AND:"Why was President Trump even on stage at that point?"
— Western Lensman (@WesternLensman) July 15, 2024
New from @dbongino: Sources tell him that “they had been monitoring [the sh*oter] since he came in around that external perimeter area…they lost track of him, apparently, and he was hiding in a building about 300 yards… pic.twitter.com/I6d3As7vEU
Wow.
— Catturd ™ (@catturd2) July 15, 2024
pic.twitter.com/QYVHV0ftVI
Posts
130 comments:
Yeah.
I wondered if local cops - the foot patrol officers - are even allowed to carry firearms at these events.
EYE witness accounts - say they saw the gunman and were pointing at him.. Nothing happened.
I wondered if local cops - the foot patrol officers - are even allowed to carry firearms at these events.
Congress needs to be demanding an independent investigation now. There is no way Merrick Garland or Alejandro Mayorkas should be anywhere near this.
Is having a Secret Service sniper on top of a building normal protocol?
I'm asking because I do not know.
After the shooter took his shots- the shooter was neutralized very quickly.
Inconceivable and unthinkable.
The investigation Biden announced after the shooting, I heard on the radio that it’s not known which agency is going to lead it.
And the hits just keep on coming!
Even my TDS suffering friends think it is strange that they didn't at least have a couple of cops stationed at the building to prevent anyone from accessing the roof.
If there's a movie about this event, the Three Stooges should star.
And frankly, they're upset about it because the failed assassination and Trump's reaction to it is rebounding to his advantage.
I think I'm going to go with 'hindsight is 20/20', coupled with untrained law enforcement for this scenario, rather than any kind of deliberate - and malicious - inaction.
Of course, that does not mean someone isn't responsible for the inaction.
I remember when these lyrics used to make progressives cry with joy.
How hard was this ticket?
I am not throwin' away my shot
I am not throwin' away my shot
Hey yo, I'm just like my country
I'm young, scrappy and hungry
And I'm not throwin' away my shot
It's time to take a shot
How times change.
"Fight on, my men,"
"I am hurt, but I am not slain;
I'll lay me down and bleed a while,
And then I'll rise and fight again.
I tend to be very skeptical of conspiracy theories, but for an unexperienced 20 year old to out fox the Secret Service shows that there is a major problem somewhere.
I am willing to entertain the possibility that this was a planned inside job as the video suggests. But if you do believe that, you need to ask yourself why the insiders chose this 20-year old kid to do the job. Seems pretty unlikely to me. I am more inclined to put this down to massive, gross negligence on the part of the Secret Service. I also think we will never get the whole truth on this.
I am willing to entertain the possibility that this was a planned inside job as the video suggests. But if you do believe that, you need to ask yourself why the insiders chose this 20-year old kid to do the job. Seems pretty unlikely to me. I am more inclined to put this down to massive, gross negligence on the part of the Secret Service. I also think we will never get the whole truth on this.
This would be a good time for a whistleblower to come forward.
Or is that inconceivable.
"But if you do believe that, you need to ask yourself why the insiders chose this 20-year old kid to do the job."
A professional would have been too obvious. Instead, you roll the dice. The 20 year old probably succeeds, and if he doesn't, so be it.
Dear corrupt left, go F yourselves said...
Is having a Secret Service sniper on top of a building normal protocol?
7/15/24, 12:11 PM
More than one. Normie media doesn't remark on this, but there was a spotter next to the sniper. They're supposed to use binoculars, but at that range? Even I could have seen the shooter, especially if I had advance warning.
Dear corrupt left, go F yourselves said...
Is having a Secret Service sniper on top of a building normal protocol?
I'm asking because I do not know.
After the shooter took his shots- the shooter was neutralized very quickly.
7/15/24, 12:11 PM
I also do not know what the protocol is - were they Secret Service, or another department?
I have unsubstantiated rumors that: they knew he was present, but they had to wait for a 'go' before firing. Which seems like a reasonable condition under different circumstances (you don't just shoot someone with a rifle) but this is a very specific scenario.
Further, looking at the images of the snipers, is it really clear that they are 'officials'? They have 'police' markings and seem to be an official setup (indicating they may not be Secret Service?) so sensibly they are there for protection, but were there other - or could there be - other official snipers, who are less clearly identified?
Could it be that the snipers were not clear if the shooter was part of another sniper (team) and waiting for clarification? When they saw the unknown shooter shoot, they responded.
All just my speculation and may be utterly wrong, but trying to attribute less maliciousness - other than the shooter - to the situation.
ron winkleheimer said...
