argued against a proposition offered by lonejustice, who claimed that "tyrants and demigods need to be assassinated". (I believe his class of tyrants and demigods contained mostly KimJung Un and that ilk, a set with elements protected by nuclear weapons.) I countered that assassination usually fails to produce the expected outcome, that apart from the moral issue, assassination is counterproductive.
Perhaps the case of Larry Ellison shoots my thesis down in flames.
It does read like a how-to guide for the left dunnit?
These masters of the universe and their creations, they have a bit of a god complex with the inevitability of their toys. We're told AI is taking over RIGHT NOW but so far the intelligence take over is equivalence of the tiktok dog that barks 'I love you', FSD cars are the wave of the future and always will be...
Even if they end up right it's only draconian if the tools are used with malice. That's what we need to stop, not the tech itself...
it's only draconian if the tools are used with malice
But who gets to decide?
And who gets to decide who gets to decide?
Some people will be on their best behavior. Others will carry on as usual. Some will exploit new opportunities to gain fame and fortune with bad behavior. It all depends who the people with power want to hold accountable. J6ers yes, antifa no. Prediction: AI will not stop bad behavior by mentally unstable young transitioners, inner-city gangbangers, and antisemitic Hamasniks.
"The new generation of autonomous drones."
Way cool! No car chases, instant obedience or capture. YAY AI
How could any educated person put this forward as a positive? Is that why Ellison is stuttering throughout?
SELL.
Everyone will be on their best behavior. For example, in Springfield a childless cat lady will go outside and help the new neighbors catch one of her cats.
Bob Boyd:
it's only draconian if the tools are used with malice
But who gets to decide?
The same people who decide if your speech is hate, or misinformation, or allowed.
There are over 1,000,000 government surveillance cameras currently operating in London, which is about 1 camera for every 9 people. This is our future. Welcome to the Brave New World.
“They” will build a robot clone of Hillary Clinton who will be the official monitor. She’ll be in charge of monitoring communication. First monitor police behavior, then all communication then our thoughts.Everything and everyone will be controlled.
Compared to that kind of life, the craziness and chaos and confusion that we face on a daily basis is kind of a relief.
We'll all be required to wear Buddy Holly looking smart glasses at all times, like driving with a dash cam, at least until the Neuralink implants are ready. After that, if you accidentally say him instead of them, the next thing you know you'll find yourself on the floor, waking up from an electronically induced grand mal seizure and you'll have pissed your pants. It'll be great! Because you'll learn your lesson.
..even unpopular government in the US and EU has worked to blunt technology related to privacy and the individual. As per usual in places that vote will be up to voters to make the issue as a priority...
Boston doesn't have quite that many but every step on my way to work was within the view of a camera...and a gunshot mic and a bomb sniffer...
...but that doesn't count the uncountable number of camera phones. Assume one per person...
Did you know that there are at least eight pounds of copper in every traffic camera?
Sounds like Christopher hitchens definition of Christianity
A panopticon worthy of the 21st century.
And Memphis gets a shout-out.
except Christianity holds no power here.
YES
I realize that it is Ellison/Oracle speaking (with an interest in enterprise software, which underlies his 'positive' vision) ... although I did for a moment think he had stolen Danny Bonaduce's body https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danny_Bonaduce
Also...
I see trees of green, red roses too
I see them bloom for me and you
And I think to myself
What a wonderful world
It's a good life.
Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri, prophetic in many ways, has as a Secret Project the Self Aware Colony. A link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTq117U8KBg
This is what Ellison wants, and what the leftists like Inga want.
He said, benevolently.
I was thinking the exact same thought.
Maybe the route is: The electricity it takes to power AI is heating the planet!
Hard to believe Ellison is 80 years old. Of course, he obviously has had some cosmetic work and hair dyes but even discounting that he looks very fit and healthy for being that old.
Of course, the world he is describing is Big Brother literally watching and listening everywhere including inside your residence- a true dystopian future. Our descendants will curse all of us in the future but without ever voicing it out loud or where lips can be read.
"We'll all be on our best behavior..."
That's not true because of selective punishment. Just look at all the people who were caught breaking the rules and breaking the law on video who were not punished because they belonged to a protected group. (Like many of the pro-Palestinian campus protestors, members of the Occupy movement or people crossing the border illegally.)
Thirty years ago or so, when they were touting how having all the cameras watching would cause people to "behave" I pointed out that more likely, those who grew up under surveillance would just not worry about privacy. And what do we have, a couple generations of young women who care little about being naked on camera. Of young people who care little about videos of them doing things that were kept hidden from sight in the past.
Society runs on polite blindness. If you can't escape observation, there is no benefit in trying. Just tell the preachers, the police chiefs, the old biddies, the whomever used to go after those who became known to have gone outside polite society norms, to get stuffed.
Of course, Ellison is expecting the "betters" to move quickly to impose punishment on those who violate the elite's directives.
How'd that work with stopping women from smoking cigarettes or drinking in public with men a century ago? How'd it work keeping the hemlines down in the 1960s? How'd it work keeping homosexuality in the closet?
That is what they said about the UK (at least about London and the other cities), but if you get enough people out into the streets, you can get away with a lot. Wait till it's dark, wear a mask, and leave your phone at home. And isn't AI a two-way street? Rioters and criminals will be able to locate cameras and disable them. Hackers can wreak havoc on the authorities' networks.
Screw that. If.you want people on their best behavior, let everyone be armed.
An armed society is a polite society.
"She would've been a good woman if it were someone there to shoot her every minute of her life." - The Misfit
It started with having a drug dog sniff your luggage. No need for probable cause because it is not really a search of your luggage. If you don’t have drugs, no one will ever know what is in your bag.
We can trust dogs. We can’t trust AI.
G-Pub
Me too! Getting old is not fun but has one advantage
Why they are afraid of Trump enough to kill him.
I'm still fond of the 40s and 50s.
Ellison got a scare in the Sydney- Hobart Race a few years ago but it has probably worn off by now.
I had to get a Dashcam after a couple of false reports and a banning as a result of the last false story where I wasn’t even given the opportunity to address the charge against me because they wouldn’t tell me what supposedly happened. It was kafkaesque to say the least.
Almost every new home here in northern Georgia has a front door security camera. The voice startled me the first few times I delivered Amazon packages, with a whistle followed by a warning “You are being recorded”.
I've gotten addicted in the past year or so to British and Scottish cop shows. (The two best are Prime Suspect with Helen Mirren and Blue Knights in Northern Ireland.)
Two things I have learned:
1) In the UK they have CCTV cameras on seemingly every lamppost
2) There is a lot of bad behavior in the UK. Based on what I've been reading about British crime for the past 30 years, my suspicion is that the shows tone down the quantity of bad behavior including murder. The whole of the UK is like Chicago, crime wise though without guns. In the 90s and oughties it was probably worse than Chicago and on a par with Newark or Detroit. Chicago said hold my beer and has caught up.
If there is a relationship between CCTV cameras and crime, it tends to be a positive one. More CCTV and more crime. That does not mean cause and effect, of course. It does mean that it does not seem to have reduced the crime levels.
Giving up privacy to the surveillance state seems to mean a loss of privacy. There does not seem to be any benefit to the people losing their privacy.
It only increases the fascism levels. "Everything within the state, nothing outside the state, nothing against the state"
John Henry
I wonder how many here are:
A Complaining about their loss of privacy in general
And
B Have Amazon's spybot (Alexa) in their homes? And have Facebook or What's App accounts.
If B is true, you can just STFU! about privacy and fuck right off. I'll still be your friend, maybe but you have no standing at all to talk about privacy.
John Henry
We have traffic cameras in Puerto Rico. But after having spent God only knows how many of my tax dollars, they are prohibited by our constitution. So you see them all over but don't have to worry about them.
John Henry
I've mentioned this a couple times here over the past dozen years. It mostly gets a yawn.
Bluetooth traffic monitoring is ubiquitous throughout the US. These are bluetooth sensors set up alongside streets and highways that captures the MAC address of every Bluetooth device that passes by.
So your car, if it has Bluetooth for the radio, is blasting out a MAC address. If anyone in the car has a phone, that MAC is captured as well. My tablet, I assume my hearing aids and so on.
Put a license plate camera near one of the trackers and it would be trivial to build up a data base of cars, owners, license plates and MACs. That is, assuming they don't already have that from the car companies.
And of course, by tracking phone MACs they can identify every phone riding in a car. Should be trivial to identify the person from the MAC.
At the moment, all this data is anonymized (they say) and it used only to monitor traffic flow (they say). I known and hear you saying "The NSA does not have yottabytes of this data stored in their facility in Utah, John. You are just paranoid."
So maybe that it true. What would it take to turn in on so they can track, at a very granular level, the movement of every person in the country? Perhaps a 9/11 type event? Maybe assassination of a presidential candidate?
It is not exactly secret. Or even a little bit secret. Just search "Bluetooth Highway Traffic Monitoring" you will find more information than you wil ever digest. Like this, from one of the vendors of the technology. Now selling it to track foot traffic as well.
https://www.mhctraffic.com/bluetooth-tracking
John Henry
Thinking on this, I could probably buy or build a device to record every Bluetooth MAC that ever comes within range. Put that in a database with time and GPS location, Tie MACs to people, where possible (friends and family)
No need for govt, warrants or any sophisticated equipment. I am already collecting the MAC addresses. Look at your Bluetooth next time you are on a plane. You may have 100 MACs show up. Just a question of recording them.
I really miss Radio Shack.
John Henry
Hate it break it to you, but the surveillance state is here and has been here for a long time. Think how easy it is to get hold of a high-visibility vest, pull up at a utility pole in an unmarked van in any neighborhood, pop some orange cones onto the sidewalk and make it look like there’s work going on. Those “workers” are not necessarily what they appear to be. Every time an old streetlight is swapped out it’s equipped as a listening station. I’ve seen people on the street appearing to speak to someone on their phones but their eyes were fixed on their target, relaying info to another operative so that the target’s new position is passed on. The moment they spotted me observing them they clammed up and took off down the street. Don’t laugh. These are all surveillance assets, and that’s their job.
Ann had a post the other day discussing whether Havana Syndrome was real. Yes, it is, but not in the way it’s portrayed by the media. We’ve all read stories of people who have been driven to do awful things by “the voices in their heads”. These people were not all mentally ill but experiencing surveillance coverage in the form of sophisticated tech being beamed at them to scramble their brains and cause mental distress. I know it’s sounds outlandish…
(Moved this comment to the main thread instead of a reply to Yancey, specifically.)
The revolution will be supervised.
FFS! The FBI still only writes notes up after they interrogate you. They don’t tape anything except for crowds so they can get you stepping over some imaginary line so they can start with trespass charges. In my life I never thought I would have such disdain for government agencies.
Go to the X.com home page and watch the first 30 or 40 video clips to see how people behave with cameras pointed at them.
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