Even my TDS suffering friends think it is strange that they didn't at least have a couple of cops stationed at the building to prevent anyone from accessing the roof.
The more pressing question is why didn't they have someone stationed on the roof of that building?
The SS is claiming that it was the responsibility of local police to secure buildings outside the agreed SS perimeter. So, yeah. Not their fault. They did their best. Shit happens, yaknow?
Nerdrotic posted a video that showed from the time people started to notice and point out the guy on the roof, to the time the bullet grazed president trump, was nearly 2 minutes!!!!
I’m going with climate change as a place holder until we have more credible information.
Hire a kid and roll the dice? I can't buy that. Also, if it was planned, kid would have been able to get in position without being spotted, and filmed.
I'm going with "malicious incompetence" until I learn more.
The Peter Principle is evident across the entire government. Incompetence reigns on the proles beneath.
It was a 20 year old kid because he would be too stupid to realize that he was a patsy, and would not live through the experience.
It is also being noted that Jill Biden was also speaking in Pennsylvania, and she got the A team.
"I’m going with climate change as a place holder until we have more credible information."
Ha!
"It is also being noted that Jill Biden was also speaking in Pennsylvania, and she got the A team."
Well, she is the real President.
I would bet there was someone/s who were supposed to be on the roofs of that particular building and the ones surrounding it. Those roofs were light colored and imagine standing on that roof late Saturday afternoon was a miserable job to have to perform- it would have been blazing hot. I think we might well find that the people who were supposed to have that roof secured came down off them just before Trump began speaking and thought it enough to simply watch for people trying to climb onto the roof.
"I'm going with "malicious incompetence" until I learn more."
I do think that's the most likely.
Jupiter said...
It is also being noted that Jill Biden was also speaking in Pennsylvania, and she got the A team.
Maybe they didn't short Trump agent-wise, but did they stack his protection team with a bunch of fuck-ups no other team wants and the USSS can't get rid of?
I’m not sure how DE&I could have contributed to this situation.
You have to give potential shooter a chance?
Have shooters been delegated to misdemeanour while we weren’t paying attention?
We can only listen in to so many city council meetings.
This was 100% planned and orchestrated.
I posted the video of people yelling at and pointing to the shooter for a minute while he got up, laid back down, got up again, just generally acted like a retard then finally took the shots. That video was almost a minute.
This "assassin" has FBI patsy written all over it.
There was at least 1 person on site that knew about it. Whoever designed and coordinated the security CONOP set up a clear and obvious flaw in the security and the patsy they recruited was told where to go and how to approach.
This is not going to end well for anyone.
And of course the FBI is in charge of getting to the bottom of this.
I do think it's easy to predict Trump's first personnel firing if he takes office.
WHY? because they were Waiting for him to shoot.. so that THEN they could shoot him
Does anyone doubt that if Donald Trump had been advised there was a suspicious person outside the venue who law enforcement had lost sight of that he would have gone on stage anyway?
I suspect the Secret Service has a fear of false positives. They are afraid they will look stupid if it turns out there is no threat, and they fear the protectee being annoyed with them or losing confidence in them.
I am willing to accept that the local LEO's and the bulk of SS "agents" didn't know what was going on.
They were in general brave but obviously unorganized and incompetent.
They obviously did not have coordinated comms.
The most obvious approach vector to the asset was left open.
Someone on site knew the plan. The patsy handler knew the plan and conferred the necessary information to the patsy.
Before you even do the 360 and the walk around you get aerial photos of the location and you generally know what you will see when you walk the space.
The path the assassin took is so obvious it is absurd. They had wood lines they could have used but those would have required much longer shots.
I am just going to say right now the SS Agent in charge of security at this event did not kill himself.
Here is a more definitive video showing the shooter crawling on the roof and the people in the crowd pointing him out.
Might want to watch it to be better informed about how things went down and the time the SS had to react.
It's infuriating.
The SS is claiming that it was the responsibility of local police to secure buildings outside the agreed SS perimeter.
That would be a lame excuse. SS is responsible for the security, and even if they outsource some functions, they are still responsible for insuring it is done. One such task is that you keep track of any lapses by the other agencies and ream their asses until they get back on task and in position. You don't just think "oh, well, looks like local LEO's are out eating donuts. Hopefully nothing happens while they are gone."
As far as I can tell, there is absolutely no scenario you could paint for me that excuses the site command staff from utter failure in their duties.
CYA all the way: from DC to the beat cops: "Gee, I need two hands to climb a ladder"
"I suspect the Secret Service has a fear of false positives. They are afraid they will look stupid if it turns out there is no threat, and they fear the protectee being annoyed with them or losing confidence in them."
Tough shit. If that's the explanation for what happened it's a 100% fail for them.
Someone needs to have explained to them the concept of "low probability, high consequence" event as they are ushered out the door.
The USSS "frozen zone" was 100 yards out from the podium. Beyond was the responsibility of the local cops. The official sniper team was the local cop rapid response unit. When told, a local uniformed officer climbed the ladder to the roof, saw the gunman, and was forced to retreat when the gunman drew down on him. The gunman then rolled over and fired off his shots at Trump. The police snipers then took him out (no, there was no having to wait for orders from the head of Secret Service.) Not hard to follow or understand. However, it is a major USSS failure not to have complete control over a thousand-yard area, ground and air.
Dear corrupt left, go F yourselves said...
Is having a Secret Service sniper on top of a building normal protocol?
I'm asking because I do not know.
After the shooter took his shots- the shooter was neutralized very quickly.
Absolutely SOP.
Whenever you set up security for an asset it is very similar to setting up an assault or an ambush or any other potential engagement. You set up over watch positions that give your biggest weapons with the most firepower and accuracy the maximum amount of freedom to engage.
This includes snipers and suppressive weapons like machine guns.
In a space with buildings this is almost always on the roof of the highest buildings. The only situation I have seen that is an exception is a hill that overtops the buildings and from the top of the hill you also have overwatch on the roof. Just to make clear climbing trees is not a thing by the way.
Totally off topic:
Ann, WHERE ARE THE MUSHROOMS?! I want my Fungus of the Day. Did it quit raining up there or something?
doctrev - thank you.
I agree. The shooter was seen by a lot of ordinary people.
yet - nothing - until after the shots. AFTER.
I have a lawyer friend who's husband is Secret Service. He was on Trump's protective detail. They know live in MO.
He should be the new head of the Secret Service. He's from Arkansas. Good guy.
You want an independent agency to investigate? Certainly not anything in the Federal government. How about the Texas Rangers? And I'm not talking about the baseball team.
If it's left up to Garland to appoint a team Larry, Moe and Curley would outsmart Team Garland.
>howdydoody said...
I am willing to entertain the possibility that this was a planned inside job as the video suggests. But if you do believe that, you need to ask yourself why the insiders chose this 20-year old kid to do the job.<
Same reason they chose a schlemiel like Oswald to kill JFK - he's easily expendable.
Indigo Red said...
The USSS "frozen zone" was 100 yards out from the podium. Beyond was the responsibility of the local cops. The official sniper team was the local cop rapid response unit. When told, a local uniformed officer climbed the ladder to the roof, saw the gunman, and was forced to retreat when the gunman drew down on him. The gunman then rolled over and fired off his shots at Trump. The police snipers then took him out (no, there was no having to wait for orders from the head of Secret Service.) Not hard to follow or understand. However, it is a major USSS failure not to have complete control over a thousand-yard area, ground and air.
It is not a failure.
Everything here is about plausible deniability. This all absolutely makes sense.
If this is true Trump fucked this up. He hired someone for personal security that is absolutely terrible. He trusted the SS. Unforgiveable in the current environment.
He needs to understand what he is up against. I want to hear from his spokes people if what you say is true. If it is true he better sharpen up quick.
I see Achilles already answered in the affirmative- it is absolutely SOP.
President Bush was the speaker at my son's West Point graduation. A crowd virtually guaranteed not to have any would be assassins in it. Me and some others I just met were playing the game- "Find the snipers!" on the buildings. There were quite a few of them.
And taking my younger ones down on the field before the cap toss I was standing behind and obviously secret service female. The guy next to me and I were both wondering where in the heck she had her gun stashed. WE couldn't spot it. What made us think she was an agent? The wire coming out of her was a clue.
He didnt pick the detail obviously
1. Stop with the Instant Explanations. We don't know enough. Slow the hell down.
2. Even given so many examples of government intelligence being wrong/flat-footed about basic things, we insist on portraying them as expert, calculating forces able to orchestrate the most public, complex conspiracies without fail.
3. Humans don't like simple explanations for horrible events. We can't accept that a presidential limousine just happened to pass right under the window of Lee Harvey Oswald's workplace in 1963. Well, it did.
4. In the internet age, the race is always on to offer the most cynical explanation possible. It's a dreary exercise.
"why the insiders chose this 20-year old kid to do the job. Seems pretty unlikely to me"
I don't know if he was chosen but the "20 year old kid" would have taken the back of Trump's head off if Trump had not turned to look at the screen.
I make this statement as an old man raised in a very large city, never shot a rifle until Aug 1961 when in the space of three days was taught well enough to put holes in a six inch bull at 200 hundred yards, standing with a nine pound rifle. Along with 200 hundred other 18 year olds.
There’s a reason we haven’t won a War in almost 80 years. Why our schools suck. Why crime in cities in rampant.
The same reason a man was killed and Trump and two others were shot on Saturday.
Bad leadership fosters gross incompetence.
This is government at work.
The police snipers then took him out (no, there was no having to wait for orders from the head of Secret Service.)
Of course they didn't have to wait for orders at that point. The question is whether their ROEs were to hold fire until fired upon. If so it's nuts, and I guarantee would not be the ROE if Biden were the target. (Not necessarily political, just the difference between a sitting president and an ex-president or presidential candidate.)
Or maybe not an ROE but a judgment call by the sniper. But a major failure of judgment not to take out a guy lying on a roof with a rifle pointed toward Trump.
+1 Indigo Red @1:08pm
Above should read:
Along with 200 other 18 year olds.
From my viewing of videos I think the counter sniper team that killed shooter were most likely local Swat officers and may have had the common (these days) reluctance to use lethal force. Remember the woman cop who is in prison for accidentally grabbing her gun instead of her Taser in a struggle with a violent suspect.
If we must speculate, how about this:
This young man was like a school shooter. Bullied and lonely and mad at the world. Instead of just taking his life, he decides to inflict pain on others, make a name for himself, with the expectation he'd be killed.
I think that's the most likely scenario, if we have to pick one.
here's a repost of what i said a day ago..
back in 1980's (WAY past the statue of limitations), i worked 2nd shift in Des Moines as a Computer Operator (IBM System370.. Back when computers were cool). I'd take a break every night before 18:30 (6:30pm), which is when nightly processing started. I'd OFTEN go a block away, to the top of a parking ramp (across the street from the Ruan Building); where i'd have a smoke (What would i smoke? I'm not sure we're THAT far past the statue of limitations)..
One evening i walk up the top of the parking ramp, and head over to the wall where i'd usually take my tokes.. As Soon as i got there (and BEFORE i'd taken out my smoking stuff); an OFFICIAL LOOKING plainclothesed MAN, in dark glasses confronted me; DEMANDING to know WHAT i thought i was doing..
Since what i'd planned on doing was not something i cared to mention; i told him "just wanted some fresh air"; and he told me: "GET IT SOMEWHERE ELSE.. IF YOU DON'T WANT TROUBLE!"
I thought that was WEIRD, but discretion is the better part of valor; so i left, and went back.
At work that evening, i was reading the Des Moines Register.. And saw that President HW Bush was giving a speach that night (at 8pm or so).. I put 2 and 2 together, added 12 and carried 5..
And realized that Offical Man MUST HAVE BEEN Secret Service. The Pres wasn't giving an outdoor speech.. He was JUST going to be driving by.. And they WEREN'T ALLOWING strangers to be on ANY ROOFS along the way.. I wasn't carrying ANYTHING (well, OKAY; i was carrying a pipe and a lighter, and something to smoke), but i had NOTHING that could have been big enough to be a gun, or a bomb, or EVEN a very good camera.. And they stopped me as soon as i got in the view of the street..
Serious Question:
Is the New Improved DEI SS so freaking incompetent that they didn't have someone on the roof 135 yards away from President Trump? Or did they intentionally NOT have someone on the roof?
Keep in mind, back in the '80's they wouldn't let dope smokers get high on rooftops THREE HOURS before the Pres would be driving by
The snipers were wearing vests with "Secret Service" on the back under "Police."
Image
It sure would not have been a problem to delay Trump's appearance at the podium for a few minutes.....Biden routinely starts his middle school gym pep rallies an hour late.
On Saturday, four counter-sniper teams—two from the Secret Service and two from local law enforcement—were deployed at Trump’s rally, a Secret Service spokesman said. - WSJ
I'm going with "malicious incompetence" plus this This young man was like a school shooter. Bullied and lonely and mad at the world. Instead of just taking his life, he decides to inflict pain on others, make a name for himself, with the expectation he'd be killed with a healthy dose of Alinsky incitement...coming from "inside the house", IYKWIM...
Georgie Steponhisshortyalot and Martha Radatz said the assassination attempt should be placed at the feet of Donald Trump and his supporters.
These are news people?
Actually, the SS may have been completely on top of the situation.
From Real Clear Politics via PJM:
1. Trump detail has been working 7 day weeks with no time off.
2. Many of the agents there were temporaries from Pittsburgh field office.
3. The only regular agent present was the USSS SAC.
4. Counter snipers were only approved the day before the rally and didn't have adequate time to do a full site survey.
5. Resources were taxed as they had to allocate agents to work our unelected President Dr. Jill Biden's speech in Pittsburgh that evening.
6. Republicans on House Oversight were already investigating the situation.
https://x.com/susancrabtree/status/1812550621100421127
I suspect many soiled undergarments in the Biden WH over the weekend.
Actually, the SS may have been completely on top of the situation.
Please stop.
Wa St Blogger said...
That would be a lame excuse. SS is responsible for the security, and even if they outsource some functions, they are still responsible for insuring it is done.
Exactly.
It is such a lame excuse that you can't even call it that.
There was coordinated intent within the SS to get Trump killed.
And the people handling that kid told him more than just where to be.
They gave him a place to stage.
They gave him a clear ingress.
They gave him a clear line of sight.
They delayed the snipers long enough so he could get his shots off.
And they shot him just in time to keep him from talking.
"(IBM System370.. Back when computers were cool)."
Off topic, but I don't recall System370 being cool. Now PDP 11s, that was cool.
The 20 year old was a good shot. A lot of folks are commenting like that shot is no big deal. Bullshit.
133 yards with an AR-15 is by no means a hard shot. 133 yard headshot on a windy day while you know you are about to die and have one chance at this...and you haven't been sitting still calming your nerves and carefully dialing it in...No, thats not an easy shot.
At the same time look at the videos of him absolutely flopping on the roof. Taking forever to get into position. Highly visible from the ground. Etc.
Conspiracy theories flourish when nothing makes sense in a rationale world - this is not like Oswald or other Presidential assassins.
It's JD Vance!
Althouse was right!! Begley was right!
I would believe they (someone in FBI or SS) found a lonely, poorly adjusted guy online and decided to go for entrapment. Like the Whitmer “kidnapping” They just forgot to call him off on the day of.
He seemed to know an awful about about the layout of the rally
Why were drones not used? Is the SS that incompetent that they are not able to use the best technology for real-time intelligence. A drone with an inferred sensor could have immediately spotted him before he made it to the roof.
I’m reminded of Fredo protecting the Godfather after Pauly called in sick.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=evl5ai7Mg7w
CJinPA said...
If we must speculate, how about this:
This young man was like a school shooter. Bullied and lonely and mad at the world. Instead of just taking his life, he decides to inflict pain on others, make a name for himself, with the expectation he'd be killed.
What always pisses me off is the bullied person never seems to murder the ones that bullied him/her. Just innocents.
The NYT sent me a photo of Vance standing awkwardly and dorkily with Trump. Surprised?
360, 370, PDP-11...Yeah, ok, whatever.
MV/8000. Yes.
If govt set it up, would have been more efficient to have the shooter, with a pistol, in the crowd behind Trump.
turns out it was not the team on barn behind Trump podium after all but ...
The only positive action was an apparent 488yd shot by one USSS sniper which despatched the assasin but after the assassin launched at least 5 rounds
It's JD Vance!
=================
now why does JDVance resemble me of Hahward BF who sneers down on Legally Blonde Ellie
"So, they are still calling Republicans 'fascist' and members of the KKK. Isn't that just lovely?"
Angela Morabito
@AngelaLMorabito
the unity is going great you guys!!
Julio Rosas
@Julio_Rosas11
The March on the RNC is now underway in Milwaukee. Protesters are chanting, “No Trump, no KKK, no fascist USA!”
https://x.com/i/status/1812904727778046057
Bongino was entrusted with leading the protection of a Democratic and a Republican president. By all accounts he was a great leader. Both Presidents have praised him. What he thinks matters.
I hope the bipartisan bill to give RFK Jr. SS protection and Trump and Biden more protection passes. And I hope Trump also follows RFK Jr. in hiring Gavin de Becker to provide independent, coordinated protection as well, because the DOJ, FBI, CIA, and perhaps even the SS have advanced extreme partisans to their leadership.
The Secret Service sniper that patiently waited for the loner too fire his 7 point blank shots is probably named Jack Ruby.
The Secret Service sniper that patiently waited for the loner too fire his 7 point blank shots is probably named Jack Ruby.
I have not spent a lot of time analyzing video, but the one I saw where it appears to show the overwatch sniper firing looked almost like an "oh, shit, he's firing" reaction. I see him looking through his scope and all of a sudden his body reacts and his gun fires. Do not use me as any kind of expert, just my impression from what I saw.
And I think the name is Howard Sapphire, but I could be wrong. He didn't look like Lou Diamond (Phillips)
According to Goldinger, the commander of the Emergency Services Unit informed him that their responsibility did not extend to securing areas outside the venue. "In my view, the entire operation falls under the jurisdiction of the Secret Service, and they will outline specific duties from there," he said.
Another former senior Secret Service agent agreed and said that even if local law enforcement "dropped the ball," adding that it remains the agency's duty "to ensure compliance either beforehand or in real-time."
“Just because it is outside of the perimeter, it doesn’t take it out of play for a vulnerability, and you’ve got to mitigate it in some fashion,” the source explained.
Seems to support my position stated above @1:02.
ron winkleheimer said...
"(IBM System370.. Back when computers were cool)."
Off topic, but I don't recall System370 being cool. Now PDP 11s, that was cool.
Indeed, sir.
370 programmers wore polyester suits. PDP programmers wore jeans and sneakers and t-shirts.
I think was very gentlemanly for the SS sniper to let the assassin take the first shot before returning fire.
Kind of reminds me of when the Gardes Françaises and Grenadier Guards invite each other to fire first at the Battle of Fontenoy. Maurice de Saxe said to Louis XV during the battle, “Gentlemen of the French Guards, fire!” And Louis XV said back, “Gentlemen, we never fire first, fire yourselves.”
I mean how gentlemanly! The snot nosed little sniper can shoot at Trump first and then the SS would reply. Doesn't that beat all?
turns out it was not the team on barn behind Trump podium after all but ...
The only positive action was an apparent 488yd shot by one USSS sniper which despatched the assasin but after the assassin launched at least 5 rounds
hmm
https://x.com/CollinRugg/status/1812915463334338995
On X:
@elonmusk
"Having a small person as body cover for a large man is like an undersized Speedo at the beach – doesn’t cover the subject"
The March on the RNC is now underway in Milwaukee. Protesters are chanting, “No Trump, no KKK, no fascist USA!”
I watched a bit of that. Pretty anemic turnout and lackluster enthusiasm, to my eye. Nothing at all like the Scott Walker days. Hope all the far left's destructive energies have been saved for the Democrats.
The only positive action was an apparent 488yd shot by one USSS sniper which despatched the assasin
Is that a typo or the true distance? I have no doubt a Secret Service sniper could pull it off but were they truly that far away from the action?
MadTownGuy said...
On X:
@elonmusk
"Having a small person as body cover for a large man is like an undersized Speedo at the beach – doesn’t cover the subject"
The female SS agent had a large body the size of a small body.
The building the shooter climbed and shot from was the LEO's staging ground for security.
There is no way this was not deliberately allowed by those in charge. They either knew it in advance and let it play out to the end or the shooter may have even been picked specially for the job by the FBI.
Ha! Trump called for Biden to give RFK protection and Biden ordered it. Ever since Biden named Trump VP things have been getting done. Except for improving the USSS.
Hey people, when was the last time you saw USSS withOUT that coil of wire going up to their ear, huh? Comms, comms, comms.
Cross checking for secure positions?
And who drove him up from Bethany and held the ladder for him.
Oops. I mean from Bethel Park.
And how come the cell phone is an impossible to open model?
Malice Or Massive Incompetence": Erik Prince Gives Detailed Assessment Of Secret Service Failure The only positive action was an apparent 488yd shot by one USSS sniper which despatched the assasin
"Channel 11 news uncovered dramatic new details Monday in the moments leading up to the assassination attempt on former president Donald Trump. According to multiple law enforcement sources, Thomas Crooks was spotted by law enforcement on a roof nearly 30 minutes before shots were fired that injured Trump, killed a former fire chief, and injured two others in the crowd.
According to multiple sources, a law enforcement officer had also previously seen Crooks on the ground and called him in as a suspicious person with a picture prior to 5:45 p.m. Our sources tell us an officer checked the grounds for Crooks at that point, but did not see him where the first picture was taken.
26 minutes after the second picture of Crooks was taken by law enforcement and the information called in, shots were fired from the roof of the American Glass Research building. Seconds later, a Secret Service sniper returned fire and killed Crooks.
https://www.wpxi.com/news/local/alleged-trump-shooter-spotted-by-law-enforcement-nearly-30-minutes-before-shots-fired-sources-say/Q6GIK5RP6RBY5PHIMYBNXRTEBI/
From what I've read, Secret Service protections for presidents are greater than for candidates or ex-presidents. The security Biden gets is more pronounced than what Trump gets.
Trump's protection detail didn't have enough men, and they didn't have enough time to prep the location or secure it.
So to me this is similar to the failure to adequately protect the Supreme Court when there were all these death threats with the leaking of the Dobbs opinion. And it's similar to the failure to provide Secret Service protection to Bobby Kennedy Jr.
The idea that it's an inside job seems highly unlikely. Any trained sniper would have made that shot. It was barely longer than a football field. You don't conspire to assassinate someone and then send some untrained kid out there. (The secret service guy had no trouble shooting the kid, even though the distance was way further out).
What I think is that people in the government wanted Trump dead, either consciously or subconsciously. So they did not protect him adequately. That's a lot different than planning and conspiring an assassination attempt.
Biden was opposed to the shooting of Osama bin Laden, remember. I don't see him conspiring to kill Trump. I think this was half-ass security, and it resulted in a half-ass assassination attempt.
One of the things about being a "conservative" is that you believe that the Govt is inherently incompetent. (Trump is not a conservative, although he may be getting there.) When I read excuses about the Secret Service not doing X to protect the candidate, and the excuse is that some other agency had jurisdiction over that, I tend to believe it, because THE GOVERNMENT is not in the business of of accomplishing its stated goals, but in the business of avoiding blame by playing jurisdiction games.
Trump is rich. He should hire a professional security firm and tell the Secret Service either to take orders from the professional firm, or get out of the way. (My guess is that early in the Trump II administration the Secret Service will rediscover the professionalism of which it was once proud.)
https://x.com/DC_Draino/status/1812911031124976007
2 minutes.
People were yelling about a person with a gun on a roof sneaking up on the president for 2 minutes.
This wasn't some bang bang quick reaction activity.
People in the SS security detail created a path for this low IQ idiot to fumble fuck around on the roof for 2 minutes. He was hiding in a building for many minutes about 300 meters away in an obvious staging location. People saw him well before Trump started speaking and they "lost contact."
This is Bullshit. This was obviously coordinated. People at that location knew he was there. He magically got his shots off and was only killed at a point where the only thing he could do was tell everyone who helped him.
They didnt go after suleimani either for thr time of the obama administration and didnt go after any drone strikes in north africa or syria till after 2014
Anthony said...
but I don't recall System370 being cool. Now PDP 11s, that was cool.
370 programmers wore polyester suits. PDP programmers wore jeans and sneakers and t-shirts
i wouldn't know SHIT about "programming" i was a Computer Operator. I doubt PDP's even NEEDED operators :)
z eod
"Biden was opposed to the shooting of Osama bin Laden"
And Osama bin Laden was opposed to killing him, as we learned from the papers in bin Laden's secret lair. Biden just said that he has known the Brzezinski family for 50 years, and Brzezinski admitted in a 1998 interview to arming the Taliban and Al Qaeda.
We had bin Laden dead to rights at Tora Bora, complete air superiority and enough bombs to flatten that mountain he was hiding in to gravel, and yet we called a halt to the bombing for a little while, and let him go.
Something is rotten in Denmark here.
Why weren't any agents closer to Trump than several yards away, and down a short flight of stairs?
A couple could have been posted on the stairs or even just seated at the back corners of the platform.
Some talking heads have mentioned the tactic of parking large trucks or buses as a sort of temporary wall or screen, but without knowing the relative elevations it's hard to judge how that might have affected the situation.
I think if you had longtime experience with the procedures of the Secret Service, FBI and CIA and had developed personal contacts you could plan out something and take advantage of weaknesses in security plans. Not everyone has to be in on it, just key players at key points.
Why you would pick a 20 year old is the plausible narrative that he was acting alone, he was a "loner." He has no history or network to examine. Case closed. We'll soon find out if there was something on his phone to suggest anything else.
Because in the last few years we've seen how blatantly the DOJ has manipulated the justice system to produce the felony convictions against Trump, an unintended consequence is that we are now more suspicious and less likely to trust our officials who we know may use their positions to achieve their own agendas.
Something I learned today is that apparently a portion of the agents who should have been there with Trump were off in Pittsburg supporting a speech by Jill Biden.
There is a persistent story floating around that one of the Secret Service snipers had the shooter lined up in his sights but had to wait for permission — which did not come until after the guy started shooting. I’ll be eager to learn the truth of that assertion. This assertion about his having to wait for permission is bolstered by video taken at the event. The sniper with the rifle mounted on a tall tripod seems to be tracking something — or someone — through his scope, but then he abruptly lifts his head. This is followed by three “pops,” which we now know to be the first shots fired at Donald Trump.
baghdadbob said...
"The female SS agent had a large body the size of a small body."
Good one!
Sorry Hassyhamper. First, the protesters at the DNC were coordinated to wear down taxpayer functions to make demands for certain routes for 30 months of "negotiations."
Within two hours, they violated these, blocked traffic, created dangerous situations for police, who were told to stand down, and that was just the first two hours.
Their plans for the DNC are much larger, for several factors. They will attack citizens and police, prevent first responders from helping the sick, storm the convention, and get away with it thanks to leftist DAs and judges. Innocent people will die. Small businessmen on their last legs already will close. The scum media will hide all of this.
They are arriving from several states and countries. They're terrorists. I'll be reporting. But it being Chicago, the street police can do nothing. The democrats want anarchy. Obama is their ally.
With 48+ hours having now passed since the assassination attempt (to allow for real facts to come to the forefront), it seems the USSS has finally managed to sink to the level of incompetence the rest of the US Government Civilian Bureaucracy is famous for.
Back in my days of active duty in the USN (70s and early 80s), heads would roll with this level of performance.
Yep, I sure miss the old days...
Officer took a picture of the shooter on the roof at 5:45
30 minutes before the shooting.
According to the local TV station.
Hire a kid and roll the dice? I can't buy that. Also, if it was planned, kid would have been able to get in position without being spotted, and filmed.
The kid was spotted. The kid was filmed. Neither of those prevented him from taking the shot.
Rabel said...
The snipers were wearing vests with "Secret Service" on the back under "Police."
Image
7/15/24, 1:41 PM
Ah, I see that, now. Not a great image when zoomed in of course, but clearly has Secret Service on it.
I still believe this is what happens when multiple agencies are involved in providing security. At some point, a breakdown in communication and understanding responsibilities occurs.
We need to stop worrying about the dead 20 year old shooter -- he was just a tool --- and start worrying about who in the line of Trump's security is compromised and working to make sure he doesn't make it to November.
On a side note, I noticed at the RNC convention last night, Trump's security was back to being the "A" team. No overweight untrained females in sight. I was glad to see that. But, who made the decision on the security detail for Saturday night? Who assigned those agents?
The FBI has confirmed that Crooks was seen by law enforcement members from the Allegheny County Police Department on the roof of a building with a clear sightline to the former president.
Despite being alerted to his presence, authorities failed to confront him, allowing him to remain hidden for nearly 30 minutes before he opened fire on Trump and the crowd.
The shocking new allegations have raised questions about how Crooks was able to evade detection and carry out the attack, which left Trump wounded and a member of the crowd dead.
A sniper even took a picture of the suspect with a rangefinder and radioed to the command post before the Trump assassination attempt, CBS reports.
Crooks was on local police and Secret Service's radar for nearly a half hour before the shooting attempt, but he kept "disappearing" before he climbed on the roof.
"Crooks disappeared again and then came back a THIRD time with a backpack," CBS reported. "The snipers called in with information that he had a backpack and said he was walking towards the back of the building."
It gets crazier. The NYPost reports local police were INSIDE the building that Thomas Crooks climbed on top of. The building was carved out of the Secret Service security perimeter and delegated to local police despite it being a "well-known high priority vulnerability.”
Before the shooting, a police officer actually confronted Crooks, who had a rifle. The police officer scrambled back down the ladder, allowing the shooter to fire.
I just want Professor Althouse to know that when I posted a link to this post on my Facebook feed, Facebook took it down within minutes
Well, I'm back. I appealed Facebook's removal of my link to this post on my Facebook feed and it appears that the automated review restored the link. In fairness I thought I should update.
The two arguments contradict.
If he was on their radar and they lost him, then it wasn't an inside-govt conspiracy.
What's most likely is that the SS was undermanned and overextended, and they messed up.
A former prez doesn't get the same level of security as the current prez.
And that showed in the prep.
The two arguments contradict.
If he was on their radar and they lost him, then it wasn't an inside-govt conspiracy.
What's most likely is that the SS was undermanned and overextended, and they messed up.
A former prez doesn't get the same level of security as the current prez.
And that showed in the prep.
I saw this 30 minute thing only today and agree. They should have held the speech up while the shooter was searched for.
